The Future Of Mountain Biking? | Riding The Gamux Sego [EXCLUSIVE]
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- čas přidán 24. 11. 2023
- The latest mountain bikes come loaded with great technology! However, let's face it, an MTB's biggest weakness is the derailleur which hangs off the back of the bike in rock-bashing territory! We've been given EXCLUSIVE access to the Gamux Sego downhill bike which comes specced with a Pinion Automatic Belt-Drive Gearbox. Join Rich as he delves deep into the facts, figures, advantages and disadvantages of such an interesting futuristic DH bike.
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My single speed is kind of an "automatic gearbox".... I automatically pedal harder when it's steep.
Thank you for the video! I would summarize geraboxes as following “get out, have fun, enjoy the silence, no worries!”. I’m a convinced believer in gearboxes. I own a pinion tournig bike and waiting for my new nicolai saturn GPI to be delivered. Once you try a pinion gearbox you’ll never go back to a conventional drivetrain (unless you are a pro rider). The weight penalty is completely overcome by the reliable/smooth/maintenance free rides that you’ll experience. Not to mention the possibility to shift while not pedalling (which I didn’t think to appreciate that much until getting used to it and then use again a derailleur for a test bike). Moreover. Once you get home from muddy rides you can just jet wash everything without caring about degreasing and re-greasing the drivetrain. Plus pinion has an incredibly active and capable customer service. 5 stars for me (non competitive italian tourer and MTB lover)
For gravity oriented riding (downhill and enduro in particular) this could indeed be the future. But for disciplines that involves climbing and speed over flat ground it won't stand a chance due to the lesser efficiency. For regular trail riding that most of us normal people do (i.e non-competitive), this could also be an interesting novelty for many -- depending on the price. For e-mtb's I can imagine that this could get very popular. Nice video, and what a magnificent looking bike! It looks like a mix between a top fuel drag racer and a piece of industrial machinery. Love it!
Belts are actually more efficient than chains when broken in
@@Ptrmrkks That might be, but with regards to efficiency, I am referring to the gearbox and not the belt :)
I read somewhere that like-for-like, gearboxes do have more drag but as soon as you add some gunge and grime to a chain/cassette system then gearboxes equal or better with respect to efficiency. That aside, the massive advantages for 99% of us are near-zero maintenance and fewer dangly bits to get snapped off 😊. Though I fear that the Shimano/SRAM juggernaut may quash any hopes of this becoming mainstream.
@@Ptrmrkks only under high power output conditions because the efficiency of belts is far less affected by tension than chains
On the other hand, the low maintenance could make it a one-bike for trail and commute.
As someone who has ridden a Pinion Gearbox bike (P1.18 touring bike though, sadly not my bike) I can also tell you that the spacing and the amount of gears makes up a lot for the lower efficiency, That said, I agree this will be popular for eMTB's as for normal MTBs I can see this bridge a gap between a touring bikes and MTBs.
I’m waiting on this for e-bikes. I’m not buying another ebike until one comes out with a gearbox. I’m sick of tearing up chains and cassettes
There's a few already dude. Check the pinion for e-bikes.
lol get a hub driven wheel..... if you are putting 1000+ watts through ur chain, obviously its gonna break, what do you think it was designed for???? even worse if ur using 9+ speeds then its really just horrible design choice
While a hub drive resolves ebike drivetrain issues, it increases the unstrung weight, negatively affecting the suspension function.
Simplon Rapcon Pmax Pinion 😄✌🏻
@@XavieRibeiro25 the valeo is better
This is the first hyper-bike that actually floats my boat.
Just need to start playing the lottery now.
I’m most excited for the pinion gearbox to make its way to more mainstream eMTBs. If the auto shifting is reliable and the electronics don’t fail the I can see it being on future eMTBs in 3-5 years. That is of course if the price point isn’t insane.
For this to be the future we must drop the "weight above all" mentality and it needs to be cheaper but that would come with broader use.
Weight concerns haven't really been a deciding factor for some time. Obviously excessive weight is frowned upon but so is extreme light weight in specific disciplines
@@OLI-vx1md I disagree. Weight is high on people's lists when it comes to buying a performance focused bike. Otherwise carbon wouldn't be a dominating frame material and carbon/titanium components wouldn't be at peak popularity. Adding ~1kg to the bikes weight while increasing the price is a poor selling point. No one want's to buy a 4000-5000 $ carbon bike that weights as much as aluminium 2500 $ one.
@@DirtlovR believe me, most good experienced riders dont really care about the weight aslong its not in the extremes in both directions
@@DirtlovR have you ever thought that Carbon and titanium are big sellers for the material characteristics an not solely the weight differential?
Heavy trail bike, no thanks
imagine this bike with a light enduro motor!
bikes like this make me wanna buy one aluminium tube after another and start building my own ultra custom dream bike with all the crazy innovations. usually you see one or two very cool new things on a new bike but imagine you got it all in one, nailing the innovations from the certain time in one frame
upside down fork, belt drivetrain & high pivot all are features i want
If one of the big bike makers picks this up, this could be the future. The derailleur is a feat of human ingenuity but it's amazing it has lasted this long on bikes and no one has come up with a better gadget to shift gears. Same for the humble chain and spoke drive system.
I hope the supre drive takes off as it kinda seems like the best of both worlds
Amazing how we could drive mtb for years at all without all that. 😎🤪
Zerode have been doing it on trail, enduro, and DH bikes for years!!! Get on the gearbox!!!
Get ya hands on the offerings from Zerode for trail/enduro/DH gearbox bikes
Just seems like we're adding more components that will need a specialist to repair/maintain and could end you up in a tight situation if a busted circuit board is proprietary and backordered which is a common occurrence nowadays.
Years ago I had a belt drive road bike, found it so much better to own and ride than any chain bike I’ve had. Wish my Nukeproof Mega was belt drive
Another high pivot + Pinion + belt: Zerode G3
I've got the G3 on order.... arrives in January 🤞
Unless they’ve updated it, it doesn’t appear the G3 has the new Pinion which, IMO, is a game changer. Trigger shifter vs twist grip and faster shifts.
@kevinclark9176 yes I've ordered electronic shifting. You can still have grip shift too
I've worked in manufacturing for 25 plus years so I really do love technology and design and engineering. But I find that is separate from my love of riding bicycles I get suckered in just like the next guy buying bicycle parts based on new features but honestly once I'm out riding my bike I don't care. I own a dirt jumper and still ride my BMX bike which have next to zero technology and I've never once found myself wishing for a better experience. If you're racing it's a completely different world and I totally get looking for every advantage but for normal people riding bicycles I don't think there are a lot of problems to be solved. Unless of course we're talking about trying to find more time to ride bicycles❤
I personally cant wait for this to be more common on eMTB will be a game changer
From what ive heared, belt drives needing no lube is an often repeated misconception. They do need lube but not for countering wear and tear but to stop them making unnerving squeaking noises in dry and dusty conditions.
belt drive, high pivot, gearbox, i want one
Everyone riding a Zerode says welcome to 2015 😂😂
Zerode just released the G3 DH Bike and it's absolutely beautiful
I love technology in bicycles. But I also love simplicity in bicycles because a simpler machine is easier to maintain and work on.
So this sort of stuff with so many extra bearings, pivits and so on seem like an expensive maintenance headache. Great for pro teams, but not for everyone else.
There will be a point where an unsponsored amature won't be able to compete and evolve into the sport unless they have a lot of their own money to begin with.
> I love technology in bicycles. But I also love simplicity in bicycles because a simpler machine is easier to maintain and work on.
Sure. But at some point you also have to ask yourself - when's the last time you had to replace anything in a car's gearbox? You're looking at oil changes every 50,000 to 100,000 miles, so somewhere around 10,000 to 20,000 hours of operation. If you use it 10 hours a day, that's once every 1,000 to 2,000 days or every 3 to 6 years.
That's not the case for Pinion's gearboxes though. Their MGU states you should change your oil every 10,000 km. If you average 25 km/h, that's every 400 hours of riding. They also claim it's a 10 minute procedure to do an oil change.
So - in 10,000 km of riding with derailleur and chain, how often do you need to do maintenance on those? Like cleaning everything, oiling the chain, replacing the chain, replacing the cassette, replacing the idlers, replacing the front sprocket(s)? It's fairly likely you'll go through at least one chain and one cassette in 10,000 km. Especially because most people aren't fastidiously cleaning their bikes after every ride. And they'll end up with dirty drive trains that will eat through their chains and cassettes faster than that.
That's a lot of time spent on maintenance vs a 10 minute oil change. Especially since internal gearboxes allows you to go from chain to belt, which requires less maintenance than chains as well.
Im very interested at buying something like a frame set from Zerode and honestly I’m kinda waiting a bit on the news about the pinion smart shift for non E bikes. Keep the news coming!
I've got one on order.... should arrive in January
I own a rohloff speedhub and am a huge fan of internal gears. I am very interested in the idea of moving that weight to the center of the bike👍
Watch it be the same price as a motorbike.
Hands down some of the smartest bike designers in the world. I talked to one of their lead designers at Eurobike 2023 what turned into an interview and then into me getting schooled by a dwarfen master mechanic from the fantasy novel of your choice. I left with no question unanswered and then some. Great experience - and I've great hopes for this small enterprise. Wish them the best!
That is a sweet design.
Wouldn't exchange it to my Gambler, but this looks like an amazing concept for trail bikes.
I mean it's cool as hell but you're just taking mountain bikes and making them into dirt bikes with that gearbox bro that's it
The bike industry cracks me up. When I got into mountain biking over thirty years ago I showed my grandad my first bike. He had been an engineer for British aerospace and rolls Royce. The first thing he said to me was that it should be internally geared and have a belt drive for lower maintenance and reliability. Obviously that went straight over my head being a little kid. The bike industry has a gift for convincing us that these ideas are revolutionary when in actual fact this stuff could have been done years ago.
It has been done decades ago. Way back in the 1920's or 1930's. I think a German bike manufacturer is the first to offer gearbox drivetrain. It comes in 3 speeds.
@@jannadrielcervo7753 my point is that the bike industry sells inferior engineering to people who don’t understand that it could be better. It’s all designed around consumerism. There’s no money to be made if things don’t break regularly I suppose.
@@Tom-hl7wcthis is not exactly true. In biking you have to balance many competing factors and find compromises. Sure we could have had gearbox bikes 20 years ago, but no one wants to pedal around a 60lb bike with a ton of resistance in the drivetrain, that can’t shift under load, requires a grip shifter and is only available in top level spec pricing. Oh, and forget interchangeability and brand options as the frames must be designed around one specific brand/model of gearbox. No choosing between SRAM, Shimano, TRP, Box, Microshift, etc. You get one choice of brand and spec level per frame.
I say this as a big gearbox fan, I think in uses like this DH bike it’s superior to derailleurs and they finally solved the grip shift problem, but when you consider all the compromises it because not as good as a derailleur/cassette setup. Who knows, maybe in another 30 years they can solve some of the other issues and make it viable in trail and XC bikes, but it isn’t there right now.
@@kevinclark9176 rapid fire and drop bar shifters are already available for non ebikes and you can shift under load. They certainly don’t weigh 60lbs and are on trail and road bikes already. I do agree about the price but new technology is always more expensive. Once widely adopted the price will fall.
@@kevinclark9176 check out Zeroed bikes from New Zealand
How's no chain illegal with UCI? You better ask Aaron Gwin about no chain in UCI racing...
Until recently, UCI rules stipulated that "drive" has to be via chain. Snapped chain mid race run would fall outside that I guess!
@@andynelson1977Exactly. Deliberately removing your chain before your run is illegal, Gwin took to the start gate with an intact (but ultimately damaged) chain therefore his run was technically a legal "mechanically affected" run. Alternative drive mechanisms weren't approved for DH (and still aren't in any other UCI sanctioned discipline) as a chain driven system "preserves the aesthetic" of the sport. Something that the UCI went crazy on when road, track and TT bikes had crazy carbon monocoque frame designs that were both extremely fast and prohibitively expensive for smaller teams. It's a rule designed to keep the sport accessible, but gearbox belt drive systems, like the Pinion/Gates are available on affordable utility biked because they offer reduced maintenance requirements and are pretty robust. It makes a compelling case to allow them to develop a DH drivetrain outside of the original rule.
Great bike!!!
In Austria WE have a Word for bikes likes this:
Schirch!
Love it ❤️🥳
So it's Free shift and Auto Shift like Shimano has but then with a belt?
I saw this bike 6 month ago in Todtnau, Germany. It’s pretty quiet.
Zerode
This may be the future but it’s not a future I want or need. I’ve said it before. The more you make bikes like mini motorcycles, the more chance there is of legislation. I can see forced licences, insurance and restrictions of where you can ride them. Riding a bike is about fun freedom, fitness, the physical mental technical challenge. Man v the elements. This stuff takes a lot of that away and replaces it with expensive stuff that adds anxiety. Be careful of what you wish for.
As long as majority of the propulsion comes from humans, I'm fine with whatever innovation they can come up with, if it enhances the sport of riding. Hopefully a lot of the new legislation will apply only to bikes with a throttle (can those even be called 'bicycles' anymore?).
And allows less experienced riders to get to terrain that they normally couldn’t due to lack of conditioning etc. I see this causing problems especially in technical downhill terrain. People be getting hurt.
Love the 12spd pinion on my bike! But automatic!?!?
Some ebike company should be making a belt driven trail bike
The quiter a bike the better imo, im all for silent hubs beltdrives and gearboxes. What happens with gear box bike when you push it do you have to push through the gear resistance
No as the rear hub still has a freewheel I believe
@@22ethanh17 it makes sense but i want a silent bike for being out in the wild
@@eartharrow6772 get a quiet hub then?
@@eartharrow6772 this with an onyx hub and it is silent
Not for most folk…. As gearbox transmissions are contrary to the big S’s business models… they are focussed of their spares and support model and built in obsolescence / durability….. they all watched “the man in the white suit” and fear a genuine long life affordable gearbox (clearly the man in the white suit analogy only works if you ignore the last 10mins but who cares as Alec Guinness is superb in it)
WHAT.a.EDIT! That whistle in the back of the D&B tune 🫡. Richie, pro presenting. Tech is mad in that piece ⚙️🧠🖤.
Regards 🍀
Zerode out of Australia has been out for years with this tech
New Zealand
@@lancejarman1Damnit sorry!! Yes, New Zealand. Didn't mean to be disrespectful. My bad.
How much is the weight?
Specifically for downhill, Wouldn’t it be more efficient and lighter to run a single speed with a gear ratio tuned to the course and rider?
Most DH riders add weight to the bottom bracket anyway..... might as well be a gear box
"The Future Of Mountain Biking" been hearing that like pretty much every week now for years yet non of the tech catches on
Would love to try belt drive. The thought of not having to clean the chain up after each weekend 🤓 Not sure I’d like gearbox though - might need less maintenance, but can imagine it’s a nightmare when they do need looking at?
Indeed a big benefit.
The only maintenance is draing oil and refill once a year. That's it.
Keep adding more stuff to bikes and I’ll just switch to dirt bikes, price range is going to be insane but oh well
so much better than having a chain slapping around
Nicolai bikes do this kind of bikes like forever!
if i become filthy rich, i will have gamux custom make this for me with a pinion MGU as a freeride&enduro e-bike
bikes like this and the Unno's are fucking increeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedible looking
sold in EU only, $5300 pure frame + $3500 gearbox + $800 ish rear shock, who is this bike for ?
The biggest issue I see is weight. Of course this could be corrected with lighter materials. However we know this comes with additional expense. Just to add I’m referring to AM and XC riding.
Apparently the weight difference actually isn’t that much compared to a standard cassette, and as he said the weight is shifted from the rear wheel to the cranks (making the COM more central and reducing the sprung mass of the rear end, improving suspension)
The weight is perfectly placed where you need it, while shaving weight off the unwanted places (rear end). Even for AM Bikes, the overall weight isn't that much of a step back when you place it at an smart place (bottom bracket) when one could save a couple of gramms at an unwanted place. A pedalfriendly geometry helps you more than a 1000 g lighter bike.
DH bikes mostly are too light, so worldcup teams are slapping lead on the bottom bracket to make it heavier at the low center
Besides, the future AM Bike does have a motor anyway, so the weight is at the right place allready.
I want it
my next mtb will have a gearbox
No bad if you can afford it. Shame mountain biking is getting so expensive these days it’s hard for lower wage people to get into it.
Awesome bike BUT:
If they wanna sell it well, it needs an motor and a wat higher seat tube...
Manual hand gearing is a part of the skill that defines a mountain biker. Whereas this tech is cool, it lessens the requirements to compete at a higher level and that is not good for competitive mountain biking.
Belt drive and gearboxes are the future for sure. Coupled with auto shift, semi auto wow. I can't wait to see it on the market it will be the best thing since the dropper seat post
It's weird hearing the push for quiet bikes, but I suppose there's lots of places where making sure elk/cougar/grizzlies hear you and hopefully leave before you run into them isn't a consideration
Then someone comes around with industry ninen hub :D
Maybe future bikes will have built-in speakers that pipe out artificial chain slap, like electric cars that 'play' engine noises 😄
Put a bell on your bike.
nothing is more annoying than people riding around on bikes louder than cars and they can't even do anything on the bike. just out here annoying the fuck out of everyone for no reasons
@@OldManEnduro I did! It's in the form of a slapping chain :D
Possibly? Or possibly not?
Nice commercial now wondering bikes went so expensive so much commercials all around
The big thing missing from this bike that I think will take over is a pivoting seat. No tube/sliding mechanics. The seat would just pivot at the front at the front of the frame. Much lighter and could drop much lower out of the way.
not a single turn of the crank to be seen in the whole video :)
Umm, where did it finish in the DH WC? Wouldn’t say it’s maintenance free as it’s electronic and we all know how that can have a wobble!😏 gear boxes aren’t a cutting edge design so why hasn’t all the manufacturers jumped on board?🤔 could be because the after market wearable drivetrain sales would take a nose dive!
The way these things are evolving, next thing you know they'll put motors on them and we want have to pedal at all
horror!
Ain't no need to call names
@@lih-fk8by Lol
For all you snowflakes who want this on your e-bike just know that I just met and road with this codger who was 75 years old, (I’m mid 50’s)and we were hitting some really long and steep climbs on analog bikes. If you don’t want to pedal get a motorbike, or earn your decent.
looks like crocks r in for downhill this winter
SPD Crocks? 🐊
@@gmbn those shoes look suspiciously like a branded plastic sandal mt I'd see about sponsorship if I were u
We’re they ever not 😂
I cant believe the guy doesnt know the term inverted
I think USD really is the proper term, if you refer to the fork
For me personaly I would not take a gearbox bike even if they gave it to me for free because of this reasons:
- Banging rd realy doesn't happen that much.
- unsprung mass can be achieved with a lighter tire and rim too
- cable can be changed in 1min
- shift under load
- all the crank options
- all the chainring options
- al the spider and o'chain options
- all the bb options
- changing the chain every 2000k and put some lube after bikewash is a amount of maintanance that I can handle.
- total weightof the bike
- impossible to solve serious gearbox issues by myself
- more ugly cables on the cockpit or electronic that needs to be charged and updated
change my mind...
Less cables..... it's electronic wireless shifting
If you enthusiastically consider this the future, where have you been when Zerode G3 was officially announced on *March* and did exactly that? Where is your support to a small company that is pioneering the use of gearboxes in MTBs since the 00's, to the advantage of the whole community?
So GMBN, tell me one reason to continue watching you, since you are becoming an advertising platform instead of a bike information and news one?...
I know most people watch in portrait mode while on the toilet but isn't 2023 time for 4K?
Too much data use maybe but its a fair point
Not good enough or game changing enough to be the future, needs to be more revolutionary. They had internal gears over a hundred years ago....just saying....😅 but a good step all the same......Interesting though...
Looks like yet another expensive toy available only to those with an excess of expendable income and/or pro riders with sponsorships. What kinds of safeguards are onboard if the battery dies and the electronic gearbox no longer shifts? Is it still ridable? What do the maintenance and repair processes look like? What's the cost over it's lifespan? What is it's projected lifespan?
I liken this bike to what a pro rally car is to it's road legal counterpart - it's a great bit of engineering built to purpose, but it wont be your daily driver.
What’s nightmare that looks to maintain 😂
Nicholi bikes have been doing this for years why is this new
Why oh why would you run some awful techno-ish music over the clips of the gamuk bike rolling over terrain. I just want to hear the bike and absence of drivetrain noise.
Those gold handlebars did not go with that bike at all that bike should be black all the way black
I think that for those people who love maintaining their bikes themselves, gearboxes are not an option. Even if they are very reliable.
Yoooo
Hmm the revolutionary is that you can now ride it in an FIC race..
Nope
why do yo even need electric drive train when you jus need to go down?
If that's your argument then why even have gears or a chain 😂
@@lancejarman1 That's correct, gear and chains helps you go up. You can go down without gears, chains and electric drive but not without brakes.
I wish we took some inspiration from motorcycles and never invented the rear mech. Now you cannot change it since SRAM and Shimano are king and the rear mech is here to stay. Sad reality.
You mean internal gears? It already exist for commuter bikes
@@yukiko_5051sturmey archer had them over a hundred years ago
Just like car there trying to push electronics on bikes as well which makes people lazy and not wanting to pedal so they have pedal assist being said Americans will always be fat and out of shape at least a high percentage and it only increases
Really cool tech but man that bike is...in kind words..less attractive.
but ... But ... BUT ... If it is too successful it will be banned!!!!!!
Can’t believe you ride without gloves, just crazy and not a good example.
Electronic shifting, gay, also more drag too.