First Build. Budget 9mm Pistol Caliber Carbine (PCC) to use in competition.
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- čas přidán 28. 01. 2022
- ** Upgraded to Timney PCC Trigger. New Video ** • Timney PCC Trigger Upg...
Budget 9mm PCC Build (Glock Mags) to use in USPSA competition. This is my first ever build of an AR platform. I have been researching build videos for about 12 months. It has taken me about 6 months to gather all the parts. And it worked.
Edit. Relating to "Budget". The 3 primary components (lower, BCG, barrel) are not the lowest cost brands available. But are low compared to other competition related brands for these components. You can build a lower cost build by choosing lower cost for these 3 parts.
Lower / BCG: Spike's Tactical (for use with Glock magazines)
Barrel / Buffer: Odin Works
Upper: KM Tactical
Lower Parts: Palmetto State Armory Kit
Handguard: Presma Inc.
Buffer Spring: .308 carbine spring
Buffer Adjustment: US Mint ($3.00 in quarters)
#USPSA #PCC #9MM #AR9 #PistolCaliberCarbine #SpikesTactical #KMtactical #OdinWorks #PalmettoStateArmory
Good Video TIM!
Sweet build man 👍
Thank you for the tip on KM Tactical uppers, their prices are good for a budget build.
Great video. Good research. I'm not experienced with LRBHO. I built mine ultra-cheap. But I made it a point to use at least an 8-oz PCC length buffer. (Always buy pcc length for pcc.. ). I lucked out overall. I had a Rainier Arms barrel for my second build that was ramped perfectly and zero failure to feeds. My first one with the cheaper Barrel had a high number of failure to feeds until I added a Taccom feed ramp. I was amazed when I did that now the thing will handle anything I feed it. Even the Winchester steel cased ammo, Tula Ammo, or hollow points. I'm just mentioning this for anybody that looks at your video and is having that problem. I've heard great things about Odin products in general. Taccom also make some outrageous PCC barrels but I haven't bought one. ALSO, from what I've seen you always want anti-rotation anti-walk pin keepers. The blowback system is harder on the lower than a regular 15. They're easy to find for a reasonable price. I used a Foxtrot Mike BCG on one and a UCC on the other.
Besides Palmetto State Armory I've had great luck with Davidson defense and Durkin Tactical. They do a lot of 9 mm and PCC. They have low prices. I've had great luck but you always get what you pay for(?). Then again I've met people that paid outrageous prices that had problems. I've saved enough money to lose on a cheap part. I think Durkin had a complete AR kit for $280 and threw in an 80% lower
Thanks for the comment. I hope this helps anyone else. With all the different parts available and frequency of problems, it is a little scary making your first build. Thanks.
I have one of these barrels and it's definitely nice enough out to a hundred yards. It's noticeably louder than my rifled 16" barrel when shooting.
Very nice.
Nice build
Nicely done. Can I ask what was the rough total cost?
Coolest Californian on CZcams thanks for all the info and advice really helped me build my first PCC, also helped me get over the fear of being a full sized human at a match
Great to hear it. Hope you have some fun using your PCCC at matches.
I used a 5.4 ounce V7 buffer with a spacer for my PCC. Also used a flatwire spring and it runs great. Nice build tho 👍
Found your video on KMTactical review for the upper. Solid 🤘
Awesome! Thank you!
Awesome!
Thanks
Good video
Glad you enjoyed
Hello, great video. I recommend subscribing to this guy. So much information.
Much appreciated
"Let's build a *budget* 9mm PCC. We'll start with a Spike's Tactical lower, add a Spike's Tactical BCG, an Odin Works barrel..."
Budget, right?🤔
Good Point.... FYI... All three of these components were bought on sale. ($50 discount on each). At MSRP, these would have added at least another $150 to the build. Thanks for viewing and commenting.
@@timsteffen3121 No worries; it's just that I think most people who see "budget" in the title think something a little further down the price scale when it comes to some of the most expensive parts of any rifle build. And something they can duplicate. And since you can't simply manifest a sale, anyone watching your video isn't going to be a able to replicate the rifle at the same price point, which typically is the main concept behind these kinds of videos (i.e., "you don't have to spend a lot, etc.").
@@blueeyeddevil1 Again thanks for the comment. Based on your feedback, I added the following to the description. "Edit. Relating to "Budget". The 3 primary components (lower, BCG, barrel) are not the lowest cost brands available. But are low compared to other competition related brands for these components. You can build a lower cost build by choosing lower cost for these 3 parts."
@@timsteffen3121 Well, that's certainly going the extra mile 👍
Thanks bro, i 2 things from this video.
I appreciate the design and walkthrough. ... and I know it's budget build... but... doesn't the quarters negate all the weight savings you had from the barrel? could get one of those rubber/plastic spacers for like $5-$10....
I have a question. Do u have links to all these parts? Bcuz I want to do this build myself
Good video. Not sure why even have this if living in comifornia
Save your money and move east.Thanks for the video.When you moving?
Very cool! I couldnt help but notice that your ar-9 kicks significantly less than most ar-9s. Is that because of the ar-10 style carbine buffer spring you used?
The only other PCC that I have shot was a Ruger PC Carbine (9mm) that felt similar. I don't think the AR-10 carbine buffer affects felt recoil much. My research of other videos stated the AR-10 carbine buffer was more reliable. The bolt carrier group is a Spikes Tactical 9mm BCG. Like most blowback 9mm, it is weighted and very heavy. When the bolt moves forward, it does so forcefully. If it looks like the recoil is less, then there might be a few causes. First, when I am holding the PCC, my left (weak) hand is usually very forward on the handgrip and holds the PCC firmly. The second involves the Odinworks Superlite barrel. The Odinworks barrel has a built in compensator, but I think it is ineffective and useless. The actual steel barrel is about 5" long, but is enclosed with an aluminum shroud to give the legal 16" length. This allows me to use my minor 147g pistol loads (about 130 PF) without risk of becoming squibs. See link to video by JP Rifles (about 2:00 min) below to see risk of using 147g loads using fast powder. Hope this helps. czcams.com/video/bEkSPidQpdA/video.html
I’m just starting to make my first AR9 build and this video helped a lot thanks 🙏🏻
Bro, that was a great video. I'm in the process of troubleshooting and AR 941 of my co-workers that is just fit up with it. He's willing to sell it to me just to get rid of it. But my wife will probably not be very happy if I buy it and I still would have to replace the Pole Carrier group and buffer Spring and buffer weight So far from what me and my CZcams channel "icarryone" neighbor Dale Hughey have concluded so far. Thanks for the tip on the magazine catch. I had changed some other videos about that. But I think yours was a little bit more clear as to the reason for it. However I think they sell some buffer tube spacers to avoid the extra weight of the quarters. And by the way, you really should consider moving out of Communist California. We'd be glad to have you over here in AZ.
what mags did you run in the video and whats the mag count ?
Do you recommend that barrel
Nice presentation, nice result... and it is obvious you know what you are talking about. It would very much contribute to the overall quality of the video, though, if you could work on not saying UH and UM so much.... that is pretty distracting. Thumbs up and subscribed !
I'm fixing to start my ar9 build for sdi pretty soon can't wait
Awesome.... Take video of your components and Finished PCC... I guess YT rules don't allow showing assembly process.
I would look into the Juggernaut Tactical "featureless" grip, as it will give you more to hold onto and it is legal because it is more of a "Monte Carlo" style grip angle.
Must be a fellow Californian...have to know about the "featureless" options. I think the Juggernaut Tactical grip is the best one out there. But for $79.00 was a little much at the time of the build. This was a $2.00 standard pistol grip plus some JB weld to accomplish a similar "featureless" profile. Another one is Sparrow Dynamics. Not as good as the Juggernaut Tactical though. For all the Non-California viewers. The following video explains "featureless" grip well. czcams.com/video/TQQ6omYO4TI/video.html
@timsteffen3121 it is definitely pricey, but, I have tried out a few of the other grips and they all just felt wrong to me. The only real reason for a new firearm owner to go featureless is if they have 10+ magazines from freedom week, if not (and they want a 5.56 build), I recommend the CompMag and a CMMG 22 conversion bolt, that way, when they swap out the bolt and mag, it is still legal, and if anything changes, they only need mags for the 5.56. 9mm is the hard one to do, especially for people that want a pistol set up, since there really aren't any maglocks for 9mm pistol mags, and your only option is a standard lower with a standard maglock and CMMG mags with the 9mm conversion internals, which would also work for a rifle, if you don't have any 10+ glock mags.
EDIT: Not just a fellow Californian, I also work at an FFL-07 in Southern California and am the one they call for anything regarding legality of various set ups, as well as information about firearms they are not informed about. If you are ever around the IWV area, come check out Brass Depot in Ridgecrest California, we even have a website where you can browse or order.
How do you stabilize the handguard in the front without a gas block?
Free Float Handguards generally only attach at the Barrel Nut. Pistol Caliber Carbines (PCC) in 9mm generally use direct blowback operation of the Bolt Carrier Group (BCG). The high mass of the BCG is what delays movement of BCG in a PCC. Gas operation is used with other rifle caliber ARs that have a locking feature on the bolt.
That is crazy to use a barrel with only 5 inches on an AR 15 for 9 mm.
I just finished my AR 15 - 9 mm using a KAK industry 16-inch barrel that will give more velocity and energy over short pistol barrel.
I used the Oden bolt rated for full auto fire.
Upper receiver is AR Stoner and the mag well adapter is AR stoner.
The standard AR 15 223 buffer works just fine .
The Pro Mags had to be filed to work but once fixed they work fine
It really depends on the purpose of the PCC, this one was built to be used in USPSA/Steel Challenge where transitions are important. The lighter muzzle helps going from target to target.
Hi what is the total weight on your buffer and bcg? I have a geissele super 42 spring and h2 buffer 4.6-7 oz. My Kaw Valley bcg is 15.5 0z
Do you think this weight is efficient on a 16" barrel pcc..
This was my first PCC Build and it is very hard to say what is ideal set-up for weight. Too many variables. That is the reason that I chose to get the ODIN WORKS Adjustable 9mm buffer (9mm comes with 1 aluminum, 1 stainless steel and 3 tungsten weights (5.4oz - 7.4oz). I started out with the maximum weight (7.4 oz) with the Spikes Tactical BCG (15.0 oz per website). I also used a .308 Carbine Spring. The barrel is 5" (with a 16" aluminum sleeve). All I can say is that this worked for me. It has worked with Factory 115g Ball or my 147g competition reloads. With the ODIN WORKS adjustable buffer, I had the easy option to change weight, if needed.
@@timsteffen3121 thanks
@@timsteffen3121 I will just have to add quarters and check for bolt bounce. I also bought an 8oz buffer to test too but I think it might be overkill on a 16". Not sure if the ar9 buffer system works the same as the ar15 concept. From what understand from the research that I found, most talked about bolt bounce causing the bcg to go out of battery and result in early primer ignition.
@@ClearWater7.62 From my understanding, the quarters adjust the BCG travel backwards. With the goal of only going about 1/8" behind the bolt catch. This is most important when you have a LRBHO (Last Round Bolt Hold Open) feature and the bolt catch moves upwards. If the bolt travels too far backwards, the heavy bolt will gain a lot of momentum before being stopped by the bolt catch. This impact can break the bolt catch. By stopping the travel a little past the bolt catch, a lot less force will be transferred to the bolt catch when stopped. On the subject of bolt bounce, I saw a video where someone took a video (with an iphone) of the bolt (no rounds) being released from the bolt catch. The video caught the bolt bouncing back from chamber after impact. I think the adjustment was either a lighter spring or reduced weight of buffer. Don't remember.
@@ClearWater7.62 Check out this thread on a forum. It has a couple of videos showing bounce and no bounce and how corrected. www.mdshooters.com/threads/question-can-bolt-bounce-cause-an-ar-to-fire-out-of-battery.263778/page-2
4:38 -:40 you can hear him pronounce palmetto “pal-mur” state armor
What size wrench for the Presma barrel nut ?
I used a TEKTON 1/2 Inch Drive x 30 mm Crowfoot Wrench from Amazon for about $25. With a 3/8 to 1/2" adapter, I was able to use my torque wrench.
Hey Tim great video....I'm fallowing your build and I was wondering if you could give me the part # details on the Presma Handguard SKU# ?
Go to JustRails.com
justrails.com/products/new-presma-super-light-weight-13-free-float-m-lok-handguard-with-partial-top-rail-ar-15-223556
If you are military, they offer a veteran discount too. But beware, if you don't have a crowfoot wrench, most other wrenches are too thick for the barrel nut.
Move out of California to solve that grip “problem.”
do you have the link where you bought the lower receiver
Spike's Tactical is the manufacturer.. It is available at a lot places. I happened to get mine from the local Sportsman's Warehouse. There are a lot of good 9mm lower receivers available. Hope this helps.
@@timsteffen3121 thanks
to slow them times are high.
Where in socal do you shoot matches
There are matches all over. I like Prado near Corona. If you are looking for matches, check out practiscore. Most list matches there.
Practiscore website. www.practiscore.com/
Move to Texas or Florida or Tennessee
You said you got a Spikes Tactical and point to to the Bolt? Then you mention you got an upper with a different name? Kinda lose credibility with me. (6:29).
Why does having different company parts lose credibility with you? He said he got a Spikes lower and BCG and a KM upper.
@@jeffmcgovern5674 it’s not the parts , it’s that you called the bolt an upper.
FYI... you are correct... I said Spike's Tactical "Upper" while holding the Bolt Carrier Group (BCG). The Lower and BCG are Spike's Tactical. The Upper is KM Tactical. Bottom line. This combination worked well for me.
Make them run and shoot and he’ll be last😂😅😅
Check out this PCC build video also.... Well done.. czcams.com/video/SGGCemRL7j4/video.html
Honestly a fin would of been a good idea. But I respect the build!
The challenge in California today is complying with "Featureless" builds which includes NO PISTOL GRIPs. This abomination was based on CZcams video from Reno May discussing the Juggernaut Tactical Featureless Grip (~$80). Following details in his video, this cost me less than $5. Hopefully with Bruen, these laws will be overturned soon. Fin Grips do not provide enough purchase and "grip" especially when used in competition.
czcams.com/video/TQQ6omYO4TI/video.html
We use a large crescent wrench and torque by feel. Then again we're doing mechanical stuff all the time. It's no different than wheel lugs. Some people have a torque wrench out every time they change a wheel or a tire and other people do it by feel their entire life. inexperienced should always torque properly. But somebody with a lot of mechanical experience can get by with a crescent
Thanks for the comment. I almost used a crescent wrench, but mine was too wide to fit in the groove. If I had a grinder, I could have reduced the thickness by 1/16". But I am glad that I got the Crow's Foot wrench cause it worked with my torque wrench.
I'm so sorry you live in California :(
Pretty good shooting for having that wonky goofy grip. I don't know if I could fire competently with that thing o.O. Nicely done.
bro, wtf with y handle
Short Answer "California".
Medium Answer "California Featureless".
Longer Answer. See Video czcams.com/video/TQQ6omYO4TI/video.html
What the hell is PCC? Political correct carbine?
Pistol Caliber Carbine
Do you recommend that barrel
Short Answer is YES...
But really depends on your specific use... USPSA PCC or Steel Challenge...it's good.
Lower muzzle weight makes for quicker target to target transitions in competition.
Would have preferred no fake Muzzle Brake/compensator ..I don't think it really does anything except for looks.
5" barrel allows use of same 9mm loading as my pistol loads...
Tight chamber requires OAL of less than 1.120" vs my pistol loads less than 1.135.
Zero malfunctions. Accuracy is good for my purposes. (USPSA/Steel Challenge).