Thermarest (Big Money!) Vs Kilos Gear (Little Money!) Xtherm NXT | Aerocoud SLEEPING PAD ELITE
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- čas přidán 24. 05. 2024
- I continue to try and find the perfect sleeping pad as technology keeps making them more comfortable, warmer and lighter. My bubble was burst when my Big Agnes Rapide developed a leak making be go back to a Thermarest Xtherm NXT.. BUT I suffered the lack of comfort so when I got the opportunity to test the Kilos Gear Aerocloud Sleeping Pad Elite...... best wishes Tom
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Hi Tom, I have the BA SL too, on your recommend, and I can see how this Kilos pad compares favourably on comfort. Great review as always.
Hey ray, thank you for your comment and sharing your thoughts... If my Big Agnes hadn't failed then I would definitely still have it... best wishes Tom
Great job as always bud
hey thank you Stuart... best wishes Tom
Thanks Tom. Nice to see a more reasonably priced pad. I like thin pads if they are comfortable as I find head height is always at a premium. In winter I defo want to exceed R6. So I think I’ll be sticking with my XTherm for winter, and my ‘even thinner’ but very comfy S2S Comfort Plus Insulated for three season activity. I’ve only recently bought the XTherm but I’ve never experienced pad failure with the Comfort Plus over four years. On the other hand I’ve had two S2S Ether Lite pads fail.
Hey Peter, I hope you are well and thank you for sharing your sleeping pad experience... Having an R value of over 6 definitely limits your choice but then thats easier in some ways... Tom
Cool i agree big Agnes air pads hard to beat for comfort love my big Agnes insulated
Hey thank you Mark..Best wishes Tom
Sorry didn't mean to give you such a short reply Mark.. Big Agnes are hard to approach so wont be testing any, I dont think after over 60K views on my Rapide SL review...
@@TOMHEANEY100 they work with agent as they sent me stuff years back tent and air pad and sleeping bags
Hi Tom. Sleeping pad technology evolves so quickly that every year there is at least 2 new or improved models that are warmer, or lighter, or both. As you know I’ve been through a few pads in the last couple of years. BA rapide sl - most comfort but imo doesn’t sleep to close to claimed R value so it was sold. Last generation xtherm - very warm but not very comfortable so it was sold. I’ve now settled on 2. The thermarest uberlite. Amazing pack size and weight and I find it surprisingly comfortable. Durability is an issue but the hassle free life time warranty means I can live with that. And the nemo tensor extreme conditions. Very comfortable (not rapide levels mind) and very warm at 8.5 R value which is the highest of any pad. The cost of these pads is now ridiculous imo.
Hi Gary you are so right regarding sleeping pad tech moving forwards.. The Big brand ones are just so pricey and yet not reliable in my experience....The light ones such as the Thermarest Uberlite RW which is 300g then spoil you when you want a warmer more comfortable pad and you have to double the weight at over 600g.... As you know I am on the full circle and then round for a second lap with Thermarest, Nemo, Big Agnes, Thermarest and now Kilos gear.. When will I stop.... best wishes Tom
Another Big Agnes user based on your review. Boundary deluxe for me as the Rapide sl was sold out everywhere. I’d be more inclined to trust your reviews than anyone else 👍
Hey thank you for your comments and sharing your Big Agnes experience... I must check out the Boundary deluxe.... best wishes tom
What he’s not saying in this video is that Kilosgear is a company that caters to bigger dudes (aka fat). I have two of their products- their high back chair and their sleeping pad with the foot pump. I’m very happy with both. The extra inch on their pads do make a difference especially with my body “displacement” if you will. My butt isn’t on the ground when I wake up. And it’s not just that it’s for bigger dudes but their gear is light weight (not ultralight) which is a plus for me. I am willing to carry a little more weight for the comfort they provide. And believe you me- out in the woods I’m now comfortable!
Hi, thank you for sharing your experience of Kilos gear products. Its great to hear how comfortable you find the sleeping pad and also that it can suit larger users... Difficult for me to comment regarding the category of user that you mention but after using mine on a number of occasions and whether I sleep on my front, back or side I find this pad extremely comfortable and supportive... Once again thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences... best wishes Tom
That's interesting I just got mine today pumped it up and my butt hits the floor when fully inflated and I'm only 80kg, it also leaks badly and has half deflated on it's own in 2 hours since.
@@El-Jefe Hi, first of all I can understand how disappointed you may feel so sorry to hear of your experience... My butt touches the floor too when fully inflated and this is normal on a lot of pads. By Big Agnes pads did this too. A sleeping pad is optimised for sleeping comfort and if its so firm that your butt doesn't hit the floor when you sit on it then its on the firm side for comfortable sleeping... The Thermarest here does that and is good to to sit on but too firm then for sleeping.. I inflated my Kilos gear pad for over a week and slept on it for an hour every other afternoon. I have since done a number of camps with no leaks. So I hope this helps a bit and if you are not happy and the pad is leaking then I suggest that you contact Kilos Gear. I have had to contact many sleeping pad manufactures due to leaking pads and my camping partners have also had many problems.. Sleeping pads in my experience can give trouble from any brand... Best wishes Tom
@@TOMHEANEY100 Hi Tom, Thanks for the reply to be honest I wouldn't mind my butt touching the ground if it could hold air. The comment from the big guy above just doesn't seem to be accurate based on what I'm seeing as an 80kg male (in the limited time my pad stays inflated). I appreciate your empathy, I admit I am disappointed as I was hoping to use it for my first attempt at the west highland way but I don't feel I can trust the product now even if they do replace it for one that stays inflated. Another that didn't sit well is that I noticed is that kilosgear presents themselves as a company based in New York, on their website contact details address etc so I was surprised when I got my tracking number yuntrack tracking number and realised it was coming China and had to wait 2 weeks for delivery of a product that was supposed to arrive in 5-7 days (according to the website). Also just a heads up regarding the pillow I got the exact same pillow they are selling for £31 for a total of £6 inc tax and shipping from aliexpress, minus the logos (I agree about the design of the pillow it's great and holds air too). I have made contact with kilosgear re the pad awaiting reply unfortunately if they do replace it I think I will always have the anxiety of wondering if it will go down one night in the highlands which as you can imagine given the unpredictable climate up there it could be an issue.
@@El-Jefe Okay thanks for sharing and I understand how you feel.. Like I mentioned I have heard of so many leaking pads from the big brands and it didn't put me off buying this Thermarest. But it's still a real pity about yours...I am sure you will get a good response from Kilos Gear. Best wishes Tom
Hi Tom a double whammy lol I use thermarest I just got the xlite nxt to replace my uberlite as it just wasn't robust enough I had a baffle go on it the nxt feels a lot better and the extra depth is great what I like is the guarantee of thermarest like you say at some point they all fail so getting it repaired or replaced is great.
Hi Craig, thank you for the comment.... Yes my uberlite blew baffles too but this Xtherm feels pretty robust although both my camping friends have had issues with theirs.. Best wishes with the xlite Tom
I’ve used an Exped downmat UL Winter all year long for the last 3.5years & loved it...& just recently switched to a lighter Nemo “all trails” for even more comfort (& durability) as a side sleeper. The Exped will now only come out to play when the mercury REALLY heads south.
Hey thank you for sharing your experience of different sleeping pads.. I just haven't tested or used any Expeds.. Best wishes with the Nemo.. Tom
Appreciate the reply sir...& I'll take the opportunity to say a big thank you...your channel is a staple in a very small circle that I watch as I know I can trust the information & opinions you give, to help guide my own judgement. Nobody else gives such attention to detail & testing.
My first Rapide SL developed a leak from a weld after around 30 nights. 20+ with the replacement, hopefully it will last, it's a great pad.
Hey thank you for sharing your experience of the Big Agnes Rapide.. It's a great pad comfort wise so I really hope your new one continues to hold its air.. Best Wishes Tom
Thats a lot of Mat for a very good price.....i will definitely keep this one in mind but right now i am all good for mats. Its interesting what you said about having issues with mats because i have only ever had issues fairly recently with the newer Thermarest X therm NXT, Uber and Xlite NXT i had zero problems with my first original Xtherm and only sold it because i thought buying the newer one was a good idea but i ended up losing all my confidence in the quality of Thermarest . I had 2 of the NXT Xtherms which i sent back to the retailer because they wouldn't stay inflated and the other two i sent back to Thermarest which they changed with zero issues but then i sold them on eBay. You cannot fault the customer service/warranty with Thermarest but i am wondering if they are so expensive these days silly because they have a large amount of returns 🤔 that would make sense from a business angle . My first self inflatable Thermarest lasted 25 years or more but in those days weight wasn't a key factor and i think with moving forward in research and development trying to stay market leaders in a faster and lighter world some of that Old School bombproofness has fallen by the way. It will be good to find out if Kilos can provide that level of customer service but still maintain what seems to be a very low price point .....time will tell. Thanks for the video as always 👍
Hey. Olan I really appreciate you sharing your experience of Thermarest here.. Yes I think competition is really tough and technology changes the sleeping pad industry every year.. My old Thermarests gave no trouble either and as you say making them lighter has definitely affected the reliability.. I hope my Xtherm NXT here is ok as it's very new and only used a handful of times. BUT when I test the Kilos over next winter then if its ok and I think it will be, I will sell the NXT and keep the kilos as its definitely more comfortable.. I have changed my sleeping pads so much in the last couple of years as they all have BIG compromises.. When you look at the Uberlite regular at 250g that kind of ruins you in the weight department as these thicker warmer pads are 100g of being 3 times the weight... best wishes Tom
@@TOMHEANEY100 You're welcome Tom back in the day when i was young and super fit i wouldn't give weight the slightest bit of attention but these days in my 60s every gram counts and i dont mind paying for it with reason , especially if the gear is Top Quality. My Uberlight blew 2 baffles on its first outing and i have heard loads of people say that about them. i would love it if a tent manufacturer built one in a bathtub that you could use the tent bag to pump it up with, that cant be beyond a designers mind or technical fabrics capabilities . That would add a bit of tent weight but then you would be saving in not having to carry a mat and if it had a higher bit then you wouldn't havre to carry a pillow and gone would be the sliding about. It wouldn't be to everyones fancy but at least i would be happy 🤣😂🤣
@@Olan... Yeah a few years ago (about 2) I was carrying 12kg for a single overnighter.. Pushing 60 myself and with a dodgy heart I too am gram counting. Now it's down to 7 to 8kg in winter and 5 to 6kg in summer. The Uberlite mats spoil you re the weight at 250g for the regular but mine too failed.. I still need a lighter sleeping pad though but cant really fine one that suits.. Best wishes Tom
@@TOMHEANEY100 Sorry to hear that about your heart condition Tom but i hope you are managing it well, you certainly look fit and healthy. The older you get the more you appreciate your health and good quality healthy food which is an topic thats quite difficult to address when you have to consider weight and the lightest options are dehydrated meals unless you prepare your own so i do allow myself to eat processed packaged overpriced stuff when i am out on a mission and then make up for it when i am back home. Take care and ATB
@@Olan... Hey thank you for the reply.. Yes I make a big effort to try and stay off the Ultra Processed foods. Sometimes on a camp I will just use organic pasta and some pesto but others I will just use the best quality dehydrated I can find.. Then I also go for nuts as my treat.. best wishes Tom
I tried an big agness rapide to save a little weight. I went straight back to the big agness boundary deluxe which is mega comfy. Not light but comfort matters. The rapide is too smooth.
£220 here in the UK and 900 ish grams. Really nice and had a couple of comments here regarding the boundary but pricey and heavy.. But I suppose that's the price you pay for comfort and I am sure that's awesome.. Appreciate you sharing your experience.. best wishes Tom
@@TOMHEANEY100 Mine was £180 which is still expensive. I have an arm held together with screws(badly done I might add) and fibromyalgia too, so the weight and cost go out the window compared with comfort. I can't sleep if I'm not comfortable. And yeah, I do struggle with my rucksack, it keeps me fit 😊
Thanks for the review Tom, just a heads up youtube says "includes paid promotion" at the beginning of the video. I'm not sure that's correct, if they only sent it for you to review? might be worth bringing it up with youtube (I trust your reviews so I ordered one) but if kilos gear have not paid you for this review, it might be worth having a word as it gives a false impression 👍
Hi this is what CZcams says...."If you accepted anything of value from a third party to make your video, you must let us know. We'll show viewers a message telling them that your video contains paid promotion". My take on this is that I need therefore to tick the paid promotion box... I accepted the pad which has value though Kilos gear did not send me any money or have any input... Awesome that you ordered the pad so I hope you are delighted with it and I really appreciate your consideration here... Tom
@@TOMHEANEY100 I think it's only if they are given it to you free to keep after, I think if they send it you just for review I don't think you have to declare it as such (I'm not 100% sure though) Either way, I think all of your viewers know you have a high level of integrity as do I, which is why I just placed the order without thinking twice, If it's good enough for you, it's good enough for me 👍
Can still say the same boilerplate disclosure
@@El-Jefe Hi it was given to me for keepers.... Tom
A worthwhile watch Tom and definitely a pad worth a look. I liked the colour too! I am looking forward to the winter test. A 'Nana nap' had supposed to be good for you, so go Tom. I'll remember to send you a message in the afternoon to wake you when I am WORKING.
Thing is, if you buy from a dodgy chinese brand it will fail sooner or later however capable it seems. Good luck with getting a warranty replacement. I know proper brand pads are expensive but you at least have customer service. Can only speak for thermarest but they have replaced my uberlight twice and the last time I got an xlite nxt so quite the free upgrade. Don’t the cheap brands will do that
Hey thank you for sharing your opinion.. I generally stay away from the cheaper brands but when two of the well known ones failed me then certainly worth giving this a try.. Best wishes. Tom
Exactly this! There is a price to pay for this cheap gear and when it fails and you need to make a warranty claim, that's when the piper is coming to collect. Even good Chinese brands like Naturehike don't honor their warranties and Naturehike does make good quality products in general. They do not offer replacement parts or repairs, though, and if something goes like a stake loop or one of those sewn on tabs that clips to the pole or a pole itself breaks they have no way to fix it or replace the part. They even tell you on their website that replacement parts and repairs are not available, so their sole solution to warranty claims is full product replacement and they're not going to give you a brand new $200 tent just because a 2 cent pole clip pulled out of the stitching or a 10 cent piece of 16" aluminum tubing broke. They will not and I know it because I've been through the ringer with them twice for problems more egregious than a bad stitch or a broken pole. They don't even give you the courtesy or lying to you or giving you the run around. They just straight up ignore you.
People don't think about things like this. All they see is initial price and anything more expensive than the cheapest option is a rip off, except there is a cost associated with being able to actually get warranty service and to get replacement parts and repairs. There's a cost associated with being able to talk to the company on the telephone and send them an email of a broken part in the morning and by late afternoon they reply with a tracking number because the part you need is already on the way.
Don't be fooled: The Kilosgear claimed R-value of 5.0 is just that.... the company's claim. It has NOT been ASTM rated, and they wouldn't answer my emails when I asked about this. Their website went from claiming 5.0 loud and proud to.... hard to find. I find this very shady...
Thank you for your comment. Like I said I didn't test it regarding R Value . Even companies like Big Agnes are having issues with claimed r Value from the likes of Justin Outdoors and the rapide SL... but I do trust Devin from backcountry exposure who has tested this on snow. Also the r value can be improved as I said in the video from a very little weight penalty... best wishes Tom
They claim to be ASTM rated, but they're not clear on what the ASTM rating is and I'm with you - I doubt that it's the number they're claiming, but is in fact only about half that. Klymit does this also on their Insulated Static V pads. They tell you it has a 4.4 R value and right next to that they tell you it's ASTM rated, but they do *not* tell you up front that the ASTM rated value is only 1.9, less than half the R value they claim. They do acknowledge the ASTM value, but they bury it in the fine print. On their website they make it easier to find, but on Amazon where they get a lot more sales this is what they do.
It also leaks badly around the welds just got mine and it hasn't remained inflated for more than 2 hours sitting in my spare room.