Moza R9 & GS GT Wheel Review - As Good As They Say?
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- čas přidán 17. 09. 2022
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My review of the Moza R9 direct drive wheel base and their GS GT Wheel, do they live up to the hype?
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To clarify my amperage speculation.... Amps = Watts divided by Voltage.
So the Moza PSU 180W / 36V = 5A which makes sense and the CSL DD PSU is of course 180W / 24V = 7.5A and is why it has a bigger cable... the main take away is that the PSU is cheap and of poor quality which is not want you want to see powering your precision DD wheel base.
You don't know the subject so don't talk about it. For information, the section of the cable is also related to the length... I had this power supply and it didn't seem shocking to me. The most important thing is inside and you haven't opened this box, your opinion is very subjective and therefore it has no interest. Simgarage opened the r9 and the electronics are of good quality, nice welds, really very clean.
Without knowing it’s output characteristics it’s hard to say it’s poor quality. The outer casing feels cheap and the cable is thinner than the fanatec but then it’s carrying less amps so doesn’t need to be as thick. It’s still an 180w psu just gets there in a different way (more voltage, less amps).
For me the important thing was the R9 drives as well as the csl dd for similar money.
Having competition in the low end DD market can only be good for us. If it pushes fanatec to be better and gives us more choice in this segment we will end up with lower price and better products. Sim racing is a niche market and we can be a vocal bunch.
Keep up the good work Karl, I enjoy your reviews.
@@WaywardS0n I have yet to find a company that uses good quality electrical components and then puts them in a 5c thin flimsy casing. Corners have been cut to get this down to a price (although still too high given their dodgy history so far and a completely unknown support experience). If they are cutting cents on the PSU casing, there is a good chance corners have been cut elsewhere as well. And if your PSU multifunctions, you can cook your wheelbase very quickly. Buyer beware, and you have no idea about the long-term reliability of these units either.
@@dimsoneill you and Karl are using “IFs” and “maybes” to assume the outer appearance is indicative of internal component quality .
Go watch reviews by Sim Racing Garage and Boosted Media who actually take everything apart to actually give hands on details of what they observed, not just assumptions. Their conclusions are wildly different from Karl’s assumptions.
@@dimsoneill As long as it continues to give out 180w as it has for the last 3 months of heavy use I’ll be kept happy. If it doesn’t I’ll be first to kick off.
As a product it has been made to hit a price point in order to compete with the csl dd. It does that and is better in some departments and worse in others.
My personal experience with fanatec over the last few years hasn’t been great so I chose to walk away from them (and I had a full fanatec system, base, rim, handbrake, shifter and pedals).
I appreciate you shelling out and making the effort to get a review out to us. Its not cheap. I do however find it CRAZY how I just reached minute 30 and were back to the power supply again.
I have a CSL DD with Clubsport V2.5 wheel. My friend just got the the R9 with GS wheel so I had a look and tried it out. For the money and if it was availible when I bought My CSL DD kit, I would have rather gone the Moza offering than what I have. I cannot agree with you assesment of build qaulity as from my perspective, the Moza R9 and GS has better build quality than my CSL and Clubsport for the money. The Moza QR is absolutely fantastic and the performance is on par if not slightly better than my Fanatec. Still happy with my Fanatec though.
Maybe I got a badly built one mate, QC does seem to vary from unit to unit reading the comments here :)
@@KarlGosling man I love someone who can take someone disagreeing with you as well as you do. Respect karl keep up the amazing work man.
It felt like someone reviewing an ex girlfriend.
fr, bro just nit pickin at this point
Lol
I recalled your comment at 8:05 and it had me in tears 😂
Honestly I love your reviews, but super disappointed this time ☹️ probably about 20 minutes of just talking about how bad the PSU feels, although you acknowledged they weigh about the same, so if anything with less heavy plastic they may have put more into the actual components, but also only a couple of mins where we acknowledge the driving experience is actually good, and you then say right at the end that's what actually matters. I've looked it up since and can't see any reviews of the PSU being insufficient, failing or being hazardous, why was this such a focus ☹️ and the machining waviness, worth a mention but if it doesn't affect performance, that's all it needed in my opinion.
I thought I'd check your CSL DD review again and it's such a different vibe. Didn't even look over the fit and finish, showed us the ports and functionality, gave us all the specs and values, showed us mounting options. The other comments are commending your objectivity which I usually agree with, but I honestly felt like you'd decided you disliked it before you'd even put it on your rig and driven it, and people are going to write it off long before you actually mention it drives well. Love your videos but not what I was hoping to hear about on this one ☹️
It because I had high hopes and was disappointed the moment I picked up the PSU, that obviously put me in a negative frame of mine (I even mention my heart sank or similar in the video)... sadly the overall feeling of cheaping out on things just continued through the review and although the driving experience was great I just don't think it's good quality and the price of the wheel is a joke as is unsigned software etc... all signs of corner cutting.
@@KarlGoslingThanks for taking the time to reply. Honestly, Fanatec sell the PSU alone for £150, they had to engineer it to that level whether it required it or not, or they wouldn't be able to justify charging so much for it. I'd be interested to know if the 5nm PSU is built to the same standards, for example, as I suspect that would be under less scrutiny from the target market as it's not a £150 extra.
I appreciate what you were hoping for from the set, and I guess for the off-the-shelf market these are concerns I can fully understand wanting to be aware of. However, a lot of people in Sim racing, myself included, have a whole host of things running on arduinos, custom built wheels and so on, and these things for me are considerably less concerning than how the actual product performs. I'd like to know if the quick release feels solid, the force feedback is strong and responsive, the unit doesn't fail, it's recognised within all games, how easy is it to set up, how can I mount it, what does it weigh, how does the feedback directly compare to the Fanatec offering, can you tell the difference, was setup a pain compared to Fanatecs established interfaces, confirmation that you're not locked to their wheel eco system as the quick release is a standard car quick release, so any USB/bluetooth wheel should be an option. Those sorts of things.
Sorry, I hope this comes across as constructive, I love your reviews and as said, was just hoping for a lot more detail and answers from this one :(
Usually I don’t really comment on videos but this one might be helpful. After using the Thrustmaster T300 RS GT for half a year, I was choosing between Fanatec and Moza but due to availablity I chose Moza. I watched this review the day after mine was shipped out, so it made me a little nervous tbh. This week I’ve received the Wheel, R9 base and CRP pedals and they are the improved versions. There is no more spring in the pedal, so the dangling noise you showed in the video is no more. Also, the finish on the wheel has improved. I choose the Alcantara version and on my wheel it is precisely finished, it is not going over the upper part as showed in this video. Even the “squish-able gap” on the top that you’ve showed is all gone and solid.
The gear hasn’t been installed and I have yet to try it out, but so far I am stoked! Keep up the good work Karl.
Sounds like they are listening to feedback and making changes which is great!
You have no idea if this is simply down to production variations vs. an overall improvement in their QC.
I think it's very good that you present the R9 and its peripherals in such critical detail. The impression is often left on the channels that products are only being pushed, come hell or high water. I am interested in the R9, so thank you very much!
Thanks mate, if it was all cheaper these little details wouldn't matter... but top prices require top quality in my opinion.
Definitely you have hard feelings with Moza not sending you over their new stuff. You concentrated on the things which you never did on CSL DD review (yes I straight went to check this out) and skipped all the amazing aspects of Moza. Sorry, but it just sounded like a whining kid who got offended !
I'm not offended mate, Moza are upset with my honest reviews from the last poor quality gear they sent over! lol Makes no odds to me, a bad product is a bad product regardless of who makes it, look at my Sim Labs wheel stand review, Fanatec shifter review, or the Downforce cockpit review, plenty of bad products :)
After watching the whole video, I now understand why they didn't send you review unit. Bashing things like power supply without fully understanding them is interesting way to review things (since you come out as professional while not knowing how electricity works). Also your expectations with money vs quality are way off. Take a look what is base quality on csl dd and you will be surprised how good Moza has done theirs. And when it comes to steering wheels, please compare them to right equivalent. The steering wheel with all its features is compared to wheel like Fanatec formula v2.5 + their podium paddle module and makes it actually great value (not to mention the QR). Your take on small quality control things felt way out of touch on this price bracket.
Anyways, thanks for the honest review. I only hope that in the future you could make it more clear that these are only your opinions and not actual facts (like suggesting this power supply looks like it will catch fire in any second).
Those are kinda harsh hypothetical scenarios about the power supply whilst you also featured a DIY fanatec power supply from a guy in eBay before that was sent to you, parts were likely sourced from china as well. It literally has a sketchy heat shrink connection in the cable itself.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for diy stuff but I'm just pointing out that you never mentioned those sentiments when you made that review
I skipped the video in the middle part. Im guessing that there's some animosity between you and moza because this review feels off
In the DIY power supply video I literally said it's a big risk as to quality and reliability but it does work, I then said it again in this video literally likening this cheap PSU to that one! Lol
No issues between myself and Moza other than by their lack of communication after my previous review I'm guessing they don't like honest reviews?
@@KarlGosling Talking about the hypothetical fire scenerios you said at 18:45 and 19:20. Even though you didn't say it directly, that's very FUDish
I rewatched the DIY Fanatec psu video again and you actually said quite the opposite "i've run it for a couple of hours... and it didn't catch fire"
I disagree with some of what you’ve said here mate.
I think a good way to sum it up is when you’re comparing it to the mclaren wheel being half the price and how it’s ok for the mclaren to feel cheap - Well I recently swapped my fanatec gear to Moza, including that same mclaren wheel, and IMO the quality feels like way more than ‘double’ that of the Mclaren. WAY more.
I have some drunk buttons and questionable plastics, but I think you’re really holding this stuff up to high end simucube level stuff, because the Fanatec gear I had is just as cheap, badly built and not to mention terribly supported. Especially the QR, which is just awful and the main interface between wheel and wheelbase.
I really tuned out when you mentioned the knobs feeling cheap. They’re aluminium and feel fantastic to me! The comparison product from Fanatec has issues with going wobbly and snapping.
Anyway, love your work but this one felt like a bit of an unnecessary hyper focus on some minor details - you didn’t cover barely any of the software or driving experience and I was really looking forward to getting your feedback on that. The stuff that really matters yknow?
Thats cool mate we're all allowed our own opinions :)
For me at £450 it needs to be REALLY good and it just isn't, nothing lines up properly, cheap wonky screws, badly fitted alcantara. etc.... at £200 no problem.
The Fanatec wheel does feel cheaper than this and of course it is.
Software is as I said not the best translated Chinese but functional and I did say the driving experience, FFB, detail, ability to catch slides etc. is all great :)
I just feel the overall feeling of corner cutting and quality control is whats really important when making a purchase choice of this price... that PSU for example is really bad!
@@KarlGosling for sure mate, just wish you scratched a little more than the surface on this one!
To get the same level of functionality on a comparable fanatec wheel (formula V2.5 etc) you’ve already got to upgrade to the apm, which makes the wheel much more expensive than the moza. That still comes with an awful QR, so factor in QR2 whenever that arrives - more expensive again. Plastic knobs that wobble and snap, no RGB assignable buttons etc.
I guess what I’m trying to say is a lot of that money has been spent where it matters (quick release, rigidity and functionality) so some of the shortcomings are to be expected until you go into the $1000+ wheel range I think.
Totally agree, didn't understand the PSU issue either. Like sure, it itsn't premium but honestly, I just see a bog standrard PSU. Nothing terrible here whatsoever IMO.
Okay, I don't own a CSL DD and I have an R9 so maybe I'm biased but until Fanatec puts its shit together and stops charging some ridiculous prices for shipping along with not having anything aside from GT DD Pro in stock, I think Moza is a better deal. Shipping CSL LC bundle cost me 73 euro. 73. Euros. And I'm not in South America or Asia far away from the Fanatec HQ. I'm in Europe! Shipping GT DD Pro with a wheel rim and a CSL LC bundle would cost me over 100 euro. While the GT DD Pro 8NM (which is the only available wheel base curently outside of Podium DD2) itself costs 599 euros.
Instead I bought my Moza R9 for 459 euros + 50 euros for shipping to my door. And I think it's fantastic. Quick release is miles ahead of what Fanatec has on-offer.
@@yubos98 Ever had a cheap PSU go on you mate? Game over, not much to wrap your head around I wouldn’t think.
Yes you brought Moza so if course you all have buyer’s bias.
I think their quality and general business ethics leave a lot of room for improvement. Glad you love yours though. Hope it lasts and the after sales service is ok.
@@yubos98 the one thing you don't want the manufacturer to skimp on is the PSU. That's the bit that can kill you dead if it goes wrong, by fire of all things. No thank you.
In some ways, it's not so much a question of "will there be cost-cutting" as "where would you prefer there be cost cutting?" As a Fanatec user who has had to rebuild his QR and clean the pins multiple times (and I have the metal quick release), I would infinitely prefer cheap plastic on a power supply I only notice once over a terrible, flimsy QR that I interact with multiple times per session. I'm a die-hard Fanatec user, but I definitely appreciate where Moza has spent their money compared to Fanatec (and for generally offering a superior product to Fanatec at a similar or lower price point).
The issue with the PSU is not the housing but whats inside, I'm yet to see someone make a good quality PSU but cheap out on the housing, the two go hand in hand.
Even top end Fanatec gear fails. My DD1 barely lasted a year before it failed with low to moderate use. Even expensive gear dies a death at some point. The thing to weigh up is price over reliability. Give these kits a year and see what the reported failure rate is. As far as the psu goes, I'd say its a mass produced/off the shelf supply. Maybe rehoused with logo.
My GT DD Pro has just been returned to Fanatec for refund after owning it for 10 months, absolutely shocking ownership experience I’ve had for the most part! Started randomly turning off, then it just stopped working, they had it for repair and sent it back and the pedal connector fell out, so back it went. Next time they sent it back the wheel base was grinding at the 9 o’clock position! No offer of exchange so I stand to lose money as I paid duty to import it, plus the peripherals I bought for it are now useless and I have to sell them, most likely for a loss. Their attitude the whole time was nonchalant to say the least, they didn’t communicate with me unless I made a fuss, they claimed they hadn’t received which they did, then they told me it was being looked at claiming I’d been notified via email (I wasn’t) and later the same day it turned up at my door! Honestly have never gone off a brand so much in my entire life! I’m looking at getting the R9 as a replacement and praying it’s not as bad as the GT DD Pro!
I actually swapped my CSL DD Pro for the R9 with GS wheel and don't really regret my decision. I had the issue with the GT wheel slipping when under high load, the DIY quick fix is gaffa tape on stem to fill the tolerence issue. Fanatec response was essentially "we know of the issue, we'll sell you a discounted QR1". I didn't like that response so took my business elsewhere. The Moza Quick release is awesome.
Agree with the GS wheel being a bit more expensive than it should be. At £320 - £350 i think its a compelling option. The finish on my unit does seem to be slightly better than yours though, no glue can be seen around the alcantara and the plastic part doesn’t have a gap at the top. The Fanatec Mclaren rim is £300 without shipping once you have added the QR1 instead of the QR Lite which IMO is absolutely needed.
PSU plastic does feel cheap, no doubt about that. In regards to the cable thickness its a non issue because its running a lower amperage and higher voltage.
The FFB produced by the R9 and CSL DD is basically the same but i like the FFB equalizer in the Moza Pit House software which allows some real fine tuning of the different effects produced by the game engines.
Customer service is the only unknown with Moza for me. i have had a few dealings with Fanatec CS over the last few years and not felt like a valued customer, the last contact with them was the straw that broke the camels back.
At last, someone who has owned both and has a reasonable logical approach to ownership.
You would think Karl making a factual comment about the cheap construction of the power supply was apostasy from some of the more recent Moza converts.
And for the price of that wheel, getting the wheel grips Alacantra fitment and installation right is a basic non-negotiable. Would love to see how these wheels hold up to a couple of years of use. I have questions about this company's business ethics, QC/QA, relationship with YT reviewers, and customer service potential..
Karl was looking for flaws like with a microscope and telling us a dozen times he don't trust the PSU because of the cable thickness and thin plastic is just BS, since it's more important what's inside and from my experience, Fanatec is just looking good on the outside. I don't know Moza, but the D1 Spec QR I know very well from using it almost 6 years with the Accuforce and there is nothing better and very very few as good. The price of the rim is also not too much, since Fanatec, Ascher and Cube Control are more expensive and you will find similar flaws on all of them. The McLaren rim from Fanatec can't be compared since it's really punching in a lower class with it's shitty shifters, fragile buttons and QR. I usually like Karl's reviews, but this one felt a bit like a revenge for not sending him new stuff for free and the fact he just found this little nitpicky stuff is actually the better reason to buy it than the "reviews" praising how great it is.
@@Leynad778 I'm going to hold my judgment until we see the longer term reliability of the product, and how they scale production, sales and support as the product is generally good performance wise and sales are very strong.
But in my decades as a service engineer I have yet to see a power supply where the manufacturer used quality components in the circuit and then cheaped out on the cord and enclosure. But hey, Leynad, this could be the first. We live in hope.🙂
@@dimsoneill Since the PSU doesn't get hot, it might just be thick enough to do the job and a thicker shell is isolating more heat, so no advantage by design. I own cheap and more robust looking PSUs and never had a problem with any. But the wheelbase can get quite hot I know from other reviews and maybe the PSU as well if using more torque. By trying Karl's FFB settings in DR2 I know his biceps doesn't come from high torque FFB😁
@@Leynad778 The base can get warm, like warmer than room temp but I’ve never had it get hot. I like a heavy wheel too. I would assume this is by design though, using the metal case to transfer heat away from the motor much like a heat sink. PSU has always felt cool to the touch even after a 2 hour endurance.
"review"
- immediate affiliate links to fanatec
understand concerns about PSU and happy to see you own up to your speculation but seems overly negative based on your other stuff
The affiliate link is for Moza?!
It is negative mate, the driving experience is great but everything else feels cheap and poorly done, software and hardware wise.
Thanks for such an indepth review. I've been on a G29 for around a year and have loved it as a first wheel. I told myself if I still love sim racing in a year, I'll eventually upgrade to some proper gear, and over a year on now I had my eyes on the Moza R9, CS wheel and SR-P pedals bundle at around $1000, but I know my OCD will probably hate these little quality issues mentioned in this video. Should I just go with the Fanatec DD instead? Any other options to consider in the $1000 ballpark for wheel +pedals?
At this price pint the only other real option right now is the CSL DD mate yes.
@@KarlGosling cheers mate. I'm still leaning towards the Moza gear but will keep an eye out for any sales for either ✌️
Alpha mini is another option at $1k
The comparison with the £200 McLaren wheel was unfair.
McLaren has plastic QR, no carbon fibre, no dual clutch, no Alcantara, of course it’s going to be cheaper.
The better comparison would be with the CS v2.5 Formula with APM. Suddenly the Fanatec is more expensive…
It's not a comparison, I just said the Fanatec wheel is a example of a cheap wheel with a cheap price and so low quality is to be expected... not an expensive wheel with poor quality like this GS GT.
@@KarlGosling for the same funktionality of the GS wheel ( which is better and cheaper than the Formula + apm) you hab´ve to go to asher GSI ...and pay at least the double price
What would you buy this over the CSL DD? Well, every time I check Fanatec products are backordered or out of stock
Thanks for the great review Karl, I am a long way off getting a DD wheel (still saving for and building my current 'budget' sim rig) - next step is the GT seat addon for my WS 2.0.
Hi Karl
Been looking to buy my first dd wheel the moza r9 seems to fit my budget , moving from the Thrustmaster ts xw will I notice a big upgrade ?
Also can I use my Thrustmaster load cell pedals with a moza r9 or do u need to buy into there whole ecosystem
Cheers
If the TM are USB then yes you can use them with an R9 mate.
The R9 is great imo. Compared to the csl dd wheel base, the R9 is smaller, more powerful, cheaper, has the best quick release on the market, can be used with any USB wheel.
Yeah the base itself does seem ok (only time will tell as far as longevity goes), but the PSU, software, licensing, wheel and overall fit and finish is poor for the price and indicative of cheap Chinese corner cutting IME.... as I say though only time will tell :)
@@KarlGoslingAnd time has told lol. You're just a Fanatec shill with little to no knowledge on most things you talk about, and there's no two ways about it, simple. Reviews just like your driving, mediocre.
I have had my Moza since April with No problems at all the GS wheel has been great and if you ask me the price is not much different than the V2.5 with the paddle module added which i used to own, Moza has a better quick release, and you don't get the same problem you get with the Fanatec shaft coming lose in the csl dd base as mine did.
Im sorry about the way you feel but none of the problems you have shown where on my products and like i said i have had mine since April and still going strong, I might of been lucky or you were unlucky but im quite happy with mine and wont be going back to Fanatec any time soon
Yeah it's quite possible my one is not the best example and yours is much better, this often the case with varying QC from Chinese brands.
Also as I said in the video everyone has different experiences with all brands, Fanatec included, my shifter for example suffers the very common mis shifting problem and this was a strong point in my review of it.
But I'm glad yours is all good mate, the driving experience is great! :)
Exactly what happened with me, is strange that no one of the youtubers had stated yet but that shaft design has sealed the Fanatec design disaster. Sooner or later the shaft will move when it does the wheel disconnects the pins may break and so on. It's a plastic piece that the shaft connects! No matter what the waited QR2 comes to be there's no solution for that.
For 5 NM OK... but for 8NM NOT.
did you tested Simagic Alpha mini? what do you think about it? asi alternative of CSL DD with few more NM
I've not mate sorry.
I moved from Csl dd 8nm to R9 and Gs. I was using the Mclarem V2 and for me the Moza fells a way better. Maybe because I had problems with all my Fanatec products. My Fanatec PSU had just a high coil whine good enough to make the Dog cry. It's being 6 months with Moza and I never had a single problem. The only thing that annoyed me was the on/off button. If you ask me I would say, I would never buy Fanatec again for upgrade better go with Simagic or Simucube. The reason? Fanatec QR
Ps. I think they send you a steering wheel that was already disassembled. I looked my one and everything is perfectly on the place different from yours.
I only trust reviews these days when the people have parted with their hard earned cash. Your reviews are always well received.
Thanks mate.
So does that mean you don’t trust all his other reviews where he gets sent the gear for free?
@@supermccnasty4176 Ofcourse not.
Fair points regarding the power supply and the wheel (based on it's price). I've had the R9 for 6 weeks and my experience has been all good. My housing has none of the defects you mentioned, it is machined quite well. They must have sent you a 2nd for revenge lol. I use it with the CS wheel which is very nicely built as well. I would purchase the Moza R9 10 times over just to avoid the Fanatec CSL DD' s garbage QR. My experience with Fanatec has been all bad.
A great example there Thomas of how everyone has different experiences with different manufactures, I'm glad yours has been good with the R9 mate :)
thanks Karl, love your reviews. I've just bought a gt omega full set up and down to your honest thoughts and thanks for the 5% discount
Thanks Matthew, enjoy your new setup! :)
The wireless is for data transmission. The pins are providing the power.
By the way I like the honesty of the review finding all those little details that others have not reported. More important when it is your own money.
I do think you come across as a FANATEC fan boi, sorry for that but that is how I percieved your review. Not that I disagree with the comments you made.
That's cool mate, I'm not a fan boy of anything though it's just the CSL DD is the only other wheel base to compare with at this price point and performance that I have experience with.
@@KarlGosling I know you are not Karl, from watching a lot of other videos of yours. It was just how it seemed to come across to me. As said I fully accept and agree with the statements you made in regards to the "quality" of the products you reviewed and I thank you for your time and your money to give us a honest review.
Your lack of knowledge about electricity and Ohms Law explains why you are making false statements about the power supply. It’s not cheaply made, Moza went with a higher voltage which allows for smaller wire to be used because of lower current required to achieve the same 180W output. Smaller wire makes for easier cable management and concealment on a sim rig. As far as the feet go, they are probably just covers to conceal the screws holding it together rather than feet which would serve no purpose for most people.
I really hope Moza release a wheel series called the Rella. Then we could have the Moza Rella. Could be Italian Monza inspired Cheese wheel.
Does the base make a squeeking sound when the FFB hits .. when set to 100% ... Like it makes a high frequency noise ?
Not that I noticed mate no.
I recently purchased an r9, cs, srp pedal set.
I'm quite happy with the quality to be honest, pedals feel good, wheelbase is strong and sturdy. QR is amazing.
QC is an issue tho. My CS wheel Right Hand paddle shifter is not working from brand new. I've tested everything without voiding warranty.
I'm in the process to testing out the warranty. I purchased from a local official retailer. Let's see how it goes.
But overall I'm really happy it.
And yes, the English isn't perfect at times, the software has some inconsistency which has gotten better over time.
Tiny little issues don't faze me as I'm on a budget and understand this.
Edit: My local official Moza dealer have been great. They are replacing my wheel. They said Moza had been in contact, roughly a week turn around. That's good service in my eyes.
It's not bad service at all, but yeah QC is not the best and that overall feeling I have of cheaping out is what worries me long term.
QR is great and the driving experience is also great... it's just the overall feeling of cheaping out that worries me.
@@KarlGosling I'll keep you updated 👍
@@scorps0326any update? Looking at the R9 for my first wheelbase, cheers!
I bought the Moza R9, GS steering wheel and CRP pedals. Most of the remarks you made on build quality have been solved in the V2 versions. I specifically chose for Moza products because of the better quick release, but also availability compared to Fanatec. I paired it to a Omega Prime Lite cockpit and I'm really enjoying my time on the sim rig so far.
Please keep up the good work with these reviews, you're doing a great job.
Thats great to hear mate!
Stupid question, can you replace the PSU with something built better or is a proprietary connection?
If you can find one yes!
I’ll start off by saying this channel has helped me with many purchases, and your honest style is much appreciated in this world of influencers loving the free stuff and singing it’s praises.
That said, this does come across with an aspect of sour grapes, even if everything you’ve said is true. I think the emphasis on them not wanting to talk to you set the tone for more of an attack rather than an honest review, again though, you’re clearly not lying, but your stall was set out from the off, you weren’t ever going into this from an unbiased perspective.
That said, has that hair helmet thing worked at all?
The bottom line is it's just not very good for the price mate, cheaply made with corners cut.
lol No, unsurprisingly it has not worked at all!
@@KarlGosling I’m absolutely shocked the hair helmet hasn’t worked. It seemed like a dead cert. In my mind, you would be rocking a beehive and singing about Rehab by now. Again, totally shocked.
Karl, tell me you've got a review coming for the new Logitech Pro wheel and pedals that came out today?
does the moza gs wheel come with quick release or is that separately brought
Comes with it
Maybe you or your subscribers can answer this question. The mounting screws were expected to screw in the base by hand, however the screws that came with my R9 would not screw in by hand. I will have to use the wrench provided to screw them in, but I’m reluctant to force them as I may be cross threading them. Is this normal or is something wrong?
When I update to a Direct Drive wheelbase I'm going to forensically examine the power supply casing...don't care about the internals of it, I don't even care about what the wheel base is like all that matters is the plastic casing of the power supply.
please do simagic vs moza. no one has been doing them im looking at both of them and have no idea what to pick. R9 vs Alpha Mini
I respect you for going out of your way to buy and review this product. And your attention to detail was great.
But I feel in this review, you focused a lot odd time on the power supply and other minor details that may not be the most important to the overall experience. Yes you saying these minor details “May be and indication of poor quality”. But almost every other review on CZcams, including Sim Racing Garage who actually tore down the entire device, do not share your same concerns on quality on internals. You do seem to be the lone voice with such an opinion. But I do respect your own views.
I’ve watched your reviews for years. But I do hope your sponsorship agreements with Fanatec are in no way, affecting the objectivity of your reviews.
PSU is a major detail not a minor one mate, thats literally what will determine how the wheel base performs and have a big impact on reliability.
Those other minor details are really important when spending big money on just a wheel and also contribute to the overall feeling of cheapness.
I'm not sponsored by Fanatec, they don't pay me mate, I only get hardware in to review like I do from most manufactures :)
Great videos. I purchased a Titan earlier in the week using your code 👍🏻💪🏼
Enjoy mate!
It's a good solid rig for the price. Still loving mine.
i totally agree with everything you are saying about build quality, its far more important than people think because when its your pride and joy you notice these things. i remember spending £900 on a cube controls formula wheel and the quality was way worse than i was expecting, all of the buttons would rattle around if i took the wheel off my simucube and shaked it you would think all the buttons are getting ready to fall out of the wheel, you could hear them move around when ffb would be kicking in, the grips on the wheel were a nice kind of rubber finish but they had seams running directly down the middle of the grip just like that moza wheel there and the seam would be sharp in my hands so much so i filed the seam down. around the buttons was a plastic finish that was just clipped into place and i could press down around the buttons and the plastic would clip in and back out again and click and creak. On the surface of it you would think the wheel was amazing, beautiful anodized rotary dials, quality finish on the carbon, hand painted logo in the centre of the wheel... but yeh gosh it drove me up the wall the money i paid for that wheel.
sold that wheel and bought an ascher formula wheel and the difference in quality was massive and it was a few hundred pounds less, buttons didn't move when shaking the wheel, great finish on the grips, one of the most rigid wheels ive ever had... needless to say cube controls is kinda off my list now of wheels to buy.
i think many reviewers kind of gloss over fit and finish a little too easy, its a big deal for me.
Agreed mate, fit and finish IMO speaks volumes about the overall quality, care and attention thats been put into a product.
How do you think a GT Omega ART would hold up with an R9 and the SRP load cell pedals?
It would be fine, there will be some flex though as it is an entry level cockpit, see my video on bracing the ART if you have not already mate.
@@KarlGosling Thanks, did see your video when I first got the rig so I'll definitely be following that to strengthen it a bit.
Hi Karl. I would like to use your referral code to by an SRS Hurricane Wind Kit. When I click on it, I just get directed to their site, nothing else happens though. I also tried adding the item to the cart first and then clicking your referral link but still nothing happens - simply just directed to their site, no discount, no message indicating I'm using your referral, nothing. How do I do this? A discount code that's specific to you (to get your referral pay) would be much easier.
I have no idea why it's not working but you can use KG5 at checkout if you want mate?
@@KarlGosling I'm considering either the SRS Hurricane w/ tubing or Motion House Wind kit w/ tubing. If I go with the SRS, will you still get the referral with that code? I want to make sure you get it if I go with them.
Any chance you'll get your hands on the MotionHouse one to review and compare any time soon?
This video was sponsred by Fanatec. :) Who cares if the power supply casing is cheaper? To be honest I do not care it at all.
As always honest review. I think the QC issues at any price point need to be better. Whether I spend a dollar or $1000. I also owned and reviewed both products. And I now use the Moza gear and do enjoy it. Is it perfect, no but I think ultimately it has some pros over the fanatec system. I do think $499 USD compared to the $199 Mclaren is quite substantial but like in my review. Once you add the subpar Fanatec QR1 and aftermarket magnetic shifters, my Mclaren wheel was $430 and was still plastic where my GS is carbon fiber front, far superior NRG style QR, magnetic carbon fiber paddles just to name a few and still plastic wheel from Fanatec. I agree tho that for the money we spend we need better results. Ultimately, I think I may upgrade to simucube pro 2 and a GSI Hyper wheel. Keep being honest and doing a great job.
This is just a I am pissed off with moza video. Not very biased at all. I'd rather watch bossted media or srg for genuine unbiased review
It's a bit weird that the wheel costs pretty much the same as the base but this is how the market goes 😐
Anyway I have to say that my experience with the Fanatec CSL DD hasn't been perfect: the QR lite is somewhat a piece of "junk" so I had to replace it with the metal Quick Release but even with that I had to manually mod it in order to get rid of some little movement gaps...now I'm very happy and the CSL DD works great, but I didn't expect to have so many problems...
Love your critical eye when it comes to reviews. Too bad you didn't review the fsr formula wheel. Thinking of selling my csl DD and formula v2.5 for an R9 and the fsr wheel. Not so sure now
Am looking to replace my T300 from 2020 with a decent DD wheel and was looking at Fanatec, Moza and Asetek and your honest reviews helped me a ton to see which company actually puts good quality first. When spending over 1k for a full setup with pedals and wheel I don't want any cheap materials, I can skip some bling bling and torque, but the quality should be great at that price point. So I'm most likely going with Asetek.
This does not feel well presented. bitter almost..very repetitive in complaints. I got half way through it was enough.. so far you haven't mentioned any of the positives only negatives... needs to be better balanced...
I think you can buy some hub or something to make it work on Ps5. I’m kinda interested. This company or Fanatec next and I’m just not sure which 1 to buy
I was thinking you're too hard on them, but then looking at other reviews... did they take more care in putting together the review samples than the production ones? 🤔
Maybe mate? I'm only hard on them because things like the wheel are very expensive so need to be top notch and that PSU is just terrible!
Voltage is the electrical equivalent of pressure, Current is the equivalent of velocity. Only thing that really matters is power, and both have the same output (given the inputs to the device match the outputs of the power supply). How they make that power doesn't really matter (whether it's through high voltage, or high current)
It is possible to send more power down a given cable by increasing voltage, however if you increase current you will need a larger cable (like the fanatec).
I don't feel like this video was your best work, and it seemed like you had an axe to grind with moza. The powesupply is more than likely fine - there's no reason to doubt the moza power supply over the fanatec - and suggesting that it could catch fire is ludicrous - if it's being sold in the UK it will have to pass compliance. Like fanatec they will have their power supplies made in China. Your comparison to the McLaren wheel wasn't appropriate - it should be compared to the fanatec formula v2 with podium paddle upgrade - similar price and functionality, quality appears similar on both.
Throught the video you did not mention your fanatec affiliate link and your interest in people using it- while heavily pushing for the fanatec option.
I've watched nearly all of your videos to get an honest down to earth opinion on sim gear, and they've always been great, this one just doesn't sit with the rest.
You're opinion is always welcome mate, but just to point out the Fanatec CSL DD is the only direct alternative to compare with... What else could I have used? So it's logical to do so.
That PSU is awful quality mate, it both looks and feels it and if you've ever seen a cheap PSU and you then see this you'll know exactly what I mean.
The McLaren wheel was just an example of a cheap wheel that feels cheap with a low price to match... Although at least they managed to get the buttons on straight and the materials to line up well.
A £450 wheel should be much, much better with regards the fit and finish... But it just isn't.
You just get an overall feeling of corner cutting and cheaping out in my opinion... Risky for buyers spending their hard earned.
@@KarlGosling About electricity better than No talk, the power supply is not bad from what you see, the higher the voltage, the lower the amperage at the same consumption, and you need a thinner cable, the plastic? Lower temperature if you use a thinner cover... To see and compare qualities you would have to open the 2 sources and analyze the components, what is clear is that using a higher voltage is better for the engine and smarter to perform more for less. Greetings
A lot of that cable thickness would be shielding, that PSU is absolutely crap quality, and your example of it being UK compliant and therefore A-ok, well, for how long?
If you watched the channel regularly you would know Karl’s Fanatec affiliation.
Comparing the price of a RRP vs the price of a multi-product modded wheel is always going to be problematic. I don’t trust this company because they have been caught being dodgy since the beginning and the R16 fiasco. Also Chinese company should not be supported, because they support human’s rights abuses of their dictator. You might not care about that, I do, because I have morals.
@@dimsoneill Hahaha... where does Fanatec manufacture? think a little... If I manufacture it in China and I have to earn money, selling it for the same price, how do I do it? The answer is clear, I lower the quality and make a profit, that's why they use 24 Volt sources...
@@JoseFcoBN You don't have to open a PS to know it's garbage. Opening it will validate that opinion, but honestly, it's very easy to tell something's crap just holding it in your hands. There's no way that's a quality PS, they didn't even take the time to put a proper connector housing on the end.
ty for the review Moza R9 in game setting on ac and acc is currently the big talk,
its really hard to dial in the in game settings and feed back
Yeah the software is not that easy to get things right, I had the same issue.
Watt = amp x volts. So if both are 180W they have the same power capacities, no difference.
But higher amperage requires thicker cables and can produce more heat and
electricity consumption.
So the higher voltage allows Moza to use thinner cables and probably save more electrical energy.
I'm not an electrical expert but I do know a little. Voltage being pushed to the wheel base is more efficient than if the wheel base draws more current. Electric motors draw more current when there is less copper winding around the coils and it uses a thicker gauge cable and electric motors draw less current when thinner but more copper wire is wound around the coils.
Round circles? I’ve never seen a square one! Joking aside, I’m afraid I found the video very repetitive and would have like to have seen you setting up and using the wheel rather than mentioning many, many times how poor the power pack is. Did Fanatec put up the cash for the purchase?😉
I wish they had mate! lol But sadly my overall feeling of disappointment shows throughout this video, but that is honesty for you, it's how I felt and the product is what it is.... works well but not built well.
Fair review on the details yep. For the cost you want to see a better polished kit. Generally I have noticed MOZA is getting good reviews from other reviewers.
It does at least drive well! 😃
I believe you are correct in most of you comments and opinions but one thing you did not call cheap was the qr. The arguably biggest upgrade you get over the fanatic cls. I don't think this review is fair as you clearly pointed out the power supply as being cheap over and over comparing to fanatic ps. So why not compare the qr to qr that comes with the csl. You are misleading people with this review. Cost are and have to be cut and power supplies are cheap and easy to source if a issue becomes of it. Now if fanatic qr break and you bend your pins that is not a cheap source able item. What other reviewers say is for the money it's a good buy
You shouldn't have to source your own PSU mate, come one! lol
I did say the QR is great and the Fantec one is not as good but thats of little use if everything else is sub par or over priced like the wheel is for it's quality.
Very thorough review of the build quality but maybe you could have done a bit more on the driving, set up and software. Your reviews are always great. 😀 I was recommending your folding cockpit seat review to someone recently. And your hair restorer hat 😂. Like you, I'm cautious about Moza, or any new brand, that wants lots of money for tech. I'll wait and see how their users feel after a couple of years.
But saying that, I think you might be being being a tad too harsh compared to Fanatek. The equivalent Fanatec wheel (Clubsport Formula) is £400 and, my one, is of similar quality to your Moza. Maybe a bit better but still lots of similar issues with finish. Twice the money, in both cases, gets you twice the number of buttons (functionality) rather than twice the quality. The rotary thumb buttons on the Fanatec are terrible, being far too easy to acidentally move while driving. As to Fanatek quality generally, my Clubsport 2.5 base turned up with a dodgy fan. They eventually sent a replacement I had to change myself. Now after two years the force feedback keeps going light after about 30 minutes, then comes back. I have to turn the settings down really low to avoid the problem happening in races. It's not getting hot so I'm still trying to work out the issue. As to Fanatec support, same both times: here are some new drivers, send us a video before we'll do anything. I'm still trying to work out how to video FF feeling light 🙄. More recently I got their cheaper rally wheel and the plastic connection\ lock feels like it's going to break at some point! I had no problems with my G920 wheel but Logitech's flight sim rudders are crap quality. At the other end, I finally decided to go full on for quality and got Heusinkveld Sprint pedals. I now have to wear race shoes as the metal pedal edges are too sharp for bare feet. The footplate was a pain to assemble (tiny inaccessible bolts). I had to get it extra as the pedals alone wouldn't fit the holes on my rigs footplate. 🙄 And the pedals are squeeking after a month. I know how to fix it but... I'm beginning to think there are no quality sim products! Rant over 😂.
Why not speak then of the poor quality of fanatec's entry bases?
fanatec has literally take a shit on who can't afford a higher range of their bases
a half-plastic half-metal shity quick release which by the way is connected by type c and the only thing stopping it coming out the base(which unfortunately happens) is a piece similar to the one used to attach bicycle seats high quality from fanatec without doubt.
Price.
Sim racing garage did open the R9 up and said the boards look very similar to the csl. He also had to play with the software alot to fine tune but hopefully you have a looky mate and give us your opinion.
Also can you just swap out the psu if worried?
Appreciate the work mate 👌👍
Electronics is not my field so I wouldn't really know what I'm looking at inside mate sorry.
Yeah you definitely could!
Chances are it looks very similar inside because like all Chinese companies they ripped off the IP when they built it. Then copied it. International patent laws don’t apply in China. They are famous for stealing I.P, especially in cars.
I appreciate this review. Especially the info that the negative review of the last one led to being black balled by moza.
When other reviewers for the r21 mention being sent the r21 by moza..and they have previous moza reviews that were positive..I see all their reviews and their whole channel to be honest as suspect.
I appreciate your integrity.
Thanks mate!
Nice to see a honest review. Its i expected TBH cheap Chinese quality but nice to hear the driving was good
Pretty much sums it up mate yes.
Hi Karl...
I was looking at this Moza set up, then stumbled on your review ...
It's a deal breaker for me... Pricey for the quality you are getting...
I needed a new rim for my CSL... So decided to go for a mid range Fanatec rim instead!
Some seem to love the Moza set up, so I'm glad I saw your review!
Frank...
Yeah I just feel there are too many QC corners cut to recommend them... but only time will tell how they hold up.
Dude, the MOZA quality is good! This guy has a bad history with MOZA, that’s why he deliberately put a bad review. I sold all my high end Fanatec gear (wheel base and 4 wheels) for MOZA gear and it’s the best decision I ever made.
dont be put off by this review the samples were bad which karl reviewed i have the Moza R 9 -gsgt v1 wheel and crp pedals all are superbly made ( i am a retired engineer i know quality engineering when i see it) as reguards the power supply the new ones have illuminated green Moza logo and thick cables , the quality of the wheel is faultless rotory switches are solid aluminium with a very positive feel ,magnetic shifters superb , now six months old with heavy use showing no signs of wear fantastic! quality crp pedals well engineer with lots of adjustments all punching well above their price.
@@robertdenny1043 Thanks Rob, I'm a retired carpenter, and hobby metal worker!
I will need a new setup soon, my CSL fanatec hub is 5 years old now, and getting tired. Will look into Moza again... Oh, and no matter how good the equipment I have, I'm still slow on ACC... I just don't know how these guys go so bloody fast!... lol
So frustrating!
Frank...
@@frankjames4573 hi Frank I know what you mean about online I think you need a good car setup to be competitive, I mainly race the ai in Race Room as i find they are mostly race fair and also make mistakes which is more enjoyable the Audi rs5 DTM is superb 😀
I really like your reviews. But on this one i disagree with you because i think you have missed some really important points.
I have a csl dd and im selling it because i have bought the simagic alpha mini. The moza r9 and r12 were in consideration though.
The main problem with Fanatec is its qr. Its just bad. It flexes, the shaft itself flexes and you are restricted to use their own rims. You could use a podium hub but then it will mess up the distance from the rim to the wheelbase. You can't use Fanatec wheels again without moving the wheelbase back and forth.
Further Fanatec does not have a single high quality open rim for gt3. The BMW is way to expensive and not even available. The McLaren gt3 is cheap.
I have bought a McLaren gt3 v2. The plastic qr cracked. After that i have got 2 new qr from Fanatec which made the McLaren lose connection to the csl dd and stoped working randomly. The right shifter got stuck and on long endurance races the shifters made my fingers hurt as they are very hard to press.
I would have had to buy new shifters and the metal qr for it. Then the total cost would have been around 450€ for a still cheap rim. For that kind of money you can get a Polsimer f74l or a cube controls formula sport.
And this is what i have done. I had to bux a new qr system to put it on the podium hub, so i can use an ascher racing/omp rim for rally.
It added so much weight on the poor csl dd that i decided to just sell it and get moza or simagic. And then you come and say there's no reason to buy the moza over Fanatec....
On moza you can use any wheel you want and the qr is really cheap. You can get some for even 30€.
Been looking at moza the R5 bundle only couse fanatecs all out of stock for the ps dd bundle
Stock is an issue right now, GTO are the same, in stock for a few days then all gone, just have to keep checking their sites mate.
i got the V2 versions of wheelbase and wheel a couple days ago and absolutely amazed by the quality and feel of the units. I guess they did improve base and wheel in the respective V2 version over the ones reviewed here.
the wheel also now comes with the perforated leather grips and feels very nice. The only gripe i have with it is that these damn paddleshifters are too LOUD lmao. Might use that little rubber thingies they put in the box, they know its too loud :D
Yeah it sounds like they have come a long way since this early stuff!
Nice =)
I own Fanatec, and my cousin, who's my digital driving teamate, owns Monza. He bought the R5 and is looking for a GT3/ Formula wheel.
Glad to see Monza stepped up and understood that if they're gonna ask for premium pricing, they need to deliver premium products.
moza do still have issues and some bases, a quick look at their reddit shows that but most of it comes down to good engineering and design but with flaws in quality control and manufacture.
that and the lack of stock from resellers and even moza is why i got a logi pro 2nd hand but never used for 600 quid, i would have had to pay the same for an r9, desk clamp and wheel plus shipping and had a huge wait with worrys that might have issues where as with logitech even if i cant use the warranty i have very little concern that the base will fail... only thing i hope is for new wheels from them or some one else by the time i can afford it lol
phrases such as 'my gut still tells me' is reflective of the preconception of the product before starting the video. the review of the wheel seemed extreme, finding fault where there wasn't as well as actual faults - it just diminishes the review. it's telling that there was no mention of the quick release which is probably worth £100 over the Fanatec alone. The Moza wheels represent pretty competitive pricing tbh as there are indeed much more expensive wheels out there that are probably just as 'bad' as this wheel. I love Karls reviews but the prejudice is overbearing on this review which means it is not subjective and not of much use.
Maybe only the R5 bundle was what got Moza in recent charts and they need to do an R9 bundle just £100 more than that then yes the quality then would be worth taking a chance,great review let's see what Thrustmasters new DD drive brings us November,Logitechs G Pro DD looks big plasticky has a fan,old fashioned and expensive.
I looked at the review. I have been driving the rFactor simulator online for 15 years. I have a csl 2.5 and I'm thinking about a new DD steering wheel. Actually also about this combination from MOZA.
The review is interesting, but listening to the same information repeated several times 4-5 times is unpleasant and makes you feel a great bias against the given brand. You can clearly feel the use of cheap materials and construction from the description. That was enough for the description, but constantly coming back to it is unpleasant even for the viewer. In such a long review, I lack more knowledge from real use and how, for example, the programming of buttons, backlight colors and so on...
"more knowledge from real use and how, for example, the programming of buttons, backlight colors and so on..." none of that is important if the product itself is cheaply made with corners cut and I do not recommend it to my viewers.
@@KarlGosling that's fine. but repeating the same thing over and over again in a review is also counterproductive for the viewer, because behind it they see anger or hatred not only for the product but also for the manufacturer, which may have a different subtext.
i have the same gs wheel and hub combo, after watching your review i went and had a look
Nd my gs rim did not have those issues
i wonder if you had a bad example
secondly im not second geussing my choice
fabatec dont have any product i like and fnatec does not come withouth its faults
and i wasng willing to get the mclaren wheel it just wasnt to my liking
it seems like there is some unnessary critisism here
but i guess we can find faults with anything if we look hard ebough
just my 2c
Yeah I think QC is a big issue so some units are great and others (like mine) are not, you can see this throughout the comments with other owners sharing their experiences.
As an electronics engineer, the power supply comparison made me cringe ahahah.
Still, appreciate the detailed review. Even if it felt very biased, you showed a lot of things I never saw in other reviews (like the plastic gaps, showing glue and weirdly placed stickers).
Sorry but i did have a CSL DD and the whelbase is worse build qualit than my newly recent purchased moza r9. I sold the CSL DD because the wheelbase and especially the QR was very badly made.
I do agree with some stuff on the GS wheel, the stickers are not alligned which is annoying buit the finish is prettyu good overal.
Now the whole driving experience is better on the moza r9 than my old csl dd 8nm. i get a bit more fidelity and feedback
That's cool mate, we all have different opinions and different experiences with products and manufacturers.. I'm glad you're enjoying your R9! 😃
And I'm not knocking the csl dd. It's a good wheel and if it had the same QR as the moza and simagic, I would probably stick with it. But the QR is kind of a big part of a inter changeable setup.
I think you should have explored more on the software side because you forgot to mention how it has a lot more fidelity options to teak vs fanetec with its equaliser feature.
What ffb settings did you use? What racing sims did you try?
It seems as though you spent most of the video looking at how many gaps, creeks and edges etc that it had and not enough detail regarding the actual driving experience which imo is quite a lot more important than if the button lights all lights up on the wheel rim if I'm being honest. Maybe I am one of the rare people who puts driving experience ahead of the nits and crannies a wheel base and rim may have?
Totally agree. After they refused to send me a unit for free, I had to buy one to have it inspected with a microscope, and really shocking how everything was not perfectly straight and polish. This, with the colors not being exactly the same under UV light at a 46.9 degree angle, totally ruin the driving experience, and I am not even mentioning the impact of the nano waves at the bottom of the wheel base, impacting my lap time.
hahahahahahahahahahahaha
😂 finally a good comment !
they have a cheaper wheel now i think its like 250 or something i watch mad reviews on them but i got a thrustmaster set up becausei didnt wanna wait. they have a start up set too now 5mn i think with wheel and pedals too.
lots to think about here! I'm really struggling to choose between Fanatec (suffering shipping delays and poor customer service) and Moza (poor build quality, quality control)
Good review Karl, like the chap said below in an abrupt kinda way i thought, your voltage, current and amps is not quite right, but i understood your process and it's clear enough to get the gist of where you are going.
I use FANATEC and always have, the main issue with FANATEC is that the button caps on the Universal Hub eventually crack and break due to design, i agree £450 just for a wheel is very expensive but i did feel a longer "Use" time would be needed to fully reflect the product? Maybe do a follow up review in 6 months to see if anything changes??
For example, if i did a FANATEC review on my gear now, after 2 years, it would be slightly different to when i first got it, same for most products we buy i guess. Just give it a little longer if you are able to.
As always Mr Karlster, great vid and review.
Dean
Yeah thats not really my field but hopefully people got the main take away which is the PSU is cheap and nasty! lol
The wheel is just poorly assembled with what looks like poor tolerances and QC for the price.
Sadly I won't have it in 6 months, I'll sell them both on to enable other purchases for review.
I do however to long term reviews of things I do have, my Prime cockpit an LG OLED's for example.
Did you try contacting Moza before making a rant video?
hope you are feeling better brother from that back strain
Slowly getting better mate, a little less pain as the weeks go on, just having to be very careful what I do :)
I am a beginner in this stuff, started with a G29 and looking to get some upgrades.
Some serious issues i have with Fanatec
* Very slow and expensive shipping
* Cannot buy anything from local resellers
Both things Moza does have, i can go to my local Moza reseller and get stuff within 1 day with 2-3 years warranty no problems.
For the quality, i do think you are very negative about the overall build quality of Moza. While in the end it's about the product, does it deliver? It seems Moza does deliver and it's even cheaper than Fanatec. So for me i am going for Moza atm and not for Fanatec.
Respect to you for buying and reviewing at your own expense. Shame on Moza for not sending you a review sample, shows their attitude. Love your content and I trust your opinions. Keep up the good work!
Thanks mate, they wouldn't even respond to my communication after the R16 and CRP pedals review.
Why should they?? They can send products for review to whoever they want. They are in no obligation to send products for review to him
Good stuff Karl, the Fanatec equivalent of the Moza for me(cheapest wheel base, wheel, and pedals) is over $700 more to my door and that doesn't include the $280 boost kit. I guess that's why more people are leaning towards Moza
Price is a big factor for sure and as I said in the review the driving experience itself is great, it's just a gamble on quality and longevity.
I’ll admit that I’m pausing the video Karl, to genuinely appreciate the first few minutes of introduction and comments on the power supply. The non edited process of discovering the non functional rubber feet pads was amazing.
Just an other example of cheaping out on both quality an design.
@@KarlGosling Maybe the feet are just covers for screws ?
@@secret_one but still useless…😐
@@dimsoneill when have you ever cared about “feet on your power supply”?
That’s right, absolutely NEVER.
@@rexbanner2953 Yesterday actually. My cat jumped up on the cabinet I have my power supply on. Rubber feet saved it getting knocked off. Saved my race!😉
You are really having trouble letting this go hey!😆
Does anyone really think products sent to reviewers are just grabbed out of the warehouse at random? Nice to see a review of an actual retail example.
You'd think otherwise with some of the crap I get sent mate! lol But I wouldn't be surprised if we get specially selected equipment to show things in the best light possible on occasion.
Why do you want us to buy a wobbly shaft fanatec?
I'm no expert but my understanding is the higher the current the bigger the gauge needs to be. The Moza PSU being much less current doesn't need the gauge of the Fanatec unit. We sell 12v 5amp PSUs at work, branded one's, and the gauge looks about the same as the Moza PSU.
I'm curious how they both produce 180w? Going to have to look into this for sure!
Hi Karl, just voltage x current = power 👍. Fanatec less voltage more current, Moza more voltage less current.
I’ve been carefully watching differences between the CSL and the R9
Thanks again for an honest review. Everywhere else I’ve seen raved about this.. (probably because they all got one for free)
Makes it really hard for consumers to get a read
Feel free to send me that one tho 😜
It's a shame as it drives really well once dialled in but I get a worrying feeling about quality and corner cutting that puts me off.
I think Moza are putting out some nice looking products. My concern is that, in my experience, Chinese companies are a nightmare to deal with if things go wrong, and often they will. For that reason I’m avoiding them. A Moza setup is still a lot of money for most people - I’m simply not prepared to take the risk.
Great channel, Karl! Loving your reviews. Subbed.
Agreed mate, why risk it.
@@KarlGosling why risk it?? I'll tell you why: I bought a moza fsr wheel. The wheel had an issue with the bluetooth in that the wheel would reboot itself every so often. Moza was very quick to respond to me and offered to replace the wheel with a new one. They paid for the postage so I could return the faulty wheel, and they didn't charge me to pay for postage for new wheel. I received the new fsr wheel yesterday and it's working flawlessly. You need to stop being a sore looser, and accept that Moza has much better costumer support and overall a better company than those ones you are sponsored by.
Moza has top notch customer service. They've been proving themselves since they entered the game.
You talk about cheap chinese manufacture, but fanatec is build in china too, just engineer in germany.
Lots of things are made in China mate yes... but not designed in China with poor QC, thats whats most important here, cheaping out on QC and parts.
If your going to review it at that level I hope you open them up and compare the insides btw the fanatec and moza
I'm no electronics expert mate so I wouldn't really know what I'm looking at on the inside sorry.
its already been done in other videos, the internals have cheap soldering and the video i saw had a heat spreader that wasnt making contact with the chips underneath. moza has since fixed that issue by putting thermal pads underneath. but the soldering remains the same.
@@FatswellSmart You might be thinking of the Cammus base
@@JohnKachenjera i just checked to make sure and you're absolutely right i must have mixed them up. ive been binge watching dd teardown videos so i don't screw up and buy the wrong one. looks like i already screwed up lol
same boat as you, mate. I ended up settling for the moza base and it has treated me well thus far
Some might call it nit picking, but if your like me and have bad OCD, when you start noticing these little errors, specially the wonky lettering on the buttons, it will always bug me
You can’t even spell ‘you’re’ and you claim to be OCD 🙄
I’d say the reason I’m considering the moza is just availability. I’ve been looking to get a csl dd for a while now, but they’ve been out of stock since.
Thats always a good reason too mate yes.
Thank you
This is a terrible review. I have the unit with v2 series wheel and don't have a single problem. It's a great unit also didn't pay close to what you paid.
Then you got a good unit at a good price... the total opposite of what I have here.
This guy rocks on he knows his stuff
Thanks!
You really did it Karl, Moza truly hates you now lol. On a serious note, Moza did seem to take well to critizising in general from other reviewers and they did rectify some of the issues, but to go head to head with an established company like Fanatec with not much difference pricewise, they have to do better quality wise or slash their prices if they want to win clients. On the other hand, the same goes to Fanatec if they want to keep their clients, their customer service is not the best and their most popular products are presently unavailable.
They didn't take well to mine when they sent me the R16 and CRP pedal... they haven't spoken to me since! lol
@@KarlGosling I don't know you personally but with their shitty attitude towards you just because you were honest makes me think twice about purchasing any of their products and I happen to be in the market for an upgrade from my trusty old G29. Moza should have shown more respect and take any critism as a way to further improve their products.
Shocking review...Hopefully Monza will take this as feedback so they can fix this for the still to build products of Monza
A lower price of raise the QC standards is whats needed IMO mate.
Hi Karl. I have watched a lot of your videos and I like your reviewing style. It is clear, it is honest and I enjoy watching them. I wanted to comment on here after watching your earlier video about the R16, and your comment here that Moza is essentially ignoring you, based on having lived in China for nearly 6 years now.
China in general, and Chinese business in particular, runs on a concept known as Mianzi (Me En Ze). It roughly translates as 'Face' and it is something whose importance cannot be overstated. Causing loss of face in China is essentially unforgivable, and in business the approach is 'praise in public, criticise in private'. Your R16 review, while honest and fine in a western context, was far too direct for a Chinese company to stomach. They will almost certainly have seen it as causing a loss of face, and probably a loss of busines, and no messages sent afterwards will do any good at all. I got the impression that you did not contact Moza before making and publishing the video, which was an unfortunate error.
If my interpretation is correct, what would have worked much better for you, would have been to contact them privately and say something along the lines of 'There are some good things about this package. You have used the standard quick release mechanism which is much better than the ones on Thrustmaster and Fanatec wheels. Similarly, the shifter paddles are very good, and it looks as though there is a lot of potential in this wheelbase. However, there are some issues that I have to deal with in my review, so I wanted to bring them to your attention first.' Then you lay out the issues. This would have given Moza the opportunity to reply and say 'thank you for contacting us, we have been made aware of these issues by others, and we will be doing XYZ'.
If you do that, then you can say in your review that you have contacted Moza and they have assured you of XYZ and your review can lay out the current issues in a way that informs people, but does not embarrass Moza.
Chinese companies and people can handle constructive criticism. But, you always have to leave them a way to save face. If you do that, they will appreciate it, and your relationship will grow. Causing a blatant loss of face, will simply result in no business relationship at all. Even the most well-meaning attempt to mend fences, will fail.
Thanks for that Nick, it's very interesting and I had no idea! Something I will bare in mind for the future for sure.
@@KarlGosling I have caused myself problems not bearing that in mind sufficiently. Given that Moza are not likely to be the last Chinese company to try to enter the sim-racing market in the western world, it is helpful to have some understanding of how they work, weird and illogical though it seems to us!