Dark Souls 3 Lore | Ornstein and the Path of the Dragon
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- čas přidán 9. 06. 2020
- What happened to Ornstein after he left Anor Londo? Did he actually become the Stormdrake the Nameless King rides into battle on? Find out in the final video in the "Rekindled" series!
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Biggest flaw about Ornstein being the King of the Storm: he was the Lion Knight, not the Chicken Knight.
LMAOOOOOOOO 🐔
One thing I'd like to add to the the ds1 Ornstein is a illusion theory is that Smough's hammer says he is the last one to stay at his post, how could he be the last one if Ornstein was still there? Simple answer, he isn't physically at Anor Londo during ds1.
Smough’s hammer says this
@@maximillion322 thanks I'll edit the comment to say that
But why do we get ornsteins soul when we kill him
Or….because he left and as far as DS3 is concerned, we didn’t do all the things we did in DS1
@@johncobb3778 Personal head canon is he left a piece of his soul with Gwyndolin (just like how Gwyn split his soul with a bunch of people) and Gwyndolin crafted an illusion using said soul so that it essentially acted as a doppleganger.
In the Sacred Oaths description it says:
The Sun's Firstborn - Nameless King
His faithful first knight - Ornstein
and the brave dragonslayer who served them BOTH - this is Havel the Rock
Or the one who was once Dragonslayer Armour
I think that was the firstborns armour in the start if the age of fire, without his crosspear because he took that with him to archdragon peak.
@vicefulder he literally has miracles attributed to him and is named a bishop though
@vicefulder Havel literally created the Magic Barrier miracle...
Dragonslayer Armor
Dark Souls 1 Dragon Form: An actual Biped Dragon
Dark Souls 2 Dragon Form: Golden Dragon Armour
Dark Souls 3 Dragon Form: GGNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!
its not like tha-
ThePruld: GGNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!
me: GGNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!
everyone else: GGNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!
sif: YAP
That makes much more sense. Now I know my greatest achievement in DS1 is an illusion.
Just wait till it's beating up a spicy grandpa
half an ilussion. Smough is there right?
@@jorgeaguilar435 bruh. Your words touched my heart.
if it make u feel better smough was most likely the real deal
@@An_Ian thnx
Let me know what you think of the different visual approach I took with this video. I recently got all the Adobe programs and I've been working hard trying to learn them all to upgrade the level of quality I put into my videos for all you wonderful peoples! =]
Oh, also. First person to spot my fucking misspelled word gets 10 internet points! xD
The tire rite would be useful though. Summoning a new one whenever mine goes flat would save me a lot of money
Perfect timing! I will watch this twice and then sleep to the playlist!
Awesome!!! Have sweet dreams! =D
Orstein's spear is lodged in a gate. Maybe he used it to bar intruders from the bell.
I picture a dramatic scene of ornstein walking through the gate, seeing NK. Dropping his spear, while slowly walking forward. Then removing his armour in order to ne ready for his transformation into a dragon.
Would be an awkward moment when your long lost pupil undressed himself in front of you
Ashen, your complete f-ing brilliance helped me understand that the silver knights didnt disappear after "killing" gywnevere. They were always illusions. Thought it was just a gaming mechanic but similarly to filinore's egg, it could be argued attacking gywnevere shattered the illusion showing Anor Londo as it truly was. Good stuff man
Something interesting: in DS3, there are three silver knights outside Aldrich's boss room. They rarely drop covenant items for the Blades of the Darkmoon, suggesting they serve Gwyndolin still. Is he trying to stop others from entering and being devoured as well? Is his last act an attempt to save others from his fate?
@@CH4R10T_TV interesting I've never thought about that before
I remember hearing that dragons dont have a soul so how did the storm drake got his soul? I think that Orstein is the storm drake for that reason.
Ah, that's another good point, friend! =]
midir has a soul too and he's also a dragon
@@nobruh4212 created by the gods so maybe that's a reason
@@astridnightfall9707 sinh got a soul too, but it could yorgh's
The weapon of stormdrake is just an item you can acquire because the first born kill him and get his power, the soul itself is from the nameless king, and why Ornstein will become a dragon and let the first born mount him??? this is strange, even for a person who have admiration, i think that DS1 is retrated in DS3 like a tale, you can kill Gwyndolin, but she appear in DS3, you can become a Dark Lord, but in DS3 you see that dont exist a Dark Lord, so fromsoftware use this to "excuse" Ornstein being alive and to say that the Nameless King is the first born, Ornstein in DS3 serve as a link to the story, i think he just become disilluded to see his friend and former king become ally to the dragons, and see that the dragons isn't a threat anymore, they are just living beings that deserve respect too, and them see that stay as a soldier and dragonslayer isn't needed anymore, he left his armor and weapons to live a new life, because the kingdom he fought once, is no more, that end the tale of Ornstein, maybe he become a farmer.
Definitely late to this party, but I found it interesting how similar the cutscenes are for entering phase 2 in the nameless king fight and Ornstein and Smough, if you kill Smough first.
The slow, silent pat they give to a good friend they've lost, consuming their power, and the lightening explosion. Seems very similar to me.
You're not wrong! =]
Hail the Secret Tire.
Dark Souls timeline is not linear and not a universe.
It's a multiverse and in each of them there is an Ornstein. In some he is alive, in others he is dead. That's the whole point of "invasions", you visit (or get visited from) other universes that have different timelines on their own. The Ornstein in DS3 could be alive in a timeline different than the one we know in DS1 where he was killed.
This is even made more obvious when you kill Aldrich in Anri's world, then come back to yours to kill him "again".
Praise the sun
Hey so on closer inspections it looks like the storm drake that Faraam is riding on kind of looks like a bigger/featherier version of the dragon transformation. It has the twisted horns, it looks really skinny as well, and the bottom jaw looks like a humans/ dragon transformation jaw along with other subtle similarities. Over all it just looks like the dragon transformation but with longer arms, neck and a beak.so I'm 100% with ornstein being the drake.
Awesome as always. Hope that you’ll still entertain more souls theories on your channel in the future. There’s just so many things still untouched even to this day it seems.
I appreciate you making videos on the topic this long after release. Keep it coming please.
Ah yes, the sacred tire of the path of the dragon ;) gimme dem points!
Haha. Dyslexia for the win! Enjoy your internet points, sir. Don't spend them all in one place! ;)
@@TheAshenHollow Thank you very much! Super cool video though! I never considered that the lightning drake could be Ornstein. It makes total sense though and it's an awesome detail
Is it sacred or secret?
@@connorkinsman3164 Sacred
Not quite on the topic of Ornstein, but my head canon is that the Painted World in Dark Souls 1 (i.e. the big-ass painting) got destroyed and the cold trapped within escaped, transforming Anor Londo into this frozen city, Irithyll (combined with the fact that there was no sun to keep this place warm as it's an illusion to begin with) and only a shred remained on which the Painted World of Ariandel was formed
Doubt it. Time is convoluted in this world when the age of fire dwindles. The most significant of places tend to appear elsewhere. Although this also happens with everything. For example, I doubt all of those areas in ds1 were originally that conveniently close to eachother.
Hey! Yep, that's the same think I thought about Ornstein. I share this theory 100%. What about a lore video about Farron Legion?
I've been working on something DOPE for Farron's Legion. Hang tight! =)
Ahhh amazing i needed a video like this this morning and its on one of my fav topics the 4 knights. Nice work, but no mention of Velka in this one ......Ashen Hollow????
I think it’s also worth noting that the storm drake is the only dragon we’ve ever seen that possessed the strength of lightning. At least it’s assumed he possesses such strength because of his name and when his soul is claimed it bolsters the Nameless King’s own lightning. Also, when the miracle says the Nameless King claimed his soul as was customary, it reminded me of the first fight with ornstein and smough, where the surviving one will claim the soul of the one you killed first and gain their power. These are two things that occurred to me that I felt like drew some pretty direct correlations between the storm drake and Ornstein. Both possess the strength of lightning, and both follow traditional customs of the old gods. Both of these obviously would be incredibly strange for a typical dragon, but both would fit perfectly for a former dragon slayer.
Excellent recap. The placement of Ornstein's armor is proof to me that he is the Stormdrake. Miyazaki is great at offering one ambiguous clue, then offering another ambiguous clue that, when combined, punches through the ambiguity and generates a proof. I believe that's the case where the Leo Ring articulately places the Nameless King and Ornstein in the Sacred Oath as seperately mentioned personas. This is very important to me as it offers proof for me of one of my favorite theories, one that unfortunately contradicts a claim you've made in a previous video. Havel is in fact the 3rd persona that served them both. Having been a trio on the battlefield, this lends credence to Havel's Rebellion. I believe Havel sided with the firstborn over the question of Gwyn's genocide against the dragons. But he also had the concern of Gwyn's enslavement of mankind. Whether or not the rebellion was an act in tandem with the firstborn's break with his father, and even an allied combined effort is uncertain for me. Havel's "frame-up" for an Occult rebellion could've even been the frame up needed to put down the Rebellion's leader, although occult weapons would've been smart choice, frame-up or accurate judgement? Ornstein could also therefor have been the friend that locked him up for his own good, esp. given that Ornstein doesn't formally break with Gwyn until after the firstborn has already left. Havel hated magic and most likely Seathe, for very good reasons, but I don't think he was a bigoted racist against dragons. Two more things unrelated to that. I mentioned before in your previous video, just to trigger your Velka addiction, the Stormdrake is covered in black feathers. CAN YOU RESIST?!!! ahem... I believe any act of defiance against the gods would receive the blessing of Velka. Lastly, lets talk about those dragon stones. Firstly, their transformative powers are slightly different for males and females. Females have straight horns. Males have twisted ones, this can at least be a determining factor for the stormdrake's gender. The dragon stones of ds1 vs ds3. In the latter, you can also find "twinkling" versions, or lightning imbued versions. Likley, due to the firstborns alliance. Lastly, and this is just fun speculation, but what other stones have such special qualities? The carvings of Gough contain voice and emotion! Carved from an actual Archtree! I like to think there was a Giant, perhaps even a blacksmith, who created the Dragon Head Stones, either as a means for garnering defense against Gwyn's onslaught, or perhaps evidently the different races lived in a kind of harmony with the dragons. The giants were another race as old as the time of dragons, it would make sense that many if not most of this race sided with the dragons in the war against the Gods and their followers. This further explains the fall of giants, their marginalization, and enslavement. Thank you once again for getting my mind moving.
Cool Video and nice, that you keep making Dark Souls videos!!
“Some friendships can even transcend lifetimes.”
Really love this theory and you made me loving Ornstein even more!
Can you make a vid about the pilgrims? They carry stuff that look like they came from dragon peak, would be cool to see your take on that, and what the pilgrims are doing exactly.
Last video of this series? :(
I just can't get enough of these.
Welllllllll, maybe I might possibly perhaps do one or two more. ;)
The dragon form of dark souls 3 look more like the stormdrake then other dragon(forms) that we have seen, so Ornstein could be the stormdrake.
I feel like Ornstein must be the King of the Storm dragon simply because the Nameless King's weapon is imbued with his power the same way Smough would be supercharged with it if Ornstein was killed first in Dark Souls I. That just seems too reflective of that to be irrelevant.
But about Ornstein being an illusion - I was under the impression that Lothric was simply another version of Lordran however many cycles down the road. One of the differences being that the Chosen Undead wasn't there to wreck up the place, so many of the characters are further along in their lives. Ornstein has no reason to stay in Anor Londo because he'd be protecting an empty chamber above him, so he left to join the First Born. That's how I've always seen it anyway, who knows with these games aye?
Well Ornsteins lightning is lorewise a pale imitation of Gwyns and The Nameless Kings Sunlight for the Nameless King was the true inheritor of the Sun
Great video. I'm curious if in the reference to the trio of Firstborn, the First Knight, and the Brave Dragonslayer is meant to be Nameless King, Ornstein, and then Havel. It's interesting they say the First Knight was faithful but leave the dragonslayer's service open to interpretation. The fact that in DS1 you find his ring on a corpse which is supposedly a hollow Havel, but you find his gear behind mimics as part of a plot against the gods has always been interesting to me. Who else would wield a covert occult club but someone with Havel's strength and faith? Velka's crew have all been dex users (to use an in-game mechanic, but still, they all use swords, rapiers, light armor, never a club)
NineLeafClover Not only that, in your way to the Ashen Lake in Dark Souls you find the miracle of Havel wich made much theories about Havel joining the Dragon Path. And in Archdragon Peak we find the Ancient Wyvern who looks very "stonie" like havels armor.
Dont hate on your old videos. Everyone has to start somewhere and I love watching them and seeing the growth in quality. Just my thoughts, keep up the good work.
You're too kind, friend! =D
hmm... i believe that maybe he is the broken dragon statue from where you get to archdragon peak and he went to Lothric searching for knigths to become dragons...
but i may be wrong.
good video :)
I think it is him cause with the nameless King the care he show with the silence and long pause with his hand on the drake but also he hesitates before claim the stormdrakes lightning
You do better remasters than the Dark Souls remaster lol
I still think this theory is awesome, great work! Your vids are always quite intriguing and constantly improving 👍
Thanks, buddy! Means a lot! =]
Video is quality mate 🤙
I literally just asked my friends about this yesterday after finding ornstein’s gear in ds3
Great video..just going to say, if orenstien was an illusion..would he not disappear if you slay fairy snake man before the orenstien and smough?
I've always wondered if Ornstein could be that golden Lothric Wyvern, since no other share that colour.
Wait a minute, this can’t be a Ashen Hollow video...
He didn’t say Ornstein was really Velka!!!
Yes I want more lore daddy
I’ve made a discovery, do you guys remember the statue of Gwyn in the dlc Ringed city? Well, in front of the statue, is a 𝗻𝗮𝗺𝗲𝗹𝗲𝘀𝘀 𝗵𝗼𝗹𝗹𝗼𝘄, AND, we can see Gwyn giving a 𝗰𝗿𝗼𝘄𝗻 𝘀𝗶𝗺𝗶𝗹𝗮𝗿 𝘁𝗼 𝗚𝘄𝘆𝗻’𝘀 𝗼𝗻𝗲. And, the 𝗻𝗮𝗺𝗲𝗹𝗲𝘀𝘀 𝗸𝗶𝗻𝗴, has a 𝗰𝗿𝗼𝘄𝗻 𝘀𝗶𝗺𝗶𝗹𝗮𝗿 𝘁𝗼 𝗴𝘄𝘆𝗻’𝘀 𝗼𝗻𝗲, and personally, I think that’s mean, that the nameless king is sort of an heir of Gwyn! And because of that maybe Gwyn before going hollow made him like that because he known he was going to lose his mind, so 𝗺𝗮𝘆𝗯𝗲 he did that so his name will not be lost, and maybe because of the crown, Ornstein followed the path of the nameless king, which is as we could say a betrayal of the gods, but maybe Ornstein though it was the right choice, because he sees the nameless king with “the crown of Gwyn”, so he chosen the path of the foes of Gwyn even tho he might have known it was a bad choice, even, if there was no other choice... he knew it was a betrayal of his father, but, maybe he also knew nameless king was a new heir of Gwyn’s crown, so, he chosen, to follow, the path of the new king, the path of the dragons....
If you kept reading until the end of this comment, I must say first, thank you, and also, please tell me if you think maybe what I said, could be the true story (or a true part of it) of Ornstein.
I think you are right about NK collecting the lightning aspect from Ornstein; but i think it was because he has part of Gwyn's soul that made his lightning more fierce i mean what else could make someone who has Sunlight Blade lightning blade even stronger? The fact that its a 2v1 fight but geared towards NK as the 2nd round auto for obvious reasons makes even more sense. The way the power was passed on as well its almost like O&S but in a contrast manner so its not exactly the same. Ornstein would surely have to die before NK.
What about the dragons in general and the different types and the types like the mountain sized one and the one be get a glimpse of when we use the twinkling dragon stones?
Yessssssss this on top of the demons souls remake reveal! Umbassa! Good day for souls enthusiasts to put it lightly thank you ashen hollow
Oh, there once was a hero named Ragnar the Red Who came riding to Whiterun from ole Rorikstead
And the braggart did swagger and brandish his blade As he told of bold battles and gold he had made
But then he went quiet, did Ragnar the Red When he met the shieldmaiden, Matilda, who said:
"Oh you talk, and you lie, and you drink all our mead Now I think it's high time that you lie down and bleed"
And so then came clashing and slashing of steel As the brave lass Matilda charged in full of zeal
And the braggart named Ragnar was boastful no more When his ugly red head rolled around on the floor
I loved the original video and this one is even better.
I may be able to be corrected here, but I also feel like the dragon design itself speaks to the possibility of it being Ornstein. The design is original in concept, different from other dragons we see in the game. Its head reminds me heavily of the dragon form attained for completing the path. Its form is very long and slender, as a drake or wyvern traditionally are, but Ornstein was as well. Plus, it also kind of reminds of the pilgrim butterflies and angels we see in the game; almost kind of like how Ornstein went on a pilgrimage to get to this point. Idk, might be a stretch.
Reject lightning, Return to dragon.
If you look closely at a players' dragon form you can see design similarities between the storm drake and the dragon form. The head / the horns is more closely resembling with the storm drake than the wyverns. So like you theorize maybe all human dragon forms end up as the storm drake species. Plus, storm drake doesnt have scales, because it has feathers instead ( the man serpents don't seem to have scales too, i guess) . So its more likely humans turn into storm drakes at final stage of the path of the dragon?
I’ve always seen Ornstein as the Storm Drake NK is on. Why? Because it is completely different from the other dragons, having an almost chicken like appearance with feathers rather than a stone like exterior. Not to mention that the appearance is similar to if the player becomes a dragon too rather than one of the ancient looking dragons.
I would like to raise a conjunction theory along with this as I see your explanation as true, but isolated events dont happen in dark souls. 1 event builds on multiple other events.
So my theory concerns the dragon slayer armor. For sake of simplicity I will tell it in chronological order.
The first event to happen is ornstein leaving anor lando before ds1 in his attempt to find the nameless king. Then during the events of dark souls 1, the chosen undead kills the illusion of ornstien, then enough, then gwendolyn (in that order as it may be important). After that, the two humans in the main hall are killed (they were probably physically catalyst for the powerful illusions of the 2 bosses. My evidence for this is purely physical as they show up after the illusion is broken right outside the boss room, humans dont die but progressively hollow, and one of them is bulky the other is thin with a spear). Perhaps the illusion was so powerful, it clung to the phantom will of ornstein, clinging to the his main personality trait: killing dragons (bonus evidence, the illusion clung to life until enough smashed it). Then add the mixture of the human dying and releasing his dark soul. The two forces could have met and manifested an imitation of ornstein brought to life by the dark.
This phantom ornstein will then go on with the ages following 2 basic rules: go find and kill dragons, and go to serve the gods. This brings us to dark souls 2 where the armor finds an old godly city that had fallen to ruin with dragons running a muck. Heides tower of flame. Some time after the bearer of the curse engages in battle with the old dragon slayer (the bearer of the curse have could just guessed there was an actual person inside). However this armor no longer has the power of the gods (lightning) and is forced to use it's own power (the dark). The old dragon slayer is defeated and faded into nothingness.
Side note, so during this time, the nameless king and ornstein probably founded the kingdom of faaram and kept the warriors of sunlight alive. They are literal lion knights with depictions of hunting dragons. Plus somehow the warriors of sunlight kept going.
But back to the dragon slayer armor. Just as it did after the chosen undead, the body remanifested itself through its will and dark soul. We see this literally happen in dark souls 3. Through the ages, the darkness warps the armor into it's new form and finds better weapons to slay dragons. It could have died some more times during the long passage to the end. Finally it makes it to lothric and becomes a toy for prince lothric, using it to guard the bridge between the remainder of the kingdom and the archives (which would make sense considering where the archives are and the scholars that support lothric). Controlled by other beings of dark (the pygmy butterflies) the dragon slayer armor guards until the ashen on defeats it. Finally the final appearence of the armor, the ringed city. Here we learn of the armour's inhibility to die as the will to hunt dragons keeps it alive. It reincarnated through the dark (extra damage through farron weapons, pygmy butterflies, lothric, abyssal swamp, etc.) Connecting all three fake ornstiens into one immortal being, until it is defeated again by the ashen one.
Thematically it also makes sense as most fantasy games are about knights killing dragons and dark souls is about darkness being shitty, people being immortal pessimist, and how time can change things.
Final note, the armor outside the nameless king boss fight is the original armor while the dragon slayer armor is a manifestation of will, illusion, and humanity. Idk how about you come up with a better explanation than it's a technical oversite.
You didn't think about the simplest explanation: when the Nameless King allied with Dragons, also abandoned the armour he was using for hunting them. Size matches (literally, they overlap): Dragonslayer armour is clearly made for someone bigger than a human = a god. And we know only one "dragon-slaying god of war": It's more reasonable to speculate that the long-lost master of the armour is the Nameless king than a completely different character. After all, Ornstain already has an armor, so why another one?
Also, Lothric Knights warshipped the Nameless King, and Lothric was Gwinevere new home, so it's highly probable than an item belonging to her brother the Firstborne was preserved there, as a memento: Lothric Knights also allied with dragons, so it is impossible the armour was there to be used in combat. And when butterflies attaccked Lothric, they stole and controlled the armor.
@@mimmo4762 the simplest explanation.. i see
Great video and theory, and I'm sorry ti shoot this down early in the video, but the whole theory is based on a single interpretation of the dragon slayer armour description that could just as easily mean that the one specific knight had left the cathedral, and considering you fight the dragon slayer armor outside or Anor Londo and the description states it is ASSOCIATED with Ornstein I don't entirely put my faith in this theory. Good video all around though, keep doing the rekindled stuff it's great
Seriously, thats my only knitpick, the rest of theory is really solid
It not only says it's associated with Ornstein, it references "this knight" as the one who guarded the ruined cathedral of Anor Londo. Which we know is Ornstein. So being associated with Ornstein means just that because it's Ornstein's. Also the Dragon Slayer Armor boss is most likely not Ornstein's armor at all, and more likely belongs to the firstborn.
The stormdrake's design definitely looks like the GNAAA dragon form of DS3.
Although we cannot say for certain that humans, gods, giants, and wizards/witches will look different.
We can say that there is a difference in dragon forms should you be a chosen undead, ashen one, bearer of the curse.
But the archdragon peak looks as if EVERY dragon form is the GNAA dragon. (I wonder what happened to the other ones, or at the very least DS1).
I would say that the KotS is still Ornstein in complete dragon form but the lore says "tamed".. Perhaps the original japanese lore may confirm or refute the idea that Ornstein IS or ISN'T the KotS (or stormdrake if you think KotS is NK or the 2 of them combined)
The Ornstein placement is also conspicuous. I do not think it was carelessly put there as an after thought. Although I can't say for certain about the Havel copycat.
where do i find michelin's secret tire?
in ds1, you get only one soul for Ornstein fight, depending of who you killed last.
Is you defeat Ornstein first, after winning you get smough's soul, so its posible Ornstein just faints
im not sure if i believe ornstein in darksouls 1 was an illusion, since the darksouls univers is known to work in cirxles i believe he might very well exist in all circles but I might be wrong about that
Virgin Artorias: gets sent to fight the abyss, breaks his hand, flees, loses to a dude with a stick
Chad Ornstein: his illusion gets player freaked up and canonically absorbs Smough, real him denyes Gwyn's gift and declines the world of illusion and BECOMES FUCKING DRAGON
Some of the wording sounds like Ornstein and the Nameless king are one in the same. His firstborn could have very well been his first knight, and the brave dragonslayer who served both the Sun and the first knight. Though it seems to keep referencing the Nameless King as the slayer of Dragons, so it could be describing him as a brave dragonslayer.
You find Ornstein's armor discarded in the arena where the only other person is the Nameless King, a storm drake and a dragon are not the same.
Leo is the archetype of a king, lions worship a war god, Ornstein's armor is based off a lion.
I'd probably need to read the Japanese versions.
How can Ornstein be an illusion if we get his soul?
But his armor in ds 1 missing the red hair on helmet like his rank
why didnt you once mention his appearence in dark souls 2?
Follower, most likely.
Because it is not expressly stated that it is ornstein. This is more likely a case of havel's armour, there are multiple sets of that armour. It the same way DS2 is not relied upon for lore on gwyn, nito, izalith and seath. Yes their souls are present in the game and received for beating certain bosses on ng+ but the canonical reason for them being there is tenuous at best.
There is no lore behind ds2 old dragonslayer that can actually be linked to 1 and 3, no reason given his location. The leo ring whilst said to belong to ornstein isn't found on his body in 1 but is in 2. If anything this is a pretender to the title, someone that found ornstein's stuff centuries later and went on a cosplay mission!
Ds2 is also ambiguous in the dark souls timeline it is possible that ds2 could take place after 3, be in a different universe to 1 and 3 or simply 2 does not actually have a place in DS 1 and 3 mythology.
Sadly ds2 old dragonslayer has no relevance to Ornstein's lore.
So basically. Ornstien Abandon your knightly hood, become durgen
Look how they massacred my boy, turned him into a scaly!
Epic. My favorite boss is a freaking dragon now? How much cooler can you get?!
Yeah, he is a giant storm DRAKE, which the storm part and drake part or sort of cool; but being a giant bird looking creature (more or less), being a distant relative of true dragons, and not being born as a dragon are a let down for me.
let's get ittt
But I thought the whole reason why the nameless King left was because he got exiled for siding with the King of the storm so If ornstein went after him later after already guarding anor londo for A long time that doesnt make sense
I think there is more to the path of the dragon and why we have to kill hawkwood for the last piece to become the true dragon
If only we got a 2nd dragon form when using the twinkling dragon stones.
I do actually believe he was retconned but that's not necessarily a bad thing if you enjoy DS 3. From what I understand DS1 was supposed to be similar to Demons Souls, just a one off, the story and timeline in which it's events take place do a pretty good job of conveying what can and will happen. Most of these events had also been retconned, the most popular being the Dark ending, which originally brought on the age of man but was then changed to "if you don't light the fire, some one else will" to fit the narrative of DS3.
I'll say again that it's not a bad thing, stuff like this gets retconned all the time in popular franchises to create sequels or even other forms of media, Dark Souls is more choose what you enjoy.
what if ornistin impersonated the namless king after finding him dead
Some dragon-praying mummies at Archdragon peak have gray feathered-hairs similar to the Stormdrake, and are bigger then others. It's really reasonable speculating then an high faith could lead to a complete transformation. But descriptions about the Stormdrake and Ornstein don't match enough, because the word "stormdrake" seems to be referring to a draconic race and not to a single specimen. I think it's a possible and very poetic theory, but ds3 clues are not solid.
Ornstien is Velka Confirmed.
Everyone talking about the path of the dragons and the connection to Ornstein's fate, but did you know that Smough remained in the cathedral to do his job while Ornstein abandoned his postation? And he probably died in the cathedral as well?
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Does King of the Storm technically being a Wyvern have any bearing on the Path of the Dragon theory? You would have thought that it'd make you a full Dragon, not a Wyvern. Dragons are intelligent while the Wyverns don't appear to be.
I like this
Ornstein and the Path of the Dragon duuuuuuuuuuude™
I disagree that Ornstein was an illusion. I think it's more likely that the Ornstein and Smough we killed in DS1 simply had not died yet, so their first death only led to them coming back as undead for the first time. I think O&S continued to guard Gwynevere's illusion during the ages of fire that faded following the first game, but eventually Ornstein left and only Smough remained.
When the Chosen Undead fights Ornstein and Smough, it's pretty confirmed that Smough was real, but Ornsteinn not. Ornsteinn left around the time Artorias was corrupted by the abyss and Gwyn Linked the fire.
@@j.c-6424 it's not "pretty confirmed" at all. It's literally just speculation to explain how Ornstein is alive after PTD. It's just a community consensus, but with no evidence. A lot of community consensus is likely true, like the Nameless King being Gwyn's firstborn, but there's a ton of evidence supporting that. In this instance it's always, "well, how did Ornstein survive the events of the first game? I like to think it was an illusion created by Gwyndolin" and that's it. Just saying something over and over again doesn't make it true. It also doesn't account for why Smough would have bothered remaining if Gwyndolin was capable of creating an equally powerful illusion of him. Why would the illusion contain Ornstein's soul if Ornstein is still alive elsewhere, and why doesn't Gwyndolin conjure more powerful illusionary enemies to protect him in his boss fight? Why does the only thing CONFIRMED to be an illusion, Gwynevere, die after one hit and have none of her God-like power? Why is it implied Aldrich devoured Smough if Smough was real and therefore being killed in PTD should mean he wouldnt be around for DS3? I mean, that one you could answer with my explanation with the curse, but if you use that, the concept of Ornstein being an illusion is entirely unnecessary!
The answer is Occam's razor. There is a **** curse of undeath plaguing the world that even the gods feared and were affected by. Ornstein survived PTD because the concept of survival is irrelevant to cursed undeads. I really don't understand why this is always so hard for other players to understand.
@zacharyconfer1828 I think it has more to do with the fabric of reality beign completely fucked since by your logic why didn't other bosses like quelaag or artorias just come back alive.
@@fbiguy5269 there's nothing indicating they didn't, but also, Artorias was hollowed through the corruption of the abyss. Even if he wasn't technically a hollow yet, he would be immediately after his first death, since his sanity, semblance of self and will to live were already gone.
A question from me; is it 100% confirmed he wasn't hollow when we fight him? I just figured he died at some point due to the corruption of the abyss and what we fight is both abyss corrupted and a hollow at that point.
Qualaag is a good point, but let's say she *did* come back as an undead. How would the story be any different whatsoever? Are you just suggesting we would have seen her at some point if she came back? Because that's not guaranteed at all; tons of characters that objectively had to go hollow because of the Chosen Undead's or Bearer of The Curse's actions are never seen again.
Gwyndolin and the path of the *Trap*
Gwyndolin = smash
So basically his death is inevitable
I personally dont like the idea of Ornstein just becoming a dragon and I held out on believing it for so long but it really is obvious thats what Miyazaki was going for. No body where the armor is found inside the arena and the stormdrake being so different looking than any other dragon on the series really hammers it home. He definitely isnt the ancient wyvern though, they would not have named it "ancient" if thats what they wanted to imply. I do think that is the real Havel though, seeking revenge and we meet him while he is rampaging through arch dragon peak, after just killing a dragon. Would have been much cooler had he gotten locked up there and we free him, allowing us to summon him, or fight alonside his true self, against the nameless king.
Last video of his lore I wrote a comment about what he has become, and, this video totally made it obsolete, and you theory is true, he became the storm drake! Why you may ask, because the nameless king is taking the souls of the drake to imbues his weapon of 𝘀𝘂𝗻𝗹𝗶𝗴𝗵𝘁 𝗹𝗶𝗴𝗵𝘁𝗻𝗶𝗻𝗴! And who has the best place to have the power of Gwyn? Ornstein, obviously! Because like you said, Gwyn gave a part of his soul to Ornstein, so technically he has a bit of his power WHICH MEANS, Nameless king absorbed the soul of Ornstein during the fight!
Of course it is a retcon.
to be fair ornstein is very likely to be an illusion lol
How could we subscribe to you?? How could we NOT subscribe to you?!
Eh, the Nameless' move for second phase may be a callback to how Horny shishkebabbed Smoggo for his second phase.
Jeesh. Is it so hard to believe that ornstein is an undead? He lost his soul after the defeat (like when you die and can't claim your soul?). After the defeat he went in search for the nameless king. Illusion my ass!
That could also be a fair point!
@@TheAshenHollow dark souls bebbyyy!
Please add Arabic translation, your channel is very important to me and my friends, but my English is weak💙🙏
Wtf are the captions
It´s Ornstein not Ornstain
Tell me how to pronounce Frankenstein, and you'll see I pronounced it correctly in the video.
His current pronounciation is better imo. Because that's how you pronouce it in my language. What you're thinking of: 'ornsteen' sounds a lot worse. Although I'm biased.
Wrong. Ornstein first left to go to the blue cathedral in dark souls II in order to become a blue sentinel. After that game died (disregarding SotfS) he left for Archdragon peak.
It is a truly tragic story as he obviously didnt have the guts to abandon Gwyns ways in the first two games, therefore missing the GOOD dragon forms. With his arrival in Dark Souls III, all he has left now is becoming a malnourished deer.
uwu
I think you are making wayyyy to many weird assumptions. Plus the "evidence" is extremely vague and inconclusive. It makes more sense that he was there to kill the first born amd died in combat
Lol, not at all.