NEVER do this again - Carb Modification - Tachometer technique
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- čas přidán 1. 03. 2023
- I have finally put together a video that tries to explain how I modified my Walbro Carburetor to get a smoother midrange. It's been a challenge but rewarding process and I feel that I should share my results.
The one device that requires the 1Kohm resistor is the product below:
www.flyelectronics.eu/en/produ...
The article that I found so very helpful can be found here:
www.southwestairsports.com/pp...
The dimensions for my my butterfly notch are 8.5mm wide and 2.1mm from the original radius.
The Walbro WB3A butterfly disk is part number 34-65
The Walbro pop-off spring part number is 98-299
I purchased the parts from Rowena Carbs
www.rowenacarbs.co.uk/
I really hope this helps other find a smoother midrange on their Walbro carbs.
I frequently get asked about the kit I use, all links or names are below.
My PeaBee radio and communications set up is:
ICARO SCARAB Helmet with MicroAvionics PM100 Bluetooth (Vlog modified by MicroAvionics)
www.microavionics.com/paramotor
My Airband radio ( I have the appropriate Licence) is :
www.microavionics.com/ Yaesu FT450 FTA .
Engine instruments:
Trailtech TTO Tech and CHT
Fuel gauge - Tiggy Aviation
Tiggy fuel flow and quantity device - Soon to be an upgrade coming out.
GPS
NAVITER OUDIE 5 PRO with FLARM
Electronic Conspicuity device
SkyEcho 2
Camera and Microphones:
Flight Briefing room
Video Camera 4K Camcorder ORDRO WiFi Ultra HD Vlog Camera and a ICE BLUE microphone
Flying cameras
GoPro 3+, GP6 and 7 with audio adaptor.
Camera Mounts/ cases
flybubble.com/flytec-bumblebee
www.flypureair.co.uk/store/Ca...
Flying Clothing:
FlyKandy Jacket and trousers
OZEE flying suit EXEAT and 30seven gloves
Sealskinz mittens
Editing software
Adobe Premier elements
Music - Epidemic Sounds - Subscription.
#flylight
#flylightpeabee ADAM
#BMAA
#FlylightPeaBee
#PeaBee
#whywefly
#SSDR
#sub70
#Ultralight
#Microlight
#Flexwing
#Microavionics
#AviatorPPG
#Paramotorheadset
#Microlighthelmet
#Microlightheadset
#lukeharnesses
#micromaintenance
#darleymoorairfield
#Openseries
#Microlightopenseries - Sport
Your knowledge is amazing but what I heard was…
“The Turbo Encabulator is based on the principle of power generation by the modial interaction of magnetoreluctance and capacitive directance. This negates the relative motion of conventional conductors and fluxes. With technology that includes antigravic marzelvanes, ambifacient wane shafts, panandermic semi-boloid stator slots and 47 manestically spaced grouting brushes all encased in prefabulated Amulite and surmounted by a malleable logarithmic casing, this machine will revolutionize the automation industry”
Hi Geoff, I literally tried to read that out, I did struggle a little bit. It did make me laugh though. 😂
This made me smile, Geoff. Your time investment in writing it wasn't wasted!! 🤣🤣
Great info Giles. I've come across that article a few times. Glad to hear it worked out for you and I'm looking forward to solving the most frustrating thing about the excellent moster engine 👍
HI Adrian, I'm glad you found it helpful. It's weird, I'm not doing anything that others haven't found before, I just wanted to see how far I could take the notch process before it wouldn't idle properly. I kind of stopped when it was working.
Thanks Giles. A Great informative video. Looking forward to giving both of these a try
Hi Ric, I hope they work for your machines. I'd be interested to see how it works on the Polini for the tacho pick up.
Thanks Giles for sharing the article. Midrange surges is very frustrating. If this technique smooths it out then it’s a win/win!
I hope it works for you and others.
Brilliant Giles!
Hi Michael, I'm glad you enjoyed it.
Also liked the tip on connecting the tach - super simple solution. Thanks!
HI Doug, I like simple solutions.
Interesting tip on the tacho connections with a great explanation, ill be taking that on.
HI Tom, will you need this on your RV😜. Hope to catch up with you soon.
Brilliant stuff Giles!
Hi Neil, I how it gave a little insight into the smaller carbs and the issues. It has been a game changer for my flying.
⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
This is what makes this channel the best👍
Cheers
Thank you Patrick, I really appreciate your support to the channel. I do try.
Love the carburetor talk! Keep it up
Hi Travis, I hope it helped. You might have given me an idea.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 awesome! Can't wait to hear about it!
Well Giles I've just watched this again and I have to confess that a lot of it (particularly the carb stuff) was beyond me as my knowledge currently stands! However, I fully intend to continue learning and hopefully I'll be able to pinch your ideas once I've been flying the PeaBee for a while. For cruise power stability and tacho accuracy, it all certainly sounds worth the effort. 🙂
It was a bit of a headfaet for me in the beginning. Carbs are bit like magic. I'm sure we can have a good chat when you are up at Darley Moor airfield this year.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 I would seriously love that - the more I can learn the better. 😁👍
Better to add a 220p 200v (blue) capacitor in series for the RPM input interface protection, this is what I use 👌
Hi Kosta, I've been using this TTO gauge for nearly 8 year without any issues. We've also experimented with cheaper Amazon tachos with no negative results. What result does the capacitor have and would it give errors in the readings?
Wish I could understand all this....My Moster 185 has 30 minutes on it and runs great. Praying everyday for a cheap reliable electric power system for my paratrike. That day will come. Now I suffer for being a clueless two stroke operator.... Sad. Still I admire Vittorazi for creating such an amazing masterpiece that lets me get to cloudbase for pennies at a time. Love your wonderful videos GF22
Hi Andres, one day we will have a cheap electric system. You probably won't notice the mid range for a few hours but when you do, it will be frustrating. Carbs are clever things and I don't pretend to know everything about them. Safe flying.
Thumbs up! carburettor or carburetor 🤣
Great work Giles. Looks like a similar mod we would perform on model RC helicopter engine carbs to help the mid range in a hover. Thanks for sharing the knowledge.
I did check the spelling of Carburettor, it must be a UK or American spelling thing. Glad you enjoyed the video.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 Joking about the UK vs American pronunciation.
czcams.com/video/eWJgqDDuMyw/video.html
Hello Giles , it’s again a brilliant video, thanks . The problem with the rpm pick up is = the most automotive ignition cables are coiled which almost prevent a magnetic field around the cable ( almost no induction) so it’s hard to pick it up to the rpm indicator. If you connect your rpm indicator cable at the P. lead (pwr. to the primary coil) it will work perfectly , but if this cable comes in contact with A.C. ground , the ignition is off , same as you switch it off ! Use a cable with Teflon isolation ( aircraft cables) happy flying . Reiner
Hi Reimer, the earth kill circuit has just enough pulse to not blow the tacho. Its work for me for many years. I'm jot quite sure what you mean by the pwr side.
Hi Giles , the engine ignition switch (on/off) connect the P lead pwr to the primary ignition coil to ground to switch the engine off , your cable to the Tacho is on this cable ! If this cable comes by mistake in contact with ground , your engine is off !!
Yes, I agree. It runs parallel to the main kill wire anyway, so if the main kill wire is also worn through it will earth out the engine.
Hi Giles, just did the RPM fix on my Thor 190. Hope it will fix a radio problem as well beside a more proper RPM measurement.
Hi Mike, you'll have to let me know how it goes?
well done Giles, that is genius !!
Hi Gavin, which bit, because I know you do like a little bit of carb geekery.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 the wrap your wire around the HT lead, instead connect to kill wire !! cracking idea
@@pintail120 I've tried over the years to share it on the Paramotor forums but it seems to get lost in the noise.
Nooooo!! But it’s a REAL brick wall….. in your camper surely 😅😆😆😆😆. Very interesting Giles. Even though I have a different carb it will help. 👍👍
Haha, hi David, yes those bricks really weigh down the side of the motorhome. 😁
@@GolfFoxtrot22 😆
An Excellent topic to cover!!! I gave up my Moster 185 for a Polini Thor 202, so while the butterfly valve modification doesn't help me, I'm thrilled to know about it, as like you said, it was frustrating to hold a steady pressure on my throttle and yet have the engine not maintaining steady power/thrust while doing foot drags or just level flight.
I am excited to try the direct RPM pickup and figure out where on my Thor 202 I could connect it. While I think the coil is giving me a reasonably accurate reading, I'm all for absolute guarantees! I wonder if there is a T spade connector so I can put the kill wire into the T spade, connect the RPM gauge to the T part, then the other part directly into the inductor for the kill switch. WHEEE!
Seriously, I love watching you fly, but I really love this kind of nitty gritty engineering work to improve what is already an amazing way to fly. Cheers!
Hi Ooglek, welcome to the comments section and thank you so much for the extensive reply. How is your 202 holding up, I'm hearing of a lot of people going through pistons?
I'm trying to vary the content, I'm a secret engineering geek and like things just so, but I'm aware that not everyone likes this kind of content. I hope you do find a good tacho pick up point and if you do, could you let me know where you found it, so I can help others.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 Please stop keeping it a secret! This sort of stuff is GOLD. I'm looking forward to seeing if the GP2 Temp and RPM gauge that came with my Polini will work connecting straight to the inductor.
No issues yet, 90 hours in, on the Thor 202. Since I'm in the US and all of our pump vehicle gas is minimum 10% ethanol, I get US 93 Octane (EU 98 Octane equivalent but non-ethanol) non-ethanol gas. Some have gone with AVGAS, but I prefer to avoid the whole lead thing, plus AVGAS is almost 2x more expensive. No issues with high octane non-ethanol gas in the 202 thus far.
You could always split your channel if you're worried about alienating viewers who just want to watch you fly. I personally am here for both! I was wondering if the arc measured could be accomplished by a 1" to 2" radius drill bit (hole saw?) and a drill press, rather than trying to do it by hand, to get the air flow under the butterfly valve. Or measure and post a 3d model of it, then see if some company could manufacture them one-off for people interested but not wanting to modify it themselves.
@@ooglek Thank you for some good suggestions. Ultimately the shape came from the file I used and all I was doing was removing material until the engine started to perform as I wanted. I did initially want to take the cut out to a point where I had runaway to identify when that would happen but I had reached a point were it was just working and stopped. I type this with a cheeky smile, I was keeping it secret, I held back for the reasons as I state in the video, I was a little reticent as it was such a drastic modification and quite far from the vittorazi specification - I was anticipating a bit of criticism, not completely unfounded. I also wanted to make sure I wasn't getting false readings and responses so wanted to test it fully before letting everyone know. Please keep me on my toes with the comments, I'm sure you have more questions I could help with and thank you for your support to the channel.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 I think this kind of engineering experimentation is EXACTLY what the paramotor and light trike and Pee Bee community needs to get more performance from our effectively dirt bike motors. All of our motors borrow HEAVILY from existing 2-stroke parts, especially the carbs, that there are still many available optimizations and improvements that will help the sport just generally be better and more fun. I'm somewhat hopeful that in the next 5-10 years our sport can go full electric, getting a 3 hour fun flight out of some batteries -- I'd be thrilled to be done with gas and carb tuning! Until then, our sport relies on people like yourself being willing to try modifications and changes that will eventually go mainstream and make a norm.
Criticism? Hell no! I'm super proud you took a frustration into your own hands, did something about it, tested it, then shared it! Put some specs down, like what is the width of the butterfly valve you took out, and the depth, so we can calculate the arc and reproduce your tests. Science! 🙂
Seriously, keep it up, I hope that many other pilots will be interested in your engineering tinkering for the betterment of the sport. I've shared your video with a Slack group of pilots here outside Washington DC -- I hope some will try it!
I only just saw this response so sorry for not getting back to you sooner. I left all the dimensions and part numbers in the video description so I really hope that helps you and your fellow fliers reproduce the results that I have. I hope you see this response in time. Safe flying and happy tinkering. :)
Luvly Jubbly 😉 ... and very informative 👍
Hi Brian, I'm glad you enjoyed it.
Connecting your tacho up that way also has the added bonus of an early warning system if your kill switch wire breaks during flight - Tacho stops working = kill switch probably not going to work.
Hi Ian, yes as long as the failure is on the live side, it's a very good suggestion.
Great video Giles. I will try out the tach suggestion for sure. Sounds like a very elegant alternative to running the wire all the way back to the engine.
For the mid-range mods, you mention changing two factors; the carb butterfly disk and the pop-off pressure. When diagnosing an issue, best to change one thing at a time yes? Assuming you would agree, which mod do you believe actually produced the happy result? I am using a Vitto Atom 80, and the mid-range seems to have been mostly addressed in the most recent WG carb that *they have modified.
One thing I have noticed, having worked on 5 carbs for the A80, the butterfly seating/centering in the airway varies and so when I first mount these carbs I check and readjust for center. Perhaps that helps a bit.
Hi Brian, many thanks for the detailed response and I completely agree about only changing one thing at a time, it's very good diagnostic practice. I've been trialling and testing different settings for nearly a year to get to this final stage of how to set up the carb. It's amazing how even having the disk the right way round can influence a carb set up. Sounds like they have sorted the A80 carb. Is it still the WG8 or have they moved away from that one?
@@GolfFoxtrot22 The A80, as of model year ‘20, shipped with the Walbro WB (Vitto modified, 37?). The initial mods for were to address cold weather high circuit issues, which some attributed to icing. The latest, shipped with MY22 A80’s include the mid-range mods that seem to work well. I just mounted a new MY22 A80 and so far it’s excellent!
I weigh 190 lb, and fly with a Fly Product Eclipse PPG with A80 engine, under an Ozone Speedster 3, 24 meter glider. A combination that always amazes me with its easy start, low vibrations, fuel economy and low weight.
@@Brian.Garceau sounds like a good flying combination.
Wondered if that was what you had done. I read the article ages ago but didn't feel I needed to do anything on the top 80 as it wasn't an issue. Sounds like it is a good mod on the peabee
Hi Lee the WG8 is a bit hit and miss with this mod as. It has only a mid range adjustable needle. The low end is were you need this mod(if required) and the top end you can't adjust.
HI Giles thanks for sharing👌👌, Could you show us the tach brands require the 1k ohm resistor?? Thank you very much.
Hi Jose, I'll update the description ASAP
Very interesting Giles, as usual I enjoyed the video. my 582 has a wrap around, I’ve often wondered how accurate it is. Thought provoking. Pardon my ignorance but if you know the area of the filed notch in the butterfly could you drill a hole ???
Hi Ged, the notch, need to be crescent shaped to pull over the little holes in the area next to it. A hole wouldn't pull in the same way. I hope that explains a little more.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 I understand Giles. 👍👍
Watched, listened, rewound some bits, watched some more, listened a bit more and................................................no idea :-) From the comments I can see I'm out of my league here :-) great video wasted on me.
Hi Terry, I'll explain it over a brew on day😜. Hopefully the next video will be easier to understand, a competition pilot explains how to fly accurately.
I just love tech talk.
It was a bit geeky but it's been a fun adventure trying to refine the carb to a point where I'm happy with it and how to make it repeatable.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 I think you have done / shared a great resorce for others with simular carbs and motors. For me it was fun to see and hear as the solution is the same one I have used on a couple of my petrol RC model aircraft engines for the same reasons and the fun I had with a needle file.
@@flyingkub I've done a similar mod on an old carb years ago but never realised the benefits for the mid range. It really is good fun.
Great vid Giles , has this mod on the cab had any effect on fuel consumption .
Not really, it jsut makes it perform as it should. I'm still burning 5 to 5.5 lph but then I am flying at 46mph.
Interesting. I bought a cheap tacho from Amazon with a wrap around and on ground tests, the engine was only 'maxing' at 7,800 rpm, not the 8,400(?) from the manual. Assumed it was partially due to being static, but probably a reading inaccuracy also?
Hi NsM3, I hope this works for you and you have no missed with a reliable reading.
Howdy Giles,
So which brand of tach requires the 1K ohm resistor?
Ahh good point I'll update the description, I completely forgot to put it in there.
Is there a risk that the tacho could earth the kill circuit and stop the engine or are they fairly stable/benign devices?
Hi Damian, no there is no chance because the tacho is only taking a splice from the main wire and not going anywhere else. I've literally used this system on 3 of my own machines and it's how I wire up all of the ones I work on. I hope that gives you a little confidence in how it works.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 Will give it a try...it solves the problem of the wrapped tacho wire eating through the coil lead from vibration :)
Hmm, I wonder how much efficiency benefit there is if I can move the Atom midrange with this. Might need to have a test.
Hi Dan, I'm not sure on the efficiency side, other than it stopping the surge to the top jet, thus pulling more fuel. Its nice have a more consistent and stable Rpm.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 at a guess it’ll be a small percentage if any. The Atom runs sweet but J was just inquisitive if I could delay that top jet. Something tells me there’s a lot more too it haha.
@@DanielJonesParamotor it's taken me a lot of testing to get to this stage, it's probably why many don't.
hi buddy i fly the air conception nitro 200 ive fitted a rpm gauge but like you say can get the revs on it on idel its reading around 2800rpm it should be 2100 to 2200rpm ive put up to 7 coils round ht lead down to 2 coils but jumps up and down your way sounds good but could i put the wire from rpm gauge to the live wire from the start button wire. thank you again for your info
Hi Frosty, I wouldn't use the start button, but you can use the kill button. I'd test it first before making any permanent connections.
Morning mate I will try that today thank you for your support and keep them videos coming in all the best to you and again thank you
Hi buddy I done what you said from the kill wire and got a 2,100 rpm and steady reading works a treat 👍 will flight test first light in morning all I need now is the tiggy to come out and I be sorted thank you for your info and fly safe and all the best to you
@@frosty2331 oh that is great news and I hope the flight test works well. If you know of any forums that this modification would work on, then please share the video where you feel appropriate.
I'm well happy flight went well except getting to 1,500ft calm on ground high wind high had a couple of big asymmetric tucks not good with a motor on back haha but all good lower will let the guys know about the rpm gauge thank you buddy
Hi Giles - on the engine topic just curious about your max RPM and at that RPM what does the EGT peak at? My RPM maxes at about 7600 rpm with EGT of around 780 degrees C, which is usually at climb-out. This latter seems very high to me, was wondering what your Vitorazzi reads. Unable to find much on typical or acceptable values anywhere on line. Btw my engine is a Cisco Bull max two stroke paramotor, similar to yours - many thanks and sorry for deviation from topic.
Hi Blacker Welder, I'm not sure on the Egt figures as I don't run an Egt sensor. Your engine drive ratio and propeller combination will also affect the max rpm you will obtain. I'm sorry I can't help with regards to your question. The only thing I can suggest it to contact your Corsair dealer, are you in the UK?
@@GolfFoxtrot22 Will do appreciate the super quick reply. Keep your great videos going, you are doing all of us a great service!
@@user-hc8mp5gq1i I'm just a flying/ engineering geek. 😁 Thanks for your support to the channel.
How much is this ( where to go for learning i am in Sheffield thanks
Which part are you asking about, the modification?
Does this modification increase fuel consumption at cruise?
Hi Matgew, from my readings, I have notice no increase, only a more consistent consumption due to the engine not racing away onto the high jet.
Is the fuel exiting the venturi faster than the mid-jet? Will this make the engine react a little better? You've done a lot of filing. Isn't idle harder to set this way? Thanks ;))
Hi, the isn't a mid jet, only a high and low. It is the reason for doing the mod. The idle is actually much easier to set. As I mentioned in the video, and the links to the support ing document is in the description, have a read of it as it will explain what is happening and why, with the mixture than I can here in a short reply. I hope that helps and thanks for watching.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 I understand, thank you very much. I have read the article before. I did it with very minimal grating. I did not dare to file even 2,0 mm. I have to test it. Wb 37 carb on top of an 80cc reed valve engine. Might be a bit big for the engine with this 28mm carb. I mean it will have lazier acceleration. (?) I'm testing it at the moment and if it doesn't fit, I'll put the wj-71 et back in. Thanks ;)
The WG8 is normally good on the way 80cc engines, link the miniplane top80.
1 minute ago
Awesome ... i am not insane! New to PPG but not paragliding. I have all these issues with a new Moster 185 plus since break in and one of those carburetor models! Can't hold a tune, no stable idle setting and dies in the air at idle, and the 500+ rpm bump at approx 5900 rpm. Any suggestions for a new motor under warranty??
Hi Doug, welcome to the channel. I hope this helps. Have you seen the Scott paramotor tuning video?
@@GolfFoxtrot22 enough Xs to be able to do the clip on my own 🤪
@@dougbarlow7483 Xs? not sure what you mean but I hope the Scout videos helped a bit.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 many times (X's)! Appreciate the support!
Giles, why don't Moster send out their carbs modded like this?
I think it might be because it take quite a lot of time to tune each one. They do modify it to some extent by blocking off a port on the low side. Years ago they used to run them before leaving the factory, they only run the Factory R versions now.
Hello buddy how you doing just to let you know I had a nasty accident on paramotor a wire had shorted out on frame it Cooked the on off switch then my lipo battery lighted up I was on the coast but turned away as no more landing spots available to me as I claimed out of a turn the engine died had a big collapse and went into sea would not be hear today as 2 lads jump of a pier to get me as I was in about 8ft deep better getting wet than being on fire haha but thourt I say something as a safety thing on lipo battery's and wiring zip tied to frame with the vibration thanks buddy and still another day to fly haha
Oh Crikey. Frosty have we met before? I did hear about something recently so thank you for putting a comment here. Vibration is a killer for most wiring. I'm so glad you are OK.
@Golf Foxtrot 22 morning Giles no we not met yet but been chatting on hear I've joined paramotor club so I can meet you guys and paranoob such a nice guy and to get to fly with you all.runing all my wiring in plastic tube the zip tie to frame and motor nearly ready to fly again.but I'm all good coast guard and ambulance guys sorted me out as took water in lungs shock and hypothermia but good to fly ones again 😀 👍
Oh Frosty, I wish you a full and speedy recovery. Don't let the incident hold you back. Thank you for letting me know what happened and that you are safe.
@Golf Foxtrot 22 hi Giles I just had a message from a friend showing me your post about my accident I've not got facebook but thank you for a good reply to those who was slating me over it thank you again.paramotor is almost ready to have a run up just putting new wiring loom on and exhaust packing.thank you giles
Roughly, how far out is your low end jet now Giles?
About 20 to 25 minutes
I'll never rap again - copyright Jay-Z 🤣 Surprised not all tacho's would need a resistor inline for that solution as the voltage spike it's then getting is presumably vastly bigger than what would be induced by the magnetic field effect? Very interesting on the adaptation of the carb - definitely not one for the careless application of an angle grinder!
I can hear you dry sense of humour from here Mike. I've been testing/using this for a long time and they are surprisingly robust. I think you need to keep your angle grin well away from your microlight then.. Haha.
The real question is why they don't ship with a smoother mid-range. I hate the issue altogether.
The carb is designed for a chainsaw so the throttle disk does not need to be modified. I hope the video helped a little.
How about Mark makes a drop-in mod kit for us so I don't muck it up.
Hi Ed, for which one? Mark doesn't mess about with the carbs😉😜.
@@GolfFoxtrot22 For the butterfly mod. I don't trust myself for hogging it out like that. But I do recognize the sloppy mid-range and Powerband jump.
@@edwalker2790 well that would be my handyvwork😁. I do all the carb work. It's, really easy, just buy a second disk and take your time.
18 minutes of yabber before any flying, and then only a few seconds. Shocking 😂
Hi Chris, remember when you said you didn't want to edit videos.. Your turn.. Haha
Jeepers, failsafe......don’t connect anything to the live side of the coil, if something fails and runs to earth guess what happens
The engine stops, it's meant to work that way. 😁