The Psychology of House of the Dragon - Viserys' Grief has him make BAD Decisions
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- čas přidán 24. 08. 2022
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Making tough decisions under duress is a bad idea and Psychotherapist Georgia Dow uses Viserys from "House of the Dragon" to explain why YOU should avoid ever doing it!
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Looking forward to following this arc (along with all the others too!) Do you have any plans on covering Sandman?
Question for you will you react to the castlevania series on netflix?
I havent but it is one i may @castlevania and I have less of a chance for sandman but it is on the list .
@@GeorgiaDow I highly recommend it. It is a really grounded fantasy
Thank you for your analyses. Paddy Considine did a phenomenal job in this scene. The argument between Viserys and Daemon shows a very interesting dynamic between the brothers - Daemon pointing out how vulnerable Viserys is making himself by relying on the Small Council while pushing Daemon away, and only making things worse when Viserys reacts emotionally, rejecting Daemon because he focused on the “weak” comment rather than the intention Daemon has behind it - “I’ll always protect you.”
Exactly! I’ve watched a lot of reaction channels and seen their reaction to this scene and Daemon in general, being very disliked. In reality while Daemon is not a great person, he gets a worse rep than he truly deserves
@@oscarstenderup Facts. People are quick to assume he's the villain of the story when in actuality, he is shown multiple times to have a great love and care for his family.
Yes I felt that word also @ I will always protect you.
@@hunterhorsehelmsley7315 Really? I didn;t get that. He struck me as a whiny attention-seeker.
@@GoTfan-eb8tk He's that too
"You have to have a reason for the action scene, otherwise there's no point to it." - that's the showrunners showing they FUNDAMENTALLY UNDERSTAND the rules of storytelling in a way D&D fail to grasp post season 4. They often just had good battle scenes for the sake of good battle scenes. And it's why the big battles were often towards the end of a season vs sometimes in the middle or at the beginning. The fight against the zombies at Winterfell, The battle of Hardhome these are cool battles, but feels like nothing at the same time. Meanwhile this battle, the jousting, having those scenes interlaced with the birthing scene was genius.
The scenes lasted JUST long enough to get you invested in Daemon's fight, then bam cut to Aemma's struggle. And THAT scene would last just long enough before BAM cut to Daemon. You're now invested in both scenes before you know it. AND even if you're disturbed by the Aemma scene. you can't just fast forward through the birth cause you might miss the joust, and there's the point being made RIGHT there. It PAYS OFF the SETUP from Aemma when she said that giving birth was a woman's battlefield.
We shall see as it goes on whether you know the source material or not wouldn't be singing praises on them this early to each thier own though
It also brilliantly constrasts the typical male and female battlefields at the time. Daemon's battlefield- the joust- while dangerous, is all a big performance, a contest, it's out in the open in front of cheering crowds. The winners are showered with praise, glory, and prizes. Meanwhile Aemma's battlefield is hidden away, behind closed doors. There is no crowd, no cheering, no prize, no glory, just life and death.
And then they did Rhaenys escape from the dragon pit and went full D&D.
@@htaylor9677 While in terms of adaptation there are some questionable choices in this show, when it comes to storytelling telling and cinema HOTD it's really great. Scenes are not just beautifully constructed, they also serve a purpose (except Meleys' final one imo), and the majority of them move the plot forward without tedious exposition or senseless 'cool showy action' for the sake of it.
@@erikrungemadsen2081 Yes, that one was a regrettable choice from the showrunners.
That was probs one of the most disturbingly powerful things I had seen on a show for a while. The showrunners said they would focus heavily on birthing though so I wonder how much it will carry over to Allicent and Rhaenyra
I hope we get a POV from the womens perspective for one of them. Let’s also remember Laena dies in child birth too
Several times no spoilers though
This scene was both brutal and devastating.
I had to have a C-section because my daughter's heart rate was decelerating, and even with my doctor telling me exactly what we were going to do and why, and even knowing this was for my girl's safety, it was still a little frightening. We're both fine now, she's a bright and happy toddler, but it was still a surreal experience. As you might guess, this scene gave me chills.
The pregnancy scene was brutal. I'm curious why he decided to not include his wife in his decision-making. Also thank you for making a video on House of the Dragon :D Can't wait till sunday.
It also didnt feel right with me that he didnt ask her. I would assume most mothers would want them to try and save the baby. Its probably because in Westerosi culture mothers dont make decisions in situations like these so it never even crossed their minds unlike ours.
What everyone seems to be missing is that Aemma was HEAVILY drugged. The Maester says as much. In all honesty, I think that was the reason Viserys didn’t speak with her. By the time he got on the scene, they were already out of time. (I’m not gonna get into the tourney part because that’s a whole other rant.)
Viserys HAD spoken to Aemma before when she was in the bath. And she told him while she was lucid, that she did not want to lose any more children. The Maester told him, regardless of his decision, Aemma would die. She was doomed. Either way. So Viserys made the awful DIFFICULT decision to potentially save their son rather than lose them both. Aemma was out of it. She wasn’t lucid enough to make any decisions, and while she may not have been looked to even if she weren’t, she and Viserys did seem to have healthy, open communication in their relationship. We can’t know what he would have done if she was in a clear headspace. But I think that he was acting not only in the best interests of their child, but on her wishes in the best way he knew how. It was atrocious and tragic and not at all ideal, but likely, the fact she was drugged and the fact they were on a time crunch played a large part.
@@miraakprinceofapocrypha7998 what would he ask her? Hey honey, I’ve just heard you are both going to die, but if we cut you open there’s a chance we can at-least save the baby, is that okay with you?
She was in no right mind.
@@miraakprinceofapocrypha7998 They told him she's on a large dose of milk of the poppy (that's essentially morphine).
She's delirious from pain and drugs.
His "choice" as far as he knows is let her and the baby die by doing nothing or save the baby. Either way she dies, one way is faster and might save a life, it's not really a choice.
Being told she would have to die to save the baby might have gotten her to panic too.
He tries to comfort her while the maesters do what has to be done.
Honestly, as aweful as it sounds, what's the point of asking her opinion?
If she had said she refused, what then? Let her and the baby die?
She is already condemned, her opinion might just condemn the baby with her or force you to do it against her will anyway.
@@namenloss730 the point of telling her is so that she could choose to sacrifice herself, which she absolutely would have if there was no way to save her. That way she could leave the world feeling like she's saving her child, rather than spending her last moments completely confused and terrified.
This was one of the hardest things to watch. Ever.
I m sorry maybe I should have mentioned that in the opening
@@GeorgiaDow Oh, I'm sorry! I didn't mean to imply it bothered me in that way. I love your videos; this one no less than your others.
Thanks =)
I think the thing that stood out the most to me was just how gentle Daemon's "the heir for a day" speech was in contrast with his rallying cry before the Goldcloak raid. Like, he genuinely wanted to honour his nephew, but was resigned to the fact that whatever he said would be twisted. You can tell that he'd rather be anywhere else - that he wants to mourn with his family; but is forced to act out because that's all they expect of him - it's the only behaviour they'll acknowledge. In a way, giving Viserys something to be angry at seems to be Daemon's way of helping his brother grieve.
I can stomach seeing people being decapitated, castrated or mutilated. I can stomach buckets of blood and gore. But show me a woman forced to have a C-section with minimal drugs to dull the pain, and I look away.
This scene was very close to home for me. Because my mom had to have a C-section for me to come out because I was two weeks late.
I hope it all worked out well. I am sure this scene was much more deep for you.
@@GeorgiaDow From what my mom told me, everything went fine. And yeah, this scene in particular hit me hard.
It’s just weird I can handle violence but stuff like this makes me uncomfortable. Any ideas why that might be?
That scene was rough.
my problem was that noboy asked Aemma if she is okay with this...she had no say in this and for me as a woman it was upsetting to watch but that was the reality in medieval times , men made decisions over women and women were just breedingmachines
Sad this is still true today
That was the point of the scene, it's depicting medieval times(even though it's fantasy)
Also she has been given milk of the poppy (opium) so she is high as hell to make a decision.
Very good point @H K I felt it also
They could have at least tell her what was happening. Can you imagine the fear she had.
It's even more tragic when you consider that Aemma's mother, Daella Targaryen, died of childbed fever shortly after delivering her...
Paddy Constantine's Viserys Is so well done as a character imo.
I mean just that Look in his eyes during the funeral scene after his wife's death Says so much.
He's Heartbroken,ashamed,and almost looks disgusted with himself for what he chose to put his wife through under the knowledge he was given.
Georgia! Wanted to take advantage of how early I am by saying that you have quickly become one of my favorite creators. I have been able to process a lot of feelings and trauma through your videos, especially about Arcane. You really find the good in all people (characters) and show how much people's past and intentions affect their decisions. You are such a soothing person and it's refreshing to see someone so authentically caring and emotional for others. Please keep it up, thank you ❤
Hendrix appreciate these words they made my day thanks so much and I hope you keep enjoying my content
First I love your costuming in this, it's very Targaryan, even if it reminds me a bit of Cersei circa season 6. 😆 I also love your analysis of my favorite TV shows.
This scene really got to me. Game of Thrones is known for violence and uncomfortable scenes, and there was certainly that in other points in this episode. Female body autonomy is also not really a thing in this universe. However, just the idea of them holding her down and cutting her open without getting her consent first (or even explaining what was happening) is awful to me. I had the luxury of having a C section with an epidural and full knowledge of what was going on and so it's easy to imagine myself in her place if I had existed in that universe. Just the total fear and pain that she expresses it feels like a violation. Then, to make it all worse, he put his wife through all of that only to have the baby die anyway in the end.
Thanks so much Sarah
That scene at the beginning was so hard to watch, even though he made the logical decision of at least saving the baby. What bothers me more is how it happened for more than once. Here in the far east side of Turkey, in the border provinces neighboring Syria, Iran and Iraq where the effects of Middle Eastern cultures can be seen, fathers force their wives to make children until they have a son. And sometimes just by chance they never have one. Sometimes they keep having children, 10 daughters or even more in some cases, but never a son. Such women are not seen as women in those households. Thank god and whatever is out there this is not the case in all parts of the country, of course, only that part near the borders. The gov tried so hard to educate those people living in those parts in the past decades. Sometimes these women die before, during, or after birth due to complications. Even when they don't, sometimes they are killed by men just because they couldn't give them a son, even though the male chromosomes are what determines the sex of the child.
Viserys did the same, I remember her saying she had many miscarriages and other complications. If he had just said enough and selected his daughter as the heir, his wife would be alive. But he had the same idiotic ambition of having a son, and it took both of them from him. Daemon was also not wrong about "heir for a day" even though it sounds inconsiderate for that moment.
I also have a feeling Daemon might be right about Viserys' right hand guy not being who he thinks he is. Probably that's also gonna come back to bite Viserys in the ass later as he just kicked out Daemon on a whim.
Also, I love your cosplay for this show! It's very simple yet elegant, giving off a royal and noble vibe. Almost an effortless beauty... Well, at least gives off an effortless vibe. Pretty sure you put much effort in it lol.
That's powerful - thank you for your comment.
Wow Raven that is very eye opening. Thank you for sharing.
Absolutely love these videos, I hope you continue 😀
Thanks…I enjoyed your video. Blessings on your day 👍🏻
A thing to keep in mind before judging him too harshly is that there are strong indications that Viserys was being manipulated and lied to. I don't know if the maester willfully misrepresented the situation or the options but it is a possibility. Viserys was in a very vulnerable mental space as Georgia illustrated. He was deferring to the wisdom of an expert in something that he had little knowledge of. Under a great deal of stress, he was given a choice between two bad options. In his emotional tunnel vision he likely couldn't imagine other alternatives if there were any. I would need the professional opinion of an obstetrician to know what the "actual" situation was. I personally disagree with his choice or at least the way he handled it. However I don't know for 100% certain that the c-section was the worse choice. I think as king he felt responsible for the duty to produce an heir, even over the life of his queen. Duty over love is the ethics in play in this situation. He wanted to take the responsibility and guilt for his decision. That responsibility and duty is a part of what "strength" means to him. Much like Ned Stark.
Given the medical technology available, I believe that a c-section was incredibly irresponsible and looked in that instance to be poorly performed with no care to the potential survival of the mother, already writing her off as lost. It looked like there was no care or attempt to minimize damage or avoid arteries. I personally would have asked the queen how she wanted to approach it, even under the stress she was in. Or at least have gotten a hypothetical agreement on what to do in a similar situation when she was of sound mind beforehand. It's entirely possible it wasn't thought of though. I believe she would have wanted to be given a fighting chance and to "put it in the hands of the Gods," but that's just my thought.
I think his dreams also played a big role. He clearly puts a lot of stock in the idea of prophetic dreams, and believes he is having them. Might of deluded himself into believing everything would work out.
Everyone seems to forget it wasnt a Either or situation. It was both die or the son may live
There was no good option here
In medieval times even a regular, bog standard birth could lead to both. This was a breach they couldnt fix. There was only 1 way that baby was coming out. Surgery. And without being able to do stuff like blood transfusions or even knowing to sterilize the tools it always leads to death in these cases during this equivalent time period
I think another factor is from the sound of it the maesters had never DONE the procedure, they had knowledge about it from the citadel. In the books a similar situation occurred but at least the mother was supposedly given enough sedatives to be unconscious during it.
I'm really curious Georgia how you prepared to be a youtuber and chose the (clearly chosen) cadence and style with which to deliver your missives. You're inspirational and in the way you've chosen to be. Quite fascinating!
Thanks so much = ) I am trying to stop the cadence lol it is just im speaking and not writing a script so it happens. Thanks for being here
@@GeorgiaDow Aw, I get that. I imagine you're emulating speakers you admire. I have to say it is quite effective. If you truly want to break the cadence talk about something you're unsure about. Your earned confidence is the crutch propping that up, IMNSHO. Love your content.
Viserys should have told Aemma what the maester had suggested and gotten her consent to go ahead with the procedure and if she had refused he should have accepted her decision. He did not do any of that, effectively stripping her of her agency. It's awful but the show knows it's awful and is showing how in a lot of ways women are being victimised by this institutionalised and normalised misogyny which allows Viserys to tell himself that what he's doing is justified because it's supposedly about the succession. When Viserys tells her he loves her it's partially what he thinks he feels for his wife but he is also doing it to assuage his own feeling of guilt because he knows that he is allowing the maester to administer a medical procedure she did not consent to just so he could get what he is convinced is a male heir. He should feel haunted by this decision and the episode clearly shows that he is whilst not letting him off the hook in the slightest and it shouldn't in any case.
yes he should have, heartbreaking to see her pulled down without her consent
Also him not telling Aemma clearly made her a lot more stressed, which is another possible cause of her death.
Idk if you go back and read comments on your older videos but I got into you via your Hazbin videos but A Song of Ice and Fire is my favourite series so I REALLY love House of the Dragon (not so much Game of Thrones) and I often see people really miss a lot of what happens in this first episode. While the birth scene is so hard to watch still, and Viserys absolutely robbed Aemma of her agency and didn't give her any heads up as to what they were about to do, most people miss that there was no chance to save her, only the baby (according to the maesters anyway) and how his grief leads him to be manipulated by Otto. This is great stuff!!
Thankfully we live in a time where death from childbirth isn't common, at least to my knowledge. In less developed nations it's a tragic reality still I'd wager though I don't know the numbers. As for GoT, it seems a common theme. A fantasy set in a preindustrial society seems to come with all the same risks apparently.
Not in USA where maternal mortality rates are the highest in a developed country
If you live in United States of America its more common than you'd think actually.
Unfortunately, childbirth remains one of the most dangerous challenges women face. Mortality rates are still shockingly high, even in developed nations.
Show Viserys is definitely more sympathetic than him in the books.
Oooh! Would you please, please analyze all the characters in House of the Dragon?!🐉🔥🐉🔥🐉🔥🐉🔥🐉🔥🐉🔥
welp. time for my daily cry.
yikes. I was so racked with emotions, that I really didn't see and grasp what was going on....rewatching this, with your breakdown?? wow. this was so traumatic and HER knowing?!?!?! she was about to be killed? omg I can not even.
I am happy this gave you a more deep meaning into it thanks
It’s been really insulting as someone who was born with a uterus and identifies with feminity/womanhood, to see men and even other women saying the scene with Aemma Arryn was gratiutous and for shock value.
My mother almost died after having my brother due to nurses not realizing she was bleeding out. Lyanna Stark lying in a bed with her blood pooled around her after birth is what happened to my mother. She almost died. My aunt had to have an emergency c-section, and they then found out during it she had stage four endometriosis. It was a miracle she carried a child to full term and labor. I have endometriosis, pelvic floor dysfunction, and Vulvodynia. Sex is already extremely painful without the proper precautions, I can’t even imagine what childbirth would be like for me IF I CAN get pregnant.
We still face terrible fertility issues, and doctors/nurses still at times rely so heavily on technological advances that they miss whats right in front of them (my mother literally bleeding out and almost dying in the early 2000s). Just writing this off as “this show is trying to be feminist and woke” when George himself has shown an accute understanding of the struggles women within societies face (Brienne, Cersei, Rhaeneys, etc.) that he wrote IN THE 90s before a more common lexicon and understanding of patriarchy and feminism was arround kinda shows whos just watching and making reviews out of the “SJW themes” in the show really dont understand GRRM or how he disects his female characters to be characters on their own while using them to disect their society as a whole.
Great video! ♥️ I'm a recent subscriber and I love your Stranger Things videos too! I was wondering if you would ever consider doing an analysis on the character Anakin Skywalker from the Star Wars prequel movies or from their newer show Obiwan Kenobi? I would LOVE to hear your take on his personality and his tragic backstory. ♥️♥️♥️
I just did not like the part where she says no, and he goes ahead anyway. I think at the very least he should have explained what was happening. I think any mother given the choice of saving their kid, or both dying would save their child. There was no need for her to be kept in the dark like that. I had some darker thoughts about him maybe taking it out on her for saying she would not try again after this, and it's clear he is upset afterward, but was that for his wife, or for the child who died anyway? so for me, he did not come out of this looking like a good guy. I do think that's an impossible situation. You never want to have to make that choice, but she was conscious, and he could have asked her what she wanted, or at least explained to her what they were doing. I think it was cruel of him to let her be that frightened, and not tell her why. I Think they could have at the very least knocked her out before slashing her to ribbons if they weren't going to even tell her what was happening anyway. no one even considered calling his daughter for a last goodbye with her mother. she probably could have been there in 10 seconds on dragon back. there was just a lot about it that bothered me. Then he yells at Daemon for the way he was carousing to drown his sorrows but, he also cloistered himself off. he did not summon his daughter or his brother to grieve with them, even after his Daughter had to burn her mother with her Dragon. I am not a huge fan of his just now, we will see if that changes at all next episode.
Thank you, I hadn' fully grasped the full impact of the scene. I was probably fiddling on my phone because "yuck! childbirth. Please torture and maim but spare me his horror!" 😅
Could you do a review or analyse of the physiatrist from Grand theft auto V.
You should cover star trek lower decks
The reason why I can never forgive Viserys in the birthing scene is that he never told Emma what was going on. She was scared and the choice or even understanding of what was going on was denied to her.
Sure, if they hadn’t given her a c-section they most likely would have both died, so I understand why he decided the option that he did, but to not even inform HIS WIFE what was going on is just cruel.
Your outfit is out of this world
Thank you so much! I enjoyed getting dressed up = )
seeing all these again, i really believed the king should have chosen Daemon as his heir in the beginning.
I'm glad that I found out what happened to the Queen before sitting down to actually watch the show. A scene like this is incredibly triggering, even more so for those who have been in a similar situation (i.e., emergency c-section because the baby won't progress and/or is in distress). Now, I can skip over this and still enjoy the rest of the show. Thank you ❤️
I hope you are okay and things went well. Thanks for being a part of my community
do people not get that you can understand and empathize/sympathize with a person/character without excusing and trying to justify certain horrific decisions they made?
it's horrifying to see so many people endlessly defending viserys for what he did to his wife and trying to excuse it entirely. what he did wasn't okay. stop trying to act like it was. it's hard to appreciate a character's layers and moral greys when everyone is trying to act like there are none
aemma's body was her own. she deserved bodily autonomy. it doesn't matter if the maester said she was die either way - treating her like an incubator instead of a human being that was forced to keep providing him heirs even though she had already had 5 of her children die and then in the end let her die in terror and begging for her husband who she loved to stop without even being TOLD what was going on was despicable. this was HER tragedy. everyone acting like viserys deserves more sympathy and defense is insane
(yes, i understand that in the world they are in that the women are always treated like this. still, doesn't make it okay. especially since this man claimed to love her as much as he did)
viserys isn't a child. just because he is going through a lot of grief and pressure and because he was sad while his wife was being cut open doesn't mean everyone should infantilize him and act like he isn't responsible for his own decisions. he is the KING for god's sake
morally grey and antagonist characters are always my favorites because they are the most interesting to me. however, people tend to want to justify the craziest things just due to sympathy or favoritism (like with daenerys)
stop excusing characters and respect and explore the depth and range of them instead
(good video, btw!! this comment isn't directed at you! 💕💕)
I'm pretty sure if Viserys had just told her what would happen, she would be fine with sacrificing herself to save the baby.
My only catch up on that scene is that Vyseris didn't discuss it with his wife, but that wasn't a thing in that culture.
right she had no say or even knowledge
@@GeorgiaDow For sure, although someone pointed out to me she was also heavily drugged and confused in general too, not in the best state of mind to make any choice herself either so it's all crazy ☹️
i think its a poor choice of writing and directing. regardless of how george rr martin originally intended it, this king viserys is portrayed as loving and understanding.
i hear the original king viserys is cowardly and easily manipulated, but... regardless...
i feel this scene deeply misses out of character portrayal on both king viserys and queen aemma.
what tips it over the edge for me is that i think that this scene was played out for the sake of shock value to generate hype.
it was not tasteful and the interview statements regarding it feels both disingenous and disrespectful.
Hi can you help me, I addicted to something that ruining my life?
i would have appreciated it more if kimg viserys had a heart to heart with queen aemma, and the queen could have shown her resolve. its not like she was opposed to her "royal duty" and mothers ive known and talked to who had life threatening experiences during their pregnancy have shown a remarkable tendency to prioritize their unborn childs welfare before their own.
apparently one of the show runners publicly stated this scene is a statement about the overturning of roe v wade and the womans right to choose.
which i can get. but the execution of it seems muddled and a bit disingenous. also, what if a scene was intended to represent pro life? would there be public backlash instead for that particular opinion to be represented on media?
this c section scene was emotionally horrifying. but i feel like it was dragged out for shock value to A) its the game of thrones world, and B) get people talking about the show.
it did not really articulate a womans right to choose, and it underplayed the real sacrifice women make in both modern and past eras for childbirth.
and on top of the writing and directing felt sloppy, there are public statements about it being connected to the recent overturning of roe v wade.
i may be pro choice, but this continues to leave a bad taste in ky mouth.
I agree
Can You Answer This ? Georgia Do You Think Season 8 OF Game OF Thrones Was Rushed ?
rushed and massacred
They could save her, the maesters want Targariens and dragons die
Georgia...why do I get the feeling that you already had the dragon BEFORE these last two videos? = ) I dated a girl who asked me who I would save if she and my mother were drowning. I said, YOU can swim, my mother can't...so I would expect you to help me save her. As to the dilemma in this video? I would have asked her what SHE wanted, and then come to a mutual decision. If they were to both die...then he could have comforted her though that. If she wanted to save the baby, then she would have been PREPARED for what was coming and less horrified by what was happening. Either way, he would have also been less traumatized.
Maybe if you were raised in a culture where mothers dont have a say in these decisions you wouldnt even think of asking her though.
@@miraakprinceofapocrypha7998 I don't actually buy into that mostly because of his anguish with the decision and because he took the time to comfort her while it happened. If she was such a non-entity to him...I feel neither of those things would have happened. Plus he would not have been so very broken up about it afterward. I think it was not the best time emotionally to make the best decision and think of ALL the options. For me, it would have been my first thought.
@@classicslover Well i didnt say she was a non-entity to him just that he was raised in a way where he would never think of even asking her.
You would obviously ask because you were raised in our time.
@CL very well stated and I think it would have been the right thing to do. And well said he would have felt much less guilt. = )) as to the dragons
I love the new show but this thing was a little bit more graphic than it needed to be. I only say that because reaction videos where some of the ladies had to stop their reaction because some of them had gone through this before. And I know what modern medicine chances are far far less that you could lose the baby and the mother but it can still happen. I was lucky my wife and I were able to have a natural birth and I was still about to pass out. I can't imagine nor do I want to have him to make a call like that.
During the worst time in my country of the pandemic. Almost without beds for patiets, oxygen, with a colllapsed system. A coleague of mine (i was really lucky in that regard) had to make the impossible decission of having to choose between 2 patients with respiratory distress who was going to get intubated and who wasnt. It was horrible, he was emotonally destroyed by that decision. There was no right answer. Im sure that during the pandemic world wide there were similar cases. It was horrible and so sad.
Would love to see some Avatar: The Last Airbender analysis!
Hu Georgia. Do you have an email that I can use to contact you?
I have a question about a topic you'l likelyl find fascinating that has become secretly very popular.
You can find my email in the description and also in the about. Also on my website
I agree it was a hard decision, but it should have been hers, not his.
So very true
What choice would there be? They established that either both die, or she does, with a chance for the child to live. She was drugged out.
I think the entire her being tortured to death kinda cuts my sympathy for him short. But I like your take on it even if I still find it inhumane what he did to someone he loves. Can you call it even love then? Allowing your significant other's stomach be cut open while they are wide awake for the slight possibility to save a child that had no real survival chances in times like that to begin with? After all, he seemed much more in love with his prophetic dream and his hopes for grandure.
I hope you one day analyze Peter Parker in Sam Raimi’s Spider Man 2.
Viserys should have made the decision with his wife and respected it either way in my opinion. But then again I do not think it would make a lot of sense narratively speaking given the culture he was brought up in and is a product of which is sadly a very misogynistic culture (to be clear he still clearly loved his wife). But of course I was not the one being asked to make that decision so I am not sure how much if any right I or anyone else has to judge him. If nothing else though I do have to respect that he did not run from his decision and stayed with her to offer what little comfort he could.
In any event it is hard not to feel bad for Viserys, to make a choice that not only lead to his wife dying horribly but to have it ultimately come to nothing since his son died anyway is just awful in a way I can not put into words. I can not help but wonder if he spent the rest of his life thinking that if he had just recognized Rhaenyra as his heir from the beginning instead of obsessing over having a son, his wife would still be alive. Unfortunately, I feel it is a very safe bet that his guilt and grief over this decision is going to lead to him making yet more poor decisions that are going to lead to even more tragedies
Yes and a cultural statement as well. I agree they should have
This has nothing to do with the video, but your face reminded me of the protagonist in the game "Control"
I have started to play it actually Jessie Faden
@@GeorgiaDow great game and also your vids are amazing too
Beep boop, comment for algorithm
Thank you @@
Slight spoilers.
I know they never brought it up in the show but as a book reader I was like...how could he not know about choice and act so surprise. His own great grandmother died giving birth in the same way only the child lived and later married his own brother making her his sister-in-law. Their daughter is even a character in the show, Rhaenys Vallaryon the wife of the Sea Snake Corlys Vallaryon and the Queen who never was.
So proud of HBO for always never shying away from real life and hard hitting decisions. This MATTERS‼️
Honestly that C-section scene was horrible to watch
So I have seen people say this scene is bad because he didn't ask or tell the Queen the plan and I understand the thought.
But a question that crossed my mind is in the show they had 4 previous attempts at a son if I recall correctly 3 stillborn one girl, so I would have thought at some point during the 5th pregnancy they would have had a conversation about what she would want to happen?
The only real issue I had with the scene is the master going from 1 to 100 if a second
We can't turn the baby so nuclear option.
Especially from all available knowledge the king had a hard choice lose his wife to prevent more losses down the line.
In the words of ower beloved space elf.
"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one".
Ps. Sad as it is if the baby survived there would be no show so in this case the king got the crap end of the stick.
Anyway that's just some thought, very good video, thanks again georgia. ;)
There is an extra pressure on Viserys that this is not just a man in the impossible situation of choosing to let his wife die for the uncertain possibility that the child might live, but he is also an absolutist monarch in a society where power flows down the male line. Whatever the rights and wrongs of that may be to our modern eyes in a pluralistic and (at least theoretically) gender equal democratic society, the hard political reality confronting Viserys is that this child is a potential male heir who could avert a looming succession crisis that could result in a war of succession that could kill tens or hundreds of thousands and leave the realm in ruins, a situation only magnified in severity by the existence in this world of the scaly weapons of mass destruction called dragons. Viseyrs has a primary obligation as monarch to his subjects that must stand above even his obligation to his wife as her husband, but that doesn't mean that the pragmatic decision to try to avert large scale disaster doesn't still haunt him and make him loath himself for what he has done to the woman he loves. The decision clearly breaks him as a man, and leaves him emotionally and psychologically vulnerable even as the vultures circle, whether that manifests as the machinations of the Small Council or his own Hand sending Alicent to 'comfort' (holy euphemism, Batman!) the king in his greatest moment of emotional vulnerability.
I think you left out one very important thing. Forced or involuntary medical procedures "in those days" (and not that long ago for us) have a lot to do with pain. Aside from medication, pain can have serious adverse effects on decision making. I see many of your commentors wondering why she wasn't part of the decision making. Being confronted with her own death and what she's about to endure towards that death would probably be far more terrifying than what she experienced.
It was a heck of a scene, I'm not sure I would have made it through it if it hadn't been broken up by the fight.
Pretty good reaction!
Yes true point
It didn't sit well with me that he didn't prepare her. But given the context of the fantasy historical setting, I can excuse it. But damn, it pissed me off but I kept watching. It kinda highlighted for me that he's just not king material. Yet the actors involved really brought that event to life and it made me think of our current situation today that _some_ people still don't know that communication in a case like that is vital. I'd imagine the pain would be slightly less if he had _told_ her. With the little time we had with his wife I think she would have said *yes* because after 4 or so unsuccessful attempts she could have gone out knowing they were most likely successful. But lastly, I love this show!
You're giving Daemon far too much credit. Just look at how he responds to this. He throws the mother of all temper tantrums and nearly ends up starting a war just because he wanted to shou "Look at me! Look at me!"
He's a pathetic, one-dimensional narcissist.
Being a hopeful father - the thought of having to choose between my wife or my daughter is NOT good, so definitely can relate. How would I have chosen? Hell if I know. You COULD make the callous comment that "with your wife alive you can make another child", or "you do not know what that kid is gonna grow up to be, but you know who your wife is.", but I believe those ignore a LOT of aspects, such as how you were looking forward to raising that kid together, see them pick up your habits and hers and then tease her with the "That kid is SO you..." and vice-versa. This is kind of like if someone said "we will now tear off your leg without anaesthetics, but do not worry - you can get a cool prosthetic out of titanium..." - hardly a comfort, is it?
I doubt he had time to send for a second opinion or scroll through web MD prior to this hard decision, he acted on the information given.
The bad decision he made was not beheading Daemon right then and there.
People got to emotionally attached to this as Viserys was a common person. He is a king whither it was right and wrong he could have done it any way he wanted. People call him but to do nothing and allowed both to die would have been truly week. He had to choose whether with consent or not the pain would have been the same
This Grace had a dream of having a boy. He share that with his wife in the bath seance that the prince will be honored. The Targaryen have prophetics dreams into the books so he choise the heir over this wife. So sad that the honors was for this cremation.
There is no way daemon was being respectful