Does Crank Length Matter? The Most Important EMTB Adjustment You've Never Made!
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- čas přidán 28. 05. 2022
- Steve Jones is out in Vouzela, Portugal with the Miranda Components race team to test some crank lengths in search of the ultimate EMTB setup! Will shortening the cranks help steve climb some seriously tough rocky faces? Does crank length really affect your riding that much? There's only one way to find out! 🎬
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Nice test this one! Interesting comment from Tiago: shorter cranks = more cadence = more power. Shorter cranks provide less torque but coupled with increased cadence you actually get more power. Thanks very useful 👍
A good topic. I'm surprised you don't mention that shorter cranks require a correspondingly higher seat height to allow for full knee extension at the bottom of the stroke. This can be a problem when stopping while seated as you can't reach the ground with your foot and results in falling over a lot more unless you remember to use the dropper post. The other advantage of short cranks is that you can pedal faster and thus get an extra few kph of top speed on asphalt. I swapped the original 165 cranks to the Miranda 150 on my Turbo Levo after knee problems and surgery limited the angle I could bend my knees at the top of the stroke and appreciate the higher BB height and fewer pedal strikes as well. With an ebike I don't need the extra leverage of a longer crank. I agree with all the other benefits you covered.
Not sure its that much of an issue as well I certainly tend to run a lower saddle height than I would on a regular bike as the ‘correct’ leg length is less important on an ebike. In fact for climbing I very often put saddle down rather than up for more stability. Besides I am continually adjusting my saddle height to the ridding conditions anyway.
I bent the oem cranks on my 2020 kenevo and went with a set of miranda 155 cranks. It was game changing for me, bigger is not always better!
shorter cranks make you sit higher on the bike. Ifyou shorten the cranks by 10 mm, you will need to rise your saddle by 10 mm in order to come to the same distance between saddle and lowest crank position. In consequence you might want to rise your handlebars by the same 10 mm - or bend your back even more.
I like the 175 mm standard on MTBs and accept the165 on my eMTB without much enthusiasm
Really happy you finally came to Portugal to try our trails ! Will be heading to Sintra to enjoy the super trails we have here ? Cheers
incredible work around cranks. Much appreciated (now i need 150mm cranks in my orbea).
Rarely interesting & thought provoking. I saw another vid today promoting shorter cranks for better manouverability & more suspension in your legs. All food for thought
Shorter 150's transformed my Spectral ON! Loved it so much! My new Rocky Mountain Altitude comes with 170's, and i wish i could find a set of shorter cranks for it. Sadly no luck yet...
Can you tell me the BB high of the 2022 Altitude?
I switched my 2019 Turbo Levo to Miranda 150s years ago mostly because my legs are unusually short (28 inch inseam jeans). My leg joint angles improved with the shorter cranks, making it easier for me to push harder on the pedals, and allowing for a higher max cadence. Fewer pedal strikes are an added bonus.
what model did you get? I have a 22 levo SL. Did you need to get new crank arm bolt?
@@KendubiousI'm pretty sure I have the Kappa model. The new cranks came with bolts.
I recently swapped from 165 to 150 (miranda) cranks, as an experiment to see what, if any, difference it would make. From the first turn of the pedals it just felt better and more natural. Subjective I know, but I'll not be going back to longer ones.
Could you make a video about the bike's CAT of different brands ? This seems weird that we stress too much some Emtb that are cat4. Thanks for the video
Beautiful scenery Steve, but I don't know how you do it you were riding on a ledge on a rocky tarain I take my hat off to you for making it look so easy Wow dude 💯🙏👍🏾
Can't wait to see EMBN keeping with the new tech such as 4K videos! Huh?
Interesting piece Steve, did you change your crank length on your bike on returning to UK and your normal riding terrain?
I have had knee flare ups, limiting how much my knee would bend, a shorter crank helped me ride the bike sooner, which was a great relief, and in my particular case I got my motion back.
I ordered a set of Merida cranks. (does not apply to a knee that will not straighten out). I assume this flexibility only applies to ebikes, but do any analog cranksets allow changing out the right side crank arm?
I was literally just thinking about my crank length this morning. CZcams algorithm had done it again.
Haha! We hope you enjoyed! 😂
@@embn Very well done! I'm going to try swapping my 165mm for 150mm on my Husky EXC9
That motor sounded munted!
Early in 2018 I cut and re tapped my wife's 175mm levo cranks and they ended up 145mm as a experiment. Worked brilliantly on her small framed levo. So I ordered Miranda 150mm cranks for my 2018 levo. Used them ever since. Made up a set of 155mm on my shimano E8000 . Totally convinced that 150mm cranks are for me. Just use a lower gear to compensate for shorter cranks and lift the seat a bit. The Advantages are a no brainer. I did piont this out to you in 2018 but how and what would I know. 🤔 E=Mtb²
How tall are you? And retapping cranks is such a great idea!
Maybe for e-mtb it is different but on a regular mtb 170mm is ergonomically works best for me. 20years ago I tried 180, 175, 170, 165, and 170 felt best. With todays long and low geometry pedal strike happens to me every time I ride tech compared to 20year ago geometry but pedaling still feels best with a 170mm. I have a 30"/76.2cm inseam, so not real tall/long legs.
Thanks definitely going to 150 on my KSL.
What handlebar is that?
I have the same Giant Reign you road in the EWS E race last yr in a medium w/160 cranks and in high flip chip. I ride mostly enduro in N Ca (yes Downieville is my backyard) including racing the CES series. I often use the half pedal stroke on steep tech climbs. First if I changed I’d go 150 so there’s a noticeable difference in hopes my half stroke would be quicker and second it might let me ride in the low mode without as many pedal strokes. Knowing the Reign like you do do you think 150 cranks would work on that bikes maestro suspension?
power stroke greater on a longer crank. I think a shorter crank makes sense in alot of scenarios…esp with an EMB which helps you with the torque requirements. Short crank helps you keep up to the cadence when going fast on an electric bike in top gear too.
That is an advantage of a clipless pedal with a small footprint but just like short cranks there is the other side of that coin, one must take in the whole system and try and find what would work best for you.
I swapped out my EX1 170mm cranks for 160mm Miranda ones in 2019, much less pedal strikes though the real reason it's bad for it is my 2017 KTM Macina Lycan has a really low BB, with it being a more "trail" oriented bike and here in the Cairngorms I put it through what a more enduro specced bike would handle better(and always have the rear pumped a bit more than I'd want). V12's seem to hit everything tbh and maybe need a smaller pedal? I wrote off one of the cranks on a singletrack near my house in fading light in a collision with a heather covered boulder, I have err, straightened it out but replaced the pair anyway !!
I have a 2021 Trek rail and went with 155mm crank length and what a big difference. Almost no pedal strikes and my knees and hips feel much better. The 155mm were so good on ebike I just recently put 155mm on my regular bike 2019 stumpjumper. It’s even better on regular bike. And I did not have to change my seat height. I think the cranks I got were Miranda and picked them up for under 30 dollars
1000% agree. I did the same on my 2020 Trek Rail. Same observations. Easier on my hips and knees, and way more ability in techy climbs.
I run 155m cranks on normal bike and its way better in slippery stuff tech climbing etc but it doesnt excelerate as quick as longer cranks there is a reason bmx racers all run 180 or 185 mm cranks , and if you didnt adjust your seat hight it was wrong to start with .
@@Yoda-em5mt I have very short legs the 10mm from 165 to 155 did not make a huge difference in my seat height.
Hope cranks? I'm looking at 155s on my 9.8. They bang through every rock garden I go through here on my area of So Cal.
@@highwayman1218 hope cranks are great a little pricey. I can get 9 pair of fsa cranksets for the price of one hope. I found fsa for 30 dollars.
Shorter crank is even more beneficial on the downhill as you will avoid rock strikes and it is easier to put a pedal in when possible. Would not run over 160mm cranks on any bike except Pole Voima 😀
I'm usually left unsatisfied by their "tests". The proper way to test this is to choose a few common situations, then find locations for each. then you go to the first location and you do several runs on each crank, but you do a "pallet cleanser" run on your normal crank between each test cank. THEN you go to the next scenario and repeat. Ideally, this would be done with several riders of different sizes small medium and large, because leg-length and crank length work together for cadence and leverage. avoiding pedal-strikes is part of the skill (timing), so while it's a factor, I would suggest that it's less of a factor than leverage and cadence are
They are not testing, they are demonstrating. Big difference in narrative. If you want testing, maybe go for reading a 470 page book about crank lenghs instead?
@@AmvC your a goofball
@@rickywoods3101 is that ment to be english?
@@AmvC It's North American Informal English, yes.
My moterra has 160mm cranks which work great for an emtb. Hopping on my occam with 175mm cranks feels absolutely ridicculous how by knees whoop up and down and I’m constantly smashing them on rocks as well
I was looking forward to to comparison with the longest cranks but you only tested 165 and 155?? I run 175’s (only because of the lack of stock) and wouldn’t mind going back to a shorter crank but want to know the pros and cons of each.
This really has got me thinking for my Trek Fuel EXe the TQ motor works better at higher cadences anyhow so would make a sense to shorten from the stock 165mm cranks to maybe a 150/155mm 🤔
My Levo came with 165s and my Kenevo SL came with 170s, I had lots of issues with the 170s wacking rocks a lot, the 165s really helped not I am wondering is 160s would be even better.
excellent video - my bike fit professional recommened shorter cranks
Crank length also affect torque reading by the motor. It is simple phisics. Kong arm length generates more torque.
Does the 150mm fit specialized turbo levo SL year 21, I tried HOPE and they didn't fit..
One of mine bent. 152mm Delta.
Look like my 152mm cranks are already good for me. One problem is it is hard to ride with front end up, on a shorter crank.
i ran 165 then swapped out for Hopes 155.......noticable less pedal strikes and better spinning. was worth a cost of upgrade? well i could still ride perfectly ok with 165, as not a pro rider.
Man , that guy can ride ! (Not Jones , the other guy) 😂
I've been trying to get shorter cranks for my Kenevo SL but there's only one option and they're always extinct
Do you have any tips for stopping my miranda cranks constantly working loose and falling off the drive shaft of my shimano E8000 motor?
I use a wave washer on my Bosch setup. Works great.
I bought me some chinese carbon crank 165mm. Best value I ever bought for my bike
I think this should be took about in all MTB riding but my question is how much does it affect saddle high.
If you go 15mm shorter cranks then you will need to raise your saddle 15mm this in turn will change how high your bars are and make you feel like your bike has a steeper sa .
Sorry Steve, I generally enjoy your vids, but this one seems more like a commercial for the brand rather than informative concerning crank length. I played through it twice, and didn't hear a mention of the effect on seat height or bar height, by shortening the crank to maintain original seated geometry. Going from a 165 crank to a 150 will require raising both seat height and bar height by 15mm if you are to maintain your original setup. This will also raise the center of gravity of the bike/rider.This will also move cg rearward, the amount of which is dependent upon STA, which the team rider did briefly mention. This will all potentially affect stability (good or bad)
Hello, where can I buy these cranks for bosch 4 gen 155mm long Thanks for advice
From my research for 155s on my 9.8.... Looks like Hope cranks are the way to go.
I was impressed and bought the Miranda 152mm from Amazon UK. Big Mistake!.
On the second ride, I hit my shoe toe into a rock while standing. Nothing happens to my leg or shoe. But the right arm BENT OUTWARDS!
I was 100% sure that my new cheap Ali-Express pedal axle bent. - it's like spaghetti :(
I would have tought that a shorter crank would lose you power.... in the same gear. Aspecialy on ebikes....?
(E bikes add power, they have a motor, you just need to keep the cranks spinning, is why shorter cranks work on E)
You said "Obviously you probably have more stability with longer cranks on the descents" do you? I would have thought the opposite, this should be tested.
I was having a bit to many pedal strikes, and eventually bent a crank, so I dropped my stock turbo levo cranks for some praxis ones that were 10mm less then the stock. I think the stock are 170mm and I dropped to 160mm I also upgraded my chainring from 32 teeth to 34 teeth. This helps with the shorter cranks so you notice no difference with cadence.
A larger chainring makes it harder to pedal, the same as shortening the crank arms makes it harder to pedal, so I have no idea why you think changing 32t to 34t helps with the shorter cranks..
if i go from a 165mm to a 155mm will my seat hight need adjusting to combat the 10mm difference.
Yes, it will slightly change your knee angle.
@@Driftuner thanks. i`ll try highering seat then. not got new ones yet but thay are on order.
yep - the way a fitter described it to me was - your sat in a chair and you shorten its legs so you need to make that height up with a cushion……….not 100% but you get the idea
Hey Neil! Yea, if you want to make the difference up then, by all means, raise the seat post in the frame. 👍
Hope KTM bikes get bring into the US market
Cool vid steve looks like a fun riding spot why are you guys all still running flat pedals a thought you learned to ride long ago there are these new things called clippless pedals like ski binding and they give you almost triple the power in a smooth many to the back wheel dont tell anyone as there still proto types and we dont want the ebike world to spill the beans just yet. 😉
Someday when you learn how to stay on a bike, with out being clipped to it, you will know why flat pedals are better.....its a technique thing. Its the latest rage.
@@bradsanders6954 dont you really mean someday when i walk up every little hill like flat pedal riders do and someday when i think 20km is a big ride like flat pedal riders do and someday i ride as sloooww as all flat pedal riders do oh i could go on , i did ride flat pedals racing bmx back in the early eighties so i do know how to push the bike into the ground but i wont be going flats again for real riding ha ha , i do get that most riders riding clipless have really shit technique . Enjoy your flats i,m staying clipped in 👍✌
Do u ever give away any of these bikes ur given?
it's all about finding the balance (ba~dum~dum~pssh)
Good one! 😂
and strength
Practice make perfect, every one taps a pedal from time to time, just keep going you will get less as technique improves. ✌️
So true, Stewart! 👍
I must admit I am not convinced, if these bikes are being ridden and the rider didn't know the crank length, would they notice the difference
Me dieing going up hills. Old man on e bikes not sweating.
would have liked if the pro racer got a little more speaking time! What crank length is he running?
The 170-175mm "standard" comes from the times of single speed bikes, the idea was that sacrificing cadence and biomechanical stability for leverage was worth it. On anything with gears the idea of trading so much for a few gears worth of leverage from cranks is assininely stupid, but we all know how the bike industry is about traditions. On a geared bike 155mm cranks for a 180-190cm rider should be the maximum.
I prefer to use 165 cranks with my single speed mtb, while I use 170 with my geared mtb..
You don't need a big lever because you have an electric motor... And if you put the logic in reverse, you can afford a big lever because you have an electric motor. The question remains in ground clearance, seat height and rider physiology.
Motor so loud .
My experience is that 170mm is perfect for balding elderly lads.
?
They shouldn't have told you what length you had then you could have placed them blind
Too bad Miranda cranks bend too easy
Very noisy motor