I don't know a drummer who makes drumming look so easy as Bruford does. . But it isn't the way he plays. Seen him live with Bruford, AWH, Earthworks. Really amazing.
Mike Mangini in this hilariously entertaining yet technically incredible drum solo haha - czcams.com/video/krCovJgKUVQ/video.html I think the sweat is from all the coke he must have been on haha!
A lot of drummers mask their single-stroke rolls around the drumkit as something more complicated by flailing around a lot. Bruford knows his rudiments amazingly well, and he doesn't feel the need to hide anything.
@MorbidManMusic I listened to about 60 seconds of your CTTE cover and you are actually not playing it correctly. There are a lot of different paradiddle variations he's using and you're playing what more resembles the Alan White butchery of the song. You seem to have an over-inflated opinion of yourself. Then again, you're being critical of one of the most respected drummers of the 20th and early 21st centuries
+MorbidManMusic For someone who claims that Bill is their "idol," you certainly show a lot of disrespect. Perhaps the lack of talent +Tim Allbritton is claiming carries over into both your lack of understanding what an idol is and how to present appreciation for an idol in a way that actually appreciates them. Bizarre-o ("morbid") comment.
I dont know nothing about technic`s drum or even i dont play drums, but I LOVE to see and hear so much virtousity, talent and musicality from this master. He´s clearly one of the best drummers alive and one of my favorites as well as Weckl, Chambers, Colaiuta, S Smith, Bozzio, Minemann, R Morgenstein etc...
It’s incredible the way that Bill chose to use Simmons pads just for alternate sounds instead of trying to duplicate the sound of his traditional drums.
@DongFangSue He's equiped with: Simmons SDX electronic drums, Tama Artstar II Drums, Paiste Signature Cymbals 14" x 6½" Tama wood snare drum (10) Simmons ZI drum pads 22” x 16” bass drum. 12" x 10" Tom Tom 16" x 16" Floor Tom 14" Sound edge Hi-Hat 18" Power China 16" Power Crash 20" Dry heavy ride Gong Drumheads: Evans. Genera 190 snare batter, Genera G1 on Tom tops, Resonants on bottoms, Genera G2 on bass drum and Genera G2 on front Drumsticks: Pro-Mark, SD-1 or SD-9 :)
I love when Bruford does those groups of fives between his ride, kick drum, and snare drum. I think he also does it between his floor tom, snare drum, and kick drum.
l could watch the Bruf _babe_ play all daylong! His technique is impeccable and l don't care _what_ he's playing. lt sounds great to me. He's got the best wrists in the biz. Class and charisma.... with chops up the wazoo! Love ya Bill!
You went to a show that Bruford was part of - never knew what setup he would have. He was like a science teacher - "I think today, will go with this widget (drum) for the lab instruction"
Being a BIG GREAT Bill fan I'm really amused about the Simmons sounds! When he changed between acoustic to electronic sounds it is like he fell over into a work bench full of weird metal objects........;-))
@@paulbrocklehurst7253 I think they had Gavin Harrison, who frankly is a superior drummer in every way. Nothing against Bill Bruford, but Gavin is at the next level regarding technique and tone (I'm not a drummer but I love the sound of his kit(s)).
+U2WB What frustrated me most is that White has/had tremendous _potential_ ...listen to his best work on GFTO for instance. He has produced some absolutely amazing drumming. But then, it seems like he prefers to default to 4/4 making sure he hits that snare on every 2 and 4. Easy, pop, and rock. Even when Yes was more pop, I still longed for that progressive edge. Imagine if Bill was on 90215 (lol)...I like 90125 a lot, but it'd have been off-the-hook with Bill's input. ...But prolly less of a commercial success in the process. Nothing at all against White, I was just completely convinced he chose not to push his talents, and instead just did his job. It was frustrating.
@@Discrimination_is_not_a_right No, but it has to be interesting. If we're defaulting to common time snare drum on 2 and 4, something I've heard a million times before, I'm going to lose interest quickly. When White chose to get creative, it was amazing. When he didn't, it just wasn't.
@@JoinTheProgress Perhaps when the drummer is keeping time, it's so your interest can be on one of the other players, or on some other aspect of the music entirely. As a musician, you have to know when to make it interesting, and when to let someone else take their turn in the spotlight and not distract. Knowing how to do that is tasteful.
@MalstrumX I think that with Yes Bill was still growing as a drummer. It was still basically at the start of his carreer. He had lots of cool and awesome ideas, but they were just beginning to flourish. His drums and cymbals might've also just been crappy. Still love everything Bill did with Yes and later on he went far beyond that era in his playing.
@MALSTRUMX you should listen to some of the King Crimson stuff, Bill's drumming with his time at King Crimson is amazing. I recommend you the song Indiscipline and Frame by Frame to check out his drumming.
It's hard to pick just one good drummer, I think the bill bruford is my number one pick King crimson UK touring with Genesis his solo career that should say it all
@spercoco: It's only one thing: quite a few drummers despise electronic drums, for whatever reason. They have this and that drawback, on the other hand so many possibilities - I absolutely prefer them. Using a real hi-hat though. And that is the reason why some people say they sound like crap or limit your creativity (while the opposite is true) or what else. You would be surprised on how many records you're listening to E-Drums rather than acoustic ones.
Personally,I'd rather watch Bill that any other drummer living or dead. I had the fortune to see him twice with ABWH and King Crimson.Nobody sounds like him 'cause nobody is wired like he is.
@spercoco: I told you, most are using hybrid kits with integrated Roland or Yamaha pads or - as I said - at least an Octapad at the side. I've seen BTW Phil Collins at the Genesis Reunion tour. His drum technician actually asked Wolfgang from simmonmuseum if he could sell him one of his Simmons Kits. Wolfgang doesn't sell stuff, but here he made an exception and lend a Simmons SDS V. They were using newer Pads though for obvious reasons.
@maxcohen13: The SDX was a fantastic piece of hardware. Of course far too expensive, especially the kit Bruford is playing, but nevertheless really awesome.
@maxcohen13: It's simply not a piezo switch - a switch knows only "on" and "off". Why was the SDX never a commercial success? Several reasons: - The complete kit was about $10,000 - It needed much work from the owner becauise of the limited sound database, so you had to go and sample your own stuff (like Bruford shows here) - At the End of the 80ies, more and more people turned against electronic music in general (see the success of grunge music)
I remember seeing Earthworks in the late 80s then again a few years later and the lineup was replaced. I"m wondering if this was by design or necessity?
@spercoco: I see what you mean. Spliff BTW has a drummer called Herwig Mitteregger, who is regarded as one a germanys (actually austrias) best rock'n roll drummers. Cascada is a german dance act. Of course this stuff has nothing to do with drumming, it's solely drum computer, what you would need for this kind of music. You probably seen videos of live acts of Schiller. Schiller makes electronic music, but the live versions differ quite a lot, because he's playing with a band there.
@spercoco I play an electronic kit because I play in a Christian RockBluesFunk band and they are perfect for Churches where Acoustic kits are too loud . I have been playing for 16 years and I didn't know what I thought about playing an electronic kit . But it didn't take long for me to fall in love with the ability to save all kinds of different kits for all the different songs . Possibilities are endless on an e kit . No it's not exactly like playing an acoustic kit . But with the right amp fo
It isn't a similar sound. The aim wasn't to get a similar sound, or to replace BB or anyone else. The three interact with incredible variety and technical precision to achieve polymetric shapes and textures which would not be possible for one drummer, whoever they were.
@spercoco You stated, "He gets less creative when uses them." Can you tell me what specifically about his technique when he switches to electronic drums gets "less creative?" I can buy into your opinion of the electronic drums sounding "awful," as you put it, but I don't quite understand how you are gauging "creativity." Do you have a specific set of variables that make your idea of creativity more supported?
@spercoco: Namedropping, I can't get over it, thank you, you made my day. Before you tell me about conservatorys, learn how you spell it. Hint: it's not "conservitory". I doubt that they hire guys you can't spell the name of the institution. You really crack me up, thanks for that! No, I didn't learn producing in a fancy institution. I learned it the hard way. Probably the reason I'm making some money out of it while you're paying your mortgage for the next twenty years.
@Easleytee I don't know about that. I'm a Weckl fan, but he doesn't have enough humanity/soul in his playing. It's gotten better as the years went by, but in my opinion Weckl can't touch Bruford and what's more, Weckl knows it.
@checkabreak I have seen Madonna's name in the list of people he's worked with. If you feel pretty sure about, you're probably right. It's just really hard to imagine Weckl playing the groove on that song. It kinda corrects what everyone says about him having no "soul." Quit confusing us Dave.
@MashMashMusic I have seven accoustic sets and prior to that I had six accoustic sets and one electronic set which I wanted to sell. The last thing I needed was another accoustic set but a person offered to trade their Gretch Reknown Maples for the electronic kit and I gladly did so which is why I now have 7 accoustic sets. Nuff said.
@spercoco: My taste of music is quite widespread though. It's obvious that you don't need a talented drummer for a 4/4 basic rhythm with /16-closed hihats. What I actually do for a living has little to do with that. I regard is a quite an achievement to get into a whole live set in days and not to mess up, And to make it sound like on the record when this was produced with drum machines. What is what the audience expects.
@MashMashMusic Foils are nothing more than a giant piezo switch. And, if they're "so fantastic," why is it the only place you can see the SDX now is in a museum?
@VolianTi: I'm sorry, pal, I just started pointing out what a wonderful piece of hardware a Simmons SDX is. The these two guys here started to crucify me for that. One didn't respond any more (for which I'm grateful), the other started insulting me.
@spercoco: Oh, that's nice, so you have seven drum kits, brillant, pal. I've learned on an acoustic set and am now playing E-Drums, which I always prefer in a live environment. why? Because they're flexible. And because you don't need a million microphones for a proper pick-up. As I said, they have drawbacks, but the advantages are far too good.
@spercoco: Actually I'm posting comments, not writing e-mails. To practice in your flat you don't need a 5000-Euro-Kit, a simple Roland TD4K-2 does the job. I've played long enough to know what E-Drums can and what they can't. And it's always the same: the less capable someone is, the more arrogant, just like you. I'm producing for about 10 years (playing for 25, keys, git, bass and drums), and I don't need to pay a mortgage - the house is already paid for. As is my and my wife's car.
the most influential drummer in the world. Gavin Harisson and Danny Carey are still modeled on his playing, not to mention Phil Collins and Peirt. However, the least popular and known. It pisses me of. Maybe because he never liked to show off.
@Easleytee i hate weckl pretty much the only good thing he did was madonas "like a virgen" but you think cause somebody play round notes around the set really fast ... LOL
@spercoco: Another intelligent question: who is buying all these fancy 5000-Euro-E-Drum-Kits if no pro uses them? Yet there are quite a few on the market ... Of course these people don't have seven drum kits like you, so they can't be pros.
@JustinMatthewHoopes continuing my answer to your question: can you here the rhythms he's playing when he uses the electronic pads? can you also here the balance between one drum and the next? I'll quote Aln Dawson who was one of my drum teachers for many years because he said it the best (see July 1977 issue of Modern Drummer): "The more drums you have, the less rhythmic variety you tend to have. There's a logical tendency to sacrifice pitch for rhythmic variety-everybody on every inst. does."
@spercoco: Do what you like. I know quite a few drummers, and it's like this: the more incapable they are, the more arrogant and the more they tell you stuff like you do. A professional needs to make a living. That means you get to drum for different people. And yes, that means that you're drumming for pop artists too. Only arrogance can get you to think that would be simple and easy. BTW I see the same phenomenon with Heavy-Metal-Guitarists, who are unsuccessful.
@maxcohen13: Still, the SDX can do things you simply don't have in modern E-Drums, so I repeat: a fantastic machine. Virtually unlimited. Listen to what Bruford does with them during the "Yes"-Tour. If most drummers weren't so ignorant about electronics ... Before I forget: my "cheap piezo switch"-Simmons-Mark III-Drumpads work like day one despite being over 30 years old.
@maxcohen13: The SDX doesn't use piezos. It uses foils instead, which tell the drum brain exactly where the stick hits the surface, known as "zone intelligence". If you don't believe me, look up simmonsmuseum. And of course it's a fantastic piece of hardware. Look what Bill does with the stuff during the "Yes"-era. Haven't seen things like this nowadays. And: nobody urged Bill to be a Simmons-User for nearly a decade.
the biggest mystery to me is how bruford could have such a great acoustic drum sound and at the same time use some of the worst kind of sound you can get from simmons pad.
Because what you consider to be a bad sound someone else can like quite a lot. And Bill loves to experiment and looks for different not usual things. I admit that sometimes the sound of a certain pad in a certain moment in music does not sound very pleasant to me, but overall I like the Simmons pads a lot. Especially the studio recordings with those are great. But maybe it´s because I like also the pop music, not only jazz and progressive styles. I enjoy also certain styles of electronic music and I love the sounds of the 80s - which I´m sure most of the jazz and prog fans hate. And I agree that Bill´s acoustic drum sound is always amazing.
Well said. I was born in '73 which meant I listened to a lot of Top40 radio, especially from sometime around 1979 to sometime around 1986 or so. My ears became accustomed to all of the new electronic sounds that musicians were using to make a lot of the music that I heard on the radio during those years. I received a Roland synthesizer for Christmas one year which made me appreciate electronics even more. I guess you could say that I'm used to certain sounds like the ones the Bruford gets from his Simmons pads. However, it did take a few listens of "An Evening of Yes Music Plus" before I got used to Bruford using his Simmons pads to play songs by Yes and Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman, and Howe. I'm a huge Bruford fan, so basically he can do no wrong in my book.
I really like his Simmons sounds. At least the sounds he used with King Crimson and most of what he did on Earth works; the album this song was on. I'm not as big of the classic 80's style Simmon sound, but I do like it.
This is still better than when he went with Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe and used almost all Simmons Pads instead of acoustic drums. Instead of his signature snare sound he used an awful Simmons trigger.
@spercoco: I told you also I'm speaking of serious business. Maybe at the community college where you're teaching you don't have E-Drums for financial reasons. Maybe when those guys there have their end-of-term-concert you're not using electronics at all. In the real world though they do. And, now, please, no more insulting answers. Go to your mortgage-paying job, I'll tend to mine.
I don't know a drummer who makes drumming look so easy as Bruford does. . But it isn't the way he plays. Seen him live with Bruford, AWH, Earthworks. Really amazing.
Mike Mangini in this hilariously entertaining yet technically incredible drum solo haha - czcams.com/video/krCovJgKUVQ/video.html
I think the sweat is from all the coke he must have been on haha!
Bruford is amazing and he makes it look effortless.
He plays like if he was driving a Rolls Royce. Well, he is the Rolls Royce of the rock drummers.
A lot of drummers mask their single-stroke rolls around the drumkit as something more complicated by flailing around a lot. Bruford knows his rudiments amazingly well, and he doesn't feel the need to hide anything.
@MorbidManMusic I listened to about 60 seconds of your CTTE cover and you are actually not playing it correctly. There are a lot of different paradiddle variations he's using and you're playing what more resembles the Alan White butchery of the song. You seem to have an over-inflated opinion of yourself. Then again, you're being critical of one of the most respected drummers of the 20th and early 21st centuries
+MorbidManMusic For someone who claims that Bill is their "idol," you certainly show a lot of disrespect. Perhaps the lack of talent +Tim Allbritton is claiming carries over into both your lack of understanding what an idol is and how to present appreciation for an idol in a way that actually appreciates them. Bizarre-o ("morbid") comment.
I dont know nothing about technic`s drum or even i dont play drums, but I LOVE to see and hear so much virtousity, talent and musicality from this master. He´s clearly one of the best drummers alive and one of my favorites as well as Weckl, Chambers, Colaiuta, S Smith, Bozzio, Minemann, R Morgenstein etc...
Weckl... on "Village"... does it for me...
Goddamn amazing!! Like Jaco Pastorius, not only a great player, but a great composer!!
aakkoin would of loved to of seen those 2 play together.
It’s incredible the way that Bill chose to use Simmons pads just for alternate sounds instead of trying to duplicate the sound of his traditional drums.
I love how this drummer seems to paint while he plays and it even sounds like textures, from painting, at least to my ears.
that's the reason why Bill Bruford whas in the best bands ever like: King Crimson, UK, Yes or Genesis.
Correct 👍
@DongFangSue He's equiped with:
Simmons SDX electronic drums, Tama Artstar II Drums, Paiste Signature Cymbals
14" x 6½" Tama wood snare drum
(10) Simmons ZI drum pads
22” x 16” bass drum.
12" x 10" Tom Tom
16" x 16" Floor Tom
14" Sound edge Hi-Hat
18" Power China
16" Power Crash
20" Dry heavy ride
Gong
Drumheads: Evans. Genera 190 snare batter, Genera G1 on Tom tops, Resonants on bottoms, Genera G2 on bass drum and Genera G2 on front
Drumsticks: Pro-Mark, SD-1 or SD-9
:)
he looks as relaxed as someone in the ease of his own living room chatting with friends
here folks, is the most skilled rock drummer to ever live, and luckily for us, he's dabbled in jazz, as we're all currently enjoying :)
Wow... jazz drummers are amazing...
I love when Bruford does those groups of fives between his ride, kick drum, and snare drum. I think he also does it between his floor tom, snare drum, and kick drum.
l could watch the Bruf _babe_ play all daylong! His technique is impeccable and l don't care _what_ he's playing. lt sounds great to me. He's got the best wrists in the biz. Class and charisma.... with chops up the wazoo! Love ya Bill!
Bruford is Bruford....
Loved Bruford’s drumming book...”When in doubt...Roll”.
the great "Brufalo Bill"!
Hahahaha!
iconoclast at work! Bruford is an unquestioned artist!
i love it!!! always a great pleasure to se Mr Bruford and his band mates in action. thanks for this vid!
You went to a show that Bruford was part of - never knew what setup he would have. He was like a science teacher - "I think today, will go with this widget (drum) for the lab instruction"
The audience applauds like they're not quite sure what just happened, but they loved it. ;)
I think I just need to revaluate my entire idea of drum technique after watching this solo
Ever heard of Tommy Lee?
still love it!
Great playing. I love the Simmons drums he uses!
What a drummer A beast
CRAZY DRUM SOLO!!!
Bills wrists are unreal.
An awesome drum solo by a legend followed abruptly by the sound track to a lost hardcore XXX Laurel & Hardy movie:-).
Being a BIG GREAT Bill fan I'm really amused about the Simmons sounds! When he changed between acoustic to electronic sounds it is like he fell over into a work bench full of weird metal objects........;-))
Bill is unique !
Great drummer!!
Wish KC would get back together and do a tour with the 2 trio line up again.
They are already together and touring again, but as a 7-piece group with three drummers now! :-)
@@mikew4001 I'd rather have one Bill than any three replacements for him. I've seen the new line up & they are good but Bill alone was far greater!
@@paulbrocklehurst7253 Yes true, he is very special and absolutely outstanding!
@@paulbrocklehurst7253 I think they had Gavin Harrison, who frankly is a superior drummer in every way. Nothing against Bill Bruford, but Gavin is at the next level regarding technique and tone (I'm not a drummer but I love the sound of his kit(s)).
I Like the electronic drums!
Bruford made everything look so effortless. Yes was never the same after he left. Alan White is a good drummer, but Bill is a great one.
+U2WB What frustrated me most is that White has/had tremendous _potential_ ...listen to his best work on GFTO for instance. He has produced some absolutely amazing drumming. But then, it seems like he prefers to default to 4/4 making sure he hits that snare on every 2 and 4. Easy, pop, and rock.
Even when Yes was more pop, I still longed for that progressive edge. Imagine if Bill was on 90215 (lol)...I like 90125 a lot, but it'd have been off-the-hook with Bill's input. ...But prolly less of a commercial success in the process.
Nothing at all against White, I was just completely convinced he chose not to push his talents, and instead just did his job. It was frustrating.
@@JoinTheProgress I actually find White to be a very tasteful drummer. Good doesn't always have to be complicated.
@@Discrimination_is_not_a_right No, but it has to be interesting. If we're defaulting to common time snare drum on 2 and 4, something I've heard a million times before, I'm going to lose interest quickly. When White chose to get creative, it was amazing. When he didn't, it just wasn't.
@@JoinTheProgress Perhaps when the drummer is keeping time, it's so your interest can be on one of the other players, or on some other aspect of the music entirely. As a musician, you have to know when to make it interesting, and when to let someone else take their turn in the spotlight and not distract. Knowing how to do that is tasteful.
Hermosa Arquitectura !
The one and only.
I'd know that snare sound anywhere!
Que solo tan increíble ..
The longest journey starts with the first step my friend!
How do you confuse Bill Bruford?
Ask him to play in 4/4
@MalstrumX I think that with Yes Bill was still growing as a drummer. It was still basically at the start of his carreer. He had lots of cool and awesome ideas, but they were just beginning to flourish. His drums and cymbals might've also just been crappy. Still love everything Bill did with Yes and later on he went far beyond that era in his playing.
@DongFangSue You are welcome, friend. :)
@MALSTRUMX you should listen to some of the King Crimson stuff, Bill's drumming with his time at King Crimson is amazing. I recommend you the song Indiscipline and Frame by Frame to check out his drumming.
Unique
@MrJesseG123 I noticed that too. Usually he's back there grinning without a care in the world, but in this video he's all business.
In a different universe, BB drummed for Zappa.
It's hard to pick just one good drummer, I think the bill bruford is my number one pick King crimson UK touring with Genesis his solo career that should say it all
@spercoco:
It's only one thing: quite a few drummers despise electronic drums, for whatever reason. They have this and that drawback, on the other hand so many possibilities - I absolutely prefer them. Using a real hi-hat though.
And that is the reason why some people say they sound like crap or limit your creativity (while the opposite is true) or what else. You would be surprised on how many records you're listening to E-Drums rather than acoustic ones.
@VolianTi:
And yes, I made a mistake in the plural of "conservatory" - I apologize by saying, english is not my native language.
Personally,I'd rather watch Bill that any other drummer living or dead. I had the fortune to see him twice with ABWH and King Crimson.Nobody sounds like him 'cause nobody is wired like he is.
how did he get this good?
@Corilo91 Nice.
@spercoco:
I told you, most are using hybrid kits with integrated Roland or Yamaha pads or - as I said - at least an Octapad at the side. I've seen BTW Phil Collins at the Genesis Reunion tour. His drum technician actually asked Wolfgang from simmonmuseum if he could sell him one of his Simmons Kits. Wolfgang doesn't sell stuff, but here he made an exception and lend a Simmons SDS V. They were using newer Pads though for obvious reasons.
@maxcohen13:
The SDX was a fantastic piece of hardware. Of course far too expensive, especially the kit Bruford is playing, but nevertheless really awesome.
@maxcohen13:
It's simply not a piezo switch - a switch knows only "on" and "off".
Why was the SDX never a commercial success? Several reasons:
- The complete kit was about $10,000
- It needed much work from the owner becauise of the limited sound database, so you had to go and sample your own stuff (like Bruford shows here)
- At the End of the 80ies, more and more people turned against electronic music in general (see the success of grunge music)
IF you like Simon Phillips check his work with Hiromi Uehara on the CD
Voice
It is : Earthwork s
I remember seeing Earthworks in the late 80s then again a few years later and the lineup was replaced. I"m wondering if this was by design or necessity?
@spercoco:
I see what you mean. Spliff BTW has a drummer called Herwig Mitteregger, who is regarded as one a germanys (actually austrias) best rock'n roll drummers.
Cascada is a german dance act. Of course this stuff has nothing to do with drumming, it's solely drum computer, what you would need for this kind of music.
You probably seen videos of live acts of Schiller. Schiller makes electronic music, but the live versions differ quite a lot, because he's playing with a band there.
@mexicotaco0913 Or three of a perfect pair, or any of his works on Yes.
@spercoco I play an electronic kit because I play in a Christian RockBluesFunk band and they are perfect for Churches where Acoustic kits are too loud . I have been playing for 16 years and I didn't know what I thought about playing an electronic kit . But it didn't take long for me to fall in love with the ability to save all kinds of different kits for all the different songs . Possibilities are endless on an e kit . No it's not exactly like playing an acoustic kit . But with the right amp fo
When Bruford leaves KC Fripp search for a drummer who plays like he does, he needed three drummers to get a similar sound.
i agree!
And the three others don’t even close to sound like BB
It isn't a similar sound. The aim wasn't to get a similar sound, or to replace BB or anyone else. The three interact with incredible variety and technical precision to achieve polymetric shapes and textures which would not be possible for one drummer, whoever they were.
Simon Barrow yeah, the trio doesn’t try to emulate BB, but i think the groove of KC music loses a much, i like only Gavin Harrison
@@simonbarrowuk exactly right!
Simmons SDX 5000 lbs in year 1987.
@drewper73 Hmmm. I am "almost" sure weckl did I now Moffet played the like a virgin live tour, but oh well =)
@spercoco Nice opinion. Do you think it applies perfectly over all other opinions of this drummer?
this is where Peart got the idea for the end of his solo
Which one do you prefer? I personally enjoy Bill's style better...they're both very different players.
@spercoco You stated, "He gets less creative when uses them." Can you tell me what specifically about his technique when he switches to electronic drums gets "less creative?" I can buy into your opinion of the electronic drums sounding "awful," as you put it, but I don't quite understand how you are gauging "creativity." Do you have a specific set of variables that make your idea of creativity more supported?
i just want to find an improvisation with more patterns + rythem instead of just speed rage!!! buahaha is that so hard to ask for >:[
Why should there be a contest? Why do I need to be concerned about which drummer "wins?"
davidlherring: you shouldn’t, in my view.
You shouldn't. Just enjoy.
Is this the band in the Star Wars movie
@spercoco:
OK, anything I could say now just leads to more circles. But one thing: new age music? What new age music?
@checkabreak I thought Jonathan Moffet played on "Like A Virgin." Oh well...
@spercoco:
Namedropping, I can't get over it, thank you, you made my day.
Before you tell me about conservatorys, learn how you spell it. Hint: it's not "conservitory". I doubt that they hire guys you can't spell the name of the institution.
You really crack me up, thanks for that!
No, I didn't learn producing in a fancy institution. I learned it the hard way. Probably the reason I'm making some money out of it while you're paying your mortgage for the next twenty years.
@Easleytee I don't know about that. I'm a Weckl fan, but he doesn't have enough humanity/soul in his playing. It's gotten better as the years went by, but in my opinion Weckl can't touch Bruford and what's more, Weckl knows it.
@checkabreak I have seen Madonna's name in the list of people he's worked with. If you feel pretty sure about, you're probably right. It's just really hard to imagine Weckl playing the groove on that song. It kinda corrects what everyone says about him having no "soul." Quit confusing us Dave.
I guess he wanted to go to King Crimson because it's far more jazzy than Yes.
SDX - 20,000$ electronic kit. hardly silly...
@MashMashMusic I have seven accoustic sets and prior to that I had six accoustic sets and one electronic set which I wanted to sell. The last thing I needed was another accoustic set but a person offered to trade their Gretch Reknown Maples for the electronic kit and I gladly did so which is why I now have 7 accoustic sets. Nuff said.
@discoverytime1 ONE GUY WITH 4 ARMS AND 4 LEGS..
@spercoco:
My taste of music is quite widespread though. It's obvious that you don't need a talented drummer for a 4/4 basic rhythm with /16-closed hihats.
What I actually do for a living has little to do with that. I regard is a quite an achievement to get into a whole live set in days and not to mess up, And to make it sound like on the record when this was produced with drum machines. What is what the audience expects.
This is Simmons SDX. Full digital. Not original analog Simmons sounds :-(
@MashMashMusic
Foils are nothing more than a giant piezo switch.
And, if they're "so fantastic," why is it the only place you can see the SDX now is in a museum?
@VolianTi:
I'm sorry, pal, I just started pointing out what a wonderful piece of hardware a Simmons SDX is. The these two guys here started to crucify me for that. One didn't respond any more (for which I'm grateful), the other started insulting me.
Bill is sweatier and more angry looking than is usual cheerful composure but the solo is still fuckin awesome
@spercoco:
Oh, that's nice, so you have seven drum kits, brillant, pal. I've learned on an acoustic set and am now playing E-Drums, which I always prefer in a live environment. why? Because they're flexible. And because you don't need a million microphones for a proper pick-up. As I said, they have drawbacks, but the advantages are far too good.
@spercoco:
That's much better when you start making points. But then you had to add the last sentences.
@spercoco:
Actually I'm posting comments, not writing e-mails. To practice in your flat you don't need a 5000-Euro-Kit, a simple Roland TD4K-2 does the job. I've played long enough to know what E-Drums can and what they can't. And it's always the same: the less capable someone is, the more arrogant, just like you.
I'm producing for about 10 years (playing for 25, keys, git, bass and drums), and I don't need to pay a mortgage - the house is already paid for. As is my and my wife's car.
the most influential drummer in the world. Gavin Harisson and Danny Carey are still modeled on his playing, not to mention Phil Collins and Peirt. However, the least popular and known. It pisses me of. Maybe because he never liked to show off.
@Easleytee i hate weckl pretty much the only good thing he did was madonas "like a virgen" but you think cause somebody play round notes around the set really fast ... LOL
@spercoco:
Another intelligent question: who is buying all these fancy 5000-Euro-E-Drum-Kits if no pro uses them? Yet there are quite a few on the market ...
Of course these people don't have seven drum kits like you, so they can't be pros.
@JustinMatthewHoopes continuing my answer to your question: can you here the rhythms he's playing when he uses the electronic pads? can you also here the balance between one drum and the next? I'll quote Aln Dawson who was one of my drum teachers for many years because he said it the best (see July 1977 issue of Modern Drummer): "The more drums you have, the less rhythmic variety you tend to have. There's a logical tendency to sacrifice pitch for rhythmic variety-everybody on every inst. does."
@spercoco:
Do what you like. I know quite a few drummers, and it's like this: the more incapable they are, the more arrogant and the more they tell you stuff like you do. A professional needs to make a living. That means you get to drum for different people. And yes, that means that you're drumming for pop artists too. Only arrogance can get you to think that would be simple and easy. BTW I see the same phenomenon with Heavy-Metal-Guitarists, who are unsuccessful.
MIerda- Que mas decir-
@maxcohen13:
Still, the SDX can do things you simply don't have in modern E-Drums, so I repeat: a fantastic machine. Virtually unlimited. Listen to what Bruford does with them during the "Yes"-Tour. If most drummers weren't so ignorant about electronics ...
Before I forget: my "cheap piezo switch"-Simmons-Mark III-Drumpads work like day one despite being over 30 years old.
@maxcohen13:
The SDX doesn't use piezos. It uses foils instead, which tell the drum brain exactly where the stick hits the surface, known as "zone intelligence". If you don't believe me, look up simmonsmuseum.
And of course it's a fantastic piece of hardware. Look what Bill does with the stuff during the "Yes"-era. Haven't seen things like this nowadays. And: nobody urged Bill to be a Simmons-User for nearly a decade.
@Easleytee Weckl has no soul!
the biggest mystery to me is how bruford could have such a great acoustic drum sound and at the same time use some of the worst kind of sound you can get from simmons pad.
Because what you consider to be a bad sound someone else can like quite a lot. And Bill loves to experiment and looks for different not usual things. I admit that sometimes the sound of a certain pad in a certain moment in music does not sound very pleasant to me, but overall I like the Simmons pads a lot. Especially the studio recordings with those are great. But maybe it´s because I like also the pop music, not only jazz and progressive styles. I enjoy also certain styles of electronic music and I love the sounds of the 80s - which I´m sure most of the jazz and prog fans hate. And I agree that Bill´s acoustic drum sound is always amazing.
Well said. I was born in '73 which meant I listened to a lot of Top40 radio, especially from sometime around 1979 to sometime around 1986 or so. My ears became accustomed to all of the new electronic sounds that musicians were using to make a lot of the music that I heard on the radio during those years. I received a Roland synthesizer for Christmas one year which made me appreciate electronics even more. I guess you could say that I'm used to certain sounds like the ones the Bruford gets from his Simmons pads. However, it did take a few listens of "An Evening of Yes Music Plus" before I got used to Bruford using his Simmons pads to play songs by Yes and Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman, and Howe. I'm a huge Bruford fan, so basically he can do no wrong in my book.
Actually, I´m a huge fan of Bill´s playing. But not everything what he did I like.
I really like his Simmons sounds. At least the sounds he used with King Crimson and most of what he did on Earth works; the album this song was on.
I'm not as big of the classic 80's style Simmon sound, but I do like it.
This is still better than when he went with Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe and used almost all Simmons Pads instead of acoustic drums. Instead of his signature snare sound he used an awful Simmons trigger.
@spercoco:
I told you also I'm speaking of serious business. Maybe at the community college where you're teaching you don't have E-Drums for financial reasons. Maybe when those guys there have their end-of-term-concert you're not using electronics at all.
In the real world though they do. And, now, please, no more insulting answers. Go to your mortgage-paying job, I'll tend to mine.