How Much FASTER are LIGHTER Wheels?
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- čas přidán 28. 06. 2023
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Testing 18inch Konig wheels vs 17inch rpf1 wheels. Are Lighter wheels really faster?
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Video is stop motion animation some clips filmed in mexico
Tags: importance of unsprung weight how many lbs of unsprung mass carbon fiber light weight unsprung weight less weight more weight difference dyno what is the difference heavy vs light how much faster is it better more power better tires better tuning dragy dr69 dr70 da density altitude testing before and after lightweight wheels tires unsprung weight better acceleration drag pack make a difference 1/4 mi quarter mile test performance lighter set of wheels faster spool turbo how to make your car as fast as possible weight reduction lighter tires before after test heavy wheels test Kong rpf1 oz racing ultralegerrita hlt allegerita magnesium belaks 340i tuned mk5 Toyota supra mkv supra 3.0 a90 a91 tuned e50 blend vs mk7 gti golf mk7.5 mk8 lowering springs coilovers 91 pump gas vs e85 ethanol mk7 gti HPFP Upgrade autotech hpfp upgrade vs gt acura integra turbo vs mk7 golf gti boosted integra dc2 type r rsx type s fast turbo integra b18c b20 vtec ea888 mqb scatpack 392 challenger hemi hellcat 2019 mk7 gti volkswagen mqb mk7.5 mk8 gti mk6 gti 2019 gti vs unitronic stage 1 unitronic stage 2 apr tuned stage 1 ecs tuning cobb 6mt gti 7 dsg 2020 gti mk7.5 afe intake afe drop in filter mk5 gti mk4 gti k&N drop in filter deutsch auto parts modded euros gti pro dry s filter afe filter golf r audi s3 rs3 apr tuned gti modify stock air box apr stage 1 mk8 gti race apr stage 2 is38 gti cts downpipe mk7 gti snow guard delete mrblipblop civic si vs gti vs mexico streets gti vs bolt on modded 10gen honda civic si vs mk7 gti 350z vs mk7 gti g35 vs gti g37 vs gti sneeky tuned mk7.5 gti 5150 tuned eurodyne maestro cobb tuning bmw 650 2019 wrx sti scatpack challenger charger rt evo x vs evo 8 10thgen civic si vs turbo integra camaro ss focus st fiesta st vs rsx k20 mqb c6 corvette vs is38 - Auta a dopravní prostředky
You need to swap all 4 wheels to see the full benefit. Doesn't matter if you're FWD, RWD or 4WD, all wheels act like flywheels and need to be accelerated by the car accelerating forward, not just the driven wheels.
The reason they run skinnies on the front of RWD cars at a drag strip. Only needs to hold up the front and steer, otherwise minimal rotational drag.
@@exothermal.sprocketalso less friction from the tires.
@@davidtennien39 and less aerodynamic drag too
Nope, you're wrong
I'd argue this is a good mod for daily drivers too. I lost less weight per wheel than you and gained 2 MPG. That's an additional 30+ miles range per tank for me. Also, while I haven't officially tested anything else, it feels like the car is much happier and quicker around town.
Running 17x9 Apex forged VS5RS with 255/40/17 Falken RT660 on my Mk7.5 R and loving them. The wheels come in at 16.9 lbs. Also enough room for larger brakes and even fits the mk8R brakes
The reduction of diameter and lower rotating mass combine for better acceleration and braking. Additionally, handling benefits as well as the suspension does not need to work as hard. So everything benefits and parts last longer working more efficiently (brakes perform better, last longer; suspension works better, lasts longer). I get the awesome look of large diameter wheels, but the smarter pick for the performance and operating cost is the smallest diameter you can safely get away with. One last thing, getting taller sidewall tires when dropping wheel diameter does dial back steering response, but adds more protection for your wheels and offers a better ride for street driven cars. If the streets where you mostly drive are not great, this combination is without a doubt a great choice.
I think my favorite light wheel is the WedsSport TC105X. They weigh just under 17 lbs and are definitely one of the lightest wheels you can find in 18". Forged too!
My motegi racing traklites were 17.x in the 18x8.5 version. Pretty light!
Best non forged lightweight wheel out there imo
Back in the day (2006~) I had a MK5 GTI, a coworker had one too. Eventually I switched the stock 17" Denver for OZ Ultraleggeras also in 17".
This was enough to consistently beat his car on stock wheels, when before we would go back and forth or his was a tiny bit quicker.
Beautiful build man. Crazy how these little vws can compete/ yawn on big v8s. I got a fbo stage 2+ cc beats stock 10s mustangs all day. Keep up great work man.
Turbos are fun haha
I've got a 2004 VW Passat GL Wagon. American Spec. 5-Speed Manual with the AWM 1.8T. ATM Original Shadow Blue with metallic flake paint and Grey & Anthricite interior. Originally had the 15 inch steelies until I picked up a full set of the 16 inch GLS/GLX Alloys. Certainly helps. I even fully refurbished them. I do plan to purchase a set of 18s down the road and update/upgrade the suspension but first I'm going to upgrade the exhaust. The turbo, surprisingly, is still running well. However, I will upgrade that eventually as well. Having welders and buddies with other types of welders I thankfully don't need to be concerned with order. But is still interesting to see what differences can be proved or unproven.
What was the weight difference from your praetoria's to your koenig ampliforms? And how much did you get your ampliforms for? I swear the pricing for rims has gotten nuts, was looking at motegi traklite 3's for myself
To get the full benefit of light weight wheels, do all 4 wheels, then go to Willow Springs or Button Willow and get out on track. You didn't measure stopping distance and didn't measure skid pad handling. The ratio is 6 to 1, so for every pound of unsprung weight (especially rotating mass) its worth 6 pounds off the body of the car. Your handling will go through the roof and breaking will increase dramatically. In fact lightweight wheels and sticky tires will make you way more faster than adding 50-100 hp on an otherwise stock car. If you want to really make a fast car you have to improve the driving dynamics of the car not just the dyno sheet.
Handling, braking def improved. This was just a straight line test to show how much a few lbs affects acceleration.
The difference is very noticeable on low power manual cars at low rpm. I guess in a 1.4l with 85hp you have like 20hp at 2000rpm, add the A/C on a hot summer day you may end up with 15hp. now, accelerating out of that low rpm (just everyday driving) there is a big very noticeable difference when you add heavier wheels.
i'm running the enkei raijins on my gti and i absolutely love them!
I went w neupeed 18x8.5s, nite and day over the stock Austin's..... good content
Weight is a good point but why no mention that 17s are actually smaller by 11mm( 225/45 17 is 634mm vs 645mm for 235/40 18) or so in diameter that definitely helping to accelerate faster than bigger tire.
Thanks👍🏼
Overall tire diameter will affect the amount of torque that is put to the ground, per gear.
Thank god for this comment, I was starting to lose faith in humanity reading some dribble being posted here 😂. There is so much more to unsprung and rotational mass and it appears everyone reduces it down to simply reducing wheel weight with complete disregard for any other factors, ie overall diameter, never mind things like how that mass is distributed across the wheel tyre combo and impacts on lateral grip, positive or negative.
Thanks for your review and information
Just swapped out my wheels on my TCR to some SSR's. I definitely noticed a slight difference with the lighter wheels
If you wanted a nice and grippy summer tire for a fair price, I would suggest the General Gmax RS. I ran them on my 5.0 I had and they hooked 1st and barely spun any 2nd Fbo 93 2013 stick car with 3.73’s. And they are very grippy in the wet
I run GMax's and as well and I really like them!
Got a set of SuperSpeed RF03RRs to replace stock Austins on my 2016 GTI S. 25lbs to 18.1 lbs on each corner while still being 18 inchers. Car accelerates noticeably quicker. Currently EQT stage 2. Can't wait to see what happens when a TPC38BB performance model is added to the mix
Just did something similar with my 15 Q50 AWD. The OEMs + run flats were 63lbs inflated and those were 19x9 with 245/40R19. I switched to 19x9.5 Fast FC04s and Nexen SU1s 255/35R19 which were 43lbs inflated. Considerable difference shedding 20lbs a corner and 80lbs total. Pair that with deleting the big ass Nissan muffler which was about 15-20lbs, nearly about 100lbs off heh. The car feels way more nimble, acceleration is quicker from a dig, roll or at passing speeds/lower rpms.
Thanks for another informative video 🤙🏽
Appreciate you
hands down the best gti content there is. Bro actually breaks it down and shows you. jewel city ftw!!
Where’d you get your rpf1’s? I’ve had trouble finding 17 inch rpf1’s
Just wondering, what's stopping u to change all four wheels?
Nice! Are these the 17x9 +45 version?
Some grooved or c hook brake discs would go crazy with the 17 inch setup
Cool channel. Where is that rooftop lot? I wanna check it out. Thanks for the cool content
Sorry if I missed it but was the overall diameter between the two mentioned?
I have Volk Racing GR2s. 18” and 16 lbs. I notice acceleration and braking improvements due to unsprung weight over the 32 lb factory rims.
were the RPF1's weighed with the balance weights? those can be a few lbs sometimes. I've always put on lightweight wheels on my cars...a real world test i did was i raced 3 back to back runs against a friends car...went home, swapped wheels/tires, and we raced on the same road back to back 3 times the same evening, my car went from being dead even to slowly walking away from about 60+... so it does make a difference. On a track or the twisties, it would make a difference too with braking speeds and exiting corners. People always want to add power but forget losing weight where you can is 'free' power (better power:weight ratio). I run 18x9 RPF1's on my Focus ST and its a drastic difference, over 8lbs over stock wheels (and thats mount/balanced comparison)
Very insightful, ty.
Nice analysis. l run RPF1 17's and I've been happy with them. I saved a total of 44 pounds of unsprung rotational mass over the stock 18 inch wheels and tires. Also the little extra sidewall gives me peace of mind when I hit the many pot holes where I live. Wonder if you would have seen twice the acceleration benefit if you swapped all 4 wheels?
Do you also have the PP brakes? If so do you think it’s likely a rock could get in there like he mentioned?
@@rambow70 nope, no PP brakes on my '16 coupe, so I have plenty of clearance. I'd be nervous about running those wheels with the PP brakes and so little clearance, but good to know they fit! If you have PP brakes, I'd go with 18's to be safe. I've done a few other weight reduction mods to get it down to 2800 lbs with a full tank of fuel and the stock brakes seem to be up to the task with the reduced mass so I'm sticking with them for now.
@@chrisweber5327what weight reduction have you done?
@mustangmatt410 lightweight flywheel, Braille Lithium battery, resonator delete, removed rear seats and some interior bits in the rear like the cargo floor. It's a base 2 door manual, so it was already pretty light to begin with.
@@chrisweber5327How do you like the battery?
It’s En Kay lol. Love your contents. Nice build as well
Because drag is a major factor with acceleration at speed the effect of light wheels and tires will be much more noticeable at lower speeds as they will contribute a larger share of the forces to overcome. This is especially true for cars that can't spin tires in low gears.
I just swapped my rs3 oem rims to aftermarket. 57 pounds for oem and 46 pounds for same size 19" I can't wait to test it
Feel free to share your results
Went with HLT 17x8. Great
I may have missed it, but did your overall diameter change with the 17" wheel/tire setup? That could also account for the peppy feeling.
Yes it does, you are correct that plays a part on this. It shortens the gear ratio. It is expected that lighter wheels will perform better, but this test wasn't very accurate. Different parts of the road and not enough runs after and before. It's fine though can't expect a small channel to go too crazy
May not have been scientifically perfect, but you don't need to run a test whatsoever to know it's going to be better. Physics says it will be better. How much? That's the point really.
my 2023 honda civic sport 18 OEM rims 51.66 and aftermarket rims 18 41.70 and i notice acceleration is super fast and braking i'm impressive love it...
What size of wheels you are running
Diffrent tire brands have a weight difference themselves. Wish the same tire was used for apple to apple comparison. Curious if you filled up for the first run or second. Blue valve stems come by default with silver rpf1, red can be ordered separately but not substituted. Car looks good on either setup, but the rpf1 are very subtle vs the Ampliform
Specs for the rpf1’s?
keep the wheels man, super clean OEM+ look
How is with overall dimensions between them
weight savings esp with rotational mass make a huge difference, love the meats man. 17s FTW!!
Running HRE FF10 19X8.5 with P Zero PZ4 Sport tires. Amazing difference.
Cool video! I know this has nothing to do with this video but do you run a short shifter or anything?
It’s stock with a few custom adjustments I made
Are these RPF1 17x8?
I think your wheels look great. I’ve got a Tacoma, and I can save 7 pounds per corner switching to a lighter rim but I’m not sure if it would make a difference that would be the main reason for swapping.
Because truck wheels are already small in relation to their tire OD reducing the weight of truck wheels will have a much smaller effect than on a low profile car setup. This is due to the location of the mass from center of rotation. Now if you get lower weight tires that would make a big difference.
The majority of weight comes from tyres from an off-road style setup. As mentioned above the moment of inertia comes mainly from the weight furthest out (the formula is radius squared).
That is to say that you should focus on tyres and not rims.
No one in the off road community seems to weigh tyres however. Very hard to find information on it.
OOH How much I love manual ❤❤
I want to replace the DSG but it will never be good as the OEM💔
Bought a g70 3.3t awd the stock wheels are 36 pounds a piece! 19 in, swapping to wheels that are 22 pounds 19in, I'm happy about all the benefits, but the MPG is what I'm really happy about the 3.3t is thirsty man🤑
I found that my semi forged 2forge wheels changed everything, handling, acceleration ect,and that wasn't sizing down either,cars an Audi a1 s1
Now how about this test with all 4 wheels swapped and the 2 piece rotors? would love to see the difference
I chose rpf1's for the look but they are noticeably lighter than factory rims.
That’s only one gear too so over the course of multiple gear changes would definitely be effective
do u recommend a manual (with upgraded clutches ofc) for making 500whp+ over the dsg? or its just personal preference?
It’s preference. Both options will cost since you’ll need a upgraded clutch. With dsg you’ll need a good tcu tune.
@@JewelCity1 appreciate u ! and i love the build btw💪🏽 might be the fastest gti on yt that ive seen 🫡
those are prob my fav wheels of all time. the RFP01s
honestly seeing both sets together, i think silvers look better
I'd sell my Neuspeed Dream wheels for RFP01's if i ever had the chance
Did you check for difference in tire circumference between the 2 sizes? If not the same as the 18s the difference could be due the effect on gearing rather than weight.
The 225/45/17 is 1.69% shorter than the 235/40/18. So there is a slight gearing advantage with the 17” wheel too.
Also, the difference was not enough to upset the traction or ABS systems.
i put a 18" fast fc04 on my gti they were way lighter, very noticable diff in acceration and handling for the hand ass oem wheels
Idk if this is the place to ask but curious to know your thoughts on the mk8 gti? What do you think of that plat form?
Seems promising for hp but still waiting for the custom tunes. I drove an mk8 golf and the missing buttons made simple things complicated while driving
@@JewelCity1 I’m looking to purchase one so hopefully all works out. Looks like ur from SD also I’m in north county area. My other dilemma is idk to get auto or manual
@theenthusiast136 have you looked into the Elantra N?
@@MeltingRubberZ28 I have not a fan
Also, a tyre can lose well over 1 kg of rubber between new and ready for discard, and this loss of weight is also where it counts the most, on tbe outer diameter. My 235/35R19 Pirellis lost 1.3 kg of rubber each one between brand new and fully used up. That ks lile a swap for lighter wheels. So, light wheels and quite used up tyres = your beterr chances to get your personal record times (oh, and with increased tyre pressure, even more, for rolling accelerations)
What are the wheel specs for the fronts?
looks like 17x9
I think it could be slightly faster still with lighter 18s instead than 17s for the same total wheel+tyre diameter, due to with light wheels, tyre is heavier than alloy wheel, so more wheel and less tyre could be slighlty lighter and specially with less weight on the outer diameter where it counts most (because of same tyre width but lower profile, tyres can be lighter)
Overall, lighter wheels and tires combo will always outperform heavier wheels and tires, but a fair comparison would have been to test like with like, i.e. the same sized wheels with different weights (using the same tires). This way you can then definitively conclude that the differences in your results, all things being equal, could be attributed to the differences in the wheel’s weight alone and not other factors likes the difference in the wheel sizes.
You should look at some apex wheels if your thinking about changing up the look a bit.
Apex huh haha
Mk-gang roll calll all rise!🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Manual MK7 GTI? whatta dream!
I love mine :D
I wish you had it on a track for near perfect results.
I wonder if going from 235 to 225 would have made any difference as well, it would technically have less rolling resistance, either way an interesting video
Nope. Youll get less traction.
@@e0nema0tak1vif it’s the same tire, better sticker tire compound > width
If you can get enough traction, go with the absolute minimal tire possible for the least weight. But honestly, adding a couple of PSI to the turbo would cancel out any of the benefit of all this swapping wheels and tires.
Suspension action and steering would be affected nicely for track times if you're club racing. That's where it matters.
When you switch from 18s to 17s, you're measuring the difference in diameter, not the weight.
When you reduce the wheel diameter, it effectively equals to changing the final drive ratio
This video is 18 minutes longer than necessary
My factory wheel weighed 33lbs i put on on wider tyres with the same circumference and it now weighed 40lbs and felt slightly slower
My dad put on taller and wider tyres on his factory rims and his truck felt a lot slower
When i change my tyres again im going back with stock size, that extra 20lbs is a lot
What about doing lightweight front discs too. Would be good to see.
It can shave off some weight but won’t be as much of a drop as wheels
@@JewelCity1 why is that?
only change to lighter wheel/tire combo on the front bc it's fwd??? wut
This is all relevant to what type of racing you are doing. I race an mk4 at the drag strip every wed. And i found that the heavier wheel with a larger diameter tire will increase my 60 ft time vs my over all et time and my trap speed will be faster with a slower 1/4 mile time. The reason for this is because the diameter of the over all tire changes your gear ratio. Plus the heavier rotational mass prevents me from applying to much power in the first 60ft which allows me to grab traction better. If i reduce the tire diameter. I get a slower 60ft time but a faster 1/4 mile time with a slower trap speed. This is because the smaller diameter wheel is making the turbo spool faster but i lose the top end psi. There are way to many factors with just losing a couple pounds on your wheels. You have to take into account for your over all wheel diameter in relation to your gear ratio. You have to take in to account when the trubo spools in ration to you gear ratio. And when the turbo runs out of steam in relation to your gear ratio. After experimenting with many different tire sizes I found that just by changing from a 25.5 diameter tire to a 26 inch diameter tire on my mk4 made the car a 1/2 second faster in the over 1/4 mile time. And thats without going to a lighter wheel. So the larger diameter tire that matched my gear ratio at the end of the 1/4 mile put my rpm tap out right before redline. This allows the car to utilize all of its gears to the fullest potential in the 1/4 mile and still keep the turbo some what producing enough psi at the top end.
I honestly think the 18” wheel combo looks better than the 17”
17x8?
Rpf1’s are perfect
Different tyres too, you need to control more variables to even accurately say faster
Less undampend mass is the real benefit of lighter wheels. It is easier on the shocks to keep the wheel in contact with the road.
🏆
I'm running 17" over 400hp on my GTI
have you tried Forged Carbon Fiber?
Nope
cool, Imma throw some 19" wheels on my GTI...
That's a huge difference in speed! Now get your rears replaced!
That little bit could mean the difference between winning and losing, so i would say that it is worth it if you want to be a bit quicker.
Swapping all 4 wheels would make a bigger difference. And imagine comparing some cheap, huge, and heavy rims and tyres against some smaller light wheels and tyres. The difference could be easy 3kg per wheel. This means 12kg all together. They say 1kg at the wheel is like adding 7kg to the car. It would be like 7x12= 84kg. So it is like having a second person sitting in your car.
lol, Golf GTI 😂
The benefit of lighter wheels is most noticeable with lower powered cars IMO , although obviously it will make a difference with track times etc. I agree with other comments, all 4 wheels need to be changed.
0.10s won each ~400ft on track is a huge difference
Wheels and tires should always be the first upgrade before anything else, ignore all the clowns who stated that lowered cars on stock wheels and tires are better than stock suspension with lightweight wheels and sticky tires
How would you use a different section of the road with a diff slope value? The stretch of road has to be the same. Also, the tire diameter has to be the same to have a comparison of weight only differences. A smaller diameter translates to an effective diff gear ratio increase. You didn’t mention the tire diameters being the same. Redo this test plz.
didnt think 18" ampliforms were heavier than 19" oem pretorias from the golf r
They’re lighter
@@JewelCity1 I weighed my pretorias with the tires on them at 42lbs. The 19” prets are significantly lighter that the 18” prets
@@Kujashin This couldn't make less sense.
@@Shiftlinkage101 If only you knew what flow formed vs cast can do to the weight of a wheel. Look at the specs of the wheels google isn’t hard to use my guy
From what I remember it's every 1lbs off rotation it's like 0.10 sec off 1/4mile time or something close. Almost like taking 100lbs out of the car for every 1lbs lost in rotation.
I think its like 10 punds equals .10 sec and every pound of rotational is like 4. Maybe your numbers are a bit too much but i dont know
BRO … you need “TOYO R1R 255/40 17” … 200TW , good in wet … road force balances to perfection.
damn bro you race in the wet?
@@boostedbub217Yes
the difference is more notieceable in slower speeds under 60mph. It takes weight out from your car. You did it almost wrong here, but hey, you can keep testing and doing more videos.
True but Lower speed/gears would introduce more variables like tire slip while testing. we wanted to show a smooth acceleration between the tests.
15.8lbs (7.1kg) is light. Almost as light as cnc audi aluminium wheels, but i guess those enkei are CAST.
Anyway, maybe there's no significant gain in dynamic performance, but certainly it is for HANDLING and for transmission and suspension WEAR.
They are spin-forged, a process that shapes a wheel while it's in a pretty red hot state, turning.
The lightest you can go with alloy wheels is fully forged (fully milled out of a traditionally forged block of aluminum) but that's a LOT more expensive. Then, you take the leap to carbon fiber.
You just demonstrated it’s at least 11ft quicker. That’s more than a car length.
The smaller wheels look a lot better on that car
How would pebbles go where they don't fit? They are bouncing around. Its not an off-roader.
Seen it happen to someone with this exact setup.
Certainly can happen.
@@JewelCity1 I totally understand how much debris tends to go everywhere and accumulate but as someone who offroaded my car much I know where it goes and the inside of the wheel is not one place. You have to use some common sense. Calipers have low clearance in many vehicles and it does not pose a problem. If it did people would say you need to leave a whole inch always just in case rocks are coming through which they dont.
What was the total difference in diameter wheel+tire old vs new? That affects gearing which will affect times. Smaller = More Accel. Larger = More Top Speed.
In a larger mph sample size, you’d see bigger/smaller wheels taking a larger effect. In this case both are using different sizing tires to be a close match in overall diameter. This is why it’s a single gear test and mph results are captured after being fully spooled.
How manipulated that society is… all that is played on the speakers are commercials prices and unhealthy food sales 🤮
*NEED TO BE PINNED* Fact: The lightest wheels you can buy are 18", are you confused because obviously 17" and 16"s rims are smaller and weight less? Yes but wait till you put your tires on (ding ding ding), 18"s you can get the lightest tires and smallest side wall, in which tires weight MORE then rims. Tire selections for 17" and 16", may times 15" are heavy and taller tires. Are you ready for another mind blowing kicker? You can have a smaller rolling radius in a 18" wheel package, then a ny 17" AND 16" wheel package in existence , aka, you can actually make your car sit lower with an 18", then a 17" or 16". The only variable that changes is if you have an compact car, running very small brakes, that allow for a then a 15" or 14"....yet you're then maybe a little insufficient in the braking department in the name of light wheels. Most people need to clear big brakes.
It's a very funky chicken to have a 18" wheel (with tires) on the ground and roll up a 16" wheel, and the 16" are literally taller and heavier.