Who Were the Wise Men from the Christmas Story?
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- čas přidán 15. 12. 2021
- Merry Christmas!
Some sources:
www.thegreatcoursesdaily.com/...
time.com/5923009/three-kings-...
www.nationalgeographic.com/cu...
The Magi and the Star in the Gospel of Matthew and Early Christian Tradition by Tim Hegedus
Contra Celsum by Origin
The Bible
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and by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
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#magi
Well this was fun , Merry Christmas to you.
Great video
I was under the understanding that the word "magi" applied to any learned man, and not just Zoroastrian priest.
in spanish translate as "Los Tres Reyes Magos" (Three Magician Kings)
Maximiliano Garcia Chirinos have you noticed that in the Bible there is no mention of the number of the Wise Men? People simply think about the number 3 because there were 3 gifts offered to the new King that was born. But the Bible says nothing about 3 men.
@@MultiSUPERLATIVOthere’s a pretty good movie called the fourth wise man about a fourth member who gets separated.
I feel like Mir as in fragrant oil, as anointed.
if we're gonna break down misconceptions about and misinterpretations of the Bible (not to mention straight up misrepresentations/falsehoods by church "leaders"), we're gonna be here another 2000 years...
This works great at 1.25 times the speed! Yours truly, Knud from 1956...
Much better at 1.25
....
The gifts also relate to Adam and Eve. If I remember the account correctly, it was gifts given to them by God when they were married by God. Also, re the Star, the magicians of Nimrod saw a star overpower the other stars the night Abraham was born and knew it applied to Abraham being born that night that he would overtake Nimrod's kingdom.
Good video.
The movie, "The Young Messiah", which was much better than I thought it was gonna be, had a very interesting spin.
In the movie, the visit from the so-called "Wise Men" was real, but the visit was KEPT SECRET from Jesus himself. Joseph and Mary wanted Jesus to NOT KNOW about the visit. Interesting spin.
Side note: when I see the word, "Magi", I think "Magician" or "Sorcerer". 2,000 years ago, there was no difference between "Astronomy" and "Astrology". "Science" and "Occult" were the same discipline. Think of the later "John Dee", an academic genius, who transcribed the "Angelic Alphabet", used to communicate with "Spirits". All Kings had Oracles/Magicians/Prophets. These dudes had some powers that "we" don't understand. Those were the "Magi".
Dumb premise. Jesus is God, He knew.
@@Meira750 depends on your creative style in storytelling. Luke 2:52 says Jesus grew in wisdom and stature. Sounds like an odd verse when describing God. I haven’t seen the movie but can grasp why the premise existed.
@@tylermartin6532 Well, to a Gnostic, that would be complicated but to those who believe he was fully God and fully man, as most Christians do, it's clear as day.
Rock Reynolds, this secret then was maintained during the entire life of Jesus ? Is this what the movie portrays ? During the visit, Jesus, I suppose, as a human being of under ten months of age, wasn't aware of it. Well, later on, He knew everything because all the science and all the mysteries of G-d are before Him. The birth of Christ was not during the winter time in Israel (in December) but more accurately around April, at least this is what scholars and most historians say, differently from what is described in this video.
@@MultiSUPERLATIVO I agree about the time of month but to those who believe Jesus is God Incarnate, he knew everything.
👍🏾👌🏾
Another great addition for our homeschool unit. Thanks so much!
Incidentally, my grandmother had multiple porcelain nativity sets throughout the years that usually had to be replaced when one or more of the main figures would get broken. But we always saved the others, from the shepherds and angels to the animals and magi and just added them to the current set because "Hey! No one ever said how many there were!" The Magi always got set further away to symbolize that they were on the way but not quite there yet. Over the decades, her nativity display got awfully crowded and the Magi got moved to a different bookshelf entirely. We just said it was more historically accurate when people asked about it. XD
These court magi, would've also been sent as emissaries and representatives of their Kings ... So both magi and King could technically be right.
Heres the real question: why would they travel such along way to celebrate this one birth and then never interract with him thereafter nor chronicle his existence?
Yes, the question of why the Magi traveled all the way to see the Messiah is interesting. Most Zoroastrian texts are long extinct. It would be really interesting if they found a text hidden in the future. According to Wikipedia
"The surviving texts of the Avesta, as they exist today, derive from a single master copy produced by collation and recension in the Sasanian Empire (224-651 CE). That master copy, now lost, is known as the 'Sassanian archetype'. The oldest surviving manuscript (K1)[n 1] of an Avestan language text is dated 1323 CE.[1] Summaries of the various Avesta texts found in the 9th/10th century texts of Zoroastrian tradition suggest that a significant portion of the literature in the Avestan language has been lost.[2] Only about one-quarter of the Avestan sentences or verses referred to by the 9th/10th century commentators can be found in the surviving texts. This suggests that three-quarters of Avestan material, including an indeterminable number of juridical, historical and legendary texts, have been lost since then. On the other hand, it appears that the most valuable portions of the canon, including all of the oldest texts, have survived. The likely reason for this is that the surviving materials represent those portions of the Avesta that were in regular liturgical use, and therefore known by heart by the priests and not dependent for their preservation on the survival of particular manuscripts."
Magi were extremely wise men. And could have traveled to study in Parthia from different countries. You cannot discount the mention in Isiah of men traveling from Sheba, and Seba, and so forth. It looks like you may be picking select choices in Scripture to support your version, rather looking at the full and multiple Scriptural stories
The one thing this video didn't explain is where the rubber cigar comes into all this
The bible isn't clear as to when the star appeared. The wise men could have shown up on the day of Jesus' birth, and it could have been two years later. It's also definitely not a normal star, since the account suggests it moves from Jerusalem to Bethlehem to lead them to the specific place Jesus was at, so many speculate it was some sort of guiding light moved by God or carried by an angel. As such, it's not likely that it was a predictable, astronomical event as many scholars in the last century have suggested to try and pinpoint the day Christ was born; the most common narrative of this sort believing it may have been some conjunction between Jupiter and Regulus.
It's actually likely they did not show up until after Jesus was presented to Simeon at the temple forty days later, because Luke records Mary and Joseph offering two turtledoves to redeem Jesus for being the firstborn, which was the offering for the poorest people, and if they had already received the gifts, they would have been expected to offer the full redemption price. Also, the flight to Egypt seems to occur the same night or night after the wise men came, which would also imply they had already taken Jesus to the temple.
It is most likely it just never happened at all
The Bible isn’t clear, got it.
It does say, however that Herod ordered all the baby boys under two to be slaughtered so we know it was within the first two years. They would have taken Jesus to the Temple on the 8th day for his circumcision which is why Catholics celebrate 1 January as a Holy Day commemorating that event. Since Jesus was the first born and a boy, he, even as fully human, he opened Mary's womb and belonged to the Lord. The redemption takes place the same time. This is Jewish practice. I don't think the Flight to Egypt was necessarily the same night but soon after. Bethlehem is right next to Jerusalem so it wouldn't take any time for the Wise Men to get back to Herod but it's possible they hung around and accompanied the Holy Family to Jerusalem for the Presentation in the Temple and then went to Herod.
Litigious Society, if the bright star moved from Jerusalem to Bethlehem to guide the Wise Men, why did they go to the presence of Herod in order to ask the name of the city where the Messiah was about to born?
@@MultiSUPERLATIVO Because they didn't have our Scriptures which clearly state that he comes out of Bethlehem the city of David, his father. MIcah 5:2
The Magi were Zoroastrian priests following a Zoroastrian prophecy about the return of Zoroaster, who was a descendant of Abraham and the founder of the monotheistic, highly ethical religion of ancient Persia. All the monotheistic religions of the region are connected through their descent from Abraham and their prophecies that predict the “return” or renewal of revelation
Nope
@@MrGreensweightHist just nope? Like you aren't gonna provide a counter? Just nope huh.
Yep- Yeshua - over 400 prophecies fulfilled from the old testament in the new.
It is sad how we take biblical facts and put our spin on them. All your points are well founded. How long do you think it took them to get there, a year, two? (Herod’s two and under order.) They had to gather up a caravan, (you did not travel far without great prep). Another issue is I doubt Jesus slept in a stable. In that culture there was often an animal residence attached to the homes (with the ubiquitous manger). Joseph's relatives were from there. I don’t think that the culture would let a birthing mother stay in a stable thus they likely stayed with relatives since there “was no room in the inn”. I wonder if Joseph (the carpenter) made a new manger for Jesus (useful later too). How is that for a personal spin? ; )
The Gospel is clear. You either accept it or not. That is an interesting point about Joseph's family however. But you're wrong about the animal quarters being attached to the human habitation. Jewish religious laws would prohibit that. Even with the kosher animals, animals are physically unclean and there are strict laws regarding personal cleanliness. A lot of Orthodox Jews today don't keep pets because of them. In this part of the World, animal habitations were often caves. The Jerusalem/Bethlehem area is full of them, and most Mediterranean/Eastern depictions of the Nativity show them in a cave. A manger with clean straw would be a fairly nice crib.
Well where is the alien and dinosaur I saw on that ep of Mr. Bean?
did that alien come from the spaceship in Life of Brian?
It’s absolutely clear that they were firefighters!
Why, you ask?
Well, easy:
Because they came from a far (fire)…
CORNY
Dude…
Thanks for the laugh 😂
Wife loves that one, but you have to be a northerner with ties to the south to appreciate it.
OH , and the manger scene has to have the magi wearing firefighter hats
The Bible never said three wise men! So why are we saying there are three? It said the Wiseman but never said three people add information to the Bible because I guess there were three gifts but what if there were three types of gifts in wisemen brought those three types of gift, it could’ve been three bringing frankincense, three bringing mirth, and so on but we need to stop adding information to the Bible. It was not three wisemen.
Like everything in the Bible is allegorical but regardless the word in Greek refers to zoroastrian magicians
My Theamythra had three wise men
give one verse in the bible about the 3 king or magi. We are based on the bible not deception.
Balthasar Gelt. I AM SUPREME!!
The bible no where says three Magi, it says Wise Men and no where does it mention three. They theorize from the three gifts. Sad we do not stick to what the Bible says period. Daniel was a wise man and in Daniel 2:27 he makes a distinction between the Wise Men, Astrologers, magicians and soothsayers. Daniel and his companions weren't magi, short for magicians, they were Wise Men. Let the bible interpret the bible.
Eye on art, does Mark use the word "magi" in his gospel or does he use "wise men"? The book was originally written in greek.
The Bible does not tell us how many wise men or magi there were. To state that there were three as fact is not accurate. Also Matthew clearly has Joseph, Mary, and Jesus living in a HOUSE at the time the wise men came to see Jesus. Matthew 2:11 “On coming to the HOUSE they saw the child with his mother Mary and they bowed down and worshipped him.” It’s hard to see how this could have happened on Christmas night. If Jesus was born in a manger could they have moved to a house the same night? My mother, God bless her, got annoyed when she saw manger scenes showing the magi and the shepherds together. She would always say, “The wise men were never at the manger.”
*What was that "star" that led the wise men to the manger?*
The wise men had seen a mysterious light in the heavens upon that night when the glory of God flooded the hills of Bethlehem. As the light faded, a luminous star appeared, and lingered in the sky. *It was not a fixed star nor a planet, and the phenomenon excited the keenest interest.*
*That star was a distant company of shining angels,*
...but of this the wise men were ignorant. Yet they were impressed that the star was of special import to them. They consulted priests and philosophers, and searched the scrolls of the ancient records. The prophecy of Balaam had declared, *“There shall come a Star out of Jacob, and a Scepter shall rise out of Israel.” Numbers **24:17**.* Could this strange star have been sent as a harbinger of the Promised One? The magi had welcomed the light of heaven-sent truth; now it was shed upon them in brighter rays. Through dreams they were instructed to go in search of the newborn Prince.
*The Desire of Ages 60.1*
*Chapter 6-"We have Seen His Star”*
This chapter is based on Matthew 2
*“Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the East to Jerusalem, saying, Where is He that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen His star in the East, and are come to worship Him.”*
DA 59.1
The wise men from the East were philosophers. They belonged to a large and influential class that included men of noble birth, and comprised much of the wealth and learning of their nation. Among these were many who imposed on the credulity of the people. Others were upright men who studied the indications of Providence in nature, and who were honored for their integrity and wisdom. Of this character were the wise men who came to Jesus.
DA 59.2
The light of God is ever shining amid the darkness of heathenism. As these magi studied the starry heavens, and sought to fathom the mystery hidden in their bright paths, they beheld the glory of the Creator. Seeking clearer knowledge, they turned to the Hebrew Scriptures. In their own land were treasured prophetic writings that predicted the coming of a divine teacher. Balaam belonged to the magicians, though at one time a prophet of God; by the Holy Spirit he had foretold the prosperity of Israel and the appearing of the Messiah; and his prophecies had been handed down by tradition from century to century. But in the Old Testament the Saviour’s advent was more clearly revealed. The magi learned with joy that His coming was near, and that the whole world was to be filled with a knowledge of the glory of the Lord.
DA 59.3
The wise men had seen a mysterious light in the heavens upon that night when the glory of God flooded the hills of Bethlehem. As the light faded, a luminous star appeared, and lingered in the sky. *It was not a fixed star nor a planet, and the phenomenon excited the keenest interest. That star was a distant company of shining angels,* but of this the wise men were ignorant. Yet they were impressed that the star was of special import to them. They consulted priests and philosophers, and searched the scrolls of the ancient records. The prophecy of Balaam had declared, *“There shall come a Star out of Jacob, and a Scepter shall rise out of Israel.” Numbers **24:17**.* Could this strange star have been sent as a harbinger of the Promised One? The magi had welcomed the light of heaven-sent truth; now it was shed upon them in brighter rays. Through dreams they were instructed to go in search of the newborn Prince.
DA 60.1
As by faith Abraham went forth at the call of God, *“not knowing whither he went”*
*(Hebrews 11:8);* as by faith Israel followed the pillar of cloud to the Promised Land, so did these Gentiles go forth to find the promised Saviour. The Eastern country abounded in precious things, and the magi did not set out empty-handed. It was the custom to offer presents as an act of homage to princes or other personages of rank, and the richest gifts the land afforded were borne as an offering to Him in whom all the families of the earth were to be blessed. It was necessary to journey by night in order to keep the star in view; but the travelers beguiled the hours by repeating traditional sayings and prophetic utterances concerning the One they sought. At every pause for rest they searched the prophecies; and the conviction deepened that they were divinely guided. While they had the star before them as an outward sign, they had also the inward evidence of the Holy Spirit, which was impressing their hearts, and inspiring them with hope. The journey, though long, was a happy one to them.
DA 60.2
They have reached the land of Israel, and are descending the Mount of Olives, with Jerusalem in sight, when, lo, the star that has guided them all the weary way rests above the temple, and after a season fades from their view. With eager steps they press onward, confidently expecting the Messiah’s birth to be the joyful burden of every tongue. But their inquiries are in vain. Entering the holy city, they repair to the temple. To their amazement they find none who seem to have a knowledge of the newborn king. Their questions call forth no expressions of joy, but rather of surprise and fear, not unmingled with contempt.
DA 60.3
The priests are rehearsing traditions. They extol their religion and their own piety, while they denounce the Greeks and Romans as heathen, and sinners above others. The wise men are not idolaters, and in the sight of God they stand far higher than do these, His professed worshipers; yet they are looked upon by the Jews as heathen. Even among the appointed guardians of the Holy Oracles their eager questionings touch no chord of sympathy.
DA 61.1
The arrival of the magi was quickly noised throughout Jerusalem. Their strange errand created an excitement among the people, which penetrated to the palace of King Herod. The wily Edomite was aroused at the intimation of a possible rival. Countless murders had stained his pathway to the throne. Being of alien blood, he was hated by the people over whom he ruled. His only security was the favor of Rome. But this new Prince had a higher claim. He was born to the kingdom.
DA 61.2
Herod suspected the priests of plotting with the strangers to excite a popular tumult and unseat him from the throne. He concealed his mistrust, however, determined to thwart their schemes by superior cunning. Summoning the chief priests and the scribes, he questioned them as to the teaching of their sacred books in regard to the place of the Messiah’s birth.
DA 61.3
This inquiry from the usurper of the throne, and made at the request of strangers, stung the pride of the Jewish teachers. The indifference with which they turned to the rolls of prophecy enraged the jealous tyrant. He thought them trying to conceal their knowledge of the matter. With an authority they dared not disregard, he commanded them to make close search, and to declare the birthplace of their expected King. *“And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judea: for thus it is written by the prophet,*
DA 62.1
*“And thou Bethlehem, land of Judah,*
*Art in nowise least among the princes of Judah:*
*For out of thee shall come forth a governor,*
*Which shall be shepherd of My people Israel.”*
R.V.
DA 62.2
Herod now invited the magi to a private interview. A tempest of wrath and fear was raging in his heart, but he preserved a calm exterior, and received the strangers courteously. He inquired at what time the star had appeared, and professed to hail with joy the intimation of the birth of Christ. He bade his visitors, *“Search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found Him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship Him also.”* So saying, he dismissed them to go on their way to Bethlehem.
DA 62.3
The priests and elders of Jerusalem were not as ignorant concerning the birth of Christ as they pretended. The report of the angels’ visit to the shepherds had been brought to Jerusalem, but the rabbis had treated it as unworthy of their notice. They themselves might have found Jesus, and might have been ready to lead the magi to His birthplace; but instead of this, the wise men came to call their attention to the birth of the Messiah. *“Where is He that is born King of the Jews?”* they said; *“for we have seen His star in the East, and are come to worship Him.”*
DA 62.4
Now pride and envy closed the door against the light. If the reports brought by the shepherds and the wise men were credited, they would place the priests and rabbis in a most unenviable position, disproving their claim to be the exponents of the truth of God. These learned teachers would not stoop to be instructed by those whom they termed heathen. It could not be, they said, that God had passed them by, to communicate with ignorant shepherds or uncircumcised Gentiles. They determined to show their contempt for the reports that were exciting King Herod and all Jerusalem. They would not even go to Bethlehem to see whether these things were so. And they led the people to regard the interest in Jesus as a fanatical excitement. Here began the rejection of Christ by the priests and rabbis. From this point their pride and stubbornness grew into a settled hatred of the Saviour. While God was opening the door to the Gentiles, the Jewish leaders were closing the door to themselves.
DA 62.5
The wise men departed alone from Jerusalem. The shadows of night were falling as they left the gates, but to their great joy they again saw the star, and were directed to Bethlehem. They had received no such intimation of the lowly estate of Jesus as was given to the shepherds. After the long journey they had been disappointed by the indifference of the Jewish leaders, and had left Jerusalem less confident than when they entered the city. At Bethlehem they found no royal guard stationed to protect the newborn King. None of the world’s honored men were in attendance. Jesus was cradled in a manger. His parents, uneducated peasants, were His only guardians. Could this be He of whom it was written, that He should *“raise up the tribes of Jacob,”* and *“restore the preserved of Israel;”* that He should be *“a light to the Gentiles,”* and for *“salvation unto the end of the earth”? Isaiah 49:6*
DA 63.1
*“When they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary His mother, and fell down, and worshiped Him.”* Beneath the lowly guise of Jesus, they recognized the presence of Divinity. They gave their hearts to Him as their Saviour, and then poured out their gifts, *-“gold, and frankincense, and myrrh.”* What a faith was theirs! It might have been said of the wise men from the East, as afterward of the Roman centurion, *“I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.”*
*Matthew 8:10*
DA 63.2
The wise men had not penetrated Herod’s design toward Jesus. When the object of their journey was accomplished, they prepared to return to Jerusalem, intending to acquaint him with their success. But in a dream they received a divine message to hold no further communication with him. Avoiding Jerusalem, they set out for their own country by another route.
DA 64.1
In like manner Joseph received warning to flee into Egypt with Mary and the child. And the angel said, *“Be thou there until I bring thee word: for Herod will seek the young child to destroy Him.”* Joseph obeyed without delay, setting out on the journey by night for greater security.
DA 64.2
Through the wise men, God had called the attention of the Jewish nation to the birth of His Son. Their inquiries in Jerusalem, the popular interest excited, and even the jealousy of Herod, which compelled the attention of the priests and rabbis, directed minds to the prophecies concerning the Messiah, and to the great event that had just taken place.
DA 64.3
Satan was bent on shutting out the divine light from the world, and he used his utmost cunning to destroy the Saviour. But He who never slumbers nor sleeps was watching over His beloved Son. He who had rained manna from heaven for Israel and had fed Elijah in the time of famine provided in a heathen land a refuge for Mary and the child Jesus. And through the gifts of the magi from a heathen country, the Lord supplied the means for the journey into Egypt and the sojourn in a land of strangers.
DA 65.1
The magi had been among the first to welcome the Redeemer. Their gift was the first that was laid at His feet. And through that gift, what privilege of ministry was theirs! The offering from the heart that loves, God delights to honor, giving it highest efficiency in service for Him. If we have given our hearts to Jesus, we also shall bring our gifts to Him. Our gold and silver, our most precious earthly possessions, our highest mental and spiritual endowments, will be freely devoted to Him who loved us, and gave Himself for us.
DA 65.2
Herod in Jerusalem impatiently awaited the return of the wise men. As time passed, and they did not appear, his suspicions were roused. The unwillingness of the rabbis to point out the Messiah’s birthplace seemed to indicate that they had penetrated his design, and that the magi had purposely avoided him. He was maddened at the thought. Craft had failed, but there was left the resort to force. He would make an example of this child-king. Those haughty Jews should see what they might expect in their attempts to place a monarch on the throne.
DA 65.3
Soldiers were at once sent to Bethlehem, with orders to put to death all the children of two years and under. The quiet homes of the city of David witnessed those scenes of horror that, six hundred years before, had been opened to the prophet. *“In Ramah was there a voice heard, lamentation, and weeping, and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children, and would not be comforted, because they are not.”*
DA 65.4
This calamity the Jews had brought upon themselves. If they had been walking in faithfulness and humility before God, He would in a signal manner have made the wrath of the king harmless to them. But they had separated themselves from God by their sins, and had rejected the Holy Spirit, which was their only shield. They had not studied the Scriptures with a desire to conform to the will of God. They had searched for prophecies which could be interpreted to exalt themselves, and to show how God despised all other nations. It was their proud boast that the Messiah was to come as a king, conquering His enemies, and treading down the heathen in His wrath. Thus they had excited the hatred of their rulers. Through their misrepresentation of Christ’s mission, Satan had purposed to compass the destruction of the Saviour; but instead of this, it returned upon their own heads.
DA 65.5
This act of cruelty was one of the last that darkened the reign of Herod. Soon after the slaughter of the innocents, he was himself compelled to yield to that doom which none can turn aside. He died a fearful death.
DA 66.1
Joseph, who was still in Egypt, was now bidden by an angel of God to return to the land of Israel. Regarding Jesus as the heir of David’s throne, Joseph desired to make his home in Bethlehem; but learning that Archelaus reigned in Judea in his father’s stead, he feared that the father’s designs against Christ might be carried out by the son. Of all the sons of Herod, Archelaus most resembled him in character. Already his succession to the government had been marked by a tumult in Jerusalem, and the slaughter of thousands of Jews by the Roman guards.
DA 66.2
Again Joseph was directed to a place of safety. He returned to Nazareth, his former home, and here for nearly thirty years Jesus dwelt, *“that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a Nazarene.”* Galilee was under the control of a son of Herod, but it had a much larger admixture of foreign inhabitants than Judea. Thus there was less interest in matters relating especially to the Jews, and the claims of Jesus would be less likely to excite the jealousy of those in power.
DA 66.3
Such was the Saviour’s reception when He came to the earth. There seemed to be no place of rest or safety for the infant Redeemer. God could not trust His beloved Son with men, even while carrying forward His work for their salvation. He commissioned angels to attend Jesus and protect Him till He should accomplish His mission on earth, and die by the hands of those whom He came to save.
DA 67.1
*The Star in the east was a Company of Brightly Shinning Angels*
*Bible Symbology / Star = Angel*
*²⁰....The seven stars are the angels* of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
*-Revelation 1:20*
The eastern star was a company of angels that only appeared to the wise men. If it were a fixed star or a planet it would have been known to astronomers, kings, priests, scribes, shepherds and common folk alike.
*Matthew 2:1, 2* -tells us that it led the wise men first to Jerusalem and then disappeared without anyone else seeing it. And later as the wise men departed for Bethlehem it reappears and leads them to the manger. (Verses 9,10). No one in Jerusalem seen the star reappear over Bethlehem when the wise men left or Herod would have followed it for himself and found Christ.
Angels can appear, dissappear and then reappear, fixed stars and planets cannot, nor do they hover low directly over a city (Jerusalem) and then reappear and hover over a manger. Angels can show forth their bright shining glory and lead the wise men directly to the manger and yet be invisible to everyone else.
Makes one pause and muse the traditional reasoning of a star or an angel being interchangeable on the top of a Christmas tree now, does it not? Traditionally in the not so far distant past, Bible believers knew that the Star of Bethlehem was comprised of Angels.
The guiding star was a ufo.
Jesus was a created being and was inseminated into Mary without intercourse. (Or actually who knows maybe she did have intercourse in an alien ship. If ufo abductees are to believed aliens are running some kind of human breeding program !)
UFOs show up all throughout out history.
Are they really aliens !? Are they outside influences from the matrix which we are confined in !?
Everything is made up of “pixels” in our reality just like the false realities we create in video games !
All supernatural occurrences, glitches, Mandela effects, everything can be explained away if we are inside a simulation !
Is our god dead !?
Is our matrix important ? Or is it a forgotten garbage computer that will one day die !?
Do people from outside the matrix still come see us or are we unimportant !? Is there a million simulations going on at once !?
Does that explain time slips, alternate reality encounters, etc !?
The universe is a trip !
Fate has ruined me. I can’t look at angra without seeing the angry mango.
You probably have no idea what I’m saying, but you guys scrolling get it 👉
The number of "kings" was never mentioned, only the three gifts are noted: gold, frankincense and myrrh.
It could have been two or it could have been a caravan. Talk about misinformation, yeesh 😐
astrology!
They were Magi, who were wise for seeking God’s Son, Jesus Christ.
Believing a myth can cause many irregulararities .
One problem here is that the magi didn't come to the barn/cave, they arrived after Jesus was born and visited them when they lived in a house in Nazareth.
NO, they didn't return to Nazareth until he was at least 12 after they found him in the Temple speaking with the Priests. That is generally considered to be after Herod died. It makes sense as the conversations with the priests would coincide with what has become known as a bar mitzvah. That wasn't the big production back then that it has become. It was simply a boy's first time reading from the Torah in the synagogue.
And there is even a bigger mistake, while considering Jesus' birth in December. It is winter time in Israel. There wouldn't be any shepherds in the hills taking care of sheeps. It is a real error crafted by the Catholic church and this insane tradition of Christmas (the birth) in December.
In my prostant church I was told they were astrologers
A valid point since astrology was more accepted as signs, calendar points. even when the constellations went by different names depending on the tribe (using the middle eastern anthropolgy's definiiton).
They are Persians
Persians
The 3 kings are the belt stars of Orion, which appear every Winter in the northern hemisphere. Jesus is the literal Sun, which rises again on the 25th of December in the constellation of Virgo. Jesus is born between Sagittarius and Capricorn, the horse and goat, hence the stable. The 12 disciples of Jesus are the signs of the Zodiac. The Christian story, along with every other historical depiction of a deity appearing on Earth, is astrological.
hmmmm you sound so sure of your information. I do not dispute it, I am impressed with your surety
so Jesus was LITERALLY a supermassive ball of 6000 degree C gas on Earth? WOW!
No. Zeitgiest is wrong.
You really shouldn't rely on what it said...it lied
Except that Orion is up right now, and has been prominent in the sky at any lattitude similar to Judea since October.
Ahhh but the solstice and Sol Ivicus or or Saturnus festivals that Constantine and the Niceans used....except those are all in December (the 10th Roman Month), Nicea and Constantine's throne were in Turkey and Constantinople-Istambul....and Orthodox Christmas feast of the nativity was on Jan 6, the rising day of Sirius in Virgo or the Star of the deliverer in the House of David to Hebrews....
Kind of blows Gerald Massey and Zeitgeist right out of the water.
However everyone was pretty sure of the passover in 33, and therefore Ressurection day. That was assumed by the Roman bishops at modern March 25. Add 9 months since heroes are conceived and die on the same day in ancient philosophy. The Eastern bishops assumed it to be 12 days later on April 6....add 9 months and you get Jan 6.
BTW when the Eastern and Western churches decided to agree on Christmas as Des 25 much later and long after paganism had been forgotten,....
Jan 6 was changed to Epiphany the feast of the Magi arrival...aka 12th Night.
If we study history forward it makes much more sense than if we guess at it backward.
@@STho205 Zietgiest is constantly full of crap.
Good to see someone else calling it out.
Though some of you own assertions are incorrect, like...
"BTW when the Eastern and Western churches decided to agree on Christmas as Des 25 much later and long after paganism had been forgotten,...."
Nah, Paganism was still going strong
The Dec 25th date emerged in 336,
Zoroastrian priest
I don't think it's entirely "made up;" after all, if the Old Testament states that kings would come to bring Him presents, then there must've been some kings who did. The historian Josephus says that there were hundreds of wise men who came to see him.
They were astrologers, scientists of that day
.wise men, yes.. kings? I doubt it..
Perhaps what the Old Testament says isn;t true?
I like your response, D Painter.
Your logic is flawed.
If the old testament says that Kings would bring presents then it is more likely they would make up the kings to fit the preexisting narrative, like they made up a number of other things in the nativity story that just are not true .
King had a much broader meaning than what we think of in modern monarchies. It could mean the head man of a province or a minister of a government department. Even today, in modern Hebrew, government ministers are referred to as Sa'ar, or Prince. In Hebrew, the Prime Minister is Sa'ar ha Memshalah, Prince of the Government.
For heaven sake educate yourselves, the wise men, manger, guiding star is fabricated by Luke only in Luke 1:26-38.... Luke never meet Jesus or Jesus mother, and Luke only started writing scriptures after Paul went to Greece in 47AD and they meet...and Paul recruited Luke to help himself, Paul fabricate scriptures with the objective of making it seem Paul's new religion was fore filling stupid old Jewish prophesies, so as to convince the Jews to convert to this new Roman faith and make the Jews more managable! Read Luke 1:1-6 in which Luke says while he thinks the information in his scriptures is true, it is only hear say from unspecified people, not any eye witness accounts of anything by anyone!
remember Jesus supposedly died in 30 or 33AD!
Try Mattghew Ch. 2
@@Meira750 Hi..... what verse in chappter 2 of Matthew. You see Paul wrote in Galatians 1:8-9 and 1:13 how he stopped other followers of Jesus writing or preaching anything Paul was not preaching. As a reaction to Jesus original real Appostles publically call Paul a liar at the Council of Jerusalem.... and preventing Paul from ever being able to use the title Apostle, (2 Timothy 1:15 & 1 Corinthians 9:1-3).
Resulting in the Gospels such as Matthew only being attributed to the Appostle after their death, not written by them. Meaning the Gospel of Matthew was very much used by Paul to make statements he wanted to use to validate his other fabrications while painting the desire picture of Jesus in scripture.
If this gives you any angst.... I'm happy to encourage you to fact check or ask for more details.
@@apollo8352 It's always best to go to the closest source. That would be Matthew. I accept the Canon of Scripture as it is, although I have some problems with Paul. However, I do not see him as directly inspired by the Holy Spirit as were the Prophets, none of the Apostles were, but he was commenting out of his accumulated wisdom as a rabbi. BTW, there is an original Hebrew manuscript by Matthew in in Hebrew University's Mount Scopus Library. This was uncovered by Nehemiah Gordon who is the son of an Orthodox rabbi but who became a Karaite Jew. Karaites are Jews who reject the Talmud and are, for lack of a better word, Sola Scriptura. They observe Torah as they see it directly written so not mixing meat and milk literally means not cooking a kid goat in its own mother's milk, for example. Cheeseburgers are ok, unlike for Rabbinic Jews. I have done my "fact checking" and know what and why I believe what I do.
The nativity story is full of contradictions and assuming they were real men at all is a logical leap
@علي يا سر Might be a language barrier or translation issue, but I do not understand your comment.
Sorry
@علي يا سر that came trough much clearer. Thank you.
however, there is no evidence to indicate he .was a real man
@علي يا سر There have always been men who have questioned superstition.
I am saying there is no evidence Jesus, specifically, was a real person
That's because of incorrect interpretation. For oen thing, December is off as the birth month for several reasons. The first being the Romans wouldn't have ordered travel in the dark of winter for the purpose of census taking. Conditions are too brutal. It can be very cold in the Judean Hills and snow. Nazareth is aboutr 150 Km. straight shot down the spine of the "West Bank," which is traditionally Samaria. It would have taken close to a week to make the trip thru hostile territory. More significantly, The 6th month is Elul on the Jewish Calendar. This corresponds to late August-September. The New Year biblically is NOT Rosh HaShana. That is some rabbinic convention the origin of which I am not even sure. Originally, in the Torah it was called the Feast of Trumpets. So, if the Angel appeared to Mary in the 6th month, it was Aug-Sept. 9 months later would be April-May. Also more likely for the shepherds to be out in the fields then rather than a snowy December day. There have been a lot of errors in translation and calculating calendars. I think the Church just chose December to give the people something to cheer them up during bleak days of winter and to replace the paganism of that date.
@@Meira750
So many mistakes in this narrative!