Who Is the WORST UNIT in All of Fire Emblem
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- čas přidán 20. 04. 2023
- part 2 here: • Bad Units Tier List Co...
Thanks to @MythrilZenith for joining me!
Who is actually the worst unit? We dive deep into this super complex question in part 1 of this 32 part video essay that will shake the foundation of fire emblem as we know it. - Hry
I haven't seen a comment like this, so here are the timestamps for the video:
3:51 Bantu (New Mystery of the Emblem)
6:34 Fiona (Radiant Dawn)
10:46 Sophia (Binding Blade)
14:15 Gray (Gaiden)
16:59 Setsuna (Fates: Birthright)
20:46 Robert (Thracia 776)
25:34 Wolt (Binding Blade)
30:00 Vika (Radiant Dawn)
36:15 Lucia (Path of Radiance)
42:00 Rolf (Path of Radiance)
47:13 Amelia (Sacred Stones)
49:50 Est (Shadow Dragon and the Blade of Light)
56:19 Bunet (Engage)
59:10 Arden (Genealogy of the Holy War)
1:00:10 Bors (Binding Blade)
1:02:09 Jubelo (New Mystery of the Emblem)
1:03:36 Flora (Fates: Conquest/Revelation)
1:04:25 Brady (Awakening)
1:10:19 Jagen (Shadow Dragon and the Blade of Light)
1:12:06 Nyx (Fates: Revelation)
1:13:56 Ashe (Three Houses)
1:22:03 Karla (Blazing Blade)
1:24:40 Astrid (Radiant Dawn)
1:26:56 Asaello (Genealogy of the Holy War)
1:29:11 Gunter (Fates: Revelation)
1:33:24 Mist (Radiant Dawn)
My biggest Rolf memory was playing an iron man, losing Titania, pulling Rolf off the bench, and at the end of the game, despite being missing for over half the game, Titania still had more kills than Rolf.
Based
I must've gotten really lucky with rolf in my playthrough, he actually capped str really early and was an mvp in a lot of levels lol. Specially ones with birds.
“I just eaked by” - Ashe
I think my favorite "bad" unit has gotta be Marty in FE5. He literally comes with ZERO speed and skill, like Kaga himself is laughing at you to just try and build him. He's so bad that when he actually does get a kill its super hype. That and his awkward portrait facing the player just make him so endearing, and when you finally promote him to Warrior he's actually kind of a beast!
Just remember, it ain't a party without marty.
I knew Sophia would be sent to worst of the worst. Icon!!! 💖
I love that you mentioned Fiona’s utility. I think she’s so pretty but it’s hard to make her a good fighter.
Sophia is one of the original and greatest Girlfailures I’ve ever seen and I stan her for it tbh
She also comes in at chapter 7. You can use her in the prison break map. Well. Rescue utility
Counterpoint for using Setsuna: Takumi annoys me and I will never deploy him
So Brady is one of the better awakening kids, he can get gale force from his mom and by the point you get to him you will have plenty of seals to reclass him and rescue staff spam is a pretty good way to grind levels while helping clear maps
Also if you wanted he starts at level 10, meaning he can be promoted right off the bat. Given that awakening level is infinite, you don’t have to worry by missing levels. I would put Brady in “not actually bad”.
I would say Brady just falls off due to availability and his lackluster bases compared to the enemies around him in his join chapter. If you aren't lucky, he can be outright killed if you can't rescue him fast enough.
That being said, Brady is a magic unit in a game where magic is broken and his choice of fathers with the options of Ricken and Henry opens up his options tremendously. Just the utilization and specialization of magic in Awakening should keep him out of this list in a whole.
Granted, as a character he might as well be a more punkish yet less predjudiced Shinon, but that's not what this tier list is judging.
Kid units in awakening can be whatever you want them to be, so it must be hard to tier them. All of them have the ability to become unstoppable player-phase demigods, except for Yarne, Gerome, and Laurent.
At least berseker yarne is low key kinda crazy. But in ability to get gale force does inherently put him below all the rest unfortunately.
@EmissaryOfSmeagol dont sleep on gerome. He makes a great rally bot w access to 4 rallys res from his mom, luck and magic from priest and Sage, then I belive troubadour turns into Fighter and gives him rally strength, then have his father past down gernal for rally defence
Instead of talking about how the units you love are bad, we're talking about how the units we all say are bad are actually good. Let's go!
Thanks for having me on, I had a great time and can't wait for part 2.
so that's why shannam and samuel weren't here
I think you nailed the Ashe description, he's not bad per say having both axe and bow boons means he gets super valuable death blow and hit+20 earlier than most others, but when that is your most "unique" quality in a game with Raging storm Edelgard or battalion wrath+vantage Dimitri, it pales in comparison.
I recently did a Setsuna + Corrin backpack solo of Birthright Lunatic, so yeah, I can confirm it’s possible. Of course, that doesn’t make Setsuna good, it’s just further evidence that Birthright is super easy haha
IMO good and bad units in BR don't make it easier/harder just more/less boring haha
@@DaniDoyle lmao yeah, 100%
Mr. Tree, please have mercy for Maribelle, she has just married Libra in my save file
@@diogenes26 I saw you change your answer 👀
Satsuna my beloved 🙏
I think vika is a very funny unit in this context. She’s not actually “bad” but on top of the game not letting you train her there’s only 3 playable ravens and one of them is better than half the playable cast stat wise and the other is nealuchi.
Judging radiant dawn units is so weird tbh
@@DaniDoyle Fiona is probably the best example of that because until now I thought she was pretty decent she just has horrible chapters
I’m so sad to see Mercedes on this list.
When it comes to her attack magic she has no extra range spells or effective damage and with her good but not Constance/Lysithea level magic growth she ends up being not so great offensively. When it comes to her support magic spells she can basically full restore your whole team 2 maybe 3 times a battle. And she has physic and can take off all negative effect offs your units but the sad thing is that you usually don’t end up needing to use her support spells other than physic which makes her sadly the most meh of healers. Her full restores do come in useful on the last map in Crimson Flower though! And since she does have a good magic growth, you can put her in Valkyrie and she is decent.
To be fair, I use Lysithea as a Dancer/Mortal Savant Hybrid.
also, she's the only in-house healer who can't get Physic before Chapter 2, lame
Fortify in crimson flower is often an active detriment because it ruins Bernadetta's vengeance damage. And if you aren't running vengeance on Bernadetta then you are still gonna rather use physic to top up Edelgard while she's in Timbuktu getting picks.
Fun fact about Bors utility! In chapter 4 he can survive alright vs nomads and iron sword cavaliers so if there is one of those enemy types alive (maybe even two!!) and someone defensively weak like Elen or Lugh are in range of that enemy he can rescue them without being in a lot of danger.
I shat myself when seeing that Lindon is considered bad.
Mage knight levin sword Lindon was my jam.
Can't wait to see part two! Good video buddy!
I actually feel better about Linda now than I did when this to your list was filmed but I still think he's one of the lower tier units in the game, not because he's bad but because almost anything he does other units do better. Engage's cast is just so strong
@@DaniDoyle Yep, that I can see however. I got him when all my magic casters were falling off. Céline falls off, Citrinne falls off, never used Ana because, why would I in a first playthrough? Jean falls off mostly do to deployement slot and because Pandreo is a thing. And I didn't use Hortensia because I can't stand her. That, combine with the fact he's the only red unit you can recruit, really makes me want to use him with both Pandreo and Ivy. And I don't know, I feel big brain when reclassing him into mage knight with the levin sword. Basically a middle finger to Céline falling off.
If he goes Sword Griffin for Levin Sword shenanigans, his stats surpass Griffin Chloe in most important areas, he only really loses out in Spd and Lck, and his big Con lead pretty much closes the Spd gap when using the Levin Sword (until lategame when Chloe's Spd growth can catch up) And he gets his Staff rank bumped up from C to B. The unfortunate part is that the build itself is prolly stronger earlier in the game, when the Levin Sword can flex its ridiculous Mt better, so Chloe or Pandreo would be better at it looking at the whole run, but he can do it and the build holds up late into the game. Levin Sword good.
(or if you're not into that build, Thunder is C rank so crit engrave plus Olwen just gives him Magic Hunter's Volley)
The Wrath+Dire thunder build is actually nuts. And it's not very hard to setup. He carried in maddening ch22 in my first run.
I used to play Fates online all the time, in terms of building as many optimal units with capped stats for destroying enemy castles and winning battles against friends. In that specific scenario, where growths and bases are not a factor, but the cap modifiers are, Setsuna is actually just a mid-tier archer. Better than Takumi when capped, funny enough, because she has a +3 Speed, and Takumi has -2. Which means that if both players have them as the same class and the same number of statues, Setsuna will always double Takumi.
That being said, Shura is a top 5 unit in all of Gen 1, and also commonly runs a bow set, so Setsuna has stiff competition. Still a very fun unit, I’d say!
I paired Setsuna with my MU in a birthright lunatic run because funni fast archer and I wanted to try a Sniper Kana. Ended up going for Kinshi Knight early then changed back to Sniper around chapter 16 cuz crit go brrt. Needless to say it was a fun iteration of Kana I never expected to do so well.
I used her in my last BR run. I tried making her work as a combat unit, so I did a skill path where I put her into great knight with swordfaire and other damage boosting skills. she did fairly well, but still wasn't really a frontline unit into the endgame due to her poor survivability. I kinda wanna use her as a swordmaster in another run. Her dodginess is pretty good then.
Bunet is so bad that the Fell Xenolouge joke when he talks to Evil Fogato is legitimately just "Man you were such a good unit"
LMAO
The only stat difference between Ashe and Bernadetta that matters when it comes to spamming Deadeye is that Ashe has +1 base Dex. Their base Str and Str/Dex growths are identical. If both use Deadeye with the same build, Ashe has 1 whole extra Hit on Bernadetta, while she can still get herself the +5 Atk from her personal that Ashe can't. I see the point how Ashe can be useful with it, but if Bernadetta supposedly doesn't have the stats for Deadeye then neither does he, she is just as capable (and honestly better thanks to her personal) at pulling off that build than Ashe is.
Thank you, Bernie is honestly just better. Sure she has a bane in axes but she doesn't need it since she can just go falcon knight if she needs to fly.
@@cryguy0000 tbh if you want her to fly you might pick Falco over Wyvern for her anyways even if she didn't have the axe bane so Lancefaire boosts Vengeance (or the based option, Dark Flier for flying Rescue :V)
My mom isn't on this list. Incomplete research.
She's in part 7 actually
One thing you missed about Robert is that he has 3 PCC (x3 crit rate on follow up). Not that it makes him good, but when trained up he can become a crappy Fergus, which is pretty funny
Crappy fergus with no Beo sword? Acceptable
The case with Fiona is so dumb. Ingame she's portrayed as a really strong unit being the daughter of one of Daein's former four riders and as a gameplay unit she is so incredibly bad with her bases. I think it's due to some programming error that gave her level 1 base stats instead of level 9 base stats because those base stats are NOT Level 9 stats. Then add to the fact you only get to use her for TWO chapters the first part BOTH of which are INDOOR whihc gives her a -2 to movement.
Such a shame too because she has a few good things going for her. Earth affinity and TWO free skills. But her base stats... yeah you'll need some incredible babying an d cheesing to make her viable. And bsides, the Dawn Brigade is already incredibly starved for EXP to begin with. At least she gives you another Thani tome later in the game.
I remember training Fiona to Paladin. My brown Imbue queen. What a gimmick.
It's ironic as this race is usually athletically the fittest.
another thing with ashe is if you want to make him a wyvern, he isnt awful by any means. i prefer bow knight build, but if you give him a rapier as a wyvern knight he can be a flying armor shredder
Haven’t watched one of your vids before and was pleasantly surprised by both your content AND by your guest (who I love). Great video!
Awesome! Thank you! I'm also a fan of Zenith's content :)
Honestly it feels so weird seeing Ashe get called a "bad unit" in general because every run I've done of 3 houses with him, he's been an invaluable MVP of my team, like playing without him feels so weird for me personally because he just always ends up really well-leveled and strong
he did better than my sylvain for my first few BL runs anyways LOL
brady’s section is funny because it’s a random mashup between laurent and brady himself with no warning
I’m glad y’all were nice to Ashe, he deserves it. He’s a good boy :3 (literally nothing further than him being a boy who is good, I think he’s a good kid with a good heart and it fucked me up to kill him on my blind playthrough of Three Houses)
Brady slander when he's a part of the Maleforce :(
Brady's viability is really dependent on how Maribelle and her husband's stats are like. Since his base stats are Maribelle's + her husband's stats + brady's base stats /3. Him also being able to get galeforce does make him amazing for the dlc maps where they expect you to have maxed out units so having another galeforcer can come in real handy. For a normal playthrough though, I can see him being rather forgettable. He could be quite th magic powerhouse if Ricken is the father and gives him tomefaire so he can promote to sag right away. Even as a level 10 priest, his stats are just depended on his parents in the end. The same could be said for all of the Awakening kids.
Why did y’all use Alva’s portrait for Robert? Don’t disrespect my boy Alva like that! 😭
I'll disrespect the Thracia scrubs all day
I honestly hate how much meta-gaming for these SINGLE PLAYER games have taken over the fandom, but at least we can admit that some characters are fun to use even if they aren't the best or require some extra investment.
MERCEDES IS CONSIDERED BAD? she carried me singlehandedly through all 4 of my 3h runs
there's no truly awful units in 3H except Anna
Dedicated Healers in three houses aren’t really amazing where in theory everyone can be a healer, she lacks warp along with an eh reason spell list. Fortify is very situational compare her to lindhardt and he is a vast improvement
@@nightwish1453 I don't think falling short of amazing should count as being bad.
Oh well, here we goo because I have a lot to talk about those units.
Fiona: My favorite use of her is rescue droping Yellow units in 3-13 to block the higher grounds.
Sophia: The greatest thing I've seen one person said about her is using ch14x and ch15 to baby her and promote for another staff user, good in an ironman context.
FE2 Gray: (I don't know if this is his portrait lol) A good use is sacrifice him and choosing mage as his class to chip damage for your mercenary Kliff in chapter 1.
Setsuna BR: Fine because it's BR, I used her a lot due to my girl archer bias
Setsuna Rev: like half of the cast, bad availability
Roberto: ... Can be captured to access the special Gaiden, I guess. At least scrolls can fix him
Wolt: decent filler. Can be Marcus' support partner and gives 1 defense, 5 hit, 5 avo , 5 crit evade. They start with 20 points and are +2, so 20 turns left to build C support.
The best thing about Wolt Marcus is both can be fillers, meaning that they don't wate support slot in long term units like Allance.
And Wolt can be a good bait in ch 4 because at base he is ORKO by cavs, a perfect sacrifice when someone miss 80 hit.
And yes, you can get 2 Orion's bolt in one of the Western Isle map because one of them is from a village and the other is from all Klein's NPC
Vika: for some people is "we had Jill at home(swamp map) meme", to me is must use unit in the swamp map.
Lucia: At least she is good in RD lol
I honestly think that FE9 Wolt is better than FE10 Wolt because RD isn't a game that I want to train a unit in a part that has a lot of ready to use great units
FE1 Est: Actually fun to train, specially with triangle attack set up when one of the other sisters does the chip damage to set a crit kill to Est
Bunet: I love Bunet and hate Alfred, but sadly Alfred is better. SAD
Arden: haven't used yet because I'm lazy to move him across the map except for the pursuit ring to Noish
FE12 Yubello: ... I can't think of a way that he lives after the first few turns in ch 4 lol
FE1 Jagen: He does Jagen things pretty well with iron sword. And decent bases with 10 mov
Nyx: For a moment I thought it was CQ Nyx because I think Rev Nyx is ok lol. Rev Nyx has time to grow and build supports unlike other nohr units who joins later. CQ Nyx ... her hit rate is a big problem, usually used as mother.
Ashe: good boon choices Axe and bow are what matters to him. Brigand-> Sniper and that's it, hunter's volley death blow build ready. He will never be a good option to recruit, but he works fine in AM as a weak sniper who can non tanky units with crit
karla: her recruitment is her personality, good unit
RD Astrid: Even Paragon can't save her. F
Asaelo: I like him but I usually just use him on arena and to chip damage some ch8 wyverns. F
RD Mist: I don't remember if she can promote with a normal Master crown. The last time I promoted her was in 2018
??? How on earth is Sophia good in under an Ironman context?
@@pksprite6401 she is another staffer, you need a couple, and if you somehow manage to lose most of them Sophia can be trained to 10 and promoted in 14x, so she is "good" in that sense. Not combat wise obviously
@@felicepompa938 she’s not even good in that context. She has easily the worst staff utility in the game, needing to gain a brutal 9 levels off combat just to reach E rank, which just gives you heal. If you really want an emergency E rank staff user, Raigh even joins a bit earlier. She’s good in an Ironman context in the sense that every unit is better when they might be the literal only option you have.
(Want to talk about some of the Fates units since I do have some experience with some of them)
With Flora I do think she's otherwise worse than generic Maids on Lunatic along with no partner personal unlike Gunter, Jakob and Felicia so she's marginally worse. She can still grant Felicia Dark Mage through their support (which is a fast one) so I guess if you want Felicia as a magic user and need Odin or Leo to marry someone else, she has that (though being a backpack for arguably the worst version of Felicia since no Vantage is definitely not great)
With Setsuna she can pass on Archer to any child units or Gen 1 units that want it either through marriage or friendship, which is a plus I suppose. Marrying her to Takumi gives her Spear Fighter which you could mess around with in it's skill selection for Kinshi since Takumi wants Sniper more. Ninja reclass also worth bringing up since Mechanist lets her use bows and separate herself from Takumi to some degree but I'd argue he's still outright better. She's still definitely outclassed by Takumi but she's definitely not as bad as people make her out to be, and somewhat fun in Revelations since she gets access to classes like Berserker for crit builds or Bow Knight for utility
With Nyx you only mentioned Rev Nyx so idk if it's worth bringing up her Conquest stuff since she's more mediocre to underwhelming (outclassed by Odin, Leo, Ophelia and even to some extent Camilla as a dark mage) in Conquest compared to outright bad. Noteworthy things being she's one of few units who can get Vantage in Conquest thanks to Odin alongside Leo and Ophelia, and she has access to Archer from Mozu. Because of this she can weirdly work well with Conquest's magic weapons since she has access to every -faire skill through supports (Swords from Odin, Bows from Mozu, Axes from Arthur and Keaton and Shurikens from Kaze). This is pretty niche though but definitely could be funny to mess around with if you like her enough
With Gunter... yeah Gunter is just kinda ass in Revelations, both in regards to no supports and worse stats. He's significantly better in Conquest thanks lower internal level and higher level cap allowing him to get pretty ok skills but otherwise he's still mainly a stat backpack that can carry on his joining chapter and works as a marriage bot for female Corrin. Still if we're just talking about Revelations only, then he's pretty much worse than his Conquest counterpart in every way and a bench warmer past the early chapters
weakest shit unit enjoyer vs strongest S tier unit enthusiast
My inner demons are fighting again
14:40 Darn, that was my opportunity to simply add the comment "hate speech", but I double checked and you did pick out the right portrait.
Edit: Apparently, all Yumi have one additional might relative their Bow equivalents, with about 10 less hit. Not noticably worse tbh.
Amelia is potentially the only "Halberdier" in GBAFE which makes her extremely cool as far as I'm concerned
oh, lord. I got near the end of the video and was like, "they're only halfway through"
There's a part 2 AND a part 3!
I will make a small case for fiona if you can get her up to your other units she is usually pretty tanky and her magic is good enough that renewal will usually get her close to max hp so it let's your healers do more or even her since she doesn't need to use healing items as often
Mist requires Holy Crown and cannot use the Master Crown. She can, however, just hit level 21 to promote like any other unit, and that is what was changed from Japanese to English versions. In Japanese versions you need a promo item to reach Tier 3 classes (but not Tier 2).
Revelations Setsuna is nice during the chapter you get her, since she can help other units your forced to use that chapter like Ryoma attack for a second time safely. She can also double quite a few enemies that chapter in Lunatic, which can be nice for building dual guards. Haven’t really tried using her much after that though.
FE11 Bantu is definitely a Worst of the Worst unit too. He gets one-rounded by enemies in his joining chapter on Hard 5, while he has all the problems you described he has in FE12 of nearly nonexistent growths, no reclassing nor promotion, and being stuck to using Firestones (of which you only get one of by the time he joins in FE11 from a difficult-to-reach village, and you won't get the second and only other Firestone until many chapters later from an enemy Manakete that is absurdly strong on Hard 5, so you can't even try to grind him up to make him usable even if you wanted to). He doesn't have to deal with all enemies having Vantage+ like FE12 Bantu does, but that turns him from being the worst unit in the series... to the second worst unit in the series.
Hey I used nyx in a revelation playthrough got her to 20 in both premotes and she had 20hp by the end of the run
I’ve developed a soft spot for Johalvier in my last few Genealogy playthroughs, like it really does save on Running Seliph out to the west of the map so you can get Julia Nosferatu… I mean he’s no as camp as Johan but he’s very sincere :)
Can't believe Jesse is in this list. He becomes the best unit after you mummy grind him and dread fighter loop him to capped stats. I will have to leave a dislike and report this video for misinformation.
maribelle get darkflyer and thus can give bradi galeforce
the problem with him is that he have no weapon mastery + staff locked
1:28:36 Asaello does have access to the killer bow on an all-subs run, and Deimne is usually better off using the brave bow, so he doesn’t really need it. The killer bow isn’t even necessarily better than his silver bow, however, so it doesn’t make much difference either way.
Imo the biggest upside to killer bow is the extra hit (crit is nice but 100% hit is poggers)
@@DaniDoyle I don’t know any exact doubling thresholds, but the killer bow is also much lighter than the silver bow, so it might allow him to double a bit more often as well. Even then, he has the same problem as Jamke where his pretty good combat doesn’t do much due to low movement, and you don’t even need him to deal with wyverns since you get Hawk around the same time.
my fondest fe6 meory is that the gods decided bors would be a monster and by the end of my playthrough he capped speed, strenthg and defense
I too, had a speed capped bors. But in all honesty even when he don't get much speed I still use him. Uses axe and can tank anything. I don't care if he doenst double. Bors is a beast
I don’t need sleep. I need answers.
this video made me realize there are many different ways to play awakening because when yall were like “can brady even inherit good skills from maribelle?” I WAS LIKE GALEFORCE?! then i realized apparently not everyone is galeforcemaxxing
Galeforce is 35 levels away (10 of which are stuck staffing). It comes far too late on brady to be worth it IMO (I go more in depth on this in my awakening tier list)
1:05:15 as a member of the Brady Collective (my real name is Brady), this hurts my soul. “No amount of skills can help him.” 😭
1:10:20 “this is probably the most enjoyment Brady has ever given anyone.” I’m DYING
It's such a shame that archers aren't that good in Awakening. I like Virion as a character. If he were more developed, he could easily be a foil or mentor figure to Chrom ( showing the sacrifices and hardships that being a leader of a country entails, even more so when you consider that Chrom was never brought up to inherit the kingdom).
I think two simple things changes would make archers, including Virion, more viable outside of Lunatic runs due to their extra hit rate skills. One, have them learn a skill that hits at 1 range or just have their weapons hit at 1 range. It's criminal that Awakening doesn't have that and Fates does. It nerfes the potential of this class into the dirt. Second, make archers resistance tanks. Make their niche into mage killers. This would already work with Virion considering one of his reclasses is to the Mage line. It would also work with Noire since Tharja is her mother and a mage. It writes itself.
48:42 Journeyman2 promotion options are Super Journeyman or Hero. Recruit2 promotion options are Super Recruit or Paladin. Pupil2 promotion options are Super Pupil or Sage. And they all share the same +0 Con promotion bonuses.
Bernadetta actually has a combat art that only her and Claude have which lets them keep one enemy in place without a gambit.
I didn’t wanna kill Hilda in my CF play through so I brought Bernie with a training bow to keep her in place for like, ten rounds lol
Yeah Bernie's kit is kinda stacked. Encloser, Vengeny, Persecution Complex, Pass, heck even rescue if for some reason you don't like her combat. I love Bernie
@@DaniDoyle
I’d definitely describe Bernie as an A tier character tbh. Honestly a lot of black eagles are pretty good from my memory.
Edelgard is obviously S tier
Hubert is prolly B tier because his best class (Valkyrie) is unavailable to him 💀
Ferdinand is just swift strikes A or B?
Petra has one of the higher strength growths out of the speedy units and she gets into flying classes easier than most A tier imo.
Dorothea has a great spell list and makes for a pretty good Valkyrie (she is lucky her dmg targets res 😅) B tier
Lin is pretty good with flier effective dmg and warp and physic (he is quite literally worse Hapi in every way though 😭) A tier
Caspar is definitely the worst out of them but still can do pretty nice dmg as a grappler C tier prolly
@@biandanxious3438FE3H units tend to give good impressions when invested into, the golden deer are all pretty amazing as well.
Claude is S tier just because his stats are good an unlike the other lords his personal class is very good. He’s probably the worst house leader but he’s still very good.
Lorenz can go either mage or cav, and he’s mediocre at either, and then he promotes to dark knight to be mediocre at both at the same time. B tier
Hilda is basically Petra, except a little bit slower but with more charm, both go into flying classes well, and are fast, strong units.
Raphael is if caspar consumed his speed growth to become more powerful (in strength and defense.) which is fine on maddening because caspar isn’t fast anyway, C tier.
Lysithea is the best mage in all of FE3H no contest, she has boons in both magic types and has a personal skill that increases the gains in those weapon ranks in combat, and makes her master classes faster, and she learns warp at B, compared to everyone else who learns warp learning warp at A she has swarm which can help with speed checks, Luna, which is useful vs high res units that’d normally give her a hard time, and dark spikes, which makes all cavalry a joke and is very strong otherwise as well. S tier.
Ignatz has hit +20 as a personal skill which means he can become crazy accurate and stack hit +20 with itself, which makes him very reliable, and he has an authority boon, and he’s more than capable of being a good bow unit. A or B tier.
Marianne is a solid healer who trades Mercedes’s “overkill” healing for Silence, Frozen Lance, and a good reason spell list. A or B tier
Leonie is a very good unit, she can go into a lot of different classes and her personal skill makes her very nice in the early game, she also learns point blank volley. A tier
@@samkeiser9776 I agree that Lesotho’s is busted but my personal opinion is that Hapi is the best mage. She is the easiest character to get (because she is an ashen wolf dlc character lol) and her support is insane. She has an amazing spell list offensively and defensively, she can use warp potentially more than usual thanks to her crest, and she does more dmg against demonic beasts but if she is within their atk range she will basically get attacked guaranteed. So basically effective beast dmg for free lmao.
@@biandanxious3438 recruiting in FE3H isn’t extremely hard because any student you get to a B support has a 10% chance of asking to join your class every week, which can be save scummed, so basically only a handful of them can’t be recruited super early by speeding through a support, like Ferdinand and Leonie (Ferdinand’s B support is locked to post time skip and Leonie’s is locked to after Jeralt dies.)
So Lysethia can be recruited pretty early via this method.
I think the main reason that Lysithea is better than hapi is because she has warp at B and a faith boon and her personal skill boosts her ranks. Lysithea also has an authority boon as well. in comparison to Hapi being neutral in faith, having warp at A and an authority bane.
As far as I know, Crest of Timotheos cannot activate on warp, and even if it could I’d think Lysithea’s warp being B rank is better than Hapi having an 20% chance to save a warp use.
Hapi’s personal skill is really good if you know how to take full advantage of it, but both lysithea and her learn Seraphim vs monsters. And Lysithea on the other hand learns dark spikes to delete cavs.
Also it’s still really really good that lysithea has an authority boon.
But that’s just my opinion.
Oh my god! You 10/20/20’d Amelia into the world’s fastest General, too!?
as did I on my first playthrough. it was amazing lol
Brady with Libra as his father was fundamental for me to complete apotheosis, the hardest chapter in the game. Every children are above the fathers but if you don't play the highest difficulty you don't need them
in my last fe8 draft, i decided to make neimi my project and was genuinely surprised at her performance. i fed her a few kills and promo'd her post chapter 6 and despite not having reliable 1-2 range she had plenty to do.
There really is a trope about the 'bad archer' who actually becomes the best archer
[I am Altruistic-Computer, but have embraced my true form and become MS paint Midir]
The main thing I remember about Robert is that when you put the official thracia website through google translate it calls him 'a little bit of a motherfucker?'
Maribelle can pass down Galeforce to Brady (she has pegasus knight in her class set), so I guess he has that in a hypothetical situation where you managed to get Maribelle to reclass, promote and reach level 15 - but then again, Yarne is the only child unit to be unable to get Galeforce.
lindon is very deadly +20% cri from skill, 1 extra thunder hit from rings
if u stack cri on him, he always kills ppl
this was rough as someone who's favourite fe character is brady. The fact that you forgot even his name stings 😭
I'd argue that 'planned obsolescence' units like Wolt should go in 'not actually bad' personally.
Don't know if anyone said it, but Catria and Est have equal growth totals which are 7 higher than Tiki's.
I am a massive Vander supporter, and I will say, he isn’t awful, he’s got good growths and decent build. His big problem is his awful bases and his massive internal level (Level 15), so he can’t even take advantage of his pretty good growths until later edge game
Paladin also doesn’t help him, I recommend shifting him into a different class as soon as possible
TBH I don't think you reclass Vander because in a vanilla playthrough you don't use him after chapter 8 (which is when you first get access to second seals)
Fair enough honestly. I’m a bit biased cause I’m a Vander simp so maybe that’s why I think he’s really good
I wouldn't count his growths as good either unless you're comparing it to jagen or that type.
I love these kinds of videos because no matter who ends up at the bottom, I can always say "that's not even the worst character in their own game let alone the series" and at least three madmen will agree with me
Bors is a special case where he suffers more from the game he’s in than actually being bad. In FE6 terms, his stats and growths aren’t that bad and he should fill a fairly valuable role as an early tank. However, hard mode bonuses combined with it being an early-game sea of axes just completely destroys his role unless you’re gonna feed him kills.
Even on normal, Bors struggles to fill his role without being fed experience because hit rates are bad and once again it’s an early game sea of axes. So he’ll be a wall and not do much more unless you actively put work into him.
Then, the absolutely biggest tragedy for Bors is that every chapter is a seize chapter. If there were some route or defense chapters, he’d be able to do more than plug a hole in a path. And that’s how you get a magical situation where everything working against Bors makes Wolt better than him despite how Wolt should be worse based on class, stats, and growths.
Journeyman 2 promotes to either Journeyman 3 or a Hero.
Recruit 2 promotes to either Recruit 3 or Paladin.
Pupil 2 promotes to either Pupil 3 or Sage.
Guys, I have terrible news. That's not Robert. That's Alva.
Dire thunder Lindon with the Balenciaga drip copium.
Robert is a favorite for me, the limited dialogue he gets just really endears him to me. I do agree though, he's the longest training project of the horse boys, and not being able to interact with the capturing mechanic is rough.
He becomes very crit and avoid happy after the training montage, I definitely prefer his fun factor to Alva, Cain, and even Callion, who is obviously post-training a better unit, but in a more, idk, boring way after a while.
Fun fact though, Callion and Robert are the two horse trainee-esque types who have an FCM above the standard 1. I forget what Callion gets, but Robert gets 3 FCM.
Also, if anyone was curious, his death quote was what made me like him. It just suggests a pretty complicated messy scenario with very little text, and that's what I like about it.
Oh thats interesting! I wonder why Kain and Alva got such low fcms :(
@@DaniDoyle Right? It feels like they each could have gotten something like it, I mean that or a different skill for each, so as to let Cal and Rob have their thing
One thing Bros kind of has is that in a negative growths playthrough he can get rid of his weapons and divert the attention of enemies with his large defense stat while not gaining much exp. In chapter 1 I distract pretty much all the initial enemies with him while other units sneak past. Chapter 2 he can choke enemies at the first fort so Shanna has enough time to carry Marcus and Roy near the gate. Chapter 3 you can go the top route and use him to choke the top right corner from the soldiers that give chase. Chapters 4 and 5 he isn’t that useful due to a lack of good points for him to choke. Chapter 6 he can choke a few hallways if need be. Chapter 7 onwards he kind of just falls off as simply better units join and Barth can be used as a better wall.
To be fair though I haven’t gotten past chapter 8 yet due to running out of the armorslayer in one of my runs making chapter 8 a lesson in futility.
interesting...
Personally for me the worst of the worst is Sophia :
- You get her in a desert chapter and gotta protect her
- She is a lvl 1 Shaman and you just got Milady and will Percieval will join you next chapter lmao
- You can feed her all the kills , promote her at 20/20 and she still gets one shot/two shot and double
- Furthermore she does not even have hard mode bonuses , so sucks more to be her
- Foot lock unit with tomes that weight her down big time , who would have thought it was a great idea?
- The other units like Bantu can have small uses on like stalling or chip damage even on a 0% growth while Sophia is just so terrible on every category
- To put more salt to the wound , there are far better mages that you get , Lugh has availability, Raigh is decent with hard bonuses , Cecilia and Niime have insane utility , Clarine is your only mounted healer early game , Saul is pretty good early game , even the first cleric you get in chapter 2 has way more utility. EVEN HUGH COMES with decent stats LMAO.
Raigh does not have hard mode bonuses
Raigh doesn't have hard mode bonuses but he still has better stats at base and at 20/20 than sophia
Guiding Ring tho
i’m pretty sure that sophia would get one-rounded in chapter one with her bases
Bunet is bad relative to Engage characters but tbh he's still a better unit in Engage than like 30% of the FE6 roster
I'd put him in greatly outclassed or outclassed but still fine tbh personally
I'd definitely say outclassed but still fine.
Most of the effectiveness of engage characters are defined by what ring their using more than what the individual unit brings to the table. Even if they had no ring, Bunet could just reclass to hero and dual assist + chain attacks to contribute to the rest of the army.
Just considering Bors to this list should be a crime. I don't think I ever had a bad bors. Integral part of any FE 6 run I make
I feel like the thing of Ashe vs. Bernadetta is that Bernadetta, like y'all said, only really works in the context of persecution complex + vengeance. Like overall Ashe has equal better growths for most stats (5% higher magic, 15% higher luck, 5% higher res, 10% lower charm in the battalion game tho) but doesn't have the same sort of win condition that Bernadetta has.
Imo Bernadetta is kinda like Cyril in that their stats are perhaps lower than they should be to compensate for a strong personal ability. Bernadetta's damage is just fine at full health and Cyril doesn't have a single base growth at or above 50% without aptitude before class bonuses.
I mean, stats are kinda at their least important in 3 houses, which is the point i was making. Bernie and Ashe have nearly identical stats in all the areas that matter, but Bernie has Vengagnce + Peg Access + Encloser + PC + Pass + Rescue (I dont think rescue matters for her tho) which is why they lie at near opposite ends of the tier list under most criteria.
See also Cyril actually being quite good in 0% growths
Marth is there. I cannot forgive.
Well at least my man Bunet is at the top of the tier list for once
Delicious
1:16:12 This claim is absurd. Ashe and Bernadetta have identical growths in STR, DEX, and SPD and the same STR base. Ashe has slightly higher base DEX and SPD (by 1 and 2, respectivley) but this difference is negligible. Ashe's boon in axes making it easier to go into Brigand is not that substantial either when compared to an In-house Bernie or a recruited Bernie in Fighter as D+ axes is easy to get. When it comes to averages, they'll be identical in the same Classes, but Bernie has her personal skill which makes her stronger than Ashe on average which, when comparing them as Deadeye spamming Bow Knights, is the main factor of comparison. So, even without vengeance, Bernadetta would be equal, if not slightly better, than Ashe in the same role.
That is the point that I made, they have virtually identical stats, and are a good demonstration of why stats are not a defining point in three houses.
Where does nil from fell xenologue go on this list? I had to turn down the difficulty because protecting him was too much of a chore in ch 1
We recorded this before Fell Xenolouge came out, but he's pretty worthless yeah
to be fair, that one is intentional. he's deliberately pretending to be weak and is a liability on purpose. He's trying to screw you over.
Oh I didn't actually see Ashe there until you guys started talking about him. I find it strange he's there at all when it seems that the common consensus I've seen in the 3Hs communities I'm in that the bad units are Raphael, Ignatz, Cyril, Anna (who I do see there), and Alois
Kinda makes me wonder what your opinions on Ignatz are since he's the bow user for Golden Deer (and therefore I think its easier to compare him to Ashe, who's the obligatory bow user in Blue Lions even though the class system was entirely redone for 3H anyway lol)
Cyril was previously believed to be bad because people didn't understand a few things about his kit, but it's pretty common concensus that he's a very good unit, she's actually able 1 round every single enemy in his joint chapter and continues to be a very strong delete button throughout the entire game thanks to his access to vengeance and point blank volley
Ignatz is way better than Ashe in that he has better personal skill, he has authority boon so faster good battalion access and at D rank auth(which he starts at E+ so you can get it at chapter 2 if you want) he gets rally speed which is insane early game. He also have breakshot that's also really good. He starts in a house with Hilda who in the early game wil almost always give him +3 damage with good positioning and Ashe doesn't have that in his house.
Lindon with dire thunder + wrath is good and funny
I wanted to use jade jn engage when I got her and when I did
- 0 HIT
- Got 1 shot by most units for some fkn reason
- hits like a wet noodle
Now shes my strongest unit, this also happened with Gregor(awakening), Ignatz(3 houses) and fukin peri(fates)
The problem with Vika is that she's not great at either shoving or rescuing due to low Con. She is, however, able to shove Tormod across the swamp, which is her biggest contribution. Her second biggest contribution is probably carrying Micaiah up the map in 1-E, though you can just use Volug and Nailah for that and get better combat and more movement, and the lack of Canto doesn't really matter, especially if you use Pass.
I was definitely overrating Viika at the time of recording, it had been a while since I had played RD hard mode and for some reason I though she could do more than she realistically can.
I KNEW I WASNT INSANE THAT RIDERSBANE WASNT EFFECTIVE AGAINST PALADINS!! 😭😭😭
Bad units are so much fun, I love all of them 🙏
That’s not Roberto that’s my boy Alba a very good knight, you guys have done him bad
I do have a dumb arugment for Astrid. I tried using her for a randomized tower run and her low strength actually can help spare the revolters since at least on normal mode (jp hard mode) they prioritize their health over killing enemies. So if you want to have the enemy not focus on Geoffery you could use her to chip damage. In general though I do prefer her stats over Fiona who a nightmare to train in the same challenge. Also Astrid has a free paragon so you could get double experience along with more skills. Again she a fun meme tier for me, but I could see the tiniest argument to help her. Still no retaliation and can't use crossbows does suck.
On hard Astrid is one rounded by every unit she cam face. That's not the sign of a strong unit
18:40 ish Yumi are actually stronger than bows. They are basically to bows in this game what axes are to lances. Considering the archer class (the primary people you are going to be using yumi on) have a bunch of bonuses to hit through skills, I’d say Yumi are actually fine.
Indeed, especially so if you promote to Sniper and get the innate boost to accuracy / if you take advantage of Air Superiority as a Kinshi Knight
Is Miranda on this list?
No but honestly she should be
I suspect Nyx:Rev gets a lot of flak from Nyx:Con. Since in conquest you dont have any time to bother with her and her fragility. Rev gives her more room to try which means you have more room to not like her instead of her inevitably dying a horrible death in conquest.
I found Henry father Brady to be an amazingly good War Monk because he can get very high magic AND axefaire for bolt axe.
It's a niche, for SURE, but it's a niche that made him unique because nobody could do it quite as well as him. It still doesn't make him that useful for a regular playthrough, but it would DEFINITELY move him to "fun meme unit" for me.
Priscilla always turned out amazing for me, she was my dark banisher/healer to go at almost every FF8 run, she holded in fact the light tome and was a monster tbh, Marisa too was almost a must-use for me, she used always the Adhulma or whatever the name of that blade is, for some reason, she ended up better as Joshua 3/4 times, Joshua had only 3 or 4 points more in strenght but Marissa outclassed him in everything else. Sophia i liked her and did try to make her work, but she was just so slow, weak(low Might) and with almost non existent skill that it was impossible.
Very interesting video, but I think you messed up with Alva and Robert in Thracia hahaha. The portrait is Alba's who is a lance knight while you were talking about the bow knight who is Robert. I can understand I might do that myself talking about Fates characters so it's a pass.
Yea, we mixed the portraits up 😂 we actually addressed this embarrassing mistake in the sequel (which is coming out this upcoming Friday) its funny but tragic I think Robert Alva Kain and Carion are all so similar I always mix them up
I'm looking forward to the video! They are a bit similar yes but I like them so much as a squad like a cooler Wolfguard (because despite Wolf and Sedgar, the original squad is terrible 😂) . One of the main reasons I want a remake is they get a bit of spotlight along with Glade and Selphina. Actually all of Thracia's cast is so underappreciated by the community, I feel.@@DaniDoyle
Not going to lie I had zero idea that Virion and Ashe were even considered bad units 😂
Actually that is not Robert, that is Alva
You used the wrong portrait for robert that’s Alva
Honestly I strongly disagree with your assessment regarding Flora. Flora at worst is a mediocre staff bot. The formula for staff accuracy in Fates is (Hit + Magic + Skill + Weapon Level Bonus). The only maids you can capture in Conquest are in chapters 18 and 26. A chapter 18 maid has 17 mag and 21 skill, while Flora (who for context can come in right before ch19) has 16 mag and 25 skill. A/B rank gives +5 hit and S rank gives +10 hit. So after adding it up, disregarding staff accuracy, the generic maid has 48 hit and Flora has 46 hit. She is technically worse but only by 2 points and for a unit you get for free. Which in the context of assessing units is always a big bonus, getting a unit for free is always a boon no matter what. So at the bare minimum Flora is doing staff work, primarily with the freeze staff, for free with no investment or capture needed. She's still low tier in the context of Conquest, but that doesn't make her worst of the worst at all, especially when a free freeze user is extremely useful. She's definitely better then FE12 Bantu whose the closest FE has come to a genuinely unuseable unit and Sophia who gets orko'd in her join map by mages and only gives a guiding ring. She for sure does more then BR Setsuna who at most can ohko fliers in chapters 11/13 and that's about it. The placement is also especially egregious considering that Izana isn't even on this list, even though he comes later with the same points you levied against Flora. Flora is definitely mediocre and a bottom 10 unit in Conquest. But she far outranks most of the units on this list, let alone being called worst of the worst.
Yeah in retrospect I'm probably a bit too mean to her just because of how she stacks up in comparison to conquests cast, the fact that the rest of the units are so strong makes me feel bad about her in comparison but she definitely doesn't belong in the same tear as absolute trash like a bantu
@@DaniDoyle Honestly that makes sense. When everyone is so consistently good, to be on par with a generic is really bad game feel. It doesn't help that Flora, even in the context of Conquest, ends up being lower tier anyway. I get why you feel that way about Flora, because it really is just "how much do you value freeze use". That reminds me how Izana is completely outclassed by a generic Onmyoji in ch22 which has shurikenbreaker and tomefaire. Having units on par/outclassed by generics in a cast as strong as Conquest just feels bad. So I do get where you were coming from.
my first thought of skimming this list was being baffled seeing elincia on the list. she's fine in fe9, and in fe10 she and haar unironically solo 2-E. really curious to see where she ends up
thieves also strike me as weird to dock(except for ashe bc thieves have 0 fuckin utility) bc they're thieves. maybe sothe fe9 is because of his inability to promote and therefore weaker str and spd? curious to find out
I think Lynn and Eliwood are arguably some of the worst units in the series. Because they're force deployed on some maps and are game over conditions, they are an active detriment if you don't train them. But they're such a pain in the ass to train that it's even more of a detriment if you do train them. With most bad units, even if they suck, you can just not use them and they won't hurt you. But with Lynn and Eliwood, they hurt you no matter what you do.
I know you could argue that other "bad" lords have the same dynamic going on, but I disagree. With other lords, they're force deployed on EVERY map in the game, not just some of them. This means that in almost all cases, it is worth it to train them (only possible exception is Roy, but most people would say he is still worth it to train, at least for new players).
Me looking at the people actually on the list: Oh I use this one and this one and this one and this one and
I mean... what part of the deadeye build mentioned for Ashe bernie doesn't just do better? the only thing that he has over her is easier axe access but even then it's not unreasonable to get it on her before like chapter 6, even if you're unwilling to gamble certifications. besides that, she has the same dex growth with 1 less base, same strenght base and growth plus persecution complex, which means that even without her skill or vengeance, she does the same damage as him with deadeye with the same accuracy. Besides, unlike him, she actually has encloser so she's actually better at it than him bc she has the utility of freezing a dangerous target for a turn
I agree they're identically started and so theoretically if you wanted to do that build they would both be equally good at it, but I also don't think that I is a particularly good build so I don't see it as a selling point
@@DaniDoyle makes sense. Personally I got great use of Bow Knight Bernie on my maddening SS run for the maps where I didn't skip with flier vengeance Bernie bc she could safely freeze dangerous targets for a turn while still being able to delete stuff with vengeance when needed
Astrid was one of my strongest units in PoR but I didn’t play RD because I got really bored really fast. I can’t believe she’s so bad in RD because she had such amazing growths in PoR.
Setsuna would prob be really really good in Conquest. In Birthright it's not even a choice, you'd just as soon run priestess Sakura as your dedicated bow user if Takumi or Reina weren't already in your sights.
Yubello is really good.
At dying in his join chapter. Holy shit is it hard to protect those little gremlins.