Are US Low-Cost Airlines in REAL Trouble?!
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- čas přidán 14. 05. 2024
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After a lot of furloughs and staff shortages at the airlines and airports, the airline industry in the United States and elsewhere is finally showing some promising signs of recovery - even if some problems remain.
But what about Low-Cost and Ultra Low-Cost Carriers? Are they recovering in the same way, or… are they actually in trouble, and if so… why?
Stay tuned!
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Below you will find the links to videos and sources used in this episode.
• Can the Airline Indust...
• How Budget Airlines Li...
• Frontier Airlines - Au...
• Ryanair CEO Michael O’...
• We 've just ordered mo...
• Frontier Airlines Pilo...
• Fastest Track to Becom...
• 'Incredibly difficult'...
• Delta Air Lines | How'...
• Southwest Airlines pil...
• U.S. Air Force: Capt S...
• Station Focus: BWI, Ba...
• JetBlue makes offer to...
• The A320neo Family: Un...
• A320neo with Pratt & W...
• New Planes | Spirit Ai...
• Spirit Airlines| Soari...
• Look What’s NEO at Jet...
• Hawaiian Airlines A321...
• RTX tumbles after disc...
• Pratt & Whitney’s Gear...
• PurePower PW1100G-JM E...
• Spirit Airlines: A Fre...
• Frontier Airlines "Fre...
• In the Making: First #...
• Behind the Scenes - Cr...
• After a 36-year journe...
• Airlines see a decline...
• Travellers with disabi... v
• European travel is exp...
• Summer travel demand i...
• A320neo: reducing oper...
• United - Introducing P...
• Discover Premium Econo...
• Biden administration t...
• Meet the new JetBlue l...
• Breeze Airways | Game ...
• Breeze Airways adds 2 ...
• Breeze Airways adds n...
• Breeze Airways secures...
• Fly In A Big Front Sea...
• Airline meltdown
• In a Blink: Southwest ... - Zábava
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What's going on with Boeing? Is it cursed by Douglas?
Have used Nord for years, excellent product/value.
Nord has been very useful.
@@EdgyNumber1 seems like it to me
I was also going to ask you to do a piece on Boeing, after the latest PR disaster with the Max, this time the Max 9. Are they unlucky or simply negligent?
For me, ULCCs aren’t worth it because of the extra fees that make it just as expensive, and the insanely bad customer service. Frontier ruined all of them for me around 10 years ago when they cancelled our flight with no notice and gave us absolutely zero help getting on another flight. We wound up paying $400 extra per ticket to get on the last seats available on an American Airlines flight 8 hours later, with an additional layover. I spent a good portion of those 8 hours on hold with Frontier trying to get a refund. They were super rude and definitely did NOT want to give any money back. Never again. AA was amazing, and if we had booked with them in the first place, the fare wouldn’t have been that high. I will gladly pay more for a better experience, flexible and refundable fares, honest pricing with no hidden fees, and decent customer service.
Agreed. It's the same reason I refuse to fly Ryan Air. Not just their disgusting behaviour during the pandemic, trying to hand onto passenger's money for the best part of a year instead of refunding but the fact that now it's not even worth the trade off for their notoriously terrible attitude if anything goes wrong. They have upped their fees and you get less for more to the point their tickets cost no less than better airlines who will treat you better if there is a delay or problem.
Unfortunately your story is all too common and is the real reason why this business model is not succeeding here in the U.S.
Not the same experience here with easyJet and Ryanair, full refund and all expenses paid very quickly 🤷🏻 and they tried to put us on next flight available.
try Avelo if nearby.
@@user-gi7ol9dw6b Yeah the low cost model works much better in Europe and south east Asia.
I think these carriers need to realize is that passengers do not enjoy being nickle and dimed, offered restricted flight schedules, and then herded into uncomfortable aircraft, and treated like crab by staff.
There is a difference between not offering snacks and meal service, and oh, your bag is 1mm too big GOTCHA, pay $99.
I don't consider Southwest really an LCC anymore. Their costs are are very close now to the big 3 and now it's referred to as the big 4 with them in the US.
and the experience is terrible too. Not what they used to be. Now you line up in huge sequential lines. Other passengers haranguing you to see you boarding order. I have never felt more like a head of cattle to slaughter. They literally pit passengers against one another. Even the gate staff "humorously" mock the last 3rd of boarders as middle seaters. It's just bad.
@@bigbaddms they actually haven’t gotten any complaints about that least of their issues
@@johniii8147 well it's hard to complain when that's literally their system. If you don't like it, then don't fly the airline. Which is what I have opted to do. I want a reserved seat.
@@bigbaddms I agree
@@bigbaddms You have a reserved seat, Southwest doesn't intentionally overbook sales. You get one seat in the aircraft, the choice is yours. The closer to 24 hours before departure you check-in the early you get to pick that seat. All seats go to the same place at the same time.
Im not a pilot, but these videos are always educational and you never loading the videos with useless data. Thank you for always getting straight to the point. I've learned a lot from your channel. Keep up the work.
Me: "The sky is blue"
MentourNow: : "The real answer is actually more complicated"...
True 😂
Well it actually is..😉
@@bhargavdesai7984my words exactly
And I’ll tell you all about that, right after this.
I own a low cost airline. My fleet includes me, a two-seat ultra light for “long haul” flights and, for regional travel, a paraglider w/a paramotor and a tandem harness for pilot & passenger. I charge by the pound and mile. The upside is I can pick up and drop off from almost anywhere.
Just gotta have a commercial pilots license since you make money.
What’s the fee for latching the door securely?
@@Doug_Dimmadome No! No! I deceptively registered as a leisure and entertainment service. Give me at least some credit. BTW, I’d need an ATPL, not a CPL, if I had properly registered as an airline.
@@benoithudson7235 There’s no latch. No doors either. However, I have mini liquor bottles: $30ea. A Lunchables pack can be purchased for $15. Smoking is allowed.
What’s the point?
LCC's and ULCC's were also thought to recover quicker because they cater mostly to vacation travelers, which everyone wanted to do, after lockdowns. Legacy carriers, with more space devoted to business pax, also got hurt as people learned to work remotely.
Yes!
Now people can’t afford a vacation because the grocery stores and landlords are making record profits
@@kevinb2469
Oil companies, most of all. However, inflation is getting under control and prices will stabilize.
@@frankpinmtlDeflation causes existing prices to go down. Slowing the inflation rate is simply slowing down the price increase rate of prices that have ALREADY risen due to prior inflation.
Slowing inflation does not reduce prices
@@stevewhite3424 I said prices will stabilize. Salaries need to catch up (as they are with pilots) and then competition will drive prices down a bit. Once landlords cannot fill vacant places, airlines cannot fill empty seats, people eschew expensive purchases and seek cheaper options - prices will come down. This is why the current low unemployment rate was such a big thing - it drove employers to pay employees better. Inflation will come back to a healthy 2% per year.
Everything has increased - including the amount of money earned by people. It just took awhile for that to catch up.
I would not consider Southwest a low cost carrier anymore. Whenever I shop them, their fares are almost always greater than Delta, American and United. Sure maybe they sell a few cheap seats, but they are hard to find. To me, SWA is a full cost carrier. Spirit and Frontier are lower cost carriers, but they play all kinds of up-charge games with luggage, food, wi-fi etc so they aren´t much cheaper than the majors.
Don’t forget to factor in that SWA doesn’t charge you for things that the other carriers do (eg, bag fees, change fees).
The only part that may be considered “low cost” for them is the all-economy cabin - otherwise they’re basically what a U.S. carrier would’ve been in the 90s.
Southwest is the most expensive airlines
I concur. Southwest has become a mainline carrier. The prices are no longer the lowest, they are trying to attract business travelers, and they are flying out of major airports now, such as O'Hare in addition to Midway.
Similar issue faced in Indian aviation by P&W now GoAir is bankrupt, Air India Vistara merger, Spicejet has ownership issues and INDIGO is dominant a whopping 65% of Indian Domestic aviation market
It’s important to understand that in the USA, you really have two very different types of ultra low cost carriers - Allegiant and Breeze which concentrate on flying routes where the origin and/or destination is usually a smaller market vs. Spirit or Frontier which tend to mostly fly between mega metro areas. The latter compete directly with the legacy carriers’ nonstop services while the first two only compete with majors indirectly. As such, they have very different business models and equipment needs. In any case, the low cost carriers have definitely benefited from the overall shift from business to leisure travel post-pandemic. Business travelers were the majors’ most lucrative customers and now a lot of that business is gone forever.
One could actually make an additional comment - its the shift from Business Travel to Leisure Traveller that has prevented the retirement of many still flying Boeing 747 and Airbus a380 - with an rising demand on key routes...
Are you the same Max Power that keeps bashing on Tim Dunn?
wow
How is the equipment needs different? Flying from Albany to Palm Beach is essentially the same flight as JFK to Miami
@@jpazinholiterally nobody in the US is flying 747s. United was the last one and they retired it in 2017
Allegiant is actually pretty good. Spirit was an absolute NIGHTMARE.
I've flown Spirit a lot because of the ultra low fares. This past holiday season I flew back from Orlando on a flight that was only 20% full. It was the fewest number of people on a flight I have ever been on and it only cost me $20 one way. No way they made money on that flight.
They still need to get the plane to where it will (hopefully) take on more passengers. Taxi drivers going empty back to the train station also don’t make any money. My point is that sometimes having a couple paying customers can be a favorable option to flying an empty plane.
flights have to be 60% full (legacy) and probably 80+% full on LCCs so probably bled money that flight. That said, the next turn could be a high yield route with 90+% load factor per flight. The people scheduling these things run complex programs that optimize all of this.
I hope so... As a European I flew with frontier once and never again
.. how they treat their customers is absolutely disgusting
do tell? What did they do?
How does Frontier compare with Ryanair. I know Ryanair is the first airline to ever do the Al La Carte pricing and pre-reclined seats even though I never flown them.
@@davidperry4013 ryanair has strict rules - but at least you've got rights in Europe if something goes wrong... Frontier staff will treat you like an animal if something goes wrong
Roller coasters do have distinct parts called block zones, so the metaphor is very true since only one train can be in a given block zone at any time
...for those that do not know what block zones are...
@@Puukiuukithe roller coaster designers split the track into sections, maybe 10 sections along the length. Each section has sensors to detect when a train enters and exits the block. It also has brakes at the start of each block. It will only allow the train to continue into the block if there is no train currently occupying the block. Sometimes they have a buffer, a block or two between trains just to ensure no missteps on the sensors.
The parallel being that the aviation market can't have two trains one one block. The budget airlines can't also be premium. The premium can't also be budget.
I don't fly Spirit or Frontier. First, they are not as cheap as people think after you add on all the extra costs that you need. Second, the lack of the space on the plane is brutal and doesn't work for my family all over 6 feet tall.
Third is the trash you have to fly with and 4th is their ghetto ass gate & cabin crews
Agree
I once tried to price out the exact same trip on Frontier and United. Frontier charged me $160 for the flights but nickel and dimed me up to $250 to choose my own seats and bring a carry-on bag whereas United included all of that from the get-go for $220 total. The start and end of my openness to flying on a ULCC.
My very personal take is that the Low Cost airlines lowered the service quality at a faster rate than their prices so many potential customers prefer to pay a little extra for the lowest air ticket in a regular airline. The other view is that the general quality of the flying experience went down so much that many customers are actually paying more frecuently for the Premium Economy and even Business seats (while most airlines actually ditched entirely the First Class approach)
Then again Southwest allows free checked bags while the "high cost" airlines now charge to check a bag. The end result is many, many more bags getting taken on board the flight on the "high cost" airlines which is a rather miserable experience.
It's important to note that the major US carriers make a huge amount of money on their affinity credit cards/frequent flyer programs- so much so that some say they are now as much banks as airlines. Also Delta especially due to being the most technology savvy probably gets the most add-on to fares by tempting with affordable upgrades. I am someone that would never pay full for first class yet I have been upgrading frequently now for additional payment.
First class on a long international flight is literally like saving a full day on your trip. Usually the rest of the day when you arrive at each leg is recovery.
@@plektosgamingHe was talking about US domestic flights
And Business Class with lie flat seats! .a dream compared to economy.
@@DRthistle Anything is better than economy
@@johniii8147 But he also mentioned international flights as well, because some carriers are expanding into those markets and finding it hard to compete. When your entire fleet is nothing but economy seats, there is no option for wealthy vacationers who want to fly to Mexico for vacation - who don't want to pay for every last thing, be harassed by the crew because your kid's backpack-sized "personal item" doesn't fit in their tiny bin, fees for baggage, and sites and aps that are just barely above spammy malware in their level of hurdles they make you jump through, popups, and hyper-aggressive marketing.
Everyone I know of who goes even to Mexico from the U.S. simply takes a major airline. And if you can afford it for a longer flight, say, to Hawaii, business class with an actual proper seat and decent food and all of that makes the vacation feel like it's started early.
Southwest might be one notable exception, IMO, as their recent expansion into international destinations in Central American and the Caribbean are a possible middle-ground. The seats are still economy and it's very basic, but there are no games. Bring your luggage, carry-ons, and even get served a small snack or meal. I fly Southwest versus the ukltra-low carriers every time that I can as it's zero stress.
Flying Frontier tomorrow from a small airport (TTN) to a large hub (MCO). To me, Frontier makes up its cost in its baggage and individual pricing. I don’t want Discount Den, because sometimes I fly Spirit from ACY to FLL, or MCO. Depends on who has the better arrival schedule time to the destination that I want. Anyway, baggage costs used to range $30-45USD, but now it’s $80+ for a carry-on. Seats were once priced $20, but now they range $35 USD for the rear seats. So, it’s either the club, or pay individually for everything. Or in my case, pay for two clubs. I don’t- but those little things drive the price up fast.
Anyway… did you know Frontier offers “All-You-Can-Fly” passes seasonally and yearly now? Just like Amtrak’s rail pass.
In tried frontier once. And it cost more because they nickel and dime you for everything. So I only fly southwest for the past 15 years now. Always 100% happy. Ultra low cost carriers are trash.
If you have ever flown Spirit or Frontier, you understand why the market is trending towards other options.
This!
The last time I flew Spirit, 03/14 was the last time I'll ever fly Spirit!
If add in the luggage fee, seat selection fee, and other fees, it comes up to more than a Delia's flight.
At Frontier, Even if you understand and play the game properly (1 personal item, no ups no extras), they will find other ways to cheat, such as closing the baggage check ahead of time then charging extra at the gate (experienced Firsthand), or letting people fly out with the same bags but deemed too large on the return trip (witness). On top of that they'll get aggressive and abusive.
Whenever I fly Spirit I get to brush up on my Spanish.
It's also worth pointing out that Spirit and Frontier have a (mostly-deserved) image problem in the U.S. For most of us that fly frequently in the U.S., even for frequent leisure travel, you couldn't pay us to fly on either of those carriers. They have a reputation for rude, unhelpful staff and prices that don't end up being much better than the big 4 by the time you add in all of the ancillary fees for things you might want or need. Meanwhile, they have far less comfortable cabins with the worst seat pitch in the U.S. commercial aviation industry. Frontier even went so far as to close down their customer support call centers. You literally can't even call them anymore when something goes wrong.
While real median income has dropped a bit in the U.S. over the last couple of years (for the first time in quite long time,) prior to the pandemic and even during the first year or so of the pandemic, real median income in the U.S. was rising quickly and far more people can afford to pay a bit extra to have a decent experience on their vacation rather than a miserable one as compared to, say, 10 or 15 years ago. By the time of the pandemic, real median household income in the U.S. had risen to around $75,000 USD, with by far the highest household disposable income per capita of any OECD country, even compared to relatively wealthy European countries like Germany, Switzerland, and Luxembourg. As a result, a lot of the people who would have flown Spirit, Frontier, or Allegiant in the past have been more willing and able to pay higher prices for a better experience over the last few-to-several years.
As for the decline in ticket sales, that was mostly just a function of coming down off of an insane high from pent-up travel demand during the pandemic combined with normal seasonal trends. Ticket prices for summer 2023 were, in many cases, just outright absurd due to the very high demand and the supply of aircraft and pilots not having caught up to that, as well as FAA staffing levels not having caught up to where they need to be for ATC. But as we started to come back down off of that pent-up demand (and also the economy continued to weaken a bit due to the very high inflation of the last 2-3 years,) prices returned pretty quickly to more normal levels. At least after adjusting for the crazy inflation of the last 2-3 years, airline ticket prices in the U.S. are more around pre-pandemic levels now. Still, overall passenger numbers are quite high, just not with demand outpacing supply as much as it was over the summer.
Southwest is really a different animal entirely. They take a nearly opposite approach to Frontier and Spirit on pricing and customer service. Their ticket prices are about the same as UA, AA, or Delta, but the legroom is just as good or better, they include pretty much everything you need in the base fare (even compared to UA, AA, and DL, let alone Spirit, Frontier, or Allegiant,) and their staff are generally friendly and helpful. They also have the most flexible ticket policies in the industry, with even their cheapest fares able to be changed or cancelled with no fees for a flight credit that never expires. While a lot of frequent flyers don't like Southwest's open seating policy, still nearly everyone will prefer to fly with them over Spirit, Frontier, or Allegiant. While they did have a major meltdown at the end of 2022 and much of how long it took to get it fixed was their fault, it was some pretty crazy weather that caused it. Much of the central section of the continental U.S. was seeing once-in-a-lifetime type temperatures and wind chills and it happened right at the beginning of one of the heaviest travel times of year. While Southwest should have had better systems in places for dealing with such disruptions, it still would have been a huge mess even if they'd had perfect systems for coordination in place.
👏👏👏
Have you flown American or Delta, or even United economy? It’s exactly the same as what you get on spirit. You might have a better “airport” experience but when you sit down for the flight, it’s crappy seats and service in the back. Before you mention seat pitch, I was on a delta 737, their seats were so thick there was barely any room to move your legs making them uncomfortable. All LCCs have lower seat pitch by an inch or two but they have the slim seats so it feels like they’re as good or better seats as far as legroom goes. If you can save some money, why not fly on LCCs, many of them have wifi now like Spirit and Breeze.
If you have no luggage whatsoever, and you want absolutely nothing but a super cramped randomly assigned seat, then a LCC is perfect. If you want ANYTHING more than the absolutely worst, then a mainline carrier is better. Yeah, mainline carriers are lousy as well these days but at least you don't pay super high fees for even carryon, and every other little thing. The flight booking sites (Kayak) even let you omit Spirit as an option. Gee I wonder why?
@essel23fly
No it's not exactly the same, Spirits seats are markedly worse than any other airline I have ever flown with. And I have flown with most of remaining major US airlines, the military, and a couple European airlines. Spirit can join everyone else when they have actual seats and not the horrible worn down facsimiles they have on their planes.
The seats with spirit are so worn out it was like sitting on a piece of overstretched cloth, and because of that it was impossible to sit up comfortably or straight in-spite of the nearly vertical board they called the back of the seat. I had pain in my back, tailbone, neck, and hips for that mistake and will not repeat it. I also had to fly a whole leg physically covering my ears with my hands because for some reason the engine noise was completely unbearable. Do they fish out as much insulation as they can to lower weight or something?
Earlier this year I had to do a short hop on the most horrible little Air Canada jet I'd ever stepped on (it was ooooooooooooold), and it was still a relatively comfortable despite how ridiculously packed in and smelly it was. I would suffer through the awful airports in Canada, and Air Canadas on the ground incompetence over flying spirit if I had to choose between only those too.
@@essel23fly I fly Delta (economy, domestic First, and Delta One) dozens of times annually. I have Platinum Medallion status with them. I also fly Southwest many times per year. Delta has 31" pitch in economy, Southwest has 31 or 32" depending on -700 or -800/-8. Spirit has 28", the least in the industry in the U.S.
Also, it's kind of funny that you say they're "exactly the same as what you get on Spirit," but then say they're not the same with the extra padding vs. slimline...
Awesome video again by you and your team Peter! Would love to see one done on the Canadian aviation industry in the future ! Take care 😊
I find this interesting as Petter talks about the business side of airlines. A couple of things from my own experience. I live in the Los Angeles area and used to commute frequently to The Bay Area (around the San Fransico Bay, for those who are not used to the term.) Most of the time, the only thing that mattered was convenience, i.e., between which airports and what schedule. But occasionally, price became a factor. Surprisingly, I found that the "low cost" alternative (Southwest) was rarely the lowest cost, and legacy airlines often had lower-priced seats. But having been a very frequent traveler for many years, eventually, the severe discomfort of flying means that for any travel with a flying time of less than about 75 minutes (that includes Los Angeles area airports to the Bay Area), I now always drive. It takes about the same time as getting from door-to-door as flying and is a lot more comfortable. It is cheaper, too, since I don't have to pay for expensive parking or rideshare at the departure airport and rental car or rideshare at the destination airport. For longer US domestic flights, I always fly 1st class and international, always business. No matter if it is business or leisure. There is an emerging market of all-you-can-fly membership airlines. You pay a monthly fee and can fly as much as you want. These small airlines operate business jets or turboprops and typically serve general aviation airports. This, in turn, means that passengers can show up 10 minutes before the flight, and all the discomfort and inconvenience of large airports are virtually eliminated.
I agree. I used to have to work with customers in Edmonton Alberta while living in Calgary (it is about 200 miles). To fly to Edmonton at one time took about 45 minutes while driving took about 3 hours along a high speed highway. But as security became more of an issue, suddenly you needed to be at least an hour at the airport both ends and it started taking over three hours all included. So I also started to drive as it was just more convenient. No charges at the airport for parking and usually a similar or even shorter time frame. No concern about flight cancellations or time delays of one sort or another. Also able to stop for a quick meal coming home!
Yes, these are special circumstances but air travel is beset with many delays these days.
The problem with regional short haul flights in the UK is the check-in and airport security process takes so long, that flying doesn’t actually save you much (if any) time over driving.
I’ve had flights were you’re advised to check-in 2 hours before the flight departs and then there’s the time it takes to drive to the airport and carparking (some carparks are nowhere near the terminal). This might add 4 hours in total onto the flight time. Then add another hour getting out the airport at the other side.
The only saving grace is how overpriced trains are in the UK. If time isn’t an issue then it actually costs less to fly from London to Berlin, then get another flight from Berlin to Edinburgh, than it costs to get a direct train from London to Edinburgh.
Spirit's and Frontier's problem when they tried to expand aggressively was once the legacy airlines began hiring again at full speed in 2021, they couldn't hire pilots anymore as pilots when given a choice between flying for Spirit/Frontier or American/Delta/United would choose A/D/U over S/F and any pilots hired at S/F would be in short order be on their way to A/D/U not long after starting at S/F. New planes were arriving at S/F quickly, but hiring couldn't keep up - it was getting undercut by hiring at A/D/U. arriving new planes werent fully utilized because they didn't have the crews to keep them flying. forcing them to raise pilot pay to much as A/D/U pay their pilots..
P&W engine problems grounded the planes, so while hiring at A/D/U continues a full speed, at least at Spirit - hiring has come to a halt as now Spirit doesn't have the planes (because they are parked) for the crews to fly.
At the same time, the passengers S/F are targeting - are really at the lowest end of the economic spectrum. Inflation has hit this segment of the population hard - what budget they do have - it's been hit to cover basic necessities like food and gas. They didn't have money to begin with for airplane tickets - so Spirit and Frontier it was. once the price is out of their range, they just won't fly.
The leisure passenger market targeted by A/D/U are more resilient - as they raise their fares, their passenger target segment can and is willing to continue paying more. when A/D/U increase their price, their passengers just willing pay more - begrudgingly.
Ironically, the very lowest end of the economy has seen the biggest wage and pay hikes, and that has offset inflation effectively. But white collar workers are being hit hard for a variety of reasons: even before AI and other productivity gains, there was already an oversupply issue.
Point-to-point would have been welcome for Christmas travel.
OSL-AMS-BRS t/r was a pain - especially when weather meant to divert via DUB. SAS used to fly OSL-BRS some years ago, and very convenient it was, too. So, I support the P-2-P model.
Alaska Airlines just had a blown out window which caused a grounding of the new 737 models. Something's really going on with Boeing as other problems have cropped up which isn't boding well for regionals that rely on them. This year isn't off to a good start with air travel as there have been 2 severe incidents already.
Boeing hasn't been healthy for decades.. I point the problem starting with consolidation with McDonnell Douglass..
Not a window actually, but a "door plug". It meant to be a door but is not a door in this configuration.
It is the 737 Max 9, and yes they are now grounded. Its not a "window" but a door plug (with window), the space for a door that was not installed and something to plug it close was done instead. Looks like this plug wasn't put properly, BUT, this particular plane was already having issues with cabin pressurization, so the signs were there. The worst thing is that it was only 10 weeks old. Thankfully nobody was lost, hopefully people will learn to never remove their seat belts unless you absolutely need to go to the toilet (which you should minimize by using toilets at the airport).
@peymantakallo dint something like that or similar to it happend to the old dc 10?
@@zyancuerdo1615yes, at least twice.
Interesting as always. I find myself under-convinced by the idea that big pilot pay increases are a sign that carriers are back on their feet. Feels more like a sign of pilot shortages leading to carriers being royally, erm, not back on their feet. There's a great aviation channel that's covered this issue. It's called, 'Mentour Now!' - I highly recommend checking it out.
Very interesting video. I’ve never been a fan of low-cost carriers for the simple reason that they’ve made air travel miserable, even in basic economy on the larger carriers due to their need to compete. I’m old enough to remember when air travel was actually enjoyable, and passengers were treated like human beings, not cattle, even in economy. I’m by no means wealthy, but at this point in my life I will pay extra on domestic flights for first/business class, or premium economy on transatlantic, so that I don’t have a miserable experience flying. Thus I am not the target customer for the LCCs. And I am not alone in this. The LCCs might win back some customers if they took some of the emphasis off rock bottom pricing and instead offered service that doesn’t make you feel like a piece of cargo.
And regarding the size of the planes being ordered… it’s interesting to note that United, for example, has a huge fleet of E175s and CRJ900s. Bigger is not always better. With these small jets, the larger carriers can connect passengers to many minor airports… and even offer decent service en route.
What annoys me about airlines is how they lie about baggage. Any bag is now a huge surcharge that inflates the price of your ticket. But when I was in the military our transport aircraft had no issues with weight, if I remember troops could have as much as 55kg each on a full flight.
The elephant in the room is how many airlines are stopping passengers from taking bags, then filling their hold with cargo freight.
@@notmenotme614the reality is that flying passenger bags isn't free to the airline. It costs them extra fuel, it costs them handling costs. Sure, the planes can support the weight, but that doesn't mean it's free.
Cargo pays more than free bags, so they make the bags cost the same as cargo, a true market rate to offset the opportunity cost.
and in those old days fares were probably 30% higher or more. The ULCCs are necessary competition the passengers need. My experiences on F9 and NK (Frontier and Spirit) were just fine. Sure one of my Spirit flights had a warm cabin and no wifi, but it was $50 from NYC to KC.
You would hope the LCCs to succeed so that would leave more space in the legacy carrier that you enjoy while passengers are paying lower fares in the LCCs.
I work with different airlines in my area. The low cost carriers I work with are Avelo, Allegiant, South West, Frontier, Spirit. All the other carriers I work with like Delta, United, Alaska, American fly to the same destinations. when purchasing a ticket in the end after paying all the fees there's about a $50 difference making it not worth flying with the low cost carriers with the exception of South West.
I wish there were more low cost carriers in Canada; Swoop was bought by West Jet, Flair is focusing on vacation destinations over winter instead of domestic flights, and Porter & Lynx Air are very specific (and often short) commuter flights.
Canada is too small to support too many airlines
I still drive to most of my destinations within the US. We had planned to fly from GRR to MCO in 2019, but our flight was booked incorrectly, so we drove. Instead of leaving on the originally scheduled day, we left the day before and arrived in Orlando 3 hours before we would have landed. Then, for our return trip, we left later in the day (instead of 5am) and got home at 10am the following morning. I drove straight thru in both directions, making each trip of 1,230 miles in ~17hrs, with a total fuel cost of ~$240 for three people. I traded time for money, which was fine by me. I wouldn't earn as much as I saved in 2 days of work, as I did by driving vs flying. I also didn't need to use a rental car or public transportation for those 10 days in Orlando, or have to schedule times to travel. Convenience was a great benefit, also. We had free parking at Disney via our handicap placard and I received extra benefit from my veteran status, which made my Disney trip worth the time spent driving. But Disneyland will always be a flying trip. There's too much traffic, not enough parking, and what parking there is, is very expensive! You can rent a car for the day, if you really want it, then return it when you're done, instead of paying more than the rental cost to park it!
i fly spirit a lot. the experience has been great, especially for the crazy-low price. if you play the game...you're saving a ton of money. that has meant i fly for short vacations much more often.
here's hoping that their financials stabilize (and spirit does not become part of jetblue).
breeze and allegiant's fleet flexibility (and operating out of smaller airports) are great ideas i hope will help them apply more pricing pressure (and get me on vacation even more)
Having competition is a benefit, too.
Right now there's a ton of doomerism on Spirit but the company will be fine.
Almost all low cost airlines walk a fine line between moderate financial success and insolvency. Each downturn in the economy weeds out the weakest. In the end, when time comes for renewing their fleet they fail from lack of capital to invest in a renewed fleet.
Perhaps in the US. In Europe Ryanair and Wizzair are doing very well. Taking market share from network airlines. Wizzair also has issues with P&W engines so had to reduce some connections.
I don't think that's true at all. There's always a market for used jets that keep costs affordable
Really hasn't proven true that fleet renewals has proven a big issue for most LLC. They are ordering and leasing aircraft in droves. It's actually a bubble in ordering.
Southwest has had such longevity due to smart capital management in the past. During good times they would hedge fuel and stockpile cash so they could weather the bad times that would inevitably follow while other airlines would party all their money away figuratively speaking and be left with a hangover in the downturn.
Please do a series between the differences between cargo (except live stock) and passenger in terms of route planning hut
Hmm…what’s the difference between livestock as cargo and regular cargo? They still have to fly same routes to larger airports.🤔
Mate had an interesting job flying with meat, he took race horses round the world not the pilot was cabin crew for the meat, horse kicks off on flight not good for plane so It sleeps or is put down depending what's happened or going on. Remember they were race horses so would be paying a lot more than first class
That is simple.. fedex and ups use a hub spoke system.. everthing else is point to point or space availability thru hubs.
Tight schedules and minimum turn around…sounds totally safe. FAA needs to mandate minimum 90 min turns to ensure safety is prioritised…other regulators too
JetBlue is no longer a "leisure" carrier, it is now an established major air carrier catering to all customers. It's US transcontinental Mint service from NY to CA is a premium business product, JB has taken over the DC/NY/BOS shuttle business away from American (who inherited the Shuttle from USAirways) which is a business market. JB has been and is positioning itself as a premium carrier.
They also have international routes now.
Imagine a Jet Blue A330-900 LOL
@@richarddixon146 They fly the Airbus A321LR on transatlantic flights
I'd make the same argument about SWA, far from a startup now no matter what they say about themselves. That said I do enjoy flying SWA the major downside being their lack of international routes or partners.
@@truebluemiata I love flying Southwest!
Not only because they are only one of two airlines that service my regional airport, but they let me take my extra spicy Pad Thai onboard for my meal😋
Prices dropping or stable in a world where on-costs, salaries of pilots, maintenance staff, cabin crew, ground crew, managers, planners, etc, landing slots, gate access, fuel, aircraft hire, energy and so on are rising - many exponentially, is a recipe for disaster. And ULCC/LCC run on a very tight cost margin already. They have little, or no, leeway on costs v ticket price.
My theory for the rise of demand for premium offering over standard economy offerings is: There is just not enough space available in the common economy seat for the average traveler. And with single isle flight segments growing in length, that lack of space is not only an issue of comfort but also becomes an issue of heath risk. The current space available in premium economy seats is comparable to the space that was available in many economy seats some 20-30 years back.
And while an average adult in North America in the 1990s weighed about 75kg, today that weight (if all the different health reports are to be believed) is more than likely in the 90-95kg range. So with less space and bigger sizes in standard economy, it is no wonder that more people will opt for a more premium product that provides a bit more space and comfort.
My theory is that after Covid (with all its problems) people just said "fuck it, YOLO"
One reason that JetBlue wanted to buy Spirit was to prevent the merger with Frontier airlines. Had Spirit and Frontier merged, it would’ve been a real threat to JetBlue.
🤔 it wouldn’t have anything to do with a primarily East Coast airline wanting to purchase an airline with a big Midwest route structure would it? Weird concept high income earners are moving to the Midwest where you have little route structure.
Actually JetBlue bought them because they want there assets to grown due to the backlog of aircraft deliveries.
@@BirdDog. so Jetblue has zero intention on expanding into the Midwest. It strictly for airplanes is what you want me to believe? Or do the two theories mostly go hand in hand?
@@robertprivate742 I said they wanted to grow and it would take a decade to deliver that many news buses. Also the pilot shortage was cited for this as well. They want nothing to do with their business model. Purely assets and pilots. Jet Blue said not me. Frontier Spirit merger would present little threat to Jet Blue and more to the legacies. Especially with JFK being their stronghold.
@@BirdDog. Ok no worries when are union spoke to Robin H at a pilots Town hall that I attended. He suggested that the route infrastructure was a big reason behind the purchase of the company he stated “that it would take 7-10 years to achieve”-Robin H. But I guess I wasn’t paying that good of attention. I agree the plane delivery issue was also sited.
I do miss the old MP videos in the living room with the past out dogs on the couch🤣
Me too! And the colour coded cushions!
Same! I love the new videos but I miss the dogs! 😂
Frontier is *so miserable* to fly on, and *so infuriating* with a fee for everything short of breathing, that I absolutely will not go on a flight with them. If the government didn't regulate safety, the oxygen mask above your seat and the floatation device below it would be extra purchases at boarding.
However I hope these airlines continue to maintain a modicum of success. More competition is better. It's never been so cheap to fly places.
I'm sure you will.. Because you're a cheap person... So stop posting nonsense.
I think Neelman has figured it out. JetBlue, Azul & Breeze (all Neelman airlines) are kicking butt in their respective slots.
I think that the fact that US market is saturated with low-cost carriers means that supply far exceeds demand, like you mentioned, and so prices are lower and it is difficult for individual airlines to gain market share and profit.
at least in the markets i fly out of, ULC flights are always packed full. if they are oversaturated, it's not on the flights i'm taking.
It’s not saturated in the US by any means. That would be Europe and Asia.
Hi! I submit this question in response to your invitation at the end of the video. You emphasize the need for airlines to make money. I understand that airlines of course want to maximize efficiency, but I would be interested in your perspective about the points programs and the relative place that the actual flight operations, including their profit margins, have in the broader travel industry. The CZcams video "Why Airlines Don't Make Money Flying" [or "How Airlines Quietly Became Banks"] (Wendover Productions, 2021) got me interested in this topic, and I wonder how that perspective relates to the focus you have on airlines as profit centers. Thank you as always for your excellent content!
I'm wating for Frontier to charge extra mid-flight ... for Landing.
The section on Jetblue and FLyDubai reminded me of MAXjet and Silverjet. For those who don't remember, they were lower cost 'all business class' airlines in the early 2000s, using older aircraft and all the business class seats that other carriers were pulling out to replace with fully-flat beds. Seats were more expensive than an economy seat but quite a bit less than 'true' business class. We flew MAXjet once back in the day and enjoyed the experience: neither my wife or I had ever flown in anything other than economy so having better service, a wider recliner seat and above all LEGROOM was delightful.
Both companies went under after a few years: they never had enough fleet to make operations viable, true business class passengers didn't think much of the business-minus service (and having flown on a few business class flights subsequently, MAXjet wasn't of the same standard - but it was also about half the cost), and the economic crash did them in. Had they been positioned as 'all premium economy,' maybe they would have been more successful.
Hello, Petter, I have an idea for a video on your Mentor pilot channel. It’s not a typical commercial airline accident. This accident occurred in 1996 and was famous for numerous reasons. See, the flight was a publicity stunt called “Sea to Shining Sea.” There was a seven year old girl who was attempting to become the youngest person to flight a cross country flight. Actually her father was using his daughter, Jessica Dubroff to stroke his ego. When the group was flying out of Cheyenne, Wyoming the weather became unsuitable for flying. However, despite airport staff begging them to stay over, the adults insisted on taking off. Jessica’s aircraft ended up crashing immediately after takeoff. Everyone aboard was killed.
Sounds like a hit.
Those breeze Embraers (and a220s also) are really good looking jets.
Your presentation on the aviation industry is impeccable! I began watching your videos while I was living in Milano back in 2019. Since, I have returned to the States and look forward to watching your videos every week. How do you have time to produce such great quality videos and continue flying your commercial 737?
Hey mentour! Could you, please, make a video about the US NOTAM system that everybody was talking about one year ago? Thaaanks
Will be interesting with the shift to more premium seats which favours larger aircraft vs smaller aircraft with direct flights, I know personally I will take a larger seat and better lounges over going point to point, especially for longer flights. The other issue with smaller aircraft and more point to point routes is pilot shortages and pilot wages going up exponentially will likely start favoring larger aircraft either with less daily flights or back to more hub and spoke type models
Hey Petter
Recently, I've seen a few videos about oblique-winged airplanes. Are they on the far horizon? Could they revolutionize flying faster than the speed of sound as well as flying as a whole? How viable even are they? What would be the training required for pilots if they switched to oblique planes?
Thank you for your great videos and have a wonderful rest of the day.
Best regards
I just flew Southwest, it wasn’t the fact that I forgot about last years melt down. It was just hard to pass up their 2 included checked bags. A deals a deal 😅
Another issue you didn't touch on are frequent flyers like me getting the shaft when flights were stopped. We had seven separate flights already paid for when the pandemic happened. Larger carriers like KLM, Luft and BA all held the ticket for future use. Low cost airlines said Meh, you're out of luck. Or gave credits for a fraction of the ticket. And it was too difficult to rebook after. Whereas I called Luft and they were willing to help. So I no longer book with the low cost airlines. If I add in the thousands I lost because of the halt in flights with low costs, it's no longer low cost
Wow that's disgusting. There should be a class action lawsuit. How do they legally get away with it? Force majeur?
Just do chargeback on your credit card. Ryanair customers did, although their credit cards were banned by Ryanair but who cares in an era that you can create credit cards on your phone
Yes and also because the tickets were, at the time, bought through Kiwi. They refused to give credit. We walked away from so much money. But Luft was super good. We had brought my mother to us in Estonia for her 70th birthday. She couldn't fly home because she needs assistance (she has MS). Lufthansa would sell her a ticket but the German airports were only allowing people to travel if the trips were less than 24 hrs. She lives in Western Canada. Every ticket was, with layovers, 28 to more in travel time. So Lufthansa held the ticket until she could travel within the restrictions. KLM reimbursed me back in credit for two trips to London and that was good. The rest? Baltic and Ryan sent us coupons for something stupid like 50 bucks and they had to be used by a particular time period which expired due to the differing travel restrictions throughout the world. As such, we were never able to use them. Plus one of my kids graduated in Canada in 2020. I had to miss the flight and miss the graduation, despite being booked, because of travel restrictions. WestJet only reimbursed us back 50% of that flight and only, again, if used by a particular time. This wasn't possible with the quarantine times instituted in Canada. We also had a trip to the States during that time and again, couldn't get reimbursed for that as they (I think it was Spirit for the US part of the Journey) just refused. It should be noted that we only travel with Premium Economy if the airline covers it so it's not a question of cheap economy seats. We hired one of the law firms that fight for your refunds and they were only able to recover a small portion of that money. BTW - class actions are only an American thing. We don't even have that in Canada. We have co-filers for actions but your style of law isn't similar to most other countries. The EU protects some things with their airline legislation but it's very difficult to get your money back if the cause is out of their control. In fact, we are going through exactly the same issue now because we were stuck in Munich in December of this year. Blizzard shut down the airport and the airlines are fighting everyone for hotel and meal reimbursement. Because there is no way I am living at an airport for 3 days. They even pulled all their staff so you were just stuck on the phone, which they wouldn't answer. Terrible customer service. And that was Lufthansa surprisingly. We did however go to the Ricky Gervais show and he was stuck as well so clearly the airlines do not play favourites. All that being said, we are part of the thousands who do still travel, and did so during the pandemic as well, observing the quarantines of course. But we walked away from thousands of dollars. So we only book with the large carriers directly now. @@bigbaddms
Tried. Unsuccessful@@GreenOliveBranch
Some US airlines need to code share with some bus companies. Or Brightline Florida out of Orlando.
Or use charteted buses like Amtrak does with the Through Way. In some markets dedicated rubber tired connections might make more sense and ate cheaper yo run.
I have NOTHING to do with aviation whatsoever. And I absolutely love both this guys channels✅️👍
Thanks for this video! I am a BIG fan of ultra-low cost carriers. While many of co-workers hiss and spit at the thought of flying Spirit, I always remind them that if they don't like the conditions, they shouldn't fly the budget airlines. They don't get Delta at Spirit prices.
Nevertheless, for some perspective, in the video he talks about the lag in returning to flying international by skittish travelers. In our experience (my company) it wasn't the travelers themselves but the company. We had eager travelers but company policies still restricting int'l travel. Also, we had many offices still working remotely even though air travel was approved, so there was no office to go to. I run the budget for our int'l division and air travel has only just begun to return to 2019 levels, way behind other travel.
A second item is a matter of my own perspective. USA's Southwest Airlines is often labeled as a "budget carrier", but I hesitate to call it that. Yes, its model is different from the big 3 (Delta, United, American), but it hardly fits the criteria of other budget carriers like Spirit, Frontier, and Allegient. For one thing, their prices are rarely lower than the big 3. I fly a fair amount (about 50 flights per year), but am extremely price-conscious as I work for a non-profit and want to stretch their dollars. With rare exceptions I never choose airline over cost just for personal benefit (e.g., frequent flyer miles, lounge access, etc.), and even those rare exceptions were not airline-related but timing/convenience where the lower cost was detrimental to the trip.
Although I live and travel between cities well-served by Southwest, only twice between 2002 and 2022 did I fly Southwest. That means out of 557 flights, only twice did I choose Southwest. Finally, the four-largest "ultra low cost" budget carriers in the USA make up less than 10% of the market combined, while Southwest is the NUMBER ONE domestic carrier (in most years), with 16% of the market by itself. With that much market penetration and prices that equal or exceed the majors, I hardly consider Southwest in the same family of "budget airlines".
But thankfully, maybe even more or most importantly, Southwest doesn't take you to the cleaners when booking flights, which distinguishes it from ANY airline that calls itself "budget". On Southwest, in almost all cases the price you see on the screen is that same price you pay when you buy, which cannot be said for the ultra-low cost or even the majors. This has led to me flying Southwest 16 times in the last 13 months as their overall price has actually begun to be lower than even the ultra-low cost when bags, booking fees, seats, etc., are factored in..
Speaking of mergers and anything related, Hawaiian also got bought out by Alaska Air in Nov/Dec of 2023.
I hate the low cost carriers, it's such a nickel-and-dime BS. My siblings love them, I, on the other hand, don't fly much and when I do, I usually go 1st class or pay a lot of extra $$$ to get to the head of the line for Southwest. I'm 6'6" and most airline seats just S*CK. Years back, I had to sit in a middle seat in the back of an Airbus from ATL to SAN and told myself "never again!".
6' 5" here, was flying Delta from LAX to ATL for Thanksgiving. I dropped into the window seat and could barely breathe. I was smashed left, right, front, back and top. For the first time in my entire life, I had claustrophobia so bad, I couldn't sit. The seat was wedged so hard against my hips I couldn't even fully sit down. We hadn't even pushed back yet. It was sickening. There was 1 middle seat in an exit row, they moved me to. Between 2 huge guys. I ended up standing most of the flight, which was not too bad actually. The seats are medieval torture devices now.
As commercial air travel has taken the same route as the Greyhound Bus, it’s definitely not a pleasure to fly any longer.
I know swapping an engine is labor intensive, but when an engine manufacturer releases a bad engine (or part of the engine), I feel they should be held at least partially responsible and have to loan the engines to get at least a percentage of the grounded planes back to flying.
My understanding is that most engines aren't purchased as much as having a perpetual maintenance contract with the manufacturer.
We fly Allegiant a lot and have always had a great experience!
This man deserves a phd in anything airtravel.
Southwest has to love that they are still considered a low cost little upstart, when they are one of the largest airlines in the US. They do push that narrative, to allow them to charge more and still charge for every little added convenience. Although it's kind of nice, because United just shoves their boot up your rear end, then berates you for not being appreciative of United's stellar hospitality.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but Southwest is one of the few airlines that doesn't seem to be trying to take more money from me for every little thing. The biggest example is no charge for your checked suitcase. On my last few trips with Southwest I don't recall paying anything more than what I paid for the base ticket for the entire flight and that ticket price was a lot less than Delta, United, and American. I've also found that with Spirit - once you pay all the extra fees - the total cost is more than Southwest. To top it off, I've always had good experiences with Southwests employees.
I think that you explain those problems really well. To the point that I felt guildty fot not going any ******* where and not helping the poor airlines to fill the seats.... :/
What a bad person I am.
I don't know if I would exactly classify JetBlue as a total leisure airline anymore. With the newer premium class Mint Suites and service they have been able to capture a lot of business travelers away from the legacy airlines.
You must be a B6 crewmember.....
for a flight im taking in a couple of months...
Frontier flight was cheaper, but seat selection and bags added over $100
Southwest flight was more expensive, but not paying for the luggage actually made it cheaper.
The ULCC are charging such high fees these days that their total cost to fly are costing MORE than regular carriers. But it varies, my flight to my destination i will not have anything more than a personal item which makes it cheaper to fly there, but on return i will have my luggage and its cheaper to take a different airline.
in the past, i would just use frontier round trip (mainly because it was the drastically cheaper non stop option out of 2 non stop options), as seat and carryon costs were cheaper and make it worth it.
another factor with low cost carriers....you tend to get more low class and ghetto passengers and people will pay extra to not deal with that.
ULCC carriers have the WORST quality of seats, and when you factor the extra costs for seats and bags going sky high, its comparable to delta or united etc in cost and people are comparing much more too.
Something else i noticed, the ULCCs to some destinations have layovers that are excessively long compared to others, and many people do not want to sit at the airport for 4-9 hours compared to 1-2 hours.
Oh, finance… A large company is not really defined by what they do (produce), but also from stock value, rentals, contracts, debt profile or asset management.
Meaning “things” that happen on a corporate (also state/public/policy) and macroeconomic level where most “customers” have very little influence.
What we don’t seem to learn from 2008-9 or 2020-22 is how this huge (and growing) part of the global economy (finance) influences people way more than mere “supply & demand” for i.e. passenger flights.
This is not a Washington, London or Brussels issue, otherwise these challenges would have been isolated to some countries. That is why (in my opinion) finance and internal trust in financial values “regulates” markets way more than any single OECD government can. Not to say that politicians don’t want to either…
…if they or the national treasury also own shares and assets…? 😅👍
Air Canada has started acting like a low cost carrier but with higher fares. You pay the high fare and they make you pay on top for absolutely everything else including luggage. Very frustrating as a passenger.
Can you cover the collision between the Japanese coast guard plane and the Airbus when more is known? Also the blown out (unused) door on the 737-9 max over Portland?
Good video, as always. A suggestion, could you maybe do a video on Icelandair, a Boeing customer for 70 years, decision to switch to Airbus?
I don't really have much of an opinion on Low-Cost Airlines as the last time that I flew was on a return flight from Chicago, IL to Sea-Tac, WA with Southwest Airlines during the early 2000's. Price was reasonable, staff were helpful, pilots knew what they were doing, and there were minimal delays in departing or arriving. I've only recently heard about what was going on with Southwest during the infamous 2022 winter, that was quite a mess to say the least. Can't really say anything about other Low-Cost Airlines outside of Southwest as I haven't flown on them, only hear about the various "horror stories" from other people (former crew members, passengers, staff, pilots) during my commute and during my shift at a museum.
Jeez, I'm totally confused. I've a friend who's a pilot for Spirit and it's a bit unsettling to see this confusion in the their situation as well as in that of the industry in general.
I haven't flown with any low cost carriers yet. But thats because out of my airport. They dont go to where i want to. Except for 2 routes and if you add baggage and the other markups . They are more expensive then delta.
Can you make a short clip on current event like this past week there are two air accidents. Just a short of your opinion 🙏🙏🙏
In the UK, airlines were quick to say how they were struggling during covid and require a government bailout but when covid ended they were reluctant to offer cheap tickets. The hypocrites. Airlines would rather have seats go empty than give you a ticket for less. The UK airlines were very quick to blatant price gouge over the Christmas and New Year period.
They're doing fine. Frontier recently made $300 worth of fraudulent charges on my credit card. I asked them to refund the charges. They said, "we're so sorry, but we're an economy airline, so no."
Petter, you hit the nail on the head when you said that every airline is at a different point on the roller coaster.
Hi Petter, greetings from Argentina, again.
I wish you and your family a wonderfull 2024.
Here I am once more to do a suggestion: would you consider on making a research and a video of the aviation industrie ("normal", Low Cost and U. Low Cost) in South America? The reason I´m asking is because our new President declared "Open Skys" to our country and i presume this will afect not only Argentina as the rest of the region as well.
In other matters, I´m still asking if you are considering on making a video from the LAPA 3142 accident occurred in Aug 31 1999 in Aeroparque airport, Buenos Aires.
Cheers from NE Patagonia.
A lot of pilots are leaving low cost airlines for legacy airlines as well, thus costing the low cost airlines more money for pilot turnover costs. They pay a hug toll when they train/type a pilot, only for that pilot to leave for a legacy soon after training. Im surprised this wasnt mentioned in the video. Almost half of my indoc class at my legacy was ulcc guys.
Have you seen the contracts? Not to far off legacies. If I was in the top half of Spirit I wouldn’t move for a worst quality of life only to make it up in the backside of my career. Plus AA may not even be around if we have one more major event with their debt load. So that only leaves Delta and United as viable options. Now if I was a 3 year spirt FO then I would make the move up. QOL is everything and pay is secondary in my opinion. No difference in your QOL making 30k-50k more year at that tax bracket.
Could higher interest rates also have a larger impact on LCCs, e.g. if they‘re more highly leveraged/indebted? No idea how an airlines balance sheet look like though, just a thought.
Are the LCCs and ULCCs really a better value? It seems like once you fully book they aren’t that much cheaper than mid tier airlines like Jet Blue and Southwest.
JSX vs American and Southwest would be interesting. I haven't flown JSX yet but I'm looking forward to finding an excuse to do so.
Enjoy flying JSX from BJC. It cots more but when you account for time and cost of rideshare or parking it's worth it.
I flew Spirit once from Pittsburgh to Orlando. Never again! For it's Southwest or bust. I would put Southwest in the same category as JetBlue.
Hallo Peter to Hank you for the great videos you are making!
I’m lately was very interested in airships and blimps and was wondering if you would like to make a video about it. 😉
I was checking Allegiant prices and they seem quite a bit higher at least flying out of PSC.
Also at the end of pandemic first time flyers with Covid checks were using that money to fly to Vegas (where I work) and Orlando on frontier allegiant and spirit
I think there is a cultural thing with Southwest both within their employee force and their customers. They’re just different 👌
Not so much anymore. Their employees are generally unhappy and trying to strike etc. Use to be true but that's changed pretty radically in recent years.
@@johniii8147 hate to hear that. I just follow one of the ground guys on FB that seems totally enamored with SW
@@walk4718 it’s Facebook he’s trying to get promoted, but it’s well-known very unhappy labor groups these days
Whats the fuel burn difference between the 320 NEO and the 321 NEO?
Allegiant has a significantly different business model than the other carriers and does very well. It is not comparable to Frontier or Spirit.
Thank you very much for bringing up this discussion! - Yes, well, it´s a complicated story with an Open-End.🙂
My pleasure!
@@MentourNow🙂
From what I understand is that Breeze is attempting to do what Ryanair and Easyjet did in the late 90s/early 2000s when the cheap jetset kicked off. Find local regional airports and use those as destinations for larger cities/hubs. Once the popularity of the cheap jetset really gained strength, cheap air carriers like the ones above tried to find efficiences by using larger aircraft, to reduce flight numbers, gate fees, fuel fees etc while carrying the same or more passengers (I call this the generation 1.0 of this strategy). Now that those airlines have chosen this upgrade path, airline like Breeze is attempting the next generation of this strategy. What I find interesting (and only my opinion) is that this 'Generation 2.0' style wouldn't work in Europe. Given the transport links and now the lack of regional airports that are not utilised, there would be very little room for these types of airlines over here. It will be very interesting to see if this business model will take off (pun intended) in the US, where the lack of other transport modes, the prevalence of connecting flights and the often under represented idea of building local airports to generate demand (due to the great natural space of the US.
Apologies for the long post!
Having planned multiple trips around America post pandemic and often seeing routes from Spirit, Frontier etc being offered, I just couldn't work out why you would fly with them unless you literally planned on taking nothing but yourself there. Not markedly cheaper than any other company once fees are baked in, bad flight times and bad airports around major cities. Compare that to Southwest's offering, or Alaska/JetBlue on each coast, and legacy and there's just no reason to go with them
Southwest offers good pricing. Sometimes you add up all the fees on allegiant, spirit, frontier and sometimes all those fees add up to more than the Southwest ticket where bags fly free. I also think that JetBlue offers a better product than Spirit.
Most of the airline staff and crew here in the US are outstanding!
the LCCs and commuter operators are facing another problem - finding pilots. the Majors have been hiring pilots at an insane rate for the past year+ and will likely continue for a few more years. my best estimate is over 1000 pilots / month being hired by the 4 USA major airlines ( AA,DL,SW,UA) and the supply of replacement pilots is nowhere near that quantity
Now I wonder why in the US they call it ultra low cost when costs are higher compared to the low cost carriers in Europe.
Because ATC and airports are not privatized in the United States, and the distances between airports are much larger.
A low cost carrier in the USA would be southwest or blue jet where bags and amenities are still free. Spirit and frontier would be ulcc.
It really depends, I was able to find a round trip from EWR to MCO (almost 1,000 miles) for $40... Travel with no bags and that's the real price! Lol
i routinely fly to mco from the northeast (about 1000 miles) for $20-$40.
When it comes to low cost airlines, I worry about them removing vital things for being safe when flying. For example low employee wages and overworked employees can also be a problem if an employee is driving a vehicle (for example the one that carries baggage to the aircraft) is too tired and my drive incorrectly. There is also the risk of avoiding proper inspections on things that can break such as those recent 737 incidents...
please a size compaction of al plains from all current main factories
It always makes me wonder why so few airlines hedge their fuel purchases. There have been times when Southwest was paying less than half the spot rate for fuel. While sometimes they are overpaying as well (that is the nature of betting on commodity futures prices) what it will do is give stabilization to their fuel cost so they don't get fuel shock surprises.
imagine an airline had millions (or billions) of dollars in fuel futures. Then the government announces a world wide lock down of "two weeks" that turns into 2 years. Oil futures actually went NEGATIVE $18 (by my memory). Meaning you had to actually PAY $18/barrel for someone to take it for free. It's $74 currently for a barrel, so if you went long on ONE single contract, and ended up having to pay $18 for someone to take it, you'd lose $92/barrel on each contract. A contract is 1000 barrels so that would be $92,000 lost for EACH contract you were long. It would be losses in the 10s or 100s of Billions of $ for a major carrier. They are only hedging, which means partially offsetting their increased costs. But what happens if the whole market drops out?