Another Sunni.. Hiding the Truth ft.
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- čas přidán 30. 09. 2023
- I went on a live stream on TheMuslimLantern's channel - which was titled "Non-Muslims ask any questions about Islam"
Since their sect doesn't consider us Muslims, due to the fact that Believing in GOD's book is not enough - I decided to try to engage in a friendly discussion with Muhammad Ali.
I had a good impression of him prior our discussion and I really believed we would be able to have a good discussion.
However, time after time, Sunni's treat us in one way.
Abusive, arrogant and manipulative.
• Arrogant Hadith Reject...
He posted our discussion, after he heavily edited it to deceive his viewers, and he conveniently cut out all the parts that shows him as a liar.
My brother's Charlie Channel
@IslamChannelUSA
/ @islamchannelusa - Zábava
Brother Muhammad, you really should have recorded your own version of the video. This is what happens when you don't. It's also what the BBC does in interviews, they edit.
Not just BBC, but virtually any mainstream media channel
@@sal_strazzullo this is what the kuffars do. A Muslim will never do it even he loses, because is not arrogant
You are right my brother
For people that claim that they believe in the Message of the Quran - I expected better... but I guess we both know
@@MuhammadfromGODthere was multiple cuts lol
The lantern guy forgot the most important question …. Where’s Mecca ?!
Hilarioooos
Muslim Lantern gave a full on response please check it :
czcams.com/video/1Gc0mbEqasg/video.html&ab_channel=TheMuslimLantern
Salam alaykom. I’m so happy to find someone talking about this in English, let show people the RIGHT ISLAM , Islam of the QURAAN, Allah taalaa’s words
Alf million alhamdo lillah
yup 3:18-20
I just wanted to add, I found your channel through that Muslim lantern video. I even left a comment but it got shadow banned. That's simply disturbing... Here is the comment in question :
"Been following Muhammed (The Muslim lantern) for roughly a year. Unsubbing after this video. I couldn't stand watching him interrupting the guy over and over again then deflecting into the pointless details like "what hour? 5:30pm?" and then strawmaning the half-finished sentence. You already know how the length of days work and how it changes depending on the season. If you are so confident in your position just let the guy make his point then refute it thoroughly, was really looking forward to actually understanding his point. Sad to say but this discussion made you sound like the insincere Christians you often debate. May Allah guide us All."
Peace.
You've been watching him a year and you've only just realised how deceitful he is?
I've been commenting on his videos about how deceitful he is for over a year. He consistently lies and misrepresents Christianity. I always leave comments asking why people still follow him even though he outright lies to his followers prolifically.
he cares about his looks more than the truth.
@@Al3XB85 I don't know whether he is or isn't lying about other stuff. The reason I was following The Muslim Lantern was because it was one of the channels that, by Allah's will, saved me from the depression and Nihilism that comes from being a religious person brought up in a secular society and academically indoctrinated into post-modernist nonsense.
To be honest the Christian channels I know of (Apostate Prophet, David Wood, Christian Prince) are far worse when it comes to misrepresentations but that's a whole other can of worms. May Allah (Allaha as Jesus would call Him) guide us All.
@@saidzihmmou6426 So it would seem sometimes....
@@eyashawk6283 you need to understand that these are poeple that cannot have logic altough they like to show to watchers that they have logic. a example is that the quran says there is no compulsion in religion, and the hadith say whoever leaves islam execute him. They will defend the hadith. instead of throwing that trash away and saying quran is our guide when its contradicting.
Secterians reminds me of vaxxinated people "follow and trust the science/gov. blindly '
it's safe and effective."
Exactly sis! We should just blindly accept the scholars!
"Trust the scholars" - those who divide the religion
Whenever you do a live with some of your Muslim dahwa please always take someone as evidence to records, they always say edited remove stuff and cut part they don’t like…
Questions :
Were there any sunnis when the prophet was alive ?
Was the prophet (pbuh) a sunni himself ?
According to the hadiths books, the prophet (pbuh) knew everything, then why he could not know what was going to happen to him as he had claimed it himself in the Quran ?
Did God send the Quran in a language that only expert theologists or scholars could understand ?
Do other sects of Islam understand the Quran? Or do they have to become sunnis to understand the message in verses of the Quran ?
So many puzzling questions !! Could somebody help please !?
Bro I wouldnt have found your channel without that debate, hopefully sincere people will look at the behavior of the host and evaluate their own conviction in the Hadith based off your arguments and their own investigation. May Allah bless you and guide us all inshallah.
czcams.com/video/1Gc0mbEqasg/video.html&ab_channel=TheMuslimLantern
he edited out everhtbing 🤣🤣🤣 Glory be to God almighty
Akhee ❤❤❤. I wish you happiness and strength. Patients and stoicism are your strong attributes. Smile at the knowledge you have akhee❤❤❤❤. AllahMaAk
Brother do screen recording while having debates
so this guy completely edits clips and then presented to his audience a clip of him literally fighting a strawman. this is just sad honestly no matter what your belief is. Muhammad keep doing what you're doing,
Alhamdulillah ...ya akhiy muhammad just tell to them the truth even though they dislike it...support you 100%
Hadith to Sunnis is like the Talmud of the Jews. Both read from other than the words of God. Both listen to the words of man who wrote with their own hands and desires.
Spot on!
For a moment I thought I wrote this comment. You are correct
Yes i swear to god You are Right brother ❤
exactly
Not All Hadith But Bukhari-Muslim Hadith
I like your videos, you're very open minded and willing to have civil conversations with people mA (mashallah).
Muslim lantern kept trying to act like he's stoic and not arrogant but he kept having a huge purposeful grin on his face every time Muhammad talked, showing he's already not genuine or listening and is thinking to himself "imma debunk this idiot" before he's even heard what Muhammad has to say, and of course interrupting him then telling him not to interrupt. Fake humbleness. He also acted like him correcting Muhammad's arabic is a "gotcha" when its both a red herring and ad hominem in one . This is typical sunni behavior, they will hug and be extra courteous to kafirs and non muslims but then show 0 respect to actual muslims they disagree with and commit takfir like its drinking water. When i pointed this out, one of his supporters replied to me saying fake muslims are a bigger threat to islam worst than non muslims therefor the priority should be to remove them from the fold before taking on actual enemies of God... And that right there showed to be why its been 1400 years and muslims have still failed to unite against Imperialism or Israel, instead we've been fighting each other for 1400 years in a never ending war
In regards to Lantern being arrogant and sarcastic and dishonest, Im a Christian who has been trying to point this out to his followers for over a year now
Are yall sided with Quranist now, to attack Muslims
@@Al3XB85Thanks for your attempts, but as you can see, they won't stop, and they are coordinated as I'm sure they have meetings and such where they teach each other how to debate other sects, other religions and so on. This is true for most religious and political organizations unfortunately, that's why it's better to be on the side of those who don't show those signs, those that are actually humble
@@Al3XB85 those guys like the Lantern that want to be seen as "learned" and "scholars", are literally like the Pharisees. They exist in all religions. Jesus has already exposed their behavior and their ways.
I'm a Muslim but I believe in what Jesus said, and I have learned a lot from the Gospels and the Bible in general.
@@Pendekar-1144 Its funny seeing you using a term which essentially means Follower of the Quran as a derogatory term, whos really attacking muslims? Plus, ive never seen any "Quranist" declare takfir on sunnis, cant say the same about sunnis they pretty much declare takfir on every non sunni and even within sunnism you have wahabis comitting takfir on regular sunnis lol
Stay strong and keep up the work 🙏 only god can help us and guide us
Look at how he edited and cut stuff he wants to prove he is right he does the same thing with Christian as well..
I watch him doing it so arrogantly..
I dont like the fact that the minute I would question the hadith I'm threatened with hellfire almost immediately and im not a muslim. What are you afraid of? Im simply asking questions and im curious I haven't even aligned with anyone to oppose you.
His attitude is really condescending and narcissistic. Not fit to have an intellectual debate whatsoever. I’ve noticed sunnis like recycling the same arguments over and over, yet its funny (and sad) how they fail to see that their own arguments is against them.
As a Christian I really enjoy your videos. You're intelligent, funny, warm and kind, I always learn something from you and you inspire me to seek and learn too, thank you 🙏
'Never met a hadith rejector that can recite Qur'an properly' 🤣🤣🤣
Never met a Qur'an rejector who FOLLOWS the Qur'an properly! 🤣
Never met fluent Qur'an reciter who FOLLOWS QUR'AN PROPERLY..
Never met a hadithist who is consistent.
@@negeto2460 How do you explain the seven Ahruf of the Qur'an?
@@Afghan31 They cant lol, may Allah guide us all
Respect for you
But how do you pray brother?
one can find find details to pray in quran verse surah baqarah surah nisa surah maidah surah syaura surah al isra surah sad surah al maun surah zumar surah hijr surah sajadah
i already practice it months
May God strenghten you in your efforts against these clones.
Not literal clones, but in a certain sense yes, because they parrot what others of their side parrot, and they're probably incentivized to do so. Not all Sunnis of course, I'm talking about the "learned" ones, the "scholars" , if you read the Gospels, they are like the Pharisees, Jesus has already exposed them.
Maaan, why didn't you record it the first time around, or extract it from his stream immediately after. If I were in your shoes at the time, the very first thing I would've expected was for them to edit the heck out of the interaction.
It’s because muhammad Ali has not cut anything I swear this guy is a liar
Subhanallah, i watched the video on the channel of Muhammad Ali and didn't notice back then the edits... if so that's extremely deceptive.
La ilaha illa Allah
Muhammad pls sit down with mufti abu layth
It would be a nice chat
Yes brother you doing a great work 👍
Salamun ‘alaikum
I find it so remarkable that Mr Ali would quote 'poetry' to prove his points whereas the Qur'an states:
""And We did NOT teach him poetry, nor would it BEFIT him, for it is only a reminder and a clear Qur'an."" {36:69}
Why doesn't Mr Ali also quote from Magicians, soothsayers, and foretune tellers since he has no problems quoting from 'poetry'??
Keep up the great work akhi! Qur'aan'-Wahdahu!
Please listen to why he qouted the line of poetry. The Quran is in Arabic, to understand it you need knowledge of the Arabiv language. To explain that salah and duaa are used interchangeably he qouted an example from the Arabic language.
He isnt using poetry to lets say explain how to pray but to simply explain the meaning of some arabic words. Big difference. Be sincere.
@@muhanadal-hasan1820but did the prophet use 'poetry' himself to explain Salah? NO he did not!
@@negeto2460 bold of you for assuming that traditionalists would even want to follow the true way of the prophet.
@@asr2009 Negeto is very open minded. This is something I really appreciate about him. He is a Qur’an only Muslim, which is the correct path.
Salams. Wanna talk privately?
Salam brother Farid
I have my email on my channel page- it would be nice to talk to you.
Asalamu alaikum Farid I love you for the sake of Allah brother ❤️
hadith is idol worship. Abandon it while you can.
@@MuhammadfromGODso, they brought in the 'big guns' to try to convert you brother Muhammad! Don't let these people seduce you to follow their 'parallel' religion which has nothing to do with the Qur'an!
My email is muhammad2 [at] tuta.io
yeha the muslim lantern was insufferable. god knows the content of his heart, he forgot that. he wanted a punching bag to mock for views. i hope he knows how to answer to god for his behaviors. he didnt want to hear the arguments - he wanted to mock. honestly i dont see the difference between him and david wood.
Akhi, could you comment the PBD Podcast with Daniel Haqiqatjou ?
Bro I was thinking the same thing. Muslim orthodoxy is as insane as christians but the little truth they have is powerful. Allah help us
@remanalmersal5968 To be fair to the Sunni gentlemen they completely dismantled the Christians. Unfortunately they do not reflect on their own ideology though.
@@Quran_Alone_Dawah yeah I think the whole point was to get some Muslims in a room together and say death to non believers.......
@arslaanmania1309 Was planning to but have a busy schedule now. Will also tone down on the comments
Watching that video with the lantern guy was infuriating but alhamdulillah i found this channel
@TheMuslimLantern Arrogance is the characteristic of the inhabitants of hell
So where is the full, unedited version?
I believe you brother mohammad
Brother didnt he ask you if you could speak arabic? And you said no....or am i confused. Anyway glad i found you through him haha
Edit:personally i think you were very patient and calm. i was so impressed and hardly saw you interrupt him, shocked to hear he tried to edit it to make it look a certian way, it didnt work at all! He seemed nervous and angery the whole time in contrast to your calm demeanor 😅
Brother you are just fack up guy. You are the protejct of zionist e wahabis, you are clear munafiq
brother M, I have been following the Quran only for a long time now. I am just wondering sincerely, on whether you were always a only Quran brother from the beginning or were you a sunni or shiite before. ---- keep up the good work my brother.
MY COMMENT TO HIS VIDEO:
Sunnis watch but don't realize their embarrassment.
Sunnist: "I know Arabic language haha, so I'm right,
I got my Arabic from pagan poets, not from Allah."
Quraniy: "so Allah had to rely on poets for Arabic?
but Prophet Muhammad wasn't given poetry/36:69."
Sunnist: "Recite correctly, you don't respect Quran,
this is the problem with Quranis they can't recite."
(his audience: haha, God blessed me with sunnism.)
Quraniy: "I appologise for my mistakes
and I appreciate your correcting me,
but I was gonna make quick points
cuz you keep interrupting me often."
(in most cases, he read properly there
and just paused, it's perfectly fine to do,
and in times he may have mistaken there
cuz in rush, people may do some mistakes,
and he has reasons to rush cuz you interrupt,
so he's trying to make his points very short,
and I assure you that I can recite Quran,
and I don't pause as he pauses often,
and I try to recite ayats fully as possible
(this proves I'm a totally different person here,
before sunnis start lying that I'm somehow "alt",
tho I'm not using my account, tho keep assuming),
unlike many of your sunnis which can't even recite
as Ali Dawah, even APuss recites better than him.)
Sunnist: "You keep complaining that I'm interrupting,
are you trying to play a victim card on public emotion?"
"look he interrupted after I interrupted him many times,
he has no sense of justice, he asks to stop what he does."
[no comment for retards.]
Quraniy: "let me ask you one question,
I already let you ask many questions."
Sunnisist: "no, you're not allowed, this is my platform,
I'll kick you if you don't follow my rules on my stream,
as my hadith orders to k!ll those who disagree with us."
"now answer my question: how do you do Salah i.e. Dua?"
Quraniy: "Salah is not dua, I Sall (Salah) 3 times as in Quran 11:114,
(Quran is fully detailed, obeying majority misleads/ 6:114-116.)
and I try to not add anything from myself to the commands,
unlike you who added loud Salah which God forbids/ 17:110,
and you talk to a Prophet in grave 5 times a day in tashahhud,
and you say Allah hears those who praise him, but He hears all,"
(and you ask Allah to bless the Prophet as he blessed Abraham,
so you claim Abraham is more blessed yet you exult Muhammad,
and make of his grave a mosque, and invoke a man in mosques,
you say s.a.w. to Prophet Muhammad but a.s. to other Prophets,
while Muslims make no distinction among the Prophets/ 2:285.)
Sunnisist: now I have to kick you.
see, we can't tolerate such people.
& I'll keep smiling like Belle Delphine.
hahahahahaha what an accurate description
I agree with you, the Sunni wasnt necessarily after the points Muhammad did. Instead he would counter a question or he would simply be correcting arabic and saying he cant recite right.
@NotTheUniverse "And if you obey most of those upon the earth, they will mislead you from the way of Allah. They follow not except assumption, and they are not but falsifying." 6:116
"And most of them believe not in Allah except while being mushrikoon." 12:106
@@NotTheUniverse you wanna say that follow Muhammad means follow whatever mullas tell you is Saheeh even if we see them clearly contradicting Quran? Rather, you sunnis are blind followers of liars, while we follow the Prophet through Quran.
Follow the Prophet for us means follow what Allah said about the Prophet in Quran, not to follow whatever is said in hearsays Ahadith of people which are made centuries after the Prophet by emitting about 99% of other Ahadith as baseless.
@NotTheUniverse Alhamdullillah I obey Allah and his messenger:
"[That] indeed, the Qur'an is the word of a noble Messenger." 69:40
Quote the full ayah 59:7 ya munafiq
"And what Allah restored to His Messenger from the people of the towns - it is for Allah and for the Messenger and for [his] near relatives and orphans and the [stranded] traveler - so that it will not be a perpetual distribution among the rich from among you. And whatever the Messenger has given you - take; and what he has forbidden you - refrain from. And fear Allah ; indeed, Allah is severe in penalty."
Allah has his messenger distribute loot from the towns.
As for the Qur'an not containing enough detail:
"One day We shall raise from all Peoples a witness against them, from amongst themselves: and We shall bring thee as a witness against these (thy people): and We have sent down to thee the *Book explaining all things* , a Guide, a Mercy, and Glad Tidings to Muslims." 16:89
"We have made the Night and the Day as two (of Our) Signs: the Sign of the Night have We obscured, while the Sign of the Day We have made to enlighten you; that ye may seek bounty from your Lord, and that ye may know the number and count of the years: *all things have We explained in detail.* " 17:12
"O People of the Scripture, there has come to you Our Messenger making clear to you much of what you used to conceal of the Scripture and overlooking much. There has come to you from Allah *a light and a clear Book* ." 5:15
"Alif, Lam, Ra. These are the verses of the *Book and a clear Qur'an* ." 15:1
"Shall I seek other than Allah for judge, when He it is Who hath *revealed unto you (this) Scripture, fully explained* ? Those unto whom We gave the Scripture (aforetime) know that it is revealed from thy Lord in truth. So be not thou (O Muhammad) of the waverers." 6:114
" *A Book whose verses have been detailed* , an Arabic Qur'an for a people who know," 41:3
" *Thus do We explain the signs in detail* ; and perchance they may turn (unto Us)." 7:174
"And when We read it, follow thou the reading;" 75:18
"Nay more, *it is for Us to explain it (and make it clear)* : 75:19
"For We had certainly sent unto them a Book, based on knowledge, *which We explained in detail* ,- a guide and a mercy to all who believe." 7:52
"And they do not come to you with an argument except that *We bring you the truth and the best explanation* ." 25:33
May Allah guide you to Islam
So he never showed where the Quran says to follow the Hadiths???
Also that Arabic poetry he's talking about, also shows that Arab poets could create a verse like the Quran.
So there existed people back then and before the Quran that could have written something like the Quran.
May Allah give you hidayath
Allah guide you
I think at this point, it’s pointless to argue and debate these people. I think it will be better just to focus on understanding the Quran.
In the video, I see three persons. The one in the middle and the big one on the right seem similer in attitude----narcissistic,, condescending. The left one is different from the other two.
Anyone have any resources on how/when to pray via quran only?
Their is a channel called 'Explore the Qur'an and the Bibel' it has many videos with different topics about the history of Islam itself. From the theologically-historical aspect thanks to the 4th Caliph Uthman (the first Caliph who didn't know the Prophet Muhammad by person, but was from the Quraysh tribe) he implemented all of the tradition and hadith practices which is present in the Muslim world since now, causing the first revolt at the time of the Islamic empire also known as 'Caliphate'. After Uthmans death Ali took the throne and Muawiyah in Damascus claimed himself also an Caliph, which caused a civil war in the empire. Soooo from this I understand that before Uthman came to power every tribe had it's own version of the Quran, with it's own chronological order, etc, etc .. and I guess everybody had their own way to pray? God is also saying in the Qu'ran that the believers are praising him standing, sitting, or laying on their sides, which is a indication of that? Since I know that everything was rationalized by one caliph, who thought it would be a great idea to implement a system to a religion which promotes the opposite, I think the Ummah went astray since he was in charge.
Ahlul bida wal jama'a 😂
Sahi bukari is like apostle Paul of Muslims
Subah Allah, nice work, how sad and sly of these guys, he really chopped off most of ur dialogue, he said the koran necessitates following the hadith, and then he said i didnt say that, well these guys like the trinity followers are saying something and then denying it in the next sentence, brother Muhammad, i saw ur debate with shamsi at speakers corner, u nailed him and he got emotional started asking about mecca, as if the quran is some ancient atlas, looool, May Allah guide us all, aameen !!!!
akhi please make ur own recordings next time, its super crucial in these times !!!
Brodie is trying to come back but he couldn't speak when he was in the debate
Cause your arrogant boy couldn’t let me speak
@@MuhammadfromGODMay Allah guide you and me and him to the absolute truth
تخيل اني أرسلت اليك رسالة مشفرة، ثم أعطيتك مفتاح الشفرة لكي تقرأها…
هل ستحتاج الى الرسالة المشفرة بعد ان تفك رموزها؟
طبعاً لن تحتاج اليها
هكذا يعامل التراثيون القرآن
Claims to follow the quran.
Also him: Backbites, knowing as a major sin.
This green lantern brother speaks like he's in a rush, that he barely gives himself time to reflect on the logic of the question and has rude traits of hypocrisy and keeps on disrespectfully saying you don't understand to the questioner as if its become a habit he robotically uses in conversation, when in reality he is not understanding.
two perspectives is important, some of the things this brother says is true, particularly in his first video, but this brother fails to recognize the statements Allah repeatedly says in A'raf and in surat Nur, establish prayer, pray zakat, and follow the messenger so that you can be rightly guided. This is similarly stated in surat A'raf. This brother thinks the hadith are all lies because he doesn't trust the science of hadith, I would recommend that he looks into it. I'm not a sunni, I just follow Allah and the prophet like I was commanded.
The quran is not something that can be interpeted how you want, we cant just read the quran and understand without the interpetation of ibn kathir wich is filled with the siraat. Without this youre missing a basic fundament of islam and the understanding of the quran.
brother next time record yourself too, so we can see.
Muhammad has to debate this guy and hopefully Othman bin Farouq
Please do a response to PBD CHRISTIAN MUSLIM DEBATE ❤
brother! next time please record. and go in a debate with debater who are humble and can use their brain rather than plays dirty to win. It seems like, they would lie and hide the truth from the people so they can convince that their ancestors were in the right path.
“Ahul bidah wal jamah” 😂
I like to call them Ahlul-Mushrik Wa'l-Dalaal 😊
Do you accept or reject the prophet Muhammad?
he accepts the prophet yes. every muslim should. the thing is, the messenger's job is to deliver the message and the message is quran.
What is a hadith rejector? Im an Orthodox Christian so I have no idea what that means
Hello Howard, I'll explain: hadith are the stories of people who recorded our last prophet. The holy quran was given to the prophet and is God's words preserved, the hadith are recorded sayings/stories of the prophet passed down by people. Hope that was clear! May God guide us to the truth.
Anywhere you find muslims doing weird behaviors be sure they are following man made hadiths. Such as stoning to death, killing apostates, marrying 6 year old girls etc.
Hadith rejectors reject man made hadiths and only follow quran.
@@diegoalves9357 Glory to God brother and thank you for enlightening me, may you have many years and God bless.
The sayings of the Messenger, may God bless him and grant him peace, are called hadith. Unfortunately, most Muslims consider the hadiths to be ruling over the Qur’an, even if they differ from the Qur’an. Hadith deniers do not accept this approach and consider the Qur’an to be the teachings of Islam without a partner.
Muhammad Ali even copyright striked his debate with GodLogic and the whole time avoided the debate topic in it. He is dishonest.
I am an atheist but I find you very entertaining I also watch Apostate Prophet maybe you should debate him next he is an atheist and very against Islam but he will have a debate with you in a respectful manner also you two have a good sense of Humour
Firstly What do u think the word' sali' means in surah at tewbah verse 103
Secondly learn How to recite properly
i dont get it. why do u hate hadiths? do u think there all fake?
Hadith cannot be taken as a reliable source when so many "sahih" hadith directly contradict the Qur'an.
personally, i just don't care about them. why should i careif God completed the religion. i believe quran is sufficient
Simple, man made hearsay hadith are not from Allah.
Their iman is weak, so anything outside their understanding, or anything "too extreme" messes with their feeble little minds 😂😂
You should expose some shias brother
HE SCHOOLED YOU 😂😂
Just sounds like you are upset you lost the argument lol
he literallt clarified all his point logically and also showed how the muslim lantern cut out pieces of the video to sho a misrepresented reality of the discussion. seems like he has no honesty, something a muslim should have
Dude I’m a Sunni but your videos are really making me think twice. You make many good points and I agree his entire demeanor with you here with not sincere at all. Please keep making videos I believe your intentions are pure may Allah guide us ALL to the TRUTH ameen
you a submitter?
Al-Bukhari (3651) and Muslim (2533)The best of people are my generation, then those who come after them, then those who come after them. Then there will come people whose testimony will come before their oath, and their oath before their testimony.
I was always confused how this could be, being though they went to war with each other. Then it hit me one day, hadith is what changed.
can you explain?
@BD-eo8zw Quran 5 32-33. The first three generations were killing each other. How are they the best of muslims? Why were they killing each other? Because they didn't agree. The fact that they split says there was no hadith consensus. Had the Prophet ordained hadith, surely he would have dictated. And if im am to take hadith as truth (along with hadith mention above) and hadith doesn't really come into play until after those 3 generations, then I need to look at what changed.
Muslim Lantern guy is condescending and belittling. He always has this smirk on his face… it is futile to debate people like that.
Hey Brother, I don't know whether you're upon the truth or not and I myself am still looking.
A part of me instinctively wants to reject the Hadiths. As far as I know, the prophet (pbuh) himself ordered nothing of his words to be recorded other than the Quran and that anyone who recorded anything else should burn it (I'm not sure who gave Bukhari permission to go against this order, shouldn't he be obeying Allah and the Prophet?) plus even the Sahaba believed the the Book of Allah is enough as per the story of the prophet (pbuh) on his deathbed and how they saw no reason to give him paper to give more advice. In my mind, it's so obvious that had the prophet (pbuh) wanted us to follow Hadith, he would have simply ordered his companions to note down what he says, that would have certainly been more efficient than waiting 200+ years.
On the other hand, it seems plainly obvious that certain hadiths couldn't possibly be unauthentic since they carry great wisdom and make clear prophecies that came true and which the prophet couldn't have known about (the deserts of Arabia being green, the Bedouin arabs erecting towers etc). This leads me to believe that there are at least some Hadiths that were transmitted correctly.
That said, my biggest issue with Hadiths is the mentality of people that fully embrace them. Somehow, even suggesting that Bukhari and others could have been wrong about literally any Sahih Hadith is enough to get metaphorically crucified. That's insane levels of zealotry that I just can't get behind. Not even the Prophet (pbuh) was infallible, yet Al_Bukhari and his transmitters were? Even worse, at what point does "Obey God and his messenger" become Obey God and Bukhari and anyone who claims the messenger said x or y?
I'm feeling a bit lost at the moment, not sure which path to follow and it's hard to find people to discuss this with without being labeled Kaffir or Mushrik or whatever else, it's almost Church levels of "we don't like questions here". May Allah guide us all.
seek God
This is almost the exact predicament that I'm in. But I think I'm going to start reading and understanding the Quran first before turning towards the Hadith. I hope insha'Allah we are guided and turn towards the truth.
وَمَا یَنطِقُ عَنِ ٱلۡهَوَىٰۤ﴿ ٣ ﴾
Nor does he speak from [his own] inclination.
إِنۡ هُوَ إِلَّا وَحۡیࣱ یُوحَىٰ﴿ ٤ ﴾
It is not but a revelation revealed,
(53:3-4)
If you end up rejecting all hadith how would your reconcile this verse. From my perspective, looking at Quran you have clear verses stating that The Prophet sws was taught the Quran and given wisdom that he did not know. The Prophet sws had to have taught outside of the Quran. From the Quranist point of view it seems like he sws is just a mailman delivering the scripture. When you have everyone interpreting a verses in the Quran in how they see it, it becomes an issue.
My honest advice would be to focus on learning the book of allah, your ibadah, and keeping firm on your salah.
May Allah guide us all.
@@luf832 Well this verse says that the Prophet was taught nothing but revelation. I don't have Quranic knowledge but this is what I could understand at first glance. To me I don't have a problem with following the Messenger of Allah, it's just that some Hadiths make me consider the authenticity of all Hadiths. I hope all of us are guided towards the truth Insha Allah.
@@davidela9022 Are you claiming the “obey the prophet” verse was only for the prophets time when the Quran is for all of mankind. The Quran was preserved the same way the sunnah was. How could you claim the only true thing you can be sure about is the Quran but when you ask a Quranist about the preservation of the Quran they for some odd reason dont like getting into it?
New sect : hadith rejectors
Prophet followed Quran alone
and rejected false Ahadith too,
as did all other Prophets before,
false Hadith associators (mushirks)
are the new sects of deceiver Satan,
New sect: Mulla worshipers.
(Those who can't suffice with the words of God, yet claim to be Muslims.)
Quran only followers never say their in Sect, you guys are in a Sect and spout lies about others.
nope, most "quranists" or "hadith rejectors" identify as a MUSLIM
No it's a sect that calls other Hadith rejectors. Bro it's other way around. Oh sorry, not sect, infact calls them kafir. According to that sect all will go to hell but they will be in heaven because bukhari has in in his book
Which hadith are you talking about?
You keep calling his specifications of speech as word salad.
Are you for real man? I genuinely thought you were misrepresented in the podcasts.
But this Clarification video is exposing you.
Don't forget (2:42) and (28:50). Wake up, you are an important asset but this was not expectedly from you.
What kind of Islam is this you don't care about making tahreef of the Quran?
The sectarian Hadithian Islam does that and even worse they say the book of Allah is NOT complete! Mushriks! They’d better repent. Are you one of them?
It is obvious thay Muslim Lantern is a deceptive person. Stay away from thay guy.
You obviously are not ignorance about the quran. Making some pronounciation errors doesn't prove that you are. He was jumping on some things just to jump on them. He is better than some dawah guys, but he still has the little ticks that show he thinks someone is wrong and he feels a certain way. It's better to avoid that if you want the person, or viewer, to hear the message. Right or not, people respond emotionally, so if one snickers, regardless whether they "should" be mature enough to ignore it, ot does distract from the message. It's also disrespectful.
First my brother learn Quran, the only time you didn’t make a mistake was literally when you were reading it.
اتمنى لو انك كنت على قدر كبير من العلم باللغة العربية وبعلوم الدين
لانك حتى الان لا تعلم الكثير وانا الاحظ ذلك باقل قدر من العلم الذى حصلت عليه فى المدرسة عندما كنت صغيراً
لذلك رجاء تعلم وربما ستصل للوسطية والاعتدال ما بين اتباع القران وهو الحق وكذلك ان تتعلم الحديث وتتعلم ان هناك احاديث كثيره تحتاج لمناقشة وهذا صحيح ولكن هذا لا يعنى ان كل الاحاديث كاذبة ولا يجب ان نتبعها يمكننا ان نتعلم من الاحاديث الكثير
انا اتفق معك ان القرآن كامل ومستقل ومنفصل تماماً عن الحديث
ولكن هذا لا يعنى ان الحديث ليس جزئاً من هذا الدين هناك الكثير من النصائح والارشادات التى يعطيها النبى لنا طيلة حياته وسيكون من المؤسف عدم الاستفادة منها
Kaafir lantern, edits and then dogs follow him blindly, yes follow Kaafir Lantern and your a dog 🐕.
You're embarrassing all of us. I see us fighting each other all while the actual kafirs watch and laugh. 🙄
In the bible we have detailed explanation in resurection snd judgement day.
So as muslim from wuram nothing new you ccn teach us.
We keep ot on focus bu contonuing on prayer and do a ts of love to do works
A instructs you to follow B,
in order to FOLLOW A, you must do as A has instructed,
Therefore; in order to follow A, you must follow B.
[Bad Faith] That means that if A commanded you to follow B, but B does not exist then A is incomplete. A can only be complete with B because it calls for b. that makes A dependent on B!
Allah WOULD NOT command you to follow B if B doesnt exist. (this is moot tho)
How do i follow quran? Do what quran says.
What does quran say? Follow hadith as well as other things.
How do i follow quran? Follow hadith as well as other things.
Quran is not dependent on any instructions mentioned within it. Following or Not following the instructions of the quran is what becomes dependent on the instructions themselves. You are forcing the idea of "Dependency" on the wrong part of the sentence. I don't think you were disingenuous. But i think you're blocking yourself.
Rather than taking the logic of his statement to these lengths, why not have contended that his claim of the quran commanding him to follow hadith was an inaccurate claim? Isn't that your perspective?
Because he removed that part of the discussion when he didn’t answer it and I asked him a few times. He also committed to answering by saying “I’ll show you were”
But he conveniently didn’t add the part to the video he edited
@@MuhammadfromGOD Brother, i appreciate your response to the latter part of my rather long comment. Tho it concerns me why you did not mention or respond to the other point, the main point, the one that took up about 80% of my comments text.
Do you still think that the way you framed it logically, and what his statement would entail is correct? Or do you recognize the issue now with more time having passed?
Not towards his attitude, not towards his behavior, nor your treatment, but his actual words in describing his belief that the quran mentions to follow the hadith, and that he must follow the hadith in order to follow the quran, and the odd ways in which you forced that idea into entailments far different than what he was clearly saying?
Your dependency logic is totally wrong.
Quran says to live nicely with women, if there were no women, we wouldn't be able to follow the Quran completely.
So is Quran dependant on women?
Do the same analogy on almost all commandments and prohibitions, if the prohibited or commanded things didn't exist, we couldn't fully follow the Quran.
Quran is dependant on wine, lottery, idols???
P.S: you still said the word صلاتك wrong, it doesn't have to do anything with waqf, your problem is in the TA, not the KAAF.
You are making fools out of your audience.
1. The Quran is a set of instructions that needs to be followed.
2. When you are saying there are more instructions outside of the Quran that needs to be followed.
3. Therefore those instructions become a requirement by the source.
The Quran is not dependent on you interacting with Woman, Wine, lottery or idols. It tells you how to *react* when dealing with those matters. Without you ever coming in touch with them, the Quran is still complete.
Women, wine, lottery and idols are circumstance of the situation that is being discussed and addressed in the Quran. There are instructions on what to do with them directly.
The instructions are incomplete without the secondary source as per you. That is a dependancy.
Thank you for trying, and arguing that GOD's book isn't enough
@@MuhammadfromGOD
Ok, even if we limit ourselves to the instructions principle
If the Quran implies following the Sunnah in itself, Quran is not dependant on the Sunnah.
WE are dependant on the Quran and Sunnah.
The Quran is enough for us because in it we have guidelines towards Sunnah.
@@omerfarukbukurevic8368 That's the basis of the Argument which I didn't get a chance to address with MA - which is what I kicked of the discussion with
The Sunnah is found in the Quran of what GOD has ordained for the Prophet and those who came before Him [33:38]
One quick example is that the Prophet used to pray 1/3 - 2/3 - 1/2 the night. This is a proper Sunnah.
The issue we conflict with Sunnism is what is "Sunnah" and what is structure on accomplishing the directive of GOD.
When I was asking the Question in regards to Prayer (do not be loud and do not be silent) - I was questioning the two prayers of Dhur and Asr - these are the point where we are skeptical of what we have been told - only because we used the Quran as a filter.
I appreciate your reply and being earnest in your approach
@@MuhammadfromGOD Also
Allah says that in the Prophet we have the best example.
So that means we should follow his actions and manners.
Is Quran dependant on the Prophet?
@@MuhammadfromGOD Asalamualaikum brother,
I have a question for u.. look isn't it obvious that u don't follow the sunnah if u only follow the Qur'an because Qur'an is the word of Allah swt and as we all know that Farz are those things which are obligatory upon a muslim. A commandment from Allah recommended for the betterment of ones character, morality and rationalism and Sunnah are the methods of the Prophet pbuh so if u only follow Qur'an u do not actually follow the sunnah of the prophet since Qur'an is only the word of Allah swt and if Allah swt has said anything in it, it is farz not sunnah..
You failed in this video. This is just a tit for tat. He goes through several proofs in a video he posted 3 months ago. If you really want to prove your point, disprove that video and his proofs.
Is this guy shia
he believes quran is sufficient. implies hadith is unnecessary
its called muslim, no sects since that is not allowed refer to the quran. all those who call themselves sunni sufi shia or whatever they will be informed by allah the almighty about what they have been doing.
Indeed, those who have divided their religion and become sects - you, [O Muhammad], are not [associated] with them in anything. Their affair is only [left] to Allah ; then He will inform them about what they used to do. 6:159
Astaghfirullah he isnt a mushrik, Shia obviously are. They are like nazarenes
@@SmitTheAdventurer so what should I do should I label myself as a Muslim and when someone asks what sect I am should I just say I follow Quran and ahlul bhayt
@@Assadul-Naml how do Shias perform shirk no Sunni has explained it to me they all call me a kafir and leave which is against your Hadiths to call a fellow Muslim kaffir so tell me how do Shias do shirk
Bro Muhammad Ali destroyed your arguments bro. Come on man..
Brother your excuse for not reciting the Quran correctly is terrible and unnecessary...Just say sorry I was not be able to do it correctly, because i was nervous or whatever...full stop...no dialect, no he wants to this and that, no nothing...you were wrong and khalas...btw it is a temporary suukun at the end of an ayaah, but just if you stop..if not you read like it is a normal sentence...but a last question to the quran only position here... how do you even know, how to read and recite the quran properly? I mean how do you know, that you should not read the kasra in the end, because of the temporary sukuun, and how do you even know where and when there are ijama und tashkil, if you onl have the quran, because different Ahruf and Qiraat are existing today?
I mean maybe you hear all these questions thousand times, but i want to understand your position.
Shame you're such a victim. May Allah guide you guys you're so weird
I dont like this Guy , but I have to give respect where its due .
Atleast he holds everyone to the same standard and doesn't let the sunnis get away with their double standards.
Fair play !
Why you are wearing a skull Cap? Is it mentioned in the Quran to wear it? Just asking
He mopped the floor with you and it's was live so there was no editing.
The uploaded video was edited
@@Quran_Alone_Dawah but the conversation was live and Muhammad ali clearly exposed the so called quranist,he couldn't even pronounce the quran right, and was in multiple occasions playing the victim card.
@@Quran_Alone_Dawah If you reject the sunnah while it shows actual authenticity of its chain of narration, you should go ahead and reject the Quran as well, because it was transmitted by people OTHER than the prophet himself. Those same companions that were with prophet as his trusted people have sayings that have been passed onto to the next person which in of itself contains trusted, honest and well qualified people. So, how do you know the manuscript of the Quran you have, how are you sure the people who copied it were not fallible as men are fallible?
@workerofpeace I don't trust them with the Qur'an. They made tahreef in their mushafs. I verify the Qur'an through code 19. You have no proof the Qur'an or hadiths are from Allah other than chains of transmissions. I have objective mathematical proof.