Are Good Works Necessary for Salvation? (FC Article IV)
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- čas přidán 23. 05. 2024
- Our website: www.justandsinner.org
This video is a continuation of the Formula of Concord lecture series. In this talk, I discuss the debate around good works following Luther's death. What is the role of good works in the Christian life? Are they necessary for salvation?
This was a very good lecture. Not too ling ago, Trent Horn addressed this on his channel, and he left me scratching my head at his logic. He basically stated that NOT attaching works to salvation created a lack of assurance; sounded like he was projecting Rome’s conundrum on Protestants.
The clarity of the Lutheran Reformers on good works was refreshing and a major factor in my conversion to Lutheranism, as they addressed the issue in a manner that neither Calvinism nor Wesleyanism consistently did.
Thanks Dr Cooper, your teaching accurately explains the role of our good works in the Christian life. Only the biblical view of our good works is compatible with grace, and it frees the Christian to do good works with truly good motives! You've threaded the needle in a way that honors God and avoids antinomianism. Great job!
This talk was astonishingly excellent and wholesome to my soul. Those qualities are integral to the truth of scripture as reflected faithfully in the Formula of Concord article under discussion, but to convey them so faithfully and clearly is a wonderful gift! Thank you, Dr. Cooper.
Keep up the good work, Dr. Cooper!
Great video Dr. Cooper. I always go to the story of the woman who anoints Jesus’ feet, specifically Luke’s version (Luke 7:36-50). Jesus says that we can see that the woman’s sins have been forgiven because of the good act she is doing. “Her many sins have been forgiven, as her great love has shown.” The forgiveness is not granted because of the act of love. Rather, the love is the evidence of the forgiveness
Thank you for doing this!
This was so good. Thank you so much ❤
Good work. The faith that justifies loves, but the love of the faith that justifies does not justify.
Really appreciated a video on this specifically. Very helpful as always
I love your new intro graphics!
Very inciteful, thanks!
Very helpful.
As a Calvinist, you’re doing a good work about doing Godly good works…!😊
PS have you done a podcast or YT on Church discipline regarding errant or sinning congregant members , etc.?
It’s funny, the day after you commented this he posted a video discussing the differences in church discipline between Lutheran and Reformed traditions
Thank you so much for the lectures on the Formula of Concord! I've been so thankful for these and the AC collection you've been releasing!
Do you ever plan to cover Chemnitz "Apology of the Book of Concord?" or is that a bit too niche and specific?
Either way, thank you for your good work!
"You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone." James 2:24
So yes, good works are necessary for salvation. Our good works do not save us, but they are absolutely necessary.
As a Reformed follower of your channel, I very much appreciate the clarity of this approach. We Reformed have had to defend sola fide from within our camp when confusion over good works has erupted. The Marrow Controversy erupted in the early 18th century in the Church of Scotland, for example. Most recently, in this century, we have seen in the borderline denominations (conservative and confessional, e.g., PCA, OPC, URCNA, etc) the Federal Vision Controversy. Both were connected to good works as necessary for salvation. Thankfully in both controversies faithful men rose up to preserve the gospel. The perpetrators of Federal Vision (think of Doug Wilson) still teach a two-stage justification involving good works. This also is taught by John Piper, the Baptist pastor of the Young. Restless, and Reformed movement.
The Formula of Concord is very helpful in identifying the troublesome language that can lead to such views. I thoroughly enjoyed this episode. Sola Fide!
What do you mean two fold justification involving good works?
@@ZachFish- That man is "initally" justified by faith alone apart from works, but then that justification is consummated by good words, which is the doctrine referred to as neo-neonomianism. It is anti gospel.
Your statement at 16:42 of Luther's perception in Saxony is so poignant for today: "There are some pretty bad misunderstandings of the gospel". Keep up the great work Dr Cooper, and God bless!
Greek american here. I feel doom and hell when i listen or read from orthodox fathers. I read hope and joy and GRACE when i read Luthers quotes on justification and Christianity.
The citation at the 18 minute mark is from on the councils and the churches by Martin Luther.
The ones we are commanded to do to attain salvation.
It is only in broken humanity that faith, motivations, words, works are separated and often insincere. Lies infuse every aspect of our existence.
It is the work of the Holy Spirit to cleanse us of lies, to transform us to live simply and honestly, to re-integrate all aspects of our being and make us new.
Good works done sincerely are evidence of God's grace moving in the person, whether that begins prior to or subsequent to a person's justification.
"...for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose." (Philippians 2:13)
You and Dr. Biermann should record a conversation on human rights. Ive asked him about this before and am still confused where he stands on the issues.
Several years ago on the Internet, a Lutheran typed to me that it is more correct to claim that salvation is through FAITH FIRST rather than through FAITH ALONE. This makes a lot of sense to me when reading the Biblical texts.
And what do you have to do second to be saved? How many steps are there?
@@KevinDay
James 2:22-24
@@jamesb6818 Whoa, never seen that before! 🤯 You've totally won this 500 year old debate by pointing out a verse no Protestant knew existed!
@@KevinDay The steps and things to do to be saved is up to God. Romans 1:17 mentions this revelation as coming FROM faith TO faith. With Abraham, his faith resulted in the works that saved him, as per James 2:21-24. Likewise, the Lord's Prayer of Luke 11:2-4 has the structure of the 10 commandments. We voice this prayer so that we then obey and fulfill the 10 commandments through our faith in the powers of God that work through us. Trying to define such works for a salvation that does not come through faith, but through one's human willpower, tends to NOT place faith FIRST.
@@KevinDay
No need for patronizing. Faith and works are intertwined. Work’s complete our faith, faith is never alone.
Faith is an action, Jesus says that even believing is a work.
Saying this as a Protestant
The point of salvation is to get peace to be able to do good works. Doing good works is it's own reward. Who looks for a later reward, has already gotten it.
I struggle
So do I
You can know 100% for sure right now that ALL of your sins (past, present, and future) are completely forgiven and that you possess everlasting life. All you must do is trust completely in the finished work of Jesus Christ on your behalf. Christ died for your sins, was buried, and rose from the grave (1 Cor. 15:3-4). The moment you trust in Him alone to take you to heaven, you receive the FREE GIFT of eternal life (John 5:24). While your good works have much to do with how much God blesses your life and whether you receive eternal rewards in heaven, they have nothing to do whatsoever with where you spend eternity. czcams.com/video/I3A5mXtS9Lc/video.html
I cant understand how this is still a question for anyone that has read the NT. The pledge ( non-water baptism) saves you, and good works are evidence related product to follow. As a born again, you will have an inherent desire to do works.
it's the other way around. Salvation is necessary for good work's
My goodness, if only you dear Protestants knew your Scripture, we would not have had five centuries of holy war with Holy Mother Church. . . . Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Matthew 7:15-20. By faith alone one is not saved. James 2:24. Pick up your cross and follow me. Matthew 16:24. If you love me, you will do as my Father wills. Christ most ardently! . . . For the Catechism of Holy Mother Church has faithfully abided by eternal doctrine 1,500 years before Luther. And through the Desert Prophets, 3,500 years plus before the Reformation. . . . To wit, we are saved by Faith AND (not OR, but AND, AND) Good Works. The Church has never said one can work, alone, to Heaven. But one can lose Heaven by doing evil. Is that such an unclear doctrine worthy of disintegrating the unity of Christendom? . . . For that is perfectly directed by the Holy Bible and, dare l, logic and conscience, theology from the first Apostles to today, and revelation to saints like Sts Anthony of the Desert, Athanasius, Francis, Augustine, Franics, Dominic, Catherine, Aquinas. . . Let me also say beyond the inanity of sola fide, the same for sola scriptura, the bladphemy against Mary and Christ's one, true church (which is neither Calvinist, nor Mormon, nor Witness, and et cetera), and prosperity Gospel, and once saved always saved, and so on, which depart from the Catechism of Rome. In prayer, as Christ prayed, that we be ONE.
@@WinstonNewYorkWhat are you, the Romanist equivalent of the "I am more blessed than Mary" guy?
@@BenjaminAnderson21when the argument is lost the insults follow.
"Salvation is necessary for good work's"
Pretty Catholic (justification is necessary for works of Charity)
Says the Catechism:
_1989 The first work of the grace of the Holy Spirit is conversion, effecting justification in accordance with Jesus' proclamation at the beginning of the Gospel: "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."38 Moved by grace, man turns toward God and away from sin, thus accepting forgiveness and righteousness from on high. "Justification is not only the remission of sins, but also the sanctification and renewal of the interior man._
_Since it belongs to the supernatural order, grace escapes our experience and cannot be known except by faith. We cannot therefore rely on our feelings or our works to conclude that we are justified and saved.56 However, according to the Lord's words "Thus you will know them by their fruits"57 - reflection on God's blessings in our life and in the lives of the saints offers us a guarantee that grace is at work in us and spurs us on to an ever greater faith and an attitude of trustful poverty._
We are saved by
- grace, an unmerited gift no one can earn
- through faith, a response of the intellect and will to God's grace
- a faith working in love ( Ja 2 v24: faith is made complete by works of love )
As St. Paul says
- I am saved (Rom 8 v24, Eph 2,v5-8)
- I am being saved (1 Cor 1 v18. 2 Cor 2 v15, Phil 2 v12)
- I have hope to be saved (Rom 5 v9-10, 1 Cor 3 v12-15)
- I am working out my salvation in fear and trembling (Phil. 2 v12)
- with hopeful confidence in the promises of Christ (Rom. 5 v2, 2 Tim. 2 v11-13).
@@Defender_of_Faith You know, I see you and a handful of others across these channels routinely miss the substance of that which you criticize. It's totally up to you of course, but I might gently suggest that you actually READ the Apology (Defense) of the Augsburg confession or the Solid Declaration of the Formula of Concord, both found in the Book of Concord, to understand what it is you think you're defeating. The articles on original sin, justification and good works respectively will give you an overview. And yes, I have read the CCC.
If mundane things like household chores and helping your wife or cutting down some branches for your neighbor are good works for a baptized Christian, how is it possible for a Christian to be in danger of doing no good works whatsoever, or "insufficient" works?
Hmm. I think I (and the Reformed tradition more broadly) would state the matter quite differently. Per Turretin:
"Works can be considered in three ways: either with reference to justification or sanctification or glorification. They are related to justification not antecedently, efficiently and meritoriously, but consequently and declaratively. They are related to sanctification constitutively because they constitute and promote it. They are related to glorification antecedently and ordinatively because they are related to it as the means to the end. (XVII.iii.14)"
So we are not *justified* by works. That is to say, we are united to Christ by faith alone, and made sharers of his title to the kingdom--co-inheritors--by faith alone. But that doesnt mean that *salvation as such* isn't through Spirit-given holiness. If salvation, more broadly, is theosis, then works constitute salvation not with respect to justification, but sanctification and glorification. That is to say, if glory is grace consummated, then our final glorification will grow out of our walk with the Spirit, even though we have the title to the kingdom and the forgiveness of sins by faith alone. Thus Turretin:
"This very thing is no less expressly delivered concerning future glory. For since good works have the relation of the means to the end (Jn. 3:5, 16; Mt. 5:8); of the 'way' to the goal (Eph. 2:10; Phil 3:14); of the 'sowing' to the harvest (Gal. 6:7,8)...of labor to the reward (Mt. 20:1); of the 'contest' to the crown (2 Tim. 2:5; 4:8), everyone sees that there is the highest and an indispensable necessity of good works for obtaining glory. It is so great that it cannot be reached without them (Heb. 12:14; Rev. 21:27)" "
This, i think, is in keeping with the Biblical emphasis on salvation as broader than justification.
So the preaching works differently in that we deny that salvation is just pressing into justification. Salvation is the ever increasing sharing of God's life, which is joyfully our inheritance--it is to press into God's life in fellowship with him through holiness and holy delight.
Loved it!
Works cannot merit the grace itself of justification (i.e. the transfer from the state of sin to the state of grace). But they can merit an increase in grace and eternal life for those in the state of grace who obey God.
Increase in eternal life in the context of rewards. however not the increase of of eternal life IN CHRIST on the matter of KNOWING THE FATHER. Eternal life IN Christ is by faith AND NOTHING ELSE BUT FAITH and not works.
Good works are necessary for one's sanctification, however not for justification........ including water baptism, which is preceded by SPIRITUAL baptism of the Holy Spirit ahead of time as per Acts 10.
Below is what Luther wrote (emphasis in capital is mine). I leave it to the readers on how they understand what Luther meant.
I reply to the argument, then, that OUR OBEDIENCE IS NECESSARY FOR SALVATION. It is, therefore, a partial cause of our justification. Many things are necessary which are not a cause and do not justify, as for instance the earth is necessary, and yet it does not justify. If man the sinner wants to be saved, he must necessarily be present, just as he asserts that I must also be present. What Augustine says is true, “He who has created you without you will not save you without you.” WORKS ARE NECESSARY TO SALVATION, BUT THEY DO NOT CAUSE SALVATION, BECAUSE FAITH ALONE GIVES LIFE. On account of the hypocrites we must say that good works are necessary to salvation. IT IS NECESSARY TO WORK. Nevertheless, it does not follow that works save on that account, unless we understand necessity very clearly as the necessity that there must be an inward and outward salvation or righteousness. WORKS SAVE OUTWARDLY, that is, they show evidence that we are righteous and that there is FAITH IN A MAN WHICH SAVES INWARDLY, as Paul says, “Man believes with his heart and so is justified, and he confesses with his lips and so is saved” [Rom. 10:10]. Outward salvation shows faith to be present, just as fruit shows a tree to be good.
Martin Luther, Luther’s Works, Vol. 34: Career of the Reformer IV, ed. Jaroslav Jan Pelikan, Hilton C. Oswald, and Helmut T. Lehmann, vol. 34 (Philadelphia: Fortress Press, 1999), 165.
Romans 4:5 says even with NO works whatsoever you can be justified by faith. But i love lutheranism
Ultimate salvation being the right to enter the presence of God in heaven, we should heed such Scripture verse as Revelation 22.14 "Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates of the city." God requires that we cooperate with His grace so as to become perfect. Only the obedient will have the right to enter heaven. When made right with God, justified, we have the grace of God to enable us to do the works, if we will, so as to merit the reward of heaven.
Can it be said that the purpose of human life (after the fall of Adam) is to have our hearts shaped such that we are capable of freely accepting complete sanctifaction by God after death? We have to be made capable of obedience from love of God for who He is, and not just obedience from desire or fear of what He can do for or to us. If we are concerned primarily with our autonomy and independence, how will we accept being remade more perfectly in His image. The participation of our will in saying yes to God is essential to being remade in His image, and just as God cannot make a square circle (because it's a nonsense concept) God cannot remake us in His image without the participation of our heart in the sanctification process.
Good works are not mixed with the flesh as they do not come through the flesh ; the flesh attends or is present with the new nature but cannot prevent good works from truly and actually being good works. In other words, the old man and new man never mix, they are separate ; just like Christ's human and divine natures were/are together in one person, they were/are never mixed together.
2 Timothy 1:8 KJV Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God; 9 who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began, 10 but is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:
Titus 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 that being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
Ephesians 2:8 KJV For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 not of works, lest any man should boast.
The citation of Romans 8:13 at around the 1 hour point is very
appropriate and rather poignant.
"For if ye live after the flesh,
ye shall die, but
if ye through the Spirit do mortify
the deeds of the body, ye shall live."
Paul is not teaching anything new. This was taught all through the prophets. And indeed Paul in Romans 8:13 is alluding to Ezekiel 33:13 which essentially says the very same thing.
Romans 8:13 and Ezekiel 33:13 are sister texts. They both lay down the life / death dichotomy. And we must take warning.
Ezekiel 33:13 strikes at the epicurean delusion that once declared righteous and made alive indeed through faith, that we can continue again in unrepented sins. We simply cannot and God warns that we shall die in our sins.
Notice also that this is the language of Jesus (John 8:24).
It would be good to see more proof texts from the Old Testament for this. Certainly we could cite:
Deuteronomy 32:32-36 (which Hebrews 10:30, 31 picks up on).
Psalm 68:21
But God shall wound the head of
his enemies, and the hairy scalp
of such an one as goeth on still in
his trespasses.
And Psalm 85:8 which is fully congruent with Ezekiel 33:13 and Romans 8:13
I will hear what God the LORD will
speak: for he will speak peace
unto his people, and to his saints:
But let them not turn again to
folly.
The whole thing boils down to a category misunderstanding, even between different authors of the Bible. There are no context free categories, they are all logical impositions on experience. Reality exists in a continuum and expecting no dissonace of categories is naive.
Some view salvation as that state of peace one enters when one has faith. This state causes a desire for good works, and indeed is required for it. For them saying by faith alone makes sense. The works that follow are the path of sanctification.
Others view salvation as the ultimate end state of the soul of perfection in God, after sanctification. For them saying by faith alone is not correct, they would say by grace alone one enters faith and then he resulting works takes one through sanctification.
Actually both groups agree that faith is required for good works, and that dead faith, e.g. that which boils down to belief without trust, does not lead to good works.
There is too much bickering over words, while the actual traditions fruits in the spirit are not even considered, it's all theoretical.
As a Calvinist, you’re doing a good work about doing Godly good works…!😊
Good works don't save you but bad works can unsave you.
Imagine a situation of a mother with an infant. She must care for it and do work for it not to die. Wouldn't she do the work necessary it would have surely it would die and by willfully omission she would become a murder doing so. So works do justify us also besides having faith.
Faith is ultimately a gift. We don't get saved by meriting it, we get it prior to any good deeds committed. So we are saved in the past without any work making us deserving salvation. But to remain saved we need to be repentant about our sins and commit to living the Christian life and if we finish the race, we are ultimately saved (will be saved). Those are the three tenses of salvation. Not by works so that no one can boast, yet not by a dead faith. One could say St. Paul speaks about the beginning of faith in Ephesians 2:8-9, but St. James speaks about finishing or working out the gift of faith we received. End even those works after we come to salvation aren't anything to boast about, because as Ephesians 2:10 says those works were prepared for us and we are only able to execute them through being in Christ, just like the parable of the vine stock that says a branch can only produce fruit as long it's attached.
@angelikawesson4277 Do "born again" people stop sinning entirely, do they sin less (if so, how much less? give me a number.), or does being born again have no effect on your behavior?
@angelikawesson4277 You misunderstand what is meant by "works" - work means to obey the commandments - to be Charitable, Honest, Honor father/Mother/Elders, etc. by doing so, you live a moral life. That in itself you become a follower of Christ.
One is not required to volunteer in a soup kitchen, etc. Charity comes when we live a life like Christ, this is being born again.
I didn’t go to Dallas Sem but pretty sure they are embarrassed by their old dead reputation - Hodges, Ryrie, all that hyper dispensational anti-Protestant stuff from the 1970’s was rejected by 1990, and their new reputation is more built on the works of textual archaeologists like Wallace, less dogmatic, more inductive.
Scripture says death is the wages of sin (Rom. 6:23) and the soul that sins shall die (Eze. 18:4). What delivers us from death? It is righteousness that delivers from death (Pro. 10:2, 11:4). “Whoever is steadfast in righteousness will live” (Pro. 11:19). “In the path of righteousness is life, and in its pathway there is no death” (Pro. 12:28). Jesus said in Mat. 25:46 that the righteous shall go to eternal life. Then how to be made righteous that entitles us to enter heaven?
Faith is counted as righteousness but according to Scripture faith is not the only source of our righteousness. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he [Christ] is righteous (1 Jo. 3:7). In Gen. 15:6 what was counted (Hebrew חָשַׁב, Strong H2803) to Abraham for righteousness is faith. But what was counted (the same חָשַׁב) for righteousness to Phinehas in Psalms 106:31 was not faith but what he did as described in verse 30 (in more detail in Num. 25:7-8). When Christ said that the righteous will go to eternal life (Mat. 25:46), their righteousness comes from what they did (Mat. 25:34-35). The Hebrew word for righteousness (צְדָקָה, Strong H6666) also means alms or acts of charity. Synagogues and some Jewish homes have צְדָקָה boxes, where they can drop money for the poor. Pro. 19:17 says: “Whoever is generous to the poor lends to the LORD, and he will repay him for his deed.”
It is not salvation by works - in Catholic teaching our ability to have faith and/or to practice righteousness, through both we are made righteous, comes from and is only possible by grace through Christ, as apart from Him we can do nothing (Jhn. 15:5).
31:10 bro basically said, "you're not him"
If unrepentant sin can cut you off from grace and there is such a thing as 'sins of ommission', then works are necessary for justification, at least in the sense that an repentant sinner with faith, will try to commit them, if opportunity arises.
I would say the Works are part of Faith regardless of sin.
These are called the "fruits of repentance" in confessional Lutheranism, not instruments of some sort of "final justification" that we "grow in." That's the difference.
@@EricBryant I can understand that. In Catholicism, the sacraments do not justify us either
Not exactly. It’s a false dilemma. I will die if I jump from a plane without a parachute. I will live if I jump from it and use a parachute. I will also live if I don’t jump from the plane.
@@calebklingerman7902 no. The plane would be the world. If you stay in the plane, or in the world, you die. The only way to live is outside of the plane, or outside of worldly desires. The jump is Faith the parachute is "Good Works".
Without Faith you will never jump.
Without "Good Works" you won't survive the landing.
To use your analogy
We are saved by faith alone apart from good works.
So good works are not necessary?
Yes, they are, but not for salvation.
So we are saved if we have faith but not good works?
We are not.
So good works are necessary for salvation?
No they are not.
Talking about teaching confusion.
Dancing on the edge of Paradox. I love this aspect of Lutheranism.
Christianity is always a religion of paradox, but never of contradiction. That’s why G.K. Chesterton is my favorite theologian
@@calebklingerman7902 Chesterton is dope too. I haven't read him but his name comes up a lot among "great, classical Protestant thinkers"
Not quite Protestant. Most of his career he referred to himself as an “orthodox christian,” kind of a high-church Anglican with Catholic leanings. Late in life he converted to Catholicism outright.
@@calebklingerman7902 oh wow I didnt know that. I love Anglicans, too, so fine by me!
Second?
behold
, the chad lutheran
Morals and virtues ,count bonus,like brownie points ,good tooth fairy if needed .unleaded or premium.? Watch out here comes east coast tornado run ,On a Holiday. Did u work today .!?
😕
There is only ONE condition to receive eternal life according to the Word of God. "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved" (Acts 16:31). In contrast, there are multiple conditions for becoming a disciple or follower of Christ. Self-denial, fruitfulness, water baptism, hating your family, taking up your cross daily, loving others, etc. Whereas eternal life is a FREE GIFT, discipleship involves WORKS. Those who persevere in discipleship will be greatly rewarded in heaven, while those believers who fail to walk in discipleship will be ashamed at Christ's coming (1 John 2:28). Whereas eternal life is received once at the very moment a person places their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, the discipleship decision must be made repeatedly over one's lifetime. If you mix up salvation and discipleship, the result will be a false gospel of works which is an accursed message according to Gal. 1:6-9. czcams.com/video/I3A5mXtS9Lc/video.html
The works that are necessary for salvation are blatantly obvious because the purpose follows the command. Baptism for the remission of sins is so clearly obvious. What is not obvious is detractors of baptism claiming it is a good work (meritorious work) therefore discrediting it as being for what scripture says it is for. Where is the intrinsic good in baptism? The only intrinsic good it might have is shot down in 1 Peter 3 where it says not the washing away dirt from the body. So it is NOT a bath. 1 Peter 3 goes on to tell us what it is... It is an appeal to God. (not an outward show so stop trying to tell me that when scripture says something different). If you don't believe baptism is for the purpose of salvation then you don't believe the bible.
"...WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION with fear and trembling" (Philippians 2,12)
...for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. (Phil. 2:13). Hope this clarifies and helps.
People today are busy with their passion.
There is a general attitude that it is unreasonable to expect people to live out ordinary biblical morality, to have to suffer or endure the cross.
Increasingly, people declare that they are not responsible for what they do and/or cannot help themselves.
Its a 'modern' diluted Christianity in auto/passive mode
@@marcuswilliams7448 "He who believes and ???? (works) will be saved" (Mark 16,16)
@@johnnyd2383 If you think Baptism is *your* work, congratulations, you are now a Baptist.
We Lutherans also believe that Baptism saves, precisely because it is God's work whereby He joins us to the death and resurrection of His Son, forgives sins, imparts the Holy Spirit, and causes us to be born again.
@@joekey8464 I mean, such an attitude has existed since the Apostolic Era, which is why the Holy Apostles write about and admonish to holy living.
Fifth
We are biological machines, responding to our environment and learning along the way. There is no sin. There is no salvation. No afterlife of any sort. No God. No Satan. We have these pretty remarkable brains that allow us to make up all sorts of complexities and philosophies and theologies. Don't believe them. They are not true. This is it. Life your life.. You'll die and then it'll be over. Enjoy the journey. Be kind.
What if you are wrong?
There are exorcisms, Marian apparitions, Shroud of Turin, etc. all mysteries that actually happen.
It is not like there are zero glimpses for the supernatural.
Read the life of the saints, there are thousands of them, they are real witnesses to the realm beyond the material world.
You be a good moralist, and may God replace your heart of stone with a heart of flesh so you may join us in Christ's kingdom
@@tomo5136 I take that in the spirit it is given, thank you. Likewise, I welcome you to join with the human race and try to make the most of this life we have.
Justification is God (Elohim) allowing us to sin without recourse as then the Lord (YHWH) is justified for His creation of 'evil'.
"I form light and I create darkness. I make peace and I create evil: I the Lord do all these things." ~ Isaiah 45:7
Without evil, there could be no partiality OR even 'grace' itself as 'grace' is indeed partiality and something that scriptures state NO MAN is given.
Elohim is Yahweh, you are very confused
I am not confused. You just need a 'real' teacher.
@@tomo5136 - question. Is God the author of evil?
No. That would be YHWH that does that...
"I form light and I create darkness. I make peace and I create evil: I the Lord do ALL these things." ~ Isaiah 45:7
If you want to know someone that can 'rightly divide' your scriptures for you... then call this number: (S1N) 2CY-1DIE. The dude is a prophet and has a bloodline into Egypt and is probably related to Moses.
Shalom.
God doesn't extend grace to man?
@@soulosxpiotov7280 - of course He does... by allowing man to do 'evil'.
I don't even have to watch this to know everything is gotten wrong. Doc? We need to speak.
Grace is 'evil' that is used for 'good' and I say that because it is 'evil' to break God's law and thus 'grace' is what allows us to bend God's unbreakable law WITHOUT suffering the JUST and FAIR punishment that would be need to be dispensed immediately in order that the verse which states that God shows NO PARTIALITY to man - be 'truth'.
Since God's law is NOT breakable - it teaches from BOTH directions... and rewards from EITHER obedience OR rebellion. These are the 'wages'.
In this manner, sinning is merely the school of hard knocks, and why most nobody comes to desire a relationship with God until AFTER they are 'broken', and by the 'rod', for not following the 'staff', the reality of the means by which the law is designed to through blessings and curses make this 'law' applicable to all. See Romans 2:12-14.
Since grace allows for sin, and sin for suffering, and suffering to break the sinner via unbreakable law - working out one's salvation is done by 'grace' or... yes, sinning boldly - in understanding that NOBODY gets away with ANYTHING, and yet EVERYONE is shown 'grace'.
Christ's death did NOT need to be as per 1 Corinthians 2:8... as Paul states clearly. Salvation does not count towards salvation except as being an indication that the person is saved, as proof through the desire to do the [good] works. Grace is allowance to sin, and thus we are saved (beaten) because of grace.
Truth is that the law cannot be broken, and grace understanding that you can only fulfill the law by breaking it.
The law cannot be fulfilled by the letter, but by the spirit only. Want proof of all this?
Exodus 21:12 is what Jesus wrote in the dust 1st, and then Leviticus 24:17... thus via scripture providing the (2) witnesses necessary (via scripture) to make His point, Exodus being older, and Leviticus younger and why they left in that order.
If you want to find the prophet that you are looking for to teach you these things, then understand that it has been a very painful 4+ years to watch all this needless suffering. I am 'he'.
😔
My goodness, if only you dear Protestants knew your Scripture, we would not have had five centuries of holy war with Holy Mother Church. . . . Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Matthew 7:15-20. By faith alone one is not saved. James 2:24. Pick up your cross and follow me. Matthew 16:24. If you love me, you will do as my Father wills. Christ most ardently! . . . For the Catechism of Holy Mother Church has faithfully abided by eternal doctrine 1,500 years before Luther. And through the Desert Prophets, 3,500 years plus before the Reformation. . . . To wit, we are saved by Faith AND (not OR, but AND, AND) Good Works. The Church has never said one can work, alone, to Heaven. But one can lose Heaven by doing evil. Is that such an unclear doctrine worthy of disintegrating the unity of Christendom? . . . For that is perfectly directed by the Holy Bible and, dare l, logic and conscience, theology from the first Apostles to today, and revelation to saints like Sts Anthony of the Desert, Athanasius, Francis, Augustine, Franics, Dominic, Catherine, Aquinas. . . Let me also say beyond the inanity of sola fide, the same for sola scriptura, the bladphemy against Mary and Christ's one, true church (which is neither Calvinist, nor Mormon, nor Witness, and et cetera), and prosperity Gospel, and once saved always saved, and so on, which depart from the Catechism of Rome. In prayer, as Christ prayed, that we be ONE.
What you will discover if you poke around is that protestants hold to their error primarily on account of their psychological frailty.
They cannot adopt a theology of the afterlife that deprives them of assurance. It's an issue of anxiety.
TL;DR
You went in to a rant there at the end of things that aren't in scripture, or aren't practiced by Lutherans, but more importantly faith alone is in the Scriptures.
Ephesians 2:8-10 clearly says "not of works," so you're having to interpret Paul's words as though he's being unclear with his words. 1 Corinthians 3:10-15 repeats this point making it even more clear that if all of someone's works are judged unrighteous, then they shall still be saved by having the right foundation of faith in Christ.
Likewise John 3 and 8 both repeatedly say believing in the son of name of the son saves and freedom us from sin.
The only way I see you get around this to demand works being necessary is to call faith a work at which point you're using semantics. Even then, it's semantics that still make Paul's words look wrong or misleading.
@@litigioussociety4249 I can't believe i see you everywhere lol! I saw you in Testify vid and RZ! Let just say that I'm now a fan...
@@litigioussociety4249 Rant? Like crying racism, when one can't argue. . . . I can't go through all 17,000 denominations of Protestant heresy, and don't have to, to know that the bedrock of sola fide and sola scriptura and rebellion against Our Lady and Holy Mother Church, upon which the Protestant 'protest' are founded, are unfounded. . . . .
Look, simply, the first prophesy (about Mary by the way), and the last, are about the wages of bad actions (or bad works) and the reward for holiness (or good works). If you would only know your verse, and honestly apply reason reasonably to grammatical construction, it would be abundantly clear the place of good works in salvation . . . not alone mind you . . . but as consonant with good faith . . . just as the one, true, Church of Christ has preached since the Sermon on the Mount . . .
Proverbs 3:27-28
Do not withhold good from those to whom it is due,
when it is in your power to do it.
Do not say to your neighbor, “Go, and come again, tomorrow I will give it”-when you have it with you.
Ecclesiastes 9:10
Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might, for there is no work or thought or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol, to which you are going.
Ecclesiastes 12:14
For God will bring every deed into judgment, with every secret thing, whether good or evil.
Matthew 5:14-16
“You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden. Nor do people light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a stand, and it gives light to all in the house. In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
Matthew 25:40
And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’
2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.
Galatians 6:9-10
And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up. So then, as we have opportunity, let us do good to everyone, and especially to those who are of the household of faith.
Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
Colossians 3:23-24
Whatever you do, work heartily, as for the Lord and not for men, knowing that from the Lord you will receive the inheritance as your reward. You are serving the Lord Christ.
1 Timothy 6:17-18
As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty, nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share,
Titus 2:7-8
Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works, and in your teaching show integrity, dignity, and sound speech that cannot be condemned, so that an opponent may be put to shame, having nothing evil to say about us.
Titus 3:8
The saying is trustworthy, and I want you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed in God may be careful to devote themselves to good works. These things are excellent and profitable for people.
Hebrews 10:24
And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works,
Hebrews 13:16
Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God.
James 1:22
But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.
James 2:14-17
What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
Revelation 19:7-8
Let us rejoice and exult
and give him the glory,
for the marriage of the Lamb has come,
and his Bride has made herself ready;
it was granted her to clothe herself
with fine linen, bright and pure”-
for the fine linen is the righteous deeds of the saints.
Revelation 22:12
“Behold, I am coming soon, bringing my recompense with me, to repay each one for what he has done.
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