Obersoldaten VS Everyone - CoH2 Guide
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- čas přidán 3. 07. 2024
- An in-depth comparison of Vet 5 OKW Obersoldaten VS all allied long-range infantry specialists
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Can you please do Obersoldaten MG34 vs STG44
Whatever you do , don't let the ober pick up another LMG.....
why?
@@El_Tanque_ they will delete almost any infantry squad in most circumstances; and as the video states, the mg34 makes up for the squad's bulk of the DPS, and if you double that with another lmg......
@@notrequired602 oh, I thought it was for something negative actually
**DONT LET THEM HAVE 2 BARS,SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE HERE**
Yeah
Sacrifice a ober squad and pick up their mg back lol
I am surprised the Commandos did so well at max range considering their Stens are useless there. Those Brens are scary in their hands.
Yeah they have almost 2x the DPS of tommy brens.
Nothing to be surprised at, LMG units get their firepower from unit that is holding the MG. Same way Grens are viable, 3 models are there mostly soaking damage while fourth one is dealing damage. And I think commandos get some bonus with Brens as well.
@@GonkOrange even vet 3 Tommy? I think they have faster reload
@@GonkOrange even vet 3 Tommy? I think they have faster reload
Another fantastic video, thank you!!
As I know obers have the second smallest target size among axis units the first one is JLI ( jagers light infantry ) with veterancy bonuses JLI have 0.46 when obers have 0.50
EDITE (again): JLI had their vet 5 RA bonus removed, so their max vet RA is "only" .57. Obers are the best at .50
yeah you're right! JLI are just crazy good...
EDIT: Just checked Serealia, says JLI are .57 at vet 3 and .46 at vet 5
But according to the veterancy guide at CoH2.org they don't get any received accuracy bonuses at vet 4+5>
Therefore, somebody is wrong :D I don't know who though. A brief survey of the patchnotes didn't give me any more info.
They are not only among axis infantry.
1rst are JLI, 2nd Obers, 3rd rangers
@@armano4125 Rangers are .52 at vet 3 (according to serealia)
Just checked, the vet 5 RA bonus was removed from JLI. So they only have .57 Received Accuracy. Obers, that means, have the best at .50
@@GonkOrange I'm talking about vet2 bonus on JLI
The thing is, once allies get explosives, you're most likely getting wiped. Katys, Calliopes, Scotts - anything that makes boom really does the job on obers thanks to the stupid special weakness to explosive damage.
Well in the end you need a counter to make them a hard time
Absolutely love guides like these. Very helpful and fun to watch. You could revamp some of these guides and create a master Coh2 playlist with tons of guide videos for each faction 😁😁
THANK YOU, YOU BEAUTIFUL, BEAUTIFUL MAN
I did something recently that I have never seen elsewhere : pick an lmg and then upgrade with Stg44+. Sorry but it's too shocking to explain how the 1v2 3 stars penals turned out
Keep going
Obers are a non doctrine premium, they aren't meant to stomp on doctrine premiums unless you out micro your opponent. They're for making conscripts/riflemen/sections literally insignificant.
Thanks for the tips now I'm about to make people rage 😈
Also consider Penals who picked up lmgs, they are good too. Win at least 50% when they got a mg42
Imagine obersoldaten upgraded with 2 infrared stg44s then picks up 1 lmg.. 😈
Obers are great for a non-doctrinal unit. But I tend to lose them so easily to any aoe effects, be it tank shots, off maps, rocket arty, or mortar fire.
If allies had gren rifle nades, I don't think my Obers would ever stand a chance of gaining vet, lol.
I have feeling that they have some hidden explosions penalty. Both Grens and PGrens are much more survivable than these guys. I mean for Grens its obvious, but I also have much easier time preserving PGrens than Obers for some reason, both LMG and StG version.
What about obers that pick up a dropped LMG? Or obers vs double LMG grens?
I mean that's a niche case and not really worth spending the time testing
Would be interesting to see how things changes if you manage to pick another weapon, bren, a dp, bar or whatever
MG34 is basically the best LMG for infantry in game, it has the best DPS out of any infantry LMG upgrade...so there's no reason for them to pick up anything else before they upgrade MG34
If you pick up another gun obviously the Ober will be even better since they can get another gun off the ground.
@@henryhamilton4087 I meant if you picked another gun aside of the mg. Would like to see how much the numbres grow...
If the obers picked up another mg they would win all of these engagements 100% of the time. There's no reason to even test it
Fun fact, airborn guards have 3 weapon slots, and if they pick up 3 mgs that NOT dp, they have big chance to win obers
@@GonkOrange that is nearly impossible.
What makes them OP is the OKW get them natively. No other faction gets that outside a doctrine ability and they also get the king tiger natively qnd they get vet 5. Only weakness they have is no snares so if you blob them you get just drive over them with tanks unless they have spammed raketenwerfer that never misses and always pens.
They really aren't OP. Gonk was comparing vet5 Obers with vet3 units, but it takes a lot more to get the Obers there and in most games they'll never get there. Also, they arrive pretty late in the game, usually around the time that plenty of very strong anti-infantry stuff is making its debut.
Also, the Raketenwerfer absolutely does not 'always pen'; I have seen it bounce off an IS-2 twice in a row.
If you really think these units are OP you should try doing a few games as OKW. See how easy your game is...
Like Kill3rCat said before me, they aren't that "unbeatable", they're just specialists that excel at one thing. They are kinda mindless to use and quite strong if allowed to vet up. However, they come at a late tech timing allowing your infantry as an Allied player to get a veterancy edge over them so even if you don't have vehicles or artillery, you can still tame them or at least match them.
@@MBKill3rCat Schwerer is usually up between 11 - 13 mins. Giving access to Obers. That's not awkward or late timing for team games.
@@XIGuyIX I would disagree. Sure, you get access to Obers then, but it's going to take you a few more minutes to get 2-3 squads out, and then you need to upgrade them with MG 34s, and even then, you've got a veterancy edge over them. If you don't have a Katy by 15 mins, I'd be shocked.
@@MBKill3rCat Standard build order for Soviets wont generally have a katy by that timing. By 13-15 mins most soviets have a t-34. Majority of Axis players will have a p4 out by then, katy is too risky.
2:25 how do you activate invencible cover?
in normal game and whit no invencible cover, obers vs guards infantry got 0 wins of 12 fights
great video, as always
Coh2 cheat mod II
So the thing is on the map most of the green cover won't be destroyed by PTRS. But sandbags are easily destroyed by them.
@@GonkOrange ye, i have the mod, but don't know where that option its xD
wheird a 0 vet command panther it's faster than a vet 5 command panther
or i managed to fk up in some very weird way
@@mr.pilchard4548 selected unit -> health -> invulnerability -> enabled
Or something like that iirc
@@GonkOrange thanx :D
Where did you get the veterancy stat sheet at 1:35 ?
C O M B A T U N I T R E A D Y !
I tested them a moving into eachother, no cover.
Every squad here (not pathfinders) performed at around the same strength.
Simply losing to Obers on average being at 1 full model health remaining.
Guards rifle performed far worse even with me controlling the guards and activating firing positions immediately.
So the performance of guards is really amplified in cover to cover fights.
Also when A-moving squads into eachother the Obers have extremely powerful focus fire and will often drop models on the first burst.
Overall it seems the test in the video was favorable to allied units.
Yeah Obers are one of the best a-moving turn off your brain squads in the game, no doubt. Probably why OKW is seen as the "noob friendly" faction.
Raid sections with upgrade, 7 men Conscripts, SVT conscripts, Penals at medium range, grenadiers with LMG for comparison, rifleman with 2 bars or m1919, etc...
Nah, oberschweines will kill all of them
Raid sections with Vickers k are close range unit, no point in testing them here.
All the other units will lose to vetted obers at long range 100%.
@@GonkOrange lose by how much, clearly we are interested to see
@@GonkOrange raid section close range unit, vicker K is LMG
@@BruceLee-tm3cg the Vickers k has similar stats to the BAR.
Does that include the 3% + accuracy perk added?
You mean intel bulletin? No, I did all the tests with no bulletins.
Does the Jaeger light infantry beat ober?
try stg44 in mid range heavy cover
You really loaded up the pathfinders with a near-impossible weapon set for them to lose?
This is pathfinder shaming!
Well, USF lacks long range specialists so I think he just put the PF there for more options
The only problem of course is the PF will be vet 3 by the time the obers hit the field. They’ll be bleeding like crazy for 5-8 mins before that vet 2 bonus kicks in.
dude if theres obers just get shock troops
But of course, people still will be complaining "axis OP ". Imagine those matchups without cover or in closer range or without veterancy. Sorry, german elite infantry has only 4 models while allied have 6 sometimes 5. No wonder that even in best conditions obers have 50/50 chance. Their only merit is they dont need doctrine to be deployed.
Lol Axis is OP and way easier to play
@@xujok lol, A-move allies always complain
The obers are still crazy good, 50/50 win rate vs a unit that takes much more munitions and (depending on which unit) much more micro to put in a "winning spot" plus the fact that they are just part of your tech tree and have no build limits (airlanding officer, usf officers).
Axis still op tho
@@DustyPazner i'll never understand how you guys manage to fk up whit allied forces.
they only way i can loose is when i got 2v1 from the begguining or when allied players cry and abandon at minute 3 cuz "they loose the position" (or manage to loose 2v1 whit 4 tanks vs 0 armor)
Can you make a video comparing mg34 and assault package?
czcams.com/video/zIO8Ythkruc/video.html
Check out this video from my bro Syriss. It's in german so you'll need to turn on subs, but he covers both upgrades in detail.
@@GonkOrange Thanks.
Honestly, "obers op" mindset is an indication of newer players. Been there myself. There were plenty of times I got stomped by okw blobs with obers leading the way. But as time goes on, I realize, how niche obers are. They have limited utility, come at awkward timing: mediums roll around, indirect fire rain from sky, doube/triple mgs camp the flanks etc. So, the answer is, as usual, git gud
I almost never build obers as OKW, personally.
Most games I have JLI or Panzerfusiliers, which function as kind of "semi-elite" infantry and I don't want to pop cap myself by building a squad of obers on top of that.
I only build Obers if I lose a squad of volks and don't want to go through the experience of a non-vetted Volks getting stomped on by vetted allied infantry.
They have an overloaded kit, they dont lack utility. They just cant fight tanks
@@armano4125 they do. Usually the "utility" you want are snares (huge deal), low reinforce cost to recrew team weapons, survivability (to cap VPs under fire and generally stay on the field) and useful roster of abilities (like button, mines, camo etc)
Obers are really good at killing things and ok at field presence (tough, but low model count). But late game a lot of things are really good at killing infantry, and you usually want something more from your infantry, then just firepower.
They are nice to push flanks and side VPs due to their abilities. If there’s an mg holding a VP just smoke the line of sight. Throw them with conventional infantry and they’ll rip and tear as well. I love how they wipe AT crews. But yeah, one bad roll of the dice and they are wiped. They are good and in some cases maybe too good, but putting all eggs in one basket is no bueno
I agree for the most part, however it has to be noted they perform significantly more abusive in team games as OKW player can afford to build 2~3 without much consequence. And blobbing them together + vision tools basically forces any infantry into instant retreat opening up a flank for attack.
Also the test is a bit skewed since the Obers are known for sniping off models within 1～2 burst, which is harder in green cover fights allowing the Obers to take more damage than they normally would. The Obers would perform a lot better in yellow cover which is also the most common enviroment
can you try having obers and paras shooting at conscript to see which of them would kill conscript faster?
i feel like obers are much much better at wiping than paras
You can try any matchup you want, just download cheat mods 2 from the steam workshop and play around with it
So what is the best cost efficiency infantry unit? Ober or guard rifle?
I'd definitely say guard rifle. Considering they they come on the field earlier, have both anti infantry and anti vehicle abilities, and their reinforce price can be kept down my merging, while also allowing them to stay on the field longer.
Arguably the best elite unit in the game, in terms of power, flexibility, and price.
@@GonkOrange and they in the soviets' best commanders lol
Is STG upgrade any good on obers?
You don't risk losing the LMG to the enemies if the squad die, you can detect snipers and other camouflaged units (not an important bonus) and the squad now ignore cover which is a very powerful ability. But because they are now specialized for mid to close range combat if you give them STGs, if you want to make multiple Ober squads you only make 1- 2 with STG, the rest still equipped with LMG. Assuming you can even afford to have that many Ober squads.
does that mean that vet 3 obers vs vet 5 obers would draw ?
Yes
Is there any use of the stg upgrade when you have the mg34
You can't upgrade with stgs if youve already upgraded with the mg34
In general tho I prefer the mg34 if I have the choice.
They come with a greater detection range, which is great vs commandos and pathfinders. They also shred obers even with the lmg34 at long range when behind cover. This is because they negate a portion of the cover bonus.
Not gonna lie I do like the obersoldaten,
However! In terms of being my most favorite ❤ axis infranty I honestly still love my panzergrenadiers because of thier intended design. What I'm trying to say is that I notice that obersoldaten are axis default elite infranty that meant for defensive playstyle (thier default weapons and upgrades is bolt 🔩 action rifle and a lmg) while my favorite unit panzergrenadiers are meant to be elite infranty that are aggressive and breakthrough enemy defensive which is what panzergrenadiers are meant for! Their equip with assualt rifle (every model) bundle granade and when veterancy they gain the combine arm ability which enhanced their speed and survivability when close to friendly vehicles which is perfect for attacking the enemy!
Please do a video on panzergrenadiers 😁
Falchenmjagers best
what about obers with infrared stg44 ?
Really good, best used against players who abuse cover
@@armano4125 imagine using cover, wow such abuse.
MG34 Always superior unless vs camo units, even in heavy cover.
Did not test at very short range as those fights usually end with a grenade exchange and retreat.
Usf player here. Pray for me lol. Just can't deal with mgs anymore. Pathfinder only thing that helps early on and still iI feel like over half the game I'm playing dodge the mgs and lmg. M20 comes to late to spot and enemy light vehicles are pushing you around by then while your 50cals get melted and reketens just retreat while you lose vehicles in a single volly lol. Idk why they ever nerfed captain, lieutenant and m20 zooka. Smoke is meh it works on occasion if not dealing with multiple mg coverage. It still kills me that the fighting position is damaged to small arms fire includeing mgs so no way to hold a spot for long enough yet if i get behinde an enemy position i need to have zookas. If usf had better vision it wouldn't be so bad but dam. Imagine just giveing engineers some vision..common both UK and soviets get multiple vision options includeing snipers and flare. Then we all know about non doctrin artillery, elite units and tiger...common.
Guess I should just be happy my rifleman can use rifle grenades now without needing veterancy after constantly getting fully wiped by artillery fire and grenades to allow openings for panther pushes.
Surprised paratroopers did so bad for needing to spend 120 munitions... bad enough the single m1919 is more expensive and still less effective.
They Excel at being replacements for dead volks
How this dudes cost 9 pop cap but rangers has 10?
Because rangers lead the way.
There are much more other actions are effect this game. there are huge bug like Usa and British inf. lmg rifles are hit much more accurate for on retreat enemies and it makes you lose all units so easy but if you are OKW you can not wipe any retreat units so easy. If want to know true test statistics, do not position as same directions. Units are targeting to enemy as first close model. Infantry units have different position on lineup. For example; when volks are 5: (2 front) + (3 back) while riflemans 5: (3 front) + (2 back). It means voks have 1/3 ratio targeting same model of rifleman's but rifleman's have ratio 1/2 of same model of valks. It makes rifleman's advantage to attack and kill volks model faster. when volks lose 1 model they also lose fights 4/5. That is why this game have not true balance. Systems coordination works like checkered notebook for inf units and angles, positions are very effective. You can test it with sandbags. Build sandbag on 1th position of reverse side of the parallel white square from atack direction. you will see units positioning at 2th green points of the sandbags. When tank attacks to your units it can not damage with main gun until it destroy sandbags. Only mg did damage at that time. That is why game have bad coding after CoH1. They try to make it copy paste as what they see from coh-1 but they have no idea about how it is works in details. They have no idea many of other elements like key binds, UI design, options, key customization, Graphic Design (They don't even know the difference between the two concept art and graphic design). True question is. Why they start to make CoH3 when CoH2 is still early beta mode.
I don't understand any of this comment.
@@GonkOrange Do you want to understand?
cant understand any of this comment
@@gflvnfp2873 you have to know some math and geometry to understand. But also I can not explain that in English well. That is about game mechanics. I have to make a video for this.
I get what you are saying :)
Their damn grenades capable to overpressure light to medium tank but I. Game nah jack shit can't do shit.
countering obers with inf , its like countering tank with infantrysection , you can easily deafet them with mortar tank , because 4 man team 1 shot can deal good dmg on them and force to retreat.
What the hell is mortar tank?
@@phoenixdelta346 i mean mortar and tank
Ober comes just too late to be good.
蘇聯的是傘兵?? 蘇聯最強的步兵不是 傘兵啊
Honestly they are unfortunately such a downgrade from CoH 1 Knights Cross holders ngl
Another myth about axis units , sadly allies players overestimate axis units .
Allies are very op
Im disappointed comments like these still exist in 2k22.
@@armano4125 explain