Rust Bluing a Post 64 Model 94 Winchester - Can it be done? - Gun Restoration - Laurel Mtn Forge
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- čas přidán 1. 08. 2024
- A While back I acquired this Winchester Model 94 Post 64 that was ugly as all sin. A great little shooter, but lacking in just about every other department. So, I took it upon myself to really dig in deep to try to find a solution for all of us regarding what we can do to refinish these beyond Durakote, Cerakote, or painting them. Hope this provides some value to the communtiy, and hopefully you find it valuable in your edeavors.
Cheers!
Link to the full In depth Rust Bluing Video
• Gun Restoration - Truo...
Music by @Keph-artLOFI Which is always amazing, CHECK HIM OUT!
Timestamps
0:00 Intro
0:30 Bluing Removal
1:54 Overlook & Game Plan
3:44 Sanding
4:20 Bluing Preface
6:20 Applying Laurel Mountain Forge
8:30 Chapter 2 - Bluing
10:18 Converting Oxide
13:15 Carding
14:27 Kerosene Bath
15:33 The Final Cut
#leverguns #leveraction #winchester #Model94 #Post64 #Restoration #savage #hunting #22hornet #bluing #refinishing #western #winchester #rifle #pistol #firearms #gun #conservation #engineering #reloading #revival #history #historyfacts #firearmshistory #gunhistory #leeenfield #carcano #finnish #italian #mle #smle #303 #ww2 #colt #vlog #vlogger #vlogmusic #gunsmith #gunsmithing #mechanic #garage #cleaning #timelapse - Zábava
i think the pre 64 winchester 94 is the most beautiful rifle ever made. And yours came out stunning.
Thank you!
Awesome job! Looks outstanding!!
I genuinely appreciate this video. You put a lot of effort into filming it. Super straightforward and simple. Thanks
Probably the best video so far, gun turned out beautiful
Thanks bruv, I'm really really happy with how this turned out! Now I can officially quit youtube happy hahaha
This by far the most underrated gun Chanel I’ve come across. Gonna be showing all my gun buddies
Very nice work. I have been bluing knives and guns for years and got to tell you I learned a lot from you in this video. So much I can improve on. Keep up your good work and hope to see more videos.
Patients is a vertue and your gun is a result. Your education was well worth the time. Thank you.
Great job man! Patience and perseverance paid off, and that's a beautiful rifle. Thanks for sharing.
What a great finish on a great gun. I love your enthusiasm and so glad to have discovered this channel!
Thanks!! I'm glad you made it here! Lots more to come very soon!
Just reviewed your video and man it was great! I have a few lever action 30-30 of my own and I had a restoration job done on one and it turned out all full 😢. The bluing was purple and and the rest of my rifle was …..well, lets just say everyone who says they are a gunsmith is not a gunsmith and everyone who says they restore old rifles may be lying.
Ive always used sponge brushes for the best results using cold blueing, nice even coat, no streaking.
Great job. That came out looking really, really nice. Thanks for sharing your process.
Thanks so much! It is my pleasure!
As someone who just bought another lever gun I have to say you did a superb job on that winchester it absolutely is beautiful you know you `restuff keep it up . I`verefinished a few pistols none came out like your rifle congrats.Dennis
Thank you!! I was very blessed with how it turned out! Luckily for me I always find myself wrapped up in the used and abused section, so I've had quite a bit of practice prior to this! Still haven't gottem my hands on a pistol to reblue though! someday soon I'm sure
Your timing on this was a god send. I pulled this from the bluing salts and my heart dropped.
Thankfully I have an operational rust blue setup. Thank you 🙏
I'm glad I could help! I knew when researching for this project that if it went as it did, it could potentially help a lot of smith's and DIY guys. Hope your project went well, cheers!
Looks excellent, I have a 1980 Model 94 and I've been having a helluva time trying to blue the receiver. Thanks for the video, I'm going to try your method.
Amazing work!
Thank you for your time to research, do the labor, and video this process! I am especially pleased to see these “modern” 94’s can be refinished without a rattle can! Nice work!
Music in the background is fine, btw.
I'm glad I did all of it, and thanks for watching! Honestly I could have been happy with it keeping the vintage brown look. But it's definitely hard to beat a good honest blue!
I'll also keep you in mind as far as the music goes. Honestly it really does help keep the reverb down in a stone shop. For now it has to stay until I get a better audio setup.
Cheers!
@@BLWRK An unfortunate period of my life caused me to neglect my ‘72 vintage 94 and the receiver and lever got case rot. Such a shame because the barrel, mag tube and most other parts look great still.
Even from new (handed down from my grandfather) the receiver never had that deep blue. The treatment never really “burned in” like traditional steel parts. I have renewed plans for this one now!
Bluing Winchester mystery metal…you did it…fabulous job…subbed.
Gorgeous. Nice job.
Great stuff Adam, excellent demonstration of what can be achieved AND entertaining to boot!……your persona and creative editing make for a winning combination - you’ll go far! Keep up the great work.
p.s. one sweet ‘94 result 👍🏻
Thanks! I definitely try to put a lot of heart and soul into my editing. Your comment really reaches deep, and you don't know how much I appreciate all of it!
Wow! That's truly a work of art!
Thank you!
Beautiful job!!! Thanks for sharing
That was Awesome!!!
Beautiful job! I'm more of a Marlin fan but that really is gorgeous!
Positive, handsome with superb result!)))
Thank you very much!
Very nice work Sir!!
Good work Adam👍
Bravo brother ! What an awesome finish !
Thanks!
Turned out Supreme Bro,
Good Work
Awesome job I've done this before with a Marlin 336 and yours turned out better then mine
I use laurel mountain forge browning solution on my flintlock builds.
I let mine rust for a week in a humid climate then steel wool leaving the pits, then neutralize with baking soda..I then blue with 44-40 cold blue. Then I use steel wool and motor oil and bring it back some. Makes them look old and worn. I love building guns to look old. Just my preference.
Good job on your work there. I have a post 64 in 30-30 and I am redoing the finish on the stock and forearm but I'm happy with the factory bluing. If I come across a lever that is rough, I may do something similar.
That came out very Nice!!
On my todo list!
Incredible stache! 😌 a satisfactory stache
My freedom caterpillar accepts and appreciates your praise.
'Merica
Very good job, makes me appreciate the bluing job my dad did on my 1965 marlin model 60 back in 1979 after I forgot it outside in the rain when my wife was in labor with our daughter. 🙂
I am the way the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father but by Me.
Jesus Christ
Great job! Art takes time!
Thank you!
Great results and a great video! I've been debating whether to Rust Blue my Winchester Model 12, 16 gauge made in 1932...Now I think I will do it. I'll try for that Winchester dark luster which will require finer surface preparation and many more rust/carding cycles. I'll let you know how it turns out! Thanks again Amigo
I would say "You Nailed IT" as a guy who did OJT Industrial Passivation and rust bluing is a passivation, Great Looking Job!.
It's incredible to know that somebody with your expertise found their way here and enjoyed the video, thank you so much!!
P.s. I never knew the correct term for the process, which is amazing!! thanks!
@@BLWRK and "I AM" Saved! I trust you too!
Wow! That turned out great!
Thanks! It was a ton on fun, not nearly as much fun as shooting one of these if you know what i mean! :D
Amazing outcome!!! Your patience definitely paid off beautifully!!!! I have a post 94 I’m just going to ceracoat it. Done it many times with various firearms with great results but that blue you pulled off is 👌🏻
Thank you so much! I too love the turnout of Cerakote, and honestly it would have probably been far more practical on an instance such as this.
BUT, sometimes you just have to try and push the envelope and accommodate the group that loves that old timey feel 😎
I also have one of these nasty 94’s and have been debating the slow rust blue. I can cerakote it so much easier, but that blue finish sure is beautiful.
One thing I’m pondering is how would it work if you were to prep the rifle and parts like you would for cerakote and blast it with 120 grit AO instead of sanding it. Degrease and gas out would be the same, but instead of painting, heat it up in the oven and apply a blueing or browning solution. Then card, heat, apply solution, bake and repeat.
Wow, just amazing
Thanks!
Very nice work Adam...
Thank you!
Great job..... Looks awesome!
Thank you
I just rust blued my first flintlock barrel with the Laurel Mountain stuff. It came out great. I did the bath in PVC pipe with boiling distilled water from the kitchen.
That's great! The chemical reaction does not care what avenue it takes! Cheers
Rust bluing is all I know and I love it. I just finished Win 1873. I tried the cold bluing once. I didn't like it. Ok for screws and pins. Give Birchwood Casey's Browning solution a try. Put on hot steel (~275F) and boil in rain or distilled water...nice deep black.
Thank you from all of us who have bought that $25 .22 rifle that is perfectly fine except for the purple and yellow spots that Bubba left when he baptized it in a bottle of touch-up blue.
It is important that you let people know the central importance of 150% degreasing before applying the rusting solution. I just finished the second application of bluing to a No 4 MK I, and I never card off the frog hair after first applying the rusting agent and it turns out the same. Also, I use a makeshift accelerated 'ripening' chamber I cobbled together out of a U-haul wardrobe moving box, a small space heater, and a Walgreens vaporizer to bring the heat above dewpoint (110% necessary if using low pressure steam, as condensation on the metal will cause runs) and about 100% humidity. It works a lot faster than 3-4 hours. Great save though!
Super job!!!
Thank you!
Very impressive. A long process but the end result is definitely worth it. Cheers
Thanks! Cheers!
For rust bluing I usually end up polishing down to 400 Grit Silicon Carbide. My rust blue solution etches a very fine amount which I can control using 200 proof ethyl alcohol. I card the surface with a .0025" stainless wire brush then boil in distilled water then do another pass. I use a camel's hair brush for application.
Nice work on the final product. It has a beautiful satin finish to it. This should last at least 50 to 75 years.
So I've never done a rifle in this coarse of a grit before. Typically I polish to 600, and have had really good results. The next rifle I'm doing I've polished to 2000 grit to see if its's still capable of biting and reflecting the surface finish. My understanding is that the blue finish has as much to do with how fine it etches just as well as the surface finish, so we'll see how it goes.
I've heard of mixing ethyl alcohol to the mixture to give a much more shiny finish, but I haven't stumbled on enough definitive information to really try diving into it and testing it. So any information you might be able to provie would definitely be put to good use!
Was going to mention Mark Novak's steam chamber (hot plate/stockpot/PVC tower with cap) setup then saw a mention of him with your awareness. Busted my bubble😅.
Surprised you didn't have some rod across your boil tank to suspend the smaller parts.
The firearm turned out great 👍.
What a great job 😮thank you for your vidéo !!!
Glad you liked it!
I subscribed just because of this video. I absolutely love my Win. 94s. Two chambered in 30-30 and the other in 44 mag.
Glad you enjoyed! I'm pretty fresh at posting so the content will only be getting better!
So when is some new content coming up again? This video showed up on my feed again. Waiting for some more good content!
Long story short, WOW!
I have a post 1964 model 94 in need of refinishing - Still serviceable and in use though needing refinishing, but I have nowhere near the patience and skill that you exhibit.
i am saved. it is the most important dicesion one can make.
Looks good. I am always surprised at the different methods used to rust blue. I have blued several using Mark Novak’s method with good result. I wish you would have discussed cleaning prep prior to application of bluing solution, though I believe anyone trying this will look further into it before committing to the process. Thanks for the video.
Absolutely! Mark is Incredible!!
So in a previous video I delved deep on prep and application. This particular blend of Rust bluing Solution is called Laurel Mountain Forge barrel brown and degreaser. Degreasing prior to its use, I have found, to be minimally necessary. Obviously applied degreased, but not nearly as involved as the Trademarked "Rust Blue" or other brands with similar compounds which require a much more extensive degreasing methods.
Cheers!
Nice job 1
Thanks , I have a later 94 that needs a refinish .
Excellent!
Many thanks!
Thats good work.
Thank you!
Good job !
Thank you!
Awesome
It looks great. I am not sure if i could do it to my 1949 (year) 30-30 given to me by my dad. (now passed) Thanks I enjoyed the video very much with all respect.
I don't blame you! I'm sure it's a beautiful piece in its own right with more character than either of us! Glad you enjoyed!
Dude, OUTSTANDING video. Entertaining and enlightening. Just got my bluing (boiling) tank and carding wheel in the mail. I've got a half dozen old bolt guns that need some TLC and will be rust bluing them soon. Just need to decide on what solution to use. Leaning toward Rust Blue American Formula.
I've used multiple different flavors of the RUST BLUE brand with great results. With said formulae, I've found that prep is incredibly crucial. I do hope the best for your projects, and expect it to be very rewarding!
I did one of these a couple years ago. I removed the barrel and plugged it with dowels to protect the bore. I boiled and carded after each time in the humidifier. Turned out great.
Love it
Thanks!
Sweet
It looks amazing 😀😃😄😁😆😅😂🤣
I have a .44 Magnum model 94 with the crappy peeling blue. Brought it to a local gun shop that does gunsmith work. The guy said you can’t blue it and wanted to $175 to durablue the receiver. The barrel was actually in good condition. I believe Winchester went back to a hot blue in the early 80’s. Maybe I will find someone who can do this type of work.
Pretty
What kind of wire do you use when pulling it out and coating it with laurel mountain
That was a lot of hard work but in the end it certainly was worth it. Came out great. Does anyone know when they stopped iron plating the receivers? I think I have heard that it was before 1970 but I was just wondering. No way I would ever want to do that much work on a gun and I could only imagine what it would cost to have that done.
Great job! It looks awesome! You got a new subscriber out of me bro. This may push me to do something with that spare 94 receiver I have. Hmmm
Thanks man! glad you made it!! If you do decide to dive in on that '94 receiver, stop back and let me know how it goes!
Omg. Super cool. I need this for grandpas Gun. It’s not bad shape but probably never cleaned. little bit of rust pitting. HELP!
Gladly, unless you're looking to take on the task of refinishing it, your best bet is just steel wool, then keep it oiled! Cheers
Oh man... that looks absolutely gorgeous. Makes mine look like a turd. I'm still debating on how to refurb mine and I don't have the room nor the equipment you have, so I'm probably gonna have to rely on hot salts or cold bluing. Yeah, I know. Cold bluing is more cosmetic painting rather than actual bluing. Might look into that vegetable oil quenching, see how that holds up.
Honestly, if it were me in your shoes, I would look into durakote or Brownells equivalent Alumahide. Both work incredibly well, and I've seen many with the right prep, turn out great!
Just my $.02, goodluck!
@@BLWRK Wow, I'm actually quite interested in that Duracoat. I've been checking their website out for the past few minutes and they seem legit. I'll check out the Brownells stuff as well, but yeah, I'm leaning towards the former! Thanks for the suggestion!
I tried that years ago and while it looks good now it will deteriorate very quickly.
Hello
Nice video.
My winchester 3030 was made in 1978. And i wonder if its is the same alloy ?
Thanks.
The Alloy would absolutely be the same, but the outer finish is what is determined by the year of MFG, or more precisely the Serial Number will determine the finish. You will still absolutely be able to use this technique, but it may just take some extra sanding to get to the bare Sintered Metal.
Cheers!
If mine turns out half as good I'll be straight!
I'm not saved (and not interested, but thanks anyways! 😊) but this is dope, good stuff. bluing old stuff is something I have yet to work up the courage to try myself but your advice has me thinking I'll try it instead of trying half ass copper plating again 😆
Luckily, this form of bluing is generally considered the most practical form of actual "bluing" any DIY'er and steel enthusiast, so I'm glad I could maybe point you in a more positive direction! 😄
I've been told by many experts NOT to reblue the Pre-64 Winchesters as it devalues them. The new blueing causes the gun to lose its authenticity.
Have you used a airbrush to apply the acid for evenness and no runs lite coats some people will heavy spray
I have never used an air brush, but I will definitely look into it! I've read a little bit about chemical mist bluing, but I've been so consumed lately with this that it fell on blind eyes.
I'll definitely look into it more, stay tuned!
In 1964 Winchester did not make the decision, the new owners, Olin Corp. did.
Cost cutting just like AMF did when they bought out Harley Davidson back in the day.
I had a 1967 Winchester with that black chrome finish on the receiver. Did not care for that but what else could you do?
If you were looking for a bluing finish, this is the most practical way to do it. Being that yours is an early serial number chrome finished rifle, you will have a bit more sanding to do on the receiver to remove the plated layers, but after that, the process would be identical!
Typically refinishing these consist of all the kotes(cerakote, gunkote, durakote, etc) rust bluing is an option(matte to gloss) or, you could send it out to be iron plated then hot blued. I've listed these in the order of practicality.
What rust blue solution did you utilize for this project?
Laurel Mountain Forge barrel brown and degreaser
I have a 1931 built model 94 leave it alone or work on it ?
I'm a firm believer in keeping all tools, especially firearms, in good working condition. However, one must absolutely weigh the consequences of their actions and decide accordingly.
In other words, if the gun is in absolutely horrid condition with no chance of survival without intervention.. then it's a no Brainer. BUT, if it's a personal preference decision based on how it looks, you must consider that it will probably lower the value of the gun to collectors.
Food for thought, cheers!
feel like doing another one?!
🇦🇺😎👍Nice
Thank you!
Aren't you supposed to boil and card after every application and rust cycle?
Not necessarily. In the past, I used to boil and card between every cycle. After about my 12th rifle, I began carding after every rust cycle. Cutting out the boiling step altogether until I get a nice velvet brown. I have found that the end results are virtually indistinguishable.
Did you re-blue the heads of the screws?
Great question that I didn't cover in the video! I flame blue all screws that I either have to repair, or are already in the white!
Cheers!
@@BLWRK Thanks for the clarification.
Also did you do anything to the inside of the barrel or the magazine tube?
That looks beautiful. Now GO SHOOT IT!
Thanks!
So I posted a short of getting some shots with it, but I'm starting to throw around the idea of a full history of the 94 with some range time in it!
oops, Beeeeautiful.
Thanks!
Fucking sick dude! Can you notice your sanding marks at all on that?
Just my opinion of course, but I'd prefer a pre64 in its condition before reblueing. That's just me though.
Will you do mine!?
Okay tips here, first toilet bowl cleaner will cut the bluing faster than vinegar. Steel 'wool needs to be soaked in acetone to remove the oil from it since oil will kill the rust bluing process, 320 grit is a very good grit to prep for bluing still not a rough finish but allows a good surface to the rusting to occur. To expedite the rusting process you cant get an old carboard clothing armoire for packing and cut an access hole in the bottom, hang your coated parts in the box. use a small ceramic space heater from like DG to get the temp up to about 100 degrees then use a clothing steamer to introduce steam in the mix, takes about 2 hrs to get the good frog hair rust on the parts maybe a bit longer. Alwasy use latex gloves when handling parts. I like to wash parts after sanding with soapy water wipe the dry then let em sit a while, next wipe them with acetone to remove and residual oils and left over soap. In my setup I use a stainless steel cooking pot with a toilet flange attached to the lid and about 36 inces of 4inch pvc pipe with a cap that is loose and slotted for a cross bar to hang parts from. Get it steaming good and hang the parts in the tube for about 10 to 20 mins. stops the rust and turns it black. I dont use steel wool after the prep phase I actually use a carding wheel on an old 1/2 inch heavy duty drill with a dimmer switch controlling the plug in that way you can get down to between 300 and 600 rpm for buffing the barrel. Last but not least, yes you can use kerosine but used and I stress USED motor oil works too. You cant use new motor oil because it has all kinds of rust and corosion inhibitors in it as well as other chemicals that will remove that bluing. After that oil has been run for 3k miles those chemicals are gone and it produces a very nice black finish. Side not if you get into welding or making like I do for work certain tools that need to be around water and not rust to death you can heat things to a dull red and quench them in used motor oil to blacken them and the oil pentrates the pores so not or low rusting occurs.
You covered all the bases!! Thank you! In a previous video I dove deep in describing the process and REALLY went deep on all my methodology, but I'd also like to comment on a few things here to maybe clarify a little bit. Because all of your information is correct and useful in most rust bluing applications, and generally a good idea in ALL rust bluing practices.
In this particular video I used Laurel Mountain Forge barrel brown and degreaser, which has a degreaser within the solution. Which works INCREDIBLY well I might add. Typically I would always run through a myriad of degreasing and gas-out procedures to try to prevent oil bleed out in the middle of a blue job. I've found that the degreaser in LMF works so well that I don't even have to degrease the steel wool. I still however wear gloves throughout the process.
I had used a cardboard box for quite a time, but I had found that an old cheap electric smoker with a digital thermometer and control panel cuts my time investment 10x. Because I can set the temperature to 100 degrees and leave a steel cylinder of water laying on the heating element, occasionally spraying the element with some water, and it produces the same effect!
Perhaps I will do a video in the future covering the differences between several different solutions, their methodology in application, and their end results. In any case, I will be stopping back to put your comment to work for me! Thanks again!
P.s. Toilet bowl cleaner?? I love it! Definitely going to give it a try!
Each coat of rust should have been converted (boiled) than carted off for 8 to 10 coats or untill it stops rusting.. id consider this weak amd only one coat
beee
Utiful
What's up with this weird music? I thought my speakers were screwed up.
Should have just left it the way it was
Different strokes for different folks, cheers!
The background music doesn’t add anything to your content.
Noted, thanks!
I've mainly been using it to cut down on the noise of working in a stone building, but I'll try to put your comment to work and maybe start thinking on how to upgrade my audio setup
And now it will stink for ever.