Vision Center for Pool Players
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- čas přidán 31. 05. 2024
- Wishing I had this vision center information 30 years ago at the beginning of my pool career. Hopefully younger players will find it helpful for their pool and snooker and billiard games.
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There are days that i can run multiple racks of ten balls. In challenge matches when i get annoyed at bad rolls, it really derails everything. When i make a big deal of a bad roll or when an opponent gets lucky- i totally collapse and can’t even run an open table with ball in hand. Mental and emotional mastery is a big part of the game- like any endeavor i guess.
This was exactly what i needed. I had cataract surgery on both eyes a couple of years ago with my left eye being slightly short and my right eye being slightly long --- so where I used to be deadly on my "aim" I've been missing just slightly to one side or another. It would seem my vision center has changed to where even though I am right eye dominant the vision center (I used the mirror method as I don't have my own table) is now to the left edge of my nose. -- at least at a close distance -- I'm gonna have to try it again from a longer distance (lie 7 feet) to get a sense of whether or not its slightly different for long shots v short shots. :)
Fascinating. Many thanks. I'm playing pool a little more and didn't expect to find myself thinking about this very interesting stuff!
"If you knew what you didn't know, you wouldn't not know it." Danny DiLiberto 😁
This vast THE Best presentation of vision center you’ll ever find! Thank you so much for the effort!💪🏻🎱
Jar Jar made me laugh out loud and very loud. Good stuff here. X is side to side, Y is up and down, Z is forward and backward but also a sense of 'level'. I Dare a cruise ship to offer billiards.
From what I have gathered watching Ronnie O'Sullivan over the last few years, he is getting older (30 + years of professional playing) and is putting a lot of thought into his enjoyment of playing. He is still one of the best, if not the best snooker player in the international circuit. He says he doesn't want to play if he isn't enjoying it. (winning is always more fun but I think you win no matter what if you are having fun)
A side note: A funny thing about acquiring targets. In trap shooting, most instructors try to help students identify their dominant eye right away. Stereo vision is important since it is advised that you see the target with stereo vision but only one eye is determining the line of the barrel. Your site line (not you aim point - you point a shotgun unlike "aiming" a rifle) is where your barrel goes to shoot the target. Many people can't consistently use one eye (dominant eye) to "see" straight down the barrel. Most instructors will have the shooter block out one eye as a "fix". All that said, I know of at least one instructor who has had great success, training many top notch shooters to use both eyes (regardless of dominant eye) and let their subconscious mind get the gun to the target. I love that concept.
I guess my point is that your brain can do amazing things with your vision - did you know that the lens of your eye puts an upside-down view of the world on your retina and your brain turns it over to give you the picture you see? I am told that you can wear lenses that will invert your vision and your brain will adjust what you are seeing to be straight up again in short order. 🤩
Thanks Bob, this Vision center concept is is so important and informative….as a former recognized BCA instructor, I often thought of this concept and tried to convey this idea correctly but never understood it enough to get students to understand completely….you really knocked this one out of the park….kudus to you!!!!
That's makes complete sense 😅.
Thanks. I think I'll start trying that tonight.
Thanks Bob. I have struggled all my life with this issue. Having had my left eye muscles semi-paralyzed since I was a child I do not have binocular vision and am slightly cross-eyed. I have learned to manipllate that eye for "cosmetic" purposes but functionally it is still inferior. I find my vision center actually changes depending on how tired I am since this makes it more difficult to keep that eye aligned with the other. Now that I know the actual cause, this tutorial may help, so again, thatnk you !
I too have the issue of not having binocular vision. My eyes are not aligned and I have the ability to use one eye or the other with only some peripheral vision from the other eye. I’m not sure how to apply this to my situation. Perhaps I could use the left eye for left side angle shots and the right eye for the right angle shots and change the alignment based on that?
As a visual motor expert doing a PhD in England on quiet eye in snooker … I was very impressed by the detail and relatable content in this video 👍!
Great job content provider
Yes - an excellent video without the mistakes most people make in the vision centre conversation.
Judd Trumps cue is well out of line when feathering the shot but straight as he hits it when he plays snooker.
thank you! this is super informative and easy to understand. i never knew about the dominant eye part and now im confident im fixing it the right way 🙏🙏
Bob, Howdy; Nice bit of work putting that one together. Thanks.
Very interesting. I knew there was something a little wacky about my aiming.
Great video Bob! First time I've actually tested for the center of my vision and discovered it's at the inside edge of my dominant right eye according to the paper on the mirror test. I will have to try the ball alignment on the table to see if this is consistent. Enjoyed the explanation!! Thanks
What a great video for understanding and testing vision center. I’m cross-eye dominant as a right hander who shoots left handed. I noticed the same accuracy issues when cutting one way vs the other. I’m definitely going to work on finding my vision center and doing stroke drills with my newfound info.
Your content is very good, I always try to keep up to date as possible to see what new content you have and how I can apply
Excellent video Bob - Thank You
Thanks Bob, this "pool ball method" is the one i always use with my students but i will also try the "mirror method"... keep on sharing.. Best wishes..
Excellent graphics. Great information. I subscribed.
Great educational/informative video!!!! I'll check my vision center alignment with the 4 balls method asap. Thanks
Wow. Very well done and easily understandable. Nice work
Really excellent video, and a subject I've been experimenting a lot on myself. I really like the techniques for finding the vision centre, I will have to try those myself. Certainly I have found the squarer my shoulders are to the shot, the more towards the centre of my chin I can place the cue, but of course the compromise is my rear shoulder is way outside the line of the shot. I suspect that this is why players such as Jayson Shaw, Joshua Filler and Mark Williams are such good shot makers, because they sight the ball much squarer-on and then cue under their bodies. They just somehow manage to deliver the cue straight without the most optimal head->shoulder->elbow alignment, which most players can't do (myself included).
Excellent info....bob.... I enjoy all your videos and you will make it..... To a 100k soon
What a great video! All around excellent!
Interesting fact, some people have a diffrent dominant eye for objects up close and far away.
Thank you
Excellent information
1:55 Wow I literally have the exact same issue. Glad I'm not the only one
Great video! I need that info!
Not to be pedantic, but I find it easier to think in terms of roll, pitch, and yaw. In the case of your diagram X is Pitch, Y is Roll, and Z is Yaw, given that X, Y, and Z are thought of as an ideal point in space determined by your vision center, height above cue, and distance to bridge, or maybe tip.
--------- later:
Oh dear! I just did the 90° paper trick, and the result is disturbing. I have monocular vision, that is my left eye focuses on near things, and my right eye focuses on far things. It's quite handy much of the time, but maybe not for pool. When I found my vision center, it shifted according to the distance from the mirror. Close to the mirror it is almost directly over my left eye, as I moved my head back it shifted to the inside corner of my right eye. Every time I've tested for eye dominance it's been my right eye, I never bothered to adjust for distance. Now I have to figure out how to deal with it.
I shoot with whatever gives the best body position. I am right handed but shoot 80% of shots left, even with the limited shots I do right handed it is very close in shot making. Starting to believe I should have shot right handed all along. Being ambidexterous at this game is very powerfull.
I have a cheap Black and Decker laser leveler (purchased at Walmart) that works unbelievably well for marking straight lines on my pool table. It has a red colored laser line that shows on green felt . In placing paper reinforcement donuts , it works like a charm. I noticed my vision will get a little blurry when I strain to find straight lines on the table. (Old age), Great video ...
Great video thankyou.
right handed player here but my vision center is in the middle of my left eye. making it harder to get comfortable with my balance on my stance
Hello, I found this video very useful but I didn't understand the mirror method. Where should I focus while moving side by side? Should I always look perfectly in front of me? In the end, is my vision center where I can see just a very small part of the paper back from the mirror ? Thank you so much!
With the mirror method you are trying to see the edge of the sheet of paper, with both faces of the paper hidden behind the edge. Then the edge marks your vision center.
@@ShortstopOnPool Oh, thus I shouldn't care about the part of the paper attached to the mirror. I should only focus on the perpendicular part, right? Thank you so much!
Great stuff BoB
Good stuff brother.
Maybe this is why sometimes I feel like the table looks perfect and then sometimes I just can't seem to see the balls right. Maybe that's me moving in and out of my vision center and not knowing it
Very possible
Great Video!
thanks bro...nice..tgis is what im waiting for
Hello Bob! I have been struggling with this issue lately which made me unable to pot balls the way I aim it. I am cross-eyed dominant, so I play with my right hand but it’s pretty obvious I’m left eyed dominant, but when I aim with my cue, I find that the cue becomes centered when it is under my right eye which is causing some issues for me. My cyclopean eye seems like it would be just under my left nostril and yet the center of my cue seems to be directly under my right eye.
Bob thank you for this lesson. This is really very informative. Albin and Wu Jia Ching is the same crossed handed with their dominant eye.
Yes. I find it interesting that Albin Ouschan is cross-eye dominant with his cue all the way over under his left eye. Then his sister Jasmine is the same, but her cue is not nearly as far left.
@@ShortstopOnPool I will be same as Wu I’m a lefty and right dominant eye but I will use snooker stance cue under the chin use my right to focus on the aiming point.
@@ShortstopOnPool is y and z axis the same while adjusting? Tnx
@@ryandelossantos2198 No. X axis rotation is tilting your face up or down. Y axis rotation is tilting your head side to side.
@@ShortstopOnPool what about the z axis?
Great video and the graphics were excellent - although Steve Davis' vision centre IS in the centre of his chin, as it is with many players.
Good
That card in the mirror thing, and “seeing the edge of the card” could you elaborate more on the edge of the cards image and how it looks when you assume it’s in the center of your Vision .
Vision center to one side and you will see the face of the card. A little to the other side and you will see the other face of the card. Keep going back and forth by smaller and smaller amounts until you see ONLY the edge of the card. That is the center of your vision.
I see with my mental vision... pool is a 4D visual game👍🎱
There's a few videos on this topic, this is by far the best one.
My main issue is that once I know that I have a vision center problem, how to I 1) find out where it is 2) learn to place my head in the proper position.
1) after asking someone to take picture of me while in the shooting position, I was quickly able to address some issues (my % success on a drill that I do every day went from around 45% to 80% immediately). In this particular drill, I was struggling to stop applying left spin on the cue ball and as soon as I fixed my head position issue, that problem is practically completely gone.
2) I now needed to improve on the progress made in step one, I took a measuring tape, and placed reinforcement rings from the top left pock to the bottom right pocket at every diamond. I then setup an x-shot like situation, and line up the cue using the reinforcement by laying it on the table ... the goal being to be able to get the cue ball to follow into the pocket after pocketing the object ball. Now when I go down, I move my heads left and right until I feel like the shot I'm looking at looks straight ... this has helped me improve this drill from the mid 30% to the mid 70%. Yesterday, I shot 84% on it (I incorporate 50 of these shots in my daily routine, I plan to stop when I have at least 3,000 shots done)
In both cases, the drill success rate shot up immediately. There was no learning curve required here as going from a not straight to straight stance should automatically make a difference (and it did).
I'm also seeing improvements directly related to this topic in other parts of my game.
BTW, there's only 2 channels where I eagerly await new content, this is one of them.
Regards,
Bertin
Accidental left spin on the cue ball tells me you are right-handed. Correct? Exact same issue here that can arise anytime I don't ensure proper alignment. Excellent description of figuring it out. Thanks for the kind words. Working on a good one right now about how to practice. Should be done in a few days. Hope you like it.
Actually, left handed … right eye dominant. Hence the reason i’m putting a lot of effort on this part of my game.
Ok, what if someone learned how to use a long distance contact in one eye, and a close up contact in their other eye.
Then, to see if it worked better, changed to use the long distance contact in the opposite eye ...
After training, the person could use either eye at distance and the opposite eye to read. Meaning that the person can consciously pick which eye to focus.
What if a person is eye ambidextrous?
When finding vision center using straight line of balls on the table I’m I looking at the first ball or straight down the middle, I know it’s probably a stupid question, but really struggling with this aspect of my game, thx from a fellow 6’5 player with really bad vision
Great video, I'm blind in my right eye, would I be better lining up over the left eye?
You can find your vision center the same as anyone else. Chances are it will be on or very close to your good eye.
Hello👋🙋♂️ there Bob.... 👍
Amazing and interesting video🎥..
Super like👌👌👌
Very helpful Information👍
Do keep posting
Warm regards and best👍 wishes
The UnknownManCub 👍😎👨🏭
Hi, loved this vid. I have amblyopia in my left eye (a brain, eye disconnect basically). My mom taught me how to play and she is left handed...so i am right handed and play left handed pool. So basically i am a mess lol...although i can play better than average.
I also have astigmatism lol. Should I do the paper test every time before i play since it could be different given the day?
Thank you so much for this enlightening vid!!
I am not an expert but I do not think your vision center will move around day to day.
Bob I was not clear on the card in the mirror method at 6:10
Why is it folded at 90 degrees.
And it looks like it is not aligned when you make the yellow cross on the edge of the card - I can see a reflection on the side of the card.
It very hard to get the camera lined up right. Don't overcomplicate it - you are just looking at the edge of the paper, so you don't see either face on either side of the edge. The edge of the paper marks the center of your vision.
So what whould happen if a right eye dominant player like me closes his seft eye when shooting? Like shooting a rifle.
Not much, you lose some peripheral vision. One-eyes pool players can do just fine. I think using two is better if you got'em.
I have been working on this a lot. I find it hard to get my Z axis aligned. Look at the pic. I think part of it has to do with my lazy eye and I think depending how it is wandering around I think my vision center may be wandering also. Still working on it.
It was very hard for me too. I have been working on it for six months at least. My advice is go slow and work incrementally. Get your head turned a little at a time.
I never get why people look at only the cue ball while taking a shot. I only look at the object ball
For some reason even though I’m right handed and right eye dominant I shoot pool left handed. How does this affect my vision center? If it aligns more on the cue or anywhere right of it what will that do to my alignment? Jay
You have it backwards. Your vision center is not "affected" by anything. It is where it is. You move your cue stick underneath your vision center. Does not matter if you hold it in your right or left hand.
@@ShortstopOnPool ok so even if moving the cue under vision center and it gets closer to my side it’s ok
I wear glasses and with my poor vision they are thicker than most. I am wondering if this is affecting me. I think i am hitting center ball, but sometimes you can see the obvious english.
This is the way.
My vision center is straight down the middle. No preference for either eye.
great video
i have been playing with centre chin for 7 years and i have seen no improvement in my snooker game
tested my eyes and they said, i am right eye dominant and my left eye is only 1% stronger than right eye.
however i tried putting the cue under right and left eye but i cannot decide what to choose?
its been 3 years and i still cannot decide, i keep switching under right chin and left chin and unable to find the perfect vision centre, its bcaz i am used to this centre chin which i played with for 7 years
can you suggest the best way to find vision centre ? for me
thank you alot
Use the lined up balls method to find your vision center. I demonstrate this in the video.
Does this line up balls method apply on a snooker table?
Thanks in advance 😊
It is not an acronym if it does not create a pronounceable word. If the letters have to be pronounced separately, its an initialism.
Tell this to the MAGICIAN EFREN REYES 😀😆😄🤣👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽
I have a question but I’m wondering if you answer any more questions any more? I will check back tonight to see if you respond then I will ask my question. I hope you acknowledge me thanks
I try to answer question if I can.
I'm blind in my right eye. Can I still play pool effectively?
Yes. Neils Feijen is a top pro with very limited vision in one eye.
@@ShortstopOnPool Thanks for the answer!
But even knowing my vision center, I still had to adjust for the way my brain puts together the images. When it appears to me I’m hitting center ball I have to move the entire stick about 1/20th to the left.
Judd Trump isn't cross eye dominant because he's playing pool with the wrong hand. Actually he is right handed.
I only have one working eye 😢
Top pro player Neils Fiejen has only one good working eye. Doesn't matter. Put your cue under that one eye and play!
Next level... Say you have right eye dominance.... On straight shots and cut shots to the right, you come into stance with right eye on the edge of CB and OB line. On shots that cuts to the left, you teach yourself how to use the left as as dominant on THESE. This way, the vision line is never crossing over the pool cue. THIS is the reason that breaking from the left rail on 1p is going to be more accurately.
This doesn’t make sense because when I do the triangle test I’m right eye dominant but then when I do the paper test, I’m left eye dominant
Not doing one of the tests correctly