Why our initial expat attempt didn't work for us!
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- čas přidán 18. 05. 2024
- We tried taking the expat route in 2021 during the pandemic. Our first attempt didn't really work for us. This video describes some of the issues that impacted our decisions at that time.
Taking the expat route is a major life change, with a wide range of impacts - financial, lifestyle and personal. It may work great for you, or you may have some reactions similar to ours. Each person will have their own specific circumstances that will impact the suitability of an expat move to their life.
We did a scouting trip to see if it felt right. We had seen lots of people reporting positive experiences as expats, and were at a point in our lives where we no longer needed to live in our previous location, and had minimal responsibilities tying us to our home country. It was an amazing adventure, but in the end, the overall balance of pros and cons tilted to not making a full move.
The key to evaluating the suitability of an expat move is to obtain as much information and possible, on all sides of the issues, to determine the full range of issues you will confront, and assess the impact of these issues based on your specific circumstances and needs, to see if the expat route is right for you. Hopefully this video can contribute to a small part of that information, and can be useful in helping others considering this type of move.
If you liked this video, please LIKE AND SUBSCRIBE to support the channel!
We have a few others in the works that will be out soon (when we can fit in working on them around our paying work).
ABOUT US: We are interested in exploring how slowing down your travel impacts your experience of the location and culture, as a slow traveler or part time expat, and can help you get in sync with the culture and gain a deeper experience. If you are new to the idea of slow travel, check out our recent video that explains the overall concept.
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We got rid of most of our belongings, and headed to Portugal to move overseas. But it didn't really work out for a number of reasons. But we are really happy with the alternative - being slow travelers and part-time expats! We have a small home in the USA that is our home base, and spend 1-3 months at a time in one place overseas, several times a year. We stay long enough to really learn about a place's people and the history, and experience living in the culture.
And in case you were wondering: Our channel title "89 Days Away" refers to the EU Schengen limit of letting visitors stay 3 months (in the Schengen zone) during a visit-living away for 89 days before having to go home. If you want to stay away for longer, some other countries let you stay for 6 months, so you can put together an agenda that allows you to stay overseas as long as you need to get what you are looking for.
00:00 Introduction
01:11 Housing
02:30 Systems are not transparent
03:34 Taxes and Immigration
05:43 Assimilation
06:49 It can be lonely
07:32 We came back home to reassess
We tried taking the expat route in 2021 during the pandemic. Our first attempt didn't really work for us. This video describes some of the issues that impacted our decisions at the time.
Taking the expat route is a major life decision, with a wide range of impacts - financial, lifestyle and personal. It may work great for you, or you may have some reactions similar to ours. Each person will have their own specific circumstances that will impact the suitability of an expat move to their life.
We did a scouting trip to see if it felt right. We had seen lots of people reporting positive experiences as expats, and were at a point in our lives where we no longer needed to live in our previous location, and had minimal responsibilities tying us to our home country. It was an amazing adventure, but in the end, the overall balance of pros and cons tilted to not making a full move.
The key to evaluating the suitability of an expat move is to obtain as much information and possible, on all sides of the issues, to determine the full range of issues you will confront, and assess the impact of these issues based on your specific circumstances and needs, to see if the expat route is right for you. Hopefully this video can contribute to a small part of that information, and can be useful in helping others considering this type of move.
Edit: Glad to see this video has promoted a lot of great comments. Thank you for sharing. We can all learn from your experiences.
If you liked this video, please LIKE AND SUBSCRIBE to support the channel! We have a few others in the works that will be out soon (when we can fit them in around our paying work).
Thank you for providing such an honest assessment of moving abroad. After watching the video and reading all of the comments, I can see that many of my concerns about leaving the US and relocating to Europe are valid.
Here are some other concerns that your followers may need to be aware of if they are not retired and work for themselves.
I am a business owner, and i've discovered that moving me AND my business abroad by completely expatriating is problematic. First, if you sell digital or physical products and Stripe is your main payment processor, you need to know that Stripe isn't available in all European countries. The same holds true for Paypal. Even if you relocate to a company where Stripe is supported, if your main customer base is in the US and they're buying in US dollars, then the $$ needs to be forwarded to your European bank account. This means a currency conversion plus added fees, which can cut into your profit margins. European banks may also "sit" on the money coming in to your account while they assess whether or not you're running a legit business (that you're not laundering money, for example).
Second is the corporate tax rate in whatever country you live in (in France it's an extortionate 33%).
Third, if a European country is going to make it difficult to get a visa or driver's license, just think about the hassles you'll have running a business over there.
Fourth is that if you expatriate (give up your American citizenship) yet have employees in the US who are working in an office, or in a warehouse packing and shipping products for your business, the IRS is still going to tax you.
There are so many CZcamsrs out there preaching how you can be a digital nomad, live anywhere in the world, and earn an income That might work if you are a blogger, IG influencer or writer. But if you are selling things online, even digital products, you open up a great big can of worms.
So for anyone reading this who wants to live abroad and be self-employed, you need to do a LOT of research about payment methods, banking and corporate taxes before you quit the US and go over there.
At this point I'm considering the slow travel method.
Love your speaking voice, by the way---I had you pegged as a Philly guy too until I read the comments below. Keep these videos coming, they're excellent.
I´ve been an expat in Germany for 23 years. I moved here to take a job and am still here. No place is perfect, but the only problem I have is that the States get weirder and weirder every time I visit. One of the best parts about living here is the traveling I can do during vacations to all the wonderful parts of Europe. I pay a higher tax rate here, but my quality of life is much higher than in most parts of the States. Everyone has to make their own decision, but living in Europe has a lot of plusses (pluses?).
The idea of traveling throughout the EU on cheap flights and trains was a big attraction for us.
I moved to the UK 40 years ago. I am in New York city right now about to go to jfk to fly home. After a month back in country of my birth, I will be happy to return home. The expense, the crazy politics, crazy drivers! I don't regret being an expat. I don't understand America anymore.
I have heard from several expats who did not appreciate how easy day to day living is in the US until they tried living somewhere else. You are not alone.
ye are in that same boat - been in mexico for almost 1 yr - everything is so much more expensive for "gringos", and I feel we got scammed at every interaction this year, until we learned so many things... we are thinking to go back to the usa after another year here, give it more time before going back... not saving much at all giving the bad conversion rates and the rampant inflation in mexico
I was an expat for work, 20 yrs in 5 different countries in 2 South American locations, Africa, Great Britain and Azerbaijan. Always rented housing but bought autos. No place on earth will be like the country you left. Living out of your comfort zone provides great growth. Not everyone can adapt and that’s ok. Best experiences of my life. Currently in US but looking for that next destination to try out in retirement years. Healthcare is #1 on my radar.
It also takes a few months just to figure a place out.
As a single retiree, I thought relocating to a country with a low cost of living would be the ideal solution to stretch my limited funds - who wouldn't want to live in an exotic place at half the rent? So I traveled to 40 countries over a decade but finally decided keeping my studio apartment in Chicago made more sense. I can still travel as much or as long as I want but I always have a place to come back to, and a physical US address for residency.
Exactly! I
Plan on slow traveling around 9mos out of the year and come home for the holidays. I still have my paid off home and rent the front 2bdrm a to tenant who practically pay all my bill back home as a side hustle.. Looking forward to to retirement in 1-2yrs and start my journey
I too have been very fortunate to have traveled around the world.... But remember You can always use services like " Traveling Mailbox" which gives You a brick and mortar address in the USA for a low as $19 bucks a month and will shred or forward your mail/bills to anywhere in the World.......And no I don't work for them
We use a place called St. Brendan's Isle for our mail forwarding (Not paid by them)
Yeah Linda I can see that. I've gone round and round about moving abroad but I think I should keep my little house in Arlington Heights despite the stupid property taxes and just travel a few times a year. Worst case I might have to rent a room out 😮
But Chicago is crazy expensive and the health insurance costs, housing & food costs are going to continue to rise.
It's gonna be even more difficult for ppl on a fixed income. 😮
These are the exact reasons that we opt for part-time expat slow travel. There is too much risk and the fact that the process is not transparent sets up a foreigner for disaster. Thank you for sharing your experience and happy travels!
Can you explain what is "part-time expat slow travel "?.
I do not see any reason to ever purchase a house/apartment in a country you are not a citizen of. Real estate is very easy to get into and very difficult to get out of.
Some EU friends were telling us that it would be much wiser to rent vs. purchase for a number of reasons.
I disagree. I wouldn't want to rent forever, not knowing whether or not I can stay for as long as I want to (think e.g. the owner selling and new owners wanting to move in) and not having it customized to my wishes.
Renting is a great option while you find a location you want. The property can be left to a family member. But you need a good expat community, IMHO.
@@peterfischer7084 If your not a citizen, you can always be forced out of the country and your house confiscated. Property laws outside the US are very different.
Zoning is especially different or nonexistent. I know a guy that bought a condo in Thailand, and a year later a disco opened up across the street. Music booming until 4am every day.
@philpatt970 That depends on which country you're talking about. Within the EU, I doubt very much that this is/ the case even for non-EU citizens. For EU-citizens living in another EU country (such as myself) it certainly isn't.
I traveled and live in Europe, Africa and Asia before I was 40. Then I returned to the U.S. for the past 25 years. I think, from what you describe, it was easier uprooting a life that wasn’t too “rooted” when I was 20 - 35 and relatively poor (with few material comforts) and had more energy than it was as I got older. By the time I was over 40, I wanted more money, stability, to be closer to my parents who were getting older, etc. I was more flexible back then and adapted easier to different lifestyles, mainly because I had less expectations, I was more fit, and more ignorant. I was in adventure mode. Now, as I’m getting ready to retire, I am looking forward to traveling again but for shorter trips. I love having my home to come back to where my family is and where I am always familiar. I still want to explore, but I am more interested in comfort, mentally and physically,
I tell my kids, if you are interested in living abroad, do it while you are young and have few responsibilities.
I'm a single retiree with a small income. PRE-COVID I researched Portugal which would have been affordable at that point. Then I learned that I am eligible for Italian citizenship by descent - andd spent months gathering documents to support my claim.
But for the past 2 years, Portugal has become much more expensive and bureaucratically difficult. And Italy has its own problems. Given the economic and demographic issues in the EU now - and the seemingly endless Ukraine conflict- I decided last year that I'm too old for an Expat Misadventure.
I'll have to agree with all of these points. Living overseas can be an absolute nightmare. I lived & worked in Malta for a year & initially, me & my wife were excited about the prospect of living on a Mediterranean island but the novelty lasted about 2-3 months before we started seeing real problems across the board.
The main one being just how primitive living there was. It was like living in the UK in the 70's. It was that far behind in terms of infrastructure & amenities. Simple things like no central heating in winter (which were surprisingly cold) caught us both off-guard.
Decent food from supermarkets I normally take for granted in the UK was almost non existent in Malta. It was extremely difficult to adjust to. After a year, we came back.
Next, I ended up working in Sweden. A beautiful country with no language barrier, as they speak perfect English there and the people were fantastic. I went in 2017 & their immigration issues were becoming a real problem in Gothenburg, so I could start to feel the tension in the city. It was starting to become a bit ugly.
Housing is cronically bad in Sweden & the house prices are absolutely bonkers for a shed in the country. Most people live in apartments but they are overcrowded with waiting lists that go on for years. On top of that, the tax absolutely crucifies you, so even though it was a beautiful country with great people, living there was just out of the question & that's coming from someone who had a very well paid job. It just wasn't worth the investment. Just after I left, the UK came out of the EU following Brexit & so the timing of my departure was absolutely perfect. It was literally a few months after I left that everything changed as I would have needed visas & all that hassle.
Best thing I ever did was to return to the UK and work from home. I've never looked back, mainly because my mortgage has been paid off for years, I have good pensions I've cashed in while myself & my wife still working & earning good money both of us working from home, so a large disposable income I'd rather spend in the country I've been born & raised in. I'm just getting too old to mess around with relocation now but 2-3 holidays a year is absolutely how it should be but having said that, I'm quite happy taking time off when I like & going down to my local pub and having a nice meal & a few pints. You can't beat that really.
You didn't do your research before relocating.
@@JamesG1126 Research won't tell you everything. We settled in a small town, but traveled through some lovely and similar-sized towns in other states that really wouldn't have done at all. You have to go there and get a feel for it.
Keywords: large disposable income, no mortgage. Not everyone has this luxury and so living abroad becomes that much more appealing. For many people it's going to be well worth the time, energy and money to become an expat.
@@jackbaldwin3649 Isn't gloating when someone feels the need to proclaim "no mortgage, large disposable income"? Sure sounds like it to me!
@@jackbaldwin3649Want to visit family and friends? That costs money. Want to have sick care insurance? That costs money. Factor in all costs and life as an expat is expensive. If you want cheap retirement, look for a 50 year old single wide in Alabama.
As someone thats traveled a lot after a while one place starts to look like all the others. its a nice fantasy to find a foreign land where everything seems wonderful but seldom translates into reality. I think your decision to just visit different countries part time is the perfect solution. Im going to do that
This is awfully honest AND refreshing at the sam time. For someone that grew up in a latin country, have spent 34 years in the US since, and now is looking to relocate permanently as "early retired" to a completely different and new environment in Europe, it is nice to see that I am not crazy when I see lots of the pitfalls others brush off. I have come to the point of realizing that owning a place in Italy so I can "feel at home" when there while having the privilege of being in the US for family time with my sons and yet having tons of time to slow travel is something far more valuable TO ME PERSONALLY than what's advertised by many that have done none!! Way too many videos glamorizing things that are not there and brushing off the vast reality most of us will encounter. YMMV!!!!
We really wanted to make it work, but as we tried to push the process forward, it eventually seemed to be more trouble and effort than was worth it. The approach may work for many people - it did not for us. Glad to hear others had the same reaction.
@@89daysaway I do think the ERV for most european countries is great for "some people", but they are certainly not for everyone retired that wants to spend a lot of time in Europe and my or may not have a home there. Yes, it does eliminate the option of 100% full immersion to the local culture, but at the same time it does cripple your ability to travel and do many other things. Which is better? It is entirely up to you!!!
You touched on some of the issues that led my husband and me to become urban "expats" (lives spent in Los Angeles, Phoenix, Denver, Washington, DC) in rural (under 1,000 people) northwest Wyoming. No state taxes. No estate taxes. Incredibly friendly people. Laws, language, building codes, and business systems that we largely understood. Plus scenery that is jaw-droppingly gorgeous. Urban areas foster anonymity and loneliness, high costs and stress. In 17 years living in DCs northern Virginia suburbs we only knew our neighbors on either side enough to say Hi across the fence, no one else. Our first weeks in Wyoming we met dozens of people, many of whom invited us into their homes for dinner.
When changing your environment you have to plunge in and adapt. If the culture, religion, or politics is radically different from yours, you have to accept it and consider that maybe they're doing something right, because you fell in love with their town. You can't bring your urban attitudes and expectations and want to change everything.
In DC job titles and education gave you social status, and as a TV producer and Pentagon senior analyst we'd been in the middle of it. Here it's your ability to build things, repair things, start a business. Hunting, fishing, ranching. Our former jobs mean nothing. We have no movie theater, no concert hall. We have no high-end, fast-food, or chain restaurants, but we have cafes where we know all the staff by name and they know us. We have good neighbors ready to lend a hand with whatever problem.
Our town depends on tourism in the summer. In winter, entertainment is hosting dinner parties where you reconnect with neighbors, outdoor winter sports, and (as I did last night) going to bread baking classes. If your comfort zone is urban, but with cost and culture a factor, you might consider smaller cities in Middle America. Large cities, like DC, have become a nightmare. And yes, slow travel first. You will know when you find the right place. We traveled in our Airstream trailer across the country for three years before wandering into our little town for a week. We went on to South Lake Tahoe where we'd planned to stay 6 weeks, but after just 2 we looked at each other and said, "Let's go back." We went back and bought 4 acres of land and started building a house.
We have been to scores of cities and countries all over the world, but every morning we look out our windows at the river and the wildlife and we couldn't be happier. We still plan to travel, but with our little town as a base.
That sounds absolutely heavenly! (And we're intimately familiar with the DC scene, and totally get it. 😉)
I wasn't looking for an expat experience but when I landed in a small town of about 2,000 in the rural midwest for what I thought would be a temporary stay, I knew I was home. For many of the reasons you state, I plan on never leaving this bright spot I call home until I'm dead.
I was so happy to read your story about moving from the east coast to Wyoming! I live in NYC and just started looking online at Wyoming as a place to live. No income tax, no corporate tax (I own a company). Do you mind if I ask where you live? Your town sounds delightful. Another question I have is, which airport do you use for travel? I've thought about moving to a rural area then wanderlust takes over, telling me to live near an airport! I was looking at Cheyenne because it seems a short distance away from the Denver airport. Thanks so much!
@@jenniferhicks7408 Happy to address any questions. We live in NW Wyoming on one of the routes into Yellowstone. (NW is the incredibly beautiful part of the state and includes the Tetons and 90 percent of Yellowstone Park.) Jackson is the major airport in Wyoming, with several other cities hosting regional airports that can link you to hub airports in places like Denver. Both of us having traveled all over the world with our jobs, we now believe in slow travel and avoid airlines whenever possible, but when we can't avoid planes we use Jackson.
The Jackson Hole area has become absurdly expensive because of the ski resorts, so if you're looking for affordable rural living plan on at least an hour drive into the airport there. Ditto appointments with medical specialists. The southern part of the state has serious winter weather, so take that into consideration too.
When we were looking at real estate we were shown lovely properties up in the mountains or 7-8 miles out of town, but know that "up in the mountains" can mean your place may be inaccessible in the winter and 5-15 degrees colder year round than the valleys. "Out of town" means you'll need to know how to drive on snow, sometimes with chains, sometimes on snowmobiles. No subways here. This is hardy pioneer country.
Take your time doing your research and visit for several weeks at least, before committing yourself. (Watch the film "Baby Boom!"for the NYC to country experience. I thought much of that rural experience shown was a joke until I came here.)
As I said, we love Wyoming, but there are small towns all across America. You just need to find the one that fits. If you have a chance to RV for awhile, that really helps the search. America between the two coasts is just unbelievably beautiful, and for three years we had a blast seeing a good part of it.) Check out Wikipedia for a list of Wyoming airports. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airports_in_Wyoming
Wherever anyone ends up, the key is adaptability. I love that line from the film The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel, that a new experience is like a wave. Try to stand still and it knocks you over. Dive in and you come safely out the other side. Good luck. Hope to see you as a neighbor!
Thank you so much! You cleared up some questions I had. Appreciate it.@@wyominghome4857
The whole "everything in EU is blissfull, c'mon over" tale has been oversold to US/Canada for the past several decades (of which the internet has been all too happy to stoke). Many enjoy EU travel to experience unique cultures, architectures etc. In our most recent vacation (Paris) we found much to complain about but actually enjoyed the challenges (which I'm sure would get old if we had stayed longer) balanced with much to admire and enjoy (including several positive interactions with locals). Your day to day interaction with people will only be as strong as your language fluency (particularly listening) which is a much more significant investment. Thank you for the reality check!
I spent 10 years in France but decided to come back to UK after Brexit, and I'm kinda not regretting it (I thought I might). I'm really glad for the "EU experience", and it was a good experience, but I'm more inclined now to have a UK base and travel to places further afield, like Asia, Australasia, and America. I, too, appreciate the OP's reality check - it could potentially save people a great deal of time, money and heartache.
Great video, that really hits home. Im in Ohio, retired and considering becoming a snowbird in Mexico, I'm Mexican-American so the transition will be seamless as I'm fluent in Spanish and quiet familiar with the customs and traditions the only thing I dont like is the constant fluctuation of the currency (it is getting more expensive) and not wanting to drive in Mexico. As much as I love Mexico I just can't see myself living there year round. I feel i can Airbnb it for at least 3 winter months as I would never purchase property outside of the USA, there's just too much risk involved in such an expensive purchase. I appreciate your insight and sharing your experiences and I wish you all the best. Rafael 😊👍
I just returned to Canada after spending a bit over 2 years living in Panama, great climate and nice people, safe, fairly up to date infrastructure and modern conveniences. But, like you said, awfully isolating and lonely, when you are surrounded by a totally foreign culture and language. It can be worse when you go alone. When we look at moving abroad we only see it through rose colored glasses. At the same time, we only see the negatives of our home country. We don't think of all the familiar things we will miss until we don't have them anymore.
Beautifully put. Exactly the way we felt. And your point about our changing relationship with our home country. We gained a new appreciation for our home country as well, in so many ways. That surprised us. Thank you for watching and writing and welcome home!
Agree that it can much harder alone. I travelled all over Mexico and at times it was quite lonely - also, there is so much to deal with; it is not exactly a 2 week all inclusive beach holiday.
Did you learn Spanish?
No because I wasn't sure if I would want to stay long-term.@@jackbaldwin3649
I think it really boils down to why you are looking for a different place to be.
All really good points. I had to help my mother in a hospital where French was the working language. My French is so-so but I found because I was stressed that my ability to speak was hampered. Hospitals are difficult places to be anytime but having a language barrier makes it way worse. I would never live where English is not widely spoken especially as I get older.
Stay in the US.
Good video. I've lived in Mexico for 4 years, and despite reasonable, mostly consistent efforts to learn Spanish, I have a hard time understanding people. I can deal with daily tasks more than well enough, but you reallly need to be fluent to have a good time with friends. My number one piece of advice is to start studying the language years before moving.
I have a friend fluent in a half dozen languages and one thing he does right at the beginning is read local newspapers. As in the U.S., the issues are broad but the language is about 8th grade level and in reading you can have a dictionary close at hand.
Both Portuguese and spanish are not the most difficult languages for English speakers to learn but do take hundreds of hours of listening to start to understand. Sometimes moving to a place with limited proficiency of the language hampers your language learning as people sometimes tend to communicate with you in English. You have to actively listen and study the language, which can be done way before you make the move
A very thoughtful and honest depiction.
I moved to Porto a year ago and although my experience is different than yours, you are correct in pointing out the effort involved and the reality of the real estate market and taxes.
There is so much I can relate to in this video. You did such a good job presenting the major issues in such an honest way.
I lived in Japan during my 20s. I moved back to the US about 7 years ago for work reasons. I loved livign in Japan and didn't want to move back to the US, but I can completely understand everything you're talking about. It can be very difficult to live abroad and a lot of the people who have never done it can't really grasp how difficult it can be.
Thank you.
Yours is the most accurate description of the challenges expats encounter when they move to a new country. I will share your post with folks I know who are looking to make a move as corroboration to what I have already shared with them.
I settled in Spain 7 years ago after living, studying and/or working in several cities in Canada - my country of origin, Peru, Taiwan, France, the USA, Mexico, and The Netherlands. I have lots of experience as an expat. So much so that I would be an expat in my country of birth as I have very few ties in Canada.
In my experience, the greatest challenge to making a permanent move boils down to communication and unless you have a talent for languages, communication will always be a challenge. I have a talent for languages. I read, write and speak fairly fluent Spanish, still communication remains a challenge due to cultural and tacit dimensions of communication.
I think your issues with transparency of processes and procedures were mostly about communication and unfamiliarity.
You may be surprised to learn that Portugal is actually among the less bureaucratic countries in Europe and significantly more transparent than Italy, France or Spain, those other expat favorites. There are many government resources to help you decipher what to do BUT very few locals know they exist and "professionals" have little incentive to share their "competitive advantage" with you.
As an expat the issue for me has been less the lack of bureaucratic transparency than the recurring cost of bureaucracy. In our first 5 years we spent over 20k euros on bureaucratic processes related to residency and citizenship alone. It took me years to decipher Spanish bureaucracy and find some of available resources. For critical processes like residence permits, income taxes and property purchases, etc. I always work with specialized lawyers who sift thru the endless reems of paperwork and submit things on my behalf thru electronic means available only to them - expensive but easy on my blood pressure.
With regards to coastal housing you are 5 years too late just about anywhere in the world. Portugal and Spain coastal real estate began rising 5 years ago and after the pandemic prices exploded. Decent coastal homes that were selling for 200k to 300k in 2017 are now selling north of 700k. These days what´s left as affordable on the coast anywhere in Europe are mostly overpriced with some serious Sh1t holes on the market as you discovered.
We opted to move inland where housing is significantly more affordable in very idyllic beautiful villages - but the sense of isolation would be unbearable for most. For what it is worth the tsunami of expats in many coastal areas has begun to erode the local culture - in Spain the Costas have become depressing mix of theme park and strip malls with golf clubs here and there. The coast of Spain reminds me of Florida.
You are right to say that as an expat you will never assimilate - you will always be the foreigner. I am not bothered as for locals respectful foreigners are often exempt from the usual social obligations that can be stifling, and in some ways it gives you the freedom to be who you really are without judgement. However, If you are an a$$hole, tolerance will be fleeting.
Your part-time expat compromise is exactly what I recommend to most people who ask me about moving to Spain, especially for retired or near retired folks. But even for younger folks, I caution against going all-in until they have lived in a place for a year or more.
Great post! A very relevant and useful overview for any nationality.
Thank you so much for taking the time to provide such thoughtful and detailed comments. I wrote up notes for the content for this video pretty quickly, and looking back, I really should have clarified a few points better. You really helped clarify things a bit better for me.
I'm a military veteran and in 2012 we left the USSA. We have lived in Eastern Europe and South America and have never looked back. We have lived better in both places than we did in Amerika. Certainly has worked out for us.
Finally some honesty.
I hear you. My wife and I are thinking exactly along the lines of slow travel as well. 3 months a year overseas. One place for an extended time without friends, family or really deep connections with community, would be tough.
Your honesty - especially by social media standards - is refreshing. I suspect you will have saved some people a whole lot of money, time and heartbreak. Only good wishes to you, from a former expat in France (10 years) now back in Blighty 🇬🇧 P.S. I Hope your daughter has an amazing experience in Scotland!
Thank you so very much for your kind words! We do hope to help people with this channel. 😊
thank you for this info. These are all things Ive wondered about, but I've not seen they addressed. You were concise and unbiased.
Great overview and thank you. The inside of DMV background picture as you started talking about bureaucracy was a nice touch.
Beautiful voice. No idea why this video came up on my feed and totally agree with you. Thanks for sharing
We totally agree with your assessment. After spending decades building a low tax retirement in the US, I’m not really interested in giving up our hard saved investments to another country at higher rates than we planned on. For us, slow travel is the best option. Schengen rules can be annoying for sure, but easier to navigate than all the pitfalls you guys have identified.
Thank you for the comment. We were interested in moving to the Netherlands, but after adding up a 1.6% tax on assets, and (mainly) the bite that inheritance taxes would take for our daughter, just visiting for longer periods made much more financial sense.
France doesn’t tax US based pensions, capital gains, or rental incomes. It seems to be the best deal in the EU for Americans that don’t need to work.
Great video and useful information. Thank you and I agree with you. 👏👏🍾
After 3 years of searching for a better place than Sounthern California where we live, we could not find a place that would have a higher quality of life for us 🥲. Yes, cost of living is high in California but life here is great and easy. Like you, we decided to just visit and enjoy other beautiful countries and cultures but not to fully relocate there. It is not worth it, a least for us, and everyone is different. Enjoy the journey and best wishes to you. 🙏👏
Very interesting! Thank you for being so open & honest. A very thought provoking video!! 👍🏼
Glad you enjoyed it!
This is my assessment as well, part-time expat is a great thing. While you can meet new people, and make new friends, family is family, which in the end is truly what mattes. 😊
Why purchase when you can rent and it would practically be cheaper
And allow you to move/travel much more quickly. Only buy a home if you're certain that's where you wish to live for a significant amount of time.
Thanks for sharing your experience in a very fair and even-handed way. This is very valuable.
I’m eligible for Spanish citizenship and lived there for a year when I was a young adult. I started planning a number of years ago to return. Then my life changed and I was dealing with a serious heath issue. It took me a good amount of time to assemble an excellent healthcare team and I’m finally improving. All of this and the challenges posed by taxes and managing my retirement savings and more has caused me to reassess this option. As much as I love Spain, I know that I’ve changed along with my needs. It’s sooo much work to move there and I’m considering spending a few months in Spain rather than living there full time. Such changes are not easy to make and, yes, everything has become far more expensive these past few years. Slow travel, I believe, is a better option for me at this point in my life.
You bring up a good point. I traveled in my 20s for 22 months across Asia and never once worried much about my health. Now in my 60s I want the stability of a known doctor, ability to keep a kitchen stocked with healthy food, and all the other little and big things that spell comfort. I'm obsessed with France and will visit, and love the idea of a part-time expat because that term encompasses a little adventure with a grounded base.
Great video. Honest and courageous. We thought we'd move to Spain upon retirement, but the more we worked through the details and taxes, the more we liked the idea of long visits in lieu of residency. But hey, who knows what the future might bring!
Great video! Thanks for sharing your experience.
Our pleasure!
Very well done! Thank you for your honest assessment of moving to Europe +.
Great Video-really impactful. So much of this resonated with us as we begin our slow travel around the world. Setting down foreign roots is already seeming like an option that we’d rather cross off our list for all the reasons you mentioned. Thanks for the help!
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching. :-)
Excellent advice. Former expat here.
Excellent points to considr. Thanks
Well, after 34 years in the US, I'm from France, the US , other than making good money, is not working for me. I have no idea why most Americans pick up Portugal.
I think that it was low cost housing and low taxes. But now that seems to be over.
Ten, fifteen years ago you would be right about Portugal. But suddenly it got "discovered" and now it's all changed.@@89daysaway
tu forthis video
i havent lived overseas in many years and this gives me some serious thought on how to navigate
Have you traveled much in the past? It sounds as through too many new things were a shock. There are ways around all of your complaints. What you're planning now we've been doing for the past 30 years knowing after retirement we'd end up here permanently. Make sure you include all expenses when you compare the "low tax retirement" in the US compared to the EU. Most EU countries include universal healthcare with residency, requiring a supplemental policy that costs 700-900 for two per year. In the US health insurance is $1200 a MONTH for two. Primary property taxes are low in the EU, much lower than even the southern states known for low property taxes at the expense of public school education. It's a completely different approach to life and not for everyone. Reading the comments it's apparent most folks in the US are better off staying put if you think there's more "risk" in normal transactions than living in a country listed 131st safest on the GPI
Great points. Someone can live in EU for less than the US.
We both traveled extensively both in the us and overseas, for work and pleasure, both short term and longer term, so we were used to travel and living in foreign environments. But for those trips we weren't focused on establishing a residence.
In this video we just wanted to give some observations that may be useful for others to consider. I think that each person or family will have a different combination of financial and family circumstances that impacts the suitability of an expat move.
The approach that worked best for us was a part-time expat slow travel approach. That may not work for others, and a expat move may be better. The best advice I would take is to gather as many perspectives as possible to inform your decisions.
That's great info.
Glad you liked it
Can you imagine being an immigrant to the US? It was such a culture shock and the weather is much colder.
It depends. My neighbor is from Scotland (shout out to your daughter!) and everytime their family comes to visit, they throw on shorts, sandals and sleeveless shirts and sit outside enjoying the warmth of the 45F degree weather. They think it's summertime in December! While I wouldn't call that freezing cold, neither is it beach weather!
Europe has limited land and many centuries older. If you’re expecting a brand new DR Horton home in a nice planned community, you went with US expectations.
All of the houses we saw were actually really nice in general, either new construction or new modern renovations. Some had issues such as high moisture levels or inadequate heating and insulation. The houses we liked that were in well established consistent neighborhoods of similar quality houses were priced a bit higher than what we were comfortable spending. We would have likely been fine committing to a purchase on the same house in the US, but in overseas it seemed a bit too risky.
@@89daysawaymy wife and I came within 10 minutes of putting a large down payment on a house in Portugal before the golden visa blew up. The problem frankly is that knowledge of proper construction techniques in Portugal is very limited. Most houses were built by local villagers with minimal education, using simple locally available materials. Houses that are built to modern international standards are quite rare and command unreasonable prices.
As a Canadian,I’ve very much considered the US to be a great place to retire. If you live in the US,you have an abundance of sunny places to spend your winters,plus the convenience of being in a friendly country with amenities that are quite similar across the country. 👍
Amen, bro. Almost every day we get sun in my part of NC. Barely see snow. It'll be 73 F on Thursday.
Great video that articulates many issues facing expat dreamers! I think you should have also included challenges with maintaining consistency with health care providers. Question: you mentioned that you maintain a “stream-line” home in the states, but how do minimize the “empty bed” cost of leaving for extended periods of time? Do you rent out your place?
We don't rent out our current space. It is smaller condo that is paid off, so minimal ongoing cost.
You burst my bubble, in a good way. You spelled out everything I feared.
It could still work for you. We just wanted to describe some of our impressions so that there would be a counter narrative to the folks who seemed to be endlessly cheerleading the expat move. I think that the suitability of an expat move depends on a person's specific circumstances.
@@89daysaway Is there a visa that is beyond the 90 day but not like retirement.
Not that we’re aware, but not experts. Maybe someone reading knows?
Thank you for your very candid explanation of why you chose to slow travel vs. becoming an expat abroad. My husband and I are nearing 70 and relate to so much of what you are saying. We love to travel, but a few weeks here and there a few times a year suits us much better than living abroad. Managing the overhead on the homefront and being realistic with our expectations makes that possible. Thanks for some excellent advice.
Glad it was helpful!
Appreciate the candor --quite spot on! We made the shift to France 7 years ago, but following the Schengen 90/180 protocols as well, but we had decided to purchase a property. I also concur, while one says "I don't want to be around a bunch of expats ..... " what one realizes is locals don't have to go through many of the administrative procedures as immigrants do (to me - an expat is indeed an immigrant) -- and this is where a network of other expats who have been there / done that can be immensely helpful. Now with the UK out of the EU, they are also in the same administrative processes as say we from the US as such, a wider pool of people to commiserate and share stories with.
I’m an immigrant as a child from Germany. We travel a lot and now since retired, take longer trips which are pretty affordable compared to the old 7-14 day international trips. Now we do a month minimum, and travel off peak. Last year we traveled about 15 weeks. Cost us about $25k and included 2 cruises.
The slow travel model is much more realistic and still reasonably affordable. We purposely purchased a condo here in FL, and downsized. It requires minimal attention and can be left for many weeks, yet is a wonderful homebase.
Renting overseas just makes way more sense. There are so many nice places to travel to here and overseas.
I understand that for some it is more affordable to not have a home in the US, but it certainly leaves much more flexibility.
Great video, and it seems you have found the right way forward.
Wow, what a wonderfully informative video - thanks (I subscribed)
Thank you so much!
Thank you for your very insightful experience with living overseas. It was very relatable for us. Obviously the "juice wasn't worth the squeeze."
We still love spending time in the EU and other places. Maybe we were too old to take on that big an effort...
A very good video. I hope you're able to find a new country. I respect you for having the courage to try. I have read about the tax issues expats face in Portugal; however, it still seems to be popular. i have also heard the healthcare is good in Portugal. Being on the hook for US taxes if you stay for more than a month is part of the research phase.
Thank you so much for your kind words. So much research goes into this decision. It can be overwhelming, but there are fortunately lots of resources out there. Thanks for watching and commenting. :-)
I agree that it is difficult. I moved to Portugal and live in Madeira. Its beautiful and that climate is better than the mainland. It was and continues to be a lot of work to live here but I am enjoying my life so far. I have expat friends and and not feeling too lonely.
I bought a moderately priced condo and ad excellent help navigating the purchase process. You can't go it alone. You need an expert team for immigration issues, property purchase, and taxation. I have the NHR so I will not be paying the high taxes. It is al about timing and a willingness to live outside your comfort zone. I may move back to the US at some point. I did so much research that I found very few surprises here. I am learning the language and many people here speak a little English so I have been able to get things accomplished. It's a grand adventure and I am certain I will be able to sell my apartment should I decide to leave.
People chose Portugal because it is safer than many countries in Europe.
Wow. These are all great points. A lot of content about moving to other countries is often focused on how much cheaper it is and the ease and benefits of these countries. No one talks about the fact that moving to another country is a huge cultural change that involves a big adjustment process. It's not just about economics. The country/city you move to has to be the right fit.
Your voice is narration worthy 😊
I lived abroad when I was much younger so I know and understand all the small and big hassles one has to deal with living in a foreign country. I think it helps if you already have that experience of realising that there can be a lot of tough times. Now that I am older, I get a bit annoyed with all these CZcamsrs who paint an idealistic picture of living in different country, especially if that country ostensibly is cheaper (like Mexico, Panama, Costa Rica, the DR, etc). My experience for example of travelling all over Mexico for a year is that it was not as cheap ad I anticipated, and the odds of getting some kind of intestinal sickness are higher than I realised (even with exercising a great degree of caution). Plus, what people who boost about living abroad often don’t address, is the difference between doing it all alone versus going with a partner. No matter how adaptable a person is, or fluent in different languages (or not), it can also be a challenge if you have specific needs in terms of food, like gluten intolerance, or if you prefer organic foods but cannot get them (or maybe you can but for even more than you would pay in N. America). This is what I miss most about Canada for example. Also, in some places like the Dominican Republic, there is not the control on pollution like vehicle exhaust and noise. Walking around in a city or town can be very toxic. Where I lived in Canada the air was so fresh and clean. These are actual health issues and a big pirotiy for some people. A lot of expats don’t seem to care as long as their rent or housing prices are less and they can live in a warm climate. I think at this point, I would rather opt for cold and clean. As for being a snowbird, that could be easier, but then you have to have. someone take care of your apartment or house while you’re away, water your plants, etc. I travel with a small dog so getting her documentation in order is always a consideration as well as providing her with good vet care and her special diet. No matter where you are, it will always be a trade-off. the bottom line is what you are willling to give up and what you want to add to your life.
Great points.
Thank you for your honesty! I used to live in Asia and Europe and I have admit there are so many beautiful places out there. But I’ll never exchange freedom and convince of living in the US for anything else! I might do slow traveling but boy, I always have tears in my eyes when I come back home. America is the best place to live!
No, Canada is the best.
So you guys were looking at listings for the places you wanted to relocate to, but didn’t bother to start picking up the language beforehand?
We were trying to learn Portuguese while in the US. We were planning to immerse fully once we relocated, with face to face classes, etc.
Fair enough. I hope you and your wife get to truly enjoy you guys retirement. Thank you for responding and clearing up my misunderstanding. @@89daysaway
@@89daysawaylanguage immersion is very easy to do. Netflix, CZcams, etc. Don’t wait, do it now.
This is a great suggestion. We've noticed a ton of new foreign language offerings on Netflix over the last year. We get older and wiser, right? 😉 Thank you!
Wonderful video, thanks for taking the time to share your experiences. Part of this I think is the effect of aging. At 72 I’m still excited about traveling but don’t have the energy or health to do what I could do when I was younger.
Good point. We would have been more willing to take on a all encompassing effort if I we were 10 years younger.
Having lived abroad in different EU countries for 30 years I believe you're spot on with the different issues a migrant can face. Also, as an American you'll be seen as wealthy and will be likely to be ripped off when negotiating prices. Regarding the inheritance taxes, usually a big chunk of the funds is exempt of tax for the children. Also, you might ask your children to buy the property.
You are so right about Portugal!
As more people in the developed economies have searched the world to relocate, more and more countries have increased the requirements for residency.
Yes it is going to keep changing because well... any country just can't take everyone in.
Thank you for your honesty. Good on you for giving it a go. It takes courage and a lep of faith to make the move overseas if you don't have connections in that country. I'm from the US and have been living in Asia for 22 years. China, Thailand, South Korea and Loas. There are many advantages to living abroad. However, it is NOT easy. My accomodations were/are far less than I ever had in the US [the exception being South Korea - I lived in a very nice neighborhood]. When I left the US I went from living in the Catskill Mountains to Shanghai having traveled only to the Caribbean and Canada [hardly a world traveler]. But after 6 months in Shanghai [shopping at the wet market] I came to believe that everyone should live [ not just visit] in a country that is far outside of their comfort zone. It is a humbling experience. BTW, I would be happy to repatriate the the US, but my wife and I have invested in businesses here, so we need to get some return first ! Good luck on your future adventures.
I think that the main thing that caused us to sour on the idea was the housing. We had been renting in a high cost area for the last few years, and really needed to buy a place that we could make our own. But what we saw at the time seemed overpriced and didn't check all of the boxes we needed.
Been an expat 15 years in Asia for work (Tokyo, HK, now Taipei). Always makes more sense to rent and figure things out, I did buy in Japan but then had to move to HK so, in retrospect, didn't work out but did enjoy a couple of years in my flat that had a nice garden. Would like to buy again but housing terribly overpriced in Taipei (400k and up for a small apt) while rents are reasonable so probably no. Been happy with healthcare in TW (recently went through breast cancer and the system is low-cost and highly efficient). Will stay to get PR, I am almost 60, will figure out retirement later, right now, no definite plans there.
The up front taxes on real estate are off-putting, but you have to keep in mind that the annual real estate taxes are very minimal - probably under $1,000 per year - at least in Spain and France which I am familiar with. I’m used to spending 5 figures per year in California.
I was an expat for 9 years (Singapore and China). A few challenges, but overall loved it!
Singapore sounds great. We have that on our wish list.
I completely agree, it is hard to move to another country when you are new to it and not speaking the language or not knowing the customs it can become triple hard to navigate. It’s also difficult moving to a place where you have no family, friends or connections and making new friends can take time and effort. I know of an acquaintance who moved to southern Spain for retirement and though he had certain friends in the area from his navy’s days he thought he would have an easy transition into the whole culture but that was not the case. From listening to him, I got the feeling that he wanted his US habits to translate flawlessly and literally into Spanish culture and I think that’s why it did not pan out.
Then I have another friend, a US national also nationalized Spanish since she was married to a Spaniard and now divorce for many years, she decided to move back and retire in Spain to be close to her son (her other child lives in the US). There is a tax treaty between the US and Spain and US nationals are always taxed on their income no matter of where you live, even if you chose to live in Hell the IRS would come and find you there.
Now onto the issue of moving or not moving. That all depends on what people want of life. To me is finding some kind of balance between the things you hate and the things you love. I currently live in Florida (since 2019) but I have bounced back and forth from Europe (Germany and mainly Spain) for the past 30 years. I am in the process of purchasing an apartment in Spain and yes, the prices for homes are a lot higher than the US and that has to do with location. If you are an introvert and don’t mind living more isolated there are plenty of cheap places in Spain but if you want convenience then you have to fork out the money. Yes, the initial payment of an apartment may seem large but in the long run is much cheaper than in the US (some places pay outrageous HOA, home insurance, property taxes etc). We will eventually choose a place with an airport that has direct flights to all other main European destinations. It will make the life of my kids easier when they want to visit us (we have a kid in Scotland and the next one soon returning to Europe). The US has great things but how I envision my life down the road when I am old and cannot drive is to have the ability to walk to the supermarket, or ride the tram to town to watch a play, etc. to have the freedom of movement when I cannot no longer drive.
I think I over extended myself. But I just hope you all find your happy place.
Thank you so much for telling your story and for offering such thoughtful advice. (And your IRS comment was funny!) It's really interesting to hear about your friends and their experiences trying this. Everyone has a different experience and deals with things in different ways. Thank you for watching our videos and for sharing your kind thoughts. Best of luck with your new apartment!
I live in Chile, and they have laws where your child must inherit from you, even if you have a will saying otherwise...and homes in ugly mixed neighborhoods are desirable in order to hide your wealth, as people in nice neighborhoods may be targeted for theft and carjackings. You can hide a beautiful interior and patio behind an ugly facade, and most people will not update their exterior in order to keep their assets more hidden. The loneliness is real, as people from other cultures have vastly different ideas about what is appropriate in so many social scenarios, and often have ingrained bad will or jealousy of Americans.
The grass is rarely greener on the other side. But it is fun to explore the world.
Rent, Rent and Rent, never buy unless you have cash and do not care about inspections. I grew up in Italy and then went back from 2013 to 2020. I was fine because I knew the language, the culture, the lifestyle. My wife who was born and raised in the US had a hard time and we eventually moved back. While she loved everything about Italy she missed having a deep conversation. I would recommend getting a elective resident green card and renting. AI speak English, Italian and Spanish so I could and can navigate the system, but then again if I moved to Ireland or Great Britain, I would still have a hard time integrating as an American. Most ex pats move to places where there are the same type of people. Look at Mexico, Costa Rica etc.
We gave explored moving to Portugal as well but decided to visit and slow travel instead of going through the hassle of moving,bfiling taxes etc. I amd originally from Undia so it'd be easier for me live theur part time to enjoy food and weather but come back to the home base in the US.
TY interesting considerations
What you’re describing is what anyone with language barriers experience. Make a choice that one will be happy with and change if need to suit the lifestyle aim for.
Good points and it is nice to see a video of reality for some people and their experiences in expat lifestyle. We are working on a move to the EU and considered Portugal but after the NHR program ended it is off our list. France is where we are planning and there is a lot of research to do. We have already had a tax projection done by a French tax advisor and will pay less tax than we currently pay in the midwest. France recognizes Roth IRAs where some countries don't. France doesn't tax US pensions that are taxed in the US . My spouse has EU and US citizenship and I have US and am applying for Italian citizenship to hopefully avoid the Visa process. You can get on the French healthcare system in 90 days of residency and even with top up private insurance the cost is less than here in the US for us. There are social, language and other factors to consider but we are excited to try. Good luck to anyone who gives a go.
I'm also seriously considering France!
I was hearing that France had high inheritance taxes (and other taxes). I will have to give it another look.
@@89daysaway France does have high inheritance taxes. Great place to live but a bad choice to die so the saying goes. We have no children and our heirs are already well established so anything we leave will be a bonus. Property tax is paid mostly at time of sale for larger amount and annual is in the hundreds not thousands unless you have huge chateau or lots of property. VAT is an issue throughout the EU but food and goods prices are often less overall except electronics and cars which are infrequent purchases and still not so much more as to be shocking. What we save in the property tax difference, health care and food we more than break even in our tax assessment. Wherever you consider having a tax accountant do a tax assessment is critical. We looked at Belgium, Austria and Germany before France and Portugal and Spain and settled on France.
@@89daysaway I have heard that also. And in general that French taxes were high enough that a lot of wealthy French live in nearby countries with more favorable taxes.
@@89daysawayit does have high inheritance taxes, and other taxes, but those most don’t apply to US retirees. Inheritance taxes can be mostly avoided by gifting non-French assets to potential heirs before death, or selling French real estate to them for a low price, with retained right to occupy until death. The US has lifetime tax-free gift limits of many millions of dollars, and your family in the US isn’t subject to French taxes on your gifts. If you have assets that are in US trusts that are “out of sight” of the French government, that works too. There are a lot of states with trust arrangements that are difficult to find for US creditors, never-mind the French government.
“A streamlined home in the US” is the key if you expect to travel unless you have substantial resources. Five years before retirement I bought cheap, small and easy to maintain, and now I’m ready for slow travel for a few months at a time without having to break the bank maintaining a big, expensive home. SELL THAT PIG! You don’t need 4000sqft.
Great video! Thank you for your honest perspective. Language can be a huge barrier. In your travels have you come across any European cities where speaking only English is not a barrier? looking forward to your future videos.
Most places we have been you can get along in English, and on our many visits to Portugal it was not really an issue most of the time. It mainly becomes an issue if you travel too far from a city, or are trying to engage with people and businesses that are more local. For example, in the Netherlands it seems like everyone speaks English, but we had difficulties renting a bike in a town called Houton (Near Utrecht). Or trying to interpret a menu is a restaurant in a rural area of Portugal.
Thank you for your response. Have you been in Nice FR or Valencia Spain? If so, how about English only speaking in those locations. Amsterdam doesn't seem to be an issue, but like you say if one travels away from the city, its hit or miss.
Hi! We have not been to either Nice or Valencia. Those are definitely on our lists. We've been to Paris, and thought Kristen's few years of French would make it much easier to navigate, but apparently "school French" and "real-life French" are quite different.😂 But our hearts were in the right place!
Check out El Salvador 🇸🇻 when you are adventurous again. Very safe and friendly.
Re-locating is not for everyone. Renting is like buying Screw-up Insurance. The chances of you finding the single-best place to live in a month or two are infinitesimally small. In the last 6 years I have moved to better and better locations and now, after 5 moves, I think we might know where we want to buy. Slow travel would be like a full-time job for me. I wanted a new home base. I found it, but it takes both flexibility and commitment. "I want to move to a new country, but I want everything to work like it does where I come from." ? That just doesn't work.
Renting for the first 6 months or so is the best approach.
Hey buddy, thank you so much for this video. I recently visited family in Argentina and I had a fantastic experience. I did a lot of research and I did find some friction as you discuss however, everything was better than you described in your experience. If I could add one thing that I don’t have as a skill, it would be the language skill. And I think that you addressed it in your video and it’s very true. You and your wife should have dedicated yourselves to learning the language, and rather than trying to maintain an American presence in a foreign country as it kind of appears from what you were saying in that you wouldn’t take the adventure beyond Burger King or I don’t know if that’s the right way to portray it, but. What I mean to expresses that I don’t know that you have yourself enough in that situation if if you didn’t pick up the language skills in. What I did is, I would just go to a restaurant and struggle and it was good for me to go to a restaurant and yes, sometimes I was surprised what came for you know what I ordered and I just ate it and took it as part of the adventure.
We would have fully committed to learning Portuguese if we had stayed - classes and everything. It's a hard language to learn, but becoming fluent would have been essential. But the overall experience did not motivate us to make the commitment to that level of work.
We ate in plenty of restaurants. But sometimes we were just fatigued with addressing the non-English menus and went with the easy way out.
Very clear and realistic ! Thanks! Language and culture take a decade+ to absorbe. Start with the language & country long before you make the move.
We had not made a final decision on what country we were going to try until about 6 month before we left. No long runup period to prepare.
Yes, best to rent or airbnb and be a slow nomad or "slomad" haha! I've been a digital nomad with my now 14 yo twins for 7 years now, slowly traveling around 20 countries so far. We hang out with other digital nomads, worldschoolers and sometimes expats. I think it's the best way to go until you really want to settle down in one place.
Very true. As a native European I can confirm that the real estate market here is in-transparent, illiquid, and comes with high transaction costs. Indeed Portugal is especially overpriced at the moment.
The real estate market in the US is pretty screwed up at the moment as well.
@@89daysaway Absolutely 👍 Fully agree.
This is a very useful summary of your experience. Were you thinking of moving your money and investment accounts overseas?
Not really. The US seemed to be a safer bet for savings, with more options for investments. Had we moved, we would likely have adjusted our plans a bit once we learned more about the system in the new country.
Excellent video
Thank you very much!
tried another country for a year but was glad to keep my condo in US when i decided to move back. will do the same if i try another country. bottomline visiting a place is different from living there.
People can transfer assets in the US into a trust to protect them from taxes if moving/retiring somewhere in Europe. Also, many countries have treaties/agreements with the US on double taxation.
We have been told that some counties, like the Netherlands, do not recognize US trusts.
Home is where your friends, and family, brothers sisters parent, children, grandchildren are
We decided long ago that we would not buy foreign property for all the reasons you listed. Bottom line is we want to go different places and owning a foreign property limits us. Plus I didn’t want the responsibility. 2-3 long trips a year is the plan.
Loved your video. We are coming to very similar conclusions. We did not move to Portugal, but our scouting trip highlighted similar issues. It is a wonderful place to visit for a few weeks, but not to stay long term for us. France actually has a much better tax structure for Americans due to our treaty, but the big downside is their inheritance laws. Spain has a lot of positives, but do not like their wealth tax. The list goes on. Our current thinking is to spend a few months outside US, possibly two separate locations per year - may be one in Asia and another in Europe, but not become 'resident' of any other country.
That’s exactly our thinking and general plan! It’s good to hear that others have had the same impressions/experienced. Hope it works out for you! Thanks for watching.
My husband wants to retire abroad, but your video is exactly what I’ve been telling him I’m worried about. We’ve decided to downsize to a condo in a cheaper location while we slowly travel abroad and explore other locations in the US for 4-5 years while our daughter is in college and then make a final decision on where to settle.
Glad we can help. It is always a good idea to take a multi-month trip to the area you are considering, live in a furnished apartment so you can make your own meals and get in sync with the residents, and try to find an neighborhood that feels comfortable to you. Living there for a few months can give you a lot of information...
Good idea.
I think moving to another country could be a wonderful experience, but it is better to start slow and see if the place/city could be something I would like to be at. Renting is a better way to start in order to “feel” and understand the people, the culture, and their way of “business.” Many people are expecting for things to work “like” their “countries” in other places. Showing up with an open mind and an open heart is the best attitude.
Totally agree with renting first.
You could find a country with reasonable taxation levels but the IRS will never forget you. They even chase people who by accident of birth were notionally American, Boris Johnson comes to mind. Many European financial institutions refuse to open accounts for US citizens because of onerous reporting requirements. Evan Edinger on YT did a very good take on this.
Doing taxes for both te us and your expat country does increase the cost and complexity of tax preparation...
I LOVE your couch and where did you get it??!!
Its a photo webcam background... Our rooms looks bit too cluttered.
I think this entire story would have been different if you just did it piecemeal as a transition rather then some sort of hard-break where all the is estate planning stuff and taxes came before integrating into the new country and making substantial connections.
We wanted to check out living for a while in the country first and see if it was a fit.
This is an informative video but as an expat most of my life, I have to point out a few inaccuracies.
First of all, it's not true that you can only be in the US for 31 days or else you will be considered a tax resident. In fact, generally you can stay up to 4 months a year but you have to be careful as the calculation is complicated.
From the IRS website:
"To meet this test, you must be physically present in the United States (U.S.) on at least:
31 days during the current year, AND
183 days during the 3-year period that includes the current year AND the 2 years immediately before that, counting:
All the days you were present in the current year, AND
1/3 of the days you were present in the first year before the current year, AND
1/6 of the days you were present in the second year before the current year."
This AND is very important because it's not OR.
Also, from the IRS website is the following example:
"You were physically present in the U.S. on 120 days in each of the years 2021, 2022 and 2023. To determine if you meet the substantial presence test for 2023, count the full 120 days of presence in 2023, 40 days in 2022 (1/3 of 120), and 20 days in 2021 (1/6 of 120). Since the total for the 3-year period is 180 days, you are not considered a resident under the substantial presence test: for 2023."
NOTE: You can be physically present for 120 days each year and you are still NOT a resident of the US for tax purposes.
I live in the EU. Portugal is overhyped. I was there in May and found it to be poor in general compared to several other countries in Europe. It was very pretty, I admit.
As for inheritance taxes and security when buying property, it varies from country to country. For example, in Sweden we have no inheritance taxes, wealth taxes, or gift taxes. Buying property is pretty straightforward and not risky. Property taxes are not even $900 a year even for a million dollar property. Just saying.
Anyhow, honestly, being an expat isn't for everyone. It's often more frustrating than it is romantic. There are Americans who move abroad because they just cannot afford to live in the US. I know I can't.
Many thanks for the clarification. Anyone taking the expat route should get pro tax advice since it can get complex. I'll have to check out the Sweden situation.