Sheldon Menery Rules Commander | Shuffle Up & Play #14 | Magic: The Gathering Gameplay
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- čas přidán 13. 11. 2022
- ▶Today the creator of Commander sits down with myself, Brian David-Marshall and Ced of One More Mana to play Pre-EDH, which is Commander without any Commander Precon cards.
▶Are you looking to Shuffle Up & Play games of Magic: The Gathering over webcam? The "Looking For Game" section of our Patron Discord is 100% free and open to everyone: / discord
►Check out my guests' channels!
Sheldon Menery @SheldonMenery
discordDOTgg/commander
Brian David-Marshall @Top8Games
www.fetchland.com/
Ced Senpai @ManaSquad
/ onemoremana
►Deck Lists
Sheldon's
archidekt.com/decks/3278041#P...
BDM's
archidekt.com/decks/3538529#P...
Ced's
archidekt.com/decks/3286038#B...
Prof's
archidekt.com/decks/3538510#P...
►Credits
Lead Editor: Kevyn Wallace
Assistant Lead Director: Nick Snyder
Music / SFX: Def Cat @defcatofficial
Intro VFX: Kyle Sullivan, Kevyn Wallace
►Special Thanks
Josh-TheProxyGuy
Andre Garcia
Jebari Dean
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May Sheldon Rest in Peace - Plenty of good times spent at Armada Games in Temple Terrace and he will surely be missed
I saw the news and instantly came to this video, I’m glad another person recognized the significance of this loss to the MTG community. Rest in peace, Sheldon.
yeah same. may he rest in peace@@ethanziebell3513
Is this the lasted posted gameplay of Sheldon online?
im new to commander and binching all tollarian episodes oh my god my he rest in peace i was out of magic for 15 years now getting into it again
@@zaahirre1142 There is another game he played semi on-camera (just his board, no face cam) with Olivia, Alias & Gavin on Elder Dragon Hijinks channel for their 1-year anniversary. Think that came out about 2 months after this episode
Rest in peace, Sheldon Menery. And from my perspective as a true fan of Commander, a humble thank you for all you've done with this game and this format. Godspeed.
Professor: "It's just a tree. It has zero power How is an elderly ent such as this in any way a threat"?
Idk ask Saruman 😂
hahahahah
Isengard is rolling in its grave.
That one goblin was right in the fellowship movie, “The trees are strong my lord, their roots go deep.”
Oh wow now that's a terrible "joke"
Saruman the white.
SARUMAN THE STINKY.
Oh dear is Sheldon ever grumpy at the idea of proxies at the table. I'm glad Prof is so tongue-in-cheek about it
That's alright. He's a cool dude and is allowed to have his own opinions like everyone else. I don't see why I should turn against someone for having an opposing opinion to my own.
@@TimmyTurner421 when that opinion is "i should have a superior deck because i have more US-dollars" then yes, you should turn against that person.
LOL i made the same observation. I thought Sheldon was going to pull out a DV for Prof to play with.
@@ich3730 No, I shouldn't. I politely disagree and go on with my day.
I think he sees it more as a provocation and thinks the situation is awkward.
3:14 I loved that professor tested the group by asking if they allowed a proxy in the match. The looks to each other faces, the almost awkward silence... dude... 😂
I think he was just testing Sheldon after their "your playgroup can decide" proxy discussion in the interview.
imo you shouldn't even have to ask if you have good quality proxies. the forest card proxy only worth asking about since not everyone memorized every card in your decklist. Otherwise it's nobody's business who printed the card or whats on the back.
@@Khanstant i disagree, if you're the only one playing proxys then nobody else stands a chance xD
the look that they gave eachother while he was saying it too lmao
Mr. Menery's face during the last little monologue there... you could cut yourself on that look 😅
Rest in Peace, Sheldon. Thank you so much for everything you gave to the Magic community. You will be missed.
Both Sheldon's and proffesor's decks being created by an anime girl makes this a so much funnier episode
So nostalgic hearing BDM's voice. Dude was like the Bob Costas of Magic The Gathering.
I'm to young to get either of those references ;3;
BDM giving his own play-by-play!
First time seeing him and I’d love to play a game he seems like a super solid guy
Who the hell is Bob Costas?
@@jonq5380 Old sportscaster. He was so good he got a ton of Emmys just for his sports commentary. (just in case you're **that** young, an Emmy is an award for excellence in Television)
Rest in peace Sheldon, ill be building a new commander deck this weekend in honor of your legacy.
R.I.P. Sheldon. You're a legend to all of us.
Love seeing BDM playing all these years later still.
I got to play him once at PAX in a 4 pack sealed Zendikar tournament. Got lucky with my pulls and draws and dropped Luminarch Ascension every game.
I just got back into Magic and commander a year ago and this was the video that introduced Sheldon Menery to me. RIP to a legend.
RIP Sheldon. May flights of flying hippos sing thee to thy rest
I was floored when Sheldon said his card was signed by John Petrucci! That's so cool (and slightly random, but hey.) Dream Theater is amazing, and LTE is phenomenal, too!
Brian is absolutely throwing hands this episode
100% lol. he's kind of a dick
Sheldon clearly is choking back an objection to the proxy cards.
This video will be last one Sheldon is in and we must cherish it and also remember him with this video RIP
Hey love this series. Seems very genuine and it's great. Thank you
Glad you enjoy it!
The fact that Sheldon has a card signed by Dream Theater is pretty rad.
“I will keep, and regret.”
I feel that.
Great people, great pod, great game. I especially adore Ced, and the weird cool deck he brought! Love to see the show and how much you put into it, Prof, and I look forward to the next episode.
Sheldon didn't go infinite. 8 mana doesn't go infinite. 12 does.
Edit: Sheldon said on Facebook that he had the Mirari's Wake in hand, but just forgot in the moment to put it down. Math checks out with the Wake.
They just told him he won so he wouldn’t make another ban announcement
He was netting 1 mana each time because of the bounce land and had enough initial mana that once he did that at least 4 times he was infinite.
@@darknova000 he's netting 1 Mana from playing the Whale, but lacks 3 from boumcing it. 1-3 is less than 0, therefore he loses Mana for bouncing and playing. He needs either a mana doubler or more Karoos.
@@pillegraknel4308 At 1:00:51 they show a shot of his lands. He has 13 lands, of which 1 of them is a bounce land. He had enough initial mana to perform this sequence at least 4 times which would pay for Palinchron's ability. This would allow for him to repeat the process over.
@@darknova000 it doesnt tho... every activation costs four mana, casting Palinchron taps 7, untaps 7 and he needs 4 mana every single time to bounce it back, the simic land only generates 1 extra mana, but he always needs 4 to activate, and 4 - 1 is still not netting him positive mana to go infinite
I wasn't expecting the prof to bully Sheldon from pre-game all the way through to the end
"Well you could own it" yeah I could also choose not to pay my mortgage. Go little proxy star! Don't let the man keep you down lol
I think it was some good teasing between pals
Just keep in mind that if you proxy cards i will too and i will not accept any complains for using cards like Gaes Cradle or Mana Crypt.
@@roercula8425 Because it's impossible to proxy without aiming for a 10 power deck? That's an unbelievably childish take.
@@rathlord I never saw anyone proxy a cool card thats neat for the deck it has always been for optimization purposes.
Or because people cant stand to not have everything available to them.
Outside of commander when i started with the "regular" game ive met enough people who wanted to play "casual" and "just with the cards they have" ignoring any banlist.
Which ended up beeing them playing their Sol Ring just for "Fun" in their Eldrazi deck while i was playing the deck i build out of my deckbuilders toolkit.
In commander im playing casual decks with no game winning combo why do you need to optimize against me? And why is it bad and or childish if i do the same?
@@roercula8425 cards can be expensive without being optimal, like 90% of the reserve list. Or I just want a doubling season because it’s a staple but I can’t afford a play set or more for multiple decks. Or I just want custom art.
Proxying isn’t all Mana Crypt, Gaea’s Cradle, and Power 9 cards. And it is utterly childish to either make that assumption or to decide that you’d simply play a max optimized cEDH deck because I have a single proxy in mine.
Luckily, I don’t have to play with asshats like you.
I have have had the "Diamond Valley" conversation with Sheldon more than once at Armada Games, and was met with a very similar. "Well you could own it" attitude. I just stopped asking him to play.
it's not a fun snarky response to give either, it's just a shitty passive aggressive one. the guy absolutely irks me and comes off as a jerk. I'd never want to play with somebody like that and I don't even use proxies or anything I just don't want the... arrogance?
@thatepicwizardguy It feels worse in person somehow, especially when you are fairly new to the format. He comes off as this ambassador to the game but acts more like a customs agent.
For those wondering, Mind Stone actually made its debut in Weatherlight, not Visions.
I caught that. There were a few mistakes in this episode. The professor didn't pop up to explain any of them this time, either.
@@JervisGermane It's a lot of work to keep up with every card and I imagine he has to spend much of his time producing, planning, and editing. It was still enjoyable to watch and his heart is in the right place.
Maybe he should hire some of us to help catch mistakes before the final video releases 😀
Absolutely nobody is wondering
I'm still very confused how Sheldon went Infinite... 7 lands untapped on etb that can make 8. He needs to spend another 3 to bounce... where does he make Infinite mana
You are correct. This was a misplay. Pali is 7 to cast and 4 to bounce. You need to have the 7 land produce 12+ to go infinite. This is most common with Heartbeat of Spring which I am sure is in the deck and probably in hand but he got ahead of himself. What he showed is not infinite.
exactly that!! I came to the comments to look if anybody else noticed. palincron only wins, if you can produce 12 or more mana with those 7 lands (11 for cast and bounce +1 to be positive) on that boardstate he should not have had any possibility to make infinite mana.
apology video when?
He was netting 1 mana each time because of the bounce land and had enough initial mana that once he did that at least 4 times he was infinite.
@@darknova000 doesn't work
The entire opening discussion is great. Proxies, alternate versions and banned cards that are in a deck to do cool things should always be allowed.
Tell the douchebag who made commander that. It makes sense that such a toxic format has such a toxic creator. (I’m an EDH player too btw)
I think the whole point of it being a discussion is because it shouldn't "always be allowed", but should be discussed. So, either the discussion was great (per you) or it was unnecessary because it should always be allowed. I think it was great.
Yeah, surprising people, on camera, when there’s been significant pre-event communication, and it’s reasonable that they don’t have alternate decks…
I think it was an example of what *not* to do.
@@alternateimagegaming that's my fault, I should have added in my opinion. Obviously that's not something I would ever force on another play group or my own if they were uncomfortable with it. I personally believe that someone's restrictions due to budget or time outside of the game should not translate to a restriction inside the game. I have personally found that without that restriction decks become more fun and creative.
@@mikeipp5226 for me it seems like not having available the most expensive and powerful cards leads to more creativity in deck building. "I might not have this 1000 dollar card, but how else can I make this work". There's almost no reason for proxies of cards you don't own, outside of testing for consideration to own.
Watching BDM play made me realize how much I missed him, and the fact that WotC has given no commemoration for what he did for the community is such a shame. At Wizards 30 he should have been invited for at least a day, and been given a ceremony dedicated to him and what he has done for Magic as a whole.
I have not heard one bad thing about BDM in all the years that I've been following, and he has such a geeky energy, but also a charisma, that it's just wonderful to hear him talking about Magic again.
Wow! You are so right! That probably applies to a lot of other people as well. Obviously as we all know, the people currently making the game don't have any ties or give any thought to its history. It really is sad.
The fact is that pro magic history isn't very important. The colossal majority of magic fans don't care and never have.
@@FlourescentPotato I get that, but his title as magic historian always seemed more ceremonial to me than anything. I enjoyed him because of his commentary on GPs and PTs (when those were a thing). He was there for the very first pro tour way back in 1996. He retires after being involved with the game for over 20 years and being one of the iconic voices of competitive magic, and WotC doesn't even lift a finger as he leaves. It would be like a broadcast great in baseball getting 0 send off as they go into retirement. It's not necessarily required, but it would have been a great feel good moment and I think a lot of people would have appreciated it. Having that moment to reflect on all the good a person has done for you and the game you love.
@@FlourescentPotato you have any data to back up this claims?
Rich Hagon and BDM are the voices of Magic commentary I know most. I didn't even notice it was BDM on the thumbnail cuz he's blocking his face a little but ya I would have watched this sooner! If they aren't honored by WotC that's a failure of Rosewater proportions lul.
I feel like I know how the prof feels about some of what sheldon does and how he conducts the business of the CRC
Right? This just felt like the professors being salty about rules committee for an hour. (Tbh I get why but still)
Rest easy Sheldon. You will forever be remembered.
As awkward as it was, I love the pre game convo about gold boarder and proxies. Great job displaying how kitchen table or non completive games should start out.
Definitely good timing for the initial discussion around proxies and being able to play them :)
Unfortunate that he went infinite without actually having a way to go infinite. Good game though. Really like this pre-commander edh concept (I started in M11 so it's edh how I started)
He had a simic growh chamber in play
@@Aaackermann Simic growth chamber gives him 8 mana with 7 lands. For palinchron to go infinite 7 lands need to generate 12 mana (4 for it's return activation + 7 for casting + 1≤ to generate mana on each loop)
@@Aaackermann still not enough. he needs a mana doubler or the original deadeye navigator combo. Or more bounce lands. He clarified above that he had a miraris wake in hand and didn't cast it on accident. technically he had the infinite but forgot to play the first half ha
@@xDixonDallasFan69x Yes, you are right. My bad! ;-D
RIP Sheldon. Appreciate your conttribution to the world.
59:41 kind of poetic how the professor shuffles his much hated sol ring to the bottom
Thought I was the only one that noticed. Seems hypocritical as he himself banned it
I miss hearing BDM talk about gameplay!
Edit: you should get Randy Buehler and Rich Hagon along with BDM for an episode of Shuffle Up and Play. Classic commentator nostalgia!
ME TOO!!!!!
Still come here just to pay respects
Love this game and the community
Ty Prof
RIP Sheldon, thanks for helping bring EDH to a wider audience, fuck Cancer.
Huge mistake at the end there. Sheldon does not have infinite mana from just the palinchron.
I was thinking exactly this. 8 is still less than 11
I saw that too. Unless im missing something he does not have infinite mana.
He was netting 1 mana each time because of the bounce land and had enough initial mana that once he did that at least 4 times he was infinite.
@@darknova000 how though, hes at a net loss after each untap, hed need more mana from somewhere to go infinite. After 4 cycles hes only getting 1 free bounce which still means hes going -3 in mana each time
@@darknova000 you need 4 mana to bounce palinchron. That's 11 mana total bounce/replay. Sheldon only had 8 mana worth of 7 lands
After hearing the news this was the first thing that came to mind. Rest in Peace Sheldon.
This is just an intellectual debate about a card game disguised as commander gameplay
Very excited to see another Shuffle vid with One More Mana crew, keep those coming Prof
Or the MtgGoldfish crew
Rest in peace and thank you for bringing such an awesome format for Magic. Thank you for making it magical. You’ll be missed.
RIP Sheldon. That this was his last gameplay video makes me so sad. We're going to miss you, Elder Dragon!
Thanks! It was lovely getting to play EDH with you at MTG Summit. Spectacular video.
That proxy stunt was bold haha
"I HAVE SOMETHING TO SAY, ITS BETTER TO BURN OUT THEN TO FADE AWAY!"
Loved the highlander kiergan reference that clearly either annoyed Prof to no end or just whooshed... hard.
Edit
Sheldon calling a player wormtongue, but as brain was playing an ent it should be fool of a took since that was who conned treebeard into war
RIP Sheldon. You will be missed.
Rest in peace Sheldon
R.I.P. Sheldon Menery ;-;7
Lmaoooo, the proxy questions, well played Prof!
Glad to see Ced came in his -Sunday- Monday best!
What a damn good trio to appear along with the Professor! Glad to see BDM here, and Sheldon on again!
We need a two headed giant game on this channel now. It’s been mentioned and needs to be played it’s an excellent format that has been forgotten by everyone but kitchen magic players
I agree! Love two-headed giant, but rarely get to play it
ah, clearly someone did not watch the video to the very end. :D go to 1:05:25
@@m1gr3nA that’s not two headed giant at all. See you saying that is exactly why he should do a two headed giant episode because people like you don’t even know what the format is. I’m not blaming you for not knowing I’m just telling you that’s not what two headed giant is. That’s what he said a guild wars game.
@@davidhowell1415 no, he said "guild war" as in they will use guild colored decks. in 2hd game. please explain how what was shown in the clip does not adhere to 2hd format rules as defined in comprehensive rules.
@@m1gr3nA two headed giant is two players playing their own decks combined into one player starting life totals can vary between 30-40 per game ( remember this is as sanctioned as commander is and battle bond was an unofficial commander set under the guise of two headed giant ) both people on a team draw and play lands as normal, you can share resources to cast spells the game ends when life total gets to zero, or one of the decks on your side is milled out it was a format used when you had 4 people that wanted to play with 60 card decks. The singleton rule doesn’t apply. It used type 1.5 ban and restricted lists nothing was prebuilt to work together it was a I’ll play this deck because it shared colors with your teammates deck. It was a way to play with 4 people before commander or any other 4 player game mode was around. Circa 97-2005 ish
RIP Sheldon, and thank you for the best MTG format
Prof playing proxies with the edh creator, that's what I call courage
It’s definitely not courage. It’s his show and if Sheldon objects, he looks bad. Prof is essentially leveraging public opinion against Sheldon’s preferences.
Sheldon did NOT create Commander.
@@jordanewers5375 Truee..
@@jordanewers5375 intentionally misplaying Palinchron for a panic win makes Sheldon look bad
@@jordanewers5375 Are you seriously calling about the Prof "manipulating public opinion" when Sheldon literally call himself "the creator of EDH". That's just insane.
I had only recently started playing Magic and found this channel even before that, this is going to be really interesting seeing cards that were before commander format came to be.
Hope Prof and everyone is doing great!
Love the relaxing, laid back feel of this. Not all over the top and flashy. Makes me want to go dig into my old cards and build a Pre-EDH deck. Love what you’re doing here!
Thank you for everything you gave the community, Sheldon. May he be remembered as long as any of us shall live.
Rest in peace, we will never forget you and your work for the community. Your name is know even here in Brazil. Tks for everything.
RIP Sheldon Menery, thanks for this format!
RIP Sheldon
"Its on the reserved list, they're never gonna reprint it" Its great comedy like that that keeps bringing us back to TCC, absolutely hilarious prof
RIP Sheldon Menery, You will be missed 😢
21:38 I'm so glad I wasn't the only one thinking there should be a Duran Duran reference with this deck.
I love everything about this video and crew, and have been waiting for this to finally drop.
The intro is perfect, because it showcases Step 0, as well as the benefits of being a wonderful casual format.
Rest in peace legend, thanks for participating in what is today my favorite format. I hope you can play even more where you are now.
Rest in power, Elder Dragon. And fvck cancer.
Pali is 7 to cast and 4 to bounce. You need to have the 7 land produce 12+ to go infinite. This is most common with Heartbeat of Spring which I am sure is in the deck and probably in hand but he got ahead of himself. What he showed is not infinite but he prob had it after drawing that many cards.
I was about to say, something wasn't adding up, but I wouldn't put it past him the missing piece was still in his hand.
@@olburgle2841 Under another comment, Sheldon commented that in the 30+ cards he drew, there was a Mirari's Wake and an Overgrowth. In the excitement, he got ahead of himself and played under the "Pali goes inifinite here" mindset. He easily had infinite that turn, it just wasn't on board, and the mistake didn't affect the overall ending.
The upside-down graveyard is also good if you play with a lot of people that ask to see what's in your graveyard...
34:16 This is my favorite Greater Good, I love the flavor text from Mary Shelley, the white border goes really nicely with the beautiful art and it helps the card stand out when I tutor for it. BDM's reaction to it was perfect, my play group acts the same way when it hits the table because I play Hogaak.
The “Duran Duran” joke made me giggle. Crap, maybe that’s a sign I’m getting old.
My favorite episode so far. Brian David-Marshall cracks me up!
3:10 - is that a sneaky "big butts and cannot lie" joke?
Thank you again, professor, for another great video! Sharpie on a forest was very nostalgic for me, because that's how my brothers and I played with "good" cards when we were kids (4e, Ice Age). 😊
Absolutely loved this game. Would love to see more old school EDH like this
Rest in peace.
I'm just getting back into MtG after about 30 years(very short childhood stint), and I am beyond grateful for your videos here at TCC. It's very sad to hear of Mr. Menery passing away, but beautiful to be able to watch these videos featuring him.
This was fun to watch! This series is my favorite game play series, thanks Prof!
52:19 props! DT is a great band and JP is one of the living legends of guitar.
And JP is a great band, too!!!!
Rest in peace, Sheldon Menery.
I really-really hope that there will be more of these videos, it's extremely fun to watch and I learn a lot from these as a new player!
I love the Command Zone, but man. Shuffle up has this energy that really gets me. I feel like this resonates more with the older players, and I oh so very appreciate it. Thanks Prof.
This show is realy turning up as a polish product. Good job Prof !
Rest in peace friend. Did BDM ever get his rematch? I'm definitely going to have friends over tomorrow to play some EDH.
as ad newer magic player,, its actually really fun and amazing to see older players still going. ^^
Prof absolutely owns a Diamond Valley.
That Pheldagrif looks like Post Malone's face with all those signatures on it.
Rip Sheldon Menery
I like the music you include in these videos. Easy to listen to, adds a more relaxed feeling. Great video as ever, glad you started this series!
He did the diamond valley thing just to piss off Sheldon
Good bye Sheldon, ty for commander.
Am I the only one who saw palinchron costing 4 mana to bounce back, so you'd need to make 12 mana to go infinite with it, and that suture priest only does damage when a creature enters on an opponent's field?
You are right on the Pali. The Pali was just missing Heartbeat of Spring and I am sure it is in the deck. That said the actual win con is that the Grif gives your opponents the tokens to trigger Suture Priest. Not a great showing from Sheldon but he stated at the end that it was not his deck. Had the pieces, just didn't play them cleanly as he wasn't super familiar with the build.
If the mana was infinite then Phelddagrif creates tokens on your opponents board so that part of it works fine. There just wasn't infinite mana.
In another comment thread Sheldon replied stating that he had the necessary card in hand, just got basically too excited and mixed up play order. Since there was no interaction happening it didn't change the outcome. ("In the big pile of cards that I had drawn was a Mirari's Wake (and also Overgrowth).")
@@__nobody__still bugs me lol. I mean we all make mistakes but it’s weird a table this dedicated to magic didn’t catch it. Oh well probably more of a problem with my ocd.
@@__nobody__ i think deadeye navigator was the intended card to go off with.
Love the pan-tilt zooms in to cards in these vids with the delightful easing in to place at the end. Super cool bit of choice in the editing craft there.
Very fun to see the old style of gameplay here! Reminds me of the old kitchen table 6-player pods back in 2012 and 2013. Good nostalgia here
I can't believe you got Sheldon to play a video recorded game on your channel!! That's so cool Prof! Also love your commander choice for this playgroup.
I’m a big fan of using the older cards. I recently built a Premodern edh deck and now I’m hooked.
The best thing about this video is that it really feels like you're at the table with these guys for a game of magic, and I'm here for it.
This is one of my favorite videos of shuffle up and play. To great legends of Magic the Gathering playing magic. It is wonderful to see these guys play.
There seemed to be a certain level of tension in the room at game start like they all just had a argument right before the cameras rolled.