Hey, would love an update on how the greenhouse is doing this winter - specifically if your thermal battery setup is keeping it warm enough to grow through the whole winter. Thanks!
It won't. He is running it backwards. You need to be pulling the cold air dense air up out of the the system for it to store heat efficiently. Not forcing warm less dense air down.
Good documenting of the build. I love seeing the enthusiasm of a fun project. I built five 26ft x 100ft high tunnels on our farm about four years ago and installed a very similar system in one of the tunnels as an experiment. I use a big wood stove and the ridge heat to charge up my buried system. The big advantage of a wood stove is that is that I can create heat and still move hot air into the system after the sun sets. The first spring, and only 30 days after firing up the wood stove, I recorded ground temps at 61-63 degrees at a depth of 12" on April 1st. We live in Alaska so that was truly amazing to see. I had a 2-3 week jump on the other market growers that year. So I have some experience with this type of system and with that in mind, I have a suggestion for your greenhouse. I would strongly suggest installing two opening vents above the doors and make them as large as you can. There are times when you need to get that excessive high heat out of your greenhouse right now. What happens on those high heat days is that heat rises and it will collect in the peak of the ceiling area. The heat builds and acts like an insulating blanket creating more heat and radiating heat downward. No amount of fans is going to displace that heat that is trapped up high because the sun just keeps creating more heat and it cant escape. I had this problem big time the first 2 years even with roll up sides and 7ft x8ft end wall swinging doors. I finally figured out what was going on and installed 3ft x 7ft vents in the end ridges. That was the key. I have never had an over heating problem since. I usually open the vents, end walls and roll up sides starting in early June through harvest. Another huge advantage of opening everything up is to allow all the beneficial insects into the green house. But the bigger reason for proper venting is to eliminate moisture. If you have moisture beading up on the plastic, you have a moisture problem and you must vent. I see in your video that you are running fans and even shade cloth. That tells me you have way to much heat and most likely to much moisture? Mold and bacteria, especially powdery mildew will become your new worst nightmare. The spores will collect in the drain pipes, in the soil on everything. And then the cycle begins next season during high heat/moisture times.
I hope nothing bad has happened but I really enjoyed your videos. Very informative and would love to see some new ones and how the green house is doing.
Put a misting system in and just turn it on a few minutes a day or twice a day for the humidity. Also, I'll be building mine this Spring and in addition to the crops, I'm adding a couple Ponds for some Aquaponics. I think that'll help add humidity. Thank You very much for this instructional video series. I find it of great value and it gives me more confidence approaching this task. 👍😁 God Bless
Really cool project... I would suggest adding an aquaponics component to the greenhouse. In terms of solving the issue of overheating, you wouldnt be able to effectively cool your greenhouse via air based geothermal system in the summer in your specific region...too much humidity and too hot. - I would argue that the only options would be to install several Roof windows... and a Driver fan above each of the doors in the greenhouse... So the driver fans would operate in the fashion of one blows air in and the other blows air out, which would provide a constant air exchange.. and the roof windows would act as a natural release of hot air buildup... that seems to be the only options which are somewhat practical... Driver fans are an easy install... The roof windows are a bit tricky... not sure how that can be done effectively for the polyfilm greenhouse... - Another option that you can try is circulating a bit of water through your geothermal pipes, just a bit, maybe at like 15-20% fill so that the pipes have water only covering a small part on the bottom and the air that you are pushing though can be cooled more by water absorbing heat (water is 800 times more dense than air)... think of a water fountain cooling system thats stuck inside the pipe... once winter comes around, you pump out the water from the geo pipes and run it dry... Again, really cool project... Best of luck!
The water needs to be in the grrenhouse in its gaseous form (water vapour) in order to absorb the heat. When the moist air enter the tubes, it drops to dewpoint and the water vapour condenses out. To change phase from gas to liquid it has to give up the energy it took from the greenhouse to change phase from liquid to gas, The result is warm rain in the tubing, A lb of condensate represents around 1000btu, a greenhouse full of transpiring plants generates a lot of water vapour. Its interlinked, unfavourable temps and humidity in the greenhouse means less transpiration, so less cooling. You can get around this to some extent by using overhead misting to raise the RH% to get the ball rolling. A lot of folks dont realise the plants are an integral part of this system, it doesnt work nearly as well without them..
Haven't seen an update on the greenhouse over the fall winter and spring growing seasons. Very interested in knowing what you have learned/experienced.
Congratulations on a great project! Would planting a row of deciduous trees along the south side leave you enough light to make the house useful in the summer while controlling the temp, and go bare in the winter to give you the full benefit of the sun?
Can we get a brief update on how the process is working? How are the summer time temps, winter, pest and disease pressures, and did it change what you can grow compared to a hoop house or open garden?
You may want to look at a swamp cooler system to increase humidity, lower the temp, and increase the efficiency of the earth battery. These systems are relatively simple to build, but highly effective. Keep up the great work, y'all!
Thanks for taking the time to post this comment. Being in North Carolina - swamp coolers and not something we often think about, but in this circumstance would be perfect. Really wondering if couldn't construct something on the exhaust pipes from the earth battery system and take advantage of the fans we already have running.
Checking in today (3/21/21). I've missed your posts. Your wood chip areas should be nicely composted by now, and the roots from the sunflower patch will have composted ... time for a garden/soil update! Hope you and the fam are well and have weathered our pandemic well!
I hope you do a follow up asking the very same questions at the end of each season. It would be great to document your findings so other's can learn from your first hand experience. A recommendation to help keep the temp down. A roof vent along the peak would be ideal OR a large vent at the peak of each end wall would help a little. Rollup sides are best. Passive air movement is better than forcing massive amounts of air through large fans. Big fans cost big money and they don't fix poor ventilation. 2nd Recommendation. The earth battery need not be directly below the greenhouse. In your soil maybe it would be better to run the earth tubes external to the greenhouse. You could dig a long trench without serpentine routes, just go out 100' and back to the greenhouse (two to four turns max) and you will increase the cooling substantially. This will remedy the problem with drying out the greenhouse soil jetting air out through the ground. Rj - Beyond Harvest Veganistas
Thank you for the thoughtful comment. Good call about the vents in the peaks vs. fans. Roll up sides is on the long list of "to-dos" with the greenhouse. We just didn't get there yet and had to turn our energies to the garden and other things on the farm. We'll get those in before next summer!
Rj Aquaponics, Your 2nd Recommendation is very interesting. I recently watched this CZcams video czcams.com/video/ZD_3_gsgsnk/video.html&ab_channel=KirstenDirksen .If you jump ahead to 10:40 , you will see where Russ says the tubes run 75 feet in one direction + 75 feet in a 2nd direction and is able to use it during the summer and winter.
Yupp, the earth is a huge thermal battery. It makes no difference if you have tubes beneath a greenhouse or not. I like the idea of only have a few turns instead of serpentine with numerous bends.
Looks so good brother. Thanks so much for letting us be a small part. One thing I would like to ask. How much power are you using in a 24 hrs? I just ask as I would like to help tho's who will ask me if they can run this with solar.. Love you guys as my brothers and Sisters in Christ. God Bless guys..
Thanks for all the information! I've been working on a geo-greenhouse on my property for a couple of years in my spare time. Your videos have helped me envision the finish line. I wish I had a tractor instead of just a shovel and a wheel barrow! ;o)
Doug, where do you live? If you are close to Kelowna, BC, Canada, I can go help you out a bit as I am recovering from hand injury - I can do most of the work as you can see the recent videos I posted in my YT account.
Is there a reason there has been no further videos or updates on anything for 4 years?...but there is this comment of thanks for such nice words 1 year ago?...did the greenhouse not work out as you had planned/expected?
Great Update, I must thank you for keeping your videos concise and always on topic. There's so many CZcams channels out there that start rambling on about unrelated items that have nothing to do with the title of the video (just to make their videos longer). Plus, I find that you do such a great at explaining things that you must have been a teacher in a previous life. :-) Thanks you so much..
There have been some very awesome geothermal greenhouses built to cool those temperatures you would need 300 feet of 12 inch pipe under ground and to be able to move 4 times more air then your moving now. 112 degrees is still very hot for a greenhouse. But I'm sure it works wonders for Germination.
I know I'm very late to the party but the cover is probably not enough if you have hot summers. Considering the investment in the geothermal system it makes sense to invest in a more sophisticated cover and vents. Having dug under the greenhouse, there's very interesting systems using side "chimneys" that connect to the greenhouse underground.
Just watched this series and I'm very impressed with what you have done. I would love to get an update on how you've been getting on with it in the last 2 years.
Just food for thought. It might be a good idea to use the exhaust air from the GT/EB system to fill your 2 layer poly cavity. Might cut cost of inflation fan and allow the cooling of the environmental barrier. Maybe a few degree difference in inside temps.
Thank you for sharing, I watched with interest as you and your family working on the project and enjoyed it. You did good and worked hard, be happy about that! I learned from your experience, thanks again. My interest was finding an affordable method of managing the climate in a greenhouse. Especially important as were thinking about producing a house in the Canadian climate that would produce year round. Please accept my thanks for your video experience.
Great videos! Because your soil is sand and below that clay, it's not only a heat and cold bank it's a humidity bank. Sounds like your draining all the humidity ( water ) through the blowers. Can only sustain high humidity if there is moisture left. No humidity less effectiveness in your system. Just add water, but would require some time for it to absorb .my guess.
I have a small geothermal greenhouse. I didn't go as deep. Winter it's not as efficient due to the depth but in summer because it's not so deep so the moisture really keeps things cool
You mentioned that air is coming up and out of cracks in the greenhouse floor. That made me wonder why a perforated pipe was used? Wouldn’t a non perforated pipe perform just as well (or better), because the pipe surface is the temperature of the surrounding soil? Makes me think the perforated pipe would cause the system to perform less efficiently, due to the loss of some of your cooler air through the perforations into the greenhouse floor. Since the system runs most of the time, it’s under positive air pressure most of the time, so air in the surrounding soil never has a chance to enter through the perforations. Also, seems the perforated pipe is the reason there is a drop in air velocity between your air intake and exhaust. Lastly, it seems a non perforated pipe system would help, at least some, with maintaining a higher humidity in the green house. This was a very interesting project. Thanks for sharing it on YT.
Obviously the perforated pipe was a mistake in this whole system from the very beginning...not sure who gave him that information...I think originally he was concerned with creating a greenhouse that heated itself but as we all know and he found out is that heating a greenhouse isn't nearly as difficult as cooling a greenhouse...since there were no updates any more recent than 4 years ago we don't know how the greenhouse maintained warm temperature in the winter which I believe is what he set out to experiment in the first place, but yes of course regular pipe (non-perforated) is usually used for a whole host of reasons
Enjoyed watching your work. What if you were to divide the Greenhouse in half. Half controlled by the earth battery and the other half uncontrolled, since your battery is under-sized then right size the greenhouse!!
Hey, St Isidore's Farm. First off great work and documentation of a really cool project. Secondly, I would like to give you some advise that may help to increase the circulation of the air through the thermal battery system without having to buy new equipment. You have touched on the importance of thermodynamics and for good reason because those principles are always relevant in systems thinking and design. Advice: Switch the fans from the roof of the greenhouse to the open tubes as close to the cool floor as possible. I advise this because of the properties of the fluid (air). Air is more dense at cooler temperatures than the fluffy less dense hot air that rises. The fans will operate at the same specs. However, by taking advantage of the difference in density due to solely changing the Y position (height) of the fans in your closed greenhouse system, the fans will more move more air molecules (Mass) per same unit of volume of air. This is theoretical and I would be interested to see the before and after in the change of wind speed as well as the temperature gain/ loss due to this simple thermodynamic principle related to density. Frankly stated I think that pushing air from the floor of the greenhouse and letting the greater net negative pressure suck the lighter, hot air from the peak passively would improve the function of your system. Let me know what you think, I wish you the best and keep coming out with more good content.
Water in the earth battery will help cool with the evaporative cooling and it also helps with heat transfer between the air and the ground. You don't really want a dry earth battery, because the water helps as long as it is not filling the entire height of the pipe.
The evaporative cooling takes place in the greenhouse, not inside the tubing ;) You want the condensate to drain from the tubes as completely as possible. A tube half full of water will limit the amount of air you can run through the tube, the more air you can run, the better..upto a point.
@@JasonStewartsStreak We really hope to at some point. Priorities in life have put them on the far back burner for a while. But we really do hope to. Thanks for everyone's patience.
Looking into building an EMT greenhouse in my backyard and your video series was by far the best documentary from start to finish (watched it all in one sitting!) My goal is to build a greenhouse that runs off the grid, and I’m hoping to accomplish this with a solar panel feeding a couple deep marine batteries going to an inverter which will power a thermostatically controlled 120v heating element (or two). I’m in CA so we have fairly mild winters. One thought on your design: I noticed the huge amount of runoff you have in your French drains. Would it be feasible to collect some of that drainage into a holding tank and rig up a system with the necessary pumps to water your greenhouse? If you had an elevation change you could put a holding tank uphill and use a solenoid and gravity to water the plants. Just a thought!
I scrolled through some of the feedback and didn't see anyone asking this: Have you done a Radon test in the greenhouse? Since you are using an earth battery with perf pipe I would think that could be a concern.
Great series 👍 and like some of the recent comments before mine, I would also love to see an update, even if it's a bad one. Great work and my best wishes! Stay safe ❣️
Hello, Really great work!!.,. Would there be a follow up of this green house? ... Looking for how two years did affect the stability of thermal output on the battery, and what about that cool crops you mentioned , did it work? ... Those updates and up-grades on temperature control, were you able to implement? Regards from Brasil..
You might try a mist system... I had a small greenhouse in Yuma, Arizona... above ground and a mister system helped with cooling and humidity... it worked really well...just a thought ❤️✝️🇺🇸
My GHAT system should work much better, I used an 18 inch culvert attached to 15 X 3 levels of 4 inch irrigation tubing. At the exit and enter points there are 55 gallon drums where a 1000 cfm blower is attached. I have yet to assemble the 20 X 40 greenhouse over it as it is below 0 F here for the past 3 weeks. Will be starting on it next week, BTW I couldn't find that pressure switch so I came here to see what you installed. I was going to have 3 sides completely enclosed with other construction material other than plastic, because I wanted it to run year around. With a traditional hoop style not sure if the GAHT system can keep it warm enough in winter. This weekend need to get planting 32,000 onions for transplanting in April, which is in my smaller greenhouse. Need to get the new greenhouse finished and running in 2 weeks for warming up the frozen soil under it. Maybe can have the earliest tomatoes in this area.
I'm just thinking about your humidity problem, maybe you could install a water mist injection system at the exhausts of your earth battery system, this system could be controlled by a humidity sensor strategically positioned just like a thermostat. Now I'm no engineer but if I'm not mistaken getting control of your humidity could also help controlling the temperature inside
Did I miss the moisture content of the soil you backfilled the green house with... If the moisture content was low.. I'm thinking you're not getting the most temp. exchange possible.. From a optimum compaction point of view.. The number is usually in the low teens (% soil to water).. In clay it can run as high as 30%.. Easy rule of thumb.. Take a hand full amd squeeze.. (No water running out) You want it to hold it's shape... If it doesn't it's to dry... I personally thank you for your data.. It will help me save time with my initial testing
If you don't mind me asking, do you think this system could be used as an off greed cooling/ heating system for a house or at least as a support for them in a house with walls not and not a membrane ? If so, would it need extracting/ pushing fans per each room? Thanks!
would like to see your greenhouse performance result before winter, in the mid of cold winter, and in spring.. and when a week of cloudy cold wet winter... those are my most concerned questions.. good info. thanks for sharing.. although so many ppl were doing the same thing.. just that they never really tell us the weak point of the green house.. most of them just talking the positive side... i want to know the weakness of it.. what it can't overcome.. appreciate it if you do the update of my concerned questions when winter comes.. then we will really know the pro and con of this system.. May God blesses you and family. thanks andrew
Great update! Was hoping I'd see something from you guys soon. We have roll up sides and wide open doors on our house trying to keep it cool. So far we can keep it at about 5F above ambient on the really hot days without a shade cloth. I do turn on our "cooling" thermostat when the house hits 95F just to hopefully take the edge off. Don't have any great data to back up that it actually does anything, but at the very least I'm banking a little heat. Are you monitoring soil temps? And are your fans on thermostats? I remember you saying that you wanted to thermostatically control them. Our soil at ~2ft down is sitting around 82F, almost too warm for plants (I think I remember someone saying that some plant growth stops when soil temps rise above 85F). Also curious, are you monitoring inlet and outlet temps? At some point are you seeing the soil "saturate" with heat during the day, meaning the delta T between inlet and outlet decreases?
I have an idea that might help with you low humidity. Just like a CPAP machine needing water in its reservoir for Humidity or a Swamp Cooler needing water to help keep in cooler; I was thinking if you put a Swamp Cooler over your return pipes; It should help with cooling and Humidity. Tell me what you think. Thank you for sharing you journey.
You may need mist sprays from the ceiling or portable humidifiers? Many Green Houses in deserts have these on timers>?? Also I am surprised you do not have any screened panels on ends, sides,both that you can open?
Run a 8” pipe out of the greenhouse at about 9 hundred ft, 6’ down. Then bring it back in on the opposite end with a fan in it. Search for Russ Finch’s “Greenhouse in the snow” video on CZcams.
im a drainlayer the pipes always get gunk on them, but i dont think its mold and mildew really, and no drainlayer is concerned about breathing in air from pipes because of that
Why did you use the pipes that has holes in it? I believe my area has a higher water table than yours so the holes would take up water and this would not allow the air flow through them
What are your night temperatures. ? Thanks for the video, I'm very interested in the subject. After you have some time to learn more of the pros and cons, I would be curious if you would do it again.
it might be better to pull the air out of the return instead of pushing the air out of the return... also that would eliminated the extension cords hanging down. pulling air is more efficient that pushing...
Great job, I'm in the planning stage of my greenhouse. Looking forward to hear how the winter went. Have you thought about taking the poly film off during the summer? Is it too hard to get on and off on a yearly basis?
Have you considered installing a desert cooler to increase the humidity level as well as keeping the temperature cooler in the green house during the summer months?
So have you or someone you know figured out how to cool greenhouse using geothermal and how much power will be required to do so.? I really want to build one and live in hot climate region.
I have a simple idea about the fans. If you had fans on both ends and each came on at different temps and blew air in different directions, wouldn’t that be simpler? At 50 degrees and cooler fan a blew then off at 50 then fan b blew at 80 degrees and above. Idea being using simple rheostats.
Great job on the whole greenhouse construction and related information. Have you measured or have any concerns on accumulation of radon gases due to the underground perforated pipes?
We do turn them off at night. There is a theory (We stress theory) that you can "charge" the earth battery with heat during the summer and pull the warmth back out of the soil in the winter. We guess the idea is that if the ground temperature remains relatively constant, you can raise that temperature during the summer and use it in the winter. We'll see if it works and let you know if future updates. Thanks for watching!
Yes I read or saw a CZcams video where a way up North they recommend going down one foot underground with your tubes for each month of winter so if you only have three months you'll need three feet if you have eight months then you need to go 8 feet down
I'd love to see an update on how you maintained winter temps in the greenhouse.
Time to make some new videos!!! I enjoy watching them!
Hey, would love an update on how the greenhouse is doing this winter - specifically if your thermal battery setup is keeping it warm enough to grow through the whole winter. Thanks!
Still waiting
@@SuperDaveP270 Don't think it'll happen at this point.
@@jenson1569 Do you know what happened to them?
@@boringstuff1542 No I don’t, it’s been a while, 3 years and no uploads 😢
It won't. He is running it backwards. You need to be pulling the cold air dense air up out of the the system for it to store heat efficiently. Not forcing warm less dense air down.
What happened to this channel? No videos for years? Are you still around?
Wondering the same! Update us to let us know your ok
Awesome! Thanks for sharing your family project with the rest of us!
Good documenting of the build. I love seeing the enthusiasm of a fun project. I built five 26ft x 100ft high tunnels on our farm about four years ago and installed a very similar system in one of the tunnels as an experiment. I use a big wood stove and the ridge heat to charge up my buried system. The big advantage of a wood stove is that is that I can create heat and still move hot air into the system after the sun sets. The first spring, and only 30 days after firing up the wood stove, I recorded ground temps at 61-63 degrees at a depth of 12" on April 1st. We live in Alaska so that was truly amazing to see. I had a 2-3 week jump on the other market growers that year. So I have some experience with this type of system and with that in mind, I have a suggestion for your greenhouse. I would strongly suggest installing two opening vents above the doors and make them as large as you can. There are times when you need to get that excessive high heat out of your greenhouse right now. What happens on those high heat days is that heat rises and it will collect in the peak of the ceiling area. The heat builds and acts like an insulating blanket creating more heat and radiating heat downward. No amount of fans is going to displace that heat that is trapped up high because the sun just keeps creating more heat and it cant escape. I had this problem big time the first 2 years even with roll up sides and 7ft x8ft end wall swinging doors. I finally figured out what was going on and installed 3ft x 7ft vents in the end ridges. That was the key. I have never had an over heating problem since. I usually open the vents, end walls and roll up sides starting in early June through harvest. Another huge advantage of opening everything up is to allow all the beneficial insects into the green house. But the bigger reason for proper venting is to eliminate moisture. If you have moisture beading up on the plastic, you have a moisture problem and you must vent. I see in your video that you are running fans and even shade cloth. That tells me you have way to much heat and most likely to much moisture? Mold and bacteria, especially powdery mildew will become your new worst nightmare. The spores will collect in the drain pipes, in the soil on everything. And then the cycle begins next season during high heat/moisture times.
Great bit of information thank you
Great video. I have to go back to watch all the videos . Thanks for sharing
I hope nothing bad has happened but I really enjoyed your videos. Very informative and would love to see some new ones and how the green house is doing.
Such a bummer you guys stopped making videos.
How cool is that being able to grow stuff all year long. Been a great project to watch. Thank you for putting these together!
Ok, where is the video of the Plants growing in the Green House.?
Where did you guys go.?
Sux when a channel drops off. What you have could really help a lotta ppl know how well this worked in the long run.
Put a misting system in and just turn it on a few minutes a day or twice a day for the humidity. Also, I'll be building mine this Spring and in addition to the crops, I'm adding a couple Ponds for some Aquaponics. I think that'll help add humidity. Thank You very much for this instructional video series. I find it of great value and it gives me more confidence approaching this task. 👍😁 God Bless
Have really enjoyed this series as you showed each step of the way. Excited for continued updates. Thanks!
Thanks! We are to - should be interesting to see what this greenhouse does in the winter!
@@StIsidoresFarm would love to see a *geothermal and greenhouse review* now that you've had the greenhouse up and running for 2 years !
Really cool project...
I would suggest adding an aquaponics component to the greenhouse.
In terms of solving the issue of overheating, you wouldnt be able to effectively cool your greenhouse via air based geothermal system in the summer in your specific region...too much humidity and too hot.
- I would argue that the only options would be to install several Roof windows... and a Driver fan above each of the doors in the greenhouse... So the driver fans would operate in the fashion of one blows air in and the other blows air out, which would provide a constant air exchange.. and the roof windows would act as a natural release of hot air buildup... that seems to be the only options which are somewhat practical... Driver fans are an easy install... The roof windows are a bit tricky... not sure how that can be done effectively for the polyfilm greenhouse...
- Another option that you can try is circulating a bit of water through your geothermal pipes, just a bit, maybe at like 15-20% fill so that the pipes have water only covering a small part on the bottom and the air that you are pushing though can be cooled more by water absorbing heat (water is 800 times more dense than air)... think of a water fountain cooling system thats stuck inside the pipe... once winter comes around, you pump out the water from the geo pipes and run it dry...
Again, really cool project... Best of luck!
The water needs to be in the grrenhouse in its gaseous form (water vapour) in order to absorb the heat. When the moist air enter the tubes, it drops to dewpoint and the water vapour condenses out. To change phase from gas to liquid it has to give up the energy it took from the greenhouse to change phase from liquid to gas, The result is warm rain in the tubing, A lb of condensate represents around 1000btu, a greenhouse full of transpiring plants generates a lot of water vapour. Its interlinked, unfavourable temps and humidity in the greenhouse means less transpiration, so less cooling. You can get around this to some extent by using overhead misting to raise the RH% to get the ball rolling. A lot of folks dont realise the plants are an integral part of this system, it doesnt work nearly as well without them..
Haven't seen an update on the greenhouse over the fall winter and spring growing seasons. Very interested in knowing what you have learned/experienced.
Where ya'll been? Everything okay?
Of all the builds I've seen through the years yours is my favorite!
Congratulations on a great project! Would planting a row of deciduous trees along the south side leave you enough light to make the house useful in the summer while controlling the temp, and go bare in the winter to give you the full benefit of the sun?
Can we get a brief update on how the process is working? How are the summer time temps, winter, pest and disease pressures, and did it change what you can grow compared to a hoop house or open garden?
You may want to look at a swamp cooler system to increase humidity, lower the temp, and increase the efficiency of the earth battery. These systems are relatively simple to build, but highly effective. Keep up the great work, y'all!
Thanks for taking the time to post this comment. Being in North Carolina - swamp coolers and not something we often think about, but in this circumstance would be perfect. Really wondering if couldn't construct something on the exhaust pipes from the earth battery system and take advantage of the fans we already have running.
Checking in today (3/21/21). I've missed your posts. Your wood chip areas should be nicely composted by now, and the roots from the sunflower patch will have composted ... time for a garden/soil update! Hope you and the fam are well and have weathered our pandemic well!
Would be super interesting to see how your earth battery system is holding up. Can you post an update video?
Is this an abandoned channel, no updates?
I hope you do a follow up asking the very same questions at the end of each season. It would be great to document your findings so other's can learn from your first hand experience. A recommendation to help keep the temp down. A roof vent along the peak would be ideal OR a large vent at the peak of each end wall would help a little. Rollup sides are best. Passive air movement is better than forcing massive amounts of air through large fans. Big fans cost big money and they don't fix poor ventilation. 2nd Recommendation. The earth battery need not be directly below the greenhouse. In your soil maybe it would be better to run the earth tubes external to the greenhouse. You could dig a long trench without serpentine routes, just go out 100' and back to the greenhouse (two to four turns max) and you will increase the cooling substantially. This will remedy the problem with drying out the greenhouse soil jetting air out through the ground. Rj - Beyond Harvest Veganistas
Thank you for the thoughtful comment. Good call about the vents in the peaks vs. fans. Roll up sides is on the long list of "to-dos" with the greenhouse. We just didn't get there yet and had to turn our energies to the garden and other things on the farm. We'll get those in before next summer!
Rj Aquaponics, Your 2nd Recommendation is very interesting. I recently watched this CZcams video czcams.com/video/ZD_3_gsgsnk/video.html&ab_channel=KirstenDirksen .If you jump ahead to 10:40 , you will see where Russ says the tubes run 75 feet in one direction + 75 feet in a 2nd direction and is able to use it during the summer and winter.
Yupp, the earth is a huge thermal battery. It makes no difference if you have tubes beneath a greenhouse or not. I like the idea of only have a few turns instead of serpentine with numerous bends.
I wish folks would fit temperature sensors at intervals in these long tubes so they could see just how poorly they perform ;)
@@JohnGuest45 u dont think it works?
As winter progresses keep us posted .
Looks so good brother. Thanks so much for letting us be a small part. One thing I would like to ask. How much power are you using in a 24 hrs? I just ask as I would like to help tho's who will ask me if they can run this with solar.. Love you guys as my brothers and Sisters in Christ. God Bless guys..
Thanks for all the information! I've been working on a geo-greenhouse on my property for a couple of years in my spare time. Your videos have helped me envision the finish line. I wish I had a tractor instead of just a shovel and a wheel barrow! ;o)
Doug, where do you live? If you are close to Kelowna, BC, Canada, I can go help you out a bit as I am recovering from hand injury - I can do most of the work as you can see the recent videos I posted in my YT account.
Are you still around? How are you? Did you quit ? +JMJ+ God bless
Happy with all the information you supplied. This is very help. Thank you so very much.
I have watched the 10 previous greenhouse videos, and I really enjoy your channel. I have learned a lot. Thank you very much.
Thank you for the kindness of taking the time to write share such kind words!
Is there a reason there has been no further videos or updates on anything for 4 years?...but there is this comment of thanks for such nice words 1 year ago?...did the greenhouse not work out as you had planned/expected?
Great Update, I must thank you for keeping your videos concise and always on topic. There's so many CZcams channels out there that start rambling on about unrelated items that have nothing to do with the title of the video (just to make their videos longer). Plus, I find that you do such a great at explaining things that you must have been a teacher in a previous life. :-) Thanks you so much..
Thanks for the kind words. Actually, I'm a teacher in my current life!
St. Isidore's Farm Wow, I knew it!! Keep up the good work.
Aquaponics is a great idea! Should do a video on that!
There have been some very awesome geothermal greenhouses built to cool those temperatures you would need 300 feet of 12 inch pipe under ground and to be able to move 4 times more air then your moving now. 112 degrees is still very hot for a greenhouse. But I'm sure it works wonders for Germination.
I know I'm very late to the party but the cover is probably not enough if you have hot summers. Considering the investment in the geothermal system it makes sense to invest in a more sophisticated cover and vents. Having dug under the greenhouse, there's very interesting systems using side "chimneys" that connect to the greenhouse underground.
Just watched this series and I'm very impressed with what you have done. I would love to get an update on how you've been getting on with it in the last 2 years.
Great update and a wonderful build!!! We still chat about your findings and how we can apply some of the knowledge you shared! Thanks for sharing!!
Thank you for following along and all of the encouragement - we do appreciate it!
Just food for thought. It might be a good idea to use the exhaust air from the GT/EB system to fill your 2 layer poly cavity. Might cut cost of inflation fan and allow the cooling of the environmental barrier. Maybe a few degree difference in inside temps.
Thank you for sharing, I watched with interest as you and your family working on the project and enjoyed it. You did good and worked hard, be happy about that! I learned from your experience, thanks again. My interest was finding an affordable method of managing the climate in a greenhouse. Especially important as were thinking about producing a house in the Canadian climate that would produce year round. Please accept my thanks for your video experience.
Great recap! Love the follow up. Very helpful to someone else making one of these. Greatness. 👍👌
Very well done series of video on earth batteries. You guys are cool, thanks for sharing.
Great videos! Because your soil is sand and below that clay, it's not only a heat and cold bank it's a humidity bank. Sounds like your draining all the humidity ( water ) through the blowers. Can only sustain high humidity if there is moisture left. No humidity less effectiveness in your system. Just add water, but would require some time for it to absorb .my guess.
Hi there. I loved your channel but I wondered why you stopped posting ?
I have a small geothermal greenhouse. I didn't go as deep. Winter it's not as efficient due to the depth but in summer because it's not so deep so the moisture really keeps things cool
When I build a larger one I'll do 2 layers on deep and the other just like 3 feet under the bed.
You mentioned that air is coming up and out of cracks in the greenhouse floor. That made me wonder why a perforated pipe was used? Wouldn’t a non perforated pipe perform just as well (or better), because the pipe surface is the temperature of the surrounding soil? Makes me think the perforated pipe would cause the system to perform less efficiently, due to the loss of some of your cooler air through the perforations into the greenhouse floor. Since the system runs most of the time, it’s under positive air pressure most of the time, so air in the surrounding soil never has a chance to enter through the perforations. Also, seems the perforated pipe is the reason there is a drop in air velocity between your air intake and exhaust. Lastly, it seems a non perforated pipe system would help, at least some, with maintaining a higher humidity in the green house. This was a very interesting project. Thanks for sharing it on YT.
Obviously the perforated pipe was a mistake in this whole system from the very beginning...not sure who gave him that information...I think originally he was concerned with creating a greenhouse that heated itself but as we all know and he found out is that heating a greenhouse isn't nearly as difficult as cooling a greenhouse...since there were no updates any more recent than 4 years ago we don't know how the greenhouse maintained warm temperature in the winter which I believe is what he set out to experiment in the first place, but yes of course regular pipe (non-perforated) is usually used for a whole host of reasons
I thought it might help to mention that keeping a few full open rain barrels in the green house works great to increase the humidity in the summer
An overhead misting system is far more effective
Enjoyed watching your work. What if you were to divide the Greenhouse in half. Half controlled by the earth battery and the other half uncontrolled, since your battery is under-sized then right size the greenhouse!!
Interesting idea!
Hey, St Isidore's Farm. First off great work and documentation of a really cool project. Secondly, I would like to give you some advise that may help to increase the circulation of the air through the thermal battery system without having to buy new equipment. You have touched on the importance of thermodynamics and for good reason because those principles are always relevant in systems thinking and design. Advice: Switch the fans from the roof of the greenhouse to the open tubes as close to the cool floor as possible. I advise this because of the properties of the fluid (air). Air is more dense at cooler temperatures than the fluffy less dense hot air that rises. The fans will operate at the same specs. However, by taking advantage of the difference in density due to solely changing the Y position (height) of the fans in your closed greenhouse system, the fans will more move more air molecules (Mass) per same unit of volume of air. This is theoretical and I would be interested to see the before and after in the change of wind speed as well as the temperature gain/ loss due to this simple thermodynamic principle related to density. Frankly stated I think that pushing air from the floor of the greenhouse and letting the greater net negative pressure suck the lighter, hot air from the peak passively would improve the function of your system. Let me know what you think, I wish you the best and keep coming out with more good content.
Thank you!
Yes, pulling air instead of pushing air
This is FANTASTIC!
Very interesting channel! Are you going to make anymore updates?
Water in the earth battery will help cool with the evaporative cooling and it also helps with heat transfer between the air and the ground. You don't really want a dry earth battery, because the water helps as long as it is not filling the entire height of the pipe.
The evaporative cooling takes place in the greenhouse, not inside the tubing ;) You want the condensate to drain from the tubes as completely as possible. A tube half full of water will limit the amount of air you can run through the tube, the more air you can run, the better..upto a point.
You are a very good teacher... your work is awesome and inspiring...❤️✝️🇺🇸
Thank you! God bless!
@@StIsidoresFarm Are you guys planning on making any new videos?
@@JasonStewartsStreak We really hope to at some point. Priorities in life have put them on the far back burner for a while. But we really do hope to. Thanks for everyone's patience.
Great videos, I am planing on the construction of a greenhouse soon, you gave me a lot of ideas, thank you
You're welcome! Thank you for watching.
Looking into building an EMT greenhouse in my backyard and your video series was by far the best documentary from start to finish (watched it all in one sitting!) My goal is to build a greenhouse that runs off the grid, and I’m hoping to accomplish this with a solar panel feeding a couple deep marine batteries going to an inverter which will power a thermostatically controlled 120v heating element (or two). I’m in CA so we have fairly mild winters.
One thought on your design: I noticed the huge amount of runoff you have in your French drains. Would it be feasible to collect some of that drainage into a holding tank and rig up a system with the necessary pumps to water your greenhouse? If you had an elevation change you could put a holding tank uphill and use a solenoid and gravity to water the plants. Just a thought!
Would love to see a review, on the geothermal greenhouse now that you're bad at running well over two years !
Yo... What updates do you have on the geothermal Greenhouse?
Impressive project and efforts !
thanks for sharing your experiences! Great video!
Add few Vent on the roof will help the heat to escaped on hot day ; )
Buddy hope you are all well, I was wondering how things look these days.
Any new videos?
I scrolled through some of the feedback and didn't see anyone asking this: Have you done a Radon test in the greenhouse? Since you are using an earth battery with perf pipe I would think that could be a concern.
Great series 👍 and like some of the recent comments before mine, I would also love to see an update, even if it's a bad one.
Great work and my best wishes! Stay safe ❣️
We're hoping to get one uploaded before too much longer. Thanks for everyone's patience. God bless.
@@StIsidoresFarm , thank you for the response. It's great to hear that you guys are alright 👍
Still waiting on an update?? Do you have another channel?? Site?? etc??
Hello, Really great work!!.,. Would there be a follow up of this green house? ... Looking for how two years did affect the stability of thermal output on the battery, and what about that cool crops you mentioned , did it work? ... Those updates and up-grades on temperature control, were you able to implement?
Regards from Brasil..
You might try a mist system... I had a small greenhouse in Yuma, Arizona... above ground and a mister system helped with cooling and humidity... it worked really well...just a thought ❤️✝️🇺🇸
I would love to see if closing up half of the greenhouse, or making it half the size, improves the summer temps.
My GHAT system should work much better, I used an 18 inch culvert attached to 15 X 3 levels of 4 inch irrigation tubing. At the exit and enter points there are 55 gallon drums where a 1000 cfm blower is attached. I have yet to assemble the 20 X 40 greenhouse over it as it is below 0 F here for the past 3 weeks. Will be starting on it next week, BTW I couldn't find that pressure switch so I came here to see what you installed.
I was going to have 3 sides completely enclosed with other construction material other than plastic, because I wanted it to run year around. With a traditional hoop style not sure if the GAHT system can keep it warm enough in winter.
This weekend need to get planting 32,000 onions for transplanting in April, which is in my smaller greenhouse. Need to get the new greenhouse finished and running in 2 weeks for warming up the frozen soil under it. Maybe can have the earliest tomatoes in this area.
A 1000cfm fan for each layer of tubes would give you a better chance of cooling in the summer.
I'm just thinking about your humidity problem, maybe you could install a water mist injection system at the exhausts of your earth battery system, this system could be controlled by a humidity sensor strategically positioned just like a thermostat. Now I'm no engineer but if I'm not mistaken getting control of your humidity could also help controlling the temperature inside
Very informative. Thanks for answering those questions.
Did I miss the moisture content of the soil you backfilled the green house with...
If the moisture content was low.. I'm thinking you're not getting the most temp. exchange possible..
From a optimum compaction point of view..
The number is usually in the low teens (% soil to water).. In clay it can run as high as 30%..
Easy rule of thumb..
Take a hand full amd squeeze.. (No water running out)
You want it to hold it's shape... If it doesn't it's to dry...
I personally thank you for your data..
It will help me save time with my initial testing
Awesome video. It's costly but it worth it. Loved and subbed.
If you don't mind me asking, do you think this system could be used as an off greed cooling/ heating system for a house or at least as a support for them in a house with walls not and not a membrane ? If so, would it need extracting/ pushing fans per each room? Thanks!
Awesome series, thank you so much! Happy 4th of July to you folks:)
You're welcome and thanks for watching!
would like to see your greenhouse performance result before winter, in the mid of cold winter, and in spring.. and when a week of cloudy cold wet winter... those are my most concerned questions..
good info. thanks for sharing.. although so many ppl were doing the same thing.. just that they never really tell us the weak point of the green house.. most of them just talking the positive side...
i want to know the weakness of it.. what it can't overcome..
appreciate it if you do the update of my concerned questions when winter comes..
then we will really know the pro and con of this system..
May God blesses you and family.
thanks
andrew
Would love to hear how things go in winter
Great update! Was hoping I'd see something from you guys soon. We have roll up sides and wide open doors on our house trying to keep it cool. So far we can keep it at about 5F above ambient on the really hot days without a shade cloth. I do turn on our "cooling" thermostat when the house hits 95F just to hopefully take the edge off. Don't have any great data to back up that it actually does anything, but at the very least I'm banking a little heat. Are you monitoring soil temps? And are your fans on thermostats? I remember you saying that you wanted to thermostatically control them. Our soil at ~2ft down is sitting around 82F, almost too warm for plants (I think I remember someone saying that some plant growth stops when soil temps rise above 85F). Also curious, are you monitoring inlet and outlet temps? At some point are you seeing the soil "saturate" with heat during the day, meaning the delta T between inlet and outlet decreases?
I have an idea that might help with you low humidity. Just like a CPAP machine needing water in its reservoir for Humidity or a Swamp Cooler needing water to help keep in cooler; I was thinking if you put a Swamp Cooler over your return pipes; It should help with cooling and Humidity. Tell me what you think. Thank you for sharing you journey.
You may need mist sprays from the ceiling or portable humidifiers? Many Green Houses in deserts have these on timers>??
Also I am surprised you do not have any screened panels on ends, sides,both that you can open?
Very cool! I am working on something similar in Africa.
Run a 8” pipe out of the greenhouse at about 9 hundred ft, 6’ down. Then bring it back in on the opposite end with a fan in it. Search for Russ Finch’s “Greenhouse in the snow” video on CZcams.
To keep the humidity level constant, why don't you just add a 4 inch layer of wood chips on the ground?
Can always stick on of those ac cleaner sprays in once a year to clean the pipes
im a drainlayer the pipes always get gunk on them, but i dont think its mold and mildew really, and no drainlayer is concerned about breathing in air from pipes because of that
Good answers THANKS!
Why did you use the pipes that has holes in it? I believe my area has a higher water table than yours so the holes would take up water and this would not allow the air flow through them
great project.
What happened to this channel? Such great content.
Fab ….. any updates. Where did you go?
Any update on your winter months and how the system worked?
What are your night temperatures. ? Thanks for the video, I'm very interested in the subject. After you have some time to learn more of the pros and cons, I would be curious if you would do it again.
You guys did a wonderful job documenting this project. Do you happen to have any info/feedback on the temps it maintained in the winter?
it might be better to pull the air out of the return instead of pushing the air out of the return... also that would eliminated the extension cords hanging down. pulling air is more efficient that pushing...
Great job, I'm in the planning stage of my greenhouse. Looking forward to hear how the winter went. Have you thought about taking the poly film off during the summer? Is it too hard to get on and off on a yearly basis?
Have you considered installing a desert cooler to increase the humidity level as well as keeping the temperature cooler in the green house during the summer months?
So have you or someone you know figured out how to cool greenhouse using geothermal and how much power will be required to do so.? I really want to build one and live in hot climate region.
I have a simple idea about the fans. If you had fans on both ends and each came on at different temps and blew air in different directions, wouldn’t that be simpler? At 50 degrees and cooler fan a blew then off at 50 then fan b blew at 80 degrees and above. Idea being using simple rheostats.
What's happening in the green house? How did it work in the winter?
Great job on the whole greenhouse construction and related information.
Have you measured or have any concerns on accumulation of radon gases due to the underground perforated pipes?
It's been two years since an update- anyone knows what happened to them?
Thank you
Hey hey! Been a winter..you planning on a update video? Thanks man, great videos.
Awesome!! Thanks for the update. Have you thought about shutting the 6 inch fans off during the summer?
We do turn them off at night. There is a theory (We stress theory) that you can "charge" the earth battery with heat during the summer and pull the warmth back out of the soil in the winter. We guess the idea is that if the ground temperature remains relatively constant, you can raise that temperature during the summer and use it in the winter. We'll see if it works and let you know if future updates. Thanks for watching!
Yes I read or saw a CZcams video where a way up North they recommend going down one foot underground with your tubes for each month of winter so if you only have three months you'll need three feet if you have eight months then you need to go 8 feet down