Is It Time To Replace The EuroLeague Final Four?
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- čas přidán 21. 05. 2024
- The Final Four is a staple of the EuroLeague, but is it time to think about alternatives? Dive into both sides of the argument & the challenges of changing formats. What would you do if you were in charge of the EuroLeague?
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Its not outdated at all.After UCL Final in football,Euroleague F4 comes second in terms of popularity,hype among the sports fans globaly.We dont need boring NBA Finals in Euroleague,we have the Domestic Leagues in a series format and F4 is something else.
I wish that were true, euroleague wouldn’t have the financial issues. Unfortunately, (globally) people are far more into the nba despite the low level regular season
@@sotag38209 that doesnt mean el shold become an european nba. the way we play basketball bringed us where we are now, also atmosphere, also mentality of teams and players. euroleage is very unique
@@sotag38209 Believe me,they dont care at all.
@@JJHills-ho3br can you share your source?
@@sotag38209 Can you share yours?
Final 4 is the legacy of European basketball. No need to change at all. If there is a change always huge budget wins. No underdog mentality ever.
Tell me please which of the Final 4 Teams this year is the underdog?
Oly
Oly is in the f4 3 times in a row. How can we be the outsider.. Would have won the trophy two times in a row if it was for series instead of the f4 joke, both times with the lowest budjet. F4 is not basketball but a psychology test and personally, I totally hate it
@@takisarapakis6843 All i am saying is that no f4 teams can beat real in best of 7 series. But if you play better defence and take the shoots in 2 game you can be champion.
European basketball is all about the Final-4!
You wouldnt take away March Madness out of the NCAA, as it would take away its character!
Same with the euroleague! The Final-4 is its ifentity and where all goes down
Why. Its boring. Undeserving champions. Too little bball. Not enough content.
@@1vaultdwellerI agree. One game isn’t enough
L title. The final four is a celebration, it IS euroleague.
Why would someone say that after the playoff series recently? Final 4 is an L because we are leaving on the table some of the best basketball there is. Imagine PAO - Fener best of 5 series!
@@andius88 In theory it would be nice, but you should think about the players. They are humans, not machines. How many games can they play in such a short time? The quality of the games would surely decrease.
So which one is it? Feeling sorry for multimillionaires playing sports that they love (most of them anyway), or that the final 4 is better basketball than series format?
BTW to answer the question, it’s 82 + 28, so around 100 games per season - we are far from that at the moment. And, please, national championship games in EU? That’s like a Sunday practise for most of the time
@@andius88 It's both. And no matter the intensity players can still get injured. Still, if the f4 eventually get replaced you'll see that by the end of the season the games' quality will decrease.
Weakest. Argument. Ever
I don't need another version of the NBA. I need something completely different. Final4 forever. Never change it. The Super Bowl and March madness are all more popular than the NBA finals games, because they have more urgency and drama. It is only good to sell advertisments (that s why the NBA does it), but in Europe we are not as good (or patient) to monetize sports excessively like the Americans with 3 hour games.
That’s not the only reason, series especially best of 7 has strategies, adjustments, coaching etc
Hands off! Final 4 is what we live for
It's great as it is, no need for any change.
Final 4 as a best of series sounds really boring for me.
I see it as a celebration weekend for european basketball and everyone has a chance.
I also love the drama!!
It works just fine as it is!
Have you even been to a F4 weekend before? Have you felt the atmosphere in the F4 city? No series could live up to the feelings of this celebration of basketball with fans travelling to 1 place to celebrate...🎉
The "cinderella" story is not redundant since it needs to be the surprise result , not the usual result. The underdog cannot win everytime. The favorite has more chances but not 100%.
On the other hand a final and a F4 is something that all fans watch even their teams are not participating. Fans can go to the venue to enjoy big games. Playoffs will limit the interest to 2 teams fans only and no other can see a final in their country. I want to be in the final.. with playoffs I cannot know the teams, the places and how many games will be played.
Final 4 as it is !!!!
In a perfect world there would be no game for 3d place on sunday but a game between the two worst teams of the competition to play out who gets eliminated from euroleague the following season.
Don't change the F4, maybe get rid of the 3rd place match, but other than that F4 is perfectly fine
Yeah I agree. I think you can make Eurocup final game at that moment
if the champions league with 2 legs the best teams almost always prevails imagine a 7 series game in basketball, I think it would take unpredictability away
Lmao how bad would it be if the best team advances?? Gives me Eurobasket 2022 vibes
@@andius88 well that's how you see it I rather have unpredictability like when in the world cup in one games marocco knocks Portugal and spain out, etc or lyon in one legged game took man city out it's more exciting but i know many people like the same old winning again like real madrid will probably win the 500 champions league how exciting, if the semis and finals were a series I would say real madrid would in like 98 per cent chances of winning like these its different but they still favourites in one game anything can happen
Did you not just watch the quarterfinals series?
I think that F4 as a format is better, than best of 5 for the euroleague. An alternative that could be better is for the quarterfinals and semifinals to be best of 3 series, but the final to be a single game in a predetermined arena.
I think is time so replace the whole system of euroleague, without any licenses.
I think Champions leagues does a good job with it.
I get it, its your work to promote the Euroleague, you are most probably a Zalgiris Kaunas fan and you don' really care about your local league but if we had a best of 5 series in the semis and the finals, what would that leave the local leagues to?it would probably mean that these euroleague teams would have to stack up their rosters and the difference between them and the local leagues rivals would get wider and wider, plus the national championships would finish even later. That would undermine the already screwed up local leagues even further, but i guess you don't care
as a basketball fan i dont like the series at all. it was a good idea to make teams to fight for spots in play off stage and it was fair to make it 3-win series but i still dont want to see it in funal four. the best team wins. thats it. no excuses for pressure, bad shooting or anything. last year`s monaco loss to oly was not a bad luck, and llull`s floater too. it was a first-class basketball i want to see in finals
The Final4 system is great and doesnt need any changes. But I think the Euroleauge regular system should finally become a closed leauge I MEAN COMPLETELY CLOSED. The Teams should withdraw from their local leauges and play only Euroleauge. This means that more Games can be played and therefore more Teams with a lot of Fans or money should be included like Paris, London, Dubai, Galatasaray, Besiktas and etc. Im against commercialization bute the Leauge needs more cash flow. Its not profitable for the Teams to invest because the profits right now are quite small.
Final four is superior to a best of series.
As a basketball fan, obviously I would love to see series, but Final4 gives you so many great memories, like last year, when it happened in Kaunas. The whole city was breathing basketball. In my opinion, scrap 3rd place game and add EuroCup final. Someone from basketnews crew in one of the podcasts said this idea as well.
I'd go with the similar format the UEFA club competitions do - a single game final. This could be a compromise between final four and playoff series.
Let's make quarterfinals and semifinals in best-of-three series (with no overlaping games - they should start at 7.00pm and 9.00pm CET) and then a single final game in a neutral venue.
This way, we can add more playoff series, but also save the single game drama (and also allow the Euroleague to bring all the celebrities and legends into once place).
Chima, Donatas and Augustas discussed this on their Final Four podcast. And I think this would be the best scenario.
In my opinion, final series would be "one of the other series in Europe". And Euroleague has to be different than national leagues. Also, making the final game on Saturday would attract more viewers (both fans, basketball lovers and neutral viewers) than the games during the weekdays between two cities.
I think that the best argument supporting the Final four is just that "this is European basketball". I mean there has to be a difference than the American and since this is the big difference, we can accept it.
Dude are you crazy? This is what makes the Euroleague so special....final 4 is a celebration, is an event, is what all basketball fans are waiting for!!
3rd place game is still important
Great analysis. I would leave it as it is for the time being but I if I had to change smth it would only be adding 1 more game - double semifinals ( point differential wins)
Its perfect as it is!!
Domestic leagues should be the "Development League" of each country. Where you can test out and find new talent. Euro league should be the main event. Regular season + Playoffs! As a Greek I always find it very weird when Olympiacos plays against Real and 3 days later against a way lower in the power ranking team from the domestic league.
What I find weirder is that our main squad still gets 25 mins in domestic league. Let the youth play more!
@@giokun100 True, but Greek basket league has no margin for losses. One loss may define the finals home court advantage. And that's why we should have a domestic development league. Teams like Olympiacos and Panathinaikos should stop to worry about domestic trophies and focus on euroleague.
You do realize that for some years now it's almost impossible for domestic teams to get into the EuroLeague? There's barely any open slots left.
EuroLeague wants the permanent or long-term license-holders to fill most of the slots. That's why the FIBA Champions League exists. Domestic clubs qualify for it based on merit, not whether you're one of the preordained.
Best of 5, the team with more bench quality has bigger odds. More bench quality occurs when players are paid better or are in "better country" conditions and surely both. Automatically Spanish teams have the advantage. Make a fair economic plan, where teams have a maximum budget and take into account every country's tax system, then we can talk if 5 games among 2 teams from one or two countries, will gain more television spectators worldwide than 4 teams in an equal box cage.
final 4 is great as is!
They could add some games to make it best of 3 for semi and final, so to 2 wins. But it should be in the city hosting the F4 and not home and away games, is just it could be a week instead of weekend. But then the thing is that fans would be hard to be away for a week from their city although it could happen. So then it is the weekend format with single games. It is close call.
The only concern with f4 is having teams, who have a low fanbase or their fans dont travel. Also having hosting cities where basketball is not big enough to draw attention, it is supposed to be a celebration. One epic weekend to decide all.
This is perfect format, and Euroleague is, and because of that, the most competitive league. It's about players, coaches, fans, everything that makes basketball beautiful. If, but only if, there won't be national leagues, with quarterfinals, semifinals and finals with "best of seven" format, we could argue about play off series in Euroleague. But, it's not the case, so enjoy F4, the celebration of true European basketball.
Great video Thank you
F4 would make more sense if Euroleague was a cup format, with 64, 32,16,8 stages with eliminations.
For a championship a full playoff format makes more sense.
I am not in favor of a series format because the financial rules do not guarantee a more fair competitive ground in the first place ; we are talking about teams coming from different countries, with different tax rules ,different numbers of foreign players allowed etc etc. If - and only if - the rules were the same for every team, then I would agree to a series format - which of course is a more fair way to determine a Champion. So in the current situation, what I am going to propose [as if my opinion matters, but anyway] is this:
[1] slightly increase the number of Regular Season games (either in the 18-team edition or with more teams)
[2] expand the play-in tournament, with teams from no5 to no12 participating
[3] the 4 play-in winners join the RS top 4 teams in a Final Eight tournament; two groups of 4 teams each, 3 match days, then the semifinals and the Final.
Why would you want to destroy the legacy of the European basketball and make it aping the NBA??
Will Jokic be among the public? Just to know, it will be fun
The Final 4 is iconic , please leave it alone. If you wanna watch an NBA-like league why don''t you just watch the NBA? European basketball is very different from American for several reasons. Each team has to play national league games too. The Euroleague is important but for some teams competing in their national league is still important too and we do have series there. Also, reaching the final 4 is a meaningful achievement on its own and having teams representing whole countries and teams with passionate, proud fans means that without the final 4 less fans will feel the joy that their team achieved something special. Also European sports are all about tradition, and switching to something completely new will drive a lot of fans away. Sure, it may sell more tv rights to non traditionally basketball-minded markets but what about the actual existing fans of the Euroleague? Are they not important enough?
The existing fans have carried European basketball all this way but are not asked for any planned changes (especially the abominable Dubai team)
U guys have been pushing this so hard. NO. Already there is a visible financial gap between clubs. If you want to go to a playoff series model, first install rules for salary caps, trading etc. European basketball is one of the last sports in Europe that hasn't been totally ruined by money. I understand the desire to increase viewership and revenues but not at the cost of the soul and excitement offered by today's model. Cheers
Maybe make the semi finals best of 3 and then have the final in a neutral location. But I still like final 4
There are more important things that need to change in Euroleague ASAP. No 1 is officials and clear rules
I think it would be best if we did a 24 team format 12 each group and 4 from each group make the playoffs and 5-7 go to a play in and only 6 make the random groups of them (6 per group) then reset win to 0 everyones and we do top 6 until 4 are remaining (that makes 32 games unless you play the play in then more) and then we have normal playoffs like it is right now since final four is fun with that underdogs winning cus sport wont be fun if always favourite wins lets us have that one weekend where we just stare in aw at our TV
Needs to take place in a bigger arena...
Also budgets is a reason.. in the past CSKA was always there because they were throwing the most money, but couldn't win it. If it was a series final, history would have been different.
Trying to commercialize this event for bigger revenue in fact is all the reason sports are going the wrong way. We are sick of a team being dominant. We desire the unexpected. Long live to the F4
I think it would be good best of 5 series but on neutral court like curent final 4 because it will be more interestning because no one would have home court which is big advantage
If u want change the F4 then changed it for a F8, like Copa del Rey in Spain
yes probably a series of games will make it more fair.semi finals are always a gamble ,depends on the day,luck etc
For a series,because hometown teams fans deserve it,and they create better atmosphere there 🌝
Gytis is too young to remember the times when CSKA dominated in budget & roster so hard, that they could have not 4 titles in 00-s and 10-s, but at least 6. Even them told that this is BS format, because everyone knew, they were Top-team, maybe sometimes Top-2, but couldn't prove it without play-offs.
Now, when the financial equality is a bit better (and now CSKA is eliminated from the field), it's more competitive & we begin to talk play-offs once again. But still it's not so equal. And some of so called bigger clubs - I'm not talking about real cinderellas - can't even sniff F4 for years (like Pana before this year or Barca before Saras era).
OK, establish play-offs, get some titles to clubs with higher budgets - you will start talking reversely very soon!!! Because without having real financial fair-play, promotion/draft system, richer clubs will get titles in play-off settings 80-85% of the time. It's reality of world sports. Do you really want this? Will it be so entertaining for the fans? Even for you, as content-creators. Think about this first.
F4 is Euro-Basketball true identity & let it play how it goes. With all drama, buzzer-beaters and thousands of drunk fans from all over the Europe in one beautiful location.
Keep it like it is
One more mention and I will start believing you are in the pocket of the big teams.
Stop lobbying for the end of F4.
There are no fairy tales on best of 5 series. We want the magic of the single games.
congrats for the video and the thorough analysis! I am against Final 4, it's unfair.
We can follow a regular season of about 28-30 games (by dividing teams in conferences) and then best of 5 till the final. This makes a max of 45 games for the Euroleague winner. Today, we are having a maximum of 41 games, so the difference is small
In my opinion including the semifinals it needs to be play offs then only the final game has to be one game.
Have the national leagues do away with play offs (champion decided by the final table). Or have the Euroleague teams send a B team in their national leagues.
בס"ד
Why not something in between?
Like series for semis. And 1 game for finals. Like in football(CHAMPIONS LEAUGE)
Talking about fairness but the budget the teams have defers so much so the game is not fair at all. Final four kind of balances that.
Don't add more games: this summer Olympics will see only 6 games at best for any team, if you're the best, only one game should prove it. First. And second, if you want national teams facing defections from their best players in Euroleague as they can't always have their NBA ones, yes add more games. The Play-in in NBA is just a waste of time, what have we seen this season ? the teams who struggled to get in those play-ins and to win it have been brutally kicked off in the first round vs the regular season first 6 teams. The old play-off format with 8 teams was enough, the season lasts way too long, remember what happened to some guys winning the finals in 7 games in late june ? you need at least 18 days to close a total 7 games round, if things goes on like that: 36 days total from NOW to end that NBA season !!! June 27th !!! you finish exhausted, then you have to travel to get in your national team camp with jet lag for at least 2 to 3 days prior to be able to train with your team mates. That's ridiculous...
For every fan that loves watching basketball and the Euroleague, having play-off series all the way to the end would be so much better!
Literally at the best part of the season, where we can watch the top teams fight it out in exciting play off games we only limit this to 3 games of basketball (no-one cares about 3rd place) over one weekend.
It depends on whether the metrics show that there is enough of an audience, both live and from tv, that would follow all 3-5 games of the semis and of the final. Fans of the participating teams, yes they would follow it. But me, for example, as a neutral fan, I don't and I wouldn't watch all games of a series. But a Final-4? I almost always watch it...
Still, if you count that two semi-final series and a finals' one could go up to 15 games when a Final-4 is 4 games, from a commercial aspect (which is the only one important for the Euroleague organization) you win with the series..
But you end up with a generally less exciting format and less engaged audience on average, like in the NBA. That's my opinion .. ; )
+ I kind of disagree that in the F4 format you lose adjustments, storylines, comebacks. It all depends on perspective. You can have all those, but within the time limits of two games for each team. Tougher? Yes. More engaging and historic? Definitely, also yes.
The unfair nature, I kind of agree.. But you know it beforehand. So if you don't want to, don't give a 100% during the regular season to keep energy for the 2 games..
Best of 3 series in quarter final, semi final and final
I would say best of 3 series for semifinals and 1 game for final in neutral arena would be the best solution
The problem with that pool is that people who vote for all best of 5 series mostly didnt think thru about the factors u just mentioned
While final four as a format is a good one, having the teams play so many games in the regular season to get eliminated from just one game is problematic. At least in the past eras (post 88s and pre 00s) there were considerably less games, so losing was not as a total waste of energy and resources, as it is now.
Nothing is comparable to the passion and emotions of the FINAL 4
Stop touching the BEST basketball competition in the WORLD
Yes this needs to change to best of 5 both.
This idea just sucks
F4 is fine as it is
Much more things to fix before this
Love from🇮🇪
Euroleague cannot have a best out of 5 system all the way to the final... It would make sense if there wasn't such big difference in the budgets between the teams. With a best out of 5 system you would diminish the chances of any team with an average budget to make it to the final. The NBA has a properly established system where weak teams have the chance to get better with drafts and Salary Caps. There is no such thing here, making the idea of a play off series a joke. How many teams with humongous budgets can an average team eliminate to get to the chance to go to the finals?
Maybe the semi finals could be a best of 5 series , and then the final a single game
Euroleague playoffs are gonna be the tombstone of Europe's domestic championships
And that's ok by ne
Your right man 🤘 like NBA , game 7 my favourite 2 words 😁🤘
Teams need 3 wins to qualify to semi final, but only 1 win to go to the final and 1 win for the trophy. It is like qualification in semis is more important than winning the trophy. Makes no sense. Series all the way.
Personally I don’t like F4. Been watching the F4 games again and again almost every year, and every single year at the end I have the same taste. Basketball it’s a fair sport, 9/10 wins the better team and F4 breaks that rule. I do understand the excitement and all the party around it but I want that party in home games giving the chance to every fan to support their team at home. They give all the awards of the regular season in a room where players and media cheer each other and it’s like you are watching a reality show. It makes memories but tell me about the memories that Timberwolves fans made a few days ago, I want that as much as I can I have it. Not a Gala somewhere in Europe where your team might ends up betting the whole season in one game. Not fair and definitely not appealing. I still follow it though cause I love basketball.
Τake a look at what will change in the football champions league next season and has madefootball fans mad. They did this rediculus ''the first plays vs the 8th '' like basketball does.
Man City or PSG ,owened by countries not private oeners!stragle to win it because they could be eliminated from the round of 16. Man City have dominated English football but money could not win them the Ch. League They only won last year and PSG have not won it yet even though the had bought Neimar for 220 million euros and had Messi also.
Big wallets are already ''protected'' and can go far. But getting rid of the f4 is too far.
The final 4 is a huge part of the EuroLeague and I would not like a change even though at some point it will just because of the increased revenue from the increased games
Love the Final Four as it is, but…maybe the 3rd/4th game should be scrapped?
You want a best of 7? Introduce salary cap then we can talk about it.
so you want team who have the biggest budget to win every title because how can a low budget team that got to the final 4 beat in a 5 game series a powerhouse like real. You eliminate competitiveness that way
No absolutely not the format shouldn't be changed. Can't describe it but managing to get to F4 is literally by itself a cause of celebration (take pao this year for example). Also while historically the stronger teams win the titles but that still does not rule out the fact an underdog team can still win the tournament. F4 also helps to promote basketball in countries where it's not as popular thus expanding the sport. Lastly a single match causes much more drama and excitement than a series because you're guaranteed to get 100% from both sides all quarters of the game
I love the final four format but the honestly the playoffs could really be replaced by something else
Keep the final four. I love it as is.
I think that problems came with the regular season format, more than the Final Four, which is maybe a bit unfair, but certainly one of the best moments of the year. But regular season with 34 games is sometimes boring and meaningless. I understand that finantially is probably the best option for the league and the clubs, but I would rather prefer some kind of groups system, as it was at the late 90s, where every team has to be focused and giving their best effort the whole year, in order to beat those near goals.
You don't need conference system for just 18 teams. You shouldn't expand Euroleague to Arabistan and Israel. Remove play-in and play the finals over 5 games.
Series without salary cap is not fair. Dubai BC will come in 2 years. If they spend 40milions to gather all the great players nobody could win them in 5 game series.
It would be the same the years Russians or Turkish teams had huge budget.
Final4 give the opportunity to everyone to have a hope to win a title. Series eliminate the possibility of a surpise...a Cinderella story!
Euroleague is not NBA and is wrong to try ti imitate it.
If someone want to see NBA he will watch NBA not something "Like NBA" but far inferior.
Lets make the UEFA Champions League a best of 7 aswell, that will definitely help popularity 🤦🏻♂️
Possibly the worst take in the history of the channel
Final four is very anticlimactic when quarter final is best of 5
The Final 4 is what makes the Euroleague so special, and so unique. It lives up to the motto, 'Every game matters'.
Just get rid of the 3rd place game, as it serves no purpose, other than being a warm-up exhibition game for the main event and a complete waste of time. However, one could argue that by scrapping the match for 3rd place may be that a smaller club (for example, Monaco, Zalgiris, Alba Berlin, or whoever they may be, btw no disrespect towards them) will miss out on a bronze medal, as it would otherwise be a huge achievement for these clubs.
But notwithstanding that, the playoffs preceding the final 4 may need a slight change of format, but that's a whole different discussion.
In my opinion it is good as it is
Final Four is better than a series
Final 4. No reason to have a worse version of NBA playoffs
2002 PAO vs Kinder Bologna is by far the biggest upset in European cup history. Just take a look at the Kinder's roster and you will know what I mean. Ohh and by the way, Kinder was playing in their home court so... yeah
No Zalgiris Beating Kinder in 99 was.
All teams in Euroleague are not rich. Olympiakos for example can’t have a 40 milion budget like Real. How will a team like Oly compete with Real in a series of games ? If the budgets are not the same the series as a format will just secure the dominance of the rich teams. You should stick to analysing games friend
I am an Olympiacos fan and I LOVE the F4. We have won and lost the title due to the F4. Still, I love it.
The F4 giveth, the F4 taketh away
The only winner off of the Final Four system is the Euroleague..Its all about the ticket sales..If they go with the play off series systems,the clubs will get the ticket sale moneys,its all about the money.
Nope, it's perfect
It would have been great to have a group stage in the Final Four where everyone would face each other once. Imagine 3 do-or-die games where every single point counts, that's exactly how the group matches will be. The 1st will go directly to the final, the 2nd and 3rd teams will play a single match for the final (the loser will automatically be 3rd).
..
Team A - 3/0
Team B - 2/1
Team C - 1/2
Team D - 0/3
..
And in the end there will be a one-match final between A and B/C, just like all the popular sports in Europe. In the new format there will be 3 to 5 matches whereas in the old format there were 2 matches, so 1 or 3 extra matches and I think this is manageable.
I kinda liked your idea, but there are so many downsides in it, so in the end it’s just a NO.
Imagine what would happen if such a format was implemented. After yesterday's results, the standings would look like this.
.
RMA - 1
PAO - 1
FEN - 0
OLY - 0
.
Real Madrid and Panathinaikos have a big advantage but for Oly and Fener things are not over yet. Although it's not easy for them, they still have 2 crucial games ahead of them and the fans will keep cheering for them. Each of the 6 games in the group will be like another final, my friend. Single elimination creates more tension and injustice than excitement. @@henrikaslinkevicius1246
Dont change final 4 it is what makes euroleague great, they should focus more on finding good refferes instead of thinking about changing the format. Euroleague should have a soul of its own, not be a cheap coppy of NBA..