The Chemistry of Kodak Film - Smarter Every Day 275-C
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- čas přidán 30. 04. 2024
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ALL Kodak Videos on Smarter Every Day:
MAIN CHANNEL VIDEO
How Kodak Makes Film Light Sensitive (How Film is Made, Part 2) - Smarter Every Day 275
• How Does Kodak Make Fi...
2ND CHANNEL VIDEOS
Kodak's Film Quality Control Process - Smarter Every Day 275-B
• Kodak's Film Quality C...
The Chemistry of Kodak Film - Smarter Every Day 275-C
• The Chemistry of Kodak...
PART 1
How Does Kodak Make Film? (Kodak Factory Tour Part 1 of 3) - Smarter Every Day 271
• How Does Kodak Make Fi...
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The awesome people at Indie Film Lab is putting on a "Long Live Film Workshop" on October 17-20, 2022. It's a gathering of professionals, hobbyists, experts, and beginners alike, all with one thing in common - a love for the art of film photography. If you're interested, there's a FAQ and registration form here: www.longlivefilmworkshop.com/ .
Here's a video Jeff said did a good job explaining the chemistry of film:
• ADVANCED EMULSION: Sil...
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Warm Regards,
Destin - Věda a technologie
Can we all agree that Dr. Jeff Hansen is a pretty amazing tour guide? If you feel like this content is worth your time and you'd like to enable me to keep making stuff like this, please consider supporting on Patreon. www.patreon.com/smartereveryday . If you enjoy the channel, that's the single best way to help. Thank you!
He is the best!!
Any person with the knowledge and passion like Jeff has must be such a blessing to be around. Thanks for these videos, this is one of my favorite series so far.
Please bring @Kodak a great "THANK YOU" from us millions and millions film fans, this is outright so fascinating, finally we were able to see how film really is made and not the least, the quality control which has some kind of a NASA level to it. These times, it is so important to see that science really works and give us wonderful, colourful results, in the case of physical film. And thank you for giving us this! As you say, many times: AWESOME!!!
thankyou for showing this my grandpa worked here, never knew what it was like, it's incredible.
I hope he loses weight. He's gasping for breath just standing around. I want this kind man to stick around for very long
as someone from industry its crazy how much depth he shows.
obviously he doesnt share trade secrets but he is very very close to it and i love it.
high industry is amazing - i work in pharma.
same here, just in the diagnostical branch of a pharma giant. I'm a chemical technician doing lab scale synthesis of peptides. I can't imagine someone with a camera being allowed to film our most important processes, thats just not something our branch likes in general it seems.
@@covodex516 sus
@@bubbly6379 super sus but they pay me well
@@covodex516 on the point of high industry though, as an electrician it's crazy how much access we get to very very sensitive stuff without any checkups. I've been around machine shops where the companies do government/big company contracts and I'm given nothing resembling an NDA or anything, nor warned to not use a camera. Also we get keys for entire buildings without a second guess. Do y'all keep better tabs? Because I'd recommend it lmao
Yeah I would think most of what he's telling would be a "trade secret". I'm surprised he was allowed to share so much. Good for us
Dustin, having worked in a Kodak coating room back in the 80's, you did a great job of getting into the inner sanctum of this amazing industry. My father who worked for Kodak for over 40 year always told me, Kodak is not a camera or picture company it is a chemical and chemical processing company in an absolutely niche market of photography.
Unfortunately, since they were basically run by really good chemical engineers, they completely failed to recognize the digital revolution even though their own research department invented the digital camera, much to their demise.
I have always thought a really good, in-depth documentary series on the 130 years of Kodak would be a fascinating insight into a piece of American ingenuity. And I'm talking about not just the development of the company, but all of its products, research and genius around the technology of chemical photography as well as the other successes and failures of this business.
While you have done a great job of showing how this technology works, you have only scratched the surface of this industry and all the things that this company was involved in. There is a wealth of technology and knowledge inside the wall of Eastman Kodak that a vast majority of people have no clue of. Stay curious and I hope you do more on this subject.
Someone call Ken Burns
Have you always used the multi-layer laminar flow procedure for applying the colour emulsion, or did you once apply the layers individually, one after the other?
Dear Jeremia, do you know how many Rolls of Film Kodak produces, yearly, these days? Im trying to find out for some time now. Just cant find any sources :-)
It's also sad that they didn't recognize the need to diversify and use their chemical expertise to get into other markets. Fujifilm did and still is a massive company, with film and even digital photography just being a fraction of what they make money on.
Alec of Technology Connections has done a few videos talking about film and history though not nearly to the extent he's covered RCA or toasters. The history of Kodak would certainly be right up his alley though.
As a chemistry teacher, this tickles my brain. I do a chemical photo lab (turn their T-shirts into a photographic film) and this will be a great springboard into this lab and topics.
Probably a great way to introduce the discussion of surfactants and the differences between liposomes and micelles. Not to mention talk of interstitial defects and all that fun jazz.
do you have a video or something about that t-shirt to photo film experiment? that sounds awwesome!
@@buuh7592 Also interested!
Please elaborate on the shirt film thing! Sounds awesome
@@buuh7592 I’m not sure what happened, but apparently my previous reply didn’t go through. So let me try again. To find the lab, do a search for “Flinn scientific “. Once on their site, search for “blueprint t-shirt”. We first practiced making prints on white paper towels, seeing what worked and didn’t work, before moving onto T-shirts. One issue that arose was that either certain detergents or water would wash away the color, leaving behind a pale yellow image. I think this year we are going to try bleach T-shirts, following the procedures from the CZcams channel of “The king of random”. Do a search for “bleach shirts” on that channel.
I love this guy, I'd love to spend a day talking emulsions with him, maybe I could plant the seed to get Aerochrome back in production lmao
ikr!
I wish aerochrome existed 😭
He isnt why they dont make Aerochrome...
The Infrared laser used for QC nowadays as well as the infrared cameras would expose it, though...
@@programagor I guess it's not impossible to turn off the IR laser and IR cameras if they wanted to produce a batch of Aerochrome. They would have to make more manual QC after full production, with higher QC time and labour, and also more risks of bad batch (cause no control at earlier steps of production). So in the end more expensive film. But can't be more expensive than the 100$ people ask for a roll on eBay lol
The level of access you were granted is impressive. Kudos to Dr. Jeff for imparting so much knowledge!
Well considering the navy let him board an active duty nuclear submarine, still impressive but three or four levels down from that.
@@Furudal that was basically for recruitment campaign... that's why the navy gave access...
@@ChillGuy511 Yeah, I would bet Dustin got a dollar or two for showing them in a positive light.
@@ywfbi I don't think so... Do they do that? The experience he got and the video he got to make would be enough ig...
@@ChillGuy511 I do not know for sure. But the DOD pays big money to Hollywood for positive movies. "Hollywood military propaganda" returns a lot of results.
This actually puts the price of a roll of film into perspective!
As a materials chemistry student who just took a class in solid state chemistry, watching jeff trying to explain core concepts without going way into the weeds was hilarious. Theres so much interesting stuff to cover i bet he could talk for hours about it :D
I worked in a photo developing lab in my early 20s and I remember that Kodak film tended to emphasize reds and yellows while Fuji film emphasized greens and blues. (It is notable that their product marketing emphasizes these color differences). I don’t know if I could still tell, but looking at the prints of a full roll of film, I used to be able to recognize Fuji vs. Kodak. I tended to use Fuji because it was less expensive and I tended toward landscape photography which had a lot of greens (plants) and blues (sky), but I’ve always had a special place for Kodak because my great grandmother’s uncle was George Eastman who founded Kodak.
The amount of thought and design before this factory construction is amazing.
Thank you and kodak team for sharing such knowledge
The Kodak series is interesting, because Eastman-Kodak invented most of these processes. Which gives a reference point to look at how other countries' film companies, gained the ability to also make photographic film..
Well, Kodak didn't invent chromogenic monopack, it is Agfa's invention.
I'm a secondary school student and I'm doing my final year project on the chemistry of photographic film. I've found it quite difficult to find information about this subject and so I wanted to thank the Smarter Every Day crew for making this video as it has really cleared things up for me. Thanks for making us smarter everyday.
I had no idea that the silver halide light chemistry is a kind of doped solid state system like a semiconductor using free electrons and “holes”.
It’s like half photovoltaic and half photosynthesis light reactions and half charged coupled device. In GOO!
Yep. It is like photo sensitive microelectronics. A photon hit it and leaves a hole, and then this electron is capture somewhere down the line. The hole is the latent image, for what I understood it.
@GenericUser That's quantum physics baby!
The logistics of this facility is insane. Every time Jeff tried to show a hint of the scale of the complexity of the operation, my brain started to extrapolate and immediately got overwhelmed. This series has been an absolute pleasure to jump down the rabbit hole in.
I am a photography professional, I grew up with film and understand all of the basic principles, but... Gosh, I had no idea! These facilities are exceeding my imagination of film production by far. Thank you so much for this deep dive. Thanks to Kodak and special thanks to Jeff!
Honestly it's amazing. Just how much goes into a roll of film and how absolutely precise they have to be when they're manufacturing that much of it. Honestly surprised that each role of film doesn't cost $50+... A car can impact someone's life greatly or even take a life and automotive manufacturers a lot of times don't even have that level of precision. Truly, astonishing.
you can tell the depth of knowledge Dr Hansen has with how measured his responses are. Just like you said, he takes you to the edge of your knowledge, shows you there's even more that you don't understand, then explains what you can understand in a meaningful way. What an educator!
As a Rochestarian and the child of a Software engineer that worked for Kodak it’s really cool to see this but also really sad to see what a shadow of a company Kodak is of it’s former glory. The story of Kodak and the city it built is amazing.
My father was a semiconductor engineer.
(Chemical engineer, really.) I learned as a
wee youngster, about electrons and holes,
in a P-N junction. (At a small memory
manufacturer, in Mt View Ca. I met Gordon
Moore there, one Saturday. I was 12.)
I never knew that film had the same process!
steve
Literally one of those episodes where learning is fun and I can’t get enough of it.
As a lifelong film photography devotee I have been totally geeking out on this series. My career was as a physicist but my passion has always been photography. I can read the technical manuals and take a fair picture and God sent me a wife some 40 years ago that doesn’t really care about the technical stuff but she is a brilliant artist with any camera! Doesn’t matter…I LOVE knowing how stuff works! We are all so proud of you, Dustin, when Jeff mentioned ‘Laminar Flow’ you didn’t drop everything and go all geek out! This makes me wonder who can possibly take a ‘Jeff Hansen’s’ position when he retires? The level of professionalism and amazing dedication is getting harder and harder to replace. Dedicated team players are so rare now.
I've lived in Rochester for 26 years and never knew how much went into the making of Kodak film. Thanks so much Destin for visiting my city and this deep dive into the chemistry and all the other videos of how this stuff works!
Destin, the re-watchability factor of your videos is off-the-charts. I find myself coming back again and again to your videos which I enjoy the most. The Deep Dive on submarines is fantastic. I've watched the first Kodak video easily 10x and still learn something new each time I watch it. Thank you for the fantastic content. Happy to be a Patron of yours, Destin.
For those wondering why there's no Black pigment in CMY camera film, but there is Black in CMYK printing, it's because:
1. it actually saves a lot of colored ink in printing. By adding black ink in printing (actually dark grey ink...), you can cut down on the three other colored inks if you ever want to reach a black result (instead of going 100% Yellow, 100% Magenta and 100% Cyan, you can go 100% Black and maybe ~10% of each other inks, which makes a lot less ink used).
2. the color balance is much easier to do and adjust after the fact. While in photography, the photo detectors are created long before the picture is chosen and taken, in printing, you know exactly what you're going to print out before you start pouring ink in the printer. to the point where actually, not all printing is done with CMYK inks. If you know you're going to print out pages where there only two colors (say Orange and Green) then why not just put Orange and Green inks in your printing machine ? And we do.
3. bleach can't selectively wash out "black" silver traces were there's few and keep it in where there's a lot. You either remove all of the silver or none of it, so you have to make do with the usual subtractive color blending of Cyan minus Magenta minus Yellow to achieve black.
It's the ruthenium and iridium washed out with the silver?
After watching this, I'm amazed that a roll of film doesn't cost $1,000. Thank you for producing this. I'm becoming a patron today!
I am more or less surprised they did not branch off. I worked [not a chemical tech myself, IT related is what i did] in a chemical multinational [22 countries] company and know that they actually branched of into something new right before i left. Kodak has equal (or more) level skilled chemists there... they should expand their horizons if they havent already.
What's absolutely amazing about all of this is that it is the result of almost 200 years of cutting edge physics and chemistry building up on one another; giants standing upon the shoulders of giants. It really isn't all that surprising, I suppose, that film is still chugging along in the digital age when you think about it like that.
My mom was a film chemist at Kodak many years ago. Literally grew up hearing about this stuff on a daily basis, but you finally cemented all of it in a way that makes sense to me! Thanks!
Around the 18 minute mark, you mention Bayer filters of digital cameras and how they don't actually capture all colors at the same spot. However there are also digital cameras that work just like the film does, passing light through the sensor die with different wavelength sensitivity at different depths -- most notably, the Foveon X3 sensor.
Yes...a 1200-2500$ digi camera vs a 10-30$ roll of film
@@brianbarrett2487 Way to be completely beside the point.
@@brianbarrett2487 Really??? How much did that film camera/lens cost back when? And the film is an ongoing cost. You are comparing two very different items and have NOT brought in all the parameters.
Yes! Fujifilm still uses rhat tech in there newer cameras too.
Well actually film doesn´t capture all he colours at the same spot, if the light hits a crystal on some upper layer it either bounces off or gives it´s energy to the silver depending on the wavelength. It´s more that there´s no defined square pattern as in bayer filter but the colour overlap is rather random.
I'm a master's student in chemistry and I learned some very cool details about the photochemistry. Dr. Hansen was amazing!
You can see why Kodak basically makes all the color film stocks for everybody, it's amazing how much work is done to make film.
Also explains why Fuji is spinning down their factory. It's going to take a lot of demand for film to convince these companies that it's still worth all the effort.
I am so impressed with Jeff's knowledge of all of their processes. He seems like an all-around great guy as well!
I'd watch the full interview. I don't care how many hours it is. I can't get enough of this guy.
Man I wish I knew you were on plant would have invited you by where I work at the Kodak Park Fire Department for lunch!
This was extraordinary. What an insight in to the process
Holy moly 3 smarter every day videos in one day.
I love how Jeff is passionate about the process himself.
I love seeing someone passionate about this work give a tour. They normally take longer because they want to get you to feel just as excited as they are about the topic.
I'd like to thank Jeff and his team for taking the time to show us such a fascinating process and sharing their knowledge with us.
This whole series is so incredible. Thanks Destin for putting this together to share and thanks to everyone at Kodak for sharing their knowledge and insights.
I said this on the main video that goes with this one but I am super glad I'm a patron of this channel because the amount of super high quality content is just staggering. Keep up the good work, Destin.
Wow. I don’t think I’ll retain most of this information but it was so enjoyable to listen to. This series inspired me to buy an old film camera and I love it. I still go to every thrift store in town to track down film cameras that others throw out. It’s a hobby I didn’t know I had until I learned about it. This is what the internet is for!
Your videos are excellent and your work on education is highly appreciated. Thank you for staying curious and sharing with us.
i feel like this series is going to save film photography in 200 years when a single person wants to recreate the ancient technology. until then we will make sure to keep the interest and demand for film high!
I think what makes videos like this so great are how good the questions are that Destin asks. Like I know I wouldn't ask such questions, if any at all. I'd just listen and try to process it myself. But Destin asks questions constantly that look to fully understand what was said and it helps with grasping what is being explained by these people he is talking to. I really appreciate that.
I just had to pause it to write this: I love listening to people that love their job and that are proud of what they're making and talk about it with such passion as Jeff does. I'm 54 minutes in now and I'm kind of sad it's only 13 minutes left. To me this is probably the best video you've made, Destin. You ask the questions I would've asked and you try to understand what Jeff explains using your own words, which helps me to understand it better too. I had absolutely no idea that film is so complex. Well done!
Jeff is friggin awesome! I can't imagine how much fun you had with this trip.
I've been waiting & waiting for this part 2 for months!
This series has been amazing, as well as you and Jeff I don’t know why but this was better than watching an action film and kept me on the edge of my seat the hole time. I allso do not think iv ever absorbed this much information in such a short time at any point in my life. I love it and keep up the good work
Dr. Hansen did a good job of explaining the functional effect of the chemistry even though he didn't get too far into the band theory of the silver halide. Of course, the end product relies on all the other parts of the film in a much more substantial way so I understand the simplification. Very good video yet again. 👌
And a lot of this discovered by experimentation way before physics and chemistry knew about the quantum mechanics behind photon absorption. Love this 'outtake' of an hour of chemistry geekery.
Thanks for sharing this, Destin. What an amazing process to document and with such a fantastic guide!
Absolutely amazing video and Jeff is incredible. Please don't stop doing in-depth stuff like this!
Thank you for making this quality content. I love it!
Hearing a PhD say littlest made my day.
Super fascinating! Great series Destin! I love it when people are stoked about what they do.
Destin this is an absolutely brilliant video, you're so right there's hardly any info on film chemistry online! I've always wanted to go more in depth about how the chemical processes work and this sure has delivered - thanks so much
This is so fascinating! Thanks for doing this series. Kodak has been a huge part of photographic history, and their story should be preserved.
This is amazing. Going out of your way to add this to a readily accessible public record is out right win for humanity. Thank You!
I loved this. You were right, he was great at taking the explanations to the edge of my comprehension. Also, the cameraperson in me kept saying this must have been so difficult to shoot!
That's how you know they are good at their job.
I was surprised how much goes into making a film (like I didn't expect them layering different sizes of crystals for light intensity). Jeff is great at explaining!
This video is probably my favorite of yours so far. Getting a deep dive into this process is so fascinating. Coming from the controls and instrumentation industry, I was giddy the whole timing seeing all of the transmitters, valves, hmi, and such. Those flowmeters at the end were all Coriolis flow meter. If you were able to do a whole channel like this on in-depth process in manufacturing plants I would watch every single one! I appreciate your enthusiasm for engineering and science!!
Man this Kodak series has been such a wild ride. What an amazing peek behind the curtain thank you for making this happen!
I'm am 7:26 seconds in! And teers of jo are filling my eyes. Jeff is an educator like no one else, not demanding you to learn but making you want to learn more and deep dive in the beauty of this chemistry. Thank you Destin.
Thank you so much for this video series and a huge thank you to Jeff for sharing his knowledge and passion. It is truly a privilege to be allowed into this sort of facility and to have a person with so much knowledge and the ability to share an incredibly technical process in terms that we can all understand.
Finally.... Been waiting for part 2 for a while!!!
Great video. Jeff is really a great explainer! He also really seems to enjoy sharing his work.
If you want to learn more about film (Destin or any viewer) Technology Connections had a good series on film that taught me about silver halide before I got here.
Loved this Dustin!
Very interesting, top marks :)
Sir, thank you for putting it all online!
Dr Hansen is a great teacher, but you're also a great student. Asking great questions, repeating back what you have understood. Thank you for sharing - This is awesome!
I've been into analogue photography for 10 years now, and I've been developing my own film for 4 years now. This is the most amazing and most into depth video on how analogue film works I have ever seen. As you point out, theories m there's very little information on the internet, and barely any videos, expect for one dutch film from the 50s 😅
Thank you very much for bringing this to CZcams!
There is so much knowledge in Jeff’s head. He truly knows the chemistry inside and out. Incredible.
I'd just like to say, thank you so much to all the people involved in making this series of videos: Destin and your guys for taking the time and trouble, Jeff Hansen for your time and knowledge (both the science and navigating around this huge plant!). All the technicians who appeared and talked about their jobs, and the nameless people behind the scenes at Kodak who decided to allow this to be seen by the masses on CZcams. Thank you all. It's fascinating, and enlightening, and mindboggling, and wonderful that such material can be found on the internet in this age of 90 second attention spans.
This place it awesome and they must keep it operational. If sales drop, they must slow down to 1 day a week or a few days a month, but they have to keep it operational. If they were to ever go out of business, then it would cost another company A LOT of money to build their own facility and learn how to do all this stuff.
This is the coolest, thank you Destin!
This series has been AMAZING!!! and Jeff I have no words for him other than to thank him for being such an awesome host.
The best video I've ever seen about industry. Thanks for what you do Destin, continue like this...
This video just got me through the work day!
I commented yesterday on your other video that I clicked because I hoped to see the chemistry. Wow, you must have been uploading this when I commented! Awesome!!
Thanks for all you do!!!!
This is honestly mind blowing. Have not been this engaged in learning about a topic for a long time!
Super interesting episode! The knowledge this guys has is just amazing.
I'm really enjoying the kodak series so far, looking forward to the 3rd part! thank you for making this.
Thank you so very much for making this series of videos.I watched all of them. I've been going back to film gradually and every day is filled with more wonders about film but this series about Kodak had been such an eye opener. We are extremely lucky to have such valuable documentary about the magic and art of film. This is very inspiring. I cannot thank you enough for making this series and I'm extremely thankful to Kodak for being so open and let us look inside their magic kingdom.
Toured Kodak PArk in 1967 as a photo student in Rochester. I certainly was not in depth like your amazing videos. Jeff Hansen is a rock star for us with interest in how film works. This is all fantastic and make me appreciate the 10-15,000 sheets of 4x5 and 8x10 film my studio went thru every year.
Kodak would sent densitometry and test sheets from a few full batches of film and we would choose the best one for our type of work. They they would cut whatever we mix of sheet sizes we needed. A whole new appreciation for the people of Kodak.
Man I miss Kodak. Growing up in the shadows of Ridge Ave this company was the life force of the city. Heck even working in a few of Kodak's buildings as an engineer, even though it wasn't a Kodak company, was like a life goal for me.
I’d learn anything from Jeff!
I could only understand parts of what they’re talking about, but im three videos in and I can’t stop.
This is blowing my mind.
WOW, thanks Jeff, that was a wonderful ride!
This is fascinating! Thank you!
Why do I feel that they only make 127 emulsions because their software stores the emulsion ID as a signed 8-bit integer? x3
Jokes aside, this was an amazing insight into the workings (and making!) of the emulsions, I could listen to Dr. Hansen all day...Thank you!
I thought the same thing!
There really is no substitute for nearly a hundred years of experience with Kodak. From the science to the methodology, and sheer complexity of variables, it reminds me more of semiconductor fabrication than anything else. Stupendously fascinating especially when you're a big fan of film footage as the raw stock to shoot dramatic productions.
I am always thankful to the purists in the film industry who stick to their guns. For all the flaws film has in image reproduction, there is just something natural about them and it all boils down to what this guy is teaching us. Just incredible.
I can't tell you how much this video helped me understand the Kodak plant processes. I am going to visit the plant next week for work, and this set of videos saved me so much time in learning the process. Youre explanations were amazing! Great job! I hope to meet Jeff as well. I'll thank him again for his excellent tour.
This is really cool, thank you for doing this.
This is unbelievably cool, love how clearly this guy explains this extremely complicated process.
Thanks so much for this kind of content ♥
I grew up less than an hour from this factory complex and always marveled at its size. It is great to see what has actually been going on in there. Thanks Destin and, of course, Dr. Jeff!
Love that dude, these videos are very interesting!
This is my favourite of the whole series!
I didn't understand a lot of the contents of this video, but still gave it a thumbs up for the presentation (and kudos to recognizing how he was teaching you!), but I read many of the comments below from many disciplines, and the enlightenment is so infectious! This is an excellent presentation! Truly becoming "smarter every day"!
Hearing about "latent image" and "reciprocity failure" took me way back, as did the D log e curves. I started with B&W photography back in 1969 when I was in high school, and have loved the smell of Kodafix ever since. Thank you, Dr. Jeff Hansen and Dr. Hollis Todd (wherever you are)!
I would love a video on the 71 types of film that they make.
Wow, another awesome treatment of interesting information
This is absolutely fascinating!