Why Arts Graduates Are Under-Employed
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- čas přidán 1. 09. 2015
- Arts graduates are often to be found making coffee - having spent their university years studying Plato or Foucault. Maybe it’s their fault, or maybe the problem lies with societies that have no real idea what the arts are for. Please subscribe here: tinyurl.com/o28mut7
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I wish this man would read to me before I go to sleep.
+Lua Veli I don't know who you are, but thank you for sharing this information, and your own ideas too, I've seen a couple of them in some vídeos. I think that Alain is changing the way people feel about philosophy. Nice to meet you, I'm from Honduras
+Kvn Cruz Hola! Muchas gracias por tus lindas palabras y por tu tiempo. Seguir a este canal es como atender una universidad excellente y eso por vida y gratis! Alain es realmente un hombre unico en este mundo.
Me gustaria recomendarte tambien un psicoanalista Argentino que se llama Gabriel Rolon. Su libro mas famoso es " Historias de Divan". Tiene muchas entrevistas en youtube. Son bonísimas.
Saludos a Honduras!
Hi! Thanks for writing in spanish! De hecho ya he visto algunas de las entrevistas de Gabriel Rolon en CZcams, pero han sido muy pocas como para formarme una opinión de él. Gracias por la recomendación., le seguiré el rastro. Best regards!
Get one of his audiobooks. Then Alain can read to you whenever you want.
Audio books dude.
The frustrating thing is, it isn't that people don't value our work. They enjoy and consume it all the same. People love, value, and even envy artists. They just don't believe in paying for it, or giving any prestige for it. It's declined since in recent years due to more vocal protests, but I can't count the number of times I've heard that someone loved a picture, so rather than buying a print, they just stole it and printed their own copy. Or took someone's illustration from their blog and claimed they themselves created it. Or rather than paying full price for a movie or a game, they buy second hand copies or pirate it because they don't believe the creators deserve or need their payment. The thing about this problem that makes my blood boil isn't that people don't love or see the value in art and humanities. It's that they cannot be forced to pay for it, so they refuse to, and then they look down on us because they think we're stupid. Like a bargain hunter at a thrift shop, they take joy in thinking they have deceived someone and still gained something.
This is so true. The internet offers a HUGE opportunity to have your work seen, and and appreciated, but people just steal left and right. Sometimes, I feel really awful when I view pieces on Devianart, because all I have to do is take a few clicks over to Ebay, and a print shop in China is selling their art on a pillowcase. (Can't recall how many times I've seen this.) Now I understand why a lot of older artists refrain from social media, and just stick to galleries and art festivals. The online Art community is cut-throat.
Chacha5678 sure. I'll just starve myself to death then if I want to be a Great Artist.
simple word :
internet
Amen
Chacha5678 That's very nice, but you don't just become a great artist who makes great art. it takes countless of hours, and that time is valuable.
I'm a fine art graduate. I never went into the degree expecting to get a job, instead my intent was to start my own art business and its been my full time career for the past 10 years now and I love it! My nitch is in marine wildlife art, showing the world the beauty that lies beneath the surface of our magnificently important oceans.
I work on my own time now and have lots of freedom which allows me to also study philosophy, science and other subjects that interest me while I work on my art.
Most art graduates don't understand that 75% of everything you need to be doing is business oriented and 25% art.
10% of art graduates can make a living on their art. So congratulations on being in that 10%. Being able to make a living doing what you love is extremely rare in this money-centric world.
Because 10% understand that business is what makes money, not just art itself. We're talking promotion, advertisement, connections (that's a big one! CONNECTIONS, NETWORKING!), constant improvement of your product, cause your art at the end of the day, even though it looks nice in a frame on a wall, is still a PRODUCT you're trying to sell. And with every product that sells well, there is a great campaign behind it, that is pushing to sell it. That's why I agree with Jason, and believe that Art students should actually major in business and minor in art (these days at least, because that's how capitalism works, and we live in a capitalistic world as you said, "money-centric world"), cause there's only so much you can learn technically from art until you have to become unique and that means breaking the rules usually (in my humble opinion).
@anonymous anonymous ahahahaha. "The creative arts major will be more successful in the long run." That was just one of the funny things you said. I also like how you compared new art to a new scientific theory. lol
alright calm down pacaso
Oh can you help me do art full time?!
If someone doesn't see the point or the value in having the arts as an essential part of society, have them drive around in a grey cube of a car, come home to a grey cube of a house, with colorless furniture made out of plastic, so that they can have a good time not watching TV, not having any books to read, no cinema to go, no music to listen to, not having any other food but the essentials needed to be healthy, and nothing to talk about to anyone else but the practicality of all these things. I see so many people repeating this capitalistic viewpoint of productivity as the pinnacle of "value." What's the point of making/studying art? What's the point of existing systematically? What's the point of advancing medicine to increase life expectancy if there's nothing to enjoy, nothing to experience, nothing to live for. This is, in essence, a regression of humanity. It’s reducing the concept of "living" to being highly efficient animals.
So far the most concrete comment I've seen on here. Tell those deluded pseudo - engeneers which anime or movie they will watch when they will finish their boring office job, or which novel or comic they will read.... or again in which kind of houses they will live if art didn't exist. Medicine, technology, engeneering is just a means to make our life better, art is the ultimate means to make our lives enjoyable, meaningful and livable.
Hmmm. I think this discussion is rather questionable. On one hand, people can adapt to many things and environments, even if the psychological side effects can be devastating (but when is that really taken into consideration?). On the other hand, one does not need to take up arts studies (and THAT is what we were discussing here) to produce fine art, let alone novels or animes. (Is film school lumped together with philosophy/theory in this category?)
What a great point of view! Gotta right this down
I feel like this is why so many of the trailers for movies I watch these days are boring/rubbish- not even the art industries are investing in quality-they just get the money and go
this is the best comment i've ever read on youtube, thank you
I have a feeling arts aren't taught in college so that an aspiring artist can get a job. It serves more to provide jobs for the teachers.
What I don't understand is how SO many people consider the arts are irrelevant, when most people spend much of their time engrossed in them - film, television, music, etc. There seems to be this cultural dissonance in which people deem the arts as irrelevant yet in droves they continue to switch onto Netflix to watch [often] wonderful story-telling or sit in their rooms consuming hours of free music whilst reading 200+ year old novels. What you love doesn't come for free. Someone made that for you to enjoy and broaden your outlook.
Film, television and music are more along the lines of... media
Qwerp the final product becomes media. But where do you get the ideas, the creativity to create the works, ideas have to come from somewhere, not necessarily studying art but at least involved in it or thinking in creative ways. It’s still like a muscle that needs to be worked, ideas don’t just go poof in your head, have to know how to create them as well.
@@rra7490 Pattern recognition + experience resulting from observation of an environment or system + conceptualisation + stimuli association = creativity... probably.
more farmers and construction workers :)
If art or design or studying culture is so utterly useless in our society, why the hell to colleges offer it as a field of study in the first place?
I ditched art history to study to be an esthetician because I decided the market clearly treats these things as a hobby. But, the therapeutic benefits of studying literature, art, philosophy, history, and world myths and religion are quite profound. These disciplines can help people deal with real-world problems, questions like, "What is love?", "Can something imperfect or even shocking still be beautiful?", "How do we cope with aging?", "How do we cope with the loss of a loved one, or just the everyday wear and tear of life?", "What is the ideal society?", "How do I become a better person?", "Why does some music inspire me while other music I don't get anything special from at all?" and so on. But the thing is, corporate culture sees these big questions of life, answered by exploring the humanities and fine arts, as worthless, because they don't see immediate profit in it.
I did the exact same thing. I came out wanting to write, to direct and to act - basically anythign in the theatre department is a thumbs up. But then I noticed there are real problems humanities and arts can solve, so I delved into drama therapy.
Well, there are small profits - from the book market. As the comments say above, just about everything is for sale...
@VisioningHail but they do what they love. Didn't you wanted to becoming something that you loved just to get shutdown and ridiculed by your peers, and because of that exact pressure you decided to switch to STEM major?
These are all biological, psychological and sociological questions.
@@charliec7853 But not only.
If you follow your dreams, you're probably going to end up being despondant about the world and your living situation, and find yourself wishing you took even just a little bit of your time to develop skills that will help you find employment and stability.
If you seek stability, you're probably going to end up despondant about the world and your living situation, and find yourself wishing you took even just a little bit of your time to just relax, chill the fuck out and enjoy life.
yes! well-said. I think ppl are far too serious about their "reputation" and a major part of that is our "profession". I wish someone would tell when I was 18 to get a 9-5 hands-on job, and chill on the weekends as opposed to busting my ass off 24/7 at school only to get nowhere. Parents need to stop pressuring their kids to do something of a high social status when farmers or tradesmen are just as important and pay just as much. So I say work your 40 hrs/week and spend your time off doing things you love like history or cinema.
It varies person to person and on the situation.
Sometimes, the fervent pursuit of a dream is what makes a person the most joyful.
Many problems arise when intentions are misplaced and there is a lack of self-awareness.
so basically no matter what we do we're gonna lose in the end. I'm a senior in high school and this is what I have to look forward to fan(fucking)tastic
High education is still a form of self-investment but maybe less practical in life.
NOTHING.... NOTHING.... NOTHING...
Not only that, but you also have to deal with condescending pricks finding new ways to mock you due to the choices you made...
why care about the opinions of others?
+Lucas Garibaldi Exactly, just because they're not studying a hard science doesn't mean that their skills and interests are worthless. I'm still trying to deal with people not taking my major serious and I'm a psychology major. Since we live in a society that mental health isn't exactly a priority. We still freak out when we hear about how many people in the US that are suffering from depression and anxiety, but we never do anything about it. Maybe just give them some drugs and hope for the best, but never actually deal with the problems at hand.
Sorry, this may have seemed a bit random, but I just needed to rant a little bit. Okay, I need to rant A LOT, but I'm just going to be quiet now.
Carina It's okay, it's good to let out some steam once in a while. Also, frustration is something that I have to deal a lot in a daily basis, so I understand...
Thanks. :) I'm just going through a lot of crap right now since I transferred colleges recently and I feel kind of disappointed with everything right now.
+Carina
In this society, when you feel ill and say, "I need to see a doctor." Nobody cares. But if someone is depressed or anxious, needs help and says "I need to see a psychiatrist." Everyone panics and stigmatises you.
Your voice is so soothing I want to kiss it
+The School of Life next thing you know Alain is going to be autographing titties.
+The School of Life your voice is so wonderful. no wonder why you have this much subscribers. :)
i am soooothed
+ike smith 😂
It's soothing to relax you out of any deep thinking you might engage in otherwise.
the thing is that these days, having no experience is more problematic than having art/humanities degrees. There are so many graduates with STEM degrees having trouble finding jobs due to having no experience as having college degree is same as high school degrees these days. I've heard plenty of people who ended up getting high paying jobs just by having great experience in specific field even though they were completely unrelated to their majors.
That is pretty dumb. In fact, only 29% of students actually end up working in a field related to the subject they learn. This is why I believe to an extent, university is a scam to everyone and why most people should really not be going because theoretically speaking, most jobs don't really require a degree other than to fill a qualification, it's really unnecessary and is nothing more but the severe case of favoritism and over-credentialism here in America.
To gain experience is just a matter of time. Internships, clubs. As long as you're willing to work for it. If u choose a hopeless course, then you're working in the wrong direction
As a fine art major who is getting ready for his final year in college, this video really hit home for me. Going into college, I knew about the struggle I would have with finding a good job after college, but I remained persistent. Art is the most prominent thing in my life that has always gave me drive and focus, I've been considering myself an artist since the age of six. Even as I've grown and life has taken many twists and turns, my love for it is the one thing that hasn't changed about me. Although recently I've hit a bit of a snag creatively and I don't quite know the reason why, which terrifies me. I've just recently subscribed to this channel and have been binge watching videos since. Now I've finally watched this one and I must say, it was beautiful, thank you, this video has given me a measure of hope. (sorry for going on a bit of rant for anyone who reads this)
You made the right choice getting an art degree. If it makes you as happy as you described it, no matter how hard life gets, makes your degree worth it. We desperately need creators in our time of materialist, consumerist, empiricism based culture.
Exactly. Although almost in the same boat, as an artist I forced myself through painful business classes as I knew that's what society valued, and those classes were the worst hours of my life. Even though I was pretty far in my business minor degree, I had to switch to creative writing. Sociology as a major was difficult to stay focused in enough. Just graduated now, though.
yes, I too (a music performance master degree holder) found this video less informative, and more call to action-tive. I wish some actual call to action were made though. What are some way that you all try to impress you ideas on the public?
best of luck dont give up
Waru Zafoo You aren't alone. Drama and the arts are the only things I feel could be fulfilling to me as a career and yet I'm struggling with what to go to school for (I'm sixteen) because I know how difficult it is to find work. But this video has given me some hope that it is as valuable as I know it to be. Good luck friend!
Attaining a degree in any of the arts/media these days is completely useless. You'll only end up being tens of thousands of pounds in debt, which you'll most likely never be able to pay off as, after wasting 3 or 4 of the most valuable years of your life. Trust me. If you're a true artist and want to make it doing what you love, you do NOT need a University qualification to prove your competence in any field. It's just a nice accessory. You can learn about anything you want to yourself.
joe jarden Yeah I'm not impressed by your ambiguous sounding role "training ad performance improvement" in the field of "organizational development". Lol, what does that even mean? Be honest, you make a good cup of coffee, don't you? Haha. The "problem-solving skills" and "communication skills" tags that get banded along with University degrees are so overblown. Like people who don't attend Higher Education are any less capable of problem solving or communicating in any capacity. Pure BS. Just a couple of over-hyped skillset tags, which are *just* as attainable outside of a degree course, to market university degrees to naive young kids who don't know any better. And lol, creativity and innovation? If there's anything Higher Education *won't* do, it's teach you how to be creative and innovative. To the contrary, it will teach you to stick to old, tried systems and not put you in testing situations which will force you to be innovative and cutting-edge in your approach. Those organizations and corporate studies you listed sound like extremely boring creativity killers. You can learn to problem solve and communicate by self-teaching, putting in the time to hone your craft and building your networks from a younger age, instead of spending 3/4 years taking notes from a tedious Power Point presentation in a lecture hall or classroom and blowing £25k in the process. All just for the chance for a zero hours, unpaid work experience role as Office Bitch. No thanks.
joe jarden Great comeback.
For ANYONE saying "should have studied STEM" or "anyone who studied art is useless" WHAT DID YOU JUST WATCH?! You were provided new ideas through a visually and comically entertaining experience. In other words, you watched a CZcams video, written, produced, designed, and otherwise compiled by these so-called "useless" humanities majors. Just because you believe the lies society tells you about your supposed superiority for having a knack for crunching numbers, that doesn't mean you can discredit a whole range of people with talents you so glaringly LACK. The world would be a cold, dark, unforgiving place without art. You owe most of what you enjoy to an artist, not your accountant.
+Wits' End You're wrong. My debt is in US dollars.
***** Lol pardon?
Wow. The amount of cynicism in the comments of this video is almost unfathomable. I thought I was going to encounter artistic people talking to each other about the positive aspects of having studied a profession in arts, lifting each other's spirits up, but instead I find a LOT of people bitching about how all artists are low life lazy bastards that don't deserve to complain about the poor choice of having invested a lot of time and money in a future that won't promise them anything. I find the fact that they comment on this video at all is evidence of their own disappointment towards a failed art interest which they had to drop in order to pursue "real jobs" that gives them "real money" and a "real projection", so they come here to yell at artists "you deserve it!".
First of all, let's make something clear: no one is above anyone, nor have special abilities or talents, or a greater fate than anyone. We are ALL subjected to the hamster wheel, we all require a job to pay our bills, we are insignificant minions working for someone that owns our ass, call it the government, call it the powers that be. That is the world we live in. BUT, it is not a legitimate reason to give up in living a life where we work our ass off but doing what we love. The world needs engineers and lawyers and everything, but it also needs artists. While getting on this crazy race to make money, not to get rich but to survive, we also forget that we are not only made of flesh and bones; and for the most cynicals, we ALSO live in a system that is forced upon us, but that is man made and that it just doesn't work! Do you think you're safe because you studied a safe career and landed a safe job? You can be laid off tomorrow and replace you with a billion other people who do exactly the same. Artists are not "special snowflakes", but guess what, neither are you. We all do what we do in order to survive in this society, and artists not only "paint and draw pretty pictures" to make a living; they are involved in every single aspect of your life, wether you are aware of it or not. They worked in the branding of the company you work for, they built and manage the advertisement that pushes you to buy, they exploited their imagination and abilities to create the video game you play every time you get back from work. They wrote and recorded the song you chose to ask your spouse to marry you. The thing you hang on your walls so they do not look like the prison they represent. All of this is created by people with different abilities, sensibilities and proclivities than you, and that'a perfect you know why? Because we need artists AND people like you. We didn't just exist in this world to choose "the least worst thing", and work on it for the rest of our lives, reproduce and die. We find out what it is we gravitate more towards, and then work hard, be the best at it and find a way that it can serve the world. This video is misleading in many ways. Artists are definitely not the only ones in trouble, and have definitely more than one outlet to make a living, specially in this day and age. I believe we need all kinds of people; engineers, biologists, artists, you name it, because the world needs it, but I refuse to believe that there are no people left that can't see beyond the practical value of something, that don't believe in their own humanity, their soul, their spirituality. I am not talking about religion, and this has nothing to with any specific dogma or even atheism, so don't even go there. We are forced into this hamster wheel, but that doesn't.mean you have to lose your soul in the process. Art is necessary in a billion ways, and if you can't see the bigger value of it, in the million platforms available in today's world, don't bitch about the people who do actually see it and apply it. There is no need to undermine someone elses' job because you're too blind to see more than something applicable that transcends the obvious.
Att: a living, working, thriving artist.
I know this comment is one year old already but I will always come back to it when feeling discouraged. Thank you..
ThatOnePerson Your comment is so right! I thought the same as you, that artist have to be defending their work in the comments. Instead of that, it's so sad reading that people doesn't care about art and that everybody agrees in one thing: art and art's degree are useless.
I'm mexican and study literature here and I always thought that in Mexico it was harder to find a job, to be recognized and to help people because we're supossed to be ignorant people that read a pair of books per year. Reading these comments had change my mind: incredibly we had so much respect and understanding of art than most of the international audience of School of life.
ThatOnePerson Agree 100%, but this the internet if you are artistic or philosophical your either dismissed or mocked.
Lukas Re Ima go with art is problem
Lukas Re It was a joke man. I agree with you.
Some students just dont know how to market their skills. You build a network of connections through studies, internship and shadowing. Make indepedent projects on the internet. You dont just show up with a degree and say where my money at? A Certificat just means you at least passed your classes like a million others. The employers dont know you and cant guess if your worth anything special. Actions speak louder than words on paper.
And can we promote manual jobs you learn on duty and community college. We need them so much more to keep society in order. We should start doing like the rest of the world and make it harder to get in university. It would make it way cheaper. Cuz we've all seen these lost souls on campus that are clearly waisting their time and money.
Margaret it is challenging to get in the a perfect university because tuitions are fuckin expensive. That’s why we take vocational/trade schools for granted.
Since I was 8 years old I dreamed of and pursued being a musician. After graduating with a music degree I unsuccessfully spent years trying to make a living. I then changed my mindset to: If I can't make a living doing my passion, I'll instead make as much money as I can doing whatever pays the most. I'm very happy I made this choice because I learned to become passionate about the new work I was doing and it felt great being praised and appreciated so much that people wanted to pay really good money for it.
Chad Wild Clay I don't understand do you mean your CZcams channel?
'Do what you have to do, to do what you want to do.'
Chad Wild Clay guy I know makes music and live his life making $3000 -$5000 a week. He never went to college. Those streams services were the money maker.
@@EroticOnion23 My philosophy. Make as much money as possible through your 20s to do whatever you want after your 30s lol. You can easily nest a couple hundred grand in networth by the time you're 30 if you don't fool around but most people don't have the commitment, sadly.
What did you end up doing?
Art is for living, the rest is for surviving.
you can more than survive with an engineering job, for example. Just saying.
And this is why India has a major problem...
@@psyche1988 Its so frustrating because I know so many indians/ Asians who are super talented and wanted this industry so bad, but because of society and family opinions, they give up.
How do you live without paying your bills?
Unless your parents are rich or you have a patron
@@NeylaAttari well others complain and demand those who have should give money to them. Not saying all of them just saying that some are like that.
This is depressing especially if you study any of these subjects. F.y.i. I work at a coffee house 😒
Did you major in art subjects?
+Dom Grindrod Consider yourself lucky still. I dropped out of college and can't get a job. Perhaps I should go back to college to go into some artistic field that I have an interest in, only to increase my chances of getting a basic job and increase my overall presentability.
I'm never going to do what I want to do. I'll end up in a dead-end job utterly miserable.
+Dom Grindrod That's only true with this mindset. The mind is the most powerful tool in the world. Use it wisely. Start by not putting yourself down.
+pennymac16 Magical thinking also doesn't work.
The humanities are very useful.
Humanity degrees are not.
Ronald Brunson what about philosophy? I'm thinking of studying it.
Study it on your own time. You will learn much more and won't have a useless piece of paper.
Only worthwhile degrees are STEM, pre-med or accounting. Otherwise just enter the workforce early and save yourself the debt.
Ronald Brunson thank you for your solid advice. Although I have to say, after reading your personal description on your CZcams account we seem to have many big differences...! However I do appreciate your insights, thankyou.
Haha thanks, that's mainly to get a reaction out of people.
Ronald Brunson so are you really what you say you are?!
I cant begin to wonder how vapid and ugly the future would be without artists, thinkers and designers; the real watchmakers of the world
I am living as you define "the future" today. And it's not ugly, those things are just useless.
engineers and inventors a part of the humanities though...
geminix365 Were they suddenly ripped away from you, architecture, fashion, creativity, movies and plays, how would you feel?
The people who makes that gets payed well, you can't cry about that and combine someone that paints in his garage and want to get paid for that, with other things that are completly different, and that sell much more, and are more useful.
you mean scientists and engineers?
I couldn't agree more with this, society neglects creativity despite its importance
I'm sorry to say, but there are way too many poorly written comments in this thread that confirm how poorly prepared humanity students are to convey the value of their education.
+DoMadrid I'm more concerned you're willing to make broad judgements from youtube comments, which necessarily are terrible.
+K Dave I'm saying that if you want to support humanities and the arts as a necessary part of civilisation, then you need to be concerned with form when conveying your opinion. In a thread such as this, the form is the written word. I see a lot of sloppy carelessness which negates and contradicts what people are trying to say. It makes those that study the humanities look like they should be working in a coffee shop.
+Goblin Honey Are you really concerned about that. Pity for you.
I wasn't aware that these forums were necessarily terrible.
+Adri M. they...?
+DoMadrid Nailed it.
Let's face that certain people (like me) are only created to do art. I literally cannot imagine having a good experience at a normal job. I feel like I have to achieve greatness. Greatness will not be reached if I hate my job. Hours upon hours I can study perhaps a painting and learn how it's made, what it represents.
If I fail at art. I fail at life.
But when I listen to this video it just sounds like my parents saying: "No, It's fine that you can't get a job. It's not your fault! It's OUR fault!"
That's Depressing to me.
One Click Wonder I want to hug you now
If you can't get a job, it's 100% your fault. That's how the world works, but that doesn't mean that you can't use your skills at a job i.e. graphic design, videography, really making anything that people will pay you for. You can even get companies to pay you for freelance social media work. As far as having a good experience, that is less important than being able to eat. Most people in the world don't get to have "good experiences" at their jobs, at least not initially. I'd settle for what you can get until you find something that you can have a good experience at.
@Christopher Mckiernan don't forget we are also working in a world where everyone is judged upon their disability, gender, diversity as well. Even if its very slowly fading away.
Sure, let someone else work in construction in cold, hot weather, build our country, while u sit at home and look at painting all day that's very cushy job u chose over there, why it doesnt pay, anyone can do it.
@anonymous anonymous imma be honest it does sound kinda pretentious i wrote that 3 years ago
The problem is that a lot of untalented and superficial people end up in these fields because they think is very easy and requires little effort, actual talented and serious people ends up very well more often
Not always. If the market does not seem a demand for the subject, it will not work out. You can be very good, but it doesn't matter.
I'm studying English Literature and Linguistics right now. I don't know whether knowing what the fuck Shakespeare had to say about life, or what Chomsky might have to say about language acquisition will get me somewhere. Knowing the field in my country I'll probably end up translating literature/scientific/academic papers. But you know what? I'm having fun, and boy will I have more.
Same boiii
Same here!
how that go?
As long as you have a substantial inheritance to keep you financially solvent, carry on with what you love
But writing is actually a skill that's needed most other arts degrees is tough to find a job
The Arts at college level were originally taught in universities for the sons of RICH people. They would take over estates and manage them for their life's work, and the arts and humanities were so they would have something to think about and do with the rest of their time, and because so many of them would probably stand for public office, serving their countries as political leaders. They would never need jobs, they were born into them, and they were expected to be leaders for their communities.
That was a great foundation for those lucky sons of riches.
Other courses were added over the centuries as more and more college applicants were no longer just the sons of the rich, but people who would intend to get "jobs" and work outside of their own property, and later, even, gasp, women who wanted to get jobs.
The Arts and Humanities are hangovers from a different world. They may be the most important, valuable things we can ever learn, but they were never intended to provide everyone with a career spent earning money. And so we see. It's a big piece of luck if they do.
Etymologically, the phrase "liberal arts" is derived from the classical Latin phrase "artes liberales" which means, in its ancient Roman sense, "studies for those who are 'free' from the need to earn a living" (emphatically NOT "studies for free men"). The liberal arts were never intended as a course for mass education, and, as you note, they are hangovers from a different world. We will still need them, but even in classical antiquity, the liberal arts were derided as useless dilettantism.
people are brainwashed into worshipping finance and corporations and money. there are some that wise up to the con and begin to appreciate the arts. It's out there but not in numbers. Go into the real world to pay your bills and with the extra time work on your arts. There are people out there that will enjoy and cherish your work.
Exactly. The problem is when you choose the subject as a major and expect a good R.O.I.
I have no idea what most people are talking about. Arts has been largely industrialised.
1) Graphics: 2D and 3D artists are in good demand in the advertisement, animation and games industry.
2) Music: Again, musicians can also make a handsome profit if they work in freelance.
3) Writers: Newspapers, journals and other media has a solid demand of writers.
4) Orators: Teachers, speakers and in some cases team leaders have a humanities background.
5) Pol-science: Campaigners and party members can reach high places if they have ambition and connections.
Besides the above, you can always find the odd job as a teacher in some obscure humanities subject.
Exactly, because odd jobs pay so well!!!
@@hyenaswine You just completely missed his point.
By and large, the majority of the people you're talking about struggle financially. Yes there are exceptions, but that's why they're called exceptions. The odds are against you. Don't complain when it doesn't work out.
@@hyenaswine Exactly. People always want to look at the exceptions, but never face the majority.
I'm just saying, art and humanities jobs can also be automated. As an Engineering student and doing art as hobby. I just found a way to generate a million paintings in one day. 99 percent of them are trashes, but the 1% is gold, I can sell the generated painting for around 10grand. That's just for painting, there's more possibility for automation than I can imagine. I can even think how to generate a 3d environment with automation and making 3d artists obsolete.
Reminds me of the final chapter of Bertrand Russell's The Problems of Philosophy. He writes...
[The view that philosophy has no value] ... appears to result, partly from a wrong conception of the ends of life, partly from a wrong conception of the kind of goods which philosophy strives to achieve. Physical science, through the medium of inventions, is useful to innumerable people who are wholly ignorant of it; thus the study of physical science is to be recommended, not only, or primarily, because of the effect on the student, but rather because of the effect on mankind in general. This utility does not belong to philosophy. If the study of philosophy has any value at all for others than students of philosophy, it must be only indirectly, through its effects upon the lives of those who study it. It is in these effects, therefore, if anywhere, that the value of philosophy must be primarily sought.
But further, if we are not to fail in our endeavour to determine the value of philosophy, we must first free our minds from the prejudices of what are wrongly called 'practical' men. The 'practical' man, as this word is often used, is one who recognizes only material needs, who realizes that men must have food for the body, but is oblivious of the necessity of providing food for the mind. If all men were well off, if poverty and disease had been reduced to their lowest possible point, there would still remain much to be done to produce a valuable society; and even in the existing world the goods of the mind are at least as important as the goods of the body. It is exclusively among the goods of the mind that the value of philosophy is to be found; and only those who are not indifferent to these goods can be persuaded that the study of philosophy is not a waste of time.
Interestibg
+Peter Nguyen Philosophy once had value. But then Wittgenstein got confused by language and everyone thought it was brilliance. Which then inspired "post-structuralism," thereby turning much of philosophy into incoherent nonsense.
+Syncopator I'm sorry you didn't understand it. Try another read.
+abeevau Kind of a douchey response. He could actually understand and consider it ludicrous.
fmlAllthetime Yes, I consider Analytic philosophy to have retained a useful amount of rationality, and while Wittgenstein is normally considered to be one of those, I don't think he did them any favors for the most part, when you consider where the Continental philosophers went with his ideas about language (the road to that ludocracy you mentioned). I find most of Wittgenstein's statements about language to be overblown or merely obvious for the most part. There's a few things of interest there but Wittgenstein seemed to have trouble organizing them into coherence, even to his own satisfaction. His final work was published posthumously, apparently because he didn't consider it complete. Ultimately, what we've got in many Continental circles are proponents of the argument that language is imprecise, then supported with endless tomes of verbiage that seems to be attempting to prove the thesis using needlessly obscure references and invented terminology. But when you are trying to argue for the lack of precision in language, using clarity of argument suddenly becomes a counterargument, rendering the whole exercise mostly ridiculous.
I think it's important to note that many of these underemployed artists are making art in their free time, when they get home from their barista job. They share it on social media, and drive the arts and humanities with their ideas. Those ideas are then cannibalized by the big media companies for profit that the original artist never sees.
Basically, the arts are inspired. But that inspiration is mostly found in underground corners of the art world. That dialogue between artists sharing their perspectives drives demand, but they don't have the resources to supply. Big companies do, and they take those ideas, chew them up, and regurgitate them so they're different enough that it isn't just straight up theft (which is theoretically illegal), and keep the money it makes. They don't need to hire the artist. They only need to hire the people who can recreate ideas of others as efficiently as possible.
As a painter who has struggled in dealing with these exact notions, I found this video deeply warming. Sometimes even just listening to the chaotic thoughts that fill my mind being delivered in an organized and educated manner can be cathartic.
The biggest problem I've had as an artist is the constant degradation of people feeling like artist SHOULDN'T GET PAID WHAT THEY ARE WORTH. That is the biggest problem with the world when it comes to all artist: Singing, dancing, painting, photography, pick your medium. Alot of people like artists and admire us but don't respect us like a doctor or accountant but if people would look around them they will see that every single entertainment you love is from artist. Someone had to create the movie, the video clips, the television show, the play, the painting, and etc. So then you get people who want to do a 8 hour wedding before the ceremony, the ceremony and reception fully edited plus prints and a photo album for $500. Then when you give them your professional price they gasp and say "well my family member can take pictures for cheaper". Lol it just tickles me the lack of respect some have. None of these people care that we went to school or spent hours to perfect our craft like they did in whatever job they are doing and have bills just like them. I feel there is nothing wrong with at majors but if society would respect us more we can get what we deserve.
do art independently, school will just turn you into a cookie cutter with several cup holders
CHLNWR Not really. If you're weak enough to let yourself molded by it, it will happen.
But going to school for art just guides you to achieve improvement at a faster rate.
Philosophy major here at a top tier public school. Couldn't find a good job so I moved abroad to learn Spanish and a year later I'm getting a business degree in Spanish. 100% it's going to work this time. Difficult problems require radical solutions. Still don't regret my philosophy degree.
Part of the issue is that an arts education should also be an entrepreneurial education.
My arts degree became a lucrative antique business for two decades. Not everyone can see quality it needs to be revealed to them.
Subjects like philosophy and history are categorized as Arts? Good to know.
Just what I thought! They mention philosophy, history and political science as arts but not a word about music or dance which are actually arts 🤔
Θάλεια Λάμπρου
philosophy and history are “liberal arts”, while music and dancing are considered “arts”. they’re all different types of art.
Art and art history used to be appreciated and learned as a hobby and the carreer artist used to be trained by masters in workshops by working on commissions and making money. Not taught by a tenured professor you have to pay for and who doesn't get you closer to potential customers or learning about the business side of art in general.
it's hard to be passionate about your dreams when it becomes a competition.
I've only just learned that chasing your dreams is difficult
Most people I see working at McDonald's at 30 years old have art majors and are in 100k debt
It's not just art, every other college degree out there is suffering.
Opportunities are now for those who have connections or know someone that can help.
Skills can only get you so far, without the right exposure and connections sadly won't find the job you'd like.
In Business School we say Networking. Its not what you know its who you know.
We really need another French Revolution
he said "arts". he's talking about all humanities degrees, not just painting-art.
Wow love this. As someone who went to film school, I have to fully agree with this. I've been getting a fair amount of work but most people I know, even those who were at the top of the class, have already had to seek out other "regular" jobs.
+HaloUnion This might work for you, or it might not. (Granted it sounds like you have work at the minute).
Have you considered creating a volunteer role for yourself? Presuming you have some experience, perhaps you/friends could address charities and offer your services for a few hours a week. I find that most charities are awful at communications, and even worse at producing media. And then when you look at their front line services it's just drastic. If you offered a few hours, perhaps produced something for them, it would look fantastic on a CV.
I only suggest this because it worked for me (after studying politics).
Looking for jobs is the problem. Employers want specific skills to meet their existing business needs. Jobs tend to be functional-skills based, which is great if you studied software engineering or chemistry - not so great if you did philosophy or comparative religion.
Humanities graduates are in the position to change the world, but they’ll need to do it outside traditional employment structures. Existing businesses will never value your skills so don’t waste your time. Instead, look to freelancing, starting new businesses, running education classes etc. In other words, the humanities graduates need to get entrepreneurial. It’s a harder road with less certainty and more risk, but it can yield amazing results.
There is a hunger out there for what the humanities has to offer - but you won’t find that hunger in an office tower.
You can do a degree in something that will you get you a job and simultaneously pursue your interests, whatever they are. Nobody stops you from reading history books and learning more about history if you're doing an engineering degree. Of course you won't get a degree in that but a degree is honestly just a form of external validation. How many writers have an English degree? Not many. How many artists have an art degree? Not many. The problem is that the education system is designed in such a way that people find comfort in external validation.
I'm a film student I'm scared
+annyong bluth, as a student of journalism, sociology and now a graduate student of media, I say don't be scared. Be proud. You deeply understand a medium significant number of people cannot fathom, but would love to.
annyong bluth Hug me
Shans I'm a computer science major I'm not
Savage Tech lol really
U should be...
I never regretted that I'm Art Graduate. I studied human feelings, greatest works of art and about history of world. I will never change my branch for any other department.
It's called supply and demand art is a hobby not a job
I really like the art style and animation used here. Great job School of Life!
this is one of the reasons why my parents don't want me to take art major :(
I spent a year as a hairdresser’s apprentice, as I wanted a job that was stable and there will always be a market for it. It was the most depressing experience, and although it was easy work I was never intellectually stimulated. And I decided to pursue fine art and art history as I originally planned, and I love it. I went in completely aware that I’d be working in some kind of minimum wage job, for quite awhile to fund my research. But I’d rather be educated and poor, and studying something I love, than doing something I hate to make other people happy.
(Sorry a lil rant-y - I just wanted to share my experience)
Well, that's your perspective. You do you.
It's good that you are doing what you like, I don't think being poor is a bad thing.
Why should the employer spend time wondering whether a Philosophy grad would improve his business? The onus is on the grad to convince that they have practical use. The problem isn't with the employers. The grads themselves don't know where they fit in. Of course a few are able to apply their knowledge in creative ways (i.e. Literature grads in the finance sector?), but most don't. Is this the fault of societies? I think this is the fault of blind passion, going into something with no idea what it's good for.
Very old joke here...
Q: What do you do when a guy with a graduate degree in Philosophy shows up at your front door?
A: Pay him and enjoy your pizza.
+Gregory Albano A: Pay him for his words of wisdom and enjoy your home-made pizza made from organic, local ingredients?
+DHGameStudios That would be nice but most of his customers are sports fanatics, crack whores, obese retail workers, and the full menu of misery and mediocrity. Not exactly a receptive audience for some pearls of wisdom. And as he returns to the pizza parlor for his list of next deliveries, he regrets so much that he never majored in business administration/finance or did the LSAT's. Those guys are at least paying their bills. He thinks to himself, I should have majored in something practical, and kept that philosophy stuff as a personal interest or hobby.
+Gregory Albano Whats the first thing you say to an Actor?
Coffee Please.
+BadMouseProductions That's Funny!
what's the difference between a philosopher and a pizza?
a pizza can feed a family
Well let's see...
- Their degrees are extremely saturated.
- They are not in high demand.
- They're too general.
- Not enough jobs in their field are open.
Shall I continue?
Until somebody actually comes up with uses for arts graduates, instead of sound bites about how useful they could be if we understood them, we are rather oversupplied. Selling these poor souls expensive degrees that lead them nowhere is basically a pyramid scheme run by arts faculties.
I think belittling arts students as naive or ignorant of a capitalistic job market is short sighted and dismissive. 1. Because going into higher education only in pursuit of its material payoff takes away from the enjoyment and necessity of learning, which is to enrich your mind and broaden your perspective and understanding of the world. 2. To show little sympathy to intelligent, educated students just because their skills are "not applicable" to the job market is to assume that the job market comes before the individual. You realise - as this video points out - that WE create the job market and the market itself, not the other way around. Lacking sympathy to those who do not comply to the status quo is to accept it as concrete, as opposed to something to improve or change.
At the end of the day, those who work hard will be rewarded in some way, shape or form, and perhaps not monetarily. Regardless of your degree, those who slack off and don't apply themselves won't have great job prospects anyway. Anyone deterred from the comments on this video or from the stereotypical jokes that come from insecure people seeking to validate their self worth: just work hard and work for what you believe in, you will attract the right type of life for you.
David Foster Wallace did an amazing commencement speech that talks on the value of a liberal arts degree. I really recommend anyone to watch it!
+Snowflake Pillow Just because the man himself is not a great role model (I agree btw) doesn't mean that his ideas are invalid.
+Snowflake Pillow I wouldn't say "happier," but yes, I understood this video to suggest that there is a practical value of the humanities, just as useful as knowledge from other disciplines in improving this chaotic modern world.
However, what you say about DFW is a little confusing. You say, "this by no means discredits his argument," when that is precisely your intention. Anyway, if you wish to consider DFW unworthy of the recognition he gained because he had depression and committed suicide, then i consider you should also dismiss the works of Ernest Hemingway, Sylvia Plath, Primo Levi, Hunter S. Thompson... Heck! What would Robin Williams know about humour? He killed himself from depression too. And from your use of the word "even," as in "he couldn't even avoid killing himself," I am getting the idea that you view depression as a sort of defect in morality or self-will. If so, please don't, because it is not the case.
How you interpret DFW's literature is your prerogative, and if you think he breeds depressing thoughts, fair enough. For me, I don't get that. I think he tries his best to reach the truth. But to stay relevant, his speech explores the human value of getting a liberal arts degree because it teaches you to be more open-minded and empathetic. I'd get that you wouldn't want to listen to his life advice if he was suggesting that he knew the right way to live and that everyone should follow him, but he didn't, and he stated this too.
How does one tell the difference between a moronic individual, and an intelligent one? The moronic one will claim they know the right way to live. No one knows the right way to live man, get off your high horse. Also suicide is not a symptom of a defect, it's a result of an illness.
Snowflake Pillow My point when I said that "suicide is not a symptom of a defect, it's the result of an illness" was that one's psychological pain can become so tremendous that death seems to be the only viable option, an inevitable result. Medically speaking, a symptom is a subjective indicator of disease. You wouldn't consider death to be a symptom of bacterial meningitis would you?
As for the rest of your comment, cognition definitely plays a role in depression. I agree that if you're psychologically vulnerable or genetically predisposed to certain disorders, that developing harmful thought processes could certainly lead to the development of a mental illness. But, avoiding works because they were written by someone with a disorder, (or even because they deal with themes that relate to a disorder), because you're afraid that this will somehow cause you to develop said disorder, is absurd.
+Snowflake Pillow
In regards to your comment directed to me, yes, I too think that suicide is a sign of defect - a biological/psychological and social one. But what I said in my earlier comment is that you view it as a moral defect, because you see those with depression as "unmotivated", "weak-minded" and confused. Although the word depression has been overused and overextended in modern lingo, the type of severe depression that causes people to commit suicide is not because the person has the characteristics of being lazy or weak.
There are many different things that can spark depression, be it deployment, loss of a loved one, being genetically predisposed - it’s not merely an absence of motivation or awareness. To suggest such a thing would be ignorant and simple minded.
It’s a real shame that you can’t appreciate the work of people who were troubled in their personal life. I hope you’re young and haven’t experienced or witnessed depression up close, but in the likely case that you do, I hope you treat it with more compassion.
Donald Trump doesn't attract unmotivated depressed people, he attracts xenophobic republicans. I think this is enough from me, reading your comments are...what's the word? Depressing.
I am sorry for saying this, but people all over the world balance they passions vs the need of such profession in the market. The problem with the bitterness of graduates is not the serving coffee part. Is that they payed hundreds of dollars, for an education that did not improve their socioeconomic status. As I see it, If you have to invest in your future, INVEST wisely, no one would put millions of dollars on a market who shows low revenue.. why would you do the same with your future?.
+RavnoUK It's astounding how many people look at (all) things from an economic perspective. I know it's the reality we live in. But it's about seeing the value in it that currently isn't seen. When the value is recognized by people, it will be recognized in the economy, because people constitute the economy.
+pennymac16 Economic concerns are an issue in USA, I don't live in USA, nor I am from there, but since your education is treated as a business with insanely high tuitions and fees.. you are forced to think about education on the investment(profit) basis. Also, I know is not the case of every person with a degree in Arts, but most of the people blame their education and society, when the only reason for choosing a degree in Liberal Arts, or Electronic Modernistic Arts, was to be in college, party and have experience that they have been sold on the movies/tv.
RavnoUK
First of all, I am not from the U.S., neither is the mind behind the video. Why assume this?
How do you know that "most people blame their education and society"? And for what? How do you know that they (most people) only want to "be in college, party and have the exprience that they have been sold on the movies/tv"?
(I know this is an argument from authority, but I trust when I say that) John Oliver said on his show that going to college is theoretically still worth it financially speaking, even with taking loans.
Lastly, I agree, one is somewhat forced to consider the return on investment regarding education, though not only in the USA. However, do you think it should this way? I think the impact the economy has on educational decisions should be minimized where it can be.
+pennymac16 I dont assume you are from the U.S. I just clarified I was not.
I know from first hand information, that some of the U.S college students, wanted the experience, because even if they end up dropping out, its some how socially acceptable and gives some meaning to their lives. I spend some summers with american teen agers and that was their discourse , - Lets find something easy and in a college!! imagine the parties! -, Thus, many careers end up being made to fit those needs, with courses like "Gaga for Gaga - univ of virginia" and "learning from youtube - Pitzer college".. and so on.
Going to college is worthed, however I would speak of european Universities, in which you can go if you are qualified without losing your house or getting into massive loans. Free healthcare and education allows the population to focus on artistic deals or what they want to do. However, if you need to pay for your education, as in the U.S, the sensible thing to do, is to pay for a degree who would allow you to both be happy and improve your economical status.
+RavnoUK One thing many people don't realize is that you don't need a degree to be an writer ,artist,actor etc. And sadly the view you have of American college students is sadly true. I had a fried who turned down a full-scholarship from a very good college because it didn't have a great night life and instead went to a pretty bad school because it was a party school.
This made me so sad :( as a young artist I am so scared
I feel like we were raised to think that each of us has a voice of our own and thoughts to share with the world, which is true in a lot of cases, but we can't all be artists because we need other jobs to keep our society functional. I really love doing art stuff, and I'm a bit exceptional in some areas, but it seems that my best chances are getting a non-art related job and working on my skills in my free time and then maybe something will come of that(it's fun to do anyway and to be honest I'm not exactly sure what I want out of life). I think I might avoid going to college because of debt and college only really being useful to people who want to be doctors and lawyers or something practical. But I've heard it's even difficult to find openings for those jobs. Also, quite a few students in my grade want to be doctors and the like, and I wonder if supply and demand for these jobs will be come outweighed. I think encouraging everyone to go to college is like clogging a drain, but of course there are more jobs to study and get degrees and jobs for than doctors and artists. Sorry this is kinda unfocused, I just wanted to get my thoughts out.
Great, I'm even more freaked out know. I've always wanted to be an animator. Seeing my creations come to life makes me feel happier. But I guess it's just wishful thinking. I don't know what to do with my life now.
Suicide is for us who wants to go the other way in life
money
You might animate as a hobby then. that's easier today than it's ever been with things like youtube and Instagram.
This is the one thing that scares me about pursuing a degree in philosophy, but after watching this video, it made me proud to be going into the field. Yes, it is likely that I won't find something that makes me a six figure income, but if life is truly in cycles, then one day the humanities will boom again, and I hope I'm alive to witness it. Thank you so much for this video.
+Greg Tinsley
Philosophy tends to be one of the main undergraduate degree for people taking the LSAT (which makes sense if you think about it, as law is little more than applied philosophy).
If you can't make six figures as a lawyer or judge, then you are doing it wrong.
But then your studies would make you realize the baseness and bourgeoisness of focusing on something like a six figure salary.
Yeah that would be saying that I wanted to become a lawyer or a judge though. I haven't really done enough research on the LSAT and going to law school to have a direct opinion on it, but now that you mention it, I might give researching that a try. Wouldn't want to cut myself short if I had what it takes to be a lawyer, now would I? :D
+Greg Tinsley I'm sure that after a year of learning Philosophy you will look back on this comment and feel a bit dumb and naive. Which is ironic because by then you'd already be in. What I'm saying is that you will 100% change your mindset about the things you've written,but by then it'll be too late.
I studied art and have always drawn since i start picking up a pencil, my mum is an artist. She got a lucky career unlike other art students, she got a well paying job, multiple too, but that was in the 80s, 90s. She told me people has changed, and no one believes in seeing beautiful things, they like them but no one pays for them. Especially now everything is available online, but if you are an artist and you have no social media, no one will know about your art…thats the hard part.
She advised me to keep drawing as a hobby and not living off of it. And i changed my career path to a scientific career, been loving having a stable job to be able to pay for my art supplies. It’s sad but i cant complain
I couldn't agree more. It's such a sad story
It’s not that people don’t assign value to art. It’s that there’s such an excessof people graduating with art degrees hoping to get a career in an already over saturated field.
Question for you, how much would YOU pay an arts graduate to talk about how to have better relationships? Or how to express feelings in a more understandable way?
If YOU wouldn't pay an arts graduate to do that, then why should you expect other people to?
I wouldn't because those are really stupid questions to ask.
This video is fundamentally flawed - it isn't 'society' failing to recognise the value of these graduates - its the failing of the graduates to recognise / demonstrate their value to society. Personal responsibility is a much better approach than blaming your failings on others and expecting things to be handed to you on a silver platter.
+Silas Babilonia The focus on STEM is producing a bunch of people who can't follow complex arguments, recognize logical fallacies, or even have good reading comprehension. Worse, they don't even think any of that is at least worth looking into. The whole legacy of thought, culture, expression - they think it's pointless. As a society, we're screwed.
+Silas Babilonia Yea the people of France are totally spending their whole life reading Voltaire and admiring Da Vinci. They are doing the same jobs Americans do; teaching, programming, nursing, financing, taxi driving, janitor work etc. The difference is that France has had a longer history than USA so it had more time to create this culture thing.
+pink pearl
Is that a joke? Critical- and logical thinking are a key part of pretty much every STEM field. I'm studying psychology and history, so I'm not at all in the field, but pretty much everyone i know in STEM are massively intelligent in fields other than their own niche (physics/engineering, etc).
Take my sister or my boyfriend; both are studying a field of engineering, and both are some of the most intelligent people i know of, when it comes to logical reasoning, creative thinking, and overall comprehension of complex philosophical issues.
I may be belittling myself by saying this, but if i had to compare my friends from my own filed of study, with my extended STEM studying friends and acquaintances, I'd say that my STEM friends are in many ways, noticeably sharper overall, when it comes to pretty much everything that involves thinking and overall comprehension, compared to people in my own field of study.
+IchBinEin Actually your reply is a good example of what I'm talking about. I said "recognize logical fallacies" and you took in "logical thinking", which is something else. Same thing with "reading comprehension" and "overall comprehension of complex philosophical issues". I'm not saying STEM people are stupid, I'm saying STEM rewards and encourages certain types of intelligence and pretends others don't exist.
+pink pearl You must be kidding. As a STEM graduate myself, I have to say that in my impression "logical fallacies" is what they actually teach to art students. Once they graduated they live in a parallel world and only say bullshit, it is impossible to have logical conversations with them. But they are really fun and outgoing so I still like them during parties :)
This is such a counter-intuitive idea. As long as you are breathing, thinking, feeling and relating ~ u are already a part of the eco-system. No one is depriving you of your choices to study arts. The illusion is that if you do a degree in arts, that entitles you to a monopolistic view. That is the unfortunate lie ….
Fun fact: this also happens for those of us with science degrees.
Fun fact: humanities are sciences lol. Not all of it but there are fields of studies such as art theory or art history that have a science perspective, we may not need a lab with microscopes, but sometimes we make good use of gloves, mask, eyewear and white coat for archive research. But most of the time it is a lot of reading and writing.
@@laru09 ??? Since the comment I made was five years ago I'm not exactly sure what I meant but rewatching the video I think I just meant that it's not just people with degrees in the humanities that are unemployed or underemployed. I have a neuroscience degree but struggled finding a job and still haven't had a job working in that field. I'm at least working in a field somewhat adjacent now but it still feels like I am underutilized I guess. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
True. I have a degree in biology. It’s useless. Lol. Literally. Unless you have a master’s degree or a PhD. then have fun working at Starbucks. However, as he did talk about it I find my education to be versatile in the day to day life. I believe that any piece of information we have help us live a better quality life. I hold a job in retail and in my previous job I worked with 2 lawyers, 1 teacher, 1 interior designer, 1 IT(all women). Women face challenges in the workplace due to motherhood. I feel that I lost my career partially because of my family.
@@auraandrei146 I have a degree in Information Technology, but is working in customer service at present. I am aware that my chosen field is rapidly changing, and I have been left out of the IT field because of irrelevant/non-related work experience, and I am afraid that I cannot get into IT because of this. Because I graduated in 2012 and is 29 years of age (I should have been amassed 8+ years of related experience and in mid-level IT position), that fear is getting real. Also I have gotten into depression because of the desperation to get into IT. For myself, if you are 30 years old and not in your chosen field, YOU ARE STUCK AND HAVE FAILED MISERABLY IN LIFE.
@@markarca6360 that’s not true. There’s meaning in life without putting so much emphasis on our accomplishments. You have a lot to learn. It’s a journey. You won’t understand this overnight. Just enjoy your life day by day and learn that there’s beauty everywhere. You only have to open your eyes. There’s something you can learn from everyone and each day is a gift. There’s no guarantee in life that throughout your journey you will accomplish your dreams but the journey there should be beautiful. Many times on our path to a certain destinations, we realize that we meet better things in life and good people who change our direction. I wish you peace and love.
Moral of this video = Major in engineering, medicine, pharmacy, accounting or go to trade school.
yes.
JE Hoyes nope. we will work boring jobs maybe but we work to live. Not live to work. Art and philosophy could be learned by anyone who actually wants to learn those subjects.
+JE Hoyes who doesn't make more then a barista?
+BetterCallSaul true. passion should be treated as a hobby, not work.
JE Hoyes 15000 - 16000 a year
I'm an art student. This video makes me smile because it gives me hope.
i legit cried. one of my professors keeps tellin me the significance of artists in history, and now I completely understand why. thank you very much
I insisted for so many years that art was what I wanted... Art was what I loved and wanted to go to college for and despite what everyone was telling me that I would be homeless and poor for ever... I went. I wasn't going to let myself be talked out of it by people that don't value my choices or what I like... ...I put in four very challenging years at a school I could just barely afford... And I graduated. I have been a new graduate for more than a year now.... And I hate everything about my life. I have worked only retail. I am not homeless, but I live with "Mommy and Daddy" and I'm gonna be here into my 30s. I have absolutely no drive to do any art anymore. After all... No one wants any from me for a reasonable price... And no one really cares. I live my life going to my underpaying retail job to pay for my car which I only drive to and from work and outside of that I exist. I am so tired... And yet... What about what was supposed to be my passion?... All art school did was show me that I am not as creative as I once thought I was. I have so many regrets and no choices. At 23 I feel like my life is over. Which makes it very hard to find a reason to wanna get up in the morning or last a full week without wanting to die... But hey... If you think art school is lazy, be my guest. Sit back and put your feet up on a studio table to try it yourself. Lemme know how that goes for you.
First, I want to say that this comment helped me out so I'm going to try to help you out!
A couple of years ago I got an AA in General Studies since I wasn't sure what to major in. Thanks to my parents' financial situation, the government gave me Pell Grants to pay for that degree. I figured I could use it like a transfer degree later, once I knew what to study in and if I found a way to pay for college.
In time I became somewhat bitter. I worked as a "sandwich artist," a lifeguard, in the kitchen of a gas station, the kitchen of a nursing home, and then as a janitor. I figured, "Well, this isn't great but at least I didn't major in something I didn't like and then ended up disliking my job /and/ having a big debt hanging over my head." Still, for all those years since I got my AA degree I haven't been /happy/ either.
Recently I decided that is enough is enough. I'm 27 now, how many more years am I going to spend unhappily? I've recently filled out the FAFSA though I know for undergraduate degrees the government won't cover much. I decided I'd go ahead and take out a loan and I hoped I could at least achieve a middle class lifestyle with an undergraduate degree.
Then, I just had to finally decide what to major in. I've been all over the place with my interests but I know a lot of the things I like are not really things that are in-demand. I then thought, "I'm good at math. Maybe I can just major in that and get /whatever/ job. At least I'll have more money - that's what I want, right?"
Even though I told myself that I've still been stressing about this. I know the kinds of things I /actually/ want to major in but how will I pay off my eventual debt with those degrees? Then, if I'm just doing /whatever/ to get money, will I really be any better off than I am right now? Everyone says "follow your passions" and that "things work out" but that seems kind of overly optimistic. At the same time, I /want/ those things to be true. I want to do what I feel like and then if I fail I know that at least I tried rather than preemptively deciding not to try at all.
I've been scrolling through the comment section and reading hundreds of comments, looking for some insight besides just, "lol art degrees are worthless, duh." Your comment helped me because when I read it I thought, "Wow, this person went for it! They got the degree!" Even though you're not /using/ the degree I felt jealous of you for having it and that's kind of when I realized that I still wanted to major in art too. Realistically, I know I might end up where you are but at least then I'll feel like I achieved /something/ in my life and for a while I'll enjoy myself as I finally learn art in school rather than continuing to try to get better at it on my own.
One day, I hope we'll both be able to make a living off of our art. In the meantime I hope we'll be able to be satisfied so that we won't die thinking, "What if I /could/ have been an artist?" Getting the degree is hard and maybe succeeding after getting it is even harder but, you know, it's really easy to fail by just not trying at all.
You are very young don't be discouraged.
There is nothing that annoys me more than people who think the only way of life is: study engineering, law or business, get a high paying job, get a family, spend your money, encourage your children to do the same, die.
Just imagine a world without knowledge of history, politcs, art, philosophy etc. were only close minded bafoons would engineer, build, buy, use and sell stuff. Sound kinda like a fascist utopia.
+113Robinho don't forget "school of medicine". most of the doctors i know (my father is a plastic surgeon here in Tijuana, Mexico, actually, you can look him up, Dr. Raul Gongora) only become doctors for the money and the status. yes, we have a "good life", pretty house, etc. but i cant hardly remember a vacation with my dad when he`s not on some convention somewhere in Mexico, multiple courses, never ending courses, interviews, meetings, last minute phone calls... and when i try to speak with him theres always his secretary... hes ALWAYS in surgery... back in the day (hes 54 now) he used to be at the operation room at 5 AM!!!!! and leave the clinic at 7 o 8 PM!!!!! what kind of life is that?! and then he was all too tired and went to sleep. i dont even know my dad at all, hes always THE DOCTOR. but anyway, back to my point... people think thats the ONLY and BEST way to live your life: become a doctor, be a lawyer, etc... but have no life, not a real one.
The famous quote from trainspotting:
"Choose life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, Choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players, and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol and dental insurance. Choose fixed- interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisure wear and matching luggage. Choose a three piece suite on hire purchase in a range of fucking fabrics. Choose DIY and wondering who you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing sprit- crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing you last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked-up brats you have spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that?"
+113Robinho Ummm as someone studying engineering I find it challenging and rewarding. Creative and innovative solutions are core to what we do. Most people in my course feel the same, and I'm sure there are those in business and law who are following their passions. A balanced person matches critical thinking with creative endeavours. Artists of all kinds are important to society but arts majors should be prepared to widen their skill set if they do not achieve their dream job, such is life. Imagine a world without law, engineering and business. I think you will find it has equally dystopian qualities as you mentioned before. Engineering, medicine and the sciences should continue to be promoted as the degrees of choice over the arts because those disciplines match the practical needs of society. Appreciating art is a privilege; one which many people in this world do not have the pleasure of having, because of life's harsh reality. Frankly to suggest otherwise is pretentious. I have encountered many of these people you take annoyance with, often I have found they have this mindset because their family comes from nothing and want their children to grow up with the same privileges, I hesitate to say; you had.
+113Robinho I do agree that we should study history, politcs, art and philosophy for finding some meaning in life(also the sciences for understanding the univers ) but this kind of things have spiritual value not monetary value so we should beter go in to engineering, law or business cuz that pays the bills .
Before anyone missunderstands: i don't remotely have a problem with people who enjoy or want to make a career in any of said professions.
I just find it depressing that so many people think that arts as well as history, politics or other economically less promising professions are unnecessary to our society.
I majored in History and got a job right away. Granted it was in the quite easy to get into profession of sales initially. However, after I could no longer take that cutthroat, immoral, money crazed monthly rat race to 100%, I landed a solid compliance service job at the same company. And honestly, the only reason I got the job was due to the aptitude I displayed for both absorbing information, as well as verbal and written communication during my sales job - which is a direct result of my history degree.
The Humanities aren't that bad, you just can't be picky, and you really have to market your aquire humanities skills. And believe me, those skills are marketable, especially when you're up against the reading and writing skills of most booze hounding business majors. Not to mention, if I hadn't majored in such a worldy, eye opening subject like history, I'd probably have fit right in with the superficial, money grubbing salesman I was working with. I'm more thankful for that result than any.
Thank you for your inspiration, buddy. Whch history is your favorite?
Precisely. Majoring in humanities isn't special dispensation not to adapt.
As machines slowly take over our jobs the arts will be come more and more important to humanity
The message in this video is so beautiful I could cry :'(
art is sophistication and projects hope. Perhaps a Zoo where artist are caged and fed BS by the all knowing public.
+C York I'd pay to see that.
sometimes I think it's a case of these graduates not knowing how to put their knowledge to use
No, it's because they got a worthless degree and could have received the same education for free or cheaper online, the library, or even hiring a personal tutor.
@Kevin You Pre-Law, that is all. That is usually what a lot go towards so I am not surprised. Also, I am sure what you mention vary by major.
@Kevin You Yeah, mainly arts and Humanities isn't best. Some STEM programs are rough too but a better chance is still there. The programming jobs like I.T. I heard is rough too. I actually heard that crating a profile or history while learning would increase your chances upon graduation (at least on something like CS or CIS).
Seriously yo. If I was an artist I wouldn’t be looking for “jobs” after I obtained my degree. I’d be creating my art and then marketing it myself and hopefully getting some decent promoters. Id be working a simple job that can pay the bills all while paying for the art tools that I need. Pay yourself first before others start paying you IF anyone ever does. I may think my art is awesome but that may not be true for someone else. And it’s not just money it’s also about learning more and more as you progress. If it truly is your passion then you never stop working on yourself in that area. Look at the best artists of today and you’ll notice that they didn’t stop after that first big payout. It was that kind of drive and passion that got them that first big paycheck. It sounds cliche like those motivational videos but it’s logically sound to say that the guy who has a passion towards something can become just as good if not better than somebody who just has talent and no passion because the guy with the passion doesn’t have to be paid to do what he’s doing. But reality doesn’t have to be fair. You can work really hard all your life towards bettering yourself and still have people telling your art sucks.
@@chris7285 That can be done with it without a degree.
I'm so glad & happy this channel exist. Long may it continue.
This channel is a fine example of what a rich education in the humanities has to offer. Of course, not all humanities students and graduates have a great deal to offer. Some of them are better at making coffee. But I like coffee, so I'm grateful for their services as well.
i've always dreamed of becoming a film director, but living in a developing country sure makes me think otherwise on what I will take for university. People will tell me that I will go nowhere unless I pick a course like medicine, engineering, etc.
I want to pursue filmmaking. What did you end up going for?
Plenty of arts students do well, but it just doesn't happen in the first few years for everyone. It takes a lifetime to build a career.
this made me cry.incredibly important and beautiful.thank you school of life
they are the people that save us from the void and meaninglessness of life with their works
My biggest regret in life is to have studied art.
I was thinking of doing history in college and now after watching this I just don't know. I love it but is it worth my while ?
If there is one you tube channel that I had to recommend, it would be this. Beautiful inspiring work..
I took time off an oilfield industrial job to get my Studio Arts degree; don't regret it. It was my money to spend, I gained a lot of awesome friends, and then went back to sloggin' it out in steel toes & a hard hat.
I'm 40 and I'd love to go back and earn another degree, just to see what kind of friends I make and experiences I have next time.
basically every use for arts graduates you described could be done better by psychology graduates
+craig terris That's what I'm doing in fact-studying psychology. I had a joint degree with English to cover both areas and here I am today, hoping to graduate Psych in November.
+dragostea1511 Good luck with that, psychology is right up there with arts degrees when it comes to low employment. Too much supply, very little demand.
Not if you get masters. It definitely improves chances esp in my field-Development and Education
+craig terris A bachelors in psychology is useless. You need at least a Master's do do anything.
Psychology is a useless degree. Should've studied engineering, you idiot.
i studied english and philsophy at st andrews, a top 3 university in the uk. my degree did NOTHING for me. absolutely FUCKING NOTHING!!! 15 years later and my salary has never ever been over 30k. everything i read and studied i forgotton. its useless.
i wish i directed my interest in a trade. i have become so bitter and angry with life that i wish the world just blows up.
1. St. Andrews is Not a Top 3 university. Oxford, Cambridge, Durham, UCL and LSE are Far Superior.
2. Why didn't you go to Law School or Pursue an MBA (HR).
3. 30k might be low in US but you are living in UK. and that's the average salary there. Even Doctors in UK earn around 38k-45k So I guess 30k as an arts graduate should not be bad for you.
I was always said by the media, people, friends and classmates that humanistic profile is useless and ppl mastering any kind of this profile won't find any other job but at the McDonalds and will earn the minimal wage. I had to choose a profile few months ago, because I ended middle school and my "general" education. so, going with people's recommendations I went on a biology - math profile, with extended chemistry in second year. and this 4 months had me realize that's not what I want to do. sure I will get a job after this profile but I hate math. and not in the way that I dont understand it completely, because I do if I work hard, but it doesn't fill me with fulfilment. same with biology and chemistry. all the time in the past ive thought its soo cool and well... smart, better than polish or history, the classes that people half-ass and dont respect. it made me feel important and making good decisions by choosing straight up scientific profile that doesn't bring me excitement nor I don't feel passion towards. and so with friends shouting that Im making the biggest mistake in my life and I will be fucked in the future, im changing school and going on humanistic media&law profile and I don't give a shit. English is not my first language and I live in hm, let's say conservative country, but I think that being happy and doing what satisfies you is more important then what society is telling you to do. you just have to learn how to cope with it and do the best that u can. im sorry but I prefer to be paid less, but have a job which I like. also I prefer to be true to myself, and give, grow the things im good at, not forcing myself in to doing the "smart" stuff. I would end up being a poor mathematician bearly passing and having a depression bc of it.
There is one major reason that the humanities majors receive an average income less than STEM majors - humanities majors by and large contribute less to production of that which is in demand. Also, considering the cost of education, graduates of colleges and universities now more than ever face incentives to specialize in fields that utilize their capacities in a direction which is influenced by how much income they can earn. The arts and humanities are not worthless, certainly not. But they are poor fields to choose for people who highly prioritize income.
+Chance Reed You're right. I don't think it's money that makes arts graduates sad, but the lack of recognition of the importance of our fields and subjects - it's our job to improve their importance in society!
what microphone do you use? the audio quality is superb!
Hello nice philosophical people..!
+ShiftJay08 so thoughtful. I see where you're coming from. (y)
+ShiftJay08 that made my day, or at least the following ten minutes
+Danniow Hello :D
I'm a potato :v
The best channel finding of the year so far on youtube ^^
You literally hired one or a team of them to design the visuals for your video.
As a former art student who spent precious hours of his life on learning and studying the arts I thank you very much for this video.
I am an art major who has NEVER been underemployed! Glory be to God!
I believe people should study art for the love of art, not for the hope of future employment. Dont forget that scientists and engineers have imaginations too
I believe that art loses its value the moment it seeks to make money as its primary purpose.
Jeremy Evans Are you an artist?
If you don't love your job and lets say you graduated in computer science. If it's your passion, why do you want to get paid? Doesn't it make your work a little less significant?
Working in the trades is kind of like art. Hands-on work, tools & craftsmanship. The only difference is the shortage of trade jobs.
Angell, Writing code can only reach certain level of quality, as opposed to art. Anyone can learn to write decent code, but not everyone can learn how to push creativity, creativity just happens, and reducing time it takes to let creativity just "happen" leads to very poor art that just takes up space, becoming mainstream (take pop and hip-hop music today as an example. Greatest tracks in history could take up to a year to write, nowadays songs are being spit out like fucking shoes from a Chinese factory).
"Anyone can learn to write decent code" Yes, with hours of practice and dedication. And I'm not talking about CSS styling tricks, I mean to get good at languages like Java, C++, etc., you have to have a certain drive. What you mean is "anyone can learn the syntax" and that is true, but the process of WRITING the code is not the most important or the hardest thing about a programmer's job, it's THINKING up of the structure of the code they're going to write. You can hack out a bunch of if-else statement to sort 100 numbers, or, you can put your head and creativity into it, and realise the simple algorithm that can be implemented to do this in a few lines of code (code being the grunt work). Sure, creativity just happens for some people. Some are just born creative and don't need to work as hard as others (both artists and programmers) but the majority of the people get their skills and creativity from hard work and countless hours of practice.
dude when the popular culture consists of nicki minaj, the kardashians, the big brother, twilight and all this kind of shit, i think the reason real art is rejected becomes pretty obvious...
and people posting on here calling liberal arts.majors iidiots
+Joseph be stallin' Beethoven was the pop artist of his day. If you like Nicki Minaj, it is real art to you. Don't be pretentious.
Left TechnoLibertarian Party of CZcams pop is music made with the primary intention of being popular. most of Beethoven's music, similarly to a lot of classical pieces, was written to commemorate or accompany certain events. anyway, classical composers actually put thought into their music, as there are many motives and emotions they want to present, all that while writing music for a symphony, that is a large collection of instruments meant to play simultaneously.
most modern day pop music, as cliche as it may sound, sucks. the sole intention of the foul people who create this music is for it to be popular and for them to make money off of it, no matter what, and thus it is devoid of any redeeming quality. the music is "catchy" not by mistake, they want you to remember their shite songs. the lyrics mean nothing and may as well be written in an ancient language that wasn't spoken for thousands of years and no one understands, as long as there is a catchy chorus that is repeated through 80% of the song. honestly, i understand that the current movement of contemporary art claims that everything is artistic, even literal shit in a can (really), but these people aren't artists, they are businessmen/businesswomen. their only goal is to get paid, and when they have huge marketing teams and a lot of idiots for them to exploit - they make a profit.
+Joseph be stallin' In order to get paid, in order to be popular, you have to produce a song that appeals to a lot of people. If it appeals to a lot of people, it is good. Your argument that music that is made to commemorate an event is real art but music that is made so that a lot of people like it is not real art is not valid.
Left TechnoLibertarian Party of CZcams this is where the mistake lies. back when people were experimenting with music, the mainstream was music that appealed to people emotionally or aesthetically, or both.
this music wasn't made with the sole purpose of being popular. a lot mainstream music nowadays, however, is made with popularity as a main or only goal. with that being said, we would've been talking about a completely different topic (if at all) if modern musical artists would've wanted to achieve popularity through ability. unfortunately, this isn't the case. pop songs nowadays are engineered, literally engineered, to be easily remembered and "stuck in your head", and/or to appeal to a lot of people in shallow terms. a study already showed that pop songs are breaking records of stupidity in recent years, and falling closer and closer to lyrical levels of preschool kids. not to mention the disgustingly huge advertisement budged these musicians have, to the point where they literally produce trailers for their songs and music videos.
to summarize: most of the music we are talking about is addressing the most shallow feelings/states of mind a human can have (example: a male's fondness of a female's "ass and tits"), very little innovation and creativity is used in creating this music, repetition and engineered melodies are used in order to hammer the song into the listener's head, and huge advertisement budgets add to the song's popularity.
in addition, i think that history has an answer for this debate: only the great artists stand the test of time. and by fucking god if artists like nicki minaj still get celebrated 40 years from now i'll fucking nuke this entire world to spare my great-grandchildren of this shite.
Any Art degree should be abolished
Even though I want to become an Artist, I know It'll be a risky thing because of these reasons.
Pssh. Everyone these days is underemployed, not just arts graduates. It's the end times, I tell you!
I think its important that their is an awareness about the arts growing and seeing this video made me happy to see that
Art is a really shady industry your success is not only your skills but also depends on who u know and if they deem ur work as even art in their eyes