Why did he buy a Beechcraft Bonanza over a Cirrus SR22?
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- čas přidán 30. 06. 2022
- My friend is a big fan of the Cirrus SR Series. He was trained in a Cirrus SR20 and has quite a few hours in both the SR20 and SR22. Yet for his first plane, he bought a Bonanza F33A instead. Why did he do that? Because of of the cost. The Beechcraft Bonanza is often considered as one of the top alternatives to the Cirrus SR22. This Bonanza will achieve 90% of a SR22's performance at 25% of the cost. So a few weeks ago, he invited me along on a clear but turbulent day for a flight. Let's see how his Bonanza stacks up against the Cirrus SR22. Welcome aboard.
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#aviation #cirrus #cirrusaircraft #cirruslife #beechcraft - Auta a dopravní prostředky
While everybody is with Cirrus, I m more a Mooney guy! The ovation is one hell of a plane if you re not worried about carrying more than 4 folks in total. Great payload, ultra low fuel consumption and ultra high speed with a lot of room for legs, head. Love it!
My friend in CA has Bravo/TLS what a great machine. It’s so efficient and fast.
Mooney all the way baby!
It’s a shame they went out of business
Payload is low on the ovation isn’t it? 4 people with full fuel might not even be possible?
I don't find the Mooney as big inside as the Cirrus.
Everything depends on your mission.
The Cirrus is a good plane. Very modern.
The Bonanza has a superior wing, it makes short field, dirt airstrip type flying a viable option. If the Bonanza is turbo normalized or turbo straight then that thick wing also makes it a great high altitude machine.
The Mooney is more specialized. It is optimized for efficiency in everything. So if you're going from a to b at reasonable altitudes then the Mooney is an incredible value. Especially just a simple M20C.
I have a comment about how so many of us wait to bring the gear up until there is “no more runway available”. Really what we should be doing is getting the gear up when we get to the point where we can no longer get down to the remaining runway, land and stop safely. No reason to kill the climb until you pass the end of the runway, because there’s no more useable runway way, way before that time and we can be climbing way better, sooner than waiting until the runway passes below the nose.
Flew a 172 I bought for about 220hrs and cut my teeth. Built it into an instrument machine and she served me well. End of last year I started looking at both an SR22 and Bonanza. I ended up with an A36TC (81 model). No regrets. I have 1400lbs of useful load, 2 extra seats need be, a huge cargo area especially if I take the two back seats out and comfortable cruise at 10-17k at 190 true with no issue at 18gph (slightly ROP) and we have A/C to boot without giving up any space or other comforts. She also takes the bumps like a champ so I don't even worry about turbulence. 114 gallons to play with gives me a monster range as well. Best flying machines and community, no regrets (even thought I thought I might giving up the CAPS).
If we didn’t buy our SR22, a G36 would be our choice. There’s a noticeable build quality difference between Bo and the Cirrus.
Enjoyed your video and all of the info you have shared. I liked the fact that you included the decision to turn around and head back to ISP. Another pilot was on the radio to NY approach requesting Higher to get into smooth air, but you never know if it will be as forecast or as smooth as you hope it to be. It's important for other pilots to see and realize that it is fine, and no shame, to turn back when conditions exceed your comfort zone. Good decision! Thanks for sharing
Thanks Andy! There’s no pride in flying decisions. ✌️
This is a good approach weighing the differences between the Bo and SRs... including the technical conversation and performance details.
Great vid!
Thanks pal! I was trying to find someone with a G36 Bo. But didn’t find anyone.
Love your videos, and appreciate your analytical approach to the financials of these aircraft.
Thanks TM!
Owned both: 92 F33A and later a 2007 SR22G3 Turbo. In hindsight, I can tell you my preference is the Bonanza. Overall cost to own the F33A was around 10k/yr (fixed costs). The SR22 was 3 times that, and only had about 930# useful load. In my opinion, the F33/35's are the best piston singles ever built.
A friend of mine had a G3 Turbo and did have a $32K annual…it was nuts. Cirrus has since increased SR22’s useful load to 1,320 lbs.
9:25 Plane “looks great” … whatever.
Your channel is under subscribed. I'm about to start my PPL (A) in the UK, so I'm really enjoying these conversations about Cirrus SR22 alternatives. Being so new to the industry, I was immediately drawn to the SR-22 without realising it's one of the most popular planes.
Thanks mate! Feel free to reach out on Instagram (same name) and I’ll be happy to answer any questions. Good luck with your PPL. ✌️
Turbonormalize it and blow the doors off of everything! Added bonus… if you equip properly you can avoid the aft CG issue.
I flew 61TT for years… planned for 189 knots on 15.9 gallons/hour. Turbonormalized 550 could easily carry for adults and bags…
Thanks for the Tiger shout out. I happed to fly one. It is a great airframe.
Welcome! It’s built like a tank and one of the best planes ever made.
F33A is a great plane. I owned a 1978 F33A for 25 years ( N4527M based at FRG over at D&K ). Never flew a SR22, but the F33A was a tank. Super stable IFR platform as soon as your learn the numbers.
It’s such a solid plane! Are you by Atlantic’s T-Hangar?
@@SlowAsianDriver Sold the plane and moved down to Fort Lauderdale back in 2011. I was parked in the large hanger by the old tower. My mechanic, Steve Jones from D&K aviation hangered it for me and was the one who ended up buying the plane. I do miss it.....
If you ever come up, hit me up and we’ll go flying. You can reach me on IG using the same channel name. Happy 4th pal!
Nice bird for sure. I'm still bouncing around in a 152, but I am looking forward to flying low wings in the near future!
nothing quite like flying a bonanza. have always thought they were the best of the best in my day (60s, 70s, 80s).
The build quality of a Bo is excellent!
I don't know much about airplanes just learning. So far I like everything I hear about Diamond aircraft. At the end of the day I think everyone has to decide what fits their needs. People buy the type of car,truck, SUV that suits their lifestyle and I'm sure it's the same way with aircraft.
That’s very true. We looked at the DA40 as well. Airplane is a big purchase (second only to my house). Many factors such as the mission, support, parts quality & availability and of course budget must be considered. Fly as many different planes as possible and make your own independent and unbiased opinion. Good luck!
No BRS for the Bonanza. Easy decision. But really admire the cost savings.
Nice plane! I considered upgrading to a Bonanza but the useful load in my Piper Dakota is 1,150 pounds - as a 4-seater. Planned cruise at 137 KIAS. I installed gap seals all around and vortex generators. A great short field airplane that is agile/nimble.
Love the Dakota…it’s like the SUV of planes…you can load so much into it.
Decent load and speed, I used to instruct at a Piper dealer and I love the way the whole PA 28 series feels, and the way they outperform book numbers. I've had a 150 hp Warrior up to 18, 000', (well, 17,998'), and that's something you'll never get a 172 to do.
The Dakota or the Skylane are the best haulers for the $$$$
Very cool, beautiful Bo!
Thx Mark!
@@SlowAsianDriver very welcome, love the content you're sharing!
Bought my first plane in April 2022, a 1970 Beech A36. I fracking love it. In my mind no comparison to the Cirrus. They aim at slightly different markets and missions. My A36 is much easier to load, can load more, go further and is more comfortable. The Cirrus goes faster, but while burning more fuel. Besides the cost the real question is your mission and how far you plan to fly. I used 160kts for the A36 and 180kts for the SR22. For the typical 550nm legs I would do it's a 23min difference, but I can carry so much more (including people). My A36 has a 1325lb useful load.
There is a SR22T with FIKI at the club I use to rent. And I get it (it's on least back) for people that want to travel when the freezing level is low or need to make that trip, that plane delivers without having to step up to a turboprop.
But bottom line the Cirrus costs overall are about twice as much to get there a little faster for the type of flying I do. And that includes flying from WA to FL. Also in my case I delivery bought an older plane for the extra useful load (with no damage or haul issues) then then upgraded the entire panel.
I owned a F33 Bonanza for 12 years (N109BA youtube video is still up) I had the IO550 Engine upgrade and put in gap seals, I flight planned 170 kts. Great airplane.
Great plane for sure. Will check out your vid tomorrow. Thank u.
@@SlowAsianDriver czcams.com/video/1ZpvYeTnoTw/video.html
Can't lose with either airplane. I learned in a 152, got my license immediately started flying a 172, purchase a piper 140 and have been a low winger every since. Low wing just seems to be more stable. Currently own a Vintage VTail Bonanza and also fly an SR20
Love the V-Tail Bo! Happy 4th!
In the eighties when I was working at Beech Aircraft, I was in the flying club and we had some Bonanzas. A couple of them were the newer style panel with the 2-in turbine style engine gauges. Just a great airplane. A couple of them had air conditioning and we were running them for $75 an hour wet. I like the Cirrus, but I would also take a Bonanza in a heartbeat.
It must’ve been some experience working at Beech…and $75/hr wet you can’t even rent a 152 for that price now days. Thank you!
@@SlowAsianDriver I first started in '79 before I went active duty Navy. Olive ann was still running the show. I'm an original Beechrafter! Beech was a family back then, before she died and the family sold out to Raytheon.
Would you mind shooting me an email offline? I find your experience interesting and if I ended up doing a segment I would love to interview you. My email is the channel name at gmail. Thanks.
@@SlowAsianDriver Sure I've worked a lot of different jobs at Beech aircraft.
I am a Beech fan. Owned a Sundowner for 20 years and loved it. Not as fast as the Bonanza, just a simple 4 seater.
Beech builds solid aircrafts. 🤙💪✌️
Between the Cirrus and the bonanza, the obvious winner is THE COLUMBIA! That truly is the best thing for the buck
I looked at the A35 Bonanza but bought a Navion instead. My plane had been stored and needed a lot of deferred maintenance and panel upgrades, but despite the time and money needed to bring my plane up to standards I'm very happy with it. The Navion is roomier inside and more stable in flight than any 4-seater I've been in. However, my lean-of-peak cruising speed is 140-150 mph, which might be too slow for some buyers.
Wow, I didn't realized how generous Navion's cabin is (47" vs Bonanza's 42"). Learning something new everyday! At 130 kts (150 mph) LoP that's still a respectable cross country cruiser.
I don’t get the attraction of the cirrus for its cost, the bonanza is a much better value. Comanche owner here and I love it. Comanche, Mooney, bonanza, all great planes, buying a plane that was well cared for and spending a couple extra $$ is the best advice.
Agreed…however sometimes a happy wife = happy life and can’t put a value to that. 🤣 btw, a new Bonanza/Mooney are as expensive as a new Cirrus.
Nice shout out for the Grumman, we fly a tiger but I'd love your cirrus if you fancied a swap!
✌️😂
Nice Bonanza. Make sure to get a cabin cover if you leave it outside. Bruce covers are excellent. Hope you get a hanger.
Yes, I already got my buddy a hangar space at the airport. Direct sun exposure and the elements are horrible for the plane.
Having flown both, the CIrrus seems all nicely and flashy, but as an airplane it is an inferior product.
Great video
Thanks Matt.
I currently fly a 1988 F33A. My useful load is 1160lbs. It is an exceptional airplane. I cruise at 160ktas Lean of Peak and can cruise at 170ktas Rich of Peak. My fuel burn at LOP is 12gph and at ROP is 14.5gph
Bo’s are great planes. SR22 G6 has about 1,295 lbs useful load, cruises at 165 kts LOP though I’ve only seen 160 kts (13.5 GPH) on my plane and 177 kts ROP (17 GPH).
I always enjoyed flying the F33. Very stable, capable plane.
I have zero time in the SR22...but I'm willing 😁
Both are amazing planes. ✌️
Bought my first plane last year. Went back and forth between Cirrus and Bonanza. Flew an SR22T a few times, then flew straight tail and V tail f33. Liked both but Bonanza won out for me. Both are great aircraft IMHO, but for me came down to a few things. First, Bonanzas, at least the one I bought, does grass strips with ease. Second, I really just love the lay out of the avionics and not a fan of side sticks. Third, Love the classic look they have. Fourth, cost of maintenance. Fifth, while the Cirrus has a great snappiness to it, not a fan of higher approach speeds. Bonanza was just more fun to fly for me. Sixth, the one I ended up buying, has nose weights, IO-550, and increased GW to 3600. My GOW is 2322 so have 1278 useful load. Like mentioned about aft CG, not a problem in mine. I do 2 to 4 hour trips with 3 of my buddies, and still have ample room/weight for luggage in rear.
Bo is a great plane. For me, wife is the boss...she wanted a chute...I just kept my mouth shut.
Good video. I can see from the video why I’d still go Cirrus….two adults are sitting right on top of each other in the Bonanza.
Thanks Matt! Bo has 1" more headroom, but the Cirrus is about 7" wider. Never felt claustrophobic in my SR.
@@SlowAsianDriver two doors are key for me
…that too…hence I opted for C172 over Piper in my earlier days. 🤣
A the SR22 (especially the 22T) is one of the most capable cross country GA pistons out there….but the Bonanza is a heck of a lot more enjoyable to hand fly.
…and better built quality. ✌️
How much time do you have? There are countless reasons. Not the least of which being a POH that is more involved than pop chute.
I enjoyed your video. Higher would have gotten you a much better ride. You talked about going up but you never did. Good ADM, when things were not going as you planned you fixed it. For many reasons the Bonanza is in a class above the SR22, both are good airplanes. They each have their own niche in the market place. There is such a good variety of great planes out there, it is easy to find one that will fit your needs and flying styles.
Thanks Eric. That was someone else that asked for higher. We were getting a lot of PIREPs at higher altitudes hence we stayed at 4.5K. The Bo soaked up the bumps very well…imaging doing this in a C172? 🤣 Anyway thanks for watching and the feedback.
Thank you Eric, I normally like to cruise higher because of a smoother ride, but there was a PIREP from a 737 during approach, reporting moderate turbulence at 6000 Ft., and the winds were stronger at higher altitudes, the main reason why we didn't try higher. I agree with you, normally higher is better.
Both are great planes, I’d add Columbia/TTX in the mix.
Agreed. Big fan of the TTX. So sleek and fast and the cabin is quieter than the SR22.
@@SlowAsianDriver yes, because of inflatable door seals, and it has speed breaks. It also handles better with more feedback on the sidestick.
Nice video as the others, I am near FRG
Thank Wil! Do you fly out of FRG?
@@SlowAsianDriver oh no. I'm just enthusiast. I'm an old man always wanted to learn to fly now I just watch folks do it. I used hang out with the guys over at positive rate gear up club when they were at FRG
Very nice video. which airport would you recommend kfrg or kisp? Im staying in flushing for couple of months.
Hi Peter, FRG is a mad house on a nice day with student training. ISP is easier to get in and out of. Without traffic ISP is about 10-15 min longer to get to than FRG…but with traffic that can easily add 30 minute. Hope that helps.
@@SlowAsianDriver Thanks John, Planning on flying my sr 22 g1 from TJIG.
A better question: Why didn't he buy a Mooney? (Coming from a Mooney owner ;) ). The big cabin on the BE 36 is nice if you carry big loads, although my M20K has all the space and weight carrying ability I need. Long body Bonanzas handle nicely, but hot and high takeoffs gave me a sense of 'will we or won't we...' when obstacles loomed. I never have those concerns in the 'K, which always feels buoyant in initial climb. 11 gph at 170 KTAS @ 12,500' doesn't hurt either with todays avgas prices.
I just asked him and he said didn’t find any decent Mooney’s on the market.
@@SlowAsianDriver yeah, finding clean ones for a decent price is getting hard. I think it happened when people realized new high performance planes had hit the $million mark
It is because the Bonanza is much better ✈️💪 and doesn’t need a Parachute
Bo’s are definitely better built.
15:54 In the field of aerospace, plan continuation bias has been recognized as a significant causal factor in accidents
agreed. it's better to be on the ground wishing you are up there than being in the air wishing you are on the ground.
Friends don't let friends fly plastic airplanes. Always thought the F33A was the perfect Bonanza. The lines look perfectly balanced....A36 looks like the fuselage behind the wings is too long. Just like the 310R...longer nose on the R model made it look PERFECT.
Grace Kelly, Definitely.
Not sure how you can honestly compare the two honestly The SR22 is a beautiful beast
I do love my SR22 G6, however if I want a solid 4 seater with the comfort and range this is a solid alternative for around $200K vs $1M of a SR22 G6.
U really can’t compare them. Im as quick as srt22t I’m my f33a at lea than 1/3 the price.
Hey apparently your friend and I are ISP tie-down neighbors! I just moved my t-tail Lance to the second spot from the fuel pump. I'll look for you to say hi.
What a small world! His name is Braulio. I'll tell him to look for you as well :)
That's awesome, I am at spot 22, looking forward to say hi as well. Thanks.
I just found your channel, definitely worth a subscription. I’m not sure why the comparison of the 172 to the F33. Two very different missions and both have filled their niche very well. The battle between high and low wing will rage for ever! We both know we are right. Lol just curious why you didn’t climb on top of the puffy clouds to see if it would smooth out.
Thanks Jack! The good ole High vs Low wing debate never gets old lol. We didn’t climb because several Mod Turbulence PIREPS were reported at higher altitudes plus a much stronger head wind, too. Wasn’t a fun day to be flying.
@@SlowAsianDriver if you ever get out to SF Bay Area KHWD I’ll take you for a ride in my p210. Usually smooth air in the flight levels.
Would love that. Only been in a Centurion once and loved every minute.
I got my private in a Grumman Tiger!
Such a solid plane.
Uh because a Bonanza is 50 times the aircraft that a Cirrus is. Uh because Cirrus is what a doctor who's new to flying buys. A Bonanza is what a true aviation expert chooses. Comparing a 172 with a Cirrus gives you a clue as to their level.
Sounds good.
I'm confused, I was taught that if you're flying in turbulence you should try to climb above it or possibly below it as thermals and turbulence very quite a bit without altitude for sure I would have tried to climb above the clouds. Other than that I'm pretty good video
We did try to climb but it was turbulent everywhere including a PIREP by a PA26 that called for severe turbulence about 15 miles east of us at 9K feet.
@@SlowAsianDriver I understand, the video doesn't show a request for altitude change or any altitude change so that's why there is some confusion for viewers. As a glider pilot I've flown through some pretty nasty thermals but they always seem to diminish as you get higher. One option that should be explored is to ask ATC if any pilots reported smoother conditions at a certain altitude, so if they're able to report choppy conditions, they should also report more stable air? But for sure you guys are getting beat up pretty good and that's unusual for a Bonanza!
I don't have a dog in this BUT I THINK EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE A BONANZA ,!! If you like to go fast try a vtail sorry my turbo is a tank it hits and gets but since you have one already you should check out some mods you can get a bit more out of it! Happy flying
Bonanza is a well built and solid plane.
@@SlowAsianDriver I’ve had a Bonanza since 1970 when I got back let go of the pacer but it was great for getting into place wouldn’t dare try Vtail
I’m trying to decide whether to buy a cirrus 22 or a bonanza A36. I like the bonanza but my wife likes the cirrus because of the caps system.
Hi Phil, if budget isn’t an issue go with the Cirrus. It’s more spacious, faster, more useful load than the Bonanza…and CAPS is an easy sell for the wife.
Get the A36, as a mechanic that works on both and flys, you’ll save yourself a lot more that just the purchase price. Plus you’ll always be able to take full fuel and have extra room. And get a good pre-purchase!
I own a Cirrus and after my one year of owning it, I can confidentially say it is the most useless piece of garbage someone can buy. A lot like ferraris and lambos, it is all for show and nothing useful about it. Im looking forward to moving into a Malibu or Matrix next, as Cirrus has really dropped the ball on use cases.
Hello, I enjoyed your video. I'm thinking to buy my Son his first Airplane and He was looking at these Cirrus Planes but I was always a fan of Beech Aircraft. I would like to find him a Beech Turbo...
Thank You
Thank you Curtis. Does your son have his PPL yet? If not l, I highly recommend him rent a plane from your local flight school to “beat up” during training…usually C172. Once he has his PPL, I recommend a C182, Bonanza or Cirrus for his Instrument Rating. Turbo is great if you live near mountainous area, otherwise it’s not really worth the expense IMO.
F33A with io550 was my favorite plane I've flown.
It’s a very impressive plane.
Grace Kelly every day 😂😂
11:10 I don’t care for Lean of Peak because I like to fly fast and high, and I find at higher altitudes (15,000) I like the power of ROP. However at the reduced power setting you are at while flying at Va, you should go LOP, and you will have cooler CHTs. I don’t think you truly understand that LOP will give you the cooler temps that you are looking for, as long as your injectors are balanced.
LOP and ROP both give you cooler CHT…however LOP offers less cylinder pressure than ROP. At least that how I was taught.
@@SlowAsianDriver and less Cylinder pressure will produce cooler CHTs! Bingo!
When a new Cirrus costs you nearly $1M. A Bonanza is a no brained, performance is similar or better.
New planes are expensive - even the G36 Bo is close to 7 figures. This used Bo is an incredible value for what it does.
14:38 look how close you are to the cloud bases.. if you only went up 2,000 more feet, you would have found that the air would have been glass smooth above the clouds!! I have thousands of hours flying out of Long Island and upstate.. next time, just go above the clouds!
I wasn’t PIC and he didn’t feel comfortable. 🤷🏻♂️
@@SlowAsianDriver sounds like some more experience and instruction will help him out greatly.. I used to fly that route all the time. Higher is almost always better, for many reasons, lower fuel burn, better rides, more options in the event of an engine failure..
I would love a Bonanza and swap out the engine for a continental cd 300 to run on jet a1 fuel.
Full FADEC and Jet A would be a dream.
@@SlowAsianDriver I would prefer an old airplane from late 80s or 90s then upgrade. Always worth it.
FYI you are not hooking up the sidewinder correctly
I will let my friend know. Thank you! Would you mind telling me what he did incorrectly?
@@SlowAsianDriver I didn’t like the first part of your video because there was no you couldn’t get the sound it just wasn’t loud enough to really hear you guys in the car now later and Airplane was much better. But your friends not hook in that little arm it’s a curve arm that swings down and hooks to the tow pins. And the thing could torque and it would smash it up into the nose bowl without hooking that arm on there that’s a reason that arms on there in the first place so it doesn’t let it move up or down. He’s taking a big risk for that I don’t know why?
Sorry about that...I didn't realize how loud the rough road noise was until we got home. Will use body mics in the future and I will pass along the sidewinder arm info to my friend. Thank you!
@@marlensands943 Thank you for the suggestion, I agree with you, but unfortunately, for some reason, the little arm doesn't attach well and comes off all the time, that's the reason I don't try to hook it up anymore. What I do now, is to press the trigger slowly to avoid too much torque and that has worked out well. I appreciate the advise.
Bonanza doesn't make Spider vests though
😄 exactly.
My Mooney feels like a fighter jet, not a truck . Same useful load, 1/3 less fuel burn and faster, just sayin ;)
Fair enough!
30kt gusts would have kept me on the ground.
it wasn't fun at all. I think we made the right decision to turn back. It's better to be on the ground wishing you were up there than being up there wishing you are on the ground.
if i had the money sr-22 all day
not if…but when…and you will 🙂✌️🤙
Hey I fly out of same airport on opposite side of hangers😮. PM me and let’s fly sometime: love your videos. Big fan🙂
Thank pal! Are you out of KISP or KFRG？my buddy flies his Bo out of KISP and I’m out of KFRG.
@@SlowAsianDriver I fly out of ISP
Just don't kill yourself flying to a BBQ party please.
gonna try hard not to. 😂
...Ahw!!...naw!!!......BEECHCRAFT BARON 58...
But does it have a parachute 😏
That’s why we have a Cirrus…it’s wife approved. Lol
sr22t vs bonanza G36 i guess u need to ask yourself 1 door like the g36 or gull wing on the 22t for me if i'm spendig 800k+ both are comparable except the g36 i'm climbing in it thru 1 door .nope not me its 22t all the way
Agreed. G36 is slower, less useful load and similarly priced. It does have better built quality though.
@@SlowAsianDriver not even close cirrus has out sold bonanza almost 10 to 1 . the bnza has not changed in 50 yrs . more importantly garmin worked with cirrus and designed the avionics to work flawlessly . not so with the bnza its jus an add on. i have flown them both and its the 22t all day long. look at the keypad layout in the 22 its right at your finger tips not so in the 36. just 1 example