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Surprise! I used my free FSD transfer for the HW4 Model Y you see in this video, which I will be discussing in future videos. Since FSD isn't here yet for HW4, sadly I am FSDless for the time being. But there's plenty of things to compare, so stay tuned. This video was harder to make than it probably looked. Hope you enjoyed, and please drop a like if you did! A couple things to note about this test: - Although HW3 cameras are 1.2MP and HW4 is 5MP, both are compressed for dash cam footage - No color grading, sharpening, or cropping. Videos are as they left the TeslaCam drive If you'd like to purchase a Tesla, you can save $1000 & get 3 months of Full Self Driving for free by using my referral: ts.la/john27670
Good video I am also waiting for FSDb (paid the 15k) on MYLR2023 right now the car is named KARR because well......let me know when anyone gets FSDb on HW4!
@@alanmay7929I think they are talking about the fact both cars were in the almost exact same positions to show the comparison. I agree, it was very well done and gives a visually great comparison between the two systems.
It's to be expected, it's fair that they use weaker but very available components just for the sake of consistency, using different cameras will result in the AI model having inaccuracies. Now that older but better cameras are so common Tesla can upgrade the hardware and they now have to train a new model for them
It's not as much as upgrading the cameras but upgrading the HW that can process the improved resolution. But larger sensor size and improved dynamic range & color fidelity is what really makes the difference here. And I guess you're right: they could've upgraded the sensors to an intermediate improvement earlier.
@@freestonedoug in cameras there are many factors more important than resolution Phones have 108mp easily but a 6mp dSLR from 2005 takes better pics. There's the lens, the coatings, the processing, many factors that are much more important and in this case it's the processing
i really think the fisheye on the side view cameras will prevent most of the annoying near-death-experiences i have with FSD. certain angles of right turn it will just barrel into oncoming traffic when it was super obvious to a human.
@@23desdfe345r2fd23f23 If HW v4 is needed for legal approval, then Tesla has to do retrofits due to advertised promises. That would take a lot of time and money, but will not cause a problem for Tesla. If HW v3 cars are legally allowed to drive without a driver, then I expect no changes from Tesla.
@@theipc-twizzt2789 a fisheye lens is a semi-spherical dome lens, it can capture light from a much wider field of view even beyond 180 degrees, the disadvantage is that it distorts the image but that can be corrected in software.
Remember that Tesla uses the raw output of the cameras for fsd, so how the variant that is made to be pretty looking looks isn't really that important (for fsd), but one can of course imagine that the raw data has more information as well, so fsd will be able to "see" better with HW4.
Yep! Super important to understand with videos like this. ...And also importantly HW3 cameras are not normal RGB cameras! Obviously HW4 is better but it's hard to assess by properly by an owner if your trying to figure out how it affects FSD.
Good point! Maybe good resolution images of HW4 looks good for human. But it's not same input for FSD accoring to AI day presentation. Nevertheless, I expect that HW4 raw images also good for FSD
I do agree to some extent. But I do think that if they could have made the glare and stuff look as good as it does on HW4 on HW3 they would have. So, the cameras and the rest of the hardware must be significantly better.
Excellent comparison, I know it probably took a lot of work to get the exact same frame at different times with different vehicles. I’m now convinced that FSD will work much better with HW 4.
Great video! And we did the same - traded in our Long-Range Model Y with HW3 (purchased in October, 2020) for a new Performance Model Y with HW4 ... and yeah, FSD Beta is not available yet, but that will just be a small blip in the grand-scheme of things ... I'm confident we'll get back our FSD Beta in the not-too-distant future ... at our local Tesla dealership, I was told a LOT of owners of older Tesla models were doing the upgrade ... and since we only paid $8K for the original FSD Beta, doing the transfer was a total no-brainer! Looking forward to your future videos when you get your FSD Beta restored!
@@AIDRIVR - Agreed ... the build quality of our new MYP is dramatically better ... and the best thing about getting the new car (other than the performance and build quality)? The center console doesn't have that awful piano-black-keys finish! :)
@@appleblows1 - I haven't heard any solid rumors on when FSD will be available on HW4, but I'm guessing it'll be within the next few months (just a WAG on my part) ...
Strange, it is normally because of a slower frame rate, like watching a TV picture the flashing is less likely to be noticed the faster the flash(frame) rate!
@@favesongslist That's because your eyes are capable of perceiving the faster frames to begin with. Here, what I think is happening is the billboard has a low refresh rate or persistence (the duration of how long each frame is displayed), so that combined with a low HW3 refresh rate means it misses some of the frames that are displayed. It's not a problem for higher-refresh rate cameras or human eyes, because we are able to take in all the frames.
I believe higher refresh rates would likely have made it even worse. From this footage, it seems HW4 has longer exposure, which would imply a lower framerate. But since the stored video is processed, there are other possible explanations.
That’s a couple of years of progress in camera tech for you. Wow, thanks for this finally useful comparison and not that kind of useless stuff some other do! Especially the digital signage example is surprising.
Nice to see the comparison. Especially the difference in resolution. The colors are more accurately shown except for greens. For some reason the green looks fake to me. I’m really looking forward to FSD on HW4.
Ha I should have said RGGB. Almost all modern camera sensors have two green pixels, or filters, arranged in BGGR, RGBG, GRBG, or RGGB. This is called the Bayer filter. Tesla must have decided it better to lose the two green filters and gain a better luminance signal.@@RubenKelevra
@@spiderbite7849 it's not a Tesla thing. Actually automotive cameras have a long history of doing this. The benefit is a 3-4 times brighter image with low confident color information. Due to the low confidence it's then usually lowered in saturation in the debayering process, to avoid color noises being unpleasant.
Great video!! My only question is why in the world Tesla doesn’t share this sort of info with us?!?! I’m so afraid of HW3 being left in the dust in the future at this point. It seems there are many major improvements with the newer models.
@@tomsixsix If HW3 cars are not legally allowed to drive without a driver, then Tesla will do retrofits. Guaranteed! If HW3 cars are allowed to legally drive without a driver, then the promise held true. When Elon says no retrofits, he also says that HW3 should be safe enough for legal approval and that it will not be bad, just that Tesla will never stop improving the system even if it is 100x safer than a human driver... If your older than HW3 car will not legally do full self driving, then Tesla will have to retrofit that car as well... For now, Tesla will not spend that time and cash since it might not be needed, but they will have to if hose older cars cannot meet the advertised promise.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 Tesla didn't do retrofits for HW2 so not sure why you believe HW3 will get free computers. I think they will just risk a lawsuit, it's cheaper.
@AI DRIVR THX! Resolution & framerate now allows FSD to read small letter & digital signs - will Tesla implement that? Also, do you think the vastly superior color range & fidelity will improve traffic light detection? I've seen a few recent alarming cases of a red light read as green and the car proceeding, needing an intervention to stop an accident. Plus yellow/red mix-up more often.
Thanks for the comparison. Did you switch the images at 1:01? Looks like the rear camera of HW3 delivers better quality than HW4, what leads me to thinking you accidentally swapped the images.
Great video and very excited to experience HW4 when I pick up my new MY. However Tesla still hasn't solved the b-pillar problem where obstructed view intersections can still be extremely dangerous since the camera is so far back from the intersection. Maybe the new front windshield cameras help with this problem otherwise I have several intersections where FSD cannot safely make a turn. FSD simply cannot see down the road far enough with bushes and trees in the way.
I long thought that at least "A" Pillar Cameras would be better! And 2 in the Front Headlights or near them, giving Side Views, exactly for those Blind Spot situations!
If you gave me access to all of the cameras of a HW3 car and a steering wheel and brake, I'm like 99% sure I could still drive safely even with the bit of extra glare and less resolution. I'm sure HW4's extra resolution and clarity will make up for some software limitations, but I can't see how this is going to be some revolutionary step forward or anything.
Elon and Tesla are definitely planning on older HW cars to be able to legally do FSD. They are not doing retrofits until they know they are needed. Even the really old cars were promised to legally do full self driving in the future... I think Tesla would act instead of getting sued and forced to act, they just have no reason to do the retrofits until they know they are needed for sure.
While the resolution and color improvement is nice, the GLARE reduction may be the biggest improvement in terms of practical FSD usage (i.e. reduced phantom braking when driving into the sun???).
Whoa - I didn’t know the hw4 cameras will have a different aspect ratio than hw3. That rear view wide angle will definitely help backing out into traffic. It looks like you can see almost a full 180deg.
Damn. My first thought was: sure, resolution is higher, but higher resolution has a lot higher compute requirements. Second thought, particularly with the nighttime footage: I'm surprised HW3 works at all
As discussed in some other comments under this video - ai uses the raw output of the cameras. That also includes IR-range which is filtered by recording. In IR mode this camera is very good for night vision, it sees much more than what you can observe from the video.
I'm sorry they need to find a way to shoehorn HW4 into HW3 cars. At a minimum the cameras at least. But I'm sure these images are also the computer as well. Also possibly code differences.
I assume the entire hardware stack would need to be replaced (not least because the new cameras are much higher resolution and the existing hardware may not be able to cope). It would not be worth the cost or time.
Amazing to think they can do much at all with Hardware 3 when you look at the difference, Hardware 4 with AI will be the game changer! Look forward to the next video
I always wondered why the reason for the weird colors on version 3 that made everything look like the 2000 movie Traffic. They seem to have "fixed" it.
I think that’s due to the NOIR (No Inferred) cameras on HW3. NOIR cameras have interesting color reproduction on them but better night time use ability. HW4 either doesn’t use these cameras, which in the night time shots does not make a big difference, or it uses much higher quality NOIR cameras with better color reproduction. One other commenter on this video said the green color looks fake, so this second possibility is possible too.
@@TheStopwatchGodMost cameras have infrared filters. I'm not quite sure what point you're trying to make. Honestly it just looks like lower-quality cameras in HW3. "Colour" as a concept is actually extremely complex and very difficult to get right in cameras, and given it's an AI model that doesn't care about how colours actually appear, they probably didn't feel the need to try to achieve natural-looking colours.
Even older hardware should be able to do it. Nothing has changed in that sense. Tesla is not aiming to stop with "safe enough for regulatory approval", the goal was always to keep improving safety in all ways for all time... HW4 would still be a thing today even if FSD got legally approved years ago with older hardware... If older cars will not be approved for legal self driving, then Tesla will offer retrofits or other solutions. So far, it seems that HW4 is not needed for FSD to get legal approval and so Tesla will not waste energy and money on retrofits.
HW4 feeds look very crisp. However, in terms of computer vision, HW3 is still probably good for a long time. I just wish they would make some workaround LED-flicker mitigation for HW3, if possible. If nothing else, blend several frames together for analysis when flicker is detected.
I would love to transfer my 2018 Red Model 3 FSD to a Model Y with the better hardware, but what if the updated Model 3 and Y models are really an awesome improvement? I would have unbelievable buyers remorse! 😢😢😢
Seems, at least for now, HW4 repeaters to _not_ have a slightly forward viewing angle. But this might be software adjusted, and currently only set to what FSD is using.
WOW. The backup camera’s wide angle alone makes it worth it! I hate backing up and not seeing 180 degrees. I’m sure there will be “cross traffic alert” eventually…
Interestingly the rear camera view is cropped when backing up. You only get the full wide angle view when you remove the footage from the TeslaCam drive
@@AIDRIVR makes no sense! This would save me so many close calls! People don’t wait for you in south Florida if you’re half way out of the spot, they’ll go around you.
Please correct me if I'm wrong: The difference between the two is HW4 can handle higher resolution cameras than HW3. Eventually HW4 will also have high res, front-facing radar while HW3 has none.
It stops at stop signs. People do hours of driving in cities without needing to take over... One miss vs millions of hits and you say it will always miss? Just pure silly.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0Who are these drivers that have FSD driving for hours in cities? Every FSD video in a major city shows that FSD struggles to go even minutes without disengagements.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 i am sorry MAXX, it is not that i am not a supporter of Tesla it is just that i want it to move faster. and it is not me that first said that look at AIDRIVR videos. i am not happy: my parrot avoids obstacles so well with a tiny brain at i do not know how many hertz, low memory and eyes on the sides. and he can fly up and down too so what are they missing? i do appreciate the novelty of Tesla approach with video only, i think it is the right way. it is not hate on my side
@@dancar2537 A parrot's brain is _vastly_ more complex than the AI in these cars, and tuned extremely well for the job. People drastically underestimate the complexity of this task.
@@clonkex i think you are overestimating how complex nature is. that tiny brain is the result of evolution and the knowledge is either sent through genetics or learned. either way in my opinion it should not be so much information stored in it. evolution has not produced a mechanism that is so complex, it does not do that, i do not think so. it just replicates a simple mechanism. transformers are just a crutch in my opinion, we will see in the future how things evolve. do not "mark my words" because i am not certain but nns are working in llms and not that complicated
Cries in non-upgradable HW3. I'm not buying a whole new car for upgrades. It seems like a company that's model is based on sustainability should have retrofits. :(
At the end of the day, it’s a company that needs profits. It is, however, reinvesting those profits to fulfill its mission of transitioning the world to sustainable energy as quickly as possible. Also, buying a new Tesla and selling your old one to an ICE driver gets yet another gas car off the road. Your used Tesla will also be more affordable to folks that otherwise couldn’t have afforded one. That all being said, wouldn’t upgrade from anything newer than a 2021 just for HW4. We’re transferring FSD from a 2019 M3 to a 2023 MY.
If HW3 is good enough to get legal FSD then why cry? If HW4 or better is needed, then Tesla will do retrofits or offer other solutions. Right now, it looks like older cars will be able to legally do FSD so Tesla might just be wasting money on retrofits. Tesla spends a lot of extra time and effort to do the right thing, way above what is regulated. No reason to think they will ask for a lawsuit by leaving older cars without a already paid-for feature. Every time Elon says no retrofits to HW4, he also says older hardware should be able to legally do FSD. He also says that regulatory approval is not the end goal, that safety improvements is the goal and that even when the cars are 1000x safer than the best human drivers, Tesla will keep working on improvements. In crash tests from many years ago. The model S had a 6 times lower risk of bodily damage than the next safest car (a Volvo). Tesla kept making their cars safer anyways! They keep making improvements even when the car is 6x better than the competition!
More and more traffic signs are displayed in electronic version, so I guess Hardware 3 will also be capable some day. Hardware 3 will also be able to have full FSD capabilities according to Elon. I have bought it (with hardware 3), but haven't been able to use it here in Europe.
Based on this, I assume there will be a lot of lawsuits if Tesla does not allow us older FSD purchasers to transfer in the future. I am not financially able to afford to upgrade my Model Y at the moment but will want to do so in the future. I will be on the lawsuit bandwagon if need be.
If the older cars are legally allowed to drive without a human driver, then there is no problem to sue about. Tesla will not spend the money on retrofits unless they know they are needed. So far, Elon is saying that the older hardware cars should be able to legally do FSD when the AI gets to the point where regulators are needed. If you need HW3 or HW4 to legally do FSD, then Tesla will spend the money for retrofits, no lawsuits needed. My prediction, anyways... There would be no reason to fight in court other than to loose more money and Tesla is too smart for that.
Surprise! I used my free FSD transfer for the HW4 Model Y you see in this video, which I will be discussing in future videos.
Since FSD isn't here yet for HW4, sadly I am FSDless for the time being. But there's plenty of things to compare, so stay tuned.
This video was harder to make than it probably looked. Hope you enjoyed, and please drop a like if you did!
A couple things to note about this test:
- Although HW3 cameras are 1.2MP and HW4 is 5MP, both are compressed for dash cam footage
- No color grading, sharpening, or cropping. Videos are as they left the TeslaCam drive
If you'd like to purchase a Tesla, you can save $1000 & get 3 months of Full Self Driving for free by using my referral: ts.la/john27670
Good video I am also waiting for FSDb (paid the 15k) on MYLR2023 right now the car is named KARR because well......let me know when anyone gets FSDb on HW4!
Thank you for this short video! It's full of great comparisons and research and it shows.
TRADE-IN ON AUG 4 FSD 2018 MODEL 3 FOR FSD 2023 MODEL 3, HAD TO GIVE UP SILVER COLOR.
What does it cost to upgrade to HW4 without trading in your vehicle?
@@importon you cannot, buy a new one
Dang this is high quality comparison. Getting the (almost) exact same shots on both vehicles. Well done!
its literaly software update lol
@@alanmay7929I think they are talking about the fact both cars were in the almost exact same positions to show the comparison. I agree, it was very well done and gives a visually great comparison between the two systems.
@@jasonpanosh9579nope
Amazing footage! Subscribed!
what part of 'hardware' don't you understand@@alanmay7929
I'm surprised it has taken Tesla this long to upgrade the cameras. Great video!
It's to be expected, it's fair that they use weaker but very available components just for the sake of consistency, using different cameras will result in the AI model having inaccuracies.
Now that older but better cameras are so common Tesla can upgrade the hardware and they now have to train a new model for them
Considering how much they can do with such limited resolution on HW3, I would say they did pretty well and it kept cost down.
@@HenryLiu7 True, however we are talking about 1.2 megapixel cameras in a relatively expensive car at release.
It's not as much as upgrading the cameras but upgrading the HW that can process the improved resolution. But larger sensor size and improved dynamic range & color fidelity is what really makes the difference here. And I guess you're right: they could've upgraded the sensors to an intermediate improvement earlier.
@@freestonedoug in cameras there are many factors more important than resolution
Phones have 108mp easily but a 6mp dSLR from 2005 takes better pics.
There's the lens, the coatings, the processing, many factors that are much more important and in this case it's the processing
When is Elon adding a breaking bad filter to the camera?
Or God father
You mean the Mexico filter?
i really think the fisheye on the side view cameras will prevent most of the annoying near-death-experiences i have with FSD. certain angles of right turn it will just barrel into oncoming traffic when it was super obvious to a human.
i really hope that even if they dont give us an option to upgrade to v4, we can at least swap some of the cameras out for fisheye
What fisheye?
@@theipc-twizzt2789 I think he means that some of the new cameras were wider angle of view. Fisheye lenses are very wide angle with no straight lines.
@@23desdfe345r2fd23f23 If HW v4 is needed for legal approval, then Tesla has to do retrofits due to advertised promises. That would take a lot of time and money, but will not cause a problem for Tesla. If HW v3 cars are legally allowed to drive without a driver, then I expect no changes from Tesla.
@@theipc-twizzt2789 a fisheye lens is a semi-spherical dome lens, it can capture light from a much wider field of view even beyond 180 degrees, the disadvantage is that it distorts the image but that can be corrected in software.
Remember that Tesla uses the raw output of the cameras for fsd, so how the variant that is made to be pretty looking looks isn't really that important (for fsd), but one can of course imagine that the raw data has more information as well, so fsd will be able to "see" better with HW4.
Yep! Super important to understand with videos like this. ...And also importantly HW3 cameras are not normal RGB cameras! Obviously HW4 is better but it's hard to assess by properly by an owner if your trying to figure out how it affects FSD.
Good point! Maybe good resolution images of HW4 looks good for human. But it's not same input for FSD accoring to AI day presentation. Nevertheless, I expect that HW4 raw images also good for FSD
I do agree to some extent. But I do think that if they could have made the glare and stuff look as good as it does on HW4 on HW3 they would have. So, the cameras and the rest of the hardware must be significantly better.
Also keep in mind that the demo of the FSD 12 that Elon live-streamed was on HW3
Excellent comparison, I know it probably took a lot of work to get the exact same frame at different times with different vehicles.
I’m now convinced that FSD will work much better with HW 4.
Great video! And we did the same - traded in our Long-Range Model Y with HW3 (purchased in October, 2020) for a new Performance Model Y with HW4 ... and yeah, FSD Beta is not available yet, but that will just be a small blip in the grand-scheme of things ... I'm confident we'll get back our FSD Beta in the not-too-distant future ... at our local Tesla dealership, I was told a LOT of owners of older Tesla models were doing the upgrade ... and since we only paid $8K for the original FSD Beta, doing the transfer was a total no-brainer! Looking forward to your future videos when you get your FSD Beta restored!
Thank you, and congrats on your MYP! Build quality has definitely improved over the years, especially compared to my S
Doing the same! Ordered a MY LR 7-seater and transferring FSD from our 2019 M3 LR. Can’t wait.
I also haven’t gotten beta on my 23 mylr. Will we get it soon?
@@AIDRIVR - Agreed ... the build quality of our new MYP is dramatically better ... and the best thing about getting the new car (other than the performance and build quality)? The center console doesn't have that awful piano-black-keys finish! :)
@@appleblows1 - I haven't heard any solid rumors on when FSD will be available on HW4, but I'm guessing it'll be within the next few months (just a WAG on my part) ...
very nice comparison vid, thanks for this
and congrats on the new car, hopefully they will get the FSD package working soon for ya
🤞
Excellent editing as always. I love how the clips match the music!
Picking up my new Y with HW4 on Saturday. Transferred FSD from a 2018 Model 3. I am sooo excited already, and your video made me even more so!
1:24 Notice how HW3 fails to properly display the electronic construction sign, but HW4 can do it no problem. Probably due to a faster refresh rate.
Strange, it is normally because of a slower frame rate, like watching a TV picture the flashing is less likely to be noticed the faster the flash(frame) rate!
@@favesongslist That's because your eyes are capable of perceiving the faster frames to begin with. Here, what I think is happening is the billboard has a low refresh rate or persistence (the duration of how long each frame is displayed), so that combined with a low HW3 refresh rate means it misses some of the frames that are displayed. It's not a problem for higher-refresh rate cameras or human eyes, because we are able to take in all the frames.
@@jeanderbarnicely explained, thanks!
Oddly enough, that means that HW4 is less sensitive to light since it requires a longer exposure, which can result in motion blur.
I believe higher refresh rates would likely have made it even worse.
From this footage, it seems HW4 has longer exposure, which would imply a lower framerate.
But since the stored video is processed, there are other possible explanations.
Great comparison video. Keep up the great work buddy.
ALWAYS HYPE WHEN YOU POST A NEW VID, love the new hardware 4
That’s a couple of years of progress in camera tech for you.
Wow, thanks for this finally useful comparison and not that kind of useless stuff some other do!
Especially the digital signage example is surprising.
it would be interesting to see a comparison in bad weather
That wide angle back up camera is nuts
Nice to see the comparison. Especially the difference in resolution. The colors are more accurately shown except for greens. For some reason the green looks fake to me. I’m really looking forward to FSD on HW4.
HW3 didn’t have a green channel, it used RCCB cameras instead of RGB. HW4 now has RGB. It looks more accurate to me.
That's kinda funny, as the main difference is, that it has two pixels for green instead of none 🙃
@@spiderbite7849 Do we know what sensors are these? They're clearly GS (see flickering)... Sony Pregius S?
Ha I should have said RGGB. Almost all modern camera sensors have two green pixels, or filters, arranged in BGGR, RGBG, GRBG, or RGGB. This is called the Bayer filter. Tesla must have decided it better to lose the two green filters and gain a better luminance signal.@@RubenKelevra
@@spiderbite7849 it's not a Tesla thing. Actually automotive cameras have a long history of doing this.
The benefit is a 3-4 times brighter image with low confident color information. Due to the low confidence it's then usually lowered in saturation in the debayering process, to avoid color noises being unpleasant.
Great comparison video! Exceeded expectations in editing.
(hw 4 is very nice also)
Thank you, a very useful and enlightening comparison
HW3 does have a narrow forward looking cam which sees a lot farther than the dashcam you show here. Not easy to get a footage of it though.
even if that's true, which doesn't seem to be the case with this video, the higher resolution seems to completely negate that
The comparison video we needed!
You could also compare the b-pillar cameras with the Camera Preview feature in the service menu! 🙂
very well done, great editing and music.
Wow !!, just loved it, great comparison video , thank you buddy !
Thanks for making this. I appreciate your content.
What a World class video! Never saw a comparison like this. I expect it took some time and effort to make. Wow!
SUCH a smart video. This information is so useful!
happy u back
Best comparison so far, thank you! You are the best 😙
Just picked up the same spec as you! Traded in my 2020 Model 3 long range and did the FSD transfer. The new cameras are crisp!!!
wow, you could literally use those side cameras for decent rolling shots for a car video! that’s very, very cool
Thank you for your work, best Tesla ai content 👍🏻
Amazing video! Also amazing that FSD even works at all on HW3. HW4 is clearly the path to actual usable, nap in the seat, FSD.
Great video!! My only question is why in the world Tesla doesn’t share this sort of info with us?!?! I’m so afraid of HW3 being left in the dust in the future at this point. It seems there are many major improvements with the newer models.
Incredible what Tesla could achieve wih HW3. Wonder if/how much HW4 will help improve the FSD experience
just wish they hadn't promised every HW3 car would be a robotaxi well before the tech was ready
@@tomsixsix If HW3 cars are not legally allowed to drive without a driver, then Tesla will do retrofits. Guaranteed! If HW3 cars are allowed to legally drive without a driver, then the promise held true. When Elon says no retrofits, he also says that HW3 should be safe enough for legal approval and that it will not be bad, just that Tesla will never stop improving the system even if it is 100x safer than a human driver... If your older than HW3 car will not legally do full self driving, then Tesla will have to retrofit that car as well... For now, Tesla will not spend that time and cash since it might not be needed, but they will have to if hose older cars cannot meet the advertised promise.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0Or they can just stay in beta until all HW3 cars die off.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 Tesla didn't do retrofits for HW2 so not sure why you believe HW3 will get free computers. I think they will just risk a lawsuit, it's cheaper.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 They won't.
Superbly made video, thank you very much! ❤
@AI DRIVR THX! Resolution & framerate now allows FSD to read small letter & digital signs - will Tesla implement that? Also, do you think the vastly superior color range & fidelity will improve traffic light detection? I've seen a few recent alarming cases of a red light read as green and the car proceeding, needing an intervention to stop an accident. Plus yellow/red mix-up more often.
Wow that’s a huge difference! Great video!
It was easy to understand, thanks.
Great video
Nice Video! Please go under Service and compare the other cameras in a stand still also (:
Mind Blowing Difference in Camera Quality!
I didn't think there would be such a big difference reading the digital sign thank you.
We can't really know.
HW3 may be extensively compressing and/or framerate-limiting what is written to the disk.
2:20 HW3 repeater had a revision a while ago that eliminates the light bleed and FOV is slightly more outward.
Thanks for the comparison. Did you switch the images at 1:01? Looks like the rear camera of HW3 delivers better quality than HW4, what leads me to thinking you accidentally swapped the images.
awesome work thanks a lot
Yes YEs YES been waiting for a new video and like the new style.
I own a model y too but at the beginning with the two cars sitting side by side you really have to applaud how good the model s looks
Great video and very excited to experience HW4 when I pick up my new MY. However Tesla still hasn't solved the b-pillar problem where obstructed view intersections can still be extremely dangerous since the camera is so far back from the intersection. Maybe the new front windshield cameras help with this problem otherwise I have several intersections where FSD cannot safely make a turn. FSD simply cannot see down the road far enough with bushes and trees in the way.
I long thought that at least "A" Pillar Cameras would be better! And 2 in the Front Headlights or near them, giving Side Views, exactly for those Blind Spot situations!
If you gave me access to all of the cameras of a HW3 car and a steering wheel and brake, I'm like 99% sure I could still drive safely even with the bit of extra glare and less resolution. I'm sure HW4's extra resolution and clarity will make up for some software limitations, but I can't see how this is going to be some revolutionary step forward or anything.
Elon and Tesla are definitely planning on older HW cars to be able to legally do FSD. They are not doing retrofits until they know they are needed. Even the really old cars were promised to legally do full self driving in the future... I think Tesla would act instead of getting sued and forced to act, they just have no reason to do the retrofits until they know they are needed for sure.
Interesting thought. Would be cool to test exactly that. It should be possible to tap the signals from the cameras.
Wow great comparison!
Wow, what an excellent comparison video. H4 is clearly better in every scenario, especially at night and with sun glare!
thank you for making a sensible comparison 🎉 :)
Wow, what a difference. I just bought my new Model 3 4 months ago, I wish it had HW4.
OK - H4 pictures look sharper but will it affect FSD? I am sure HW 5 will be better than HW4.
Now we need an option to see the B-pillar cameras. I've had instances where the cars are not visible on the front camera since it's at an angle.
This is exactly how it feels getting a new pair of glasses.
There should be an upgrade option. We got our model y just a couple of months ago
While the resolution and color improvement is nice, the GLARE reduction may be the biggest improvement in terms of practical FSD usage (i.e. reduced phantom braking when driving into the sun???).
this is ad material for tesla, great vid! :D
Appreciate it!
Whoa - I didn’t know the hw4 cameras will have a different aspect ratio than hw3. That rear view wide angle will definitely help backing out into traffic. It looks like you can see almost a full 180deg.
Hate the fisheye on the HW4 rear cam but I guess that might save them from having to put cameras on the sides of the back end for cross traffic.
Great comparison of HW 3 & 4. It’s a world of difference!
1:01 The rear camera views are swapped. The Model S with license plate "AI DRIVR" is labeled "Hardware 4" on the right.
Great stuff - would like to know more about the differences between the two as a non-tesla owner but someone who is interested in the topic
Working on that one next. There’s a dark side of HW4
@@AIDRIVR Oh dang, was suspecting that. Is the HW4 infotainment slower?
On the blinker cams, do you notice a greater field of vision ? I heard it was around 100 degrees so in theory can see left and right at a T junction.
I didn't really notice until I brought the footage in for editing. It's wider, but not by much
Damn. My first thought was: sure, resolution is higher, but higher resolution has a lot higher compute requirements. Second thought, particularly with the nighttime footage: I'm surprised HW3 works at all
As discussed in some other comments under this video - ai uses the raw output of the cameras. That also includes IR-range which is filtered by recording. In IR mode this camera is very good for night vision, it sees much more than what you can observe from the video.
Would it be worth seeing a comparison of hw3 on a Y?
I'm sorry they need to find a way to shoehorn HW4 into HW3 cars. At a minimum the cameras at least. But I'm sure these images are also the computer as well. Also possibly code differences.
I assume the entire hardware stack would need to be replaced (not least because the new cameras are much higher resolution and the existing hardware may not be able to cope). It would not be worth the cost or time.
Amazing to think they can do much at all with Hardware 3 when you look at the difference, Hardware 4 with AI will be the game changer! Look forward to the next video
I always wondered why the reason for the weird colors on version 3 that made everything look like the 2000 movie Traffic. They seem to have "fixed" it.
I think that’s due to the NOIR (No Inferred) cameras on HW3. NOIR cameras have interesting color reproduction on them but better night time use ability. HW4 either doesn’t use these cameras, which in the night time shots does not make a big difference, or it uses much higher quality NOIR cameras with better color reproduction. One other commenter on this video said the green color looks fake, so this second possibility is possible too.
@@TheStopwatchGod Do you mean NIR cameras? Near Infrared?
@@TheStopwatchGodMost cameras have infrared filters. I'm not quite sure what point you're trying to make. Honestly it just looks like lower-quality cameras in HW3. "Colour" as a concept is actually extremely complex and very difficult to get right in cameras, and given it's an AI model that doesn't care about how colours actually appear, they probably didn't feel the need to try to achieve natural-looking colours.
Thanks!
Thank you, really appreciate it!
BUT BUT BUT Musk said HW3 would be enough for full autonomy! He promised!
Even older hardware should be able to do it. Nothing has changed in that sense. Tesla is not aiming to stop with "safe enough for regulatory approval", the goal was always to keep improving safety in all ways for all time... HW4 would still be a thing today even if FSD got legally approved years ago with older hardware... If older cars will not be approved for legal self driving, then Tesla will offer retrofits or other solutions. So far, it seems that HW4 is not needed for FSD to get legal approval and so Tesla will not waste energy and money on retrofits.
That highway sign was the most interesting difference.
HW4 feeds look very crisp. However, in terms of computer vision, HW3 is still probably good for a long time. I just wish they would make some workaround LED-flicker mitigation for HW3, if possible. If nothing else, blend several frames together for analysis when flicker is detected.
Do the HW 4 cameras fix the blind spots around the car, giving you a more 360 view of the car ?
I would love to transfer my 2018 Red Model 3 FSD to a Model Y with the better hardware, but what if the updated Model 3 and Y models are really an awesome improvement? I would have unbelievable buyers remorse! 😢😢😢
That's a big change!
thats really exciting
Seems, at least for now, HW4 repeaters to _not_ have a slightly forward viewing angle. But this might be software adjusted, and currently only set to what FSD is using.
WOW. The backup camera’s wide angle alone makes it worth it! I hate backing up and not seeing 180 degrees. I’m sure there will be “cross traffic alert” eventually…
Interestingly the rear camera view is cropped when backing up. You only get the full wide angle view when you remove the footage from the TeslaCam drive
@@AIDRIVR makes no sense! This would save me so many close calls! People don’t wait for you in south Florida if you’re half way out of the spot, they’ll go around you.
How has the infotainment system held up? Since it has half the amount of ram. Reports are saying it's crippled
This is the exact difference I expect from the year gap.
Please correct me if I'm wrong: The difference between the two is HW4 can handle higher resolution cameras than HW3.
Eventually HW4 will also have high res, front-facing radar while HW3 has none.
Great comparison!! I can't believe how much better HW4 is.
What a sick soundtrack, name of song? Subbed!
I'm gonna need more storage for my Sentry Cam. :D
How to I know which HW I have? Got my model 3 two weeks ago from Shanghai Factory delivered to Germany.
i am about to order model Y is the 2023 come with HW4 ?
a bit better, hardware 25 will make it consider stopping at stop signs
It stops at stop signs. People do hours of driving in cities without needing to take over... One miss vs millions of hits and you say it will always miss? Just pure silly.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0Who are these drivers that have FSD driving for hours in cities? Every FSD video in a major city shows that FSD struggles to go even minutes without disengagements.
@@0ooTheMAXXoo0 i am sorry MAXX, it is not that i am not a supporter of Tesla it is just that i want it to move faster. and it is not me that first said that look at AIDRIVR videos. i am not happy: my parrot avoids obstacles so well with a tiny brain at i do not know how many hertz, low memory and eyes on the sides. and he can fly up and down too so what are they missing? i do appreciate the novelty of Tesla approach with video only, i think it is the right way. it is not hate on my side
@@dancar2537 A parrot's brain is _vastly_ more complex than the AI in these cars, and tuned extremely well for the job. People drastically underestimate the complexity of this task.
@@clonkex i think you are overestimating how complex nature is. that tiny brain is the result of evolution and the knowledge is either sent through genetics or learned. either way in my opinion it should not be so much information stored in it. evolution has not produced a mechanism that is so complex, it does not do that, i do not think so. it just replicates a simple mechanism. transformers are just a crutch in my opinion, we will see in the future how things evolve. do not "mark my words" because i am not certain but nns are working in llms and not that complicated
Cries in non-upgradable HW3. I'm not buying a whole new car for upgrades. It seems like a company that's model is based on sustainability should have retrofits. :(
At the end of the day, it’s a company that needs profits. It is, however, reinvesting those profits to fulfill its mission of transitioning the world to sustainable energy as quickly as possible. Also, buying a new Tesla and selling your old one to an ICE driver gets yet another gas car off the road. Your used Tesla will also be more affordable to folks that otherwise couldn’t have afforded one.
That all being said, wouldn’t upgrade from anything newer than a 2021 just for HW4. We’re transferring FSD from a 2019 M3 to a 2023 MY.
If HW3 is good enough to get legal FSD then why cry? If HW4 or better is needed, then Tesla will do retrofits or offer other solutions. Right now, it looks like older cars will be able to legally do FSD so Tesla might just be wasting money on retrofits. Tesla spends a lot of extra time and effort to do the right thing, way above what is regulated. No reason to think they will ask for a lawsuit by leaving older cars without a already paid-for feature. Every time Elon says no retrofits to HW4, he also says older hardware should be able to legally do FSD. He also says that regulatory approval is not the end goal, that safety improvements is the goal and that even when the cars are 1000x safer than the best human drivers, Tesla will keep working on improvements. In crash tests from many years ago. The model S had a 6 times lower risk of bodily damage than the next safest car (a Volvo). Tesla kept making their cars safer anyways! They keep making improvements even when the car is 6x better than the competition!
I hope they let us upgrade soon.
Wow. One video from AIdrivr to completely osborne hw3
More and more traffic signs are displayed in electronic version, so I guess Hardware 3 will also be capable some day. Hardware 3 will also be able to have full FSD capabilities according to Elon. I have bought it (with hardware 3), but haven't been able to use it here in Europe.
Based on this, I assume there will be a lot of lawsuits if Tesla does not allow us older FSD purchasers to transfer in the future. I am not financially able to afford to upgrade my Model Y at the moment but will want to do so in the future. I will be on the lawsuit bandwagon if need be.
If the older cars are legally allowed to drive without a human driver, then there is no problem to sue about. Tesla will not spend the money on retrofits unless they know they are needed. So far, Elon is saying that the older hardware cars should be able to legally do FSD when the AI gets to the point where regulators are needed. If you need HW3 or HW4 to legally do FSD, then Tesla will spend the money for retrofits, no lawsuits needed. My prediction, anyways... There would be no reason to fight in court other than to loose more money and Tesla is too smart for that.
Does it stutter the wheel less? My HW3 seems to do that a lot around some clear 90 degree turns
No FSD for HW4 yet
Definitely better, actual color, especially against the sun the traffic lights were readable but I see a couple of reasons why it's not enough yet.
tbh my favorite change is the reds being reds instead of orange lol
So can I upgrade my Model 3, 2019 to Hardware 4??