Toyota Supra MK4 | Over Hyped or Legendary?
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- čas přidán 30. 06. 2024
- Experience a paradigm-shifting, high-impact collaboration between Albon Films and Savagegeese, revolutionizing the MKIV Supra Turbo narrative. We detail how this car was created and what that means 30 years later. Expect disruptive innovation, breathtaking visuals, and unparalleled expertise. Don't miss this game-changing, value-added content that will captivate and inspire enthusiasts worldwide. The other cars from this era are the Mazda RX7, Nissan 300ZX, Mitsubishi 3000GT, and Acura NSX.
Albon CZcams Channel:
/ @albonfilms
#cars #toyota #history
Index:
00:00 Savagegeese Intro
1:22 The Story and History as Told By Albon
12:24 Perspective and Pricing
15:00 One of the Last True Toyota-Made Sports Cars
15:52 The Mechanical Story
17:48 The Golden Age of Japanese Mechanical Engineering
20:17 Driving Impressions
26:13 Final Thoughts - Auta a dopravní prostředky
I bought mine in 1999 for $18k with 2300 miles on it and only put 2k miles on it since. I sold it right after Covid for $154k. This was on the advice of my father who at the time worked for Toyota. He said “buy this and barely drive it and when you’re in your early 40s, you can put a couple of your kids through college” well, I’m doing just that.
Wall Street bets level of return on a car. Hate to see you living out my dreams lol
That's awesome, if it were me I would've bought two. One for sale and one for me 😂
Things that didn't happen for $200, please. Should have invested the money in 1999 into the stock market... would be worth way more than $154k, on top of the devaluation of the dollar over that time.
Not to be a hater, but this is why cars shouldn't be investments..... payed insurance on it for 22 years and drove it an average of under 100 miles a year just to make less back than putting that 18k in any tech stock in 1999. People always argue that cars like this are investments you can drive... and then turn around and never drive them to keep the value up. I'll never get it, truly, and it ruins these cars for people who would actually use them as they're intended to be used. If you had put that 18k into Apple in 1999 (~$0.5 a share) you'd have $5.5mil at today's price
Mk4 Supras are good cars, but r3t@rds have massively overpaid for them used since the 2000s. Honestly surprised $154k is all you got assuming it was a turbo 6mt, given how stupid and beanie baby tier the automotive speculative bubble has been for the last 5 years, and that top trim Supras have been commanding near or above six figures unmolested for over a decade now.
Mark and Jack kept me captive in their basement for six months to make this video. When they finally released me I ran home to my wife who was already remarried to a man who drove a Nissan Murano Cross Cabriolet. My life is ruined but the video is pretty good tbh so I guess it's cool.
Married to the guy with the Murano Cross Cabriolet ... that is harsh dude :)
You from naperville? cause theres a ton of those stupid murano cabriolets there.
Sacrifices must be made to feed the content machine. Maybe she remarried the man with the Murano Cross Cab, however you helped the guys at savage geese make a (1) video, who really won, if she wanted a cross cab man maybe she was leading you to the cross cab life, rejoice for freedom is suffering.
Oh well, you have a Supra. How bad can it be?
legend
As someone who personally DID grow up with the MKIV Supra (I owned 6 of them between 1999 and 2017), I really want to thank you guys for your wonderful and thorough video celebrating this impressive car from the golden era of Japanese engineering. Although many of us did realize and appreciate the car for being the legend that it is viewed as today, it also felt a bit like a secret to those of us who knew back in the day.
Your technical assessment and feedback about its driving dynamics were excellent btw, and shows that you guys really do have a keen sense of what makes a performance car great. The primary example of that is the level of steering feedback, which is absolutely over-assisted and more suited to a GT car than a sports car. Both the steering and the brakes did not offer the feel of several competitors at the time, but yet the overall package was tremendous. That this car could be compared at all to an NSX, third generation Mazda RX-7, or Porsche 911 is actually amazing considering that it was more touring focused. But the legendary combination of 2JZ-GTE and Getrag V160 really gave it a better foundation than anything else out there, particularly when modified.
You were right to call out the Fast and Furious movie as having something to do with the Supras growth in popularity, I also believe that would have happened over time without the movie as nothing else was quite so robust from Japan during that era. It's the 'modern muscle car' that gave you a better foundation than everything else, and was able to turn and stop really well with just a few modifications away from stock. When it comes to adding power, the Supra remains nearly in a class of its own, and it was all the way until 2009 with the Nissan GT-R (R35) debuted that you had something that finally surpassed what Toyota had built so much longer before.
My sincere thanks to the team at Savage Geese for helping us to remember and commemorate such a great car that helped to shape my automotive life. Although I don't personally own Supras anymore as I agree they are not $100k+ cars to me, I will also never forget these amazing cars and wonderful community of people that I still value so much in my own life. Oh, and don't feel bad for me as I still own a turbocharged Lexus IS300 (with T56) and a Lexus IS-F, two other legendary Japanese cars that I will love forever. But in my heart I will also always be a Supra driver! 🤩
This guy is a legit Supra OG. I remember him back in the day on supraforums.
I love my Lexus IS-F - have owned it and daily driven it since new in 08. Don't get rid of it. I bought an MKV Supra to go with it - great pair of cars.
@@electrikoptik Haha agreed. Steve is a legend and hes right, this video nailed it on the supra overall experience. Its not a sports car (its a touring car) but dont also forget Supra Nationals (Now TX2K) was also the low key supra racing scene before FandF. That also helped it grow in popularity, and youtube of course once that arrived. I still have my Supra, probably wont ever get rid of it. Got my TT 6 Speed Car for $20k back in the day. Its more a cars and coffee vehicle for me now.
You had six Supras? That’s almost $600,000 right there.
LOL The MAN the LEGEND, The MR Hardtopper himself!
Nostalgia is priceless.
I hate watching these videos because they always pull at my nostalgia strings and make me want what I realistically can't afford or should buy if I could. That being said I will keep watching these videos because they are awesome!
Hard to believe it’s 30 years since the JDM hay day. I remember these days like yesterday. Thanks for the memories and review!
comments are right, you should review the Mazda Rx-7. with all the Mazda support it must be possible
They could borrow mine if they were in Texas! Lightly modified R1
Sold my R1 to a fellow enthusiast a few years ago to help pay for a house. I wasn't driving it much due to other commitments but I do miss owning it, not least of all because it's a piece of automotive art
The sexiest of the JDM
Based on the other savagegeese videos I've seen, I think they would enjoy a well-sorted RX7 with working sequential twin turbos and good tires. It's not nearly as powerful as the Supra but it feels much more agile and I think the interior design is much better-looking.
From 1992 to 95... What a time for auto enthusiasts. The C4 just boosted it's bhp. The RX-7 was a clean sheet design. The 3000GT VR4 and Stealth. The new kid on the block 300ZX TT who took this segment by storm in 1990. Finally the best of the group the Supra Turbo. I raced against the imports with my 92 Z51 Vette and it was tiring how often the manual equipped Supra Turbo would beat the vette. Great time for this segment.
The 300zx more groundbreaking and visually impressive than the Sup when it came out in 1990.
@@letsgocryptos the 3000GT VR4 was much more technically advanced than either and better looking IMO
that was a crazy time. Only thing Toyota didn't have at that moment was a compact lightweight RWD vehicle, but they had everything else. GT-Four, AE92, SW20, Soarer, Sera, hell even the Paseo was fun.
Very true! Great time for many cars. Galant VR4, Prelude VTEC, Integra GS-R etc.
I have a 6-spd 94 Corvette now. I really enjoy it. Much more than I thought I would being an import guy.
@@andydhillon1977 It's hard to go wrong with a corvette of any gen, they're all fun.
The idea that the mk4 Supra was ever unknown, unwanted or under appreciated is revisionist history. Having grown up in the import scene going back to 1995 I can say we all wanted one, 25k In the year 2000 was still a lot of money for a Supra. And lastly the Mk4 Supra was in the first Fast and Furious because it was already solidified as an amazing tuner car.
Yeah that's fair. I was thinking too when Albon was saying it was considered a shitbox and you could get one for 25k in the mid 2000's that those two things together don't make sense. 25k is new car money, buying a used sports car for that money is still a big purchase.
@@CockatooDude autos were like $16-20k in 2005-2010 6spd was $22-25k for your average color driver car under 100k miles.
The Supra was never unwanted or unknown, _but it wasn’t this mythological beast back in the 1990’s either._ *The truth is always in the middle.* Yes, I was in college from ‘96-‘00 so I remember it well. Sales numbers show the MK4 Supra was NOT lighting the world on fire. Its peak sales (1994) would be one of the worst for the current MK5 Supra. The Supra wasn’t selected because of its tuning prowess. The studio had other cars in mind for the movie. But when Craig Lieberman took Rob Cohen (FF1 director) on a drive in his modified Supra, Rob said he had to have the car in the movie.
Again…the myth of the Supra often exceeds reality. I’m not saying it wasn’t an amazing car. But its legend grew with the FF1 movie and later the advent of CZcams and drag race videos a few years later.
I have to also give credit to Polyphony/SONY for their role, creating ‘Gran Turismo.’ This was the first game where we could modify the power, suspension, gearing and aerodynamics of these cars. And people recognized how potent the Supra was. But they also recognized how potent other cars were that we didn’t get from Japan…
@@bamboosho0t I think your correct in saying it has turned into a mythical car.
I think it’s value these days had more to do with its low sales numbers and the people that wanted them 20 years ago actually having money now.
I still think F&F influence on its status is overrated.
I’ll continue consuming this throughout the day, but from what I’ve seen, youve done an incredible job giving this car the detail it deserves.
@DOGS LOL He lives his life a quarter mile at a time
Unreal d riding
Glad that Albon are getting their name out there. They make such good videos. Especially since they expanded out from Supra content to mini-docs.
Best automotive docs on CZcams
Thank you!!!
@@albonfilms MKV is still a bad ass car isn't it?
@@albonfilms so close ur trying to kiss us
Really great video. I’m surprised one thing wasn’t mentioned in regards to the Supra’s popularity though: Gran Turismo. Most of the people who love these cars were kids or teenagers when Gran Turismo was released. That game sparked a love in many (me included) for all these Japanese cars that we either didn’t get in the U.S., like the Skyline, or couldn’t afford at the time. Maybe it’s just me, but any time I think NSX, Supra, RX7, 3000GT etc, I think Gran Turismo immediately.
This is probably 60-80% of the JDM craze right now, all the kids who grew up playing Gran Turismo.
Really enjoyed this video. Gen-X Supra luster and in 2003 I got a 1995 Turbo for 25k with 44,000 miles 6-speed targa. I don't really care what it's "Worth", subjective anyways and I will never sell it. So, to me it's a perfect GT car. Agreed, it's not rough edged and is compliant and comfortable for long trips or just a good cruise. The looks are still spectacular and very rare, along with the stout powerplant, beefy short throw trans, and good brakes - It still feels very special to drive and be seen in it after all these years.
Even by today's standards I think this car looks great. Awesome video fellas.
Another outstanding quality video from SG, thank you again
I think it's great you mentioned the Lexus SC300 played a role in this car coming about, great details in this review.
mentioned for about 1.2 seconds lol.
Fun to see a collaboration like this!
The technical know-how from both Albon and SG is off the charts. That's how passion for cars looks like. A collaboration that should have been done before and should happen more, you guys compliment each other. Another documentary styled review of a car that's over 25y old and still done so good... Thanks for doing the effort!
SG technicality off the charts? You mean in the negative? Because they aren't subject matter experts on autos.
Great video, thanks your hard work with each of these legends.
Great Work Between You Guys and Albón, hope you keep this up.
Just goes to show how much engineering for chassis/suspension has coming a long way in the last 30+ years. Today, probably even an SUV from BMW/Audi or Lexus have less torsional/longitudinal twist/flex and more roll resistance than a sports coupe like Supra MK4 had back in the early 90s.
Well, it's a targa top. That makes a big difference.
@@dizzywow Even the coupe was not that different. It had a very soft chassis. My friend has one.
A mid range modern Ford SUV feels far better and has less cabin noise than any vehicle I've owned so far. I can't imagine what a BMW or Audi feels like.
@@Josh-cw8by Modern bmw's, haha, worse than your Ford for noise, because they have bling 19" wheels and run flat tires. 1999 might have been the peak for them: 3,5, and 7 series all had very rigid bodies, comparable to many current cars. It made a huge difference in rigidity when they switched from mild steel, to fully galvanized high carbon steel chassis. Japanese autos lagged a lot in this switch, because it's expensive. The new bmw's are insanely stiff, you can notice some of that in handling and noise, but most of it is irrelevant because of the soft bushings and suspensions they have to use to compensate for the huge noisey wheels and run flats. They are both louder and less interesting to drive.
Superb piece Mark and Jack. Thank you. I grew up with and drove numerous generations/variants of Supra, including Celica Supra. Majestic cars... back then. I ditto Mark's assessment. The Supra was dreamy, but it was the NSX that "changed it all."
I knew early on in my younger days that the Japanese had something special up their sleeve...I drove a 1979 Honda CVCC for years. I should have never parted with that car...
Now there’s no fun cars anymore compared to back then, at least.
Now prepare for EV mandates to get rid of all the somewhat fun remaining cars to make your life miserable, and most importantly, boring!
Fantastic video!! Very well put together.
This is now my favorite style of video on this channel. Although I like seeing the cars on the road more than the track.
Since the 300zx began the jdm trend, I think it's be awesome to see a 25 min Z vid!
Track is the best place to really test a car and see what it's about. Road driving is worth doing too of course to get the full picture.
That Celica XX has strong SD1 vibes. It was amazing that the MR2 was around at the same time and even somewhat outlasted it.
The MR2 was pretty both the MK1 and the MK2. Pretty cars will always stay popular.
Another spectacular video. Pure quality as always !
This was fantastic and the info segment with the history was awesome and so well done. Thanks guys
It's amazing the level of engineering they did back then to make this car the best as they could make it. It's a shame no one ever recognizes that and only thinks of the mk4 as a ultimate tuner car
Because no one did cared about it until some latinos and japanese started tuning it to insane horsepower
Same happen with Lexus LFA
because it was the peak of Japanese economy when they just didn't care about the cost
@@zhsome8039 Yup. People DID recognize the car, but they also recognized the fact that it was insanely expensive and not very fast. The MSRP, adjusted for inflation, is about $70,425 in 2023 money. In the 90s everyone I knew [in high school] and everyone that everyone else knew who liked cars wanted one, or 5. It's not because people/we couldn't recognize how great this car was, it's just that it's really really insanely expensive. Same reason not many people today will buy a sports car for 70K. People waiting 10 years to buy this used can of course say they recognize how great mk4 was, yet they weren't the one buying them new at $70K adjusted inflation MSRP in 1994.
@@henryshootsTurbo cost $50k in 1995. That's 100k today.
Great video especially with Albons history lesson and in-depth knowledge on the car. I hope you guys get the chance to do more older cars like the MR2 sw20
Love collabs by good channels. Thanks for the video!!!
Just dropping in to say how much I appreciate the insight if enthusiasts to expand on the emotional side of certain cars 👍🏼
Small note, you said, "a naturally aspirated 6 cylinder, or the 2JZ" but they were both 2JZ's with minor differences
I'm surprised they didn't do more comparison to the 300ZX, which was actually the closest of the Japanese competitors. They keep going back to the NSX and FD RX, which had very different objectives.
Absolutely
I’ve heard from more than a few people that have driven both that say stock for stock that the ZX is better.
That’s because it was better, despite being released 4 years earlier.
Pre Fast and Furious bullshit, AKA the 90s, everyone wanted the Z, not the bloated whale Supra.
@@hotshtsr20 Yep. One of my college friends, freshman year in 1996, had a 1990 Nissan 300ZX. Wolf Technology, STILLEN were huge tuners of the Z in America. I saved up and bought a 1991 Mazda RX-7 the year after. The Supra….its romanticized past is VERY misleading.
@@bamboosho0t Yep. I live 15 miles from JWT. Stillen ECUs are just re-badged wolf computers.
Mark and Jack great job as always, You guys are the best, always educate and give the history. Thanks for documenting all these cars, in such great detail. I will always support you on Patreon. I never knew this era of Supra used so much aluminum, because it is still pretty heavy, but it one of the greatest cars Toyota made. Only thing I will say the Nissan 300ZX I feel was more of a competitor, more so than the Mitsubishi 3000GT and the Mazda RX-7. I always felt the Nissan 300ZX went toe to toe with the Supra.
Loved the format of this video!
Dang, homie couldn’t even clean up those headlights. I owned a 95TT, and it was before I got into modding and track etc, RIP my bank account. ❤ great video !
People who say Fast and Furious made the Supra popular was not a tuner back then. The Supra was already hyped up back then before Fast and Furious. The movie is what made you aware of the tuner scene.
No. It was literally a sales flopped car.
And literally was criticized by lookin' too different to the MK3 A70 Supra (which that is literally the best selling Supra to date. Not the MK4 A80 Supra).
And note, the Supra MK4 A80 literally came from the Lexus SC 400 and 300 coupe(the 300 already had the 2JZ series engine , BEFORE the Supra MK4. And the 400 having the V8 1UZ. Speaking of the 2JZ, that literally began in the Toyota Artisto/Lexus GS. Not the Supra MK4).
@@dewarkhodern9990 They pretty covered why the MK4 Supra didn't do well in sales in the video. Even still, the Supra was still overhyped and popular. People just couldn't afford them and afford the parts to tune them. Few but some people were already putting 1000 hp on the MK4 before the movie came out. And because of the MK4 Supra's popularity, it made it in the movie.
And note, as long as we're going there, the Supra was first developed from the Celica as a Celica Supra. It carried a stretched nose in order to house an inline 6 cylinder. It was seen as a premium model and was given more standard features. After 2 generations of the Celica and the Supra parted ways in mid/late 80s and finally the Supra was a separate car from the Celica. The now newly parted Supra was fitted with the 7th version of the M engine. The M engine dates back further than the 2000GT into the early 60s. People often reduce the 7MGTE to just a mediocre engine but once you install sturdier head studs and head gasket it becomes a very capable engine in it's own right. Even still, the MK3 Supra's biggest flaw was it's heavy weight.
Side note also, the first Soarer was based off of the 2nd generation Celica Supra. So you can kind of say, the Celica also gave birth to the Soarer. So it's only natural that would continue onto the MK4 Supra.
@@thomaswills2301 The Toyota Soarer was not based on anything. It was basically its own vehicle.
While the MK2 A50/A60 Supra was based on the Lotus Excel. The MK3 A70 Supra was based on Soarer, not the other way around (and the Soarer was also the first to have the 1JZ, right before the Supra MK3 A70).
You say 1000hp Supras(MK4 A80) already existed before the Fast And The Furious? That's hard to believe (and 2JZs can't hold 1000HP on stock Internals. It's just a stock block at that point).
And literally the Supra A80 MK4 was not hyped up like that in the 1990s, it faced criticism by the public when it was said to be a "value brand front engine Ferrari" and along with being criticized of not having the pop-up-headlights like the MK3 A70 Supra (the MK3 A70 Supra is literally the best selling Supra to date). And guess what vehicle the 2JZ debuted in first. I'll wait.
@@dewarkhodern9990 The Japanese consumers responded really well to a more luxury sporty car when the Celica Supra came out. But, the Celica Supra needed to be more sporty in order to compete with it's competitors. So Toyota made the Celica Supra sportier and created the Soarer as the more luxury sporty coupe. It's based off of the Celica Supra. And you can take it from there. They are like nonidentical twin brothers. One stayed on the path of more sporty and the other more civilized luxury. So yes, as they grew they would retain similar characteristics like the same engine. They are two slices out of the same pie.
Loved the colab! Been following Albon forever, gald to see them get their flowers.
i love this collab so much. thanks mr geese, thanks albon.
These videos are timeless.
They’re works of art that will live forever.
I cannot believe Jack made it all the way through this video without saying B58
Why would he?. It's about the MK4, not BMW B58
Captivating presentation. Well done!
I skipped over this video a few times cuz I thought it would just be a rehash but this video turned out to be truly a treat. The quality of the content speaks for itself I was proven wrong and honestly glad I was. Keep up the good work guys 💯
That was an amazing history lesson.
having owned a mk1, and mk3, presently own 1 gen GS...i will always drive inline 6 engines love their flexibility and reliability
Great review and perspective on the Supra! It's a true JDM legend, I used to obsess over them in late 90's and early 2000's watching all sorts of awesome Supra videos. I like the blunt honesty about the cost of one vs what you consider value in car based on the cars experience. I suppose their values is based on the availability and the supply of good ones are probably pretty limited. Especially completely stock in good to excellent condition. Interesting comparison between the NSX and Supra at the end.
I remember in the late 90s, the popular thing to do at the tuning houses in Japan with Mark IV Supras was to ditch the 2JZGTE entirely, an install a 3SGTE mounted behind the front axle centerline with a horizontal intercooler. This lessened weight AND improved the weight distribution and the serious tuners were still making 600-700 ps for their time attack and circuit monsters! It reminds me of the 4G63 and K24 Fox Bodies that people build nowadays!!
What a great video. Thanks guys.
It can be both. Its performance on both track and quarter mile was nothing to sneeze at but the engine was its main claim to fame due to how stout it was and its ability to handle a lot of boost which is still impressive even when compared to engines of today. Combined with its looks(which is subjective), a little help from Paul walker, and some video games, the Supra went from barely talked about in the US to being next to impossible to find stock.
But that's where it ends. The engine wasn’t exactly exclusive as it was available in plenty of Toyota/Lexus models with the gte version being an exception kinda as it was only in 2 other products. Looks, as stated before, are subjective. They weren’t exactly cheap either. In today’s money, an a80 would run you about 50k for a regular model. And like any performance oriented car, unless you were an enthusiast, it be hard to justify paying that kind of money for a Toyota as opposed to similarly/cheaper priced sports cars and gt cars in the US market. So it never really sold. And the performance, while solid, couldn’t keep up with most of the big name jdm cars of the 90s. And it wouldn’t hold up as well to the cars of recent times either with the exception being the gte(but you’re gonna swap that out with a big turbo anyway to get that famed 1000hp number).
*TLDR:* The supra definitely deserves its praise for its performance, engine and moreover, its friendliness towards high boost but a good amount of the hype generated by the car were more so by casual fans and people who in reality wouldn’t even buy it in the first place.
TLDR: it’s overrated
The gte version of the 2jz is the only version worth anything. Not all 2jz engines are created equal. The GE was not even a third as capable as the GTE in terms of handling crazy boost. The 2jz GTE was only offered in the Supra. The 2jz GTE is the only one that’s valuable… all of the other 2jzs are garbage and can not handle a lot of boost. They don’t have the beefed up internals of the GTE.
@@MMPGAMMING Not really, its the same block, and its only about the block with this "boost handling" bs. Its one giant lump of iron, while most engines are aluminium and engineered to be as strong as they need to be. You change the internals when you do those high boost builds, if you stick to stock internals on GTE it will blow up too if you go high boost like an idiot, which most people do thinking it's made from adamantium or something.
Both engine and car are overrated as heck tho(which doesnt mean its bad), Supra MK4 is quite mediocre, 300zx, RX7 and all others are better. It's also impractical as hell compared to other coupes hell even Celica is more spacious trunk and rear seatroom wise. Supra is quite useless in it's grand tourer role unlesss you rely on rear seats as storage. MK3 was more roomy and you could have it with 1JZ(7MGTE motor had weak headgaskets and blows them all the time) 3000GT from mitsubishi is more roomy and also potent and comfy.
Stock car i can respect, but all the monkeys that rob us of these car ruin them. Stock Supras are scarce in proper setup(6mt na or turbo), they replace everything on it, blow it up and waste another supras for parts bin to fix it.
BTW, the saying is "sneer", not "sneeze". 😄
You’re not hitting 1000whp on a stock bottom end with a 2JZ. This myth needs to die.
I had one exactly like this... miss that black beast... :-( the Supra IV just had so much character. You felt like you were getting into a jetfighter cockpit with the wrap around console... the air con felt like a hurricane. they dont make cars like this anymore.
Awesome video by the two most underrated automotive journalists!
One of another awesome uploadd ❤
5x MKIV owner here from stock to 1100WHP and several iterations in between. I appreciate and generally agree with the detailed assessment, though I do wish the example was a USDM model, which has a few tangible improvements over the JDM. Totally agree that today's values are absurd, and with the discontinuation of many critical OEM parts the future is uncertain for those that actually want to drive/experience the car vs being a 'collectors' garage ornament. Anyhey... Fun fact RE: over-engineering -- there is 100+ WHP to be gained just from uncorking the exhaust and adding a boost controller. The USDM turbos and fuel system happily make 400-450WHP depending on octane and run mid-low 11's with the driver mod (I've done this - see my channel). Lastly, the long-term influence on values, notoriety, etc.. of the FnF is comically, if not egregiously blown wayyyy out of proportion, despite it being mindlessly parroted still to this day.
Prices are exactly what they need to be, you can't find a better car for the price of a MKIV Supra. This includes the new BMW Supra.
@@b18tuner5875 That's hilarious. 10 years ago I probably would have agreed with you. Prices were reasonable (though still much higher than its JDM counterparts) and parts, shops, racing/competition and the community were all thriving. We basked in the glory of the MKIV! Today.... over-priced and over-hyped relics of days gone by. The parts situation - lack thereof - is an extinction level event, regrettably.. I love the MKIV and like I said, I've owned/built/ raced 5 pristine examples over the years (and you would cry knowing what I paid for them at the time); it was an incredible platform. But.. a king has his reign and then he dies..... c'est la vie In today's market, for the money, there are countless 'better' cars.
@@AP3D I have no issues rebuilding my MKIV so I am not sure what you are trying to explain. I just got rev2 tail lights a few months ago for under $300 for both.
Can you name a car for the price they cost now still? That was my question. I probably wouldn't cry because I paid 30k and my example is now worth 150k+ (rarest color).
@@b18tuner5875 I would buy any modern well reviewed sports car over an old Supra. Don't hate me, but I don't need 1000hp but i want tight handling and not interesting in modifying anymore. I've been down that road before. Technology moves on, the supra is about nostalgia.
@@b18tuner5875 Hot Wheels and Gran Turismo don't count. Troll on, kid...
MK4 is a legend. Even the new mk5 has grown on me a lot now.
It wasn’t always “a legend.” In America it was quite forgettable outside of the West Coast, until FF1 + CZcams in ‘05. Then, everyone had to have one. But in the 90’s I recall a then renowned journalist called the MK4 Supra a _”Bloated, blunt instrument.”_ Judging by the meager sales, the buying public wasn’t sold on the MK4 Supra then either and its $50K+ price tag that rivaled the then Lexus LS400 price. The MK5 is a better car, it just doesn’t have the tuning reputation the MK4 has due to a 30 year gap in time. I knew once people calmed down about the BMW connection, they’ll understand how good it really is. Cherish it, because eventually none of these cars will be available for sale.
@@bamboosho0t Exactly. People criticize the MK5 A90/J29 Supra (and come up with stupid opinions with false beliefs and not truths and facts of the MK5 Supra) for being different to the Supra A80 MK4. Yet the MK4 A80 Supra was literally criticized for bein' different to the MK3 A70 Supra. And literally was a sales flop from the start.
Little do these people know, is that the MK5 A90/J29 Supra is not trying to be the Mk4 A80 Supra, it is actually trying to be the Toyota 2000GT, the Grandparent of the Supra and Celica
Mk5 is a crappy Beemer. Mk4 for life. A real toyota
@@GuerreroDelInfo The MK5 is both a Toyota and BMW. And literally have been already since it's debut been makin' 800 plus tuned Horsepower on stock bottom end (while makin' 1000 plus Horsepower on stock block already).
And wtf do you mean "real Toyota" for the MK4? Some of it's parts aren't really from Toyota, and the MK4 A80 Supra Turbocharged version literally while stock had its hands full against the base C4 Corvette models of the 1990s
@@GuerreroDelInfo I like both. I don't think its crappy anyway. Just happy the new on exists in this time of hybrid and electric cars.
Legendary video for a legendary car. Thank you boys. Love the drive through with you.
This is a fantastic video, thank you!
Y'all really skipped the 82-86 Celica Supra MK2 with it's rock solid 5M-GE and it's timeless knife cut design in the history intro ? :(
Yep, unbelieveble. The wikipedia-generation I guess…
Yup, I was aghast!! They sold a ton of those in the US, I had an 85, loved that car, should never have let it go
That was the first non-muscle car that I saw that made me look twice.
Exactly what i was thinking.
+1, don't know how they missed an entire generation that made the Supra mainstream here in the US.
This was my childhood dream car. Eventually bought a ‘97 TT6 in the rare rsp color. This is a great nostalgic car with sentimental value but my R35 GTR is way more car for half the cost.
Seeing the Supra at 5:59 it feels like seeing an old friend. Reminds me of the good old days of playing ps2 and 360 racing games and seeing the Supra on the showroom turntable
I cannot WAIT for your NSX video!
As a former JDM 94 TT auto (stock) owner I will also say this video is bang on. Well done.
Here in Australia, my friend had a Mk4 Supra back when they were considered 90s shitboxes. He loved it but sold it without making a profit. A couple years later the value started going up, and now, he would have had 10 times the money what he paid for.
All he can buy is a can of beans and maybe a loaf of bread
well it is a 90`s shitbox with a legend born out of film and dragstrips. just about any car can be modified to supercar performance
If I had not been subjected to severe societal pressures back then, my first car investment would not have ended up a major disaster with years of agony and much money lost, but likely a worthy investment rising far above original investment. (Although maybe not with inflation considered, but definitely in overall value-of-life gain.)
@@Dowlphin Maybe you’d be in less “agony” if you left the brony obsession back in 2013 where it belongs.
Anyone who thought the Supra was a "shitbox" was an idiot. It's a very well-built car, sharing its platform with the Lexus SC.
Ty; yet another top tier presentation from SG!
I learned a lot in this video. I knew the Supra of this generation was always sought after but never quite realized the story behind the car. I’m not a huge Toyota fan personally but always respected this car for the performance it offered.
These guys are dope. They present so well
Love my 95 Supra SE (normally aspirated, 5 speed W58), stock motor, only suspension mods, but I'm surprised how much attention it gets.
I live in metro Detroit and I’ve never seen one in person. Plenty of exotics lambos to mclarens
incredible video as always
Great video. Looking forward to the NSX video.
Great and informative video. I expect nothing else from Savage Geese crew. The addition from Albon was a nice touch as well I think they added a lot more depth to the video with the history of the supra and their own personal experiences
Those headlights are world class for sure. Never mind the engine
That has to be the best video ever analyzing the Supra. 👍
I've always really liked these cars. And I was really impressed when in the early 90's I raced a stock twin turbo Supra with my modified 84 Trans am and got blown away by it.
Toyota in the mid 2000s went so lean on performance cars that the fastest car they had for a few years was the 2006 RAV4 V6. Let that sink in...
We need one about the mr2!!! sw20 :D
Collaboration not competition, love seeing content creators work together
Mark IV Supra was definitely legendary for its time back in the 90s. Today, it's overhyped and overpriced with sellers still thinking their Mark IV Supra is in high demand no matter what condition its in. I wouldn't spend more than $10,000 usd on a used Mark IV Supra. With the new Mark V Supra, rather just get that car because it'll be in new condition, has less than 10 miles, has more power, looks amazing, and most of all, still has warranty on it. My friends and relatives back then always mentioned that once they saved up enough money, they were going to get a Mark IV Supra. Come time to pick one up, they changed their minds and went with newer sports cars because they get more bang for their bucks. Today, only reason why you would pick up a Mark IV is because you really love that car.
Just happy no discussion on infotainment system.
It's always weird to me when people talk about the 90's US car market, especially when it comes to discussions about the Supra and it's competitors, why the C4 Corvette always gets left out of these discussions. It's not difficult to understand why the Supra sold poorly when you could have a 300 HP V8 that's comparable as a GT car and much more of a driver's car. The 300ZX also didn't help matters as a car that matches the Supra as its own game, and the RX-7 FD, NSX, 3000GT, and MR2 Turbo all offered either better driving experiences, more unique features and designs, or more prestige and luxury than the Supra did.
The Supra is cool and always has been, but nothing about it speaks to being competitive in that market. It's cool in the same way that the new Z is cool: simply for the fact that it exists, despite being worse than its competition. And while that's enough to garner respect, that's not enough to convince most people to actually buy one when all of those other cars existed.
True, and I was around when these cars came out. Compared to the competition, in the reviews of the day these always came up short re: performance per dollar. Much of the hype of this car is due to nostalgia and the influence of shitty movies. The fact a car can be modded to hell doesn't make for a particularly compelling reason to buy, when other cars of the era were dynamically superior and did not need mods to make them desirable. The Supras of this time period failed for a reason.The obscene prices they command today are the result of Gen Xer's buying a piece of their youth that they couldn't afford back in the day, much like the Boomers driving up the prices of muscle cars.
You can't be serious, the C4 Corvette is like a Hot Wheels car compared to a MK4 Supra. The C4 was also piss slow. You should like somebody that hasn't driven a Supra before.
because American cars are ass especially from the 90s.....no one wants an ugly ass C4 Corvette
You seriously remedial comparing that shitty vette to a supra back in the day. I bought my first supra in 1998, through out the late 90s and 00’s, I never once lost to a domestic shit box in poopra on APU down in Mexico Texas. Don’t get me wrong, love the vipers & vettes, but not one of those cars were able to hang with me during the 00s era. Anyway, 2023, and most new cars still have a hard time catching up in my 30+ year old Poopra with my old ass Sound performance setup 😂
Paying 50/80k for a hellcat, basically dodge, is mind boggling to me tho ..
@@hushg2000 congrats on being one of the 3 people to buy a Supra in '98? Toyota built like 43000 MK4 Supras in total, for the whole planet, including non-turbos and automatics. That's literally any 3 years of Corvette sales. You can be as pissy as you want about it, but don't pretend like people weren't cross shopping literally all of those cars I mentioned and ultimately choosing any of them over a Supra, and usually choosing a C4 over any of the others. That's not an opinion: that's the story the sales figures paint.
And also, I really don't get where all this C4 hate comes from outside of people who just haven't driven or been around these cars. I own a 1996 C4 CE with all the Grand Sport options and it is absolutely a fucking rocket ship as well as a generally awesome car to drive hard, daily, or road trip in. People always dog Corvettes for having shoddy interiors and they also dog C4's for being slow. But at least from pictures, the Corvette's interior was no worse than any of the other 90's JDM heros, including the Supra, and with the LT1 motors in the 90's making 300 HP/340 lb ft, they weren't slow any more either. All that stuff Mark said about how soft the suspension is and how much body roll the Supra has? I promise he wouldn't be giving a C4 the same grief.
Also I don't believe that any well-driven Viper is losing to a Supra TT in a drag race or on a road course. IDK who you're trying to fool with that.
Like Steve Theodore, I am a Supra OG (if you've heard of the "lance alignment" that would be me). I've owned only two, but I've had a hardtop TT 6 speed almost continuously since 1994. I had a 15 month lapse from 1995 to 1997 after my ex totaled my first one. The review is interesting especially from the perspective that Toyota set records with the Supra that stood for a very long time in the magazine testing world. The OE tires all the test mules ran were Michelin Pilot MXX3s. They had to be special ordered and you needed to provide your VIN to get them. This is doubtless the reason the magazine cars performed so well, but I can personally vouch for their stickiness and short service life. Yes, the Supra needs to be pushed before it settles down and gets with the program. It doesn't feel good at 80%, but really comes into its own at 90% and up. That was pretty common in the '90s cars, and it is normal for any proper racecar.
The other thing that struck me as odd - I have never forgot my first test drive in the MkIV Supra in 1994. It was loud. REALLY loud from road noise. It was stiff compared to everything available in 1993 short of a go kart. Definitely stiffer than my '08 IS F and my '16 GS F. I'm not sure what was going on with the car you were driving, but the ripped shock boot made me think those Bilsteins had seen better days. Yes, for track work, stiffer springs are a necessity, but the factory setup was a pretty solid compromise biased toward stability at speed.
The latest factory offerings have moved well beyond the MkIV's capabilities, and I have no illusions about my Supra being competitive with recent real sports cars even with full ticket suspension updates and solid bushings. But it definitely is an old friend who likes to have fun with me, and can still keep a smile on my face 29 years later.
I grew up and loved the Supra MK3 and MK4. Owned both and sold them, but he's right. I wouldn't overpay them nowadays.
I rather be more happy with a 2023 GR86 6 spd manual.
Properly hyped
The Celica could have been legendary if the US got all the same engine options as Japan. We missed out on so many. The 18RG, 4AGE, 3TGTE, 2nd gen and up 3SGE, 3rd gen 3SGTE. I would have loved a BEAMS 3SGE Celica.
US did not get 3rd gen 3S-GTE Celica?
Although I know not even Europe got the 4th gen. 3S-GTE with VVT. (But I managed to own a 2000 Corolla with a 3rd gen with the Japanese ceramic turbo, and I am not unhappy about the turbo since I am not interested in getting more power out of it.)
@@Dowlphin Nah. For the 6th generation Celica North America only got the FWD Celica. Even worse, we didn't even get the 3SGE engine. If Toyota would have at least given us that the Celica would have been more popular. But we got stuck with the 5SFE engine. Decent low end torque for what it is but zero performance. The 90s was when the tuner scene was big. If had gotten the 6th generation AWD Celica that would have been a big competitor with the Eclipse.
This is a GREAT video!
I remember the 1993 Road & Track had a Supra on the cover. I've wanted one ever since. Probably won't ever get one unless I win a lottery. But you could be damn sure I'd get one.
I had a 1994 manual, dark green on beige (from 1999-2002, sold after some fast furious hype) ... Shoulda kept it lol
Riiiiiigh 😂
they didn't make green in 94. only 97 or 98.
@@naten555 Def had it. was dark g blueish /green? Sold it and got a Honda passport and the 2002 rsx type S.. Which I sold for one of the first 2003 Evo 8's..
@@shahulhusman that’s Baltic blue. That’s a 94 color.
@@naten555 ah thanks.. I had to go find a picture I had.. This was pre iPhone lol..I had Ugly enkei wheels and a real car bra and big can exhaust lol.. I do remember my rsx felt like it handled better. The Evo was a the first car I modded like crazy.. Had two Nissan gtr also.. Including a 2013 I have now. I'm 43, been through 50 plus cars.. Miss the young jdm days, keep the gtr out of nostalgia for it.
In my opinion, since you're asking, is that the Supra was a car that can't really be compared to anything we have now. For it's time it was a beast of a car. It was very common to put out 800 hp on stock internals. And the transmission would be swapped into other platforms because they were stout. And in my opinion the lines of the car are ageless. Like a Porsche. Just never gets old. Nothing at the time could do what the Supra did so easily. With that said if you pick it apart it wasn't particularly nimble. And they had old school engineering. Brackets upon brackets in the engine bay. And as much as I love the the oe wheels on the mkiv those things were way too small. Bottom line is there's a reason why til this day the most powerful and fastest import drag racing cars use the 2JZ platform. Yes at that level nothing is stock. But each platform has its limits. And the fact that the limit of a 2JZ is closer to 2k horsepower tells the engine was just one of a kind.
not one of a kind, there is another, and it's called the barra.
@@CurtisSmal That's right. Those are nasty. Aussie version of a 2JZ.
hell yeah! thank you for making another 90s jdm video! now when is the next s2k vid, cant wait!
He own one, enough said.
My first car was a 1987 manual Celica and I loved it at the time
Cars like this and the Skyline got legend status in games like Gran Turismo. Japanese developers made them better than other cars in the game, and a generation of kids took it as fact.
Gran turismo is life
The best part of GT was racing your own car. Prelude, accord, crx, integra. They were all there and ready for tuning. It wasn't just stratospheric cars like Ferraris and lambos.
@@davidr6865 It’s ass now
@@idontgotagun9867 aside from the in game economics, it’s still epic with a wheel and VR
The Skylines were better than other cars in real life. They were the fastest cars in Japan for more than a short while. They grew their reputation along the Wangan because they were simply better than anything else.
6:18 "Gone were the creases because now we are in the Jelly Bean era of car design." I was drinking the koolaid back then and loving it but yea they didn't age that gracefully. I think the MKIII looked the best in its last year. But that's my opinion.
I agree totally. I'd love a MKIII. They really stood out amongst the cookie cutter designs of the day. Something about the angles, creases, and pop up headlights make it look sinister, even if the performance doesn't quite live up to the looks. It's one of the few cars I'd like in black paint, because of the Darth Vader vibe.
I loved everything everything about this video. Great job
Well Albon sure does a good job getting you hyped about the MkIV Supra! I like that you used a, what's the nice word, honest, example for testing. I got to drive a JDM MkIV NA car recently and yeah, it just feels like a 90s JDM car in the best ways. No doubt they are an important car, but definitely not worth the insane money in terms of driving. Though, it's understandable why they are so sought after! Certainly sounds better than most modern cars too.
Anyone got any EVOs to lend these guys? Would love to see all 10 in one episode.
I rode in one on the passenger seat once, tuned for moderately more HP, and briefly experienced the intense push of the acceleration from low speed that gave me a little bit of tunnel vision.
And Toyota recently decided to manufacture a new batch of headlights as OEM spare parts again!
I also drove the Mk3 once, on a parking lot, and was surprised how nimble it felt for its size, since from the outside it seemed like a boat.
I gotta say, I find the Mk3 design a bit 'eh' on the oldschool side and the Mk4 a bit 'eh' on the modern side with its seeming dictate of everything-rounded. A skillful merger of the style of both would have been amazing.
As for this video collab production, I don't like how much the host is in my face, and with a semi-portrayal enthusiasm. (Think: 'If everything is exciting, then nothing is exciting.' - Is he doing commercials?) - To me who specifically loves savagegeese style, it feels a bit like that obnoxious kid who just can't shut up about his new toy.
What it also reminds me of is Wil Wheaton's acting in Picard. - Not that I think Wheaton was incompetent there; I think he was deliberately playing a character with such demeanor.
9:00 $42K is nearly $50K? ... Can the guy send me his loose change? 😏
11:28 Although relatively speaking a valid point, it is maybe a bit misleading to call it near-indestructible. It is that if you pour the appropriate money into the targeted HP figure, and if you push that very high, you will have high maintenance, and those builds are likely made for show, not as a daily hard-driver. - At some point a tuned engine is almost nothing of the original engine anymore. (Yeah, a robust iron block is worth a lot, but at some point you gotta pamper it all-around with engineering bling. Cracked 2JZ blocks are not unheard of. And so many other things can go wrong about an engine, too, unless you basically tune it with OEM supercar standards or above.)
Regarding the suspension and handling feeling commentary on the track, did you consider components age? Does it have replaced OEM parts or even some original ones? Because you know that oldtimers don't drive today the way they did when they were new.
Maybe this would even be an interesting video topic for you, since I don't know anyone did this: Get two cars of the same model, one kept like a museum piece with original parts, the other with quite fresh OEM replacement parts, and then compare their driving feel.
I also wondered how replacing stock parts like bushing feel on a vintage car like an Supra or S2000. But I think I know the answer already, it's a big difference. Probably not enough for a video in it and it doesn't fit what Geese does either. But it's a no brainer that it will improve response and accuracy of the suspension, no matter if it is still stock or aftermarket.
city pop intro music was very fitting, nice touch
This channel needs more subscribers
I remember the old joke:
What do a 400, 700, and 1000hp Supra have in common?
They all run 12s.
Not true at all anymore, but those cars were fun for their receptiveness to mods, not their driving dynamics.
@DOGS LOL The MK4 was 3560 lbs this is light by today's standards. To give you an idea the R35 GT-R weights 3995 lbs, 2nd gen NSX 3960lbs, BMW M4 3979 lbs, 911 Turbo (992) 3821 lbs, Mustang GT500 4182 lbs. I have a feeling my youtube account alone is older than you.
This was even back in the early 2000's not true. I was around the Supra scene from before F&F came out. Back in the early 2000's you had guys like SW, Ryan Woon and Nero Deliwala etc running 9's in street Supra's. But to run 9's and not 12's you need drag radials and a prepped track, this has not changed. The vids of these guys are still here on youtube.
@@electrikoptik I was a member of the Honda scene 20 years ago - the truth of it to us was that the average Supra or turbo tuner at the time was only interested in the dyno, not the actual drag strip or track. Turbos and builds that could make usable power weren’t exactly common back then - we would have a built turbo Honda with 600hp in a 1700 pound stripped chassis and hit high 11s, we all know what an average 900hp Supra dyno plot or turbo tuner dyno plot looked like back then. 😂
I was one of those guys that owned 7 DSM's. Lol. 3 front wheel drives. 3 all wheel drives. And one convertible. The last 91 I had I truly regret selling. It was an abs model with sunroof. And was insanely mint. Interior was flawless. Exterior flawless. Oh well.
Nice video enjoyed.
Perfect look back on reality and nostalgia 👍🙏