Are Pistol Lights Overrated? Response to Ken Hackathorn
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- čas přidán 9. 07. 2024
- Recently, Ken Hackathorn had an...opinion. Shan responds! What do you think, should we be carrying with a light?
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Positive ID is overrated. I always shoot wildly into the night and hope for the best. Works 60% of the time, every time.
True professionals use muzzle flash to identify their target!
So you enjoy flagging people with your firearm in order to identify?
So much for weapons safety rule #2.
Go on with your tacticool self.
Perfect
@johnb3685 What do you scream while you are mag dumping?
"Yippee ki yi ya MF...ER"
or
"GET SUUUM" ?
@@barfo281goofy ass fudd 💅
A tool is a tool. It doesn’t make you shoot better. It gives you better visibility which allows you acquire your target quicker and faster. For my wife it gives her more confidence because what she’s lighting up is what is in her sights to shoot.
During my time (25+) in public safety, LEO, security, Fire/Rescue, emergency management I've learned one thing. You never have enough light.
"Always carry with one in the chamber, you never know when you won't have a free hand to rack a slide!"
"Why would you want a light on your pistol? Just carry a flashlight!"
It's amazing how often these two statements are said by the same person.
I always thought that ONE IS NONE AND TWO IS ONE! So have both a weapon and handheld light is ideal. Thank u for making a video speaking the truth about what Ken and Paul thoughts on handgun lights.
How many people do you know carry a weapon light and a hand held at the same time? Short answer is ZERO. Most people who carry weapons mounted lights are Tacticool kids who mostly can’t shoot anyway.
Years ago, the police department I worked for got a new Chief. He was an old school guy. I was on dayshift @ the time, but had a light on my pistol. The Chief noticed this &, in a “you must be stupid” voice said, “why do you have a light on your gun?! You’re on dayshift!” I explained that there were times that I went into buildings that were dark. When clearing that building & it was necessary to have my pistol out, I wanted to be able to identify my target but have my hands free to get a good grip. He scoffed and walked out. 2 weeks later he had ordered all new duty gear that included a holster that would not accept a weapon light.
Off-duty, I currently do not carry a pistol with a light. Not because I am against it, but I have not found a holster that is comfortable. I have not tried Werkz holsters yet. That’ll be my next holster purchase
@brandoncollins3851 The largest police force in the United States doesn’t allow weapons mounted lights to this day for regular beat cops.
I look for every advantage. Thankful that my current department is forward thinking
Tenicor Lux 2 is absolutely incredible. Very customizable and makes my G19 feel like nothing on my hip. Would recommend
How did the werkz work out.
@@agunther08 I have not bought one.... yet
Ken Hackathorn is a legend around here. He is a lifetime member of our local gun club. It was here where he started the SWAT team and helped start IDPA. He really is what you call an expert. So I’m a little surprised to hear him say, not that pistol lights are overrated, but not saying you need a handheld too.
Imagine lighting up your threat, even indirectly, to discover it’s a police officer. I realized about a year after carrying your Werkz for my 17 that I absolutely wanted a handheld for my first choice PID. I also know that once I’ve decided to go on target that equally bright pistol light with laser will be either momentarily on or full on. There’s a decent chance that handheld light will be dropped at that point so I have a 2-hand grip. Especially if it’s more than one attacker or I need one arm to keep an attacker off my shooting hand just long enough to pull the trigger.
I think your best statement was the fact that this is a false dichotomy it’s not an either or decision. If I had to choose pistol light only or handheld and pistol, I would probably say handheld, but no way I’m gonna give up the pistol light if I have a choice. Thankfully people make Holsters for this option.
Great video and discussion about this subject Shan. I am always amazed at the trained and experienced "there is only one way" crowd. Having a secondary hand held light is a great option but a weapon mounted light is always there. Have both.
Thank you for your kind feedback!
I originally bought a light for my carry gun, but then realized I am not very often in a situation that it is that dark that its necessary. It still might be helpful do disorient an attacker, but i decided it wasnt necessary and will stick to no light in the ccw. Bedside gun is a whole different story of course.
Same here. I dont look down on people who do, i just prioritize comfort and concealable more.
@@bobbylee9862 I don't look down on any responsible gun owners, but I don't appreciate people saying their way is the only way to go. To each their own.
Balancing your context and circumstances as your own and not dictating them onto everyone else? Outstanding!
@martink3504 You have put more thought into this than the originator of the video and 99% of the people in the comments combined. You can’t really get charged with a felony for brandishing a weapon in your own house. You will absolutely get charged with felony brandishing if you do in the street what the video suggests. You will lose your gun and your precious light even if you are not convicted and if you are convicted you will likely get at least a year in the county if you don’t go to prison.
Doesn't your bedroom have a lamp and a light switch , far better illumination and it lets the bad guy know you know he's there , why sneak around when you're going to be verbally warning said bad guy of his mistake , the police have been notified , you're armed and it would be in his best interest to leave the same way he came in !
To be honest, I have been reconsidering whether a light is really worth it on a CCW, considering the extra weight, bulk, and cost it adds. I'm virtually never out somewhere after sunset that doesn't have enough ambient light, especially considering that a real threat would most likely be within 10 yards.
This is excluding the home defense setting, which I consider a light absolutely mandatory.
But it's a tradeoff with CCW, when size, weight, and comfort are such major factors.
Absolutely
Do both. It only takes seconds to mount/unmount. I keep a WML on my PDP when in my nightstand. I take it off when I carry to avoid the bulk and weight, but I do always have a pocket light. I can’t imagine an instance when carrying in public that a WML would be necessary. Sure it’s another tool. Same could be said for a bayonet. But I’m not mounting a 12” bayonet to my PDP and opt for a pocket knife.
It’s not
I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. As for "doesn't help you shoot better", it does add weight to the end of the barrel to aid in muzzle flip reduction which should allow faster follow up shots theoretically.
Unfortunately, people fight for relevancy, and I feel like that is what these gentlemen were doing with this.. I do not use my weapon light to change tires however, I do have it
Excellent video! The only arguments against carry a WML, are in actuality arguments not to use it incorrectly.. a WML gives you extra tools and options.
But his use of the weapon is a felony in every jurisdiction in the United States unless he is inside his own property. If you walk outside your curtilage and wave that gun around looking for a target you have just committed felony brandishing of a deadly weapon and because it is a firearm you will get firearms enhancement in many places. Context matters but the Tacticool Kids like this Bozo don’t get that. The Tacticools who have never actually been tactical are the worst.
I carry my guns deep in the woods out in the middle of nowhere during the pitch dark of night, with dangerous animals around that could be sniffing my space for food.. I'm going to have all the lights possible
They are literally NOT TALKING TO YOU or ABOUT YOU. How can you dim wits not get this? They are talking to the average person who is carrying a weapon mounted light on a carry gun. If you wave a weapon mounted light around in the middle of the street, your ass is going to jail and even if you are not convicted you WILL NEVER get your gun or your light back.
I'm rarely in situations where I'm out and about at night time and would need a light, yet I still have a light on my CCW.
I have noticed ZERO difference in weight, bulk or general carry-ability since I attached that light about 6 months ago. I forget it's there until I pull my gun out. Why would I ever NOT have one?
"I don't shoot at shit in the dark." ~ Clint Smith. This one isn't complicated. Seeing things is good. WML for the win.
Ceiling light or lamp for the win ! They're better illumination , other just use flash lights at home !
i have looked around but what holster of your do you suggest for a hellcat pro and what light do you suggest so all that fits nicely. also appendix carry and a enclosed red dot. what would you suggest and would the holster go with all that
I always carry a light in my pocket but I also always have a weapon light on my handguns and rifles that I carry. Great video as always
As a 60 year old shooter who LOVES WC ar’s and Sig grip modules, springs, etc…. I’m done with the WC FUD’s!!! It’s time for Hack, Howe, and the rest to go to the “Old Shooter’s” rest home.
PID, positive identification, is a real thing in combat
You made me an own holster I want to say around 2017, when you were lesser known and seemingly starting out, still use it sround my farm to this day. Awesome to see you guys doing well!
Thanks for supporting us then and now! 2017 is definitely early in terms of our product development maturity. I want us to keep driving to produce the best quality holsters we can, so we can support folks like you even better! Blessings!
I agree Ken is out of touch but Paul just highlights the dangers of flagging freindlies. He trains law enforcement and if those guys will shoot at falling acorns I think he's right about using handhelds 🤷♂
Yeah, I didn't "get" their commentary from the jump. With even a relatively inexpensive olight bladr s... I walk into a room with 800lm at the low ready, and I've pretty well illuminated the entire room. Sure, I might sweep the floor closer to something I want to see in detail, but that's about the extent of it. I don't know if they have old incandescent flashlights from the 1980's mounted on their guns or what...?
You’re spot-on why not have a free hand when a light is needed. Even if you’re investigating in a dark condition with a hand light, you can then drop the hand light if you find yourself in a life threatening situation. Then continue with two hands on the weapon if necessary and identify your target especially if on the move.
As trainers who bas3 their knowledge on 60s, 70s, and 80s knowledge, tactics and technology, it should come as no surprise that these fudds don't get it.
Really makes guys like Clint Smith that much more impressive, he is from the old school yet he is constantly evolving, learning and growing as necessary.
Long Live Thunder Ranch.
Twenty years ago I thought night sites were the cat's meow. Today I could care less about night sites. You have a moral duty to identify your target before pulling the trigger. In the dark that requires a light and training. I carry a hand light in addition to a firearm with a light.
Good discussion. I always find it interesting when I hear “I like this”, and stick with it no matter what, so it’s a personal opinion? Opinions are like onions. They spell similarly, usually have many layers, and tend to make people cry.
I'm not Law enforcement or currently serving but I am a veteran. My current job has me going to many gas/convenience stations many times at all hours of the night when I'm on call and I often come home well after dark. Worse yet a power outage is a very real possibility in my line of work. A weapon light was the FIRST thing I bought before even the pistol. Werkz videos even helped me pick out my TLR-1HL. To me a weapon light is not merely critical, it is essential and is only to be used when I need my weapon.
Everyone knows that only cops and soldiers are attacked at night. Criminals know the rules that they’re only supposed to do bad things to civilians in broad daylight.
Those guys seem like they've reached the stage where they're either too lazy to keep up with tech or their egos won't let them.
Ego. Paul is an absolute type person
So my manager is also an instructor/teacher, and he knows Ken. He summarized it like this, "Ken is right, even when he is wrong" and that really tells you the importance of not blindly believing someone just because of their "track record".
I'm a believer that a light and a dot on a pistol are mandatory. But, I also carry a handheld light.
Absolutely!
This is the way
This is the way
Why? I will tell you right now that a dot is wildly overrated for home use ESPECIALLY in combination with a flashlight. The fact that you don’t know that tells me you have never shot a dot light combo in the dark. Most of the clowns on here including the originator of the video have probably never actually shot in the dark. It is an entirely different experience and I will tell you my bedside gun absolutely doesn’t have a dot on it and my carry gun absolutely does have a dot but absolutely doesn’t have a flashlight.
I want both hands on my gun, u are handicapping yourself having a handheld in one hand and a gun in the other
Having shot competitively for over 25 years, some of which includes night matches, it is my opinion a weapon mounted light increases target identification speed and follow up shots. I have seen numerous shooters loose their grip on a hand held light costing a great deal of time to reacquire their target. Reloads are very difficult while trying to hold a light. As a trainer, we tell people to "know their target". We also tell them the first well placed shot in gun fight usually wins the fight. A weapon mounted light helps greatly in solving all these concerns. As with most things, training is key.
As to carry - I frequently carry a G19/Olight Balder S in a Werkz OWB holster. I can't say I can tell any difference in having the light and not. The holster is comfortable and very fast. You can't go wrong with a Werkx holster!
Calling a pistol light a gadget is ignorant of the its designed purpose and benefits over a separate flashlight. Also in court you will be drilled on your ability to know what you shot was a threat, thus, a pistol light.
The Fudd patrol at Wilson Combat are really cranking out the idiocy lately, aren’t they?
You might ought to listen to people who know more than you do. But you don’t so you will eventually suffer the consequences. In this case it is called felony brandishing of a deadly weapon.
@@kevinallies1014 Who’s talking about brandishing a weapon? Try to stay on topic. And you’re making a whole lot of assumptions about my training and learning without knowing a single thing about me. Joe Biden has been doing politics for over 50 years. Does that mean just because he!s been doing it forever that he knows which end is up? Have fun blindly following people using the “authority” argument. That’s called a logical fallacy. Look it up. Haven!t heard much from Mr. Hack-a-thorn since he let his mouth overload his ass. Guess WC figured they’d cut their losses and keep him from spouting ignorance.
MAN, solid video. I definitely follow Wilson Combat’s CZcams channel for the shear wisdom of Ayood and Hackathorn.
I carry a stock, unaltered firearm from the manufacturer - purely for the potential District Attorney or jury who would use my firearm against me on “evil” appearance as an added argument. It’s a reality; it’s brain dead logic to us; but, that’s just what it is.
But, since Ken’s recent, now unlisted video - man, I’m telling you, I’ve seen nearly all of the counter-arguments for lights, red dots, etc.
I may not be part of the red dot camp for carry - but, for sure, I am seeing the benefits to a weapon-mounted light more and more, because of the mass reaction and points made just like yours. SOLID video. God bless, brother. 🇺🇸
Are there any plans to add Foxtrot 2R as an option for a Glock 43X/48 MOS?
I carry a full size Beretta APX a1 in a M6 Outlier because it was the most affordable quality holster. I even have a big ol' break on it. The Outlier is a great holster, and I'd like to get an OWB one
Really Like my Werkz IWB holster for my Walther PDP with a Surefire X300 Turbo (my CCW weapon of choice).
Both parties make salient points, great video! Saw one of your holsters for the first time today great quality and thoughtful design.
I’m inside by 8:00pm. I don’t need a light. I don’t need a light when I’m inside the evening news.
Ken is just jealous of people who can comfortably appendix carry an X300.
Obviously
I am jealous that people can appendix carry.... but beer is more important lol.
@@ofcrwoof6308 I am 280 lbs and drink beer religiously, but I also lift and run a lot. I'm also naturally very barrel chested which helps a lot. Sometimes it's just luck of the genetic draw.
Appendikhead carry is a fad started by tacticool DBs who watched too many urban gangsta movies. Y'all are clowns.
@barfo281 well okay then
For ccw I don’t think it’s necessary. I’ve likely identified the threat with my handheld long before I ever went for my gun. In that instance the wml becomes an afterthought. Do I think it’s a bad thing? No I just don’t think it’s as necessary as ppl think it is. For a duty type role such as leo then yes bc you’re much more likely to draw your gun and hold on a target. Just my opinion I’m not for or against them but I do think they are slightly overrated in todays gun culture
They’re correct. WML is overrated. That being said, having a WML can still be useful. The problem is, some people believe that not having a WML on your carry pistol as a concealed carrier will get you killed. At the same time, out of the many shootings that we can see on the internet, it’s very tough (I’ve seen none) where a concealed carrier actually needed a WML. This (placing a lot of stress on the need for something that we can’t actually find applied examples where it was needed) means that the equipment is overrated. That doesn’t mean it’s stupid or useless. It can be both okay to carry and generally overrated.
I use to think weapon mounted lights were needed for EDC etc. I don't think so now. Even for Home is a stretch, handheld light is just more safe identifying targets. However, they're not completely pointless.
Your answer is kind-of weird....and somewhat contradictory : If you need to "identify targets" it means you have your gun in your hand - why would you be calling what you where searching as "targets" if not?.....if you need to identify targets - you have your gun out - then, both hands on the gun are a huge advantage than only one hand,why would you handicap yourself by using one hand for a light and one for the gun? - as he mentioned in his video - point it up and illuminate a whole room with the "umbrella technique" - in this way you are not pointing your gun at someone you may not want to - if safety is so much of a concern that you can come up with that yourself 😁😁😁 - but, yes - training is need it and not many are willing to put the work in it...
Maybe looking like the Monopoly Guy unlocks night vision augmentation?
Ken and Paul have forgotten more about shooting I will ever know and much respect to them both. However times change, some minds do not. To each their own. I carry both ways. Without a light for the deepest carry, light for everything else. Even if it’s to add weight up front and nothing else. Werkz, I love your products and videos. Keep it up! And get Jameson on more. And pls come out with a 365xmacro foxtrot 2r owb holster 😊
Thank you.
Love Werkz, Hackathron is full on FUDD.
If a person has never used a pistol on a two way range, they should stick to giving advice on winning competitions.
I see Lucas being like this in 40 years.
Charlie liked us to use the searchlights on our tanks to sight us in. That is why we flicked them on and off.
Phenomenal response!!
Good critique homie. Paul and Ken are very antiquated in their thinking. Way to debunk their garbage talk.
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU! A light is a great addition to have. Thx
My light does help me shoot my g19 better with the added weight it reduces recoil.
Pro tip: Work on recoil management instead of buying gimmicks to skip on training.
@@kevinallies1014 ok, I see ur hurt about a bunch of comments on here. Don’t worry guy, you/we’ll be alright. Make some vids or post ur credentials, pro.
I think Ken made some good points and lots of folks got their feelings hurt. I don't need or want a light, laser or dot on a ccw. To each their own.
People forget that another advantage to a high power light is to blind the target, at minimum for the few seconds it takes to ID or get effective rounds on target.
Use it or don’t, sometimes it’s not tactically sound to use. Police use of weapon lights is not necessarily the same as a civilian/homeowner use. But that all depends on the situation and what your strategy is based on floor plan, family members etc.
Excellent response video, you covered all the points I would make. I respect both Ken and Paul, but this time they are way off. My recommendation is get some good training using both a handheld and a weapon mounted light and decide for yourself what is best for you.
There's more going on than illuminating to see if there's a person there or not, but also what they have in their hands.
That could be the difference between no charges, and prison.
Hackathorn cant think outside the box. Stubborn one way thinker. Both hands on the gun for more points of contact, stability, etc. After 30 years as a police officer and 18 years on SWAT, I question Kens symantics.
Still waiting for that OWB>P365X Macro>Foxtrot 2R Holster from y'all.
Was kind of bummed when I bought that pistol light combo for a family member then found out you guys don't offer ANY OWB holsters that will fit that set up.
A big factor in my choosing to go with that pistol/light combo was the video where Shan was saying they'd have Holsters for that combo (he said Holsters plural not holster)
It’s better to have and not need, than need and not have.
That drop on an empty chamber in the beginning.... i see you 👀🤣
Red dots are what we should be talking about when saying over rated….
I’m glad with people with a good platform are putting out videos in direct objection to Ken Hackathorn and his fudd videos. I want to scream at my phone when I watch his videos. It’s a shame that people listen to that and run with his logic. Great Video.
I hope Hackathorn has your cellphone number in his Rolodex. 🤣🤣
It just smacks of boomers gatekeeping. I'm an LEO and if someone asked me if they should add a light to their handgun, I'd say go for it if you can afford it and can find a good holster. Like Shan said, WML have come so far now that there is little reason not to have one if you have the means to obtain one. They don't add that much weight or bulk and in the worst case scenario, it is better to have one and not need it then need it and not have it. There are definitely situations where going to your handheld may not be to your advantage. Regardless of the situation, PID is paramount and having a readily available light source that isn't tied to a support hand role will always be preferable, to me, than relying solely on a handheld.
Do you also have a wml on your off duty edc gun?
Yes.
If you are persuing me in the dark PLEASE have a light.
Don't buy gadgets. Buy $4,000 safe queens that are arguably less reliable than the top 10 pistols being sold today.
If you are a defensive shooter, you won’t have time to ID, if they are a threat, they obviously can see you so you can see them.
In the home, a) you should be using your rifle with a light. b) if you can’t own a rifle, use a shotgun with a light c) if you only have a pistol for home defense, 100% you need a light.
There is a difference between NEED and USEFUL. Do you NEED a light on gun? Maybe not. Is it useful? Definitely.
People also said you don't need AR for hunting, or large magazine for home defense.
There are these so-called "gun lovers" who step on others right of ownership and others' way of use based on their lack of knowledge or simply being stubborn.
It's why we see our gun rights shrunken so much over the years.
About the light tho, it actually can make you shoot better or say faster, because of the additional weight to the front. Same function as tungsten guide rods. It's why you see in USPSA CO group all those people add tungsten fake lights (well, "functional" because they have a useless tiny LED).
Well done. By the way, Werkz makes the best holsters out there.
That was a masterful and tasteful takedown of the fuddery and race to irrelevance mission Hacky Thorn has been pursuing for years. He's just gotten worse. You nailed every point,. They never heard of that "Ayoob" method? Anything done with irons I can do better with optic, and I still have my irons. Wilson makes it rich selling optic and railed handguns.
I really hope Paul covers this topic more in depth on his personal channel.
By far the best rebuttal I've seen to that silly Ken video. Very well done
Thanks!
I wouldn't say a weapon light is overrated, but they are dangerous. Pointing a loaded weapon to illuminate an area is dangerous and reckless!
I am of the mindset you point at what you are going to shoot, not point at what you want to see and then determine if you're going to shoot!
I hear the argument that the police and military do it, so we should also be able to do it! That is ridiculous; just because they do something terrible and wrong is not justification. When was a LEO, charged, arrested, and jailed for an accidental shooting? I see no tactile advantage to having a flashlight mounted to your gun. I am a huge advocate of laser dots.
lights add weight to the front of the weapon helping mitigate recoil it also has the ability to blind an enemy in the dark
Great points and very fair assessment in my opinion. I love ken, but you're 100% correct imo
Finally an educated and knowledgeable response to the fud lore being pushed around.
Everybody has there own opinion. I have to much respect for Ken to publicly feel the need to blast him over this.
I was an officer for an urban police department for 31 years. I used hand held lights on almost every shift, day or night. For about the last 10 years I had a light mounted on my pistol. I used the light many times while conducting building searches, high risk stops and other police business, but I never had to shoot anyone. The light adds capability and allows you better target identification. I’d rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.
@kevint1911 I am assuming that you didn’t actually watch this video and that you definitely didn’t watch the original video. Trying to look smart while looking really dumb doesn’t actually accomplish what you think it does.
You should take a look in the mirror.
Not once did I hear you give a reason why you should “Carry” a WML. For home defense it makes all the sense in the world. For a civilian carrying for self defense not so much. Reason being the only time that weapon comes out of that holster you have already identified the threat and are actively engaging it. If you pull that weapon and are searching with it outside the home you have already committed a criminal offense. WWL for home use, hand held for carry in public.
Why not both? What if your hand or arm is no longer functional, or you’re securing a loved one and only have one hand free to engage in a low light to dark setting in a public venue? What if the pocket light fails or gets dropped?
Practice one handed live fire drills at night with just a pocket light, then a WML, and then with both. Incorporate one handed reloading drills and/or malfunction drills with each set up.
If these "gadgets" are good enough for law enforcement; why shouldn't they be good enough for the rest of us?
I commented on one of Ken H's posts saying that he really dates himself by saying red dots and lights on pistols are fads. I was torn apart by his fan boys. I'm 60 and the green dot on my pistol allows me to shoot accurately even without my bifocal glasses. The light lets me illuminate what I shoot while holding the pistol with both hands. I carry a handheld light for searching for my keys and such but I like the ability to aluminate what I'm about to shoot. I don't see any of this as a gimmick or fad. It's allowed my 60 year old eyes to shoot the way I did at 30. How is that bad? Ken is really hurting the Ken Wilson brand. I own a SFT 9 and it's a beautiful pistol with no rail nor optic cut but I carry my Glock 19 MOS with a green dot and light in my Werkz holster.
I have a light on my house protective device, I can't see what I'm pointing at in a pitch black house,and it's also a force multiplier that light is brighter than the sun he would be blind as a bat and easier to control
Greetings! I think and I have flashlights in my weapons. These are valuable tools. I think that when it comes to weapons there are many misinterpretations and of course there are many who do things wrong, for example we must have a flashlight on the weapon and another in the non-right hand. The latter is what we would use to explore in search of a possible threat and it should not be kept on all the time since it exposes us, the same thing happens with the flashlight of the weapon or a laser, the same thing: there are people who do not like it or The Red Dot or extended parts because the chances of a jam are greater but it all comes down to a simple word PRACTICE this makes a difference practicing defense techniques with your tools make a difference
I’ve investigated numerous civilian shootings. Many occurred at night. Many were homicides (the shooter accomplished what they set out to do). I’ve yet to see one utilizing a weapon light. The fact of the matter is, it’s nice to have, not need to have. Unless you’re going out in the dark and looking for confrontation with the criminal element, LEO/MIL/security/etc, why would you waste the time, money, or comfort.
Home defense gun, absolutely. The pistol your shove inside your waistband, why?
Just go out and freaking train. Quit spending time and money on useless things. If you haven’t done it for real, keep it to yourself instead of theorizing.
So, let me get this straight, they want us, being woken up in the middle of the night to grab our bedside pistol, a hand held flashlight, our cell phone to call 911 if something is wrong, and maybe spare ammunition in a feeding device depending on the capacity of your gun and personal situation? With what hands? If you have a decent capacity bedside pistol with a WML, then you would only need 1 hand for a cell phone.
I just turn on the bedside lamp , crossing the room the wall switch activates a ceiling light that illuminates the hallway but then again I live in a modern 1940s that has electricity and not a cave !
@ImaOkie you do realize that there isn't a lightswitch for every room next to every doorway in every home, right? Also, what if you don't want a potential home intruder to know exactly where you are and the layout of your home (a ceiling light wont blind a potential home invader like a decently bright WML)? Why would you want to give up the home field advantage by turning on all the lights?
Love it. Each to their own.
For more context, Ken was talking about concealed carry in public. I've watched hundreds of citizen self defense videos in public on Active Self Protection and never seen someone use a gun mounted light. Can someone provide evidence of a citizen using a gun mounted light to identify their possible threat? I've seen a lot of people dogging on Ken but no one providing evidence of a concealed carrier using a gun mounted light. They've shown where people have shot a family member in their home but not the context of outside the home.
1) Treat every weapon as if it were loaded.
2) Never point your weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot.
3) Keep your finger straight and off the trigger until you're ready to fire.
4) Keep your weapon on safe (if equipped with a manual safety) until you are ready to fire.
"Forget #2, I'm just gonna put a light on my firearm and use that to point at people to identify them, even if it might not be someone I need to shoot." - Tacticool DBs.
Skill issue
Get some training! Learn what light spill is.
Point a gun in a safe direction and switch on the weapon-mounted light. You can make positive identification without pointing the gun at people.
@@charliefoxtrot5001Okay, tacticool clown.
You weirdos are dangerously dopey.
WILL NEVER GO WITH OUT A GUNLIGHT……FOR SURE A HOME DEFENSE GUN….
All depends on you and what your doing and where your going. I don't think it's at all necessary. Although I still do it, it's more for animals than anything else.
These guys perspective is from elite law enforcement and elite military. People think the job of law enforcement and the military is to protect. It is NOT. It was their job to control, not protect. From this perspective the tools of their profession are, at best, wasted on mere citizens and at worst actively detrimental to their professional goal. An armed society is not a polite society to these two. It's a professional nightmare. I don't think either of these two personally wish to be so exclusionary if they think it through but decades of professional experience at the highest levels are hard to compensate for especially when they relax. Just two very experienced pro's being a little fuddy.
Ken is more overrated than a light on a CCW. I can justify a light, but can’t justify relying on a handheld in a defensive situation. I ALWAYS have a handheld so that can’t be held against me in the court of CZcams.
Uh no. I carry lights on all my pistols. From my G26 all the way up to my G20 10mm. Lights also add weight to the front of a gun and reduce recoil, especially when talking about 10mm. I regularly EDC my Glock 20 with an IWB holster, which has a red dot and light. And yes I agree you should also carry a separate tactical hand held light.
Which light do you have on the G26?
I suspect that a lot of people are misunderstanding what he’s saying. I think he’s specifically talking about lights on the average typical concealed carriers pistol. Not the duty gun of a police officer or military person who may regularly work at night and specifically engage with hostile people as part of their job. Not what he calls a nightstand gun or home defense gun. He specifically says that these guns are a different story.
With that said, nowhere does he say you shouldn’t, or that only military and police should have lights. I think he’s simply trying to say that for the cc gun you slip into your pocket or on your belt, a mounted light is probably not going to be as useful as is commonly believed. The very definition of the word overrated. He just presents it in such a way that it’s obviously confusing people and it does come across as a pretty negative attitude.
You are in a building with low-light conditions and there is an active shooter situation. You draw your hand-held light and your firearm. You navigate though the building, needing to open doors with the hand you hold the flashlight with. A weapon-mounted light not only frees up that hand, but also enables you to operate the light with the gun hand when needed. Sounds pretty useful to me.
@@charliefoxtrot5001you a cop or military ? If not why go in looking for trouble ? Leave call authorities , jury won't give you break !
@@ImaOkie Leaving means being able to open doors! Calling 911 means having a hand free to do it! Trouble might find you!
Also, you will need to be able to live with the fact that you could have done something, but didn't. That decision is up to you.
Jury? Please get some training on the use of lethal force and its consequences. I highly recommend Andrew Branca's book on The Law of Self Defense.
Have you ever considered making your own lights? I understand manufacturing in the US is cost prohibitive without significant investment and outsourcing to foreign manufacturers may go against your values (plus they'll probably steal your designs), but with the amount of knowledge and experience Werkz has with weapons mounted lights I feel you would be able to develop an excellent product.
Thanks for the question; it's an interesting one. I think we know a thing or two about lights, but jumping into that manufacturing is (as you point out) a bit of a leap for us at this time. I'm honored you would ask, and honored you have confidence in our abilities!
@@WerkzHolstersThis is just me. I'm just one random dude on the internet talking out of his ass. For me when come to WML I like the laser + light combo. Now when come to these laser + light combo I prefer if the product wrap around the trigger guard..think of it something like Streamlight TLR6 or something.
Why do they condone military and police have mounted lights, but not civilians? They are wrong, and need their moral compasses checked .
Sights, then lights. Period
A few years ago Ken was in a video with Larry Vickers in the movie gun vault and while looking at the Chiappa Rhino, this mf'er really said "you ain't missing much" and I'm like "right because a 357 with half the recoil is just a dumb idea...idk dudes been losing it for awhile.
I’m not going to carry a hand held light and then throw it away only to activate my weapon light.
No-one says you should!