I had a lot of problems with this miniseries, but the Baron was great. The actor played him like a classical Shakespearean villain, cunning and crafty. He was great
It is just sad that the miniseries (especially the first 3 episodes) had such a small budget. Much more could have done with many of their actors, especially the Baron.
Look again. The new Baron looks exactly like Sterling Hayden in Dr. Strangelove. "Women, uh... women sense my power and seek my life essence. I do not avoid women, Piter. But I do deny them my essence."
I haven't seen this miniseries yet but I plan to once I've finished reading Dune Messiah and Children of Dune so I can watch both miniseries at once. Looking at a few clips, it looks pretty bad but the guy playing the Baron is decent and probably closest to how I imagined him when reading the book out of the 3 adaptations.
@@migangelmart The difference is that Hayden's character was just being incredibly insecure about his manhood; the Baron though was thinking about the Bene Gesserit who really did sense his power and really did want his essence for their breeding programme.
My only gripe with the new Baron was that he kills by his own hand rather than leaving the dirty work to some lowly slave, as is his prerogative. I won’t spoil who he kills, but to those who’ve read the book it’ll be obvious
That version captured perfectly the depraved and sadistic side of the Baron, but yes he looked like a raving lunatic. This version captures his Machiavellian brilliance, but you're not disgusted by him. Here's hoping the next version will merge these 2 and get it right.
Ian McNiece is a Shakespearean trained actor. I recall an interview where he says he tapped a bit of Hernry VIII for the part, plus the baron sometimes speaking in rhyme was meant to make it even more like Shakespeare.
Piter De Vries: "As you instructed me, I have enlightened your nephews concerning my plan." Baron Harkonnen: "MY plan!" Piter De Vries: _The_ plan, to crush the Atreides.
@@Lord_Imperion55 how? He is pathetic in Part 2. He does nothing, talks smart and dies like a bitch. He wasn't unhinged like in Lynch version, or cunning and cruel like this one, he was just a sad bald dude who float for a bit, did nothing, and died the most pathetic way possible.
Something about the way Baron Harkonnen was written in the SyFy series was very Shakespearean. There was even a soliloquy at one point. Listen to the way the dialogue bounces around between the characters.
I still think this is the best Baron of all the adaptions, decadent yet classy. In the Lynch movie the Baron is a disgusting and psychotic creep and in the 2021 version I find he's too understated. The Baron has to be opulent.
In the Lynch film, the evil of House Harkonnen seems too stark. Here, they are portrayed as elegant and noble...which befits a NOBLE house who's very rich due to Spice mining (compared to the more modest House Atreides, as per the books)
Agree completely. The Lynch movie has this silly environmental thing going on. The Baron Harkonnen is one of the most interesting characters ever created in fiction, in Dune he's second only to Paul Atreides. The Baron was NOT sick or dying, he was simply an extreme hedonist (and was quite old). He wasn't really "evil" either, one might argue - he was simply doing what was best for his House. Its difficult to imagine someone out there might be able to do justice to the complexity of the character. What I HATE about this adaptation are the costume and uniform designs. I can forgive the crappy CGI, but there's no excuse for the terrible clothes. I'd give them all fancy uniforms as in the Lynch version with the Atreides. As for combat gear, I'd give them something like the actual modern gear, and I'd have them fight with proper guns!! To watch those Harkonnen guys out there in some kind of clown livery with stupid double barrel shotguns... it ruins the movie. And the Fremen need not always use knives alone, god! facepalm.. In case anyone remembers: the colour of House Harkonnen - is actually blue, not red. In fact it was the Duke Atreides that was known as the "Red Duke" (though his colours were green and black).
dIRECT0R This silly environmental thing is in the books, for a purist you seems very ignorant about that fact, and of course this is better explained in this miniseries, stop being stupid.
Lovi Poekimo Agree and disagree. The thing to bare in mind is that in the book the Harkonnen's put forth this image of nobility-but in reality they are just a bunch of thugs, and everyone knows it.
@Mider999 Actually the Baron says at one point in the movie "Never get more popular than the boss, unless you intend to sack him...oh how impolitic of me." So the Baron did plan to depose of the Emperor once his vanguard Leto was out of the way he was probably devising a plan to take over the empire and the Emperor though the exact vice versa in terms of getting rid of the Baron after using him to do his dirty work.
I believe both the Lynch film and this mini-series have their pros and cons. I love the film for its Goth style, and the mini-series' interesting aesthetic, especially the Fremen/Ninja vs Harkonnen/Samurai. I also prefer the mini-series' Baron who is intelligent and sinister and not a cackling stereotypical villain with weird postules
I agree, both have their ups and downs. I tend to lean towards the film because it's a visual feast, while the miniseries low-budget can be clearly seen as points. I think the time is ripe for another attempt, perhaps an HBO miniseries.
If they do decide to make it an HBO series, I hope they put in a lot of their promo material that this book was written back in the 60s, since I'm sure a lot of non-fans would compare it to GoT.
The casting was pretty solid, but I feel like the decor was all wrong. They make the Harkonnen's out to have a Japanese feel to them, when I personally think they should be more based off Romanov Russia.
toomanyaccounts my one area of disagreement: the Harkonnen soldiers should look like old school Russian Cossacks. It’s the Sardaukar that should look like Nazi stormtroopers.
I know this post is old, but honestly, some of the best mentat performances were in the RTS games with live action actors. Strategy lent itself extremely well to giving the mentats proper venue.
Hmm, I treasure the amoral sadism of Kenneth McMillan and the affably evil urbanity of Ian McNeice; a truly great portrayal of the Baron would successfully mix the two, as per the original books. IMO.
@@SirJamesthePaul He's MORE than proven he can portray an exceptional Villain, (suitably blood-thirsty & savage in King Arthur and utterly VILE in Girl w/the Dragon Tattoo as Martin Vanger.) I do believe he's more than up for portraying (arguably) the Greatest Sci-Fi villain ever...
i watched Dune today, it was awesome. My 14yr old self (when I first read the first novel and every one after) lost his mind. Just beautiful. Let the Sleeper Awake
But when Rabban sends an assassin to instil them with fear before the time is right the Baron slaps him, and has to accellerate his plans. It is not inconsistent to want an opponent overconfident before you attack him and afraid when or after you do. And that is the whole essence of the scheme. He wants them afraid at a certain time and complacent at a certain time and those two times are foreseen and relished by him from the beginning, though they are perfectly distinct in his mind and mine.
The costume design of this whole series really puts into perspective what a budget is to a costume department. These designs in theory aren’t bad but they don’t have the money to mix up the materials or do more intricate patterns on them so it all looks cheap.
I’m pretty sure Piter is reading a phone bill there, not a proclamation from the Emperor of the Known Universe. (I still love most of the set designs though)
@@Glopdemon yeah in theory everything looks good but they just don’t have the money to make it pop. And I don’t think it’s a phone bill it’s the call sheet for the set or the menu from craft services
Well said. The basic shapes both in sets & costumes were fine, but lacked the depth & detail so they ended up looking...basic. Some of these sets were over-lit, & a lot of detail could have been implied & areas left dark to imply size & reduce the need for detail. Too much “TV” lighting.
It is a shame that the only adaptations of Dune thus far have been either David Lynch's (excessively 80's) acid trip, and some low budget mini-series with production specs that make it roughly the equal of the cutscenes from Emperor: Battle For Dune. How I would love to see an adaptation that does Dune as competently as HBO did Game of Thrones.
Emperor had better cutscenes though, and a wardrobe based on the 1984 film. I would not mock Lynch's film, although the final product was mangled by the infamous Dino DeLaurentiis, the original ending was still filmed before the final cut and there were many scenes from the book that were put to film. The 1984 movie inspired the look of the series for decades (including this low budget TV miniseries) and would inspire Westwood Studios to create the RTS genre and the best book/movie adaptation games ever. It also had an awesome soundtrack and whole host of special FX that continue to hold. The sets were also VERY elaborate, a sight that is exceedingly rare today.
Well, count yourself lucky, a sjw adoption is about to hit the Market, and it will be awful. Gender switching, smashing the white patriarchy, and lesbians. Glorious!
@DarthNaver1 I should say after Leto's confidence has made him vulnerable, and the Harkonnen's have attacked. The attack generates sudden fear without preparation, hence the mistrust, and lack of coordination.
In case no one remembers at this point: the colour of House Harkonnen - is actually blue, not red. In fact it was the Duke Atreides that was known as the "Red Duke" (though his colours were green and black). The Baron wasn't red-haired either, but black-haired (he was Paul's grandfather). The guy with the red hair was the Emperor. The red thing comes from the video games, which even subverted the Harkonnen crest, and used a black ram's head instead of a blue griffin. The Baron also was NOT sick. That comes from the Lynch adaptation. He is simply an extreme hedonist, having him be sick subverts in part the whole character.
dIRECT0R I've oft imagined what a proper Dune movie treatment would look like, and among other things I imagine the Harkonnen's being based of Romanov Russia-their soldier's would wear cossak style uniforms, blue in color, Piter would bare a marked resemblance to Rasputin, and the Baron and his nephews would wear formal looking uniforms ala the Russian nobility of that age-with blue trimming, of course.
Daniel Ryan Piter is not Rasputin.. I would go with early 20th century military uniforms (they were all more-or-less the same in general) when walking around indoors in scenes like this. But out on Dune, I'd actually prefer their soldiers wear realistic-looking desert camo. Sardaukar and Harkonnen as well, though of course, with sufficient stylistic differences, and with clear markings (blue for Harkonnen, black for the Sardaukar). The Baron, however, should be dressed pretty much as he is here. Always in robes or wide coats of his own style. Though not in red, but in whatever colours.. with insignia, when in a commanding role (such as the landing on Dune).
dIRECT0R When I say Rasputin, I mean I picture Piter being tall, having a somewhat emaciated appearance, very large, emotive kind of eyes, and wearing long, flowing garments. I also picture him constantly rubbing his fingertips together to show how eager he is for his next drug spike.
Daniel Ryan Sure, but that's not Piter... remember he was rather effeminate (in contrast with the Baron's low, booming voice). I can't imagine him with a beard. Also, why wouldn't he be in an appropriate uniform? For me, Brad Dourif (from the Lynch adaptation) is the quintessential Piter. You know, Wormtongue? :) Though maybe with less of an '80s haircut :D Maybe John Malkovich too.. :)
dIRECT0R No beard, absolutely. But the crazy hair, sure. But otherwise, like I said, tall and very thin, very stand out kind of eyes, and wearing flowing kind of garments. Might add I picture the Corino's being comparable to the Centauri from Babylon 5; very opulent and dressed in lots of bright, outrageous colors-contrasting with the Sardaukar, who would obviously be based of Nazi storm troopers.
he doesn't emote at all in the movie. I like McNiece's Baron because he's like Palpatine, thoroughly enjoying every moment of scheming, savoring his own cunning
Well I don't mean to stretch, I just mean that my interpretation that the Baron is actually forming an intelligent and consistent plan is the only one that makes sense in the context of the plot. I found it clear when I watched the film, but I was informed by having read the book. I admit that it may not have been clear to you and maybe that is the movie's fault and not yours, but the Baron as a character (in the most Platonic sense at least) is perfectly consistent in his planning.
I like that they tried to follow the book almost exactly. It's a shame it feels so cheap, and the color scheme is somewhat dumb. Overly saturated. I know that was common with the times though.
Out of all three versions of Baron Harkonnen this is the best. The first was goofy as all hell, the third is just so edgy you cannot take him serious. This guy nails the role on the other hand. He is decieitfull, cunning and evil and he enjoys every momment of it.
@Eldritchfan No he is not being inconsistent, he says that "at the moment of his [Leto's] greatest confidence, the traitor strikes." Then "alone and vulnerable on the edge of the universe, Duke Leto will finally come face to face with fear." The fear the Baron is talking about comes "finally" that is after Leto's confidence has made him vulnerable. That is when they all "turn on one another like rats in a flood," which is exactly what happens.
Also, first he says he wants Leto suspicious, then he says he wants the Atreides confident and secure. The baron can't make up his mind. At least in the older film the baron was consistant throughout. And being suspicious can also make you vulnerabe, it causes stress and fractions in the ranks.
The 1984 version of Baron Harkonnen, as portrayed by Kenneth McMillan, was more gleefully sinister. He was evil, he knew he was evil and he set out to commit as much evil on a personal level as he could. The proper words to describe his evil and how he and his nephews enjoy their evil and sadism escape me for now, but it stands to reason that the Harkonnens of Lynch's film were the type of scum that the rest of the Landsraad, especially House Atreides, saw House Harkonnen as a cancer that needed to be eradicated. It also stands to reason that Baron Harkonnen saw his house as a cancer that he wanted to spread, and he would stop at nothing less than the complete consumption of the Imperium by the cancer of Harkonnen evil. The 2000 version, portrayed by Ian McNeice, is devious and cruel, but subtle and cunning. Lynch's Baron Harkonnen wants you to know he's coming for you and intends to torture and torment you and all your family and planet, because it's just what he does and he loves it. SyFy's Baron wants you to rest on your laurels and stop looking over your shoulder, and he's watching you and making sure you relax and grow secure in your knowledge that you've firmly dislodged your enemy and sent him packing, so you won't see him coming. Feyd-Rautha is just as vicious and cruel as his uncle the Baron, but he is just as intelligent and devious, so he's the more dangerous of the Baron's nephews, while Glossu Rabban can be counted on to be persistently overwhelmed and consumed with bloodlust, the stupid bully that prefers outright terror and brute force over subtlety and manipulation. The Beast Rabban is the type to just charge in and slam into you, knocking you down so he can begin stomping you into the dirt, and the stronger you are, the more he will thoroughly enjoy it. He wants you to cower behind your walls and shields, shuddering in terror and watching him rush at you ith every intent of blasting his way through your walls and shields and making his way to you, and when he reaches you he will enjoy making you hurt in every possible way he can imagine before he finally just kills you out of sheer boredom, though Rabban enjoys the kill about as much as he enjoys inflicting pain to satisfy his anger and hate. Out of the main characters of House Harkonnen, Glossu Rabban seems anhedonic. His pleasures are simple -- blood, pain, greed, gluttony, waste and killing -- and he indulges himself whenever possible. Killing Rabban would be a mercy, whereas getting rid of his brother and uncle are an urgent necessity.
I was gonna say TL;DR but everything you have to say is very well put and full of insight about the different adaptations. So MLBWR: (maybe long but worth reading)
@@caseyhafer2550 Thank you. I'm glad I was able to write it. I'm not certain how to quantify Stellan Skarsgård's version, except as a unique and sinister synthesis of the two.
@DarthNaver1 Sorry, it doesn't fit. In the context of the movie, the baron is happy that the duke is suspicious at that moment, which goes against his plan. And if the duke's household is turning on one another that implies there's time before the traitor strikes.
I think the issue though is when you try to directly adapt it and “keep it exaclty like the book” it doesn’t come out on screen very well. I think the way to make dune work on screen one must do a degree of adapting for the right medium.
How SciFi was able to get the rights to remake the movie is beyond me, especially how the Herbert estate holds on the source material only letting the Lynch version of Dune permitted for commercial use.
@@GotoMaki4Micah Since I am up to reading children of dune I really wanted to watch the T.V. series which got better reviews. It is the poor production values that throw me off. Well I bought my IMAX ticket and a few days I'm going to see the first part of DUNE! Denise is a brilliant, methodical director who takes his time. I just hope enough people still have the concentration after/well still during Covid to pay attention and take there time. I hope for them to finish the novel and move on the next next stories.
I did really like the miniseries and thought all the actors did an excellent job. My favorite was the most recent adaptation as I think it felt the truest to Frank’s vision. I hated the 84 version at first but with lots more knowledge of the universe and many more Quinn’s ideas videos, I’ve come to appreciate it a lot more.
Not exactly. Yueh strikes by letting down the fort shields. It is before this that they are confident, and afterwards during the Harkonnen attack that they are fearful and uncoordinated. He wants the fear, but he wants it only after the confident complacency. In the movie he talks about his whole plan first and says that by the end of it they will "come face to face with fear" and won't know who to trust and "will all turn on each other like rats in a flood"
Has anyone 4k-upscaled both of these Harrison Dune tv miniseries yet? The Lynch version has already been upscaled to 4k (Spicediver, etc) & the Villeneuve was already filmed/mastered at the same/near resolution. I'm sure the next Dune visual adaptation a couple decades from now will be at a much higher resolution, perhaps more than 10k or so by then. 05/02/24
Actually he still had the suspensers in this one although they were hidden under his clothing in fact in one of the prequels it is said that he had them attached to a chain belt and I remember Peter saying something to the baron that if you strap them about your waist you will have the freedom to walk again or something like that the freedom I once had the baron said and when he took feyd into his house after he took him away from his mother and father he took one of his suspensers and hooked it on to his nephew's clothing so that the little guy wouldn't get hurt too easily yes dumb as it might sound he wound up raising feyd!
This is what Baron Harkonnen really is in the book. Sophisticated, cruel and armed with a very dangerous intellect.
And very egotistical and narcissistic, apparently.
For reals. The other films try too hard to make him look gross/evil
Ian McNeice was a great castingchoice and undoubtly the best actor in this adaption.
@@kennethjenkins5578 he IS incredibly evil. He's also a sadistic sociopath.
I had a lot of problems with this miniseries, but the Baron was great. The actor played him like a classical Shakespearean villain, cunning and crafty. He was great
Ian Mcniece really played a superb Baron. He came at it like he was performing Shakespeare. And it worked.
It is just sad that the miniseries (especially the first 3 episodes) had such a small budget. Much more could have done with many of their actors, especially the Baron.
While I love Villeneuve's reimagined Baron as Space-Col. Kurtz, this here is the version that's actually closest to the book.
I like the audiobook voice best but I think Ian here captured the scheming nature of Harkonnen.
Look again. The new Baron looks exactly like Sterling Hayden in Dr. Strangelove. "Women, uh... women sense my power and seek my life essence. I do not avoid women, Piter. But I do deny them my essence."
I haven't seen this miniseries yet but I plan to once I've finished reading Dune Messiah and Children of Dune so I can watch both miniseries at once. Looking at a few clips, it looks pretty bad but the guy playing the Baron is decent and probably closest to how I imagined him when reading the book out of the 3 adaptations.
@@migangelmart The difference is that Hayden's character was just being incredibly insecure about his manhood; the Baron though was thinking about the Bene Gesserit who really did sense his power and really did want his essence for their breeding programme.
My only gripe with the new Baron was that he kills by his own hand rather than leaving the dirty work to some lowly slave, as is his prerogative. I won’t spoil who he kills, but to those who’ve read the book it’ll be obvious
The 1984 version of Baron was more clinically insane while this Baron is more professional with his wits.
Ken mcmillan was astonishing in that film
This is actually more in line with the book. He wasn't some shrieking lunatic. he was shrewd, calculating and vicious.
@@ryanarment5393 Did not know that.
That version captured perfectly the depraved and sadistic side of the Baron, but yes he looked like a raving lunatic. This version captures his Machiavellian brilliance, but you're not disgusted by him. Here's hoping the next version will merge these 2 and get it right.
84 version. Love that crazed portrayal.
True Roman Spice, For True Romans.
This is the comment I was looking for. Nice.
He was fabulous as the cryer.
Dune. The High School Play.
Baron Harkonnen is Shakespearean in this version!
As he should
I could not agree more
Indeed, he is.
The Audiobook has a great Baron as well.
Ian McNiece is a Shakespearean trained actor. I recall an interview where he says he tapped a bit of Hernry VIII for the part, plus the baron sometimes speaking in rhyme was meant to make it even more like Shakespeare.
Piter De Vries: "As you instructed me, I have enlightened your nephews concerning my plan."
Baron Harkonnen: "MY plan!"
Piter De Vries: _The_ plan, to crush the Atreides.
out of all versions of dune this baron is probably my fav hes evil smart and at the same time very cultured
Well he sounds like he's a Hitler wannabe lmao.
My favorite Baron is the new one he is fucking terrifying
@@Lord_Imperion55 not in Part 2 he isn't.
@@OverLorD768 a yea is in my opinion
Much more scary then the other 2
@@Lord_Imperion55 how? He is pathetic in Part 2. He does nothing, talks smart and dies like a bitch. He wasn't unhinged like in Lynch version, or cunning and cruel like this one, he was just a sad bald dude who float for a bit, did nothing, and died the most pathetic way possible.
Ian McNeice was also outstanding as the newscryer/ chorus in 'Rome' with his excellent stylized announcements and gestures.
0:37
Rabban: BUT ARRAKIS WAS MINE!
Feyd: shut up rabban.
So in character for both lmao. This miniseries is so underrated.
Something about the way Baron Harkonnen was written in the SyFy series was very Shakespearean. There was even a soliloquy at one point. Listen to the way the dialogue bounces around between the characters.
My god, that man! He didn't just play a role. He WAS the baron! MUAH! *Chef's kiss* :)
I still think this is the best Baron of all the adaptions, decadent yet classy. In the Lynch movie the Baron is a disgusting and psychotic creep and in the 2021 version I find he's too understated. The Baron has to be opulent.
I agree. He did need a deeper voice, like in the book, though.
Stellan Skarsgård's version has a perfect voice.@@matthewdietzen6708
In the Lynch film, the evil of House Harkonnen seems too stark. Here, they are portrayed as elegant and noble...which befits a NOBLE house who's very rich due to Spice mining (compared to the more modest House Atreides, as per the books)
Agree completely. The Lynch movie has this silly environmental thing going on. The Baron Harkonnen is one of the most interesting characters ever created in fiction, in Dune he's second only to Paul Atreides. The Baron was NOT sick or dying, he was simply an extreme hedonist (and was quite old). He wasn't really "evil" either, one might argue - he was simply doing what was best for his House. Its difficult to imagine someone out there might be able to do justice to the complexity of the character.
What I HATE about this adaptation are the costume and uniform designs. I can forgive the crappy CGI, but there's no excuse for the terrible clothes. I'd give them all fancy uniforms as in the Lynch version with the Atreides. As for combat gear, I'd give them something like the actual modern gear, and I'd have them fight with proper guns!! To watch those Harkonnen guys out there in some kind of clown livery with stupid double barrel shotguns... it ruins the movie. And the Fremen need not always use knives alone, god! facepalm..
In case anyone remembers: the colour of House Harkonnen - is actually blue, not red. In fact it was the Duke Atreides that was known as the "Red Duke" (though his colours were green and black).
dIRECT0R This silly environmental thing is in the books, for a purist you seems very ignorant about that fact, and of course this is better explained in this miniseries, stop being stupid.
Lovi Poekimo Agree and disagree. The thing to bare in mind is that in the book the Harkonnen's put forth this image of nobility-but in reality they are just a bunch of thugs, and everyone knows it.
Daniel Ryan Nobody really questioned their nobility. ..
Would you agree that, all things considered, this is the best Baron Harkonnen put on film?
dIRECT0R Totally.
Whenever I see this actor in anything else (including Chariots of fire) I keep thinking 'That's The Baron!'
Quarter Master General Runciman in the Sharpe series is solid gold. Fantastic performance.
@Jaegar19Ultima Yes. I came here after watching this compilation of the news man from Rome: czcams.com/video/xH0kO5qcPf8/video.html
Yes, Ian McNiece was Baron Harkonnen, Rome's Newsguy, he was in Chariots of Fire, and he's also Winston Churchill in Doctor Who.
@@thegoodwin Who was he in Chariots of Fire?
@Mider999 Actually the Baron says at one point in the movie "Never get more popular than the boss, unless you intend to sack him...oh how impolitic of me." So the Baron did plan to depose of the Emperor once his vanguard Leto was out of the way he was probably devising a plan to take over the empire and the Emperor though the exact vice versa in terms of getting rid of the Baron after using him to do his dirty work.
Ian McNiece stole this whole movie
I believe both the Lynch film and this mini-series have their pros and cons. I love the film for its Goth style, and the mini-series' interesting aesthetic, especially the Fremen/Ninja vs Harkonnen/Samurai. I also prefer the mini-series' Baron who is intelligent and sinister and not a cackling stereotypical villain with weird postules
I agree, both have their ups and downs. I tend to lean towards the film because it's a visual feast, while the miniseries low-budget can be clearly seen as points. I think the time is ripe for another attempt, perhaps an HBO miniseries.
Or a Netflix series.
Or maybe a game of thrones style series
If they do decide to make it an HBO series, I hope they put in a lot of their promo material that this book was written back in the 60s, since I'm sure a lot of non-fans would compare it to GoT.
Lovi Poekimo Denis Villeneuve will adapt it ;)
This guy playing the Mentat is really enjoying himself.
The casting was pretty solid, but I feel like the decor was all wrong. They make the Harkonnen's out to have a Japanese feel to them, when I personally think they should be more based off Romanov Russia.
Daniel Ryan try to be like the book
@@Dim4323 in which case according to Frank Herbert the Harkonnens should look like Nazi Germany
toomanyaccounts my one area of disagreement: the Harkonnen soldiers should look like old school Russian Cossacks. It’s the Sardaukar that should look like Nazi stormtroopers.
I kind of feel like the Romanov fitting would fit more with house Corrino
Well the whole the bad guys are Red is nothing new. In the game Dune they made Harkonen the Red Faction when it was in the book ots Sigil is blue.
"Piter. Explain the plan...." And I was desperatly expecting this scene in the new movie, ...so sad
Ian McNeice is FRICKIN' AWESOME as the Baron.
He nailed the character better than the book did.
This makes no sense.
Getting Piter's (or any Mentat's) inteligence onscreen is an almost impossible task.
I like in the new film when their eyes roll up into their head when they are calculating.
I know this post is old, but honestly, some of the best mentat performances were in the RTS games with live action actors. Strategy lent itself extremely well to giving the mentats proper venue.
The actor playing "THE BEAST" Rabban's got two of the most underdeveloped arms I've ever seen...
Hmm, I treasure the amoral sadism of Kenneth McMillan and the affably evil urbanity of Ian McNeice; a truly great portrayal of the Baron would successfully mix the two, as per the original books. IMO.
I think Stellan Skarsgaard will knock it out of the park in Dune 2020.
Faux Affably Evil
@@SirJamesthePaul He's got a lot to live up to, if you ask me. But I think he can do it.
@@SirJamesthePaul He's MORE than proven he can portray an exceptional Villain, (suitably blood-thirsty & savage in King Arthur and utterly VILE in Girl w/the Dragon Tattoo as Martin Vanger.)
I do believe he's more than up for portraying (arguably) the Greatest Sci-Fi villain ever...
@@Sidragrosm
Well, he looks and sounds fucking terrifying. I think he's gonna be the best one yet.
i watched Dune today, it was awesome. My 14yr old self (when I first read the first novel and every one after) lost his mind. Just beautiful.
Let the Sleeper Awake
McMillan nailed the depravity, McNeice nailed the withering intellect. Skarsgård took the best of both of these and nailed the bored cruelty
But when Rabban sends an assassin to instil them with fear before the time is right the Baron slaps him, and has to accellerate his plans. It is not inconsistent to want an opponent overconfident before you attack him and afraid when or after you do. And that is the whole essence of the scheme. He wants them afraid at a certain time and complacent at a certain time and those two times are foreseen and relished by him from the beginning, though they are perfectly distinct in his mind and mine.
The global satin supply must've taken a real hit during this production.
The costume design of this whole series really puts into perspective what a budget is to a costume department. These designs in theory aren’t bad but they don’t have the money to mix up the materials or do more intricate patterns on them so it all looks cheap.
So very well said 👍 it really let's down this version. In contrast I just rewatched the new one last night and the costumes are unreal.
I’m pretty sure Piter is reading a phone bill there, not a proclamation from the Emperor of the Known Universe.
(I still love most of the set designs though)
@@Glopdemon yeah in theory everything looks good but they just don’t have the money to make it pop. And I don’t think it’s a phone bill it’s the call sheet for the set or the menu from craft services
Well said. The basic shapes both in sets & costumes were fine, but lacked the depth & detail so they ended up looking...basic.
Some of these sets were over-lit, & a lot of detail could have been implied & areas left dark to imply size & reduce the need for detail. Too much “TV” lighting.
@@MrGeek2112 it hurts me because it had the cinematographer and costume designer of the last emperor which is a beautiful looking film.
Ian McNeice was perfect as the Baron!
It's going to be hard for Stellan Skarsgard to top Ian McNeice's Baron.
I feel like Stellan Skarsgard's take on Baron Harkonnen would be more grim and dark.
It's going to hard for them both to top Kenneth McMillan's Baron!!
@@Kaghemsuha Nah, Ian McNeice blew Kenneth McMillan away. Not even a contest.
I don’t think so.
He did
The evil Baron. So wicked , so intelligent so disgusting.
And so much fun.
The Baron and his nephews in the 1984 movie were a lot more creepy and evil looking than the ones in this movie.
They also looked like bunch of sewer people. Here they dress befitting a noble house.
@@ElBandito Exactly more intimidating.
"Of course it's a brilliant plan. I designed it!!" So saith our Baron.❤
I love the Lynch Dune movie but i gotta admit this sound more accurate about the book perspective of the arkonnen
When Dune looked like Spy Kids hahaha
This was the best baron harrkonnen
If only we can combine the feeling of 1984 version and the accuracy of 2000 version....
And the special effects of the 2021 version.
He's the gold standard for the roll
2021 Baron is the scariest, but boy this Baron is so enjoyable to watch
Casting was solid outside of Feyd. This Feyd looks like a total nerd.
Lawzy I think it fit. Feyd is supposed to look effete.
@Lawzy *Miniseries Feyd is tall, muscular and arrogant.*
@@bidenistechnicallyadictato738 but he is not a muscle-minded tank brain like his brother Glossu"Beast" Rabban.
This is my favorite baron
So this is what Bert and Al Large do when they're not in Portwenn.
This Mentat is channeling Bela Lugosi. I like it.
I am a huge fan of Dune.
Winter Comes for House Atreides!
Ian McNeice deserved an Emmy for his work.
I’ve read all the Frank Herbert books, and all of his sons, and Brian j Anderson’s, this is the best adaptation of the harkonnens
I like this version better.
It is a shame that the only adaptations of Dune thus far have been either David Lynch's (excessively 80's) acid trip, and some low budget mini-series with production specs that make it roughly the equal of the cutscenes from Emperor: Battle For Dune.
How I would love to see an adaptation that does Dune as competently as HBO did Game of Thrones.
Emperor had better cutscenes though, and a wardrobe based on the 1984 film. I would not mock Lynch's film, although the final product was mangled by the infamous Dino DeLaurentiis, the original ending was still filmed before the final cut and there were many scenes from the book that were put to film. The 1984 movie inspired the look of the series for decades (including this low budget TV miniseries) and would inspire Westwood Studios to create the RTS genre and the best book/movie adaptation games ever. It also had an awesome soundtrack and whole host of special FX that continue to hold. The sets were also VERY elaborate, a sight that is exceedingly rare today.
Well, count yourself lucky, a sjw adoption is about to hit the Market, and it will be awful. Gender switching, smashing the white patriarchy, and lesbians. Glorious!
@@HerrHoppenstedt They're changing one character. Cool your jets.
@@HerrHoppenstedt Damn this is the most retarded take ever
Very interesting to see this comment is 9 years old and your wish was granted with Dune 2021
Classic.
The Barron is a perfect Shakespearean villain
That was the dude who read the news in Rome
I could never get over the jank costumes
This is the best version of Dune so far, beats the '84 and newest version hands down
Very random, I know, but that twink servant 1:36 is everything
Damn the Barron is good in this
Baron Harkonnen, the only survivor of HBO Rome
When I read Dune, this is how hear the baron.
I think the problem with these scenes is that there's just not enough red
@DarthNaver1 I should say after Leto's confidence has made him vulnerable, and the Harkonnen's have attacked. The attack generates sudden fear without preparation, hence the mistrust, and lack of coordination.
In case no one remembers at this point: the colour of House Harkonnen - is actually blue, not red. In fact it was the Duke Atreides that was known as the "Red Duke" (though his colours were green and black). The Baron wasn't red-haired either, but black-haired (he was Paul's grandfather). The guy with the red hair was the Emperor.
The red thing comes from the video games, which even subverted the Harkonnen crest, and used a black ram's head instead of a blue griffin.
The Baron also was NOT sick. That comes from the Lynch adaptation. He is simply an extreme hedonist, having him be sick subverts in part the whole character.
dIRECT0R I've oft imagined what a proper Dune movie treatment would look like, and among other things I imagine the Harkonnen's being based of Romanov Russia-their soldier's would wear cossak style uniforms, blue in color, Piter would bare a marked resemblance to Rasputin, and the Baron and his nephews would wear formal looking uniforms ala the Russian nobility of that age-with blue trimming, of course.
Daniel Ryan Piter is not Rasputin.. I would go with early 20th century military uniforms (they were all more-or-less the same in general) when walking around indoors in scenes like this. But out on Dune, I'd actually prefer their soldiers wear realistic-looking desert camo. Sardaukar and Harkonnen as well, though of course, with sufficient stylistic differences, and with clear markings (blue for Harkonnen, black for the Sardaukar).
The Baron, however, should be dressed pretty much as he is here. Always in robes or wide coats of his own style. Though not in red, but in whatever colours.. with insignia, when in a commanding role (such as the landing on Dune).
dIRECT0R When I say Rasputin, I mean I picture Piter being tall, having a somewhat emaciated appearance, very large, emotive kind of eyes, and wearing long, flowing garments. I also picture him constantly rubbing his fingertips together to show how eager he is for his next drug spike.
Daniel Ryan Sure, but that's not Piter... remember he was rather effeminate (in contrast with the Baron's low, booming voice). I can't imagine him with a beard. Also, why wouldn't he be in an appropriate uniform? For me, Brad Dourif (from the Lynch adaptation) is the quintessential Piter. You know, Wormtongue? :) Though maybe with less of an '80s haircut :D
Maybe John Malkovich too.. :)
dIRECT0R No beard, absolutely. But the crazy hair, sure. But otherwise, like I said, tall and very thin, very stand out kind of eyes, and wearing flowing kind of garments. Might add I picture the Corino's being comparable to the Centauri from Babylon 5; very opulent and dressed in lots of bright, outrageous colors-contrasting with the Sardaukar, who would obviously be based of Nazi storm troopers.
I love how baron is enjoying himself in his scheming. New baron seems very bored in trailers.
Agreed
he doesn't emote at all in the movie. I like McNiece's Baron because he's like Palpatine, thoroughly enjoying every moment of scheming, savoring his own cunning
New Baron is almost too professional, he treats everything like it's a daily job to get over with.
Winter has descended...baron, you mean...winter is coming.
Love the miniseries, love McNiece’s portrayal, and I really love that Piter’s report on spice production looks suspiciously like a phone bill
this evil lair reminds me a lot of the Peacekeepers in Farscape XD
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Though I'd still pick Newman, McNeice and whoever played Stilgar.
Well I don't mean to stretch, I just mean that my interpretation that the Baron is actually forming an intelligent and consistent plan is the only one that makes sense in the context of the plot. I found it clear when I watched the film, but I was informed by having read the book. I admit that it may not have been clear to you and maybe that is the movie's fault and not yours, but the Baron as a character (in the most Platonic sense at least) is perfectly consistent in his planning.
I like the Harkonnen theme in the Dune miniseries
The spice must flow. True Roman spice for true Romans.
I like that they tried to follow the book almost exactly. It's a shame it feels so cheap, and the color scheme is somewhat dumb. Overly saturated. I know that was common with the times though.
Out of all three versions of Baron Harkonnen this is the best. The first was goofy as all hell, the third is just so edgy you cannot take him serious. This guy nails the role on the other hand. He is decieitfull, cunning and evil and he enjoys every momment of it.
exactly! he's conniving, unscrupulous, and he wants to tell you ALL about it ❤️
ian mcniece is a great actor!!
Actually like this Baron better the Stellan Scarsgard version!! Wasn’t crazy about their Rabon but wtf no Feyed
Feyed is going to be in Part 2
Rabon is the big deal in the first half of the book but Feyed is the big deal in the other half and they're doing a part 2.
3:37 - 3:40
Somehow I find the Baron's reaction to Mudir Nahya's questioning to be abso-fucking-lutely priceless.
This is honestly so much better than Lynch's version.
True Imperial Spice Melange for True Imperials
@Eldritchfan No he is not being inconsistent, he says that "at the moment of his [Leto's] greatest confidence, the traitor strikes." Then "alone and vulnerable on the edge of the universe, Duke Leto will finally come face to face with fear." The fear the Baron is talking about comes "finally" that is after Leto's confidence has made him vulnerable. That is when they all "turn on one another like rats in a flood," which is exactly what happens.
Damn... he pulled this off so incredibly well.
Also, first he says he wants Leto suspicious, then he says he wants the Atreides confident and secure. The baron can't make up his mind. At least in the older film the baron was consistant throughout.
And being suspicious can also make you vulnerabe, it causes stress and fractions in the ranks.
“One of the greatest school plays ever filmed…”
Also known as speed Dune.
Thanks Algorithm!
is the music for this part in the soundtrack?
This looks like an early 2000's video game commercial.
@Noah Arce *You mean like a cutscene from Dune 2000.* :)
Precisely @@bidenistechnicallyadictato738.
@@bidenistechnicallyadictato738 Dune 2000 pc game was gold.....not.
The 1984 version of Baron Harkonnen, as portrayed by Kenneth McMillan, was more gleefully sinister. He was evil, he knew he was evil and he set out to commit as much evil on a personal level as he could. The proper words to describe his evil and how he and his nephews enjoy their evil and sadism escape me for now, but it stands to reason that the Harkonnens of Lynch's film were the type of scum that the rest of the Landsraad, especially House Atreides, saw House Harkonnen as a cancer that needed to be eradicated. It also stands to reason that Baron Harkonnen saw his house as a cancer that he wanted to spread, and he would stop at nothing less than the complete consumption of the Imperium by the cancer of Harkonnen evil. The 2000 version, portrayed by Ian McNeice, is devious and cruel, but subtle and cunning. Lynch's Baron Harkonnen wants you to know he's coming for you and intends to torture and torment you and all your family and planet, because it's just what he does and he loves it. SyFy's Baron wants you to rest on your laurels and stop looking over your shoulder, and he's watching you and making sure you relax and grow secure in your knowledge that you've firmly dislodged your enemy and sent him packing, so you won't see him coming. Feyd-Rautha is just as vicious and cruel as his uncle the Baron, but he is just as intelligent and devious, so he's the more dangerous of the Baron's nephews, while Glossu Rabban can be counted on to be persistently overwhelmed and consumed with bloodlust, the stupid bully that prefers outright terror and brute force over subtlety and manipulation. The Beast Rabban is the type to just charge in and slam into you, knocking you down so he can begin stomping you into the dirt, and the stronger you are, the more he will thoroughly enjoy it. He wants you to cower behind your walls and shields, shuddering in terror and watching him rush at you ith every intent of blasting his way through your walls and shields and making his way to you, and when he reaches you he will enjoy making you hurt in every possible way he can imagine before he finally just kills you out of sheer boredom, though Rabban enjoys the kill about as much as he enjoys inflicting pain to satisfy his anger and hate.
Out of the main characters of House Harkonnen, Glossu Rabban seems anhedonic. His pleasures are simple -- blood, pain, greed, gluttony, waste and killing -- and he indulges himself whenever possible. Killing Rabban would be a mercy, whereas getting rid of his brother and uncle are an urgent necessity.
I was gonna say TL;DR but everything you have to say is very well put and full of insight about the different adaptations. So MLBWR: (maybe long but worth reading)
@@caseyhafer2550 Thank you. I'm glad I was able to write it. I'm not certain how to quantify Stellan Skarsgård's version, except as a unique and sinister synthesis of the two.
@Mider999 This one is more accurate to the novel.
there really needs to be a version of dune every 10 years or so
funny comment
Why does Piter look like a run away Vatican Cardinal?
@DarthNaver1 Sorry, it doesn't fit. In the context of the movie, the baron is happy that the duke is suspicious at that moment, which goes against his plan. And if the duke's household is turning on one another that implies there's time before the traitor strikes.
I think the issue though is when you try to directly adapt it and “keep it exaclty like the book” it doesn’t come out on screen very well. I think the way to make dune work on screen one must do a degree of adapting for the right medium.
Woow this video is going to blow up soon! :)
Potiphar is wise! (Joseph and the technicolor dreamcoat)
How SciFi was able to get the rights to remake the movie is beyond me, especially how the Herbert estate holds on the source material only letting the Lynch version of Dune permitted for commercial use.
Honestly for me the costumes are the best part of this miniseries. I love Feyd’s weird triangle thing.
The problem with this series which is not bad is that everything looks like a highschool play with 90's command and conquer graphics.
@@GotoMaki4Micah Since I am up to reading children of dune I really wanted to watch the T.V. series which got better reviews. It is the poor production values that throw me off. Well I bought my IMAX ticket and a few days I'm going to see the first part of DUNE! Denise is a brilliant, methodical director who takes his time.
I just hope enough people still have the concentration after/well still during Covid to pay attention and take there time. I hope for them to finish the novel and move on the next next stories.
I did really like the miniseries and thought all the actors did an excellent job. My favorite was the most recent adaptation as I think it felt the truest to Frank’s vision. I hated the 84 version at first but with lots more knowledge of the universe and many more Quinn’s ideas videos, I’ve come to appreciate it a lot more.
0:45 what I like here, it's the visible rivalry of Rabban and Feyd, though I don't know if it's accurate as I didn't read the book.
Not exactly. Yueh strikes by letting down the fort shields. It is before this that they are confident, and afterwards during the Harkonnen attack that they are fearful and uncoordinated. He wants the fear, but he wants it only after the confident complacency. In the movie he talks about his whole plan first and says that by the end of it they will "come face to face with fear" and won't know who to trust and "will all turn on each other like rats in a flood"
Not fort shields, house shields.
Has anyone 4k-upscaled both of these Harrison Dune tv miniseries yet? The Lynch version has already been upscaled to 4k (Spicediver, etc) & the Villeneuve was already filmed/mastered at the same/near resolution. I'm sure the next Dune visual adaptation a couple decades from now will be at a much higher resolution, perhaps more than 10k or so by then.
05/02/24
oh hey, it's the newsman from Rome and Winston Churchill from Doctor Who
This is the American Baron, rolling around in a mobility scooter
The shart will flow
Actually he still had the suspensers in this one although they were hidden under his clothing in fact in one of the prequels it is said that he had them attached to a chain belt and I remember Peter saying something to the baron that if you strap them about your waist you will have the freedom to walk again or something like that the freedom I once had the baron said and when he took feyd into his house after he took him away from his mother and father he took one of his suspensers and hooked it on to his nephew's clothing so that the little guy wouldn't get hurt too easily yes dumb as it might sound he wound up raising feyd!