The Punjab Bloodied, Partitioned and Cleansed | Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed and Dr. Naazir Mahmood
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- čas přidán 29. 01. 2023
- The Partition of India in 1947 resulted in the biggest forced migration in history-some 14 million people altogether-of which 10 million were from the Punjab. This book is a holistic study of the first major case of ethnic cleansing after the Second World War. Besides shedding new light on the events through secret British reports, it also contains poignant accounts by eyewitnesses, survivors, and even participators in the carnage on both sides of the border.
The discussion on “The Punjab Bloodied, Partitioned and Cleansed” authored by Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed is moderated by Dr. Naazir Mahmood.
About the Author:
Ishtiaq Ahmed was born in Lahore on 24 February 1947. He received a PhD in Political Science from Stockholm University in 1986. He taught at Stockholm University from 1987 to 2007, and was then invited as Senior Research Fellow and Visiting Research Professor by the Institute of South Asian Studies, National University of Singapore, during 2007-2010. He is now Professor Emeritus of Political Science, Stockholm University and Honorary Senior Fellow, Institute of South Asian Studies, National University of Singapore. He has published extensively on Pakistani and South Asian politics. His research interests cover fields as diverse as political Islam, ethnicity and nationalism, human and minority rights, and indeed, partition studies.
#Pakistan #India #Punjab #Partition
Dr. Ishtiaq was the first writer that i read on Pakistan history. Shukar hai.
Pakistan me is channel ka prachar kare
@@dhanapatimandal6890we won't find anyone like him in India in these times without being killed ? And we don't understand hindi, its quite different than Urdu.
@@handsomepappi kuch bhi mtlb? Tell me one journalist being killed or silenced? If it was so all the left librandus would be banned. And maximum urdu words are hindi words just written in Urdu script. Ik both the languages
@@handsomepappi India is not Pakistan, we have free speech, there are many intellectuals in India freely criticizing the government.
@@handsomepappi Hindi and Urdu are same language evolved from Hindustani language with influence of Sanskrit (for Hindi) and Arabic (for Urdu) with different scritps.
*Please invite Dr Ishtiaq again, words by him are like pearls* .
czcams.com/video/YZRXSSz5qFM/video.html
He is coming to Maharashtra India in May 23
My grandparents are from Peshawar, lost everything and came to delhi with nothing. My grandmother lost her brother and family in Peshawar
Sorry for This
I'm so sorry to read this .. very painful 😢😢🙏🙏
My god I am so sorry
Dr sahib your work is extremely important. Millions of people were victim of partition. My own family migrated from Jallandar district and settled near Wazirabad . We heard stories of atrocities and friendship . I was born in pakistan , raised in uk 🇬🇧, living in USA 🇺🇸 and now working in Saudi Arabia 🇸🇦 . My parents have died , Iam nearing 70 i still feel my parents pain. Your work helps millions of people to understand the partition traumas
Islam provides and muslims divide
@@csheruNo my brother Islam doesn't teach violence, please don't blame Islam for wrong doings of people, Islam is religion of peace, it's people who are wrong not Islam
It is generational trauma and still unresolved. We got to reconcile and move forward again. But I think it is impossible now.
It's almost 2.30 am here. I just couldn't stop watching this discussion. My family is from Lahore so I have heard similar stories from them. It was good to see so many open minded people in the audience.
Same here
We are not Abrahamist. W are not wedded to land. We are not tied ideology o book. We believe all our ideology is developed by us we created. We will adopt.
We are not shéep like west or other European s or islamist who kill in the face of different strokes. Chinese spartans we are anarchist. Anarchy is fee thinking. Hence we can get up and run. We have of kare infected by montheism, but we have enough energy to get up and run defeat all.
You are a fool as you believe there one answer. I do pity you.
We are self healing.
i am from lahore, a muslim alhamdulillah but have the same sentiments for the great scholar dr ishtiaq ahmed as you have. a very impressive respectable teacher for me
@@amirhumzahy you muslims have superiority complex I mean everywhere I go I see guys like you claiming to be superior to everyone else smh I mean no one cares who you are 🤷🏽♂️
@@amirhumzai am from delhi jay shree ram i am hindu
What a beautiful discussion, what a great man Dr Sahib is. May he live long enough to tell these stories.
Although I am not Panjabi yet close to Panjab and studied in Punjab University.I really appreciate Mr.Ishtiyak Ahmed,his tireless efforts which only an emotional and concerned charged SOUL could have done.Bravo.I enjoyed besides becoming emotional.
I am Punjabi hindu 47 years old. In my village in patiala district. There were only 3 families of Muslims but now more than 100 families.
93 family Bihar or up hai
@@Hararyoukoz3106 no they are due to rabbit infection.
Thank you Indian Embassy in Stockholm giving visa to Dr Sahab without which publishing this book would be incomplete. 🇮🇳🙏🏼
As a student from india they never taught us this history and geopolitical reasons for this partition , i am deeply thankful to Ahmed sir for this love from india ♥️🇮🇳
Dr Ishtiaq is one of the most respected researcher and impartial who is courageous enough to put research papers in the shape of well accepted books. Salute to Dr Sahib. God bless him always. 🙏
He could do this while only seating in Sweden!
I can never be tired of listening to Dr. Ishtiaq. I can only wish that he is invited to India. I would absolutely pay to listen to him!
He is going to be in Mumbai in March
@@prabhukod1 Are you sure? Would love to go since I am from Mumbai
@@purushetty7458 yes. He himself mentioned it in one of his CZcams videos
@@prabhukod1 Awesome! Thank you for sharing that.
@Student of Klaus Schwab Bruahaha !!!
My paternal city is Jalandhar, Punjab. My grandfather was remembering his city of birth while on his deathbed. Imagine the pain 😢
Your grandfather first left India because he loved Islam more than his motherland... so he left India.... Based on religion ignoring his roots... And the fact that you All are converts... He left as he preferred not to stay with kafir hindus.... HE HAD NO RIGHT TO REPENT ON DEATH BED....You all Muslim of sub continent are like him... And you face dire consequences of forgetting your religion and roots.. I am happy you all have left our nation... But we still have 30 cr piggs still in India
Muhammad bhai, I really appreciate you sharing that. My family are refugees from Mirpur, I was raised in Delhi. My grandpa used to go hang out in Old Delhi off and on. I realized later that it reminded him of Pakistan, his old country. I miss my grandpa dearly. He lost a lot but he gave me and others much more than he ever lost. We are all one family.
😂😂😂😂 accha hua
@@user-rv2yd1fl3kwhat do u mean by old country. There was no Pakistan before 1947
@@ABMSTUDY There was also no India before 1947, only British India.
My maternal grandmother's family from a small village called Qila didar singh, near Gujranwala, they started from there with 1800 odd people, moving towards amritsar and only 20 people reached alive and rest all were massacred on the way and many young girls and women were snatched away.
It is so sad,we should not forget it.
Do not forget, it can happen again. 90% of violence started by Muslims only. Ishtiaq Ahmed was very clear that the first train of slaughtered and raped dead bodies came from Pakistan to India. India only responded days later.
@DollarTree Shark india becomes the monster 😆
@@talashegumshuda5791 Yes, India should become unforgiving. Muslims only understand force, not reason. It is proven world over many times. This is due to the inability of Muslims to compromise and come to the middle. Even if one group shows some comprise another group will replace it by calling it “Gaddar”. This has been going on from Mmd’s time to be honest. All the internecine genocide is just a result of that attitude.
@DollarTree Shark what is mdms time.
Y u think muslims just leave in subcontinent. Arab america europe y muslims leave there with no violence.
It is consoling to discover truth before dying, though I feel bad for living with lies all my life stretching to 71 years.
I want more channels like this in India and Pakistan so people can see the reality.
Yes...lets thank Black Hole to give a stage bringing people on both sides together..rather divide them
we know all of this in india
@@youtubestudies4173 true 😊☺️
People in India are already aware of all this. The truth is that Pakistan never received Independence. They just went from an outright Colony to a Client State of Britain and America. The independence that they would have got was stolen from them by their Leaders.
Always a great pleasure to listen to Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed. He is very genuine and fact finding. 🙏🏻
Well said sister.
Great discussion on hard work done by Prof. Ahmed. Respect from India.
I'm from #Chakwal , #Punjab , Pakistan. There are still many stories untold . Thank you very much Prof. Dr. Ishtiaq sb & #BlackHole .Greetings from #China
Is there still covid in china?
@@YM-wp6me no. It's over now
tell story
@@g2032 and rest are demons
From india , nawab of Hyderabad, hus whole ministry, bawab of jubagadh, hidms deputy SHAHNSWAJ BHUTTO ( FATGER IF JULFIKAR) , NSWAB IF BHOPAL, NAWAB IF AWADH, NAWAB OF KATHIAWAD ETC went to Pakistan.
Thus Pakistan became a concentrate if NAWAB.
As hindu Bangladeshi🇧🇩 i bow down to feet 👣of Jinnah sahab for Partition even when it means a secular nation and more fall of our bodies as per governor Jenkin ❤🐄🛐🛕🙏bcz india 🇮🇳Nepal 🇳🇵 is alive we hv a place as hindu 🛕🛐
This is probably the first time I have seen someone talking from a neutral perspective on partition in Pakistan.
Hope better sense prevails and situation improves there.
No chance
Agreed ! No chance indeed.
He is propagating his perspective from Sweden.
Kind of a Stockholm Syndrome
It's not neutral and neither objective. Any objective thought on partition would lead to the conclusion that it's stems from Qur'an which he eloquently avoids. Besides he praises nehru and gandhi for secularism not seeing that they were also opportunists who created same problems for people as Jinnah did.
Thank you Drsaab. I loved this talk. A lot to learn and understand from our history. I pray for more people to listen to you and read your books. Humbled by your consistent research for so many years and all the hurdles that you must have faced.
So happy to see Dr. Hoodbhoy in the audience. Love him and my respects to him as well.
Regards, Just another Indian
Àq1
we are told and shown all wrong.....
My late father born in 1920 always maintained that when you carve a small country out of a bigger country, you are asking for trouble.
The question is who started the trouble. Honestly contemplate it. MOOPLA RIOTS, DIRECT ACTION day, and many such incidences which led to partition were initiated by MUSLIM LEAGUE. Gandhi even said to HINDUS that even if you ALL get KILLED that is fine please do not retaliate. But this gesture was seen as cowardice and more and more attacks on HINDUS happened that is when HINDUS retaliated as a countermeasure for MUSLIM OFFENSE. So it is MUSLIMS who initiate an attack on HINDUS. Be it in pre-independence INDIA or NOW. look at all wars we have fought against Pakistan. Every one of them was started by Pakis.
Jinnah made fools of these people and the masses there is still fools.
British united India and held it together with brute force otherwise we would have several more countries in subcontinent instead of 3 countries now. It was Congress madness that propagated akhandh Bharat utopia. which caused great tragic split. Dr sahab being a social scientist ignoring this elephant in the room.
@@mohammadmian7700 Wrong theory. If what you say was right then we would have seen multiple splits of BHARAT after independence. That didn't happen. The partition happened because of JINAH. Read books by your own authors and you will get the right history. Reading is not your forte, right?
@@mohammadmian7700 Pakistani's are brainwashed radical, your kids are taught to hate INDIA. There are many interviews of random Pakistani teenagers spewing pure hate without any logic behind it.
The Muslim League was a party of hooligans.
Sir we are very proud that you did such a remarkable work on history that finaly made us know the reality behind this so called independence, my grand parents are also from rajastan , district churu left everything there and started from zero here..... You are a institute
Amazing session by a Great scholar please keep this kind of session more and invite such people and if you may identify any person on the Punjab partition it would be a great courtesy to us.
Always a pleasure to hear Dr.Ahmed sir .
Wish you very good health & safety.
Great to see Nazir Mahmood. He taught me 26 years back to prepare for IBA exams.
Great conversation with Dr Ishtiaq … loved it esp the research behind it and seemingly unbiased attitude he had. Just ordered this book and look forward to reading it.
It is always a great pleasure to listen respected Sir Dr Ishtiaque Ahmed Sb.
This book and session is a gem. An eye opener.
It is surprising to note that all Sikh Gurus have names of Hindu gods or personalities and none have muslim names. Actually, it is said that actual practice of Sikh as a specific religious practice was started by Guru Govind Singh. It is also said that Hindus of that time used consider Sikhs are protector warriors of their religion and life and there was a practice of bringing up first male child as a Sikh....
oh yeah well than why did guru gobind Singh said hes a idol breaker?
Muslims se saath leke Khalistan banayengey Canada aur Australia mein. Jitna khud ko gair Hindu dukhane ka koshish mein Guru Gobind ke bachchon ka kaatilonse milnewalo ke ooper Daya aati hai...
Sikhism stands on the foundation of genial spirit of Sanatan Dharma, its Militant disposition arose due to continuous struggle with Islamic bigotry. Islam, for all its claims of superior conception of a monolithic God (Monotheistic sects are a well adjusted part of Hinduism by the way), was founded on the notions of haughtiness and superiority, and its history is littered with use of forced conversions, murder and rape (in fact no religious books other than Islam so overtly exhorts encourage Jihad by use of force). Hinduism is but a perverted version of Sanatan Dharma, it was necessary to unshackle its obsession with tunnel vision of idol worship, hence statement by Guru Gobind Singh about being an idol breaker.
@@slowknife2873 ppppppppĺĺĺ
Ravindra ji,aap study karen hindu dharam mein puja,maanta,aur sara vidhi vidhan itna pakhand aur loot ki raah par chal pada, karamkaand charon taraf haavi ho gaya toh Sikh dharam hindu dharam ka sudhar karne ke liye paida hua.Aur hindus hi iski nursary thi.So Sikh hindus se aate the aur aam taur par unke naam vi wahi rehte the lekin jivan jaach(way aur manners of living) badal jaate the.jo majboot hindu hote wahi Sikh bante,kiunke Sikhi talwar ki dhaar par chalne ka naam hai.
I’ve listened whole episode in one sitting and literally had tears all the time my grand parents have been through this trauma…
I am very glad to see Dr shab at this platform... 💖 From Punjab Pakistan
I was born in Pakistan, I listened to almost all his lectures.
This is a must watch for Indian Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, who easily gets appease in the name of religion by leaders like Owaisi & other regional parties.
@Student of Klaus Schwab sooner or later you will realise, it's just that you have stopped using your mind.
It would be very difficult for an average Pakistani to consume this truth. When you are taught all your life that Jinnah is God Like and you were imposed upon unfairly and you are the martyrs hearing atruth like this would make you go rudderless. It is the kind of mental shock an average human may not be able to take. I would suspect many Pakistanis would have found it difficult to sit through this discussion
Lies of Ishtiaq Ahemad in this video
------------------------------------------------------------
(1) Congress opposed Liaquat Ali Khan's budget because Sardar Patel was a right wing Hindu congressman.
But the reality is here :-
czcams.com/video/c1odDWaDQqo/video.html
(2) Ishtiaq Ahemad tried to equates the whole scenario hindu muslim communal riots . Bengal vs Bihar and East Punjab vs West Punjab.
He said that it was British conspiracy and violence was done by both side equally with support of local mafia.
But the reality is ,
Sufies Barelawis , few Devbandi scholars had declared Jihad against hindu and Sikhs.
Even Not a single thought of school of Islam oppose slavery. They justify the sex slavery of women nowdays too. The Hindus and Sikhs women were sold and raped because it was Quranic doctrine that muslims can keep sex slave (concubine) who were captive during Jihad. Even Qur'an tell about that don't Marry with non muslims until they convert into islam because they are inferior than a sex slave (londi).
According to Imam Sha'fi , muslims can check hands , privet parts too before purchasing slaves. Prophet Muhemmad's wife Maria bin kibtiyya was a sex slave.
I would suggest Ishtiaq Ahemad Sab , you should read islamic history particularly fiqah and hadiths.
The doctorin of Barelwis was "there is no Riyast e madina without jihad and Idol worshipers have only two choices convert or being killed because Jajia is only option for Ahl e Qitab according to Quran"
So , there is a lot of lies told by Ishtiaq Ahemad but I would say , it doesn't matter If an Iranian says that the Zoroastrians were good people, or a white American says that the Native Indians were very good.
it would be very difficult for a Indian bundutva nationalist to face the reality that the Pakistan was created to protect the muslims of the subcontinent from oppressive brahmin rule hence why y'all have decided to create your own Fairy tale about Jinnah being the villain
@Student of Klaus Schwab Thanks for providing evidence for the point I was making
Thats why the attendance is so slim
@@PS-ic4bp I think attendance is low because very few in Pakistan has the habit of reading and this is an author who writes in English. Plus the subject itself
I really miss my grandfather and father who sometimes talked about partition and only first real talk from Pakistani author.
I used to watch him with Qumar Cheema, Aliya and Tarik fath. He is really good person, speak by heart.
Thank you guys so much for doing this session.
Fewer comments by Pakistanis doesn't mean that there is no Pakistani literature, the problem is that this gentleman who is a doctor, respected, educated, was born in the wrong place, he should have been born in India. The reason for Pakistan's existence is ego or ideology. As a Pakistani, I fully believe in it and it was a great favor on the part of our leader that this country was given to us. After that, it was the weaknesses of our people. Due to which our country has reached this situation, it has reached this point, then the ideology of Pakistan was absolutely true and it is still true. I am and I have many differences with my country
As I see comments below. No one from Pakistan seems even watches these enlightening conversations. Such a sad thing 😢.
Just like no right wing Hindu nationalists would watch indian liberals rants similarly Pakistanis aren't interested in these Pakistani liberals anti state agendas and 95% of the Pakistanis happen to be right wing nationalists
@@slowknife2873 Counter them on facts that is Pakistan has become what Pakistan is now.
Thanks for the insightful discussion and so many new discoveries that one might never know without watching this.
Telling The Truth About Quaide Azam sitting in the university of his name requires the guts Which only Dr. Ishtiaq Sir has.
Very interesting. The research and efforts of Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed to bring out this book are highly commendable. I look forward to purchasing a copy of the book. I was born 8 1/2 months in Lahore,, before partition. I was with my parents on the fisrt train to be dynamited en route from Delhi to Karachi- my father's job as deputy secretary cabinet was to organise swearing in ceremony of the Quaid in Karachi. At another level, my maternal grandfather, Mir Maqbool Mahmood was a hero in the Jallianwala Bagh massacre. His testimony in the inquiry into Punjab Disturbances 1919-1920 led to Dwyer's removal from here.
Great to see Dr Ahmed in Lahore.
🙏 From India.
. Pakistan was ethnically cleansed, from 35% hindu and sikh to 1% now. . Bangladesh is friendly with India, but still from a 30% hindu area in 1947, it has become 10% now. most of the ethnic cleansing took place when it was east pakistan. Pakistanis must confront these truths, like Dr.Sahab is doing , and you can say that only by recognizing the LOC as the border can we move forward. Otherwise we will still be confronting after another 75 years.
Krishna bhai
East Punjabi Hindus and Sikhs went to East Punjab
While Muslims went to West Punjab.
As a result Punjabi Muslims’ population in E Punjab went to 0%
Punjabi Hindus/Sikhs’ population in W Punjab went to 0%.
It was population transfer on both sides. Not that support such transfers.
@@kdshak4904 It was a population transfer started by the rawalpindi riots (as usual).
It also doesn't explain why karachi was cleared out in 10 years.
@@AKumar-co7oe
Which book /source did you read about history of Punjab?
@@kdshak4904 🙃
Lies of Ishtiaq Ahemad in this video
------------------------------------------------------------
(1) Congress opposed Liaquat Ali Khan's budget because Sardar Patel was a right wing Hindu congressman.
But the reality is here :-
czcams.com/video/c1odDWaDQqo/video.html
(2) Ishtiaq Ahemad tried to equates the whole scenario hindu muslim communal riots . Bengal vs Bihar and East Punjab vs West Punjab.
He said that it was British conspiracy and violence was done by both side equally with support of local mafia.
But the reality is ,
Sufies Barelawis , few Devbandi scholars had declared Jihad against hindu and Sikhs.
Even Not a single thought of school of Islam oppose slavery. They justify the sex slavery of women nowdays too. The Hindus and Sikhs women were sold and raped because it was Quranic doctrine that muslims can keep sex slave (concubine) who were captive during Jihad. Even Qur'an tell about that don't Marry with non muslims until they convert into islam because they are inferior than a sex slave (londi).
According to Imam Sha'fi , muslims can check hands , privet parts too before purchasing slaves. Prophet Muhemmad's wife Maria bin kibtiyya was a sex slave.
I would suggest Ishtiaq Ahemad Sab , you should read islamic history particularly fiqah and hadiths.
The doctorin of Barelwis was "there is no Riyast e madina without jihad and Idol worshipers have only two choices convert or being killed because Jajia is only option for Ahl e Qitab according to Quran"
So , there is a lot of lies told by Ishtiaq Ahemad but I would say , it doesn't matter If an Iranian says that the Zoroastrians were good people, or a white American says that the Native Indians were very good.
Always a great pleasure to listen to Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed.
As I understand from his talks that Mr.Ishtiq Ahmed would not have liked partion to take place .Because in post-independence ,non- partitioned India ,Muslims would have got the better of Hindus and thus ruled India.
So Partion has turned out to be a good thing for Hindus but a loosing proposition of Muslims.
You communal lot is the same as Jinnah
Superb session - learned a lot, found it thought provoking and at times emotional too. Dimaag aur Dil dono ko chhoo liya 🙏👍👏👌
This man is a living legend.
Wonderful discussion 👏
Brought tears to my eyes. May goodness of humanity and truth always prevail.
Dr. Istiaq Ahmed Saab is an encyclopedia of matters related to partition!!! And he is also an exemplary humanist. People of India and Pakistan will forever be indebted to him for having impartially documented the tragedy of partition.
Mindblowing conversation 👍👌♥️
While population of Hindus and Sikhs in pakistan has Drastically declined, population of muslims has Increased in India..what Else do you need to know ??
As a prereq all the kafirs left in paxtaan will soon be converted, then paxtaan will move towards becoming super power like turkiye.
Lies of Ishtiaq Ahemad in this video
------------------------------------------------------------
(1) Congress opposed Liaquat Ali Khan's budget because Sardar Patel was a right wing Hindu congressman.
But the reality is here :-
czcams.com/video/c1odDWaDQqo/video.html
(2) Ishtiaq Ahemad tried to equates the whole scenario hindu muslim communal riots . Bengal vs Bihar and East Punjab vs West Punjab.
He said that it was British conspiracy and violence was done by both side equally with support of local mafia.
But the reality is ,
Sufies Barelawis , few Devbandi scholars had declared Jihad against hindu and Sikhs.
Even Not a single thought of school of Islam oppose slavery. They justify the sex slavery of women nowdays too. The Hindus and Sikhs women were sold and raped because it was Quranic doctrine that muslims can keep sex slave (concubine) who were captive during Jihad. Even Qur'an tell about that don't Marry with non muslims until they convert into islam because they are inferior than a sex slave (londi).
According to Imam Sha'fi , muslims can check hands , privet parts too before purchasing slaves. Prophet Muhemmad's wife Maria bin kibtiyya was a sex slave.
I would suggest Ishtiaq Ahemad Sab , you should read islamic history particularly fiqah and hadiths.
The doctorin of Barelwis was "there is no Riyast e madina without jihad and Idol worshipers have only two choices convert or being killed because Jajia is only option for Ahl e Qitab according to Quran"
So , there is a lot of lies told by Ishtiaq Ahemad but I would say , it doesn't matter If an Iranian says that the Zoroastrians were good people, or a white American says that the Native Indians were very good.
Loved it….. excellent discussion…. Prof Ishtiaq Ahmed is a delight to listen to…
Such a beautiful discussion with such insights on the book! ❤
I looking forward to read this book 📙 thank for your endeavour to enlighten young people of Pakistan 🇵🇰
Excellent conversation. Looks like in retrospect Pakistan was a blessing for the Hindus.
Dr saheb is a treasure for us. I learnt a lot from him. Great personality.
Vivek.
What a wonderful discussion 👍👍👍
🇮🇳🇮🇳🇮🇳
We should know real history, whether sweet or bitter. Bold and honest Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed is doing a valuable service by his books and talks. 🙏🏽
Its curious, we were Bangladeshis, who were economic migrants into India ~ '67-'68, before that big cyclone. Fortunately we didn't have to see '71 war, its consequences and subsequent chaos of Bangladesh. But truth to be told, even India was piss poor those days (Pakistanis don't believe but India has grown leaps and bounds). But living in India(West Bengal) without citizenship, during the Naxal movement was no picnic either. Good thing is that relations with Bangladesh seem to be thawing. Normalcy can be seen on the horizon. We are developing joint infrastructures, Roads, Rail lines, Electricity lines, Water Ways, Ports, Bridges and military cooperation too.
The problem with Pakistanis is that they always see everything through the religious lens. India as a country(ignore the RW) has never had a problem with Islam. 180+ million Indian Muslims are thriving like they never could in present-day Pakistan. People may have their biases but Muslims still have an equal opportunity to serve their country in the armed forces, govt jobs, private jobs. We have good relations with Bangladesh, Maldives, The Middle East(UAE, SA, Qatar, Oman), Indonesia, Malaysia and Iran. Paki9
The fact is bengali muslims wanted pakistan and later on they shamelessly and illegally enter india.
Respect for u and your team sir !! 🙏🏼 Keep doing this work 🙏🏼
Ma’Shaa’Allah, Excellent work by Dr. Saab. Unraveling history and analysis of the partition. Truth will prevail.
Thanks for inviting sir ishtiaq Ahmed there... Waiting for other days programs... Thanks
I always get emotional whenever I listen the stories of partition. Ishtiaq sb is such a gem who enlightened us by giving us the sight to look at this topic rationally otherwise we would have been lost in the concocted narrative, we are taught in our educational institutions.
Now, where Pakistan stands proves that this all episode was mere bullshit without having vision. I mean, how can you part a nation on the basis of a religion? What is happening now in Pak. is all the result of that mischievous act. These people (our so called leadership) were not worthy of given a small piece of land whom they granted this sacred piece of land to corrupt. Even a single of them was nowhere to be a leader to lead a country.
Sorry. Partition was a blessing in disguise for us Hindus.
@@hunk3891 Agree 100%. Muslims as a group are enemies of any other group which may have a view not aligned with Islam as Islam is supremacist and explicitly encourages conversion. Thus their subconscious goal will always be to undermine non-Muslims in the hope of proving the supremacy of Islam. This subconscious motivation will start translating to tangible actions as they begin wielding influence. The partition of India is a clear manifestation of this phenomenon.
@@hunk3891 Lmao, it was a blessing for the Muslims of Pakistan and Bangladesh, you gangus are just trying to cope hard with whatever you can about the fact that we crushed your AkhLunD bhArAt's wet dreams, still to this day I see countless bundutvas dreaming about a united south Asia ruled radical north indian gangadeshi bundu's
Wow wow calm tf down muhajir, Pakistan wasn't made for Islam, it was made for Muslims because north indian brahmin elites were threat to Muslims and we can already see what Hindus are doing to Muslims in India, those Muslims have no power whatsoever, that would've been your fate if there was no pakistan, ungrateful muhajir
@@slowknife2873 don't know about Bangladesh(🤣) but yeah. It is a blessing for Paki momineen you know. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🐷
I have this book by Dr saab, tremendous book, very detailed and the book on partition Stern RECKONING by Justice G D KHOSLA is also recommended
Very appropriate and thorough. Wish we have more such discussions here than petty politics. Brilliant Dr Ishtiaq- brilliant The Black Hole
Excellent series of intellectual discussions. I have grown really fond of this channel. My respect and good wishes to the professors and conductors. Best Wishes from Kolkata.
Sambuddha Basu.
Very nice session love n respect from india 🥰
Very good discussion.
Brilliant conversation. Loved the multi-dimentional point of views and these conversations which are totally not seen in the mainstream
What a beautiful and intellectual discussion!
Thank you so much Dr Sahib❤
Question and Answer @ 1:11:39 is reveling!
Western Punjab was very progressive and advanced agricultural province by the time of 1921! so from 1921-1947! It was Jinnahs choice of west Pakistan! Which other province was developed later? One productive province has been overpopulated to the overkill. No wonder Pakistan is breaking.
Excellent program! Whenever I’ve emailed Professor Ahmed saab, he always replies - I’m sure he is a very busy man, but yet he has the grace to respond to an unknown person like me. Goa bless you sir
Hello Dear….can you please provide me Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed’s email Id?
Dr Ishtiaq is a true scholar; as painful as it is, we should listen and learn from him. else the lousy pages of history might even repeat itself.
Brilliant episode!! From an Indian living in Australia
Thanks to both the Sirs, one for narrating such interesting facts of the unfortunate, black history of partition and the other Sir for being a moderator.
Well spent Sunday listening to this Podcast.
How can I buy either the Hindi or English version of this book ?
Amazon India sei.
"Truth has bloody habit of coming out" jinnah you did a great dis-service to the subcontinent😭
Dis-service to the north India. Gangu radical bundu's because their wet dream of AkhLunD bhArAt was crushed into two pieces lol go cry about it
It’s a great service to India. Can you imagine the politic of vote bank working.
Awesome. Would love to see more such discussions here. With love! From India
What a brilliant and genuine person Dr Ishtiaq is!!
I see another gem Dr Perveiz Hoodbhoy sitting in audience!
What a magnificent and truthful discussion!
Kashif Ali Saheb. there was a speaker at The Black Hole whose name is Dr. Sajjad Azhar, if i correctly remember. You could choose to listen to his talk where he begins to unravel the 'first' disturbances between Hindus and Muslims in the Rawalpindi area. He contends that the seeds of these 'riot' like situations from 1922-47 became the nuclei that seeded many more such nuclei in the context of Punjab. In his opinion, the centrality of the Rawalpindi communal strife to the conflagration in Punjab needs closer investigation.
My question to Prof. Ahmed: have you listened to this angle of the Punjab-wide riots, available in The Black Hole archives? Thank you for being your kind self, and the same to the organizers of The Black Hole series of talks.
Creating of New Medina by Venkat Dullipala is also great book on partition of British India 🇮🇳. Please do read how Muslim communalism lead to partion of India 🇮🇳 & Massacre or religiously cleansed of Hindu's 🕉️ by Muslims specially in Muslim Majority State of British India. 🇮🇳
Lies of Ishtiaq Ahemad in this video
------------------------------------------------------------
(1) Congress opposed Liaquat Ali Khan's budget because Sardar Patel was a right wing Hindu congressman.
But the reality is here :-
czcams.com/video/c1odDWaDQqo/video.html
(2) Ishtiaq Ahemad tried to equates the whole scenario hindu muslim communal riots . Bengal vs Bihar and East Punjab vs West Punjab.
He said that it was British conspiracy and violence was done by both side equally with support of local mafia.
But the reality is ,
Sufies Barelawis , few Devbandi scholars had declared Jihad against hindu and Sikhs.
Even Not a single thought of school of Islam oppose slavery. They justify the sex slavery of women nowdays too. The Hindus and Sikhs women were sold and raped because it was Quranic doctrine that muslims can keep sex slave (concubine) who were captive during Jihad. Even Qur'an tell about that don't Marry with non muslims until they convert into islam because they are inferior than a sex slave (londi).
According to Imam Sha'fi , muslims can check hands , privet parts too before purchasing slaves. Prophet Muhemmad's wife Maria bin kibtiyya was a sex slave.
I would suggest Ishtiaq Ahemad Sab , you should read islamic history particularly fiqah and hadiths.
The doctorin of Barelwis was "there is no Riyast e madina without jihad and Idol worshipers have only two choices convert or being killed because Jajia is only option for Ahl e Qitab according to Quran"
So , there is a lot of lies told by Ishtiaq Ahemad but I would say , it doesn't matter If an Iranian says that the Zoroastrians were good people, or a white American says that the Native Indians were very good.
My grandmother walked to Amritsar from Pakistan with her family
People asked very good, relevant questions. And some comments and observations were excellent.
Wooow. Such a touching conversation.
It has moved me so much.
I really appreciate this guy what he doing to the humanity
All comments from Indians, seems there is no thirst for knowledge and truth in Pakistan .
They must be busy watching our news channel fighting debates or standing in cues for petrol .
Jokes apart, I don’t think pakistan has still out of that partition mindset, they are still fighting among themselves and keeping the 1947 alive in their own country and in their heart and mind.
Yes very true. On all sane works comming from Pakistan only indians see and appreciate it
Lies of Ishtiaq Ahemad in this video
------------------------------------------------------------
(1) Congress opposed Liaquat Ali Khan's budget because Sardar Patel was a right wing Hindu congressman.
But the reality is here :-
czcams.com/video/c1odDWaDQqo/video.html
(2) Ishtiaq Ahemad tried to equates the whole scenario hindu muslim communal riots . Bengal vs Bihar and East Punjab vs West Punjab.
He said that it was British conspiracy and violence was done by both side equally with support of local mafia.
But the reality is ,
Sufies Barelawis , few Devbandi scholars had declared Jihad against hindu and Sikhs.
Even Not a single thought of school of Islam oppose slavery. They justify the sex slavery of women nowdays too. The Hindus and Sikhs women were sold and raped because it was Quranic doctrine that muslims can keep sex slave (concubine) who were captive during Jihad. Even Qur'an tell about that don't Marry with non muslims until they convert into islam because they are inferior than a sex slave (londi).
According to Imam Sha'fi , muslims can check hands , privet parts too before purchasing slaves. Prophet Muhemmad's wife Maria bin kibtiyya was a sex slave.
I would suggest Ishtiaq Ahemad Sab , you should read islamic history particularly fiqah and hadiths.
The doctorin of Barelwis was "there is no Riyast e madina without jihad and Idol worshipers have only two choices convert or being killed because Jajia is only option for Ahl e Qitab according to Quran"
So , there is a lot of lies told by Ishtiaq Ahemad but I would say , it doesn't matter If an Iranian says that the Zoroastrians were good people, or a white American says that the Native Indians were very good.
Prof ishtiak shahab you also answere why congress wanted secular India.?
You must answer. Why does congress want secular India ? It will help Indians who support democracy and secularism
i wish there more people like Dr Saab,i read a history book of a Dutch historian (Gerard Mak)called IN EUROPE.it took him nearly 5 year away from home,and covered every second of every event from 1th world war to 2th world war,Dr Saab did the same even better,this is how a historian works.not like Ms Jalali or Romila,who were sitting on there chair and worked on preception,which is very very dangerous.
Very enlightened conversation. Thank you for your courage......
He has done real research work in this subject.i have read this book
The best question, so far, was put up by the one who asked in Punjabi that what they got of their efforts in return when everyone abusing, chiding punjabies for everything and quite identical to professor’s habit he not only gave a sarcastic answer but also asked him to shit up.
because it is a very sensitive issue in pakistan. already all provinces except for punjab and to some extent sindh are up in arms for their rights(in india propagated as demanding independence), and any further talks will raise more voices in already bankrupt pakistan.
Hazir janab. Me wajid joyia was there asking for two questions but wasn't replied
This is such a good forum, I wish we had more of these in india
Great Discussion. Thanks to the organiser.
Subscribed Black Hole! I am great admirer of Prof Ishtiaq, thanks for highlighting tragic realities.
The discussion should also include “Indian East Punjab partitioned, bloodied, cleansed”. That should put things in perspective.
Punjab was partitioned twice.
First time in British India. The second time by Indian government.
As a 86 year Goan Indian American 50 years in India & 36 years in Georgia US born in Lahore in 1937 & therefore consider myself a Punjabi.
In India I worked in practically all Indian States. I was a Bombay Goan Catholic & worked with Hindus, Muslims, Parsees, Jains & all other communities before immigrating to the US in 1986.
Partition divided all families including mine into Pakistanis & Indians that when we went to our ancestral home in Goa for the summer holidays, in 1953 , I realized what that meant.
After hearing this CZcams episode I pray to Almighty God that Pakistan & India come together again & become friends for the good of both countries & peoples. We are of one blood- and should NOT be divided.
Sydney Desouza , Alpharetta GA
Love to hear this discussion. I share this show all my favourite cousin. Beautiful it.
Hi ! I am AMIT K. SHETTY from Biahr ,INDIA
Very very Thank you to Dr. Ishtiaq Ahmed and THE BLACK HOLE organizer. Lot of Learn and knowledge to watch this program.
I know the Partition of UNITED INDIA is very painful of both sides, But we cannot change this happened.