1000-HP GEN 3 HEMIs-SUPERCHARGERS VS TURBOS (BOOST!)
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- čas přidán 17. 01. 2021
- TORQSTORM, KENNE BELL OR TURBO, WHO BOOSTED BEST? FROM LILD TO WILD, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT BLOWER AND TURBO GEN 3 HEMI COMBINATIONS TO CHOOSE FROM. CHECK OUT THIS VIDEO WERE WE RAN A MODIIFED 5.7L WITH A TORQUSTORM CENTRIFUGAL SUPERCHARGER AT LOW BOOST, A MODIFIED 6.1L WITH A KENNE BELL AT HIGH BOOST, THEN A MODIFIED 5.7L WITH A SINGLE PTE 7675 TURBO. WHICH WOULD YOU CHOOSE?
- Auta a dopravní prostředky
Hemi + boost + ring gap = happiness
Been putting off doing it myself for awhile now. Ready to buy a 6.1 Grand Cherokee and do a twin screw on it but my wife wants me alive.
@@sHoRtBuSseR get late year 392 heads, minor port clean up.
@@sHoRtBuSseRYou know it’s possible to connect the ZF8speed in the Modern Scatpacks and Hellcats with the 6.1l Hemi
@redhunnid5142 you'd need a stand alone system to run it, but you can do it.
Thank you!! I'm rebuilding my 6.1 Hemi in a Dodge Magnum. Been in a pickle on what route to go. I've read all these things on different boosts, but this right here is GOLD. My butt dyno
feels that "torque dip" at 4000-4400 rpm, and that's when a Dyno made sense to me. lol Keep it coming, thank you.
Do a NA 426 stroker.
I love how we're where 678hp is "mild" 🤣
As always, thanks for the hemi content!
Many of Richard's videos just display the specs and data without time spent showing the assembly and runs which saves time for us ole engineering hounds that just want results. Thanks, Richard
Richard the Hemi content is awesome.
Cheers😊
Keep the content coming 😃
Yes!!! Thank you for this video. Now to actually watch lol
insane power down low with the twin screw... but your drivetrain better be up to the task
Dang, that engine in N/A form is NICE! Looking at that torque curve from 3800 to 6800. 3000 rpm of friggin' table top. I need to build one of those because that thing would be a mean little ripper.
Great video!! 🤙🤙🤙
Awesome. Just awesome
Americans like to argue?!? NO WE DON'T!!!! Lol..
Another great video Richard, I'd love to see the hemi builds become more mainstream. For some reason they have a really nice exhaust note. I imagine it is firing order or something.
Love your videos man keep them coming was going to go roots style with my build but I'm going with torqstorm can u recommend a good carburetor please
Probably should mention it's a dart SHP 377 fully forged roller motor with afr 220 heads 630 lift comp cam
What I would love a video on would be boosting a chevy 2 bolt main block studded VS stock .
Finally. The episode I’ve been waiting for.
hmmm i wanna see magnetically assisted gearing on a centrifugal super charger would be cool to see what effect it would have on the parasitic draw
Hey Richard, I'm sure on the engine dyno you go for the glory runs on most of these setups. And I think that's great for drag guys. But for us street guys that want to actually drive the car, and not have it so close to the edge that a tank of not so good premium melts it down. Coupled with typical 165-190° coolant temps, and safe timing with full street car accessories how much less on average would most of these setups make?
I’m going to play this song at my wedding lol
Don't get married. Just play the song.
LOL
Great video
Once you start dialing up the boost don't you want to have lower compression (re: Kenne Bell blower)?
Looking forward to seeing more Gen 4 Hemi stuff.
what would be more suited for the street...and highway use.....?...
Where is the boost comparison chart? Turbo vs SC.
Richard can you doing more hemi contact please
GM has made a lot of factory superchargers that are floating around for us to play with. I would love to see more GM PD blower content. Keep em coming, love your channel.
The difference in the power vs. PSI numbers of the turbo and the blower is - the blower requires more psi to produce the power similar to the turbo( at lower boost) because of the parasitic drag of the blower.
Show us how you make the turbo manifold
Mine is a 6.1 with a Procharger P1SC at 8 pounds. It give me 660. I need more moods, I will put a cam and other things in the future..
Any chance of a turbo back pressure vs blower parasitic drag test at the same boost level to see the power losses vs each other? Pick a turbo and a blower both rated to flow 600 hp maybe? I’m thinking out loud but hey, at least I’m thinking!
Best test is a fuel flow test of both at exact same power output, because that is what matters, right, wasted power at that power level. Whichever uses the least fuel at 700hp is the winnah!
Right on
Also what would be really cool is if you showed us the Cam that you had made backwards with more intake put that in a boosted engine since it lost power NA .would it gain power in a boosted engine ?
it makes less in both
Have you got some vids so we can hear 'em SCREAM? 😁
One of these days you needs to test a real blower like a roots 14-71 or a 16-71 blower
The 6.1 is dope
Centrificalsupercharger + Weastgate? Hi Richard. Is it possible to put wastegate on a SC-system? For example you have pulleys so you got full boost at 3000rpm, and dont want to blow your engine at 6500rpm. Like in a trackcar, full throtllerespons and dont have go worry about "overboost".
Thanks for an exelent channel👍
YES IT'S POSSIBLE
Can definitely be done, although it does make the blower application less efficient since you're still spinning the blower at the same speed. But if you apply a wastegate and a boost controller to a centrifugal setup you can do some cool things. We use it to drop boost for cars that normally run high octane/e85/race fuel and want a safe pump gas map. It can also be used to limit power in lower gears for traction purposes.
Love the fact you run different stuff, 7.3 godzilla coming soon?
Supply a Godzilla and I’m sure he will test it but he doesn’t have one
@@tomcelica I'm poor and race junk, can't even afford one for myself...
@@benjamindixon7571 it was worth the ask.
Can we see a turbo hemi vs turbo ls?
If you could add the dyno run videos to the charts ,that would be awesome.
Otherwise,I really enjoy the videos.
many of these older tests do not have video unfortunately
@@richardholdener1727 cheers.
Richard you’ve seen many engines and have built many of them what is the problem with the hemi design that ends up flattening cams even if they’re stock or aftermarket
I've never had that happen-the lifter/cam myth is from extended periods (hours) of idling in Taxi and Police vehicles I'm told
He almost give a receipt for all kinds of Gen3 HEMIS..
Which engine uses the most fuel at a given HP?
Edit: also, how about very specific-to-the-application cams? (more duration on exhaust for the blown motors, more overlap on turbo cam?)
He's gone over this before in LS videos. His opinion seems to be "it doesn't matter".
It's frustrating to me.
The curiosity of it all.
Richard, do you think it's possible to somehow measure the torque applied to the supercharger? Would be really interesting to see the HP consumed to drive the SC.
yes on a blower dyno
@@richardholdener1727 Thanks! Keep up the great work, your videos are always very interesting!
Hey there!
I’m pat Arnold and I’m looking to turbo my 2019 dodge Ram 5.7 Hemi, what is the minimum of upgrading do I need to do to the engine?
springs, injectors, pump and tune-along with turbo and intercooler
What injectors were used with the Torqstorm?? Loving the power numbers
60s
Do you by any chance know how much more fuel the SC required to make 1000 hp? The boost also shows how much parasitic losses there were for the SC to make near the same power levels. That being said, for a road car or track rat, the SC and it's predictable and more linear curves are better.
the difference isn't all parasitic loss
@@richardholdener1727 It's efficiency too, right? The SC is out of the efficiency island, while the turbo is still in the sweet spot? Did you see any measurable difference in air temps or intercooler temps? No matter the case, boost makes everything better! :)
Turbo made MORE power on 10lbs LESS boost. No belt slip to deal with. No pulley changes necessary to alter boost up or down. Turbo for the win all day!
I love HEMIS...
Torque storm has a smaller pulley as well
Do I need an intake manifold if I’m running a root or twin screw supercharger?
yes-the intakes for roots blowers are usually specific
@@richardholdener1727 ok i was thinking i needed a traditional factory type intake manifold was needed
I'm planning on rebuilding a stock 5.7 hemi. I'd like to make around 700hp or a little more that can be a daily. Is that possible without going forged internals?
I would say no. The early bottom ends were known for breaking after the mods started.
@@jhutch1470 yeah I'm trying to find somebody locally that I can trust. It's a lot of money to risk blowing up
Def possible with forged internals with proper ring gap
Hey Rich, you’ve got lots of videos, do you have any Oldsmobile big block vids?
no sir
@@richardholdener1727 I’m looking to build a 400 soon and wanted to see what an expert running test would suggest. I usually check CZcams on engine upgrades and I always check your vids first
@@richardholdener1727 Keep doing Gen3 Dodge Hemi videos ww love those engines. Specialy the 6.1, 6.2 and 6.4 versions..
How would the hemi perform if it had forged piston?
the same
Richard, how about a test on a turbo LS with & without air filter & muffler.
It takes power to run the supercharger that’s why it took more boost to get same number
Are we seeing the parasitic drag from the blower in the boost differential ?
no
@@richardholdener1727 so the turbo is just that efficient ?
👍
Hey Richard I had a question. I have a 5.7 hemi in my 13' R/T. I want to upgrade to the 392 6.4 but I can't commit to the 40k+ price tag at the dealership. I was looking to do a 6.4 swap.. All I found are 5k+$ understandably. But I came across the 6.4 out of an 2018 6.4 out of a 2500 truck from what I read they are not the same as the SRT 392 made more for torque with 5.7 heads and different metals used pistons, heads for durability. But it's amazing deal for a 6.4 with low miles is it worth swapping with some power mods?. It's 3500$ for the truck motor can it be tuned up to 392 srt power?
yes it can
I Calculate about 180hp parasitic loss on the kenne Bell, But for double the power from 500hp not bad
how do you calculate that? KB has actual blower dyno results on their blowers (and others)
@@richardholdener1727 just seen their video as soon as you suggested it. 💪😎, The way I calculated at first was through your 15psi of boost doubling the N/A hp, then adding the additional boost in pounds that 20-30hp/1lb boost and comparing it to the turbo motor that has no parasitic loss, I then subtracted kb blower hp from the turbo hp and equated to roughly 180hp parasitic loss on the kb.
**not too scientific, but that's the best way I can explain it**
What was the timing at 24 lbs. of boost ?
21
@@richardholdener1727 did the turbo combination run the same timing?
Now this is one that the Gen III Hemi Community will enjoy.... Torque Storms aren't the best centrifical S/C's though.
I really wish you did an Apples to Apples comparison with these Hemi's..... 6.1's will always out perform 5.7's no matter what..... Also the superchargers you choose aren't the most efficient for the applications...... Lastly the Cam choice wasn't ideal for Super Chargers. Whiples and Prochargers are a better option...... Turbo's are turbo's they should make the most efficient power period.
These videos are a mash up of data compared from different engines ran at different times for entertainment and loose comparison. It would cost a lot of money to redo these tests for apples to apples comparison with the best of the best in equipment.
"what's the difference... Why am I still talking????!!" Bahahahha
hes just full of hot air doesnt really get to the point
That power difference is probably just the parasitic loss from running the supercharger
16psi vs 24psi at approximately the same power level just goes to show how much power it takes do drive a big blower like that.
Also missing what the final air density was. I'm betting the supercharger isn't as efficient as the turbo as an air pump.
I wonder if the throttle body and intake tube on the kenne bell was a restriction?...
@@MissionRestomod I'd really like to see pounds of air each pumped and boost charts. Superchargers and hemis are just a match made in heaven. I mean look at top fuel cars !!!!!!
not apples to apples either. the engine with supercharger was more powerful and bigger displacement
Is 7000 rmp going to be reliable?
Rpm
NOT FOR A DAILY
Ok thank you. Before I had a sequential turbd ej205 and I missed the revs but the hemi torque is totally worth it
What about a 500hp daily? The awd magnum is heeeeeeavy
But turbos are gooder!😂
Definitely a blower. There's nothing like that massive amount of torque and power right off of idle.
If your launching on 2 step or a trans brake, you can make more low speed torque with the right turbocharger.
@@madmod Yes but that involves revving your engine up, which ain't what I am talking about. I mean very specifically off-idle torque and horsepower. Twin screw blowers win hands down
A big turbo will walk all over that blower at 24 lb of boost. Turbo will make 1300 horsepower and the torque will be all you can handle with an electronic boost controller. 128% increase in power at same boost level equals huge mile an hour difference.
@@PotatoeJoe69 Its not so cut and dry. Some guys have fast enough boost response to reach full boost on their turbo car as soon as it flashes through the converter off idle. Even my auto car doesnt see under 4500rpms other than launch and it goes through first quick. Roots and twin screw still have rising boost curves that dont make peak boost till farther out in the revs unless they are far undersized. Add in the extra parasitic losses driving the supercharger and the turbo car looks even better. This is all pretty strange anyways considering when are you driving wot off idle and or worried about the power right off idle? You never race at or just off idle lol.
@@madmod this just isn't true at all. It takes any turbo a measurable window of time to spool, there isn't a turbocharged vehicle anywhere in the history of everything that can reach peak boost in the time it takes for the convertor to flash.
If you had said the turbo has already reached it's boost threshold by the time the converter is loaded, sure. But peak boost? Nope. No way, no how.
Your transmission and driveshaft may not agree that more boost is a good thing. LOL
Th400 and steel driveshaft is good enough
Blown Hemi, or blown Hemi?
Wait...
Personally I blame squirrels
You always do. Every single video.
About time.....I'm tired of hearing about LS engines
Not gm 👍👍
I want everyone to whine about turbo lag. At the same power, not boost the turbo will have less time to boost on almost every combo. Blowers work and work well without having to deal with the exhaust. All you need is belt access.
Pound/feet not foot/pounds
The units are multiplied, not divided. The statements are equivalent. Torque = radius (ft) times force (lbf)