When Did Rock Stop Being Pop?
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- čas přidán 25. 06. 2024
- I looked at the top albums from 1960-2017 and worked out when and, perhaps, why rock has disappeared from the charts.
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Bill Evans Discussing Rock: • Bill Evans on Rock Music
Background Music: • 'Option C' [Jazz/Hip-h...
Sources: www.everyhit.com/
www.officialcharts.com/charts/...
www.billboard.com via wayback machine
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of... - Hudba
Personally I hope I'm around long enough to see people ridicule hip-hop as "old people music."
I already do! Haha... and l’m 45! 😏. It just seems incredibly passé to me... there’s nothing “Hip” about it, but when people who are getting a little “long in the tooth” think it’s ... “edgy” 🤮 “urban” 🤮 ...and “down with the kids” 😂🤦♂️ .... just no; Hip-Hop took less time to become a parody of itself than Rock... ( and that’s saying something) ...the media lapped it up = very uncool.
I think the longevity of Hip-Hop owes more to the ever-increasing hand of capitalism and ruthless commercialisation on global culture, than to artistic merit. That’s not saying it’s all shit, ...but most of it is!
They already do if it's the old-school or 'real' hip-hop. I believe the subgenres that are popular today are 'mumble rap' and 'trap'; and they sound nothing like old-school hip-hop. You can't even see any kind of influence that the former has on the latter like you could with say the influence punk had on grunge.
I’ll probably be dead by that time lol I’ll live to see rock and metal become that much to my dismay lol
Macro Aggressor: The Titty Baby Killer In short image is key
The shear amount of you that put all hip-hop into the same little pigeonhole is why I'm happy your favorite music is dead. Racism by different means. F*** y'all.
I like the way you posed the question "Why does rock no longer dominate popular music?" It's a more interesting question than "Is rock dead?"
thank you - yeah, I've always thought the 'rock is dead' or 'rock is dying' title is too sensationalist and oversimplifies the issue.
@@DavidBennettPiano But Rock music is still played in rock based stations. But seriously DEAD
Most of the rock bands mentioned in this video - led zeppelin, fleetwood mac, metallicia- never made the pop charts but did dominate the album charts. Rock became about the “album” and streaming has killed the “album” concept
@@tieukhavu8832 i don't think rock is dead, it's still moving, there are still a lot of new bands coming every year, it is just less visible than before
@@blendermen1070 Then we gonna change it. Seriously
Excuse me, Nickelback is Canadian. Don't try to blame that on us.
canada is in america dumbass
czcams.com/video/7aGXNQ-3EQc/video.html
@@____________5895 LOL. I'm Canadian, I get the joke.
@Daedalus Icarus It's true. The truth is, if you live in the West (the US, the EU, and the British Commonwealth) and want to make it big in music, you have to move to Los Angeles, make your music in English, and try to cater to American audiences as much as possible, to the point you make selling to Americans the only goal of your career. If you're big in any other country, you're only big there, but if you're big in the US, *you're big everywhere* there are human beings.
I hope you are joking Jon walter
I would honestly love for rock to make a huge comeback.
Kendrick Lamar's next album is supposedly heavily inspired by rock. based on the success and popularity of DAMN, id say theres potential for it to revive rock among the popular audience
@@brownie3454 where did you get this information from? that sounds pretty cool
@@Alberto-ny7kf I have an inside source
@@brownie3454 oh god
Same
Luckily we live in an Internet age in which even when a genre isn’t “mainstream” it still has a big following on the Internet
Let's take Joe Bonamassa who is mostly known as a blues guitarist, but plays other styles as well. Billboard lists blues as an alternative genre yet Joe is estimated to be worth $10 million. I'm sure there are rock acts that don't chart well in the U.S. that are making millions of dollars.
US tastes have dropped just as their math and science scores. Also RUSSIAN/ Slavic POP is killing it. Russian acts like Mbl, Antoha MC and Kedr Livanskiy are picking up where the mid 2000s left off.
Everything else in America is either a reboot or a rehash of the 90s.
Russian Music,Italian > US.
Rob Roux I don’t think us scores have dropped, they’ve always been that low
@@robroux6074 wait...I am actually a Chinese and in China there is almost no sign of Rock being huge right now
@@devondorr8212 What Part? So you have not heard of ELEPHANT GYM, Eli Hsieh, No Party for Cao Dong? Waa Wei,Yoga Lin etc. etc.?
I am guessing you're a mayate and not Chinese.
"Jazz isn't dead - it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa
Legend
Moo-ah.
Tommy Bolin fused jazz and rock into an effective hybrid, but he self-destructed before he could gain sufficient acclaim for his efforts. In his case, he burned out instead of fading away.
I once posted a question of what was the last jazz song to hit the top 40? I'd say it's been since the 1970's for a non novelty song. If you include novelties, then it's probably "Don't Worry, Be Happy" or "The Macarena".
And boy is there some good jazz around today. Not on the radio of course, silly.
Problem: rock fans don’t want bands to “sell out” aka make a living
Solution:rock fans need to support all bands and welcome new artists
I would also add another thing: rockstars need to appeal to women and girls again. If you look at every band from the 60s all the way to the 80s, women were appealed to it.
True true
Or rock fans should not always stick around with the old music but also embrace the new (good) ones which supports them in their new career
Though bands as thé Beatles and the Doors should never be forgotten aswell
Balance between old and new is healthy
@@metalrockstarizer89 Bro, plenty of 90's & 00's Rock bands appealed to girls, like Nirvana, Asking Alexandra, My Chemical Romance and especially Blink 182. Every girl loves that corny song called "Small Things" by Blink 182. But in order for Rock music to rise in popularity and be cool again, it would have to appeal more to blk ppl. Blk ppl are the trend-setters, they dictate what's popular on the radio & dance clubs. More Rap artists would have to cross over to Rock music to reach out to hood-folks.
HOWEVER... There's pros & cons to Rock music becoming mainstream in today's times, though. People would blame Rock music on the problems of America's youth again. And you'd have more 'Rock' artists sing about pimping, smoking dope, popping champagne and other things that most ordinary people can't relate with, while playing guitar and yelling into a mic. Popularity isn't everything. Enjoy Rock music while it's mostly still genuine and not trendy, vile and commercialized.
@@Galidorquestnah man, teenage girls are the one's who directs the course of the culture. Just look at the top artists since 1960 and the recent popular groups like one direction, BTS, etc.
@@algumacoisa1232 True. Let's just say girls & minorities change the course of culture.
This why i love japanese rock music. They never die even until now. Especially in the year 2006-2016 has been a really great JRock/metal era.
As predicted by the Mayan calendar
We couldn't decipher the message until it was too late 😂
ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT IN OTHER PARTS OF THE WORLD PEOPLE BELIEVE THAT THE AZTEC SUN STONE WAS MADE BY THE MAYANS? please tell me that’s not the case and you are just ignorant.
@@cascalavera9388 dude I have bad news.....
It's too late
Yup now I get what they were talking about... they didn’t mean the end of the world they meant the end of good music (but pretty much the same thing).
Prediction: Rock stopped being pop when hip hop became pop
Fuck hip hop then ☹️
rodger Hip Hop is a pretty interesting and rebellious genre. It comes from the same emotional place as rock music, and ,just like rock, its underground and experimental acts are incredible and feel revolutionary. Hip Hop acts like Death Grips are just as envelope pushing as King Crimson was in the 70s. It’s pretty dumb to write off an entire genre just because some of the chart topping material is quite boring and hollow (I mean come on, were Van Halen, Styx and Bon Jovi ever really profound?)
Hip hop brings the rebelliousness that rock brings. Because it’s the mainstream, there isn’t really space for a lot of rebellious music, most of it has to maintain the status quo and be familiar. Hip hop and rock are edgier genres then most dance music and pop, so they have a limited presence in the mainstream
Paps L late 80s rock bands; (Bon Jovi , Van Halen, guns and roses) is the worst time period for rock music .. If u don’t count “current rock music” I suppose
@@palomalazzaro9748 bullshit. If you think rap is interesting then you have the mind of a gorilla.
He forgot to mention that first Strokes record. That shit still bangs
i think strokes don't get enough recognition.. dk why
and it actually helped start the 2010's rock comeback that The Killers and Arctic Monkeys got the credit for
When you mentioned jazz and played a clip of the lick I died.
“The coldplay effect” lmao
Percival de Rolo IKR? There was a sizable amount of rock in the 60s and 70s that, for a more somber aesthetic, used only acoustic guitars. It didn’t start with Coldplay.
Edited for clarity
Albert Norton Onymous go hear that part of the video again. that’s not at all his point with the concept
I didn't know that Coldplay were a rock band! Interesting.
@@albertnortononymous9020 - you clearly didn't watch the video because otherwise you would've known he defined rock music for the purposes of this video as "an album that contains at least 4 songs with distorted guitar". He never once said that the other songs couldn't have acoustic guitar. So yeah, maybe watch the video before commenting?
@@squodge the fact that he states it doesn't make his definition valid, though, does it
2000-2007
Years when alternative rock, alternative metal, emo, post-hardcore, pop punk genres dominated the rock and metal genre
Poker Face and it was certainly not a fun ride
That's not what killed rock music, you stupid fuck. What killed rock music was Internet piracy and the decline in popularity of live music: it became almost impossible for rock musicians to make a living, and so most of the older rockers just quit and most Millennials and Gen. Z'ers haven't bothered to learn rock instruments.
@@profd65 I'm 17 and learning guitar if that makes you feel better. although i'm only one person
@@faucetwater6740 You're certainly not the only person.
I'm 17 aswell and I picked up the guitar a few months ago because of rock music.
3:15 "Simps have been around for a long time now"
They’ve always been here, waiting from the shadows
Them again
Sad But True
4:33 "look at this -graph" ~lonely guitar playing~
Please someone get the joke
I get it ;)
That bell toll following the Mumford & Sons mention got me
Says everything that needs to be said about Mumford & Sons doesn't it!?
It's not only the bells tolling but Chopin's classical song.You know, the song played at Soviet State Funerals?
I liked the folk renaissance of the 00s-10s. Mumford and Sons were the most popular group, but were certainly not the first or only group bringing folk into alternative music.
Frank Zappa:« Jazz is not dead. It just smells funny »
"Classic Rock" radio stations are killing Rock n Roll! The DJ's announce a New Album by the Rolling Stones, or whoever, but refuse to play it. Instead, these stations play the same damn songs over and over again. The easiest job in the world would be a Classic Radio station music programmer. Select songs to be played for an hour, play them over and over again, and get paid! Damn, why do I work for a living?
Jokes on you! Classic Rock stations don't have music programmers! It's all computer automated now. Today's economy can't just support paying people to perform tasks hahaha This is America not communist France.
Exactly...they don't seem to know that e.g. Thin Lizzy has more than one song. But all they ever play is boys back in town. I can't stand that song anymore. Once I heard a different song. 2004! Or take AC/DC....they mostly play you shook me all night long or money talks....hello radio DJs...most fans prefer their 70s albums!
Do people still listen to the radio?
@Dude I can never be arsed listening to 5 minutes of adverts for a song I've heard a million times
Rock radio is just a recycle bin for old classics now... SAD BUT TRUE. As an aspiring rock artist myself, i dont even care if my songs get played on the radio. I know of plenty of good new rock bands who just dont get any airplay, so believing i will have my songs on the radio is just a stupid pipedream. Besides, you dont need to get played on the radio anymore to get a following. Its all about live performance and having an online presence now.
I really don't care about rock music not being on the charts anymore. That's fine. What saddens me is to see how awful, uninspired and bland is the new music toping the charts. For the most part, it's just garbage.
That's why I hate rap
@@kajwis2675 A lot of the rap is good, but it's either not as mainstream, or it's just old... I don't think it's fairy to compare what Eminem and the likes had put out back in the day against the modern day SoundCloud rap... But if you're just talking about rap these days, yeah, it mostly sucks
@@benas_st I agree but what that genre has become over last year's isn't even music but product and they are not even trying to hide it
Exactly! Modern music is absolute garbage. It's sad to see the trash that gets popular nowadays, no real talent.
most mainstream stuff isn't that great, take illenium for example, one or a few of his songs are on the radio, and they aren't that great Imo, but he has made some decent songs.
I can't believe there aren't more comments about what a great analysis this is! Good quantitative data, then going in and looking at the top albums and interpreting why the effect is taking place, analyzing things, making analogies to historical trends in jazz and what might happen to guitar rock. This is a really thoughtful and compelling explanation. Thanks!!!
Thank you!
This David guy royally kicks major ass, he's intelligent, knows his shit and is infinitely interesting!!
Yes, I really appreciate the definition of terms in particular, it has a proper scientific humility.
Even if "academics" disagreed with the conclusions, this is serious empirical data. To think he's just a bloke, amazing stuff david!
I agree
As a geologist that video title worried me there for a moment. Phew.
hoogmonster what? It’s quite obvious he’s talking about the music genres in the title. Smh
@@calumlawrie6442 what? It's quite obvious he's making a joke in his comment. Smh my head
Calum Lawrie r/woooosh smh lol
@@calumlawrie6442 dumb
@@calumlawrie6442 No shit, dum-dum.
I remember back in 2002 I was 13 and I was learning guitar. I was in a rock band with a couple of my friends and we did covers of 70’s bands and we were planning to release our own music. One day, it was super late and woke and my family were having a campfire and “whole lotta Rosie” came on. We were singing along to the song and having a good time when my dad told me “Never let rock die, kiddo.” And that touched me deep inside. We never came out with an record but we still play at local bars clubs and party’s and are well known within our community. I’ll never forget what my dad said to me and will try my best to get people into rock
Reading the charts from early 20th century is very instructive. The genres in vogue were ragtime, jazz and swing. The prominent popstars were Al Jolson, Enrico Caruso, Paul Whiteman, Fanny Brice...
I think "it's over" for rock & roll, and by that I mean: there will be great rock bands, there will be great rock festivals, but massive phenomena which mark each age (Led Zeppelin, AC/DC, Metallica, Guns N' Roses, Nirvana, Def Leppard....)? Never more.
Every genre gets about 40 years of dominance. Time's almost up for rap.
I'm still holding out for the day that the charts are dominated by 25 minute prog epics. I know it will come.
i doubt that would go mainstream
Luke Jezza yep, that's the joke.
Dream Theater is great
Let's hope not. Nobody wants to hear long, boring, pretentious songs in which half-wits make believe they're Bach.
Of course. Look back at when Queen went with Bohemian Rhapsody for their single off A Night at the Opera. Just about every radio station they went to would refuse to play it because it was over six minutes long, but that didn't stop it from becoming one of the most iconic songs in the history of rock music.
"If it really takes a death of David Bowie to get the rock music to the charts, then I think we've got a problem"
Damn, this is one of the best quotes about "rock is dead", I wanna save it XD
I'm going to save it . . . huge fan of Bon Jovi right here and their success story is my success dream, I'm only 15 but I'm already writing songs, play guitar, and piano . . . maybe sometime down the road the drums. Rock teaches people things, true rock which let's be honest is the only kind of music worth listening to, teaches you how to feel things, how to connect with your emotions, you want a sad rock song? Go on Spotify and look 'power ballads' you want to get your adrenaline flowing before a big game? Look up Guns n Roses, that'll get you pumping. Not only does true rock teach you things, it lets you make memories, you're not going to be on a dinner date and listen to Fetty Wap, no you're gonna have "Faithfully" or "Open Arms" playing, and you will forever remember both that date and that song, because they happened at the same time. You can't make memories with today's music . . . you can't even tap your own foot to the beat because it's going at mach 3. with rock you can actually hear what is being sung, because it's being sung clearly and slowly. That's just my take on why rock died . . . because as the people who grew up with Journey, and Bon Jovi head into their 40s and 50s, their kids are growing up with Drake, and 69, the kids today idolize them, and maybe even get a record deal, then they land on the charts . . . with rap not rock. That's the vicious cycle that I'm determined to break.
"A" death of David Bowie? Was he a cat or something?
@Rob T Hasn't most of Taylor Swift's fanbase got sick of her since that 2017 single (I believe it's Look What You Made Me Do). She has become the pop equivalent of Fred Durst in a way.
Rock music has become much more exciting in 2020 when compared to 2010. Experimental underground acts like Daughters are really pushing the envelope, even mainstream established bands like The Strokes and Tame Impala are releasing much more experimental and interesting stuff then they would 10 years ago.
Going back to the underground is actually pretty good for rock music, specially considering the aggression and rebellion that the genre usually evokes.
Yes, there will never be an actual death of a genre and if you know where to look, there are still great bands making great music. There is something to looking at the trajectory of popular mass media, however, and it’s impact on society as a whole. While what is creative and what is popular have never truly aligned, there have been periods of overlap which have led to significant cultural developments. I would argue that since this last decade, what is creative and what is popular hasn’t been as far apart as it is now in many decades, or even centuries. Social media has opened a Pandora’s box where on one hand it is incredibly easy for a creative artist to make a living without being popular, but popular culture itself has become uninspired and afraid to innovate.
@@lk-gt9xv IDLES and The Chats
For rock to come back is more of an audience problem. Aging audience.
I gotta ask but is black midi a rock band? they are soooooo gooooood
@@irokosalei5133 aging and close minded audience
I think simplifying rock to distorted guitars and attributing its death solely to synths is quite the oversimplification. The presence of a backbeat, even eighth notes, weaving on the beat, and blues influences/scales are pretty important defining characteristics. As for the synth, look at Supertramp. They have several synth heavy songs with little to no guitar that are still definitely rock. Especially compared to 80s synthwave.
I mean, breakfast in america is one of my favorite albums but it false into the rock and pop category. I definitely do feel it has more of a poppy feel to it than a rock one but it does have a lot of rock elements. I’m just not sure which type of rock it is.
Certainly not hard rock, or blues rock, I wouldn’t call it progressive either.
At that point, I just think of it more as a pop album
@@Blockoumi It’s progressive pop + pop rock
@@OwlComedy ok, makes more sense
"I made a spreadsheet"
I smashed that like button.
Patrick Selley 😁
Leave it to whitey to quantify everything for everyone else.
Great video David!
Thanks Rick!
Rick Beato Live
Wow. One great approving another great. Cheers!
I kept thinking - Wow! Rick Beato would really dig this. Great Video David!
ladies and gentleman ... we got him
Why does this video have more likes? He ignored the STROKES and he labeled Nickelback as INDIE? Nickelback was signed to a major label and they don't even sound like anything INDIE in today's terminology of Indie. He also forgets the role of CHINA keeping Rock alive as MATH ROCK bands are blowing up in CHINA. Not the China of Mao , the China that is worlds #1 Economy. ..also forgets that LATIN AMERICA is also keeping ROCK alive. Many UK and US rock bands sell big in LATIN AMERICA. He's playing to the whole Neo-Liberal agenda of Hip Hop is the new rock and roll and that the world only revolves around the UK and US tastes.
"I made a chart"
How rock and roll of you
ringo be like
Interesting that when Led Zeppelin IV was released on November 1971 the graph peaked and on 1980 when they disbanded, the graph starts to decline.
All hail Led Zeppelin.
6:50
"not rock music but.. *THE L I C C *
robpiy91 if you listen to the background music, the l i c c is being peppered throughout by the pianist :)
robpiy91 That one got me.
Adam Neely wants to know your location
Eliseo Caporale Simon Fransman wants to know your location.
His analysis of jazz reminds me of how metal has developed. We’ve seen hundreds of sub genres arise with all sorts of experimentation and exciting new ideas.
More like hundreds of styles.
Yeah, Jazz is dead
@@jeupater1429 7:26
@@jeupater1429 totally. jazz is only kept alive by the academia... and perhaps Amy Winehouse, who unfortunately died.
@@dirtyharry1881 100% - and I'd add guys looking to get into girls' pants by bringing them out to jazz clubs
As a boomer, I've been waiting for just such an intelligent and balanced millennial/zoomer as David to break this very riddle down for me. Thank you, sir!
Nice boomer
Boomers can't even analyze the decline of their own generation? Really explains a lot.
W A L R U S People on the internet, especially kids, are quick to be nasty to other people because there is no accountability and they struggle to see that there is a human on the other side of the comment.
W A L R U S Props for being more mature and compassionate than your peers, then.
@W A L R U S he implied most millenials arent intelligent by saying hes been waiting for one like the guy in this video. i think thats why ppl were calling him boomer
The Blues Rock scene is more active, at least here in the US, than I've seen in years. Acts like Marcus King, Tedeschi and Trucks, Samantha Fish, Christone “Kingfish”, Brandon "Taz" etc. are creating a lot of new music that is amazing. They're not pop. But they're filling smaller theaters and music festivals all over the country. Its quite refreshing and I don't want to miss any of it.
Funny how Traffic, Yes, Rush, Chicago, Genesis, Deep Purple, and even Van Halen were able to fully integrate synthesizers or organs/other keyboards into prominent parts of their music and all found a way to still overwhelmingly sound "rock".
You can add iron maiden to that
@@Running_Colours Pretty sure Led Zeppelin incorporated keyboards into their songs. Since I've been loving you comes to mind.
RunningColours yes you can. I think “7nth son of the 7nth son” was the first time they did it and got a lot of shit for it but all in all it was a great album which still stands. When Manowar did it however (they also used an electric drum machine) they became a punchline, along with anyone who said he liked them.
Pink Floyd too
Kansas :)
“Jazz, when it left the mainstream, it was able to become more progressive-maybe this will happen for rock music now.”
Prog rock fans:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
Cygnus X-420 when rock gain popularity in the 50s, it was fun music for the young, it was fun throughout the 60s 70s 80s and 90s, besides a little bit of prog rock here and there, rock is at its best when it is FUN. Classical and jazz is serious I can’t see rock as weighty music.
@@marcusmagellan Try to listen bands like Yes, Dream theater, Opeth, Tool, and thank you scientist
Raxiu ok, I will check them out, I was a big fan of Yes back in the day. Thanks.
@@marcusmagellan and listen to Rush as well
Ismael Kenig yeah you’re right, Rush, they are cool.
Rock will never die, my friend. My newest student is 5 years old. And he don't want to play " Twinkle twinkle.." or "Yankee Doodle". He want to start with AC/DC. You should see the sparks in his eyes :)))))). Rock and Roll Forever!!!!!
“Not rock music, but-“ *the lick plays*
This was great! I'd love to see more data on this...obviously, there's more to rock music than electric guitars...but also obviously...you had to pick something and that's probably the best thing to pick. Keep it up!
A video a year old, and Hank Green and I watch it on the same day. I love getting to know about little coincidences and connections in our small world :)
@@Cherri_Stars thanks to the improved (pretty much) youtube algorithm
Yeah theres more to rock than electric guitar but for this analisys it works fine! Also hi hank
*Music and data are mentioned in the same breath*
*Hank appears*
I feel like Rock going in the direction of Jazz (going "underground" or "niche"), has already happened to Metal. There are so many sub-genres of Metal that have freely evolved over the years outside of the mainstream influence and there are still quite innovative and interesting metal bands out there. So that might just happen to rock music as well, some sub-genres already behave similarly, for example surf-rock
This has been also happening in Rock since day one, with Prog Rock (e.g. Yes, Genesis) and Psych Rock (e.g. Pink Floyd) and it's still going on these days with Post Rock (e.g. Mogwai) and Neopsych Rock (e.g. Tame Impala). Not to mention that Metal is essentially another subgenre of Rock, with its own different styles.
Jazz didn't go "niche" in the sense, that it fragmented into serveral styles that then got pinned down, quite the oppsite. In the 1960s and '70s jazz mixed, connected and went really creative, music swung between conventional styles and free jazz, funk, rock, classical music, international folk music styles, electronic experiments, everything. '60s/'70s jazzers transcendented genres instead of fencing them off.
Yea man, surf-garage-psych-punk rock, it’s all already accepted its underground status and bands and music are growing beautifully
I don't actually remember a time when Metal was really popular. So it.. really never left the niche world. I mean, SOAD and Black Sabbath were kinda popular but never mainstream as far as I know.
Stronglime I mean technically hair metal was inescapable in the 80’s. But does that count?
Amazing how you researched this topic in a very academic way with all the statistics 👍👍 I think I've finally found the channel that treats music with due seriousness 😉 keep going !
2010: Coldplay effect + Idol effect + EDM age
A more accurate conclusion would be: Distorted guitar isn’t very popular anymore.
Yeah, honestly I feel like excluding bands like Coldplay and Twenty One Pilots is disingenuous about what rock is today
@@komencanto I think 21 Pilots toe the line on being "rock" in a classic sense, but people would just be silly to say that early Coldplay weren't a rock band. Soft rock, but definitely rock.
truejim, you NAILED it. My own theory is that Rock Music was killed by one person: EDDIE VAN HALEN. He was the pinnacle of electric guitar. The imitators who came after him were noise, for the most part. So rock had nowhere to go but down.
2:50 - This precipitous downslide corresponds directly with Van Halen hitting the scene, and no one else being able to match what EVH was doing. Even Eddie himself had nowhere to go from the mountain top. That bottoming out at 1984 fits exactly with the VH album 1984, where Eddie has this huge hit ...playing synthesizer.
So to me the big picture here is that trying to be a rock guitarist from 1990 onward in the wake of Hendrix, Page & Van Halen is like trying to be a classical musician in the wake of Bach, Mozart & Beethoven. You cannot surpass what these legends achieved, so the smart thing to do is switch to something else.
As for what will happen to Rock in the future, I myself doubt that it will ever reach a resurgence anymore than classical has. You will have your brilliant flashes like a John Williams, but these will be the exceptions few and far between. Rock will never again become pop. But I do like what he said about how it will be like Jazz and that musicians will be more experimental. We've already seen that with your Linkin Parks doing their noise modulation stuff. So we'll get creative flairs every now and then. But we will never have another era packed with your Stairways, Bohemian Rhapsodys, and Eruptions being the most popular current music.
Considering punk, emo, and metal being a major influence on a good number of charting rappers like Denzel Curry, XXXTentacion, and Lil Uzi Vert, I'd say it's not the distorted guitars that's the problem
@@dahawk8574 Don't you think its possible that people just think EVH was so naff, over the top and rubbish that it made guitars seem old hat? like lycra pants? His the public care very little about skill and more about fashion and the guitar has been more fashionable since EVH, thats a whole other story.
The problem is that older audiences usually hate every single newer band saying that "Rock is dead".
If the band can't get any new audience like the older rock bands did, maybe they aren't as good?
That's not a problem. That's what keeps music labels profitable.
@@greyfox4838 The older rock bands don't get many more fans nowadays too, both the ones that stopped and the ones that keep playing, that kind of point that the problem aren't the new bands being bad instead the popular taste being different.
@@filescout266 What do you mean? Tool's last album made them do better than Taylor Swift's album. Ozzy gets arena-filled audiences. Guns N Roses at Coachella was for some reason a big deal. Greta van fleet got popular for sounding like Led Zep. I don't really know where you get your notion from.
@@greyfox4838 Yeah they do, but they don't get as much audience and new fans nowadays as recent pop music unfortunately, as the video says. And as i said my notions are from the video and common knowledge.
Wow! Impressive use of a spreadsheet. Excellent analysis.
Your videos are so interesting! Thank you for sharing your vast knowledge with us.
Oh, no you don't... Nickleback belongs to Canada. You're not pinning THAT one on us.
Exactly. America takes enough blame in the world, we don't need to take blames for Canada's creations. Same goes with Ted Cruz, that one is on you guys.
@@jimmym3352 Yeah but he was born to a US citizen mother and grew up in the US. So no, Ted Cruz is most certainly not Canada's fault.
Dude, Nickelback is not the worst band ever. It's a bandwagon meme to bash them at this point, stop going after low hanging fruit.
With "you've got Nickelback in the US" he probably means their album was in the top five.. so doesn't matter if they're Canadian, people in the US seemed to like them too :D
On the other hand, most of their album and ticket sales come from America. You bastards are the ones funding them, don't play innocent.
A lot of people moaning about their favourite bands not being mentioned. Did you watch the video at all? Chart Positions.
I think it’s kinda dumb that he didn’t mention Radiohead or Kanye once, when they are two artists who had big parts in the shift of popular music from rock to rap
And where is Queen
In the 70s it was cool to listen to unknown bands. If a band started to play on the radio they weren’t cool anymore.
At least in the punk scene.
Buster Boy well that’s sad. Either I like a song or not doesn’t matter where it comes from. Probably why a lot of hardcore music fans are snobby assholes
white spider Radiohead would be more rock to electronic
Dude, I just discovered your videos and I am so thankful! You’re awesome and I’ve learned so much in just 3 videos! You got a sub
Either Coldplay hides 4 distorted notes somewhere in their next albums or Slayer reunites and hits the charts, but this has to change.
is that a threat, sir
I call this the “idol effect”. Ever since American Idol and those other talent shows came onto TV pop stars have all sounded the same and very generic. The top 40 now is full of these very boring pop stars.
Finally someone who realizes how stupid I V vi IV is
@@williampuckett5440 that progression has been overused by them pop stars today, and i reckon they dont even know what I V vi IV is...
I kinda agree. Cheesy TV singing contests also raped a lot of rock songs like Creep. The "female indie sound" of Lorde also contributed to the loss of rock in mainstream.
@@ProximaCentauri88 1) creep is a rip off of the air that i breathe from the hollies (which btw isn't correlated to "cheesy tv singing contests") and 2) Lorde (who im not even a fan of) is not responsible for the loss of rock in the mainstream... her first single was released only a few years ago (rock was already unpopular) and her music is pop, not "female indie sound" lmao.
@@iRandom2x Yet Lorde DID NOT refuse when the American Music Awards awarded her "Royals" as Best ROCK Song.
I'm so out of touch, I still think electric guitars are cool.
Dude, me too
@Dan ok doomer
@Dan OK lenial
OK Computer
Lol Electric guitar are still cool.
Your videos are absolutely fascinating! They make me want to learn how to READ music. Keep up the great work
Thank you!
That's incredibly interesting, loved the comparison to Jazz music!
I work in animation, and we have a similar discussion with "2D animation is dead". It's most certainly not dead, but since the big Hollywood studios switched to 3D, it left the mainstream and nowadays its smaller studios, many in Europe, of course in Japan, but anywhere really, that still create fantastic handdrawn films. It's really the same as what happens to music genres once they're overtaken by others in popularity i think...
Anyway, it'll be interesting to see where Rock is going next... I still do like the more accessible, melodic pop rock from the 70s but thankfully we already have decades of music to choose from, it's time for something new :D
I love handdrawn animation.
So... Coldplay killed rock music, is the takeaway here.
SithCats, umm... I guess I’ll just let you have your totally valid but wrong opinion here! 😜
SithCats and there’d be no Coldplay without Radiohead so...
@@jeremiahseip3677 one more reason I'm not a big Radiohead fan, then.
@@SithCats I wish people would stop comparing those bands. Coldplay are lazy sycophants. That's all there is to that story.
THey didn't just kill it, they tortured it for three days in a small room, then cut it up and put the dismembered parts in their top of the range designer freezers.
Rock music is expensive to make compared to pop music.
Solo pop artists are cheaper and easier to manage.
You are right. Karaoke is cheap.
@@ransbarger Ha! i didn't want to use that word because you don't get to be a global major label product, if you are Karaoke singer. I would compare it to the tin pan alley days of songwriters and singers.
That logic is part of the problem. Instead of art we get mass produced, generic, and formulated music designed by marketing executives.
When sales started to drop off the bean counters moved in and fired all the music lovers.
Yep. Creating successful rock albums requires actual musical talent and is much more expensive and time-consuming than letting a computer generate some catchy bleep bloops and pulling a random singer off of CZcams to blurt out some lyrics over it.
You put a pretty inspiring twist at the end of this video man! Good job ✌️
Thanks!
You're so smart! I watched your videos on Chord Progressions. Your knowledge is second-to-none! 😊
Hold up hold up hold up.
'Rock can become more progressive'
*looks at Yes vinyl*
It's time
*roundabout bass lick hits*
All hail Steven Wilson
@@evy2031
New 'The Mars Volta' album when?
I miss Fish
@@rollingon5566
Who doesn't? He's my idol and the reason I started bass guitar
Fun analysis! I'm a lifelong rock fan, so call me optimistic but I tend to think that things move in cycles. Rock may yet come back in force. It's going to need a real kick up the butt, though.
Greta van Fleet - relatively new band, objectively awesome.
@@DorotaGabal Greta van Fleet is exactly the opposite direction rock needs to go. Look forward not back.
@@pTheIGuyq I'd say that's a matter of opinion. I really enjoy them, so I don't care what direction as long as it's not ONE...
@@DorotaGabal I enjoy Led Zep a great deal and Greta okayish, but it remains a sound of the past. If rock wants to become popular again or start developing itself outside of the mainstream it needs new ideas, not rehashes from greats from the past.
@@pTheIGuyq Sure, I get what you mean. How much innovation can it take, however, while still being rock? I can't say how much GvF are like Led Zeppelin, because that's not something I was listening to at the time. I'm more familiar with them through series and film soundtracks. So, for me, they don't have a nostalgic vibe, and it's more something new I discovered, than a reiteration of the old. I'm not a music scholar, I'm a music hedonist. I think that makes a difference. And in that sense, it might just work to be popular. Because young people tend to listen to other young people, or at least as a segway into the classics. It's more likely for them to be invested into Greta van Fleet, who are young guys they can crush on or want to be, than it is for them to listen to Led Zeppelin a propos nothing.
I just find this channel, this is actually very high quality content. Good work
Fantastic video, good insights, nice research! Thanks, you're King of the Week in the music commentary context.
Let's just be real, man. 2010 was rough for everybody. Lol.
That's the year I stopped listening to the radio.
I stopped in 2017. There were still some good songs in 2016. Now it's totally dead.
I stopped listening to the radio in the early 2000s when rap acts (led by Eminem and JayZ) started dominating airplay. I don't really have anything against them, they just don't make music I find interesting.
I HATED Eminem when he first came out. I thought he was going to be a nuisance for a long time. His music definitely got better after the horrible "My Name Is" and "The Real Slim Shady". There were some good songs in the 2000's. "My Immortal" by Evanescence is one of my favorite songs!!!
@@AbbeyRoadkill1 that's probably how people feel about rock. No rock musicians are creating music that mist people find interesting. :/
Tbh there was more synth and electro in the 10s. Almost simliar to European Dance/Pop in the 90s but now done by major US pop artists. Take Lady Gaga as an example: Her early songs sound like 90s European Dance. A bit of Ace of Base. You can‘t deny it. There are (or were) artists like Avicii (RIP) and David Guetta. This gives me some happy rave 90s vibes. Most pop songs are electronic and feature this typical motivational „woohooho“. Someone on youtube made a video about it and called it „the millenial whoo“. Tbh I like this kind of music of the 10s more than most music of the 00s. The 00s were so depressed and angsty. The 90s were more positive with dance, trance, techno, happy hardcore (at least in Europe).
If rock music is going to be the "new jazz"...
oh s***
Luke P. 2020 is going to be like the 60’s
I dunno. I enjoy jazz and hate rock so maybe it will do good things for the genre.
I love this content. Please share more about rock music and 40s- 80s music
Very well thought out stuff. Thank you david.
For the emergence of Indie Rock you mention Nickelback from the U.S. but not the strokes?
Christopher Raun if it’s based off the charts i’d say it’s our own fault
@@zensensei1212 IS THIS IT topped the Charts. He also didn't mention that the STROKES are HUGE in Latin America and they outsell mainstream pop bands in ARG,MEX,BRAZIL. Julian Casablancas in 2014-2017 had teenage girls in stadiums crying for him just as Justin Bieber did in the US.
This guy was being EUROCENTRIC.
Rob Roux i’m just as mad about the strokes not being mentioned
The strokes never charted high.
@UCwYt1EeUApMWAr-8nxsNrCA True, but they only reached #33 for ITI, #4 for ROF, #4 for First impressions, #4 for angles, #10 for CM. If anything, his chart does show the correct trend. In 2001 they sparked the 'revival' of guitars. Guitars/rock music were in declining trend since the Nevermind/In utero release-span ('91-'94). After the year 2001, there was a resurgence of guitar music. This is accurately depicted in the video even if he doesn't mention it.
The 'revival' never reached the heights of the Grunge era which is also depicted in the graph, and then it slowly declined.
Rock isn't dead, it just sleeping lol.
Seriously it isn't dead, it never was dead, it might take decades but I can assure you a group of people will have the passion young bands had in the 60 or 70s and they will make rock at least a popular thing again.
I hope so.
I surely have that passion, but my style tends to quickly switch more to the avant garde. Its a shame rock isn't that popular anymore
Eg, Egg n' Eggy it’s quite funny beacuse At one hand as you said it’s sad that rock isn’t popular anymore but at the other hand people listening to rock stand out more. They are sort of unique group.
It’s dead in terms of ever being chart topping again.
It will happen.
Fantastic how you created a convincing relation between a qualitative definition of 'rock' (distortion sound) and a small sample of 'pop' (top 10 charts), observing and comparing the pattern with 'jazz', and then concluding with a deep insight of Bill Evans. High quality content and all in just 9 minutes. Wow.
Such and interesting video overall and particularly the conclusion, cheers mate!
What's interesting is that the rock scene is very alive and is still somewhat mainstream in Japan
If you guys wanna make the big bucks playing rock, you gotta do it in Japan
If a musician has to go to a whole other country where their preferred genre of music wasn't created in, than that means the scene is dying (to an extent).
@@chyannemckeller9359 -- I get what you're saying, and then notice that all those 1980s British synth bands had to go to the US to make it big.
Once again here's another spinal tap defense of rock music. Well played Akira.
@@chyannemckeller9359 To be honest, that's exactly what Cheap Trick did long ago. They went to Japan where they had a huge following. Their best selling album was a live recording at Budokan
@Akira, do you live in Japan?
The world is filled with good rock and metal. Frankly, I don't care if it hits top 10 in the charts of the big countries. This year in the Finnish charts (top 50) there have been 22 Finnish and 24 foreign metal bands \,,/ Number ones: Nightwish - Decades, Amorphis - Queen of Time, Mokoma - Hengen Pitimet, Ghost - Prequelle, Turmion Kätilöt - Universal Satan, Kotiteollisuus - Valtatie 666 and Stam1na - Taival. In top 10: Judas Priest - Firepower, Kalmah - Palo, Mustasch - Silent Killer, Dimmu Borgir - Eonian, Five Finger Death Punch - And Justice For None, Alice In Chains - Rainier Fog, Omnium Gatherum - The Burning Cold, Archgoat - The Luciferian Crown, Rytmihäiriö - Gambinapsykoosi, Behemoth - I Loved You At Your Darkest, Amaranthe - Helix and Disturbed - Evolution.
fucking hate disturbed
yeh, you got the point
Nice to see 3 Swedish rock bands up there \m/
It's because Finland is the island of hope for good Metal since the 90s or so 😁
@@Klassenfeind But Finland is not an island...
Thank you for doing this, dude. This is exactly what I wanted to know. Good details 👌
It's interesting that we associate Rock with the electric guitar, but some of the most famous songs and bands that we think of when we think of Rock and Roll often don't use it. Queen, Elton John, and Don McLean to name a few. Hell if anything, the piano might be more prominent in Rock and Roll. See above, and then add Styx, REO Speedwagon, Chuck Berry, Led Zeppelin, Journey, and a whole slew of others.
Nerdy George Washington I think of it as whether or not it uses real instruments, not synthesizers
I really don't think of Elton John as rock
@@flipperbooch2194 Synthesizers are basically pianos. You know that right?
@@bradleybirkholz8883 Well, that's nice. However, Elton John is 100% rock..
@@bradleybirkholz8883 Elton John like a lot of artists does from Rock to Ballads, i think he is better known for his slow ballads but can also do Saturday Nights alright for fighting style rock. I see him more as pop music. Your Song was probably his first big hit and was a ballad. He started out rockier and then in the 80s turned into a pop rock artist. Is I'm Still Standing, Nikita, Blue Eyes, Sacrifice, Song for Guy etc 100% Rock? lol So i agree he changed a lot from 70's to the 80's to sell records.
Indie rock is where it's at today. There are so many thousands of indie bands out there now doing incredible things. It broke into the mainstream very briefly around 8-10 years ago, but is still very popular.
Indie, with all it's subgenres, is totally thriving. There are countless bands, singer-songwriters, etc all doing quite well. Yes, they are playing clubs rather than arenas, but it's a damn successful scene.
Indie rock began in the mid 80s did it not?
@@francisr8563 I think more like late 70s, early 80s. At that time, it was truly independent. Bands would pay for their own vinyl pressings, then drive boxes of their records to a handful of stores around England, and just sell them on consignment basically. Word of mouth spread from there, and they got a little scene growing and started small labels, some of which are still around today. Pretty much all were eventually bought out by major labels, so indie today is more like 'on a small label.' Regardless, there are tons of acts in this genre right now. Granted, I'm in NYC, but I could go see bands literally most nights of the week that are indie successful.
erin79 interesting point, just the whole indie thing, which you’re completely right exists in its own way today, reminds me of bands like Joy Division, The smiths, Jesus and Mary chain to shoe gaze bands, madchester all the way up to acts like catfish and the bottlemen, the 1975, Mac demarco even. Such a wide genre with talented people in it.
@@francisr8563 Yup. And even when rock was the big thing on the charts for long stretches, it was often (in my opinion) crap rock, like hair metal or those annoying 70s bands with 12 minute synthesizer solos. That was technically rock 'ruling the charts,' but all the good stuff was still small market, indie stuff happening in small clubs. I see no reason that market won't continue healthily for some time, even if the crap rock genre is no longer sought for the large market.
Hi David. Mr. Beato sent me! Really enjoyed the video! I especially enjoyed your attention to DEFINING what rock is. Keep up the great work.
Thanks very much. Will do!
Hi David. I only found your channel a week ago but already have watched loads of your videos. Very well produced and engaging. Also I love your hair. Looking forward to lots more new content.
Thanks for watching! 🙏👍🏼
I looked at quite a few comments and didn’t see any mentions of the Guitar Hero series. The first one came out in 2005 and by the end of the decade, that genre of game was dominant. I have often wondered if those games caused an over saturation of rock that made people turn away from it when the games lost their appeal.
Another major event worth mentioning is The Rev’s untimely death. I know they’re soft as far as metal goes, but songs like Bat Country, Afterlife, Almost Easy etc. were getting serious mainstream airplay - it’s wild to think about music that heavy getting that kind of attention. His death changed that band’s trajectory, and with it the trajectory of that genre.
Not to mention the over saturation of the franchise which led to the end of the series in 2010. Look at how many GH and RB were released in the span of 3 years since 2007.
My 2 cents:
Rock was killed not by hip hop or even vastly shifting tastes, but by the massive conversion from analog to digital audio technologies. Rock is inherently an analog medium - tube amps at the heart of guitar distortion, magnetic reel-to-reel tape that saturated when pushed into the red, acoustic drums etc.
When audio technologies went full on digital (late 90s) and everything became Computers, Pro Tools, quantizing, digital editing, autotune etc Rock was done for (at least as a Top 40 entity).
Rock was killed by the lazy lame indie sound. And big bands bringing those acts to open for them
jeff7775 absolutely right. The few people who have made it work after digital (jack white, Dave grohl) use analog. People were forced to use analog because that’s all there was. And that’s why rock was prevalent. But now there’s no life and energy in rock anymore.
Before the internet, musical taste was a net outward flow from the US and western Europe. With the internet, I spend so much of my time now as a 40 year old eschewing what I've listened to growing up and listening to music from the rest of the world. It's been a great equalizer.
@[Psychonymphsia Ultravistous] Economics plays a huge roll in all of this. Rock music took over from big bands largely because the overhead of maintaining a rock band is much lower than the overhead of a big band; likewise, electronic & hip-hop (often produced inexpensively on computer software by one or two people) has even lower overhead than rock bands do. The music creation model that is the most economically feasible for the greatest number of artists will always prevail, I think.
@[Psychonymphsia Ultravistous] Yeah. And I suppose it's not really concerning as long as people are not limiting themselves to the current popular genre(s) and exploring what came before. That's easier than it's ever been with services like CZcams and Spotify putting so much music at our fingertips (Spotify even generates a "Tastebreakers" playlist to get you out of whatever genre rut you're currently in). But will people take advantage of these marvelous tools at their disposal? Time will tell...
And yet, my young friend, rock leads the way in terms of live concert ticket sales. Interesting, that!
It does, and I'm a rock fan and musician, but this is totally skewed by legacy acts. Look up who comprises these ticket sales--it's U2, McCartney, the Stones, Billy Joel, Bon Jovi, etc etc. It's not young, new acts.
Impressive!
But what do these live concerts host? Not the hottest band but older acts.
@@JDelvaMusic This information is easy to look up. Drake isn't even in the top 20 of concert sales or attendance.
I thought that was down to all the posing wankers that buy a ticket for a rock gig of a band of which they own none of their albums and barely know any of their songs, other than the few that popped up in an episode of television.
We are a portuguese rock band that is right now releasing our first record.... and it is sooooo frustrating the lack of support and help we get in our hometown. Last year we released an EP and we almost needed to beg in local clubs and bars to let us play live... They only want cover bands, playing the same old rock songs and dont give a shot to the new musicians that create and produce all their music.. the only gigs we booked were about 100$ for the whole band.
It hurts and its like joking with your work and passion, but we aint gonna stop... The love we have for music, and creating music will always prevail. So if this new album wont let us play live more often and get a bigger fanbase, next year we will record a new album, and we will never stop!
The music industry and radios have to wake up!!!!
Incredible analysis David. Very thorough.
I’m glad rocks getting smaller in a way. I love having a closer more intimate feeling with my favourite artists. If your definition of rock bases around distortion in guitar then I’ll class yungblud as a rockstar... he has an amazing connection with fans. Same with a ton of other artists. With MCR coming back, green day still touring, twenty one pilots being nominated for rock album of the year, Foo Fighters still killing it, arctic monkeys teasing new albums, the killers also teasing albums and even more then I don’t believe rock is even slightly dead. Just... not as much in the public eye as it was. Which isn’t necessarily a bad thing
Twenty one pilots?
Really?
I'd agree with you about how good that proximity feels, but sometimes I just feel like I'm socially outdated when I talk about music with people I just met
RunningColours on that side of it I totally agree 100%. There’s not as many people to talk to when it comes to the music - although on the other hand that gives the community a tighter / closer feel and you get to see a lot of great rock artists in the smaller venues which i can definitely say is a lot more fun than seeing them in big arenas
🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️
Where are your parents? We need to have a chat. Rock IS dead, thanks to the likes of the bands you listed.
L N my parents are busy taking me to festivals and concerts and letting me enjoy my life without putting others down for the music they like 🤷♀️ I get some people don’t like a few of the bands i listed but it doesn’t matter because I listen to music because I enjoy it - not because I want to appeal to other people. Anyways - there’s no way you’re out here insulting Foo Fighters and green day lmao? They’re legends. So are the arctic monkeys. The others? Sure not as much but rock is far from dead. In the mainstream maybe but I think you should get out more. Go to some gigs and loosen up a bit dude. Stop trying to live in the past and gatekeep rock music
Great way to explain this, "not just the biggest rock stars, but the biggest pop stars"
Loved it
Good thing here in the Philippines, rock OPM is starting to emerge again like Buwan by Juan Karlos and Mundo by IV of Spades. I'm looking forward to more rock OPM.
This so True. Rock is always on Top. And all genres respect other genres here.
Very nice, I wish I could think up things like this and then have the smarts to follow through with them. Kudo to you David!!
rock is such a massive behemoth. it has probably the biggest number of subgenres and sub-subgenres than any other major music family. the diversity is beyond comparison. the scene is alive and kicking. it just can not establish one single band or style of rock to gather everybody to it and place it on the top 40 list. Whereas you have several labels and a few highly polished pop stars that are easy to pick and listen by the masses. this is an easier way to collect attention and raise the sales of records. simple mathematics.
Biggest number, huh? Trap would like to introduce itself.
@@shroomy__rxcks are you a joker? You know 20 or 30 subgenres of trap?
Hmm.... Trap Metal, Drill, Pop Trap, Mumble Rap, Samba Trap, Country Trap, Dark Trap, Latin Trap, and basically a subgenre with every other music genre in existence.
@@shroomy__rxcks i don't think that few compositions in some kind of style will make a whole new subgenre. A fundament for subgenre, yes, but its still not developed enough, technically you call even 1 composition as of some new subgenre. We can say that every crossover/fusion is possible in future as its built-in feature. But do you really know a few compositions of every type of music mashed up with trap? Ofc, nowadays you can maybe even hear grindcore-trap, but it would be more like a joke, honestly. There should be criterias based on which we can say its a subgenre or not, is it independent or it comes only with package of other styles/influences etc.
@@shroomy__rxcks trap metal would be a sub-genre of metal and metal is a genre that came from rock, so...
This got me thinking about the modern "progressive" music scene in general-- all these weird/complex/technical styles of rock and metal are gaining a lot more popularity now and becoming the new face of guitar-driven music. It seems like there are two paths for the post-2010 electric guitarist: either study jazz and play in a math rock band, or buy a 7-string and an AxeFX and become a bedroom dj0nt machine. Complexity and weirdness have become mainstream, and up-and-coming rock/metal bands who DON'T push boundaries-- whether it be time signatures, odd techniques, number of strings, whatever-- don't seem to thrive.
polyphia
You know, picking three chords in 4/4 was made gazillion times before. Point of music as art form is to create something never done before, or at least give an older stuff some twist. With odd time signatures you just have more options.
And a lot of bands that don't go jazzy/proggy are doing well. Check Whoopie Cat, Khruangbin, Gojira, The Re-Stoned, Carpet, Iah, ISIS, Causa Sui, Brant Bjork. And goddamit, a lot of people would say this stuff is too complex. Well, maybe if you compare it to modern soundcloud rap or Dr. Luke/ Max Miller produced pop banger. And there is nothing wrong with that. Listener that wants a deep dive into music would come to this stuff and far more avant-garde. Casual listener will be happy with Billboard list, and wouldn't go further than that.
I don't agree. Yes there's a lot of experimentation going on, but when hasn't that been the case? I think it all comes down to what you expose yourself to. It's easy to be misled into thinking that one or another genre is bigger than it really is if you listen to it more often than others.
Disagree, forcing a musical style like djent or math rock on everyone to be considered is the antithesis of creativity.
You are an amazingly thorough person.
I’m 50 years old and where I live the “rock radio” stations are playing the same music that they played when I was 20 with very few exceptions ! The most rock like stuff that is popular is labeled as country music but is actually not really “country” . ,Eric Church ,Jason Aldean , Brant Lee Gilbert , there’s a bunch and they all have huge commercial success and feature a lot of distorted electric guitar they don’t get played on rock radio .
My advice, listen to shortwave radio.
Meh, nobody listens to the radio for music anymore. It's just car driving background noise. In fact, seems like that's exactly the kind of music they always had on there any way.
Weird, no mention of Queen (dominated the mid 70s) and Green Day (1994-2009)
Right? Maybe he just doesn't talk about them because they got so much attention lately ;D.
Queen yes, but Green Day weren't chart-toppers until American Idiot (in the UK, at least) and haven't been since then. I remember pop punk being everywhere in my teenage years, but I think the point was that while being "poppy sounding" melodically, not much of it was anywhere near as mainstream as the Kaiser Chiefs or Coldplay.
There's plenty of famous bands not mentioned, they're just not really relevant to mention, considering those who were
I know I’m biased, but pink Floyd gave them a run for there money, 3 of their albums better selling than any queen album
@@spiffcorgi IDK about that. I mean, Blink 182 were certainly chart toppers. And we have to consider alternate places of getting music such as TRL on MTV. It was one of the most watched shows on television and it heavily featured bands such as Blink, Linkin Park, Korn, etc... Rock had a pretty strong presence in the lat 90s early 00s.
When I hear the phrase "Rock is Dead" I always think "What, Again?". People have been saying it since the end of the 50s, mostly people who don't like Rock. Just because Rock isn't in the charts, it doesn't suddenly cease to exist.
@@teriekwilliams2828 Your definition of artistic relevance seems to hinge on whether or not something is popular with large groups of morons. The vast majority of people don't even have a high enough IQ to "get" art. It's not for them. Two-thirds of the population are average IQ (100) or lower. Pop music is for them, engineered to make human cattle shuffle back and forth in a rhythmic pattern.
Many of the best rock bands were _never_ popular with the masses. It's a genre for smart people, like jazz or classical. Would you say that jazz and classical are less artistically relevant than Ariana Grande, because she drives the "cultural conversation" and Mozart does not? I disagree with that entirely. There is not one big culture that we're all a part of. We don't celebrate the same things, watch the same movies, read the same books, listen to the same music. We're not having a "conversation." Most intelligent people tuned out of pop culture trash a long fucking time ago. We're off in our little niche underground genres where all the good shit has always happened.
Rock is pretty much dead. It lost all relevance.
Teriek Williams
Well it drives conversations in subcultures outside the mainstream
I’ll just use emo as a off the head example. It didn’t resonate with me but it does resonate with some people and their issues that affect them
Also metal will never die. True metal that is. Metal at its roots spoke to the working class kids the same way old school rap at its roots spoke to kids in urban poor America
@@teriekwilliams2828 rock in the form of metal on the other hand is very much like classical music.
@@teriekwilliams2828 That was a pretty interesting conversation between you and @Joe
I often wonder about a cohesive culture vs a fragmentation that's beginning to come in now due to streaming services and way more artists/music/media than anyone can consume, leading to a fragmented audience (which is something I dislike) Unfortunately Joe found something offensive in there and the conversation turned to crap...
I'm late in catching this excellent and probing video! Thank you! I have shared a number of your postings in my class discussions. I hope that the students have bookmarked your channel.
Here is my two cents:
Thanks! 🙂😃😃😃
@@DavidBennettPiano My pleasure! Please do not think that my spiel was a criticism of your thoughts. Rather I think of it as in support of your views (with a slant, of course). Keep up the great work that you do!
I would love to see your research continue after the 2010s are over. If you still have your spreadsheet, please continue that research! Or at least make it available for us to continue. Thank you for this video, even though it's a few years old, I only watched it now.
Could it be, that all the millennials and genx Rock consumers are mostly streaming or pirating music, or dealing with their mid-life crisis? Charts don't just show musical trends, they also show consumer patterns.
This
TRU, if you're going by sales it's different these days. a lot of the top albums end up being michael buble or random greatest hits and shit old people buy because they're the ones actually buying music
they show streaming. the youth mostly uses streaming.
Charts take streaming results into consideration and pirating had its heyday in the 2000s and was mostly phased out by the 2010s in the west. Rock has just had its time.
If you look at Spotify ranks the clash is still in the top 500 for somehow
Basically Rock will become what Metal has been for years. Having its own dedicated following but rarely reaching the top of the charts. This has allowed progressive metal to become one of the most popular genres of metal in this decade. Probably the same for rock.
But Metal is a Genre of Rock
Metal has bands that's been to the top in the modern day, rock is just dead Nirvana and gnr were the last "epic" bands of the genre
@@TheWho58 Pearl Jam in every way was more successful than Nirvana. Chart success and album sales.
It also should indicate male emasulation. Guitar based rock is testosterone driven. Don't laugh. Do some honest research.
@@hombreenojado so you're saying people stopped doing cocaine and started doing testosterone suppressing drugs like opioids and benzodiazepines? Would explain the metrosexual and high pitched rappers of today
Soooo well done!
Great research; Great work ! Congrats!!!! Is your spreadsheet updated (2020) ?? Can we see it ?? tks.