Why The 2004 Detroit Pistons Were Not Able To Repeat
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- čas přidán 14. 04. 2023
- The 2004 Pistons were one of the most underrated championship teams in NBA history. Despite their dominance during that decade, what stopped them from capturing more than 1 title?
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If only the Pistons were able to draft Melo or Wade in 03 instead of Darko…we could have witnessed a Motor City dynasty
When you have the pressure of developing a young Melo or Wade, chemistry and identity might not have been the same, it could have hurt their chances. Starting Melo over Prince or Sheed in that playoff run?
@@twentyseven2948 I think that coach also was the reason for the bronze medal in that Olympics. I think that more talented players were on that team.
@@twentyseven2948 Not that year but the years after. Nothing would change for '04. But when you get to '06 and after...
They were able to
@@goodjoejoe Larry Brown coached an Olympics team with LeBron, Wade, Carmelo, Iverson and Tim Duncan. They only got the bronze medal.
2005- Could’ve won the finals but Rasheed let Robert Horry hit a 3 at the end in game 5
2006- Dwayne Wade made himself known.
2007- Lebron made himself known. Could’ve used Ben Wallace but the Pistons let him walk.
2008- Injuries and Boston being stacked at the time
What finished it off was trading Chauncey
They didn't let ben Wallace go but it had to do with a feud with Saunders
@@tj5180 Ben Wallace said in an interview that the Bulls gave him a contract that the Pistons didn’t wanna match so he left
@@Dtown1996 that might have been a reason but him and Saunders didn't get along. Their articles that talk about this how Saunders would bench him and during the 2006 playoffs as well in game 6 and wallace criticized him
Robert “Horny” 👀💀
@@Dtown1996 czcams.com/video/-1UnxB5XkFs/video.html
From 2002-2008 the Pistons made it to every Eastern Conference Finals. One of the most dominant eras for a team ever. So underrated.
One of the most underrated teams in NBA History. Chauncey Billups, Rip Hamilton, Ben Wallace. That squad was stacked. If only they hadn’t taken Darko.
They wouldn't have traded for sheed and won nothing
That Darko pick is like nightmare scenario for any team. Imagine missing out of a couple hall of fame guys.
And they barely even used their rookie
Literally passed on hof for nothing
@Mountain Dew Baja Blast Melo, Wade, Bosh was better than any piston and would have got time
Its like the Packers missing on Barry Sanders, Deion Sanders because they drafted Tony Mandarich
@@chrollolucilfer8618 Holy Sh_t! Did they? The Packers would be a damn dynasty in the 1990s instead of the Dallas Cowboys.. Brett Farve, Berry Sanders as the one, two punch and Deion Sanders on Defense playing Safety playing behind a Reggie White..
The Packers robbed themselves of a dynasty..
@@Unbreakable808 Larry Brown is a defensive minded coach, ain't no way Melo or Wade would had playing time.. The only one I see getting playing time was Chris Bosh..
As a pistons fan this hurts but that 04 team was glorious
@@MangoTroubles-007 lol. watch out. super tuff guy here.
When I was still young, I thought Big Ben and Sheed were actual brothers similar to the Undertaker and Kane. 😅
i use to think Tim Hardaway and Penny Hardaway were related to. it didn’t help they are like the only Hardaways in the league (excludi Timmy’s son)
@@markjackson6431 I use to think Shaquille O’Neal and Jermaine O’Neal were related too.
Well, considering Kane and Undertaker aren't related in real life, and Ben Wallace and Rasheed Wallace aren't related either, they actually ARE like Kane and The Undertaker after all.
@@markjackson6431wait they not related?
@@bayleepama nah man. but they might be the only two Hardaways to play the game. i’m excluding Timmy’s son.
The biggest underdog team that no one expected!! Always will appreciate that defensive presence!!
Not me. Not Detroit. We expected it. I called to buy a season ticket package within 2 minutes of hearing we got Sheed. My immediate thought was, We just won the championship. I'm going! 🏆
@@nathanlawson313for you, i know they'll be a contender in the east once they got sheed but i didn't expect them to beat LA. I actually legit glad they humbled shaq and kobe so it led to their breakup😁
Probably 2011 Mavs
Oh please. They were basically a product of the handcheck rule where basically you could mug and hack and foul and get away with it.
Random question,
who's actually the best player on 2004 pistons?
It’s remarkable to think since their 6th straight ECF, they’ve only made 3 playoff appearances all as fringe 8th seeds and got swept in its first rounds
We tried to milk an aging roster to more championship runs. Then you draft knight over kemba. You stagnate your front court by drafting two similar players in Greg Monroe and Drummond. You pay Josh smith. You trade for Brandon Jennings right when he’s looking like he can potentially be a guy you build around he tears his Achilles ruins his career. You trade Tobias Harris and Chris Middleton two guys who pretty much are 18ppg scorers at the very least for 80% of their careers. You trade for Blake griffin. He has one career year but suffers a knee injury which ended his prime. That’s not even all of the moves. A mix of bad management and key players being ruined by injury
Trading Chauncey for AI was also a terrible move
Random question,
who's actually the best player on 2004 pistons?
@@accountant3847 Easy to say Chauncey since he won finals mvp but Ben was the heart of that team and had the biggest impact on the team
@@bobbysmoove4796 the best player was sheed talent wise. Overall the best player was Ben
As a Pistons fan, this hurts. 😢
As a Die hard Spurs fan...it's my favorite title. Pistons are my second favorite team because of this incredibly hard team.
Spurs fanatic here. The pistons spurs finals was the most nervous coming into a series I’d been as a fan and it was warranted. I think that series doesn’t get enuf credit as one of the best ever
2005 finals was the best finals ive seen. It was intense. I think no team scored 100 in that 7 game series against the spurs.
Crazy tight defense
@@kao856 the NBA told the Referees to not let the Pistons Win it. We still took the Spurs to 7 Games despite being handicapped and despite Raheed's Decision to let Horry hit that 3.
That finals was boring and exciting at the same time lol
When Chauncey Billups was traded to the Denver Nuggets, the Nuggets actually made it to the Conference Finals that year. So Billups had 7 straight Conference Finals appearances.
The Pistons fell off after Billups left, which I think showed how important he was to the team.
The Nuggets only improved 2 games in 2008-09
Only difference was 50 wins in 2007-08 got you the 8 seed in the West... In 2008-09 52 wins got you the 2 seed... Either way the results were the same.. The Nuggets lost to the Lakers in the playoffs
@@cmoneyno5conference finals tho and Billups leadership helped get them there.
@@wutangforever Only difference is 50 wins in 2007 =8 seed and 52 wins in 2008 = 2 seed
@@wutangforever They lost to the Lakers both years... There really wasn't a difference
One of the reasons the 2004 Pistons couldn't win another championship was back up players. They had Memet Okur Corliss Williamson in 04 and lost them both in 05 due to trades I think. They had a strong lineup but needed extra consistent bench players to carry the load. Once they lost Ben Wallace in the 06 offseason it hurt their chances more. But they nearly won in 05 but losing Williamson and Okur hurt the team more than expected.
We lost Mike James too
Their only strong bench pickup during the 2004 offseason was Antonio Mcdyess buts that’s it.
Random question,
who's actually the best player on 2004 pistons?
Mehmet Okur was simply let go to sign with Utah.
Same goes to Mike James (Milwaukee).
Their agents did a good job hitting two goals in one signing:
More money and more playing time.
As for Corliss Williamson, few days before or during training camp he was traded to Philly for Derrick Coleman. In retrospect, it was a stupid move.
Sure, they signed Antonio McDyess.
But letting go of Okur and Williamson lost the Pistons' frontline depth and thrives under Larry Brown's system.
Carlos Arroyo was impressive all the way to stunning upset of beating US that summer's Olympics, but arguably James is a better backup for his instant offense.
Regardless, the Pistons were close to repeat, but getting the job done again is way better than being close.
Okur was low key perfect in that role
This is one of my all time fav teams. Big Ben was the muscle, Chauncey was the heart, Sheed was the arm
Rip was the Mask?
Rasheed, a walking technical and ejection 😂😂
Random question,
who's actually the best player on 2004 pistons?
@@accountant3847 Ben Wallace. He was to the 2000s Pistons what Bill Russell was to the '50s-'60s Celtics.
@@JAWrightonline Good analogy
Why didn't they repeat?
Because Sheed doubled off Horry to help Tay with Manu.
That's it, that's the reason they didn't repeat. I'm pretty sure when I die, the last thing I'll think about is that three going up, and my heart breaking.
💯
Haunts me to this day
Yep, but the guard play was killing Detroit, bc our backcourt couldn't keep up with the Spurs younger ball handlers. Yes Browns situation hurt the team all yrs in the repeat yr.
i wish the nba would return to this era when the pistons would hold teams under 70 points than the way basketball is being played now...
As a Miami Heat Fan, the 2004 Pistons were a tough and gritty team. I rooted for them to destroy the heavily favorite Lakers in the finals. The Lakers in my opinion, relied on superstars to just walk in a win, Detroit said hell no and fought hard. One of the best underdog stories. It was fun.
It really came down to the beef between Kobe and Shaq at the time that lead the Lakers to lose.
@@selfoblivionalex6262 no way. that excuse is so tired. they simply got beat, just like they did in 99, just like they did in 2003. they werent unbeatable.
@@Cristian-vm1bg when 2 of yout best players of a teams are having beef its going to effect the game, Not saying the 04 pistons were a bad team but their championship win was simply right place and time they saw a disfunctional laker team and went for it. Plus this same pistons team got destroyed by the spurs the follwing year and heat in 06.
Kobe literally shot the Lakers out the series because he couldn't stand Shaq getting another finals MVP. Piston fans just live in fantasy land lol.@@Cristian-vm1bg
@@selfoblivionalex6262 That's not at all why the Lakers lost, lol. If that were the case, they would've lost either to the Spurs or Wolves, but they made it to the finals. The Lakers didn't losebecause the Shaq and Kobe beef. They lost because they didn't have role players to take any sort of pressure off of their two superstars once the Pistons fully committed to sending help on both Shaq and Kobe whenever they went to make their move.
You can literally rewatch the series on CZcams and see Fisher, Devean George, Medvedenko, Payton, and Malone (who admittedly got injured) either shoot bricks or get too scared to shoot their wide open shot and pass the ball back to Kobe to throw up a ridiculously tough shot. The narrative that the Lakers lost because of the "beef" is overplayed and just a poor excuse. The Lakers had no depth and it showed. That's why they lost
Should've repeated in 05 IF SHEED COULD HEAR BETTER. Literally...
Winning in final seconds of gm7 vs Spurs, during timeout coach Brown said, "DON'T double team in the corner!" SHEED ONLY HEARD "...double team in the corner!" He thought team would rotate behind him. Nope! Left Horry wide open unexpectedly and he nailed game winning 3.
Watch the play again. You can see the confusion and lack of rotation because Sheed unexpectedly blew his assignment.
It was game 5
Having only 59 points in the fourth quarter is insane people scoring that in one half now 😂 shows how good the defense was back then
Cuz defense was allowed back then
Or how bad offense was
Nahhh offenses were just bad and lacked creativity. Offenses favorite play was just to throw the ball to a player and let him cook in ISO
Bad offense (lack of 3pt skills so no spacing) and defense rules that wasn't in favor of scorers (hand checking, contacts, offensive fouls, etc)
@@davidjr4903 Because apparently offense wasn't allowed back then? That wasn't great defense, that was just brick after brick
The 2006 Pistons had many other facts:
- They could have lost to the Cavs in the 2nd round, who also had a 3-2 lead AND good defense (mostly thanks to Mike Brown) like the Heat in the conference finals. The Pistons had already played bad offense against the Cavs and it just carried over to the Heat series.
- While the coaching change helped the team get better record, Ben Wallace was not happy with Flip's game plan. The boiling point was the game 6 against the Heat, where Big Ben was benched in the fouth quaters.
- The core players (Chauncey, Rip, Prince, Sheed and Ben) were very healthy for the whole season. That might be a huge reason why they were able to win 64 games.
Yep the Pistons firing Larry Brown and hiring Flip Saunders brought them the same downfall as the Celtics firing Ime Udoka for Joe Mazulla this past season. While the Pistons and Celtics had better offense under Saunders and Mazulla they both lost their edge on defense under Brown and Udoka. They went from being runner up in the finals to losing in the conference finals a year later.
Flip saunders was seen as a good move and the pistons actually improved their offense but some of the guys on the team didnt like him because of his coaching style and ben wallace didnt get along with him. Which led to him signing with Chicago
Flip is one of the worst coaches in NBA history. A noob. My high school team ran more complex concepts. Pistons players thought he was joking at first.
A major reason was the freedom of movement rules that were implemented in '04-'05 and started to kick in full gear in 2006. If those freedom of movement rules existed in 2004 the Pistons likely wouldn't have won the 2004 Finals since it took away a lot of their edge on Defense.
💯
thats when basketball started to suck.
Yes….. also the Pistons offense was mediocre
@@williambrabston3045 Oh please. Basketball was 'better' when teams barely scored 80?
@@chrisuncleahmad absolutely. I'll take that over today's 3 point clown shows that go 110+ both sides
You’re one of the only basketball channels I can watch, great research and summary!!! And great story telling
Considering what Detroit was able to do from 04-06 was very impressive given that they had 0 superstars. I don't know that anyone expected them to be crowned champs in any year, even in 05 after they had won.
Chauncey Billups was not far off of superstar in his best seasons. Better than his reputation for sure.
Great video. I was a kid during the era and these Pistons teams made me fall in love with basketball. Getting to watch them deep into the summer every year with the fam outside was good enough for me. Still pissed we didn’t draft Melo or dwade
First Andy hoops video I watched since I subscribed earlier this week. Totally worth it! I didn’t realize the pistons made 6 consecutive conference finals
I think the enormity of the Darko pick is single handedly why people were so skeptical of guys like Giannis, Doncic and Jokic
Giannis and Jokic are MVPs, Finals MVPs and champions. They're the 2 best players in the world. If anyone is still skeptical of them, they're idiots who don't know ball.
@@dvs620keyword being "were" He meant when they drafted people had their doubts about them.
@@dexenationgracey1979 Giannis was drafted 15 and Jokic was a 2nd round pick n people weren't skeptical of them because people weren't expecting anything from them, especially Jokic.
@dvs620 If you have your doubts about a draft pick amounting to anything, that's skepticism.
@@dexenationgracey1979 Yeah, that's not what's being talked about here. First off, NO ONE was skeptical of Luka. At the time, the Ayton pick was defensible, it wasn't about Luka. The Kings passing on him was stupidity mixed with a grudge.
And, in the case of Jokic, being skeptical isn't the same as low to no expectations. You're conflating the two. With Giannis, I don't remember hearing anything about him one way or the other. Again, skepticism is not the same as low expectations.
When I think of 2000s basketball, outside of the Lakers and Spurs, the Pistons have a claim to that spot. They were the team most fans liked. If you beat Detroit, you could claim you were the best team. The moment when LeBron went off in game 5 kinda was the start of the demise. Of course, you could pin blame on Joe Dumars for bad draft picks or not getting that bucket getter. I highly doubt we'll ever see a team like Detroit again with how the current NBA is.
Celtics from 2017 till now with Smart, Tatum, Brown and Horford... not the same streak as the Pistons but good consistency
It astounds me how people put comments up that prove they know nothing about basketball 😂🤷 Well, this is one of those comments.
Random question,
who's actually the best player on 2004 pistons?
Huh? Nobody liked the Pistons. The General Public even took the Pacer's side in the Malice at the Palace fiasco. The only people that liked the Pistons back then were A) Already Pistons Fans or B) Lakers Haters. They were a boring team that nobody enjoyed watching. Just look at the Viewers and Rating for the Finals they were in. Lakers? Great Ratings because duh Kobe Shaq Lakers. Take the Lakers out? Viewership for Game One of Spurs Pistons was only 2/3rds of Game One from the previous year. 5 Million Viewers declined to watch a second straight Pistons Finals. Not a Single Game came close to matching the previous year finals until Game 7, and even then it still didn't meet the Viewer Numbers that a 4 games to 1 Pistons Championship did against The Lakers.
@@justinlast2lastharder749 Because most of the views came by casual fans who didn't like the structure of the Pistons and the Spurs.
Awesome video man! Been a fan of this team since the 2000's. It was heartbreaking to see them lose to the Spurs in 05 and slowly declined from there on. But I still love the Pistons!
The 04 Pistons are criminally underrated.
Facts.
As a Lakers fan, I respected that Pistons team far more than the CWebb era Kings.
@@Theterminato2013 why? Refs gave the lakers that championship. Kings were far better.
More like overrated. They only won 1 fluke championship in 6 eastern conference appearances lol.
@@Theterminato2013 You aren't a real laker fan
As a Spurs fan, Even though the Spurs defeated the 2004-2005 Detroit Pistons Roster.. I RESPECT THIS TEAM AND THEIR COACH LARRY BROWN... For me, this 2004-2005 Detroit Pistons Roster is one of the BEST TEAMS in the NBA History 🙏🏻
It's ironic that Larry Brown brought two franchises ( sixers and Pistons) their best success a recent history, but he also played a part in why those teams had became stagnant ( Darko over melo, Hughes over Dirk and truth )
don't forget he gave the league Popovich! and was a Spurs coach
2:44 Even this what-if happen, it won’t get the dynasty either. Coach Brown was known for not playing rookies at all. Milicic confirmed it, and even Richard Jefferson confirmed it in his recent interview on Old Man & Three’s podcast about his experience in 2004 Olympics with Coach Brown.
If THAT WHAT-IF happens, this video title probably will be “Is Melo/Wade/Bosh really a bust?”
Since we're talking about the Pistons' glory days, can you pls do a video focusing on "How good was Bill Laimbeer actually?"
I know he was a notorious dirty player, but the dude was a multiple-time All-Star and a key member of the Bad Boy Pistons. His basketball skills often gets overlooked due to his dirty antics, but he was one of the first stretch bigs in the 80s.
💯💯💯💯💯
He's a lot better than people realize. Borderline HOFer and still the Pistons all-time leader in Win Shares
@@dash_r_media agreed, bro! 💯One of the biggest factors on why he's not a borderline HOFer is due to most people forgetting his overall basketball skills.
Random question,
who's actually the best player on 2004 pistons?
@@accountant3847 Billups.
We lost Mehmet Okur and Corliss Williamson that offseason if I’m not mistaken. They were big contributors to our offense and we just didn’t have the fire power to close out 3 primed superstars pretty much in San Antonio.
Spurs just seemed a lot smarter in hindsight
Lost Mike James too. I’m sure some it was salary cap issues but Dumars failed to ever put together a competent bench for the core after 04.
Detroit in 2004 their defense is so good
They deserve their footnote place in history. If they had drafted a useable player in that 03 draft it would have made all the difference.
It's amazing how good the Pistons were in this era. The end of their era really was shifting of the guard. Great video 📹
Another banger, keep them coming ! 💪🙏🫶
i was a fan of these detroit pistons era. the simplicity of hamilton and prince and billups and the power of ben wallace. damn that was great.
First of all, that 2004 team is one of the best ever and one of my favorite teams. In my opinion, what derailed them from repeating was their coach. Larry Brown. After playing their hearts out for him and winning it all, he tells an interviewer that his "dream was to coach in NY". To me, that is so disloyal and disrespectful of these amazing players. But, they will ALWAYS stand out for proving that hard work and smarts are a hell of a lot more valuable than big, flashy names.
Appreciate the content, my man
I remember this entire season the longest one I've ever witnessed..it felt like two season's in one.Only reason Pistons weren't able to repeat that year was home court advantage at our S.B.C Center. It was tied still going in the 4th before the Spurs pulled away with very unusual shots and suffocating defense. The best I'd ever seen actually. Two Champions from the past two year's competing for the 2005 title....it's my favorite title run. The pistons we're the most difficult talented team I'd ever seen.
Both teams actually won a game on each other's court so it wasn't a true homecourt advantage
@@chrisuncleahmad I remember...game 5 and 6...I was clearly talking about game 7 at home. That's where home court advantage is most critical....idk where you people come from. You're not smart, you ALWAYS decide post some of the most pointless, irrevelant nonsense you can think of...every video on any subject. It doesn't matter. Morons are everywhere. Human Nats...
@@chrisuncleahmadThat's exactly, what home court advantage looks like. Couldn't had been more specific in the original comment. If you weren't around than watching it in real time. Don't post about it!
If not for Pistons trading for Rasheed Wallace mid-season team definitely doesn't reach Finals. Very good move by Joe Dumars
tayshaun was the only solid defender they had up to and at the wing, when they lost ben, it really made it hard for them
Absolutely too much dribble penetration killed them plus rebounding.
This is my favorite video from Andy
Rip hamilton wearing the mask was my first nba memory he made wearing a mask while hopping cool as fuck
When they let go of Ben Wallace thats the downhill then they started getting Mcdyess,Webber & AI who all washed up. Trading Billups was the nail in the coffin. He made sure he got the Nuggets in WCF 2009
Facts
I remember 4 of them in the all star game dominating with Paul Pierce one year
Too soon... I wasn't ready for this😓
Rule changes after their title run also had an impact in their success going forward.
Even the 2004 finals were more about taking advantage of the Lakers' collapsing chemistry and inflated egos than genuinely being the better team. The Pistons' players later spoke about their primary strategy: intentionally not doubling Shaq, knowing that the Lakers' would then pass him the ball more, and knowing that Ben could, at least, contain him a bit, even one-on-one. Thereby making Kobe jealous and start forcing shots. Which, they said, played right into their hands. It was clear to everyone watching that Kobe was going for FMVP; despite Shaq averaging very good and efficient numbers and Kobe arguably having his worst series, Kobe still shot the ball more times than Shaq. This isn't a significant knock on Kobe; he was young and highly competitive and more than made up for those performances with his superhuman achievements before and especially after. His maturing and adjustments following this series are two of the most impressive things about him. My only point is that the Pistons won by preying on the Lakers' off-court drama rather than being the better team.
Even IF the Kobe played unselfishly, I still don’t think they’ll beat the Pistons. That 04 Lakers team was very top heavy af. Great starting 5, but absolute shit bench. Our best bench players were only Devean George and Derek Fisher. The rest were young or mediocre like Slava Medvedenko who back up Shaq and Malone on the bench, Rookie Brian Cook and Luke Walton and Sophomore spot up shooter, Kareem Rush. Pistons had a far superior roster from top to bottom.
@@Theterminato2013 A superior roster that itself admitted to using psychology to win? I didn't say they were a bad team; they were a great team. But the only reason they won most games is Kobe going 0.381% from the field, 0.174 from 3, and only getting 4.4 assists a night; when you're one of the team's offensive leaders, and shots stop falling, it's your job to open up the floor and get the others involved, especially Shaq who, contrary to popular belief, still owned Ben with 26.6 pts 10.8 rebs on 0.631% shooting. Kobe took close to 30 shots a game. Why did roleplayers play poorly? Because they never got the ball when they needed it. A similar performance happened in the 2000 finals; Kobe shot poorly and rarely passed, except he agreed to play fewer minutes within the Shaq-centric system. Just look at how James Harden transformed from a first option to a secondary or tertiary option; he accepted his role and started passing a lot when shots stopped falling. Coincidently, he also plays with a dominant (probably) MVP bigman and spams passes to him as soon as he gets cold. There's a reason why they never won another title: they were a somewhat predictable low-offense high-defense team that got lucky enough to play in the mid-2000s Eastern Conference, AKA a joke of a conference; as soon as competent opponents appeared in the conference, they were done.
@@RVered This narrative is not really true and has become easy thing Kobe haters use to dis credit him Kobe single handle won the only game LA won in Game 2 and 3 of the 4 losses were blowout he basically cost them Game 4 Shaq had great game and Kobe shot terrible but overall the series was lost cause No 1 KMalone got injured causing Medvidanko start and LA 3-5 leading scorer was DFischer at 6PPG 30% DGeaorge 5PPG at 37% GPayton was 5PPG on 30% that’s 16 PPG on 30 % shooting with bench players playing just as bad
Hi Andy, you should also make a video on why 1977 Blazers, 1983 Sixers and 2019 Raptors didn't repeat their championship.
2019 Raptors? Bruh, I know you didn't just ask that one 😭😭😭😭 that franchise's entire claim to relevance hinged on Kawhi re signing there and he didn't
I mean, those 76ers were coexisting with prime Bird-McHale-Parish Celtics and Showtime Lakers, and the mileage was catching up to Dr. J.
Easy..in order
Blazers: Injuries
Sixers: Age
Raptors: Losing Kawhi
Just subbed. Great video
Yeah another Andy video!!
The East was really bad in that era, but you do have to give the Pistons more credit for how they beat out the 04 Pacers. If the Malice at the Palace never happens, that team probably wins at least 1 championship and has 3 hall of famers (O'Neal, Artest, Miller).
East been bad ever since
East was not weak in 04 they beat New Jersey. New Jersey beat the spurs 2 games in 03 finals. And pacers had the best record in the league with 61 wins in 04.
@@markamica1755 Pacers? LMFAO What about the Bucks? West>East!
@@LALakers4life34 what are u talking about? bucks were an 8th seed with micheal redd every year back then.
@@markamica1755 I meant now dumbass, east been weak since 99.
It’s simple. The reason why they didn’t repeat is because they left Robert Horry open in game 5 of the 05 finals.
I mean they took a powerhouse Spurs team to 7 games, they really didn’t need a superstar to repeat. It was just making timely plays that cost them a 2nd chip and Manu being unstoppable
Still waiting and waiting and waiting for the 2 separate videos about the pre-LeBron Cavs and the new CBA.
They would've repeated if Rasheed didn't leave Robert Horry open to double Manu. The pistons had the type of defense where they could've played 1v1 and been just fine
Especially where Manu was when Sheed came over. Because of the way Manu caught the inbound pass, he was stuck in the corner. A single defender can deal with any offensive player in that situation
Can't forget all the moving screens and the referees bailing the Spurs out on a lot of calls.
Manu was great that series but not game, and Horry scored like 18 of their last 25
@@Mathias3710 Let’s not forget all the flopping the Spurs did too.
@@Mathias3710 The Spurs over the course of many years were better than the Pistons, but I am not so sure about 2005, maybe they were and someone can certainly claim that. However, your answer hit the nail on the head. Every team gets away with some moving screens, that's basketball. However, the Spurs more than any other team used moving screens as a core part of their offense. Also, Ginobili, who is HOF player and deservedly so, was a big time flopper and slammed himself into defenders so much and yet the defender would get the foul call, SMH.
Bit of a hot take, but I wonder if we could see a modern day version of this Pistons team in the Cavs if they get a 3&D wing with a dawg in him? Some similarities there; anyhow this was one of my favorite teams in the past and tho I've been a Lakers fan I was glad the Pistons won that year as the gutsy underdog
Nope. After Pistons beat the 04 Lakers and the 05 low-scoring finals, NBA make sure this kind of teams and play style won't happen again. Now we only have these scoring orgies where teams are barely allowed to play defense. It's really sad. The 05 7 game series between Spurs and Pistons is probably the best final series to watch for a neutral basketball fan.
Yeah I agree with those people. As much as I love Timmy the FMVP should have been on Manu. He was the X factor of that series vs Pistons.
This line.up is so brutal when running the offense bec.od this man.. .billups😃&his teammates Wallace's,Hamilton,Prince💭💥💭💥💭💥it's a chaos caliber..
They really only had a chance at the title in 04 and 05. The team was still good in 06 but there is no way they get pass DWade and Shaq. And after that the team is just outmatched but they somehow miraculously made the ECF.
Manu ginobili was the reason they didn’t repeat everyone except casuals know this
I was living in Florida during the ‘04 season. I still remember telling my man when the Sheed trade went down the Pistons just won the chip.
4:01 frebrezzeo lol
What a hell of a name
Giving away Mehmet Okur was a big loss for us, not even joking.
True that but Mehmet Okur wanted to start and a bigger role on offense so that’s why he left the Pistons and signed with the Jazz during the 2004 offseason.
3 big reasons.
Darko draft... (although, if we drafted Melo or Dwayne wade instead... im not sure we trade for Rasheed that year who was the biggest piece of that championship puzzle)
2. Not resigning Ben Wallace during his dominance defensively and electing to save that money for Tayshaun Prince instead
3. The god damn refs against the spurs in game 7 of the finals AND the LeBron series where even in home games LeBron shot more free throws than our entire team combined.
And NO ONE will ever convince me that the refs didn't intentionally hand the spurs that game 7.
End of the first quarter of a game seven and Billups, Rasheed, and Ben Wallace had at least 2 fouls. And Rasheed had 3... they could never recover that game
Also.. the pistons never wanted to get rid of brown... sadly.. brown always dreamed of coaching the Knicks. And when the job became available. Making him the highest paid coach in the nba wasn't enough to stop him from leaving
Reason why I have Tim Duncan below Shaq and Hakeem in my all time list. Hakeem and Shaq raised their level of play facing great defensive teams(1994 Knicks and 2001 Sixers) while Duncan always shot the ball like shit against Dominant defensive big men like Ben Wallace and Rasheed Wallace in the 2005 Finals. Duncan shot 41% against the 2005 Pistons but Shaq shot over 60% against them the previous year. Everyone always want to talk about Kobe shooting 6/24 vs the Celtics in 2010 game 7 but no one talks about Duncan shooting 10/27 vs the Pistons game 7 2005. So what does Duncan and the Spurs resort to, flopping as usual to get foul calls.
I would arguably say that game 7 2005 Nba Finals was more rigged than game 6 2002 WCF. The Pistons were screwed over worst than the Kings.
One of my favorite teams ever
Even if the Pistons drafted Melo/Bosh/Wade, they were unlikely to see much playing time under Larry Brown
Chris Bosh definitely would have seen playing time at center and power forward because the front court only had one double figure scorer in Rasheed Wallace.
If they guarded Robert Horry they might have had another ring 😂
Lemme save y’all some time.
1. Even if we draft Melo, Wade or Bosh, Larry ain’t playing young guys like that and the only reason why Tayshaun got minutes was because his filled a gap in the lineup and played D.
2. If we draft any of those 3 prospects, we do not trade for Rasheed mid season, especially if we get Carmelo. So who’s to say we beat Indiana anyways, with melo in instead of Tayshaun to play switch D.
3. Robert Horry is the sole reason we lost the 05 finals.
The problem was Manu Ginobli in the 2005 finals he was like a 2023 player in that series complete 3 level scorer 49% fg 39% 3pt & 85 ft% getting that level of efficiency from your 3rd best player is insane production. That was Detroits best chance at winning a ring after the 2004 title.
Just like the present Boston Celtics without the ring.
Yeap, My Celtics team can't get it done, lol
You right good thing this teams stars are young otherwise it may not end up in any championships and for the Jays it’s 5 overall but 2 altogether ever since they became All NBA type players. Had a good team in those runs and like the pistons are making changes to the roster after every end of the run. You could say the heat are similar making it to 2 finals but not winning any but I def see the comparison with these Celtics which ima fan of and the pistons
Watching the Squrs crush this team made me very happy. Seeing Wallace struggling in that series made me very happy 😂 and then seeing them then crumble after that just are my day. Still salty about that lakers series 😅
Duncan almost always got the best of Sheed--even going back to their ACC battles
😭😭💯💯💯💯💯
The 2003-2004 Detroit Pistons players were all players who didn't get the recognition they deserved in the first half of their careers, or who had suffered misfortune and ups and downs.
You forgot to mention the rule changes the NBA made after the Pistons beat the Lakers in 2004. Those rule changes on hand checking doomed that Pistons dynasty forever, and allowed wing players like LeBron James and Dwyane Wade to run around them.
Rip’s 2-point game was such a beauty
Interesting video I definitely didn’t know they had the third most conference finals appearances in a row.
Tumi the Pistons Define the NBA's tough defense error of the 80s with Rodman and Thomas then again in the 2000s with this squad
I was at the Lebron 25 points straight game. A junior in high school. What a site that was to see. I as a pistons fan was also a lebron fan. Lol
You could tell that team in 2004 was going to win it all. They were so well balanced and tough on defense. They just had that hungry look in their eye. Like the eye of the tiger. The Lakers were trying to buy a title with aging stars that had lost more than a step. They just didn't mesh well together. They had too many guys who were used to being the main guy on their team.
"The final end" 😂😂
In the 2005 NBA Finals they went to seven games against the team that had won a year before them, and it was an incredibly close series for both teams. Manu wasn't the Pistons-killer. If Robert Horry doesn't go supernova in the final quarter + overtime of game 5 the Pistons would've won that game and won the whole finals. The Spurs had more depth.
Flip Saunders may have helped them in the regular season but the decision to switch them from man-to-man to zone defense is what cost them in the playoffs. Wade exploited that easily, and it was the only series between 04 and 07 that Shaq outplayed Ben Wallace on the boards. Saunders playstyle wasn't what the Pistons truly needed, as what they'd done before had worked well enough to reach the finals twice in a row.
I hope you know that play was originally meant for manu to tie it but it left horray open. This was manus best year actually. We played a perfect game that for most part aside from timmy...you guy's we're the ONLY team I've seen actually get into a prime Duncan's head and literally made him scoreless in the o.t. he missed like ten or more free-throws If I remember it right. Thing is you weren't going to beat manu he was arguably the real m.v.p. of that entire season. He was incredible.
Finally we are being talked about haha. Yeah its ironic because star power was our downfall from 05-09, but not having star power won us in 04.
I saw Berry in Hermosa California, after a comedy show & he was speaking with my associate, an comedian. I heard him say to him, after my associate congratulate him on the championship Spurs beat the Piston.
He said: "I thought we was going to play the Pistons". I knew they cheated.
The reason they didn't repeat was a star player, they missed the Bull Dawgs (Mike James left) & Big Nasty, Ocur, & the rest. The Coach. The system worked, just didn't replace what was lost.
They had tayshaun prince who was on the redeem team in the Olympics at the 3, so they didn't need a melo or a d wade
Given the screwed 2003 Draft and 2004 free-agent signings of Mehmet Okur and Mike James for greener pastures and more playing time, perhaps one overlooked transaction that same 2004 offseason was trading away Corliss Williamson to Philly for aging Derrick Coleman. Following his involvement at the "Malice in the Palace", Coleman was waived and eventually retired.
Williamson was a quality player and later used as one of the trade pieces that sent him back to Sacramento for C-Webb. He was a valuable bench cog in the 2004 Finals, creating mismatch whenever guarded by small players. That wildcard/intangible was missed much in 2005 Finals.
Carlos Arroyo tried his part to give quality minutes to spell Billups, but Mike James is more of a threat for his scoring skills.
Guess Larry Brown is bored in coaching a receptive bunch, or had a culture shock after dealing with Allen Iverson for six tumultuous years prior Detroit. Perhaps he missed teaching knuckleheads, prompting him to coach Stephon Marbury and the Knicks after Detroit.
On the other hand, Flip Saunders might get mesmerized with the starting five he forgot to hone and develop the second unit. And for his over-reliance with his All-Star starters, they accumulated mileage earlier than expected.
Manu ginobli was definitely rob we all have to agree on this. Everytime I looked at the screen ginobli was going up on someone. It really was a good year for him all around the hair was making him unstoppable lol.
This is missing a key point. The NBA banned hand checking to try and reduce low scoring games after 2004. The pistons toughness and defensive identity was damaged. That was how they won games.
They were less than a minute from repeating in 05. One poor defensive decision was all it took. That’s how it goes.
Mike James and Corliss Williamson were important from the bench.
this is my team untill now.
That team was quite old. Walaces were already past 30, so their peaks were behind them. Billups and Hammilton were in their peaks but how many years you can be in your peak?. Prince was the only young and upcoming player from the starting five. And I remember that their bench was ancient with dinosaurs like Hunter, Mcdyes, and Campbell. So realisticly, they had 2-3 years window of being final contendors. They went into two finals, won first and were a few shots away from winning second. That sounds good to me. After that their aged core needed upgrades. Dumars did not provide. But I guess he was banking on his second pick. Still they managed to reach conference finals with 33 years Wallaces. I consider that overachieving.
Regarding D. Milicic one thing is always forgotten that L. Brown was notoriously bad with young players development. He wanted to play veterans only. Considering that Pistons were winning championship, it was obvious that L. Brown will not be replaced for not developing rookies. And I guess J. Dumars had this philosophy not to fix something that is not broken. Therefore I am not sure that other players would had more success than Darko. Carmelo had multiple clashes with G. Karl, who was the same old school type of coach as L. Brown. On the contender team, rookie C. Anthony would be riding bench for such plays that he played at Denver. C. Bosch was a project with the body not ready for high-level NBA games. Raptors were ideal place for him as they were loosing team with little winning aspirations and weak frontcourt. D.Wade I think, could fit Pistons, but he was a huge reach on the second pick. I remember in mock drafts before workouts Wade was project to be 8-15th pick. Only after workouts he started to climb. But drafting Wade at 2nd would be seen as an outrageous and would put a lot of pressure on him and front desk. You never know how that could develop. Of course, in hindsight Pistons could trade down but hindsight is 20/20.
Most people thought Robert Horry, Dwyane Wade or Lebron killed the Pistons dynasty.
But really, it was Darko Milicic.
Not enough love for T. Prince! Long arms, great defender!
currently my pistons suck but we'll get back to these days we have a nice core with Cade, Ivey, Duren possibly Wembanyama. i just want us to be decent at least make the playoffs.
Losing Okur, Williamson, and Mike James was a big part of why they didn't repeat.