the purpose of each team fortress class, as written by robin walker

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  • čas přidán 26. 07. 2024
  • Music: Dustforce OST
    TF (v2.8) readme.txt: drive.google.com/open?id=13rn...
    channel discord --- / discord
    channel patreon --- / shounic
    channel tracker --- trello.com/b/L3B65jUX
    [ todo list / current progress on upcoming videos / channel roadmap ]
    feedback --- forms.gle/bkuGF6attQrRPc6o9
    custom files --- pastebin.com/raw/e32aG4nP
    [ hud / crosshairs / hitsound / killsound / gfx cfg ]
    FAQ:
    Q: How did you make that? What editing software do you use?
    A: I use Adobe Photoshop, Premiere Pro & After Effects. Photoshop for image editing and thumbnails. Premiere Pro for compositing and After Effects for motion graphics (the fancy animations).
  • Hry

Komentáře • 921

  • @shounic
    @shounic  Před 4 lety +693

    hi, was a bit busier this week so i decided to get around to making this small video i wanted to make as a footnote to the video i made about tf2's quake origins (czcams.com/video/zuFgHtBlm_g/video.html). i was genuinely surprised that they literally wanted soldier to not have any particular weaknesses lol wtf
    also i fucking hate playing heavy and spy so 40 seconds of me feeding is the best i can do :)

    • @QuazzleTheQaz
      @QuazzleTheQaz Před 4 lety +8

      shounic I was curious as to why you showed us "spy montages" lol

    • @NikolasN64
      @NikolasN64 Před 4 lety

      hey i like your videos

    • @greenoftreeblackofblue6625
      @greenoftreeblackofblue6625 Před 4 lety +7

      Just suck less

    • @Matt-kl1mx
      @Matt-kl1mx Před 4 lety +1

      Dude, I was std::vector. Thanks for adding that clip.

    • @RoastCDuck
      @RoastCDuck Před 4 lety +4

      The modern purposes goes like this
      Scout: Instakill damage output, fast and immune to all damage.
      Soldier: Slower and more agile class than the scout wich depends on rocketjumping as this is the only purpose of the rocketlauncher since rockets do zero damage.
      Pyro: Relies on blocking your vision by spamming flames until everyone dies just to attempt a flare afterwards, every single player
      Demoman: Spams as much ammo as he is possibly allowed to carry
      Heavy: Slow as a snail, his minigun shoots way to much but achieves low damage output at any distance.
      Engineer: When you are playing as an engineer your buildings last 1 second and have the aim-reaction time capacity of a pile of debris, the only time they really shrine is when you are fighting an engineer in which case their buildings are undestructable and aims at you frame-pixel perfect regardless whats covering you or how fast you move
      Medic: The medic exist for the only purpose of granting players the ability to heal without the need of medikits or pills, since they are done with their teammates stealing their medikits or the lack of them in the map they are playing, the medic is a fast melee unit who always crits and it will rarely reach 100% of its uber only to waste it as their teammates are not playing as a team but rather as unsyncronized individuals
      Spy: Depends of backstabbing and exploiting the game to grant them invulnerability and instant teleport backstabs otherwise they are useless.
      Miss pauline: As the scout will never achieve anything with here along the series of TF2, her purpose is to stop homosexual fan made material related to tf2, players ended up doing both Straight and gay porn anyways.
      Administrator: Her purpose is to use her pre recorded messages every time an event happens in the map usualy ending in many voice clips being played at the same time.

  • @kingjensen8091
    @kingjensen8091 Před 4 lety +3658

    1:09 "sniper relies on distance"
    *Cuts to clip of sniper rifle being used as a melee weapon*

  • @BloodyAltima
    @BloodyAltima Před 4 lety +2759

    I love how the Pyro description is basically, "Will absolutely fail to kill any enemy on his own and will die horribly in the attempt, but he might wound the aggressor enough for a real class to solve the problem."

    • @rayanalim7375
      @rayanalim7375 Před 3 lety +356

      and now in tf2 the pyro is more like "WIll annihilate every single thing in his path with his flamethrower, not stopping untill everything is dead or he runs out of ammo, in which case, he spams flares or shotgun shots at you untill he escapes or dies.

    • @archmagef6971
      @archmagef6971 Před 3 lety +227

      @@rayanalim7375 they didn't increase the max dps of the flamethrower at all, they just made it's hit detection and dps consistent.

    • @usernametaken017
      @usernametaken017 Před 3 lety +86

      @@archmagef6971 which is enough

    • @mustanaamiotto3812
      @mustanaamiotto3812 Před 3 lety +139

      it was literally made for people who were handicapped by a bad internet

    • @margaritakouzi5630
      @margaritakouzi5630 Před 3 lety +84

      The Pyro was most likely repurposed because the Engineer would often do a better job at the Pyro’s original role.

  • @Rhetco
    @Rhetco Před 4 lety +3066

    I find it really funny that the pyro was intentionally designed to be a "throwaway" class

    • @dontsayflan4315
      @dontsayflan4315 Před 4 lety +52

      Your that girl from touhou 3 right?
      Specifically chiyuri kitashirakawa
      Or is that another person
      (talkin about your pfp)

    • @NotASpyReally
      @NotASpyReally Před 4 lety +492

      yeah the "the enemy will burn to death but the pyro will already be dead by that time" is SO TRUE LMAO EVERY TIME

    • @diegodankquixote-wry3242
      @diegodankquixote-wry3242 Před 4 lety +206

      You basically throw your self at enemy in a sewerslidal rage in the hopes one of them will be at 20 health and pray they don't find a medpack in the next 30 secs.

    • @MetalX34
      @MetalX34 Před 4 lety +200

      its initial point was to be an aim wheelchair for people with bad internet connection, after all.

    • @nursik-
      @nursik- Před 4 lety +88

      @@kimgkomg shit, he really was that useless, huh..

  • @PentaromaLMA0
    @PentaromaLMA0 Před 4 lety +844

    3:28 "but if they're unaware, he can kill them before they can blink"
    **shows perfect example**

    • @nemo9864
      @nemo9864 Před 4 lety +8

      @@comet-fy6pd That wasn't the point of his comment at all, idiot.

    • @javonyounger5107
      @javonyounger5107 Před 3 lety +30

      @@nemo9864 I pretty sure he's making a joke.

    • @zombieroo7348
      @zombieroo7348 Před 3 lety +1

      read chat during that clip lol

    • @Archimedes.5000
      @Archimedes.5000 Před 3 lety +3

      @@zombieroo7348 oh shit lmao, never would have noticed because its behind the subtitles

  • @CarCorSnoAllen
    @CarCorSnoAllen Před 4 lety +2804

    God, I love seeing scouts lob grenades at me when I play

    • @SmittyWJManJensen
      @SmittyWJManJensen Před 4 lety +286

      I like how it depics the grenades as being confusing. That mechanic is kinda still there if you think about how the mad milk and the wrap are annoying AS HELL to deal with

    • @altobug83
      @altobug83 Před 4 lety +95

      Your profile pic is what I think anyone's reaction would be to having a scout lobbing grenades at them

    • @alirezafalamarzi7062
      @alirezafalamarzi7062 Před 4 lety +10

      God forbids.

    • @moistmarsupial3528
      @moistmarsupial3528 Před 4 lety +27

      The tf2 beta had grenades, but I'm sure most of you have already seen gameplay of that

    • @AnAshenSpirit
      @AnAshenSpirit Před 4 lety +90

      Scout with grenades is an entirely different beast compared to modern day scout. A combination of bhopping and boosting with his concussion grenades let him reach insane speeds, they are nothing like the mad milk or wrap assassin. If you got hit with one say goodbye to being able to aim at all (or see, for that matter). He could be a pain to fight but it was fun to fly through maps at Mach 12

  • @thefrub
    @thefrub Před 4 lety +1130

    Yep, that is exactly how I play Pyro. Charge in, burn the entire team, die, get 20 assists as my team comes in behind me. Then I screenshot the angry messages and add them to my collection

    • @randomcatdude
      @randomcatdude Před 4 lety +34

      i wanna see them

    • @thefrub
      @thefrub Před 4 lety +94

      @@randomcatdude Only if you're invited to the shrine in my basement

    • @GreatFox42
      @GreatFox42 Před 3 lety +41

      @@thefrub what if we said please

    • @sh4dowveil749
      @sh4dowveil749 Před 3 lety +20

      @@GreatFox42 no one in the basement has ever wanted to be there before

    • @TheGoodDoctor049
      @TheGoodDoctor049 Před 3 lety +7

      Unfortunately, that’s not how it works, because medkits instantly put out fire for some reason

  • @Mido_
    @Mido_ Před 4 lety +1408

    "Medic - A great class for clearing out
    snipers that are pinning a team down."
    lul

    • @As567na
      @As567na Před 4 lety +27

      It is

    • @bruschetta7711
      @bruschetta7711 Před 4 lety +243

      @@As567na but it is also the first to get pinned down by the sniper

    • @fangrowls6336
      @fangrowls6336 Před 4 lety +52

      that explains why crusader s crossbow exist

    • @TheLegonaut
      @TheLegonaut Před 4 lety +90

      The only counter to snipers are snipers

    • @crikeybaguette4564
      @crikeybaguette4564 Před 4 lety +47

      @@TheLegonaut and spies and scouts

  • @ThumbsTup
    @ThumbsTup Před 4 lety +2274

    "Sniper relies on distance"
    *laughs in Jaratebushwacka*

  • @agenta6432
    @agenta6432 Před 4 lety +2902

    false; we all know his real name is the demonstration man

    • @Avary1984
      @Avary1984 Před 4 lety +82

      *Demonstrations Black

    • @slyseal2091
      @slyseal2091 Před 4 lety +12

      @fish Thats Fullman.

    • @piyo744
      @piyo744 Před 4 lety +77

      no, it's the demographics man

    • @augustus5481
      @augustus5481 Před 4 lety +8

      No he is....
      *Martin luther!*

    • @SoluKissin
      @SoluKissin Před 4 lety +39

      no it's the demoralization man

  • @dapperfield595
    @dapperfield595 Před 4 lety +1871

    2:55 “The Pyro often find it hard to kill enemies on *his* own”
    Pyro gender confirmed

    • @dragonsinfluence68
      @dragonsinfluence68 Před 4 lety +313

      is the team fortress classic pyro, the comics confirmed that the tfc pyro is female.

    • @James-oj6ru
      @James-oj6ru Před 4 lety +434

      dragon's influense
      No, wrong classic one, this is *QUAKE* _CLASSIC_

    • @dragonsinfluence68
      @dragonsinfluence68 Před 4 lety +51

      @@James-oj6ru my bad! thanks!

    • @Thornskade
      @Thornskade Před 4 lety +178

      That is the Quake Team Fortress Pyro, not our Pyro.
      The TFC Pyro is canonically female.
      For TF2 Pyro, we still don't know.

    • @henryambrose8607
      @henryambrose8607 Před 4 lety +26

      @@nadir4562 It isn't Team Fortress Classic. TFC is an expansion for Half-Life; this is the original Quake mod that it was based on.

  • @BigDaddy-je2nq
    @BigDaddy-je2nq Před 4 lety +223

    Demo man is short for "Demonstration manual"

    • @The_WhitePencil
      @The_WhitePencil Před 3 lety +17

      That's what the bombinomicon is, his true form.

    • @gudmansal3468
      @gudmansal3468 Před 10 měsíci

      demonstration manual for how to demo(nstration) man(ual)

  • @GermanPeter
    @GermanPeter Před 4 lety +438

    Fascinating to see how intention and execution/ outcome differ a lot sometimes. They may have had many ideas for the classes initially, but after removing grenades and even with them, how they really played out changed quite a lot.
    Medic is the worst offender, with players completely getting rid of healing in TFC in favor of momentum and capping due to his arsenal and grenades. They really just saw "Wow, he has cool weapons and grenades, who cares about healing tbh", and just went with it.
    And for Pyro, it's interesting that afterburn was supposed to finish enemies off, when in TFClassic, it apparently sucked so hard that it took off not even 10 HP.
    In TF2, Sniper is still very much effective at medium and even close distance due to him being able to snipe people pretty much instantly. Granted, that's only at the highest level of skill, but the weapon still allows it to happen.
    And of course, Spy. God, what a mess Spy is. His entire role is undermined by just communicating with your team. If everyone knows where Spy is, he isn't effective, unless someone REALLY messes up.
    Though, there's still a lot of things that carried over from the initial idea to the final execution. The majority of classes work these days as they were originally intended, Medic as a good example. In Jungle Inferno, they even made afterburn more of a problem, which is also in line with the first intention for them.
    I find it remarkable how grenades are barely even mentioned in the Readme, as if they were really just an afterthought that didn't really add to the classes themselves. And that's kinda true, frag grenades turned even Medic into a powerhouse of a class (nerfing Scout in comparison, since he doesn't get them), whereas many of the specialized grenades don't even fit the class' role. Like Engie's EMP or Heavy's MIRV. Those grenades are purely about offense, not defense.
    I think they made a good decision taking them out of TF2, it really helped streamline the classes' roles.

    • @SM-yr3nt
      @SM-yr3nt Před 4 lety +7

      make normal regular beta video instead of that weird jojo anime thing

    • @izrrr4785
      @izrrr4785 Před 4 lety +10

      @@SM-yr3nt no

    • @loaf_of_fred1487
      @loaf_of_fred1487 Před 4 lety +37

      Come on man, he’s worked up the courage to make a public comment and your dumbass is just like “ mAkE nOrMaL vIdEo InStEaD oF tHaT wEiRd jOjO aNiMe tHiNg”
      Grow the fuck up. If you don’t like that content, go make your own and see how hard it is, you fucking troglodyte.

    • @juliangardisky7236
      @juliangardisky7236 Před 4 lety

      @@SM-yr3nt Ungrateful bastard.

    • @sire6265
      @sire6265 Před 3 lety

      @@SM-yr3nt jesus christ

  • @appliedatoms7066
    @appliedatoms7066 Před 4 lety +416

    He describes scout as the flag runner, but even I with my limited TFC knowledge know that it was the medic that ran the intel.

    • @MetalX34
      @MetalX34 Před 4 lety +57

      both were run for -suicide on the flag- speedrun the flag. dunno if it was a pre-set meta or if scout's superior movespeed helped better for bhop. in any case, even in community tournaments med wasn't the one and only official flag runner.

    • @iwiffitthitotonacc4673
      @iwiffitthitotonacc4673 Před 4 lety +54

      Just FYI, this video wasn't about TFC, but the TF Quake 1 mod. I've played neither but I would assume that they play differently.

    • @RIPANDTEAR60
      @RIPANDTEAR60 Před 4 lety +24

      @@iwiffitthitotonacc4673 no tfc and tf1 are pretty similar with just slight differences like shotgun falloff damage in tf1

    • @AnAshenSpirit
      @AnAshenSpirit Před 4 lety +6

      From what I know Scout ran the Intel and Medic was more for DM iirc

    • @RIPANDTEAR60
      @RIPANDTEAR60 Před 4 lety +11

      @@AnAshenSpirit it also depended on team sizes like in smaller teams the medic did both roles

  • @ObsidianHunter99
    @ObsidianHunter99 Před 3 lety +86

    "The soldier is the core of any squad"
    If only my team of 5 snipers knew that

    • @distractioncat7285
      @distractioncat7285 Před 2 lety

      if only the kritz medic saw my 4 hp ass with a direct hit

    • @Twiddle_things
      @Twiddle_things Před rokem +1

      Funnily enough a while back i ended up in a team of 6 snipers (including me) and a single spy KEK

  • @bottlegang3187
    @bottlegang3187 Před 4 lety +170

    Medic: A great class to clear out snipers that are pinning the team down.
    Well well well, how the turntables...

  • @TheRoboKitty
    @TheRoboKitty Před 4 lety +64

    "Given time, enemies burn to death"
    Afterburn in TF-Quake and TF-Classic only did 8 damage

  • @Ashcoop
    @Ashcoop Před 4 lety +197

    1:55 Sick juggles

  • @a_blind_sniper
    @a_blind_sniper Před 4 lety +207

    I was watching some footage from TFC and was blown away that the layout for Dustbowl and Badlands was pretty much the same to their TF2 versions. I think a map tour of the old and new maps would be pretty neat!

    • @louogarlic5111
      @louogarlic5111 Před 4 lety +1

      Check out GermanPeter's Stardustbowl Crusaders video, he's talking about Dustbowl's previous versions there

    • @wizardmagic1580
      @wizardmagic1580 Před 4 lety +2

      @Bunneer it was well made tbh, i enjoyed it.

    • @AnAshenSpirit
      @AnAshenSpirit Před 4 lety +1

      Likewise with Well and 2fort

    • @xyzzy-dv6te
      @xyzzy-dv6te Před 4 lety

      @@AnAshenSpirit TFC Well was quite interesting, sludge rivers, lifts in flag room and a ladder to a sniper roof.

    • @thescience_team
      @thescience_team Před 3 lety

      He's talking about tf quake

  • @sendhelp7057
    @sendhelp7057 Před 2 lety +18

    „At close range the demoman is particularly dangerous“
    Yea, for himself

  • @jockeyfield1954
    @jockeyfield1954 Před 4 lety +48

    "robin's alias is just 'bro'"
    *in a conversation*
    "hey, bro"
    "dude, i don't like the name robin!"

  • @chuckwellington3307
    @chuckwellington3307 Před 4 lety +106

    "Soldier is very slow but makes up for it with his weaponry"
    More like Soldier is very fast WITH his weaponry and everything revolving around his weaponry turns him into the second fastest class in the game behind Scout.
    I like how they never saw it coming by the sound of it that Soldier mains would have things like 'rollouts' and Disciplinary Actions. He's nothing like what they make him sound like. That description honestly suits Heavy way more.

    • @jeninimas
      @jeninimas Před 4 lety +34

      Ironic considering rocket jumping was actually a thing in both QTF and TFC

    • @Thornskade
      @Thornskade Před 4 lety +22

      I don't know about the original Quake mod, but in TFC every class can go fast using grenades, whether that was predicted or not. While present, rocket jumping wasn't quite as effective as in TF2, getting you shorter distances and dealing more self-damage. So in that game, this description would still kinda fit.

    • @DonnieDoodles
      @DonnieDoodles Před 4 lety +3

      I think what it is is that Soldier, if he's not using up ammo and health rocket jumping around, he's actually the second slowest mover in the whole game. Like, if we're talking purely about running speed, soldier is actually pretty slow.

    • @campfortson4387
      @campfortson4387 Před 4 lety +5

      @@DonnieDoodles in my opinion, besides sniper, soldier is the class with the highest potential to stomp the server. In the hands of a really good player, there's no limit to how much ass the soldier can kick.

    • @DonnieDoodles
      @DonnieDoodles Před 4 lety

      @@campfortson4387 I personally think that soldiers who are cocky can easily be brought down a peg by a well-placed airblast, I've had it happen before, soldier literally shoots into my airblast and dies horribly.
      Sniper on the other hand has no such weakness.

  • @toilet5170
    @toilet5170 Před 4 lety +142

    How different the medic in QTF must have been from his TF2 counterpart. The TFC medic was more like a stronger scout with the ability to heal teammates and poison enemies

  • @tonyshum5569
    @tonyshum5569 Před 4 lety +612

    "the pyro often finds it hard to kill enemies on his own"
    lol

    • @wiselychosenname2867
      @wiselychosenname2867 Před 4 lety +50

      Laughs in wm1

    • @ThumbsTup
      @ThumbsTup Před 4 lety +62

      *laughs in phlog*

    • @The_Mister_E
      @The_Mister_E Před 4 lety +26

      Or at least it does now due to the afterburn nerfs.
      Although I was never one to complain about my main's claim to fame, it was kinda crazy.
      Nowadays you've gotta work to keep the fire under their asses long enough for them to fall, especially if you're a combo pyro.

    • @heidiaguirre5672
      @heidiaguirre5672 Před 4 lety +15

      [Laughs in noobs not playing competitive and never even watching a highlander comp match]

    • @PassTheSnails
      @PassTheSnails Před 4 lety +19

      Yeah, if the other player is competent. If you get killed in a pyro 1v1, you are a worse player than the pyro.

  • @MisterJohnDoe
    @MisterJohnDoe Před 4 lety +69

    “He’s got trouble if the opponent should get within range”
    *Meanwhile sniper players usually one shot you as soon as they see you regardless of range*

    • @The_WhitePencil
      @The_WhitePencil Před 3 lety

      Well, the really good ones.

    • @GoodlyData86596
      @GoodlyData86596 Před 2 lety +1

      @@The_WhitePencil too bad they are pretty common nowadays

    • @The_WhitePencil
      @The_WhitePencil Před 2 lety

      @@GoodlyData86596 this didn't age well.

    • @anonymously_
      @anonymously_ Před 2 lety +1

      @@The_WhitePencil aged like milk, pencil, aged like a _mate doing a good shot_
      Nice shot mate

  • @felixftw4702
    @felixftw4702 Před 4 lety +75

    demoman: "he's a good offensive class, not so much with defense"
    also demoman: *listed as defensive in character selection menu*
    edit: lol same thing with pyro

    • @TeleTrenta
      @TeleTrenta Před 4 lety

      pyro is listed on the offense class :
      offense:
      scout
      soldier
      *pyro*
      defense:
      demo
      heavy
      engy
      support:
      med
      sniper
      spy

    • @kainezillah
      @kainezillah Před 4 lety +5

      @Артур Коптев
      In Quakeworld Team Fortress, not TFC.

    • @willowbarrelmaker8269
      @willowbarrelmaker8269 Před 3 lety +5

      That was the version of him that didn't have the sticky bombs though, unless I'm mistaken.
      That is absolutely going to make him more of an offensive class

  • @datonedood3791
    @datonedood3791 Před 4 lety +76

    "sniper is long range"
    *laughs in 150 damage quickscope*

    • @AnAshenSpirit
      @AnAshenSpirit Před 4 lety +11

      Good luck quickscoping with the Classic, because the Classic works identically to how the original sniper rifle from TF1/TFC worked

    • @The_WhitePencil
      @The_WhitePencil Před 3 lety

      @@AnAshenSpirit not identically, but close

    • @masterdeetectiv9520
      @masterdeetectiv9520 Před 2 lety +2

      @@AnAshenSpirit you could quickscope in tfc, it didnt need to be fully charged like how it is in tf2

  • @bratpeki
    @bratpeki Před 4 lety +19

    "almost certainly be half-dead"
    lmao

  • @LASAGNA_LARRY
    @LASAGNA_LARRY Před 4 lety +346

    Robin Walker: “Pyro is a *support class* that should have trouble killing classes on its own.”
    Pyro now: Haha, w+m1 go brrrrrrr

    • @Supershadow301
      @Supershadow301 Před 4 lety +21

      Why now? It was literally designed that way. Airblast wasn't a thing back then, remember?

    • @ari-mariberry
      @ari-mariberry Před 4 lety +30

      He's more of a support class in modern TF2 than he did back in TFC and early TF2.

    • @Journey_Awaits
      @Journey_Awaits Před 4 lety +6

      Laughs in full team of pyros camping spawn

    • @eatttheball
      @eatttheball Před 4 lety +1

      Lucas Deci pyro is easily one of the best support classes yes

    • @grosezero8834
      @grosezero8834 Před 4 lety +2

      if a pyro attacked me i would simply walk away

  • @wilfreddevries294
    @wilfreddevries294 Před 4 lety +20

    From these class descriptions it's clear where the name `Team Fortress` came from. The classes were designed to work together and complement each other.
    If only pubbers knew.

  • @dr.dolittle4505
    @dr.dolittle4505 Před 4 lety +11

    1:58 can we all take a moment to appreciate how great that juggle was.

  • @areoants9453
    @areoants9453 Před 4 lety +52

    "The Soldier moves slower than most classes..."
    Yeah, sure that'll be the same 9 years in the future.

    • @Mate_Antal_Zoltan
      @Mate_Antal_Zoltan Před 4 lety +13

      he's talking about movement speed, not mobility

    • @Wintd1
      @Wintd1 Před 3 lety +18

      Soldier technically has the 2nd slowest movement speed in the game, in fact he's not that much faster than the Heavy. His mobility comes from rocket jumping, which was always insane even during days of Quake Fortress and TFC.

  • @626Link
    @626Link Před 4 lety +146

    So Pyro was always meant to be underpowered... Fascinating.
    I always assumed that the fact that he dies first in many encounters speaks the class being broken. An ambush class that can't ambush enemies...
    But clearly Robin meant for this from even before TF2 was created. That's pretty eye opening.

    • @MetalX34
      @MetalX34 Před 4 lety +37

      let's say he was intended to soften up ppl more than killing them.
      in such mindset his poor firepower wouldn't be "underpowered" but just the user overextending after setting their target ablaze.
      issue is that whether it's a matter of "ambushing" or "disrupting the enemy team", it's practically meme tier compared to being an actual threat. that would have been "okay" had the class at least been an engaging opponent, but even at that it fails miserably.

    • @slycat9449
      @slycat9449 Před 4 lety +10

      @@MetalX34 The back burner would like to have a word with you.

    • @MetalX34
      @MetalX34 Před 4 lety +10

      @@slycat9449 was talking about the core of the class i.e. excluding the unlocks.
      tho that wouldn't change much if we included the backb. overreliance on the element of surprise to be "threatening" is just a joke: it barely works even for a specialized class like spy, let alone for pryo and nearly every combat class can do it well enough anyway when it's worth doing.
      if you're not convinced, try outside of pub's maymay mayhem into an actual match, and see how you get denied more than anything. you'd put more pressure on the enemy team by being a direct threat than trying to flank or camp 24/7.

    • @AlexanderRM1000
      @AlexanderRM1000 Před 4 lety +13

      AIUI the main problem with Pyro is he doesn't fit a clear role the way other classes do (power, pick or support) making him hard to balance. Note how for a year or so after the Pyro update he was considered *overpowered* (although maybe that was more in pubs?) because of he got within range he could just murder a whole room full of enemies; then they adjusted damage again and he went straight back to underpowered.

    • @gueton5200
      @gueton5200 Před 4 lety +24

      @@AlexanderRM1000 i'm a pyro main, yeah he doesn't necessarily fit into those categories, i guess the phrase "jack of all trades master of none" fits pyro pretty well, not to say he can't be good or useful, it's easiest class to check for spies (which i still believe it's an accidental The Thing reference), reflecting rockets, pills, arrows, jarate, Uber charges and even dragon's fury fire (honestly the airblast is the best part of the pyro), you can deal with large groups far easier, his loadouts needs more interesting stuff unlike wm1 incentivators like the Phlog, but there's a lot of interesting choices you can have, like detonator for traps and increased mobility, jetpack to get to places unacessible to most classes, etc, he can be a really good class if the situation calls for it, but if the enemy team has like one or more good heavy's you practically become useless, not even mentioning how most classes can 1-2 shot you, pyro is far from overpowered, at least right now, kinda funny when i'm struggling to do anything and then an enemy complains that i'm overpowered or that i didn't do melee when i was at low health and surrounded by enemies lol

  • @acfgcnbjh
    @acfgcnbjh Před 4 lety +14

    1:55 "...weaponry, he's a good *AH* ffensive class". This scared the shit outta me for some reason lol

  • @PepperoniMilkshake
    @PepperoniMilkshake Před 4 lety +99

    It's weird that only a bit of this still holds true to this day

    • @whammeister3002
      @whammeister3002 Před 4 lety +37

      I'd say most of it holds up, most of the main differences are a result of the grenades that were removed in tf2, but other than, that the essential role of the classes carried over pretty well in my opinion.

    • @USERWASBANNED
      @USERWASBANNED Před 4 lety +6

      In comp with class limits and weapon bans, pretty much all of this holds up

    • @MetalX34
      @MetalX34 Před 4 lety +6

      you're right, a lot has changed:
      scout isn't weak af anymore and is now a powerhouse
      demo isn't the strongest at close range but the weakest, and serves more often at the frontline
      medic is full support instead of being what's pretty much the tf2 scout with a sticky jumper and a fucked up melee.
      ppl and volvo found out pyro is garbo as a "first line of defense" and turned it into a leafblower
      rest of the classes do feel fairly similar to their ancestors in function tho.

    • @Wintd1
      @Wintd1 Před 4 lety +1

      @@whammeister3002 I'd say most of it holds up besides the medic. He got a complete overhaul transitioning to TF2 and became a lot more passive than he was in QTF/TFC.

  • @pathulhu200
    @pathulhu200 Před 4 lety +2199

    they literally designed pyro to be garbage

    • @heidiaguirre5672
      @heidiaguirre5672 Před 4 lety +173

      Yup and he still is and always will be a gimmick class

    • @neptuniamarina4924
      @neptuniamarina4924 Před 4 lety +283

      @@heidiaguirre5672 And yet He's probably still all around better then Spy nowadays.

    • @MetalX34
      @MetalX34 Před 4 lety +315

      tbf they designed lots of classes with pretty garbage roles (scout having no good gun, medic being often better than scout, ect.), so you could say that "pyro is meant to just burn people and not kill" is just them experimentating.
      what's less forgivable is how they still believed that idea would work in tf2, resulting in a poor design covered with a hundred bandaids.
      hell, if spy is also a gimmick, at least his presence doesn't make the interactions more linear, which puts it far above pyro as a contributor of the game's quality.

    • @AnnieC.1993
      @AnnieC.1993 Před 4 lety +87

      And yet I still die to afterburn. It shouldn't even be in the game. All it does is kill me because captain crutch (black box conch escape plan soldier) took my health pack when he was at 199 health and I was at 20 with decreasing health.

    • @cerocero2817
      @cerocero2817 Před 4 lety +143

      I'm pretty sure they also made it with people with shitty internet connections that can't aim in mind, but I can't remember where I read that.

  • @maxithalo7796
    @maxithalo7796 Před 3 lety +9

    some of these still hold up, honestly
    Soldier, heavy, engineer, spy they all changed a lot over time but their core mechanics are still the focus today
    Medic makes me chuckle tho lmao

  • @alexlokanin3312
    @alexlokanin3312 Před 4 lety +14

    some of the tfc descriptions are obsolete in tf2, most importantly, medic. he used to be more deadly than the scout in tfc, now he's strictly the healer.

  • @SkyNinja759
    @SkyNinja759 Před 4 lety +13

    1:46 I don't think I have ever heard someone spell out MIRV. It's always been Muh-er-v. That threw me for a loop.

  • @carbon8ed
    @carbon8ed Před 4 lety +14

    Love how pyro was deliberately designed to be cannon fodder (and has stayed that way ever since) and medic was originally intended to be a sniper counter lmao.

  • @AnthanKrufix
    @AnthanKrufix Před 4 lety +3

    I think the biggest takaway is that the medic was designed to be primarily a personally offensive class who could hold their own in a fight, but then who could also could heal allies during downtime between combats.
    Anyone who's played TFC knows the meme about Medic just being a better Scout. Slightly less movement speed but better armored and with better weapons, and even also had the Conc-Grenades which was basically a free sticky-jumper... While their healing duties were linked to their melee weapon and required both they and their ally stand still to be healed and couldn't even bring them up to 'full' health because it couldn't repair armor.
    The invention of the Medigun and the healing beam in TF2 really did wonders to the medic class of not only TF2 but all team shooters.

  • @valkstir2403
    @valkstir2403 Před 4 lety +14

    Wait... Pyro was a (mostly) defensive class and Demo was an (mostly) offensive one? That explains a lot...

  • @fangrowls6336
    @fangrowls6336 Před 4 lety +95

    edit: i got complains about my previous comment so i will be switching it with one that praise the author of the video creativity about the dear god segment.
    thank you gentlemen

    • @rainermist2357
      @rainermist2357 Před 4 lety +11

      Yes, this is what the video said. No need to repeat it.

    • @fangrowls6336
      @fangrowls6336 Před 4 lety +3

      @@rainermist2357 repeating it its notifying the creator of this how much i enjoyed that

    • @rainermist2357
      @rainermist2357 Před 4 lety +4

      @@fangrowls6336 OR, what's more likely, it's a low-effort sure-fire way to rake in some likes?
      At least it's less effort than telling the creator "Hey, I laughed at X. Thank you."

    • @egorence2149
      @egorence2149 Před 4 lety

      DEAR GOD

    • @MrFathat
      @MrFathat Před 4 lety

      @Thertane stajia dear god...

  • @EpicSlash
    @EpicSlash Před 4 lety +6

    Currently I'm designing a custom game mode for Halo 5, inspired by Team Fortress, this video was an interesting topic as I'm currently going through the same challenge the original team went through when designing the purpose of each class.

  • @figeon
    @figeon Před 3 lety +3

    2:51 This! I've always seen the Pyro more as a support class rather than an offensive one. People love to laugh about how the pyro is a weak class, but he's really just more of a support class rather than an offensive one. The Pyro is at it's best when he's staying at the front lines, extinguishing teammates, checking for spies, deflecting rockets and grenades from your team in the backlines and from the sentry nest, removing sappers. What I would like to see is more variety of weapons for the pyro to allow him to become a good high damage offensive class, give him more versatility, just like the other classes.

    • @Hungeryan
      @Hungeryan Před 2 lety

      If you want to try Pyro offensively, try out the Dragon's Fury. It's not the very best but it isn't bad by any means.

    • @infucktus4899
      @infucktus4899 Před rokem

      This is old version of pyro ure confused

  • @badcatalex
    @badcatalex Před 4 lety +1

    Holy shit your production quality is amazing

  • @exxelsetijadi5348
    @exxelsetijadi5348 Před 4 lety +2

    Technically all the classes are throwaway classes too
    -scout's weapon roster mostly revolves around assists and is just a fast engineer
    -soldier relies on medics and teammates for his blast jumps and banners
    -pyro you already know why
    -demo relies accuracy and not killing yourself and well timed charges and clicks
    -heavy almost has no hope of survival if he runs out of ammo because he has little backup weapons
    -engie has a small weapon roster and most of them focus on spy checking and building maintenance
    -medic also has a small weapon roster and relies on teammates to maximize survival
    -sniper has a sharp learning curve and is almost useless when out of ammo
    -spy is almost instantly dead when he gets busted and most of his his melee weapons decrease his health / cloak meter

    • @xyzzy-dv6te
      @xyzzy-dv6te Před 4 lety

      So basically, the classes are designed for teamwork

    • @shamrocksardonic2582
      @shamrocksardonic2582 Před 3 lety +2

      This commentary is back from the days of Quakemod Team Fortress, and almost nothing about it holds true today. Scout, for example, was quite literally overshadowed by Medic, who was a combat class who _sometimes_ healed his teammates, but mostly just used his grenades to fly around the map at mach 10 and blast people with the super shotgun.

  • @kovacsabelkristof3566
    @kovacsabelkristof3566 Před 4 lety +15

    Notice, how he always mentioned the pyro as ,,him"

    • @cinex20
      @cinex20 Před 4 lety +14

      Notice, how the TF1 and TFC classes aren't the same people as the TF2 mercenaries.

    • @mittenstherealest
      @mittenstherealest Před 3 lety

      OH SHIT RETCON ALERT!!

    • @7tales311
      @7tales311 Před 3 lety

      @@mittenstherealest the pyro in tfc was literally revealed as female in the comics

    • @mittenstherealest
      @mittenstherealest Před 3 lety

      @@7tales311 Exactly!!

    • @gudmansal3468
      @gudmansal3468 Před 10 měsíci

      the qtf, tfc and tf2 ones are not the same ones

  • @lagpeanut
    @lagpeanut Před 4 lety +16

    never been this early to your vid before, but imma say i love all your vids man :D always interesting and creative, keep it up

  • @ananasasjenkins881
    @ananasasjenkins881 Před 4 lety

    I love your channel man. Its beautiful

  • @garbage3970
    @garbage3970 Před 4 lety +4

    Quality content, as always

  • @stealthc0bra433
    @stealthc0bra433 Před 4 lety +37

    Scout:
    And his grenades are a good way to...
    Me: *HOL
    UP*

    • @jakobknecht7654
      @jakobknecht7654 Před 4 lety +15

      All classes used to have grenades. That's not new info.

    • @solforecast2101
      @solforecast2101 Před 4 lety +5

      @Pyrokaliptyk wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Scout_(Classic) check this out.

    • @no-better-name
      @no-better-name Před 4 lety

      @@solforecast2101 doesn't this just confirm Scout had no frags? he had caltrops (spiky bois) and concussion grenades (insane knockback)

    • @usernametaken017
      @usernametaken017 Před 3 lety

      @@no-better-name comcusion granades are still granedes

    • @no-better-name
      @no-better-name Před 3 lety

      @@usernametaken017 i meant that frags ≠ grenades, frags = fragmentation grenades. scout does have caltrops and concs, tho

  • @FancyPantaloons
    @FancyPantaloons Před 3 lety +8

    "Demoman is a good offensive class" Demoman: *Is literally classified as defense*

  • @leonader9465
    @leonader9465 Před rokem

    Really interesting how well these have held up.

  • @cupofspiders5830
    @cupofspiders5830 Před 3 lety +3

    Medics who are “a good class in most situations”
    Fascinating.

  • @FortressOne
    @FortressOne Před 4 lety +6

    The Quake Team Fortress community is still alive and well. Come join us: www.fortressone.org

  • @SSSavanti
    @SSSavanti Před 4 lety +90

    I just realized that the "demo" in demoman means "demolition" and not "demon" and I feel extremely stupid

    • @ImGonnaFudgeThatFish
      @ImGonnaFudgeThatFish Před 4 lety +60

      ahhhh this really be a bruh moment

    • @elviejodelabolsa8263
      @elviejodelabolsa8263 Před 4 lety +27

      I got introduced to TF2 by a comment on the Benny Hill theme video that mentioned the Demoknight and edgy me thought it said "Demonknight" so I looked up TF2 and there I am

    • @thetrashmann8140
      @thetrashmann8140 Před 4 lety +7

      "You Crazy Man"- Demolitions Man, Team Fortress 2

    • @faceless2302
      @faceless2302 Před 4 lety +6

      I think the profile picture is fitting

    • @de_soot
      @de_soot Před 4 lety +26

      *_how_*

  • @dudeonspeed1
    @dudeonspeed1 Před 4 lety +2

    i'm glad there's still cool tf2 content in 2020

  • @Sporaticzzz
    @Sporaticzzz Před 3 lety +1

    Pyro: was designed to be a support class and was then made into an even better support class with air blast.
    Like half of his unlocks: we don’t do that here

  • @DoctorChained
    @DoctorChained Před 4 lety +17

    Heavy uses an "Assault cannon?"
    Are we making up weapon names now?

    • @carlosdavidg7
      @carlosdavidg7 Před 4 lety +21

      Thats what the minigun was called in quake team fortress

    • @gudmansal3468
      @gudmansal3468 Před 10 měsíci

      qtf used that name

  • @airank3861
    @airank3861 Před 3 lety +3

    I always knew that Valve switched up Demo and Pyro when listing classes as "offense" or "defense"

  • @lightningbug9564
    @lightningbug9564 Před 3 lety +1

    when playing a character in the video game i try to get into their mind set like
    scout is cocky but kinda cowardly = annoying hit and run tactics
    medic is a mad scientist = always confident in their skills and ready to get his hands dirty
    sniper is very professional = stay calm have a plan to kill everyone you see

  • @EeveeMaster547
    @EeveeMaster547 Před rokem

    I find it so fascinating how they've changed over time, and yet still retained some of the core details.

  • @raccoonpope7143
    @raccoonpope7143 Před 4 lety +8

    The fact that he only used a shotgun on Heavy makes me beyond annoyed

  • @ledraps22
    @ledraps22 Před 4 lety +9

    pyro definitely strayed from that role of front line of defense. Safe to say soldier's role also applies to pyro too now. The description for heavy also seems to have transitioned to the casual engineer building level 3 sentry nest that we have nowadays. The one for medic which notes it's a counter to sniper seems to be gone entirely.

    • @seronymus
      @seronymus Před 3 lety

      *laughs in Crusader's Crossbow*

  • @spelare1
    @spelare1 Před 3 lety

    3:29 "... but if they're unaware, he can kill them before they can blink." *cuts to clip of failed backstab where enemy was very unaware*

  • @TrustyGun2
    @TrustyGun2 Před 7 měsíci +1

    Other than the description of the Medic, these are all basically the foundations of each class even today.

  • @nopinappleshere8861
    @nopinappleshere8861 Před 4 lety +3

    i feel like some of the characters went in a completely different direction to what robin spoke about here

  • @soullessleftover8427
    @soullessleftover8427 Před 4 lety +4

    It's still amazing how this game does so well unlike the ability clones, that are flooding in the market.

  • @CapemanProducti0ns
    @CapemanProducti0ns Před 4 lety

    Fascinating, it's like looking at the sketch of the huge art piece that TF2 got to be

  • @grentreem3096
    @grentreem3096 Před 4 lety

    Interesting >:))))))) And thanks for this insanely usefull information this will help in any future attempts at playing TF2

  • @nearlyepoint249
    @nearlyepoint249 Před 4 lety +6

    yes

    • @shounic
      @shounic  Před 4 lety +7

      your username is a blight on humanity, but i respect it. truly outside the box.

    • @ranibro
      @ranibro Před 4 lety

      i can subscrie by pressing ctrl + - , look

    • @thetrashmann8140
      @thetrashmann8140 Před 4 lety

      this guy has been driving me insane but I don't know why

  • @sparklepawz1185
    @sparklepawz1185 Před 4 lety +8

    Now a days it's:
    Scout: best overall offensive class, able to pick his fights and dance around the enemy, not giving them a chance to hit any shots but rather lacking in defensive abilities especially in tight spaces.
    Soldier: core class. An easy class that's effective even for new players but once mastered is a major offensive and defensive threat.
    Pyro: best offensive support class. Able to redirect projectiles to keep teammates safe and deny pushes while still being able to attack with his teammates though at a limited range/capacity.
    Demo: most versatile class, able to defend and attack at the same time with his grenades and sticky bombs in any situation.
    Heavy: best overall defensive class. Massive damage in close-mid range but struggles to push forward with his team. Wins most of the fights he picks but has to commit even when the tides turn.
    Medic: Best overall class. Not having a medic leaves you at an automatic disadvantage.
    Engineer: best defensive support class. Able to shut down areas with a sentry, support teammates with dispensers and teleporters, but unable to effectively push with the team without major sacrifices (using a mini instead or swapping a rescue ranger for a shotgun).
    Sniper: the best pick class, able to down any class in one shot as long as they do not have uber or resistances.
    Spy: just kinda there. Without mastering multiple trickstabs, spy is outclassed in most, if not all cases, often dying right after a kill.

  • @Kilgorx
    @Kilgorx Před 4 lety +1

    1:12 "but his lack of close range weaponry means hes glt trouble if the opponent should get withing range" says as he hits 2 point blank headshots

  • @arken2583
    @arken2583 Před 3 lety +1

    The Pyro in the thumbnail is beautiful. I want it now, please.

  • @facemcshooty6602
    @facemcshooty6602 Před 3 lety +5

    pyro: designed to be garbage
    engineer: designed to be stealmatey

  • @eddboi2486
    @eddboi2486 Před 4 lety +3

    It’s interesting that he would say that medic would be a good counter for sniper, that would mean that somehow the medic would have to get behind the enemy lines rather than supporting the team.

  • @remag6371
    @remag6371 Před 4 lety

    For a sec i thought this was an ad video before i noticed the e n h a n c e d p y r o

  • @captainkeyes9913
    @captainkeyes9913 Před 3 lety +1

    “The sniper is ideal for long range”
    Shows a clip of a pyro being quick scoped at point blank

  • @MarkoLaske
    @MarkoLaske Před 4 lety +3

    pyros purpose is to die first. I like how robin was thinking

  • @QuazzleTheQaz
    @QuazzleTheQaz Před 4 lety +8

    Joel needs to play TF2...😞

  • @JuniDoesStuff
    @JuniDoesStuff Před rokem

    It's interesting to see how far the classes have come from their original TF/TFC design docs.

  • @bradlauk1419
    @bradlauk1419 Před 4 lety +1

    and then 400 updates and 30 power creep weapons later and we've got demomen who charge long range and cut people's heads off, pyros who fly all over critting when they use the backburner and killing in moments, engineers who get crit shotguns, et al.
    They really fucked up the meta man.

  • @bassbusterx
    @bassbusterx Před 4 lety +17

    sorry but the way you say "weaponary" distracts me. nice vid tho

  • @TKsh1
    @TKsh1 Před 4 lety +3

    Playing Heavy in TF2 is hell on Earth. Unless you have considerable gamesense and a decent Medic on your team, you get stomped hard by almost all of the classes. They're just stronger and more practical to play, what's the point of playing a tank class if you can't even stand on your own?
    Also fuck Pyro lol

    • @Wintd1
      @Wintd1 Před 4 lety

      Heavy is pretty easy to play in pubs since most pubbers have horrible gamesense and don't realize that you're not supposed to take on a Heavy directly at close range. Highlander is a very different story however, and I think it's one of the main reasons (other than Heavy already being one of the least popular classes to begin with) why he's often one of the last classes to be filled.

  • @justatinyturtle871
    @justatinyturtle871 Před 3 lety

    jeez shounic had no clue you were so good at the actual game

  • @EditRealityGaming
    @EditRealityGaming Před 4 lety

    Dig the Dustforce music. Chill as all hell

  • @timur5241
    @timur5241 Před 3 lety +1

    scout - intelligence
    soldier - assault
    pyro - sweep
    demoman - ambush
    heavy - suppression
    engie - control
    medic - his name speaks for himself
    sniper - his name speaks for himself
    spy - infiltration

    • @gudmansal3468
      @gudmansal3468 Před 10 měsíci

      medic is literally intelligence, you just shoot people with the nailgun and medkit and fly into their base to get the intel, medic is just more suit for intel than scout

  • @endarkenedgd
    @endarkenedgd Před 5 měsíci +1

    random fact: in tfc, medic's shotgun did more damage than scout's, so before the bhop fix was added, medic was better at being a scout than the scout was at being a scout
    lul

  • @cbeam1506
    @cbeam1506 Před 3 lety

    I like how pyro footage got replaced with a whole death cam

  • @hansonkerman7286
    @hansonkerman7286 Před rokem +1

    as a pyro main, being a throwaway idiot is actually kind of fun when i feel like it

  • @rallo9635
    @rallo9635 Před 4 lety

    damn that is so crazy and cool damn

  • @foundati0n
    @foundati0n Před 4 lety +2

    demoman being described as a primarily offensive class, and pyro as a first line of defense / support one, hmm.

  • @tetraphobie
    @tetraphobie Před rokem

    Never thought of mad milk as a supportive grenade but sure that works.

  • @2copy3copy4cpoy
    @2copy3copy4cpoy Před 2 lety

    Cobra Assault Cannon.
    State of the art.
    bang-bang.

  • @raxor_
    @raxor_ Před 4 lety

    thanks you, showonic

  • @j-sting8031
    @j-sting8031 Před 3 lety

    Very interesting that the pyro could be a supportive class because of his afterburn so he’s kinda like a damage medic made to support with after burn

  • @tuke3541
    @tuke3541 Před 3 lety +1

    "the engineer works primarily as a support class"
    Me placing down my 10th agressive sentry again with 0 teamsupport. Not due to a bad team but due to me failing to read the room "Repeat that"

  • @nqv497
    @nqv497 Před 3 lety +1

    I like how most of his clips feature nice frags while pyro's section is just a dead pyro

  • @pieofchart
    @pieofchart Před 3 lety

    Thank you, Robin "Bro" Walker.