America's Rural Veterinarian Crisis Strikes Our Farm
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- čas přidán 27. 10. 2023
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Gold Shaw Farm
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Peacham, VT 05862
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Vet here - The rural veterinary shortage has been an issue since before I graduated 13 years ago. Unfortunately it will likely continue to be a problem for quite some time, even with the addition of more veterinary schools (I believe we have at least 3 more getting accredited in the near future). There is also currently a shortage of companion animal veterinarians in many areas due to the boom in pet numbers during the pandemic. Couple that with a large number of vets leaving the profession, or at least practice due to the increasing abusive behavior of clients it's been tough for many clinics.
You're what we call a "unicorn client" - you are willing to seek care and do what's necessary for your animals, and understand that that care can come at a cost. I've noticed every time I've seen a video dealing with veterinary care you're also quite practical which I appreciate. That is sadly quite rare. Veterinary care is expensive to provide, especially right now, but we often have clients expecting us to do it for free or at a substantially reduced cost (below what we spent to provide it) and if we don't do that they review bomb clinics, get friends to call in and hold up the appointment line, and downright harass staff. That, in addition to the compassion fatigue from dealing with sick/dying patients most days has come with a hefty suicide rate as well.
You mentioned salaries of $70k - that's essentially unlivable for most veterinarians, even in a low cost of living area. The average new graduate comes out of school with a debt of $150k, but it isn't unusual to be over $400k. My husband was at $280k, monthly loan payments alone were $2500/month. So we come out of school with the same debt load as a physician, but often make less than half starting out, and our income potential is closer to 1/3 a physician's over our careers. We get loan forgiveness programs dangled in front of us, but anyone who has done their research has seen them come and go, often at the worst possible moments for vets.
I don't have an immediate solution, unfortunately I don't live in the area so don't have specific contacts, but I can do some digging and see what's around. For long term, if people would write to their representatives, urge not only the pass but FUNDING of bills to assist rural veterinarians with their massive debt load, that could alleviate a large issue. Finding ways to reduce the cost of veterinary school would also be a massive help. Programs that cover portions of one's tuition with the promise of serving a rural area for a specified time may also incentivize new vets to the area.
I appreciate you talking about this topic - it's something we've been dealing with for quite some time, and bringing it to a platform like yours is helpful to increasing awareness, especially among laypeople.
Thank you for taking the time to write all of this out.
It’s insane that veterinary school costs half a million dollars. Tuition costs have gotten to the point of absurdity. We need to allow students to get medical licenses by just passing tests and internships.
Vet care in the food chain is a national security issue. Your professional organization needs to speak about it as such. No meat or dairy means children who won’t qualify for military service (Nat sec risk there) and potential unrest and violence. (Another Nat sec risk - I can keep going with them)
I know 4 pre veterinarian students that can't get accepted to veterinarian schools, staffing the universities is another issue and that limits students allowed in. All these students come from rural backgrounds and want to serve rural America, but, even with the grades can't get into the veterinarian schools in the NW.
@@elizabethclaiborne6461 I don't disagree with you - I work in federal service for foreign animal disease diagnostics. I've seen the numbers on food insecurity if we lose even a part of our animal agriculture industry.
Unfortunately our professional organization can't manage to put together a coherent website, let alone a position statement that actually advocates for us. The AVMA has disappointed me numerous times which is why I'm not a member. Once I'm more settled in my current position I may try to become active again so that I can push positive change.
As for the preg checks, maybe you could coordinate with other cattle farmers in the area and make an arrangement with a vet that lives further away to do all of your cattle in one trip. If there's enough to do for several days one of you could host the vet and the rest share the extra cost of having the vet travel to you.
That's a great idea!!!
Excellent advice 👏👏👏
Brilliant!
Or you can do what they did in the past.... remove the Bull at the proper time know that you will be having babies in the spring, with a cut off date :)
My wife was a vet tech for 10 years and recently left the field due to increased work and stress but not an increase in pay.
Same. I have a 4-year college degree in Biology with two more years of training to become a Certified Vet Tech (on top of 5 year’s experience as an assistant) and I’m expected to work for $13-18/hour and often with NO BENEFITS 😳😳😳. That’s why I retired from veterinary medicine….and that was just SMALL ANIMAL clinics
When choosing a field of work, always choose one where you can work for yourself
@@1337farmwell, no, just be aware of what the pay is when you enter school.
I’m having the same issue but a different field of work! I can’t leave due to financial issues in my life, but probably going to go somewhere else to work. It’s been more stress and not enough pay it’s ridiculous 🤦♀️
That is an outrageous pay scale for that much training.. I don't get it. Vets around here are charging way more than they used to. Are they just not passing on the profits to the help? Or is it malpractice insurance costs? Or are they putting all their profits into high tech stuff like xray machine etc? @@kestrel4294
Some communities have pulled together to provide a package deal/contract with a vet. The package is a house, 4-wheel drive truck, and a clinic to get the vet up and running. The contract is for a certain number of years with different types of perks.
I like this idea. Villages in UK used to pay costs for a doctor's training in return for a minimum number of years of practice in their village afterwards. Why not similar deals for Vets?
This was exactly what I was thinking. They could also help finance a vet through school with a commitment to work in the community for a specific number of years. Of course, you might be in the continuous cycle of training and breaking in new vets and probably would need a continuous funnel to fill future needs. Also, one veterinarian is probably not enough, you need a team.
This is a great idea! I would hope, though, that
A) The vet is treated well during their stay (aka. Not bullied into providing services at an extremely cheaper rate because the farmers paid for their schooling.)
B) That both men AND women are given an equal chance to fill that position. I've heard of many female livestock vets being treated poorly because some farmers feel they can't do the job. You know...the old "boys club" view that some farmers have.
Otherwise this is a wonderful idea.
That is a great idea!!!❤❤🎉
University of Vermont School of Veterinary Medicine, have them come out and turn your farm into a teaching farm like teaching hospitals. They bring the Docklings, Doctors with short lab coats to learn about large breed animals and get an idea of how a eco responsible farm operates.
Pam here….for profit colleges and exorbitant tuitions are forcing people out of the professions. Some communities are ‘banding’ together to pay for a student’s tuition in exchange for working in their community for so many years.
This is my thought as well!!! A community could pay college costs in exchange for a 10 year commitment.... for the right student/person.
My daughter is a vet tech and was a office manager at a clinic in a small town in Oregon, the practice was very busy since it drew clients from a huge area but the owners shut the clinic down after struggling for the last two years to keep vets on staff, no vets wanted to work out that far from bigger towns. My daughter now has to commute 45 minutes to a city vet clinic and she lost her office manager position she had worked so hard for and her and the whole rural region now has to drive 45 minutes to see a vet for their animals.
people raised their children with freedom to not maintain or take care of the place they grew up.
You start to see how society pays for letting children grow up "free".
Remember how children been raised to get educated and move into the cities... Education means no physical labor, meaning no vets, only graphic designers.
America isn't gonna change their definition of freedom, better get ready for life without vets.
Want a change? raise the children with more self preservation in mind.
Alot of people stiff vets.
As someone who has worked in a Vet office for most of my career, I can tell you one of the big reasons most DVM's don't want to do large animals is the simple physical risk. One of the Vets I worked with started his career with large animals and 5 years in he had to have back surgery from an on-the-job injury. He left large animal care and became an avian specialist. According to him, very few Vets retire still doing large animal care unless they work for corporate farms that can afford to have million-dollar safety equipment.
Same with farriers! I do not envy that job.
@@kanek0yuki my father saw some really bad kicks from horses while in vet school. A local farrier was forced into retirement and onto disability after a kick to the head. I have so much respect for those that work with large animals as it can be dangerous.
As a vet assistant, csr, kennel tech and surgery assistant, I work almost all areas of our small general practice in Alaska. My pay Is a whole $16.50, and that's with 2 raises. We can't keep techs because there's so much stress in this field. The saying is "we don't do it for the money, we do it for the animals", but even for us, love isn't enough. We need money to survive away from work, and when work becomes your whole life, burnout if too real. I asked someone if they wanted the h3n2 (flu) vaccine as they were going to lower 48, she stated "so your telling me to get a vaccine just because there's an outbreak", she later became rude to the doctor.. all after asking if she would like her pet to be protected as we don't see the flu much in Alaska. Not even required, just recommended. But yet, even trying to help and educate can be met with a rude interaction.
⁹
yeah I guess people are a bit sensitive about vaccines
There's a similar crisis in Australia as well. Vets and Vet techs have high rates of burnout, anxiety, depression and, ahh the S word youtube hates people saying. A lot of it comes from the stress of being verbally abused by clients, sometimes times even physically. Also there are vet shortages in rural areas as well, which have an effect on agricultural areas in the same way Morgan is being affected. There is definitely a shortage in large animal vets and ones who will see farm animals.
Do most animals recover from the flu after a week or two?
Work in 5 ERs. People are NUTS
I grew up on a dairy farm and I do not remember seeing a vet on the farm once. My Dad and I did all the things a vet is usually called for. Calf pulling, Prolapses, cuts and punctures. We lived on a lake and the cattle drank from it. It was a good fishing lake and twice, we had a cow that had sucked a daredevil in, that got stuck in the back of the throat on the tongue. My Dad put a 3 inch pipe in it mouth to the point of lure and held the cow still. I had to reach through the pipe and yank out the the treble hook. I was 8 yo the first time and 10 the last time. My arms were small enough to fit through the pipe. So yeah, if you don't have a vet, can't afford a vet or it was more expensive the value of the animal. You did all the vet stuff yourself. We did a C-section on one cow and I learned how to put in stitches for the different layers of tissue. The cow and calf both were fine, but the cow was culled later. Old farmers are a good resource for vet problems.
As far as preg checks. My dad knew when every one of his 100 cows came in heat and would separate them out for time with the bull their next cycle, when he had a group of about 10, because the bull would successfully cover that many. So about every month (except January and February) we would have 10 new calves. As a year round dairy, this meant a continuous supply of milk cows. And not breeding January and February meant there were less milking in (September, October and November), which was harvest season. Just a blast from the past.
Honestly, I wonder if a Co-Op might be the way to go. If you could perhaps get several farmers together to contract with a large-animal vet to "make the rounds" once or twice a year to do the "routine" care. Wouldn't necessarily solve the "emergency" issue, but at least it'd take care of the routine matters.
This is the way.
That was my thought. A somewhat larger co-op could try to attract a vet for full time on-call care with an attractive guaranteed salary.
This is such a great idea!
Do your best to pick some of those skills yourself. It’s what we’ve had to do here. My husband trims hooves, I take care of abscesses and lesions. I do vaccinations and we both take care of injuries. You can do this. Don’t give up. Keep the information coming and never give up. I’ve even helped neighbors to pull a calf and we’re in our seventies. We stand with you from Kansas. Part of the problem is that the large animal rural DVM’s came from farm backgrounds. There are fewer and fewer now. It’s easier to make money taking care of dogs and cats.
All the best to you and your husband. You are a vanishing breed.
Oh yeah, that IS the subject here.
I believe that Morgan is up to the task. Perhaps there are dairy farmers nearby
who will teach him to check for pregnancy the old fashioned way.
Exactly. I learned trauma care and animal care as a kid.
That is the best answer. Do the vaccines yourself. I use to have horses and I did the vaccines myself.
This problem has been cooking for years and we (in the veterinary community) have been warning everyone that this was coming! Keep in mind that vet med is weird. New vets come out with an average of $150k in debt, and often can’t qualify for loans to buy their own practices. So they have to work for other clinics as they pay off their student loans and try to build clientele. There’s also laws in the US that ONLY allow licensed veterinarians to own/operate a veterinary clinic. So the number of people who can be directly involved with financing, owning and operating a veterinary practice is highly limited.
Morgan my next door neighbour here in Canada used to be a member of a Scottish Highland Cattle Association in the U.S and is a highland expert.He is probably one of the smartest most well connected dudes I know and I bet he can help❤ If I recall you’ve got an email around somewhere? If not I’ll tell him to comment in this thread
click on his icon it takes you to his home page. here click on about, scroll down for email address
I live in Western Montana and our very large county has never had a vet (not even for dogs and cats). Up until two years ago we had one vet clinic 65 miles away that serviced dogs and cats and also had a large animal vet that would make house calls for livestock. The large animal vet retired and sold the practice to the small animal vet who worked for him. Within 6 months she closed the entire office and moved. Now our closest dog/cat vet is right at 100 miles away (some to the west of us and some to the east). There are no livestock vets in either location who will come to our county at all. Needles to say a two hundred mile round trip for even non-emergency vet care is daunting for many people. As a result we have a lower percentage of animals who are getting their very basic needs met, such as rabies shots and spay/neutering, It's a recipe for disaster. Over the last 40 years there have been a number of times our county has tried to entice a vet to open an office here and the results have been zero. Over those years not one single vet has even considered it, just a flat 'no'. In addition, our area is considered a prime vacation spot so it's not like we are asking vets to move to an ugly, nasty spot. It has always just baffled me that no one will even entertain the idea....yet here we are, vet-less.
@kubdanukker1564 - Maybe your county's farmers should consider doing a deal as in the "Northern Exposure" TV show. Provide the clinic, staff, home, healthcare benefits, appropriate vehicle and a good salary. Handle the finances on a cooperative-type basis. Each farmer pays a monthly or annual fee based on the number of number and type of large animals.
Perhaps allow the recruited vet to care for small animals (meaning pets) as a side business as long as large farm animals are first for appointments, etc. In other words: The salary and other benefits are for taking care of large farm animals with no other owner charges except for vaccines and drugs (maybe supplies, too). Time permitting, vet has a small animal practice for which normal charges are billed to the owners.
Whoa! That situation is very serious for farm animals nationwide and has an impact on the food chain for all of us.
Kind of, the places where the vast majority of food comes from arent the ones who are struggling to find vets tho.
Potentially, but places with tons and tons of animals don't do vet stuff regularly for all of them anyway lol. Just at birth and before slaughter. It's really only an issue with small to medium size farms
@@colamity_5000 Feed lot finished cattle?
@@tomorrowhowever7488 its not about the stage its about the quantity. If your calving 500 head/year your gonna have a vet available to you. Smaller farms not so much. If your a real ranch with thousands of head its not even a question you'll have a vet. The feed lots with 10s of thousands of cows will have full time vets I imagine, though I've never been a part of an operation that size.
@@colamity_5000 There are co-ops for other things; why not veterinary service? For a fixed fee per each of so many operations under a certain number of animals, the whole co-op hires a dedicated vet?
Maybe your local farmers could form a co-op and recruit vets graduating from Veterinary school?
That sounds like the ecologically friendly thing to do too.
Hey Morgan! As someone planning to become a vet, I completely hear what you’re saying about the situation. There is a huge vet demand not only in the US but all around the world, and it is only getting worse. These days, you are statistically more likely to get into med school partly due to the lack of vet universities globally. I specifically want to work with wildlife, exotics and maybe general large animals… which would be difficult as there are not many countries that support international students, have the right facilities and can actually expose those students to the right animals. Your animals deserve the right medical treatment, and it is terrible that they can’t receive it. The government in the US might be trying to find solutions, but this problem is everywhere, and vets who do want to work with the exciting animals tend to prefer places with more exotic species, like Oceana, Africa or Asia. Or zoos, for that matter. It isn’t just about jobs, either. Vets who want to do good in the world are less enticed by helping animals that will be slaughtered for meat anyway, even though they are just as alive as any other creature leading up to that moment. Also, many friends who find out about my career goal immediately take a discouraging stance, whether it be incessantly mentioning putting down pets or telling me the vet suicide rate is 3 times higher than any other medical field, it all adds on to the pressure of becoming a vet in the first place. What needs to happen is a change of mentality more than a change in politics or money. Instead of getting angry at vets for potentially high fees, people need to consider the costs that are factored in to it, for example. Vets are not even that financially stable in the end. A family member earns more than ten times the amount as a general surgeon than they ever did when they practiced general veterinary surgery. I am one of the very few people who are willing to take on those responsibilities, but so many more people turn away from the field because of these bigger issues.
As a reptile person, the lack of exotic vets has been going on for quite a while. Maybe even decades. I would think you would be able name your price to care for exotics. The demand is only growing.
I applied to Onderstepoort Vet school ( S Africa) in the 90's and the story was exactly the same. During Covid a friend of mine who was a Vet joined me in a Covid lab instead of Vet work as she didn't want to deal with constantly putting dogs down.
I think people
This is spot on. I am studying as well to but to be livestock nutritionist rather than a vet. There are not many people studying in the field.
@@daggaboom I have heard of vets who carry out pet e---------s who have a ritual for it, as a candle lit at the desk. That sounds like a respectful thing to do and one that makes the necessity more meaningful, at least.
My small community is dealing with this as well. It’s come down to a few vets going back to school to become large animal vets and farmers having to pack up their animals and bringing them to town to get care except in extreme emergencies. Most farmers are being trained by vets to handle things like bloat, pulling a struggling calf, having certain medications on hand now that the vet could only have, and video calls to talk you through what to do if the vet is in a different town an hr away
I am 72 years old. My grandfather had a farm, I learnt to treat ringworm hoof rot , sprained legs and do dressings when animals got tangled in fence wire. The big dirty job was pulling a breeched calf, after you went up and got a rope on with one hand while up to your shoulder in a cow. We could not afford a vet even if you could get one. The problem is not new. If you are gonna have animals you must be a Dr as well.
@@jimputnam2044 Good point, I remember Pete from 'Just a few acres farm' saying he does all the routine procedures himself as well. In fact I think he said he hasn't had a vet on his farm in several years.
The lack of veterinarians if affecting urban areas as well. My 24 hour ER clinic had to go to 8 AM - 6 PM urgent care just because they lost enough vets where they coudn't cover all the hours. The pandemic was honestly BURTAL to the profession, plus the suicide rates for vets and techs are some of the worst in the country.
A big issue with the vet shortage is that it's not only extremely hard and expensive to become a veterinarian but veterinarian's get payed much lower in then doctor's even though their jobs are just as hard and important.
And they're treated with less respect.... or even humanity.
I think you should stick to highlands or highland-hybrid cattle. They seem fantastic for Vermont. And just super cute of course. That's my vote!
Although we are not as rural as Gold Shaw Farm, there is a lack of farm vets here, too. The vets that are here are hard to get appointments with. They are in such high demand. My daughter has decided to become a farm vet. I hope more young folks will want to choose this career path.
As someone who's lived in rural Iowa much of my life, I feel like so many people are completely unaware of the issues like this faced by farmers, but which inevitably impact us all. I don't know of any solutions to the vet shortage, but I wanted to thank you for helping make others aware that it exists.
Also, while I have zero expertise with larger farm animals and their needs, as a trainer of working dogs I can offer a bit of input on Abby dog. I know I've commented before a couple times, but I just wanted to say that Abby did amazingly well in this video. I'm glad to see you putting her in the pen with the chickens again, since it's still a bit early to move on to having her with them outside the pen. What I saw in this video is *exactly* what you want to see her doing during this stage of her training.
When you let the birds out of the building, Abby watched them but not in a hyperfocused way. There was no lip licking, no stiff body language, no taking quick steps towards them before stopping herself. Just a calm, cool reaction of, "oh, there are chickens coming out of that building now - neat." And then she did the best thing you could hope for. She laid down and basically ignored the birds. Give her a couple more weeks at this level of training, and once you're seeing this type of behavior and zero increased, inappropriate attention to the birds from Abby every single day for that period of time, move on to the next step (which would involve you observing Abby and the birds outside the pen, where the birds are more likely to run).
Seriously, I cannot overstate how impressed I am with your level of dedication and patience when it comes to training Abby. If only every dog owner were the same way! Kudos to you on the incredible progress you and Abby have made. Give Abby a few extra scratches for me (Toby too, of course!). What a great pair of dogs.
I have generations of veternarians in my family. My grandfather's vet school costs 72,000 dollars a year now. Add in the fact that vet school is becoming harder and harder to get into, even in some cases harder than med school and its a poor outlook for vet students. Many vets I've talked to recommend prospective students go into human medicine instead these days.
72K A YEAR?!?!?! WHAT
That was exactly the advice I received.
@@rpemulis Yeah that's the problem with all this 'Collage debt forgiveness' and 'government financed schools'.
Not to mention the overregulation of the medical profession in the US regardless of patient type.
See the collages figured out that they could double dip by accepting all the grants that the government was giving them through the students who get 'free' collage and then increase tuition accordingly.
Combined with the standard inflation and well... the same greedy behavior attributed to 'Capitalists' is actually far more prevalent in our Academic Institutions. This means that tuitions prices are hiked up BECAUSE of government interventionalism in spite of the money trying to be used to bring the costs down.
They'll try to justify it by claiming campus improvements or increase pay for teachers but since US Medical Regulations put a hard cap on the number of students per class in any medical field, that money just instead goes to pay for useless fluff degrees like... well... all the political correctness stuff. Collages can't even increase the number of classes offered. There's a hard cap on that too.
And THAT nonsense was implemented because people started crying about how the Government needed to regulate the Medical Industry to solve the quality of healthcare. Hard capping the class sizes was to ensure that the students were getting a quality education to prevent medical mishaps.
So I have no hope in Government trying to solve this problem ether. The next logical step would be to start assigning people to these jobs in lottery style.
@@rpemuliswhere I went for engineering is now 70k a year it's basically 20k more than 10 years ago. I think lots of people don't understand how expensive it is to get good degrees from prestigious schools (obv ignoring the fact that it's not necessary for many fields). Kids get tossed around between "get a real degree/job", "you have to go to college", and "it's your fault you're in debt" when school prices are actually completely unrealistic for most people to afford.
This means the school where your grandfather studied? Or a school that he owns or is in an executive position at?
You said it. Vet school graduates with loan debt are going to take the higher paying positions and those are probably not going to be in rural communities
There is a national vet crisis on every level. As someone who has been a vet assistant for 16 years, it's damn depressing. The angry people who don't understand why we can't get them an appointment for weeks, especially for new clients, and the anxiety and sadness as we call multiple referral centers/emergency care trying to find somewhere for a critically ill animal to find we have to send people farther and farther away to find somewhere that isn't at capacity. And us being booked out for appointments and surgeries, because we went from just under 10k clients to now over 12k and we only have 4 doctors, and who knows how many pets are spread out between all our active clients. It's frustrating and we are burning out from trying to accommodate as many patients as we can. 😭😭
What you do Morgan is get in good with a old homestead farmer . On my farm or 5 generations we do all our own vet work . Pregnancy checks are unnecessary because in the spring it will be what ever it turns out to be . But the majority of injuries and shots can all be treated by the farmer .it just seems more overwhelming then it really is . Diagnosis of animals is in the books .
True, but many medications that used to be available at your local farm store are now available with a vet prescription only, and most vets (for liability reasons) won't prescribe without seeing the animal. Makes it tough to do your own care sometimes!
Here in my part of rural AZ we have had that issue for years. Too many vets specializing in high paying stuff; almost none of them are going for the general practitioner route. And yea a lot of them don't want to live in a really small town. That said I have dairy goats and have to do all of my own vet type things because there is not a single vet within 100 miles that will come to my place. So I read A LOT, consult with other knowledgable owners and hope for the best. I can do a lot of things and have an RN friend that could help with an IV or sutures if needed, tho I could handle sutures myself, just without a vet there won't be any painkiller meds.
Have you ask a veterinarian school about either having students come out and learn, or asking if they recommend any good practices around your area?
Here in Rochester we are losing our last 24 emergency vet because of a corporation that has bought all the vets up in the area and ruined them. The nearest one left will be all the way in Buffalo. It's a nightmare.
At least you got a letter and a correspondence from your vet . Much more than i received when my interval medicine vet did. they just closed the internal med. dept. and the vet moved away. i found out when i called to get the test results for my dog. And was told they no longer will be servicing us.
That’s a terrible way to treat your clients. 😮
I’ll always regret that I didn’t go into veterinary science -I graduated in 1969 and was told by my resource teacher that Cornell university only accepts two vet students a year and NEVER females!!! Was a different world!!
I graduated hs in 1965 and the recruiter from Washington State University that I would not be accepted to vet school was that I was a girl and would only get married and waste the time and degree. I was really mad. Let us in.
In New Hampshire, My vet married his assistant doubling our vet availability. The new wife became our vet. She spent a whole day working with us on a sheep that domestic dogs had attacked. That ewe ended up having twins the next spring.
Maybe reach out to the University of Vermont - they have a vet school and see if they can either recommend someone or perhaps set up a teaching program to take the students out with a vet to see how it's done. It could be something that could be set up on a regular basis so the students get hands on experience? Worth a shot!
The best vet I had when I lived in Iowa was a husband and wife team who did small and large animal practice out of a barn on their property. They were getting older, so I imagine they will retire soon, which will be a real shame.
Consider a farmer's collective with all your local livestock farmers, so farm vet can come for a visit to your area once or twice a month for regular checkups.
My local vet (many beef cattle in the area, plus horses) has sponsored a vet school student, in exchange for a number of years in his practice. It’s a win/win for the student and our community. I know that the Mars corporation (Banfield Veterinary Hospitals/clinics) has sponsored a huge number of students, but they’re just for small animal practices. At the end of their commitment, they’ve got no large animal expertise. If there is a grange organization in your community, you might be able to coordinate a vet to come in for special clinics, but that won’t help for emergencies.
Friend of mine has a LARGE animal rescue. Lots of acres of land with a few homes on them. Had a large animal vet that was willing to live on the property and open their shop. Now that Doc cares for the large animals and dogs/cats on that rescue as well as a TON of rural people nearby. Nice set up for all involved and vet seems busy, but happy.
When we bought our farm 11 years ago, I verified that there were "livestock vets" in my area, and there were 5 listed within 1 hour of our home.
When I was gifted sheep and tried to make an appt.for a health check, I found that for 4 of the 5 ..when they said "livestock" they meant horses. The 5th one only saw sheep every 5 weeks and that was to the tune of $300-$700 per animal.
And try to get a shearer for only a few sheep.
Or better yet, an appt to process pigs.
Boy, The things you do, that you wish you never had to.
Sincethose early days, I have learned to suture, dress, and maintain care for deep lacerations on pigs, sheep, chickens.
I have set broken bones.
I have turned breech lambs, evacuated dead lambs, castrated and slaughtered pigs, and castrated ram lambs.
Sheered 150 lb sheep and trimmed hooves.
And preformed necropsys (sp) on more animals than I care to recall, and I have become the crazy lady who will come and cull or doctor birds for people.
While we are in the farming area, we are not super rural. 30 min from Philly.
This problem is real and getting worse.
Thank God for youtube and the internet.
Thank you Morgan for all you do.
Greatest love for you being honest on all your struggles and triumphs, it truly takes great strength ❤
Jeez, I hope someone's thanking you too!
Thank you for putting this video out Morgan. I dont know why I haven't been this career besides for that I live in a city now. But it's been my dream for a long time to work with equine, livestock, and other large or even oddball exotic farm animals. You kind of just re-sparked a bit of the passion I have for these guys. I feel i have a purpose, traveling farm vet💪
I grew up on a farm in Iowa and the local large animal vet would come out to our farm as my Mother was a trained vet tech. She would help him which made him more amenable to traveling to our farm to take care of our cows, pigs, and horses. For dogs and cats we would drive into the nearest town for service. My mother cared for our birds with occasional advice from the local farm vet. Not saying you need to go back to school but maybe you can find a vet tech who is interested in farm animals and strike a deal ... you provide a home for them and they assist whatever vet you find.
Our small city in northwestern Ontario is having a “vets in general” shortage. If you don’t have a vet for your cats or dogs the only options are to drive 4 hours west to a small town, or cross the border and drive 2 hours to a small town in northern Minnesota. As much as I would love to adopt a cat I’ve settled with fostering kittens through our local humane society.
Northwestern ontario has an everything shortage
Call Doctor Jan Pohl in Michigan. I met him on a flight. He has to be the most friendly, kind, intelligent vet on the planet. His attitude to a new veterinary candidate and kind words was phenomenal. Im sure he would be a great interview. The best. ❤
Its nice to hear you talking about the future of your herd, and what you are thinking about in terms of genetic variety and in terms of usefulness how you have your breeding setup.
In particular if I were in your shoes Morgan...
1) Keep a registered HL Bull, and work to get unrelated HL Heifers/cows to keep a registered pure line. Would be a source of income down the line.
2) Keep your unregistered HL's to keep a breed suited particularly to your farm going, and not be afraid of introducing non HL genetics such as South Poll, with #1 in the list you'd always have a HL bull available to reinforce those genetics, but your herd of cows could be more diverse and bred towards what you want and need.
3) A line of dairy cows kept to cross with the HL bull. Just another use and diversification of your herd for more uses.
In terms of overall size, I'd be careful with trying to increase the size of your steers too much. The larger the animal the harder it can be to keep on grass for feed, and the more it is likely to absolutely tear up and cause impaction in your fields.
I would love to see you inquire about some South Poll's more suited for northern climates that could then be crossed with your HL bull, those are some great genetics and would lead to some wonderful grass fed beef cows in the future. Some SP lines are more hairy in the winter, and have those nice slick coats for the summer to help with the fly pressure being reduced.
This also maximizes getting the most out of what you already have, a HL registered bull on hand, and a quality group of HL heifers, some with diverse genetics already. IMO those are the bread and butter of what you should be going with for your herd, but it does make sense to keep a few cows and a line going for producing more registered HL in the future, doing this also doesn't really increase your current work load or infrastructure requirements.
Personally I think it would also make a whole lot of sense to get 1-2 dairy type cows for milking that could be bred with your HL Bull or AI'ed in order to produce pure milking cow heifers from time to time. You'd produce steers, keep the cows in milk, and could save the best heifers for future breeding/milk cows, and either sell or harvest the heifers you don't want to keep for future milking and breeding.
If you find you don't want to milk year round, you can let the calves have their fill, and only keep cows in milk when you want. Your pigs and chickens would love all that excess dairy when you do decide to harvest it though. Adding dairy would require more management and a bit of infrastructure to milk and process it, but like I said it doesn't have to be a year round commitment either.
One suggestion if you want to try out the milking thing would be to do it when you have them in the barn pen for the winter like last year when you tries with one of your HL cows. You have closer access to them and it would be a good time of year to give it a shot when you have more time for farm chores. In the spring and summer you can turn the milking cow out and either let the calf have all the milk or let her dry off.
Belted Galloways seem to be a lovely breed, as are Meishan pigs. I think you should take a look at both breeds :) Also, contact a University, go speak to the Graduating class to tell them you have an ideal set up for a large animal vet to get their practice going - work with your County & the Co.'s next door to set up cheap accommodations, maybe get a dealership to logo a Van & donate it to the Vet for advertising while they are working....You Will Get this resolved! 👍🏼🍀❤
honestly if you have Highlands you do not need Belted Gallowyas. Meishand Pigs are nice and it is good that they get a new Hype, but maybe a Heritage Breed would be more fitting.
Hopefully your video will attract a vet to move to your area!
That’s definitely a huge problem. You outlined all the reasons it’s occurring and I would emphasize the fact that if it costs $$$ to be a vet you are definitely going to be where there is an known income. Dogs and cats. Etc. I hope you find a solution soon Edited- I would also add that the vets you need are going where the $$$ are too. Large cattle yards etc not the small rural farms. At least that’s my guess
I feel for you and your animals. I live half a world away in Europe and only have a tiny dog.....but we also have a severe vet shortage. I am lucky to still have the same vet I did 30 odd years ago but when he retires....we have a serious problem. My dog is old enough to be seen the rest of his days by this vet, but it did made me decide to go without any animals until this problem is solved I am without a car and for emergencies, operations and weekend/hollidays I have to travel 40 miles wich just isnt an option in any way....
Its a worldwide thing driven by money sadly enough
This is an issue I’ve been thinking about for a long time, i myself am studying to be a vet, but it’s a tough issue. Often you can’t charge the same kind of prices for livestock since they are raised in large numbers and people can’t afford to spend a gazillion dollars on just one herd member. But at the same time, these areas do still need vets.
Adding to the veterinary issue is the new law about antibiotics being restricted to being dispensed by vets. You have to have a relationship with a vet to get certain meds. Many of the large animal vets just can't handle the non-stop 24-hour calls, either. My first vet gave up after-hours calls and now sends us to Texas A&M Vet School, but they are being overloaded, too. TAMU only has one Field Production vet, and it's a wait list to get her. My equine vet lost several young vets to the long hours away from family. He was one of the few who handled camelids as well, and he dropped camelids to go equine only. There is also the problem of vet burn-out and suicide. One alternative for pregnancy checks is to ask at a dairy if they use an AI tech. My brother does AI on his beef cows (for show calves) and he uses an independent vet tech trained in AI. Or, if a dairy does their own ultrasounds, maybe hire them to come. As far as vaccinations, you can buy them yourself. But you still need a vet to be able to get antibiotics and meds like painkillers.
"Adding to the veterinary issue is the new law about antibiotics being restricted to being dispensed by vets."
Exactly! Seems as though groups of people have an interest in making it harder to raise small/backyard herds/flocks of livestock. Wonder why?
@@cuznclive2236 I understand the issue with restricting antibiotics. We already have too much resistance to wormers for parasites due to overuse. If antibiotics are indiscriminately used, it can cause the growth of superbugs that no antibiotic can handle.
This is crazy and we can't get antibiotics like we use to then no vets available. Please dont feel alone we are facing the same here in Fingerlakes NY.. Horses and dairy cows brings them money is small farms are facing hard times.. stay diligent Morgan we farmers will get through these times..
I have a niece that practices veterinary medicine in the northeast kingdom of VT. Don’t recall the town’s name but know it is near a large lake that crosses the US boarder into Canada. That’s about all I can offer.
When i was a child i wanted to be a Vet, a farm Vet. Sadly i was in special classes, and my teacher told me i wasn't smart enough to be a Vet. Growing up we were told being a Vet was the hardest job. This may be one reason there are so few now.
@--Goldshawfarm- I already know your a scammer, so no surprise.
Even if you find another vet, they will probably be very overbooked so it’s time to seriously hit the books and study animal husbandry and medical care. I highly encourage you to also get help in training your cows to be calmly handled. Waiting for an emergency to see the consequences of not spending the time to gain their trust and cooperation is not the way to go. Good luck, I know how stressful it can be to not have trusted readily available vet care. Luckily we live in the time of Skype and if you can thoroughly examine and evaluate the problem you should be able to find some help out there and save the trailering to vet school hospital for when there’s really no other options.
It’s not the first time I’ve heard about this shortage. We need more vets, dentist and doctors in our rural areas. Good luck
I love that you are so involved with your animals you notice things right away.
Our local vets used to work together to have one of them on call after hours. Now the closest vet if something happens is an hr away. We do have several large animal vets though thankfully. I know my sister works for the department of agriculture out in Ohio. She knows all the vets through her work. Might be worth it to ask your local office and see if they know of the next closest large animal vet.
The vet shortage is a HUGE problem in the US right now & sadly it’s only going to continue to get worse. There are not nearly enough vet schools & the few vet schools we have typically have very small class sizes (usually around 60-70 students per graduating class). Smaller class sizes are kind of necessary in vet school but many vet schools have been markedly increasing their class sizes in recent years trying to increase the number of vet’s but even that isn’t really going to have much of an impact b/c the demand is so high. We need more vet schools but it will take years to finance & build more vet schools. Many vet schools are short staffed too so staffing additional vet schools will also be an issues. Another major problem right now is a couple of major corporate companies are buying out a lot of the bigger practices & they are driving many of the smaller, private practices out of business. In addition to driving the smaller guys out of business, they are paying less & putting more work on their vet’s & vet techs so people are burning out or leaving for easier, higher paying jobs. The industry can’t afford to be losing any vet’s right now!!! The mental toll all of this (in addition to the mentally difficult stuff they deal w/daily) is taking on our nation’s veterinarian’s is causing a mental health crisis amongst vet’s as suicide rates of veterinarians has rapidly skyrocketed in the last several years. They are quickly climbing the ranks to be the leading career of those who are taking their lives. It’s so incredibly sad b/c many vet’s are such empathetic, kind & compassionate human beings!! I’m so glad u did this video to bring awareness the very real issue of the vet shortage in our country.
I've noticed that most vets out here in Iowa won't see poultry. They aren't seen as a valuable enough animal to be worth the appointment slot. There's even a place 20 minutes away that says on their website that they do exotics like parakeets and pet birds, but they said they won't see chickens.
I had a black jersey giant pullet (Laila) that broke her leg in a chicken tractor incident along with one of my young cockerels. The cockerel had to be humanely put down at home because he was in too bad of shape, but Laila had a lot of fight in her. She had a clean thigh break. We called every vet in a 2 hour radius and not ONE would see a chicken. They all kept telling me to just cull the bird because "you can't fix a thigh break" or "it's just a chicken." WELL this was my most promising hen for my breeding program and she wanted to live, so Joel and I set her leg ourselves. We immobilized with some cut and sanded popsicle sticks, sterile gauze, and vet wrap. Today? You'd never guess Laila ever broke anything. She is 1.5 years old with no limp or tenderness. She even became a mama on Easter and her son is my greatest breeding program prospect. Whoever says something like a clean break CAN'T be fixed doesn't know what they're talking about. Find a second opinion. And if they all say it can't be done? Do it anyways.
Best pearl of wisdom i ever received was to spend some time sitting and watching your animals every day to become familiar with ' normal ' behavior so you can clearly see when they are off.
Vets make the same wages they did in the 90s while education costs are up over 2000% since 1992 in my area.
As a horse owner veterinarians could be in very short supply especially during breeding/foaling season, so I:
1. Read everything pertinent so could do the basics as allowed by law such as give shots, clean and dress wounds, take and interpret vital signs, clean genitalia, administer different types of medicines correctly into ears, eyes, nose, etc., assess breeding cycles and pregnancies. Monitor and assist mares during and after foaling, and care appropriately for newborn foal including continually assessing for changes that may be potential emergencies in the making.
2. Correctly stored common emergency medications and had on hand correct equipment for their administration.
3. Correctly got rid of expired meds.
4. Trailer was always on the ready to make the two hour emergency trip to the vet school.
5. When vet was expected animals were always put up, clean and dry and ready for vet. This means corralled efficiently before the vet arrives so that they were ready to be handled (or pushed into the handling system) by me or a well practiced friend and I.
6. Had questions written down and ready.
7. Spent organized and concentrated time on other farms watching and learning new or more advanced skills.
Having a veterinarian for large animals has always been a luxury and a grace from God, never a given.
You've been exceptionally blessed.
Last time I was in VT, I noticed a few Mega dairy farms (which was really suprising- unpleasantly so), and many of the citzen run farms are drying up. I am sure that these Mega's have a vet on contract. I can only imagine this impact on the small farms with large livestock.
My first thought was how about a farmer Co-op approach to sponsor someone to vet all your animals and move to your area. If your surrounding community(s) banded together maybe there would be plenty of work to keep them employed and happy via a contract? Seems like a fantastic area to live in. Best of luck, so sorry this happened. And I was surprised to hear how common this problem is.
A cooperative of farmer, paying together an extra salary to a vet to settle in the area. Extra Salary, a pool of client … just a start of an idea.
We are actually short of every kind of specialized professional practitioners here in Vermont.
Well that's a bit of a conundrum, but maybe someone here has some good ideas, all I can think of is a small cattle truck so that when necessary you can take your cattle however far the distance. I have faith with your due diligence Morgan, if there is a way to fix this problem you will and for the whole community if you can. I love little Rosie, she just wants to be a full time mom and she needs her own space, hope you reconsider her situation. Thanks Morgan for the update, glad your animals are in good health and hopefully will continue to remain that way. See you soon!
So heartbreaking vets n staff have such a hard job you know they don't want to make these decisions good luck finding An amazing vet for your farm ❤
My granddad raised Hertford cows with an Angus bull. Hertford's have a big head. I remember visiting one year and he was so proud of the new Angus bull he'd bought. He also had 12 pigs one year. He called them the twelve disciples. 😂
Try some of the collages or Universitys that have vet schools. We have OSU here in OKLA that will take students and a vet to the farms to learn on big animals.
Good luck, Morgan. It sucks when things we've taken for granted disappear.
I think regarding the cows and breeding, there is a fine line of ending up with a cow that is physically too big for MachoMan to be able to get frisky with. He may would be able to service true Angus or Limousin cows. Just guessing though since I've not spent any time around the Highland cows to have a great idea of how they measure up to other (more common) breeds.
Hopefully the vet thing will work out for you. We used to have someone come in the way you do, once a year for a general check up and such. We found the guy we used through the auction barn we bought and sold through.
There is a shortage of veterinarians across the board. It’s worse in the rural areas but the cities are struggling as well. It can sometimes take you a month or more to get in for standard care. Emergencies usually have to be taken care of at urgent care or emergency rooms (yes animal emergency rooms) where is can cost double or even triple the cost of a normal clinic visit.
Agree--saw a local news station reporting about this recently. Waiting for standard care is one thing but is no consolation when you need a vet now....leaving your only option being one of the emergency clinics, which are costly--all veterinary services are costly. As far as client abuse goes, yes, my vet (who is also a good friend of mine) has mentioned how bad it has gotten. But I feel the abuse part has gotten bad everywhere, not just in this profession. Thanks
It's not just large animals. I'm trying to get a kitten neutered and I can't find anyone. We have a clinic but the next appointment is at the end of February so I get them going to have to take that.
My friend's vet office, here in the Seattle metro area, lost 2 younger vets recently. One left to sell real estate and the other to culinary school.
I've read there is a high rate of suicide for vets (they deal with alot of neglect/abuse, death, etc. and it takes a toll on their mind/emotions) - understandably so...
A lot of farmers in CA seem to be going and getting Vet tech course work because even when they can get a vet on the phone can't always get them to the farm, and can take direction from the vet for a lot of standard care, and vet will give them prescriptions. I keep thinking I need to do this myself, a lot of community colleges have the courses. Just putting it out there in case its useful for you or others.
We definitely feel it outside Portland, Oregon. The most difficult vet to find is one to see my pigs!!! One vet is willing and this vet is wonderful… but most pig clientele are pets. Mine are not! Being a vet is not what most think getting into the profession. It’s a business more than anything else nowadays and livestock vets have to do many things their clients ask that are probably not why they pursued the career. There’s terrible sadness no matter what type of vet… many small animal vets have to see neglected and abused pets and euthanize when they really don’t want to. Horse vets deal with the pressures of performance and big money. Livestock vets have to work within factory farming’s constraints. My heart goes out to them. Ver appreciative of my veterinarians and I hope you can find some soon🙏🏽 They won’t be able to stay away from your adorable cows💚
Contact your former vet and ask for recommendations. Next contact the vet school in your state or neighboring states to ask for a recommendation.
We have lost our emergency vet services due to similar pressures here, and I live in an urban area. We now have to drive (those who are able) at least 90 mins to nearby cities for our pets.
Apparently there is also a company in town that is swallowing up local vet businesses and they are going under.
These are all companion animal veterinarians, not farm animal vets.
The spirit of James Herriot weeps. 😢
Look how good Abby’s doing! (in the pen with all the birds) Good girl, Abby!! She’s so chill.
Not Rosie being the next runaway red. 😂 At least she's going back. 🤷♀️🤣
Anyone else enjoying how Morgan says “hoof”?
Vet offices are proliferating on the UWS in NY. There are three within two blocks of my building.
Unfortunately, the same thing happened in Poultney, Vt, 5 for so years ago the local vet retired and the new vet doesn't take large animals. I've had to learn to deal with most issues myself. I don't have cattle but have goats and many things can go wrong with them as well. Good luck to you!
*I really feel for veterinarians. They are the best doctors. Doctors in multiple dimensions.*
My vet told me something interesting a while ago, when I asked why I was getting the same suggested dose for a common muscle relaxant as my nine pound cat.
She explained. There is a difference between the way different species metabolize some chemicals. Would an MD know that? Well, Dr. W. has to know that!
Veterinarians are amazing - anatomy and physiology like doctors, only for several species, and chemical reactions and interactions that work differently IN EACH, and patients that do not have human language to say what's wrong.
What's the nearest other farm that has Cattle, and who are THEY going to?
Check with other cattlemen in your area and see if they also need ultrasound and things about the same time as you do; perhaps you can find a traveling vet that could come and make several stops in a day
So here is what you do.
You and your neighbors choose a young adult to sponsor to send to Veterinary school. In exchange they serve the community that sponsored at either a reduced or free fee and any other clients get full charge.
Everyone wins. Someone gets an education and everyone gets a veterinarian.
Hi Morgan i would recommend u bring in a newly weaned heifer so that u can get a bit of handling in on them before they get to big to handle it could be a new projekt for spring
I would recommend simmental cattle they are big and bulky with lots of body mad they are different coloured creme and red some with horns some pulled and they are easy to handle if they have been around people,
Even the bulls
Somewhat related to this, everyone should check out the British series "All Creatures Great and Small" about a rural veterinary practice in Yorkshire around the WWII era. There's an older one (70s-80s) and a current one that's in its 3rd season now. Both are delightful, but I'm partial to the old one.
Hurrah for the ducks! sorry to hear you're having vet issues.
Following Rosie to see where she's been going completely reminds me of the Zelda Tears of the Kingdom's Cuckoo quest haha. I didn't know chickens were actually that sneaky.
Chickens are absolutely diabolical and manipulative.
I really enjoy your videos. Not only the fact of you going from corporate America to farm life and your sharing your life with us, But, it’s obvious you do your research and in turn educate us on topics I wasn’t even aware of. Such as the shortage in lg animal care. Your videos are not only interesting but educational. Thanks!
I work in rescue. Vets do not make a lot of money like people think. And the emotional toil and stress is so hard on them. They have a lot of depression and high suicide rates. Our emergency vet services in a major city are almost non-existent and very limited due to vet shortages.
I live in the suburbs outside of San Francisco and we have a shortage of vets too. My dog was sick a few times this last year of his life. Emergency Care meant waiting in your car for at least 6 hours or more before being seen or waiting 3 weeks to schedule an appointment. I think the shortage is everywhere
Department of Agriculture needs to financially support veterinarians for rural areas.
I'm 17 am have been thinking about becoming a large animal vet and this is making me want to go for it
You should explore it! You're young enough and have time.
Hi! I have goats and alot of vets in our area wont touch ruminates with a 12 ft pole. Finding an animal mentor is the first step to providing good medical care. I went on a medical goat book buying spree so I'll always have a reference. As for the preg checks- get a cow stantion thingamajig and draw blood. Learning that skill can save you lots of money. Its significantly cheaper to draw blood and send it to a lab and have them test for pregnancy and other issues. I struggle with drawing blood but sending the blood through the mail is alot easier than i thought it would be.
Love your videos. Very informative.
Thank you Morgan!😅