2023 Mercury 40hp Tiller vs 2023 25hp on a light 16ft boat. Dont buy the wrong one.
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- čas přidán 7. 05. 2024
- Holeshot vids of both are on my channel. This is a comparison of the 2. Specs, tiller lengths, power trim location and my thoughts on operating both. Comparison between the 2, specs, tiller lengths, power trim locations.
Thank you, been thinking about getting a 40, I’ve got a 25. Works great just wouldn’t mind a little more on long stretches.
I bought a 30 Suzuki to go on my rebuilt 16v Starcraft. It weighs 165. A 40 horse jumps 80 lbs. to 240 lbs.😮😮 That much weight on the very back is why I went with the 30. Great vid.👍
Hey, thats the tiller I originally wanted!! My original plan was to flip this 40hp for profit and still come out ahead buying that Suzuki 30. However after seeing these tiller handles with all adjustments, and seeing it was on the 25 I really love it. Mercury had a rebate this month so it wasnt much more. I know that Suzuki is quieter, more powerful and cheaper to purchase! Id love to see some vids if u have the capability to compare to this.
Good review, very well laid out and explained for those interested it is a very good review of the differences of those motors actually in use for a boat of that type.
I bought a 1600 Fury FRS SS in 2017 and got the 30 hp EFI4 Merc. It is a good combination for the water I travel, the bays of Eastern Newfoundland, which all open to the North Atlantic. I recently considered the 40hp and the extra power did not in my books provide a benefit that outweighed the weight gain. The 30hp also has a pull start for that that time the motor doesn't start miles from anywhere. I run a spitfire prop after several years on the supplied 3 blade Merc prop. It seems to me I plane better at lower speeds. I stuck with the 30.
My initial thought of the torque steer was the trim tab above the prop. A friend had a 55hp motor on an inflatable years ago, PNW waters, which was brutal but was partially fixed by adjusting the tab and tightening the tiller steer. (I cannot recall how that was done.)
A great video, I think your observations cement my decision on staying with the lighter 30 hp Merc which is the same weight as the 25 hp.
I adjust the torque tab on all my outboards. I was surprised Mercury had it set perfectly just to the right on this 25. And if I was buying everything brand new it'd be a Lund Fury 1600 in blue or grey, with this new style 30. This BT165 Backtroller is just a tad lighter so the 25 does good with 2 people yet.
I have the 40hp merc on my lowe 1660 roughneck and have the exact same problem. I have to have my torque handle tight as well. Lowe says I can use a 60hp ! I'll keep the 40hp but it's a chore !
25hp or more I feel like it’s worth having a steering wheel.
I Agee totally I did the same when I purchased my StarCraft last year, I opted for the 25 Yamaha over the 40 works great I get 27.5 mph with just me in the boat I also had to raise the motor to the second to last hole I'm running a 10&1/4-inch factory prop. you choose wisely!
Thanks, Im glad I didnt spend the extra $1600 on the 30hp cuz it does exactly what I want. Not sure I mentioned it in the video but I had it mounted almost 1" higher than bottom of boat, figuring it was v shaped and the 40 ran better there. But thought i could hear the water pump sucking air briefly when I had a passenger weighing the front so when back down 1 hole. No performance lost at all, gonna keep it there.
I have a 16' smoker craft, I went from a Yamaha 40 two stroke down to a Yamaha 25 2 stroke, (had a great offer when I really needed money) and I actually enjoy the 25 more...I miss the speed of that 40 (it could get sketchy though) but everything else is better with the 25, for all the reasons you explained and especially the ease of starting... I run a 11p solas prop (consistent 24-25 mph @ 5350-5450 rpm). Great video man!
Iv loved every 25 outboard Iv ever had. I dont run big boats, always had lighter 16' and the only time I needed the 40 hp's Iv had was when I had 3 people in the boat.
@@tieoneon1614 yup, with two ppl the 25 is more than adequate...3 is my max (just not set up for more than that) and when I do have 3...the 40 would be nice, or when in heavy current, other than that...I'll stick to my 25. I found a good deal on a 30 Yamaha 2-stroke, that I'm considering...the little extra power and weight on the stern would be beneficial.
I got the same motor a year ago and repowered a 1998 Lund 14' Rebel Adventure. I agree with everything you said in this video. I would just add a couple things for you guys out there thinking about getting one of these. The Mercury will have a better resale value than the Tohatsu however, for the same price with the Tohatsu you get RPM control, a pull start with the electric start, like the old 2 strokes. You can still start these, but you have to take the cowling off and wrap a rope to pull start. Also, I have found the Mercury tiller handle to be somewhat cumbersome. It comes out on an angle from the center, rather than offset in the Tohatsu, the handle tilt release lever is sometimes annoying, and you have to hold the handle with your other hand to gear shift, but this is probably personal preference. Like i said, I like the Merc, but if I had to do it over again, I would get the Tohatsu. Performance is excellent for both. Oh, and the Merc Props are over $200.00 ($70 aftermarket) and don't come with the motor, the Tohatsu comes with a prop.
Great input. Before I got this Sea Nymph I was really looking for an older Lund Rebel 16 Adventure in blue or gray, cuz I like the seating layout and lower front deck. This boat is over 100lbs lighter though, and I found out why LOL. The AL they used is really thin. Boat is VERY light for its size, but I am fixing a few leaky rivets/seams. And like u said, yes the Merc will have WAY more resale especially where Im at in rural WI where Mercury is at least 80% of the outboard market. A 2006 Merc 25 ELPT EFI still sells for $3700 average! If i didnt get the rebate this month I would have went with the Suzuki 30 and readjusted the drivers seat to fit that tiller length.
@@tieoneon1614 I here ya, good buy, I paid 5k a year ago 😞
Looking to buy either the 25 or 30hp 2024 Merc long shaft electric start with power trim. Was going to buy the Tohatsu but with Merc giving $750 off this month with a 7 year warranty that will close the deal for me. Thanks for showing where the trim switch is mounted on the tiller handle! Thanks for the info!!!
Yes! thats why I went with the Merc 25 instead of the Suzuki 30. Make sure u check online, like outboardsdirect or onlineoutboards really really good deals
I’ve got an old Evinrude 35 on my 1436 and It’s really not too bad to run for some hours I think the big difference in weight is key
This is a very helpful video considering I’m looking for boats in that size range and styling, and ideally I’d like a tiller for the extra space in a smaller craft for when the family is along for the ride. To add to your point, my cousin repowered his dads 19ft 60 wide jon with its max hp rating of a 90hp merc. It is side console, and even with all the adjustments, that thing torque steers BADLY. However, that older boat, the boat shop mechanic pointed out on all the newer Jon’s, they come factory with torque tabs welded to them in the back to automatically help with that since the engines are so powerful these days. And his dad’s boat doesn’t have them. The torque tab is all the way to one side, and it’s a bear to handle. However with him 100lbs ago, his large dad, me and a couple anchors it runs about 45. Which to me on the river, compared to my buddies 14 v bottom with a 25 which does about 20-25, I think about 30-35mph on the river would be sufficient to be efficent spot to spot if you wanna cover water without being too fast. Better have some good shades and fast sharp eyes the faster you go on the ole Mississippi watchin for logs.
Thats pretty darn fast. I never owned a console steer with bad torque steer like that monster, but on a tiller with 31" handle it was like a baseball bat swinging. My last boat was a light 16ft console steer 2 stroke 40 hp that could hit 32mph, but on a 30 mile trip I had to dial it back to 26mph so that 6 gallons would last. I just got back from a week long trip with this current boat, 2 guys full throttle at 25 mph i covered approximately 35 miles I only used 2.7 gallons of fuel. Not needing to refuel the entire week was a major plus for me.
@@tieoneon1614 that is incredible fuel consumption. Me and a buddy almost ran out of fuel on our second to last outing on a different boat. I’d be real happy with that super low fuel consumption now. lol.
@@robertwilliamson6958 Its crazy how little fuel this uses. That was warming up the motor before use every morning, and with my dad in the boat. My cuz this week has a 17' Lund Deep V with a Merc 90 and he lasted all week less than 12 gallons with 2 passengers by staying at 24-25 mph across the lake. But u guys running the river are covering a lot more ground than we are.
I was looking at the comparison between the two motors and the Merc 25 EFI was the better motor for the 16 ft. boat!! My Landau is 15' - 3" and a 25 is max'd out!! Because I have a tunnel I can use the short shaft at 15"....not the 20"long shaft.....Also the Yamaha turns out to be 15 1/2" which stopped all the cavitation problems.....All 4 blades are biting on the edges plus the Yamaha weighs in at 125 lbs.....20 lbs. more than the Yamaha 2 Smoker I changed out.😎
Those Yamaha's are impressive being so light, I think its cuz they are twin cylinder instead of 3?? But also probably why they shake a little at idle. I think Im going to get the Spitfire 4 blade for this Merc cuz the 40hp had one, and even though I had it mounted too high the 4 blade still bit even trimmed up.
Yeah. Way too much motor weight/boat weight. Porpoising had little to do with the anti-cavitation plate being an inch+ too low. The power was just pushing the weight down in back. Aggravated by a narrow beam at the transom (= poor lift).
UNless you're a tournament guy, The 25 will do the job with all flags flying. Good choice.
I have a 200 Northwood Utility 14 (Smokercraft Voyager made by Sylvan) which is 340lbs. No way I would mount the max 35 motor on that. A 20 does a fine job of planing the boat loaded.
I must admit I wish they put my trim switch on the end of my tiller handle too but I can shimmy back like you described not a deal breaker?
My opinion changed after using it few times. I actually like it where it is on the 25 cuz it doesnt get bumped and easier to reach when raising/lowering for launch. This 25 tiller handle doesnt move at all under load so i just open my hand a little and slide it back.
My swiftwater rescue organization is always looking for affordable used tiller handles if ya ever want to get rid of one
It sold fast
Dangerous..? The symptoms you described seem like the engine was mounted a bit too low on the transom. I just repowered my 17 deep V from a 25 E tec to a 2024 50 merc 4stroke . It took a couple on n offs to find the sweet spot for the mount location, but it handles really nicely now
It definitely was dangerous when a 31" tiller handle is trying to rip out your hands any throttle inputs when doing 30mph on a lightweight, twitchy steering boat like this. This outboard was just too heavy for a tiller boat this size. Your 17ft deep v is a heavy boat, would be a great fit for this motor. I did state all of this in the video, also. The previous owner mounted it too low, i raised it to cavitation plate level with bottom then 2 holes up from that even. At that height the 4 blade could still grab but the power trim did almost nothing at plane, but boat would still start to porpoise from any ripple on the water, and wouldnt stop unless u slowed down. Both batteries mounted in front, passenger in front it didnt matter. I just sold it today, to a Backtroller 16ft deep v that was heavier and wider than this boat and Im sure it will be a good fit. Im 100% happier with the 25 hp, I profited about a weeks salary and I got to tinker with 2 new Merc's.
I can’t do tiller engines anymore. I ran a 1987 25 Merc on my 13 whaler and then a 2006 15 Merc tiller. Both killed by back. I have a 2009 50 Merc 2 stroke on the whaler now and it’s too much. I’m planning on downsizing to a 25 or 30 ..
I understand. That 40 for me was way to strenuous for me. Honestly the Suzuki 30hp for the price, more powerful, quieter better warranty make sure u check them out too especially the price onlineoutboards.com has. Mercury's are more expensive, but this new tiller handle makes it worth it to some people.
The 40hp tiller on a light boat; you’d want power steering bracket, jack plate, 16p prop or 15p 4blade, cavitation plate an inch above the bottom or about 2 mounting holes lower to raise motor on a repower. It would definitely do 40mph
I figured it would hit 40, could hit 30mph in 5 seconds revv'd out with the 13p. But....all that Id have to spend $ and time instead of making $ selling it for an outboard that I like better
I know what you mean my man you definitely have to have the power to weight ratio right I have a mercury 60 HP command thrust on a g3 1860 it has a tiller but is easy to drive
Sounds like thats a really good match. Im assuming the steering wouldnt be as twitchy on a heavier boat with one of these big tillers
@@tieoneon1614 yeah she drives like a Cadillac
What diameter is the prop? I know you said 11 pitch. Also, if you go with a 10 pitch what diameter are you going to try? The 10.7 diameter are freaking ridiculous in price! I just mounted my 25 and havent run it yet. Thanks for any info!
I got some vids up of it launching so people can see for themselves. Its a 10 spine prop shaft, so u can find some really cheap props on Amazon if u look up Mercury 10 spline prop for 25-30hp outboards 2006 and up, non BigFoot lower units. I dont think an expensive SS, Spitfire or any fancy prop would make more than a 1mph difference in this low of HP rating. I dont have a tach mounted yet so cant tell u rpms but this 11p sounds/feels perfect for this set up at 1000lbs gross weight. U can look up the specs of your boat for dry weight, add in you/motor/gas/batteries/gear. Id say a 12p would push 800lbs fine, and Im going to try the 10 for myself and Dad fishing at 1200lbs
I just checked, its 9.9 diameter on the 11 and 10p I think. I just got a 10 today, going to try it out with 2 guys in boat.
Did you consider going with the 30 hp motor? It is in the same class, so the size and weight are about the same. I was curious because I am considering getting a Lund 1600 fury with tiller motor. I am debating between the 25 of 30 hp motor. What's your recommendation? Thanks
I definitely did. If I was buying new, $$$ not an option it would be Lund Fury 1600 in blue or grey with a Merc 30. I could only find a 30 hp ELPT with in 2 hours drive at $6350, not counting dealer fee's, tax, prop etc. I got this '23 25hp at discount cuz it was last years, plus the rebate of $750 which ended May 16th. So OTD I was less than $4700 including prop. Which I think MSRP is $5200 for the 25 ELPT. Which was close to what I could get the Suzuki 30 hp for online delivered, but I love this Mercury handle. That Lund is about 125lbs heavier than this boat, and this 25 pushes 2 guys at 24mph and myself at 27mph so Id say u would see about 1 mph less. If u wanna go faster id say get the 30, but for the deal i got and the speeds Im getting with my set up Im very happy. Hopefully this long winded novel here helps, LOL. Im happy to answer any other questions u got, i enjoyed doing this and will be profiting off the 40 hp.
Correction : The rebate lasts til 31st, and is only for the 25hp but includes 7 year warranty over the oem 3 year. Id ask the dealer quick if u were interested
Thanks for your reply! That was very helpful! I am leaning toward the 30 hp motor and you pretty well confirmed it! Thanks
Id keep them both and put a jet foot on the 40
Iv never operated or been in a boat with a jet. They aint popular around here, its only props and surface drives. Curious about them though
Im surprised on such a difference in those 2.. especially the weight.. not like the old 2 strokes.. I'd take that merc off your hands if I could.. also a merc fan. Till I can afford it, my 1940's alto 2 cylinder will have to put me around lol..
I seen a Hiawatha this weekend if u are into classics, lol. The amount of force it took to move the 40 tiller handle up/down, left/right was about 3x more than the 25 Id say. They are built now for modern heavy boats, not these 90's style basic It sold yesterday, for just under what a new one MSRP's at. Still a deal with that $220 prop and not paying tax/prep fee's. A major factor in me buying that boat was for that motor, but its been a good experience especially being able to profit after buying a new Mercury also. My opinion is these modern 40's would need a boat over 700lbs to not have the porpoising problems I had. Im happy as hell with my new 25 hp, and with my older 40 hp 2 stroke I had last year id have to dial the cruise speed back to around 26-27mph {which is what this 25hp gets max speed with cheap prop} otherwise it'd average 5 miles per gallon. This 25 hp last week with 1 passenger wide open back/forth across a big lake averaged 13 miles per gallon.
Sad that you cannot max power rating on this boat. I owned a 25hp on lighter 16ft and ran great. Upgraded to a bigger tiller boat with a 90HP vmax sho yamaha... alumacraft competitor tiller 185. I have no issues steering or to operate... considering I am an office rat, 5' 8", 250lbs. I don't see why it would be more difficult to use the 40hp... probably something we don't see or mercury got wrong.
The older 2 stroke 40's were around 180lb's, Im sure they'd be fine. However these boats were sold with 30hp from factory which seem like a great fit. I seen big Yamaha tillers operated with 1 finger. Its mainly the up/down resistance with this big tiller I didnt like since im constantly using the trim. But left/right, up/down on the 25 is effortless and thats what I wanted.
Its pretty simple to add console steering .
That would defeat the purpose of me wanting a tiller boat with more room.
What boat model is this? Im trying to figure out what the beam length is.
Says at start of video, there are 5 different manufacturers that share this hull. Sea Nymph BT165. Very lightweight at 500lbs and kind of narrow at 68"
The major problem with this set up was the weight of the 40 hp, being it was half of the weight of this boat itself. READ BEFORE COMMENTING. Im deleting low IQ comments and those who didnt listen, just want to argue. I made this video to help anybody looking at these two outboards, cuz this situation is rare to actually have both. 1} Your welded boat is almost double the weight of these riveted v-hulls. They are a good match for this 40. 2} Your manual start, manual trim 2 stroke is obviously lighter > nobody here cares. 3} The 40 was tried at 3 different transon heights, all trim positions. There are videos up of each outboard at holeshot, and 1 of the 40hp bouncing at cruising speed trimmed properly. 4} Both batteries were moved to front of boat, and even with a passenger it still eventually start bouncing and wouldnt stop until speed was greatly reduced. Im HAPPY to answer any legit questions between the 2 outboards since I enjoyed this project and work on a lot of boats.
A hydrofoil would have solved your problems with the 40
@@jamessmithjr.299 Possibly. But spending more $ wasnt gonna fix the skittish handling and fatigue to operate a heavy tiller. Im 100% happier with the 25 and profited well selling the 40 to guy with a bigger heavier 16ft.
I've been looking Crestliner 1750 pro tiller which comes with a 90 big tiller. I wonder how fatiguing that would be. The bean is 94", dry hull weight about 1200 or so. The engine has a u-flex hydraulic assist which I understand is only for locking the tiller; it does not make steering easier. Yours is one of the very few useful videos.
which make Outboard? I heard the Yamaha 90 is super easy to operate
2019 merc 90 big tiller.
Motor not setup right.. i had a 25 setup too low on my 1448 flat bottom couldn’t drive it more then 30min . Now i have a 50hp with jack-plate mounted high without a torque tab and a 15pitch no issues.
Seems a lot of people didnt listen to entire video. I went over how it was mounted too low by previous owner, and me raising it to correct by standards height then also another 1" higher. Didnt make a difference. It was too heavy for this boat being 50% of gross.
Are there optiins of assisted steering for the 40?
No, not this HP.
I thinking of putting a 40hp Tiller on my 24ft pontoon. We just troll
what speed could you get with the 25hp? looking at the same motor now
just watched the rest of the video and found out. thanks
@@TakeItOR_Leaveit Gonna test out 2 people with the 10p prop tomorrow, and finally got a tach hooked up too {however not real confident how accurate these tach's are LOL}
czcams.com/video/Gvd5ERrxFN0/video.html
40 is way overkill
Probably would be ok with a 40 hp 2 stroke. 4 stroke probably was too heavy 🤷
Yes sir. My Merc 40hp 2 stroke {console steer} was 182lbs. But I never liked the tiller handles of thoses, especially with the key start and power trim on wires meant to mount remotely.
Would rather rebuild a lighter 2 stroke
100% would rather not. Had 2 strokes my entire life up until now. Last month with this put on 35 miles on less than 3 gallons of gas, when normally gotta fuel up twice with 6 gallon tank. Quiet and zero carb drama and can troll with this.
JACKPLATE ?
No. It has enough adjustment in transom holes to go 1 1/2" above bottom of keel, and i tried it. That high made the power trim useless and it still would porpoise eventually from any ripple in the water
My 14 foot NADEN bare bones tinny has a brand new 40hp Suzuki tiller on it and it is a fucking rocket ship. NADEN boats from Canada were built like tanks my little 14 foot has a 76inch beam. At one point I swapped my Naden out for a 16 foot wide body Legend and the boat was pure garbage you couldn't keep the front end in the lake and you wouldn't lean over to take a fish off your hook because the boat felt like it was going to capsize I put my motor back on my NADEN and sold the Legend. This video should be flagging your boat as the problem since both of the motors in the video are fine.
Yep, thats exactly what I said in the vid. I even pinned the top comment saying that. Wider, heavier boats would suite the 40hp just fine. Those Legends I seen, they are very similar to the Alumacraft V16 hulls. Bare bones, thin AL and even lighter than this Sea Nymph. 25hp's are good fit's for them
Should have gotten the 30hp. Personally I think there is no use for the 25 anymore when the 30hp is the same engine and weighs the same
Im glad I didnt. $1200 to $1600 average dealer price more for 2 mph faster was nothing that interested me especially when this 25hp can hit 28 mph with a cheap prop. I do still think the Suzuki 30hp is the best buy, but after getting familiar with Mercury's tiller handle, ergo's and adjustments this is exactly what I wanted and got a great price with Mercurys rebate this month.
@@dirtybootsfishing2923 Well folks, you heard it here first! Send your $ to this 20 year old trying to grow a Pedro stache, and he can turn your 25hp into a 30!!! {insert emoji's} No....Mercury isnt like Yamaha or Suzuki that shares everything with similar blocks. Mercury would need an aftermarket racing ECU or ECU flash to reprogram more fuel first which doest exist cuz Mercury's ECU's are locked to 50 state emission legal, THEN would need a larger intake and mayb injector.
@@dirtybootsfishing2923 sUrE yA diD
@@tieoneon1614 ohh ok believe what u want bro I was just saying but hey u have a blessed day sir
4 strokes too slow imo
😅😅😅😅
I appreciate the video; but, I have a 16' starcraft with a 25 hp 2cycle Johnson with extended shaft and I don't see how you could beat it. It does about 25 mph and runs on an 8gal tank all day.
Well....to each their own and no need to upgrade if it works and u are happy. But 27 mph, pushing a button to go into/out of shallow water plus raise the bow up in rougher water, and I just got back from a week stay at the lake covering around 35 miles without running my 3.3 gallon tank dry Id say aint bad 😉. I grew up on Merc 25 2 strokes, and my buds Yamaha was even faster. If they still made them new, but with power trim then their wouldnt be much comparison between power, weight, and price. And most of us would trade the MPG's for that. But the deciding factors for me are power trim and mpg's. The fact that they are super quiet, not mixing gas, never needing to fix carb float, and are super quiet are added bonus to the newer 4 strokes. Worth every penny to me