TR&CI 124: What Exactly Is (And Is Not) A Modal Spell?
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- čas přidán 9. 04. 2024
- In this episode of Tough Rules & Cool Interactions, I will be talking about the new Riku card from the Thunder Junction set that makes a direct reference to a Modal Spell, something that has never been mentioned on a black bordered card until now. There are a lot of things out there that seem like they should count towards triggering Riku, but sadly they do not.
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Rules covered in this episode are:
700.2
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"Sunset Arthur" by Michael Wyckoff
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#MTG #Magicthegathering #commander - Hry
These Spree cards are insane. Even the weaker/less rare ones are so so versatile. They will absolutely become very common in commander play.
BQ: 700.2 mentions `a bulleted list preceded by instructions for a player to choose a number of those options, such as "Choose one --."` and the Spree spells do not explicitly have this text, but afaik Spree has the reminder text of "(Choose one or more additional costs.)" which 701.1 states "... sometimes reminder text summarizes their meanings." Because of this, I understand the rules to say that "Spree" is a stand-in for "Choose one or more... additional costs." which mostly fits the description of Modal? We're not using "bullets" as text formatting for these, and the starting phrase is slightly modified so I am interested to see how the rules get updated to account for Spree cards. Oh, and my final answer is that these will certainly be categorized as modal CARDS, and I think that YES they will count as modal SPELLS.
Very well done! You nailed it. WotC will more than likely update the wording on the CR to include this, but they did use some specific wording on the release notes to say that, "You choose the modes as you cast the spell with spree. Once modes are chosen, they can't be changed." And then they mention the wording mode and modes multiple other times, so they are indeed Modal while a spell on the Stack.
Bonus question: no. Spree, like most abilities in Magic, is just Kicker 😄
X spells are just kicker. Mana costs are just kicker.
HA! Oh snap, while that is "true" from a practical standpoint, the game actually does consider them to be a Modal Spell. But yes, everything is pretty much just Kicker and Flashback. Funny that those two abilities released back-to-back. Kicker in Invasion and then the next year it was Flashback in Odyssey. Such legendary and impactful abilities in the game, both within a year.
OK, I was tricked by the wording. Indeed looking at the latest CRs:
702.172a Spree is a static ability found on some modal spells (see rule 700.2) that applies while the
spell on the stack. Spree means “Choose one or more modes. As an additional cost to cast this
spell, pay the costs associated with those modes.”
Literally the fact it's modal is the only funcional difference to several instances of kicker. That also makes them resolve in order but kicker can do that with wording.
Metagaming a bit, I think printing the first modal spell matters card without a modal spell mechanic to acompany it would be very weird. So I think sprees are modal spells.
Ha! Hey man, if you come to the conclusion in any way, then that's always good. And yes, the Spree cards are indeed a Modal Spell when you cast them.
Oh, I remembered Healing Salve but not the blasts.
I'd say yes to the bonus question - they establish different modes in the card. And I'd posit that those types of cards are the main reason for something like Riku within a limited environment.
Yeah, when working on the video, I actually forgot those cards were Modal, I actually thought it was the Charms in Mirage, but then Healing Salve popped into my brain.
Looking at Riku's EDHREC page, I see a lot of people including the Spree cards. So for their sake, I hope that Spree does count as being modal. The question is, do the + symbols and a mana cost count as being bulleted?
I would hope so for the limited environment as well.
@@seandun7083 Yeah, it would be weird if they printed a card that cares about something and then didn't print many cards to trigger that thing, especially if some of those things seem like they should.
The + symbols do not have any gameplay impact, they are purely visual for our convenience. But, having said that, and for the good news of the folks already putting lists together, the Spree cards are indeed a Modal Spell when being cast. Each option on the card is a mode that must be picked during the process of casting the spell and based on the modes picked they adjust the cost when locking that in.
@@seandun7083 Yup, the Limited scene is saft, if you pull a Riku in draft, then you will be able to trigger him with Spree cards when you cast them.
I pulled Riku out of my collectors sample pack that came with my desert bloom commander deck, i just ordered the cards i was missing for him for like 15$, super excited to try it out
Oh, congrats on the pull. Good luck with the deck. Are there any particular modal spells you're looking forward to using in the deck? Or are you just more excited for the Riku triggers?
@@ThisIsACommanderChannel i’m super pumped about both. it feels like i have a 200 card deck cuz i have so many option every turn, i’ve only golfished it a couple times but it seems like it can get out of hand pretty fast since it can happen multiple times a turn. especially with cost reductions you can spell sling 3-4 modal spells in a turn and make a huge riku or a huge board state while also impulse drawing and continuing the value. i’m so excited for a real game
@@j.angelzamorano4966 Oh snap, very cool that it is running so smoothly already. Hopefully I'll get a chance to face off against Riku one day.
Baller stuff out there man! keep it up!
Thanks man, glad you're enjoying it.
They release a set where one of the core signature mechanics involves choosing modes, then in the same set release a legendary guy who reacts to choosing modes. I can't imagine they didn't intend for them to work together.
Ha! You would be right, they did mean for them to interact and care about each other. They will in all likelihood update the wording on the CR to include these. The + symbol doesn't officially make a gameplay impact.... yet... That might be what they mention, or they might go about it a different route. Will see soon.
Spree doesn't have bullet points so it makes me wonder if they will update the rule to include bullets and plus symbols.
I would say it's safe that they will update it. They did use some specific wording on the release notes to say that, "You choose the modes as you cast the spell with spree. Once modes are chosen, they can't be changed." And then they mention the wording mode and modes multiple other times.
Awesome video as always! Could I suggest you open a Google Doc where we can ask for question so you can answer them in future videos? I have a question I haven been able to answer and two level 1 judges gave an entirely different answer:
I have Scion of the Ur-Dragon on the field and I activate its ability. My opponent casts and resolves an Opposition Agent and the Scion's ability resolves. My opponent gets to search the dragon but, does the Scion becomes a copy of the dragon?
Follow-up. If I have an Arcane Adaptation on the field naming dragon and I activate the Scion's ability searching for Blightsteel Colossus, does it become a copy?
Thanks, glad you've enjoyed the video. I could look into a Google Doc for submitting questions, but I'll need to make sure I have it set up for sending me notifications when it gets submissions. I get DINGs on my phone when people comment on my videos, but I usually wait till I'm at my PC to reply since looking up cards and jumping back between that, the YT video, and if I need to have the CR for reference... that is not easy on a phone.
As for your question, that's a solid one for sure, Oppo Agent is a while card which is why I actually ended up doing 2 videos on it and have a few others planned down the road. As for your specific questions, they would both end up working in your benefit as the Scion player. The Scion's wording specifically only checks that the card is a dragon permanent when you find it in the Library, but then when it goes to make the Scion into the new version of what it is then it doesn't check that the card is still a dragon nor does it check to see if it's still in the GY. It got the information it needed when it saw the card in the Library. Not all effects are like this in Magic, like for Duplicant, if the card is no longer in Exile or if it changes from no longer being a creature after it left the BF then the Duplicant would just be a 2/4 and be a Shapeshifter. I hope this all made sense. Basically, even a Replacement Effect like that one on Oppo Agent or something like Rest in Peace happen when you activate the Scion, it will still be changed to a copy of whatever the searched card was until EoT.
I almost missed this episode. I figured you just didn't do an episode since I didn't get the notification, but this was a pleasant surprise for my Saturday. That's very strange that it's only just now being mentioned after 30 plus years. You think they will make it a regular thing in other sets to mention it on cards?
Glad you finally caught it eventually. As for the future, I'd say that's a safe bet that they will revisit it. They're releasing so many dang products and sets, so they're gonna have to venture into things like this more. As for how much, that's the big question. Are they going to touch on it just a bit here and there, or go overboard like they did with Treasures and Ward... I hope not. I'd like to think they learned their lessons with those two. Or who knows, maybe it sits in a dark corner like Mutate.
That is so strange that modal double faced cards are not modal spells. I almost feel like if Wizards keeps going down the path of referencing modal spells that they should change the name of one. Removes confusion like this.
Yeah, it is a weird thing and I'm sure it will lead to a lot of weird games when someone runs those MDFCs in their deck. Hopefully they find this video before they put time into buying/trading for the cards.
That is a tricky bonus question. I want to say that spree is not modal. Isn't spree more like kicker? They are each an additional cost, not a choice made upon resolution.
But modal spells are selected when the spell gets put on the stack. They sorta have to be, given that in some spells some of the choices of modes have targets and others do not.
@@heitortremorYou raise a good point.
@@heitortremor Yeah, I guess that is true. Hmmm, this is a tricky one.
@@digitalworldsvr7881 Tricky indeed. And good news for Riku players, the Spree cards are a Modal Spell when you cast them. It is very similar looking to Kicker, but Kicker just changes or adds on something if it was kicked, whereas with Spree you actually pick the modes you're going to be casting while it's being cast to the Stack, classifying it as a Modal Spell.
Wasn't there an acorn card that mentioned modal stuff? I am guessing that is why you emphasised black border in this episode. I wonder how many more cards in the next 2 years will mention modal spells or abilities.
Yup, the card is called Far Out and while it doesn't say "Modal Spell" on there, it does specifically mention picking modes for spells and abilities.
Of course Spree spells are modal. Thus the put out a Commander who cared about that in conjunction. Spree is basically modal kicker
It could be tricky for some, just because the + isn't an actual circular bullet point.
@@ThisIsACommanderChannel Fair, I could definitely see out of context it being confusing. It is still a bulleted list, but the "bullets" are +'s not dots this time. And looking at Riku, he clearly wants you to go on a spree.
@@SwedeRacerDC Oh yeah, "Spree-ku" or Spree Riku is a match made in Heaven. Looking forward to future Spree cards.
Any kind of kicker mechanic could be misconstrued as being modal. Overload, cleave, bestow, adamant, ...
Yeah, Alternative Costs, that is something that a lot of players could get wrong with Riku.
what about cards like hero's downfall? they have options, but are not considered "modal." why is that?
So with Modal Spells, ones with the bullet pointed list of options to chose, when you copy them then the copies of those Modal Spells also have that mode that was chosen, for example if your opponent were to cast Austere Command and choose the artifact and enchantment modes and then you cast Fork to copy their Austere Command, you wouldn't be able to then chose the modes to kill small and then big creatures for your version. Modal Spells have those specific aspect to them. Whereas with non-Modal Spells, there are a lot that have choices that you make, like what target you want and that kind of target would be specified, but you're not exactly choosing a mode for that. If they cast Hero's Downfall targeting your PWer, and then you Fork it, your copy isn't bound to targeting another PWer, you could pick any other creature if you want. I hope this helps out.