Primal Rights CPS Bench Primer Seating Tool
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- čas přidán 10. 07. 2024
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RCBS Ram Priming Unit for $30 works like a champ, can fine tune the depth with ease. Will spend that $600 on primers, thanks for sharing your tips.
$600 was a bit much but was gonna pop.. then the f-ing guy upped it to $679 shipped. He can shove it.
No Doubt Brother 😅
I love ❤️ spending a boat load of money on equipment and still need a rubber band on it to operate it... That's a hard NO for me.
Check this out, I used to use that then I bought the Lee bench primer, the best on the market, no alignment issues, smooth, an absolute pressure to use, it is absolutely a better working tool than this is!
I really like the concept of this product and the Owner/designer Greg Dykstra seems like a man of integrity and values. He believes in this product and I would really like to see him put this product to some independent testing to demonstrate how important the seating of primers this consistently is to the shooter. Until then, it would help to try to get the unit cost down some.
Is that a primer pocket uniformer sitting on your bench?
For $600 i would expect a calibrated precision rubber band to be included 😂
I upgraded my RCBS primer setter.
I drilled a hole through the lever and tapped it.
An adjusting screw serves as an end stop.
It costs next to nothing and works perfectly.
please post a video of this. it sounds amazing.
Any pictures of your setup?
The Frankford arsenal seater has what you are describing I think..
30 years ago I bought a Lee Ram Prime for $12. It gives excellent feel and precision. I just laugh whenever I see things like this. (Cool gadget though!)
It's $600.00 and needs a rubber band?
LOL 😂
I was about to comment the same thing but saw yours! Agreed!!???
Ordered one last night thanks for the video. You were helpful in the decision. At 53 I understand the issues with a long session priming. Thanks.
I absolutely love mine. I also use a rubber band. This tool for me is the best priming system I've used.
absolutely LOVE my CPS! Ultimate in feel and speed and definitely 'built like a tank'!
Agreed! Fast, very repeatable seating depths, and it's great for my early arthritic hands!
I have one too, it is the best variable primer seating system I have used. I also have the 21st Century adjustable primer seater. Both do the job, but the CPS is easier to use and adjust.
Great video.
It took me years before I bought my CPS. It’s one of my favorite reloading tools on the bench! After a year of priming with mine I'd never be with out one.
👍🏻
I think this is a matter of saying. " I spent more, so I have the best"
When I saw your previous video when you said you got rid of the CPS, I was wondering if you were insane? This is by far the best priming tool I've been using for so many reasons! Glad to see you back to not being able to live without it :)
Can you quantify any change in accuracy or velocity, given a ~5 thousandths variance in seating depth ? 😕 I doubt it...
Wow in the 80’s I shot many 1/4 minute aggregates using a $10 Lee-Mequon primer seater, in 1988 I upgraded to a used Sinclair still using today, it was $50 back then
Sorting for rim thickness; primer seating depth consistency...my head hurts. As does my wallet when I watch your videos. As always, thanks for sharing.
Some like vanilla. Some like chocolate. Some prefer a green leaf and others a brown wrapper. Some are happy rolling in a Kia others like an Alfa.Beautiful thing about my America, you're free to choose
“Don’t be stupid” -FCJ
😂
Consistent, uniform and fast yes but a $600 primer needs you to buy shell plates (they should simply come with it) and a rubber band to ensure the primer is fully inserted (so as not to crush one or ruin one or..... And if that many people are using rubber bands for a clear flaw the designer/produce needs to go back and simply ADD a spring "hold closed" or "fully inserted" function. I can already see where I would attach a small spring at the back of that primer inserter "arm" then stretch said spring to the back of the body of that massive unit - where a small hole would be drilled to allow spring attachment. Surely that unit has enough mass to allow a small hole to allow a spring attach point at back. And that's just one potential place to attach a spring. Add in cost for spring would be what maybe 25 to 75 cents maybe even a whole $2 and then the seller add on to MSRP another $5 plus dollars. This is why I tend to shy from super high-end gear - its asymptotic value is very, very, very small given all the addons the user still needs to supply plus all the quirks you the user must still overcome.
The priming system on the Forster Co-Ax press is consistent, works good.
I totally agree. I used it when I had my Co-Ax and it was good.
I have the benefit of seeing this after your wonderful review of the Lee ACP running "three thousandths all day long" - will pass on the CPS.
The Lee bench primer absolutely is a better functional tool than this is.
John, Thanks for the video. If you ever need anything just give us a call!
Thank you very much
when he said it was expensive i thought 2-3 hundred when i seen it was 600 i said the f word and thought what dumb ass would buy that thing.
We could use a solenoid Ana a momentary contact switch attached to the handle using a battery and 12 volt coil, then it would be as revolutionary as the primer tool. Not to mention totally rad and awesome dude.
John, off topic but, what happened to the clear windscreen/riser setup you put together for your FX-120?
Huh, $600 and need a rubber band? I started with a cheap Lee Priming tool, $17 and worked like a charm until I tore it up. Upgrading from that was an RCBS priming tool. And it's been south of this unit by $500. Sorry, not a fan, but maybe spending $600 dollars means the difference in winning in a competition or not. Show us if this matters with your SD, EC and MOAs.
Is there any evidence that shows that this $600 primer seating tool increases accuracy? Primers are designed to be seated until the cup fully seats in the primer pocket. They are not designed to be "crushed". This product is one of the biggest scams yet, IMO.
I just did a seating depth test on my 6BR at 100 yds. One group was .03 and the other was better. It was so small, I could not even measure it accurately. All primers were seated using a $60 Frankfort Arsenal primer. I never once measured a primer pocket (Lapua brass and 205m primers) It seams to me for $600 you shouldn't need a rubberband.
I crush my primers mostly to ensure a tighter and consistent fit. Does improve accuracy most likely not, but it should reduce the risk of burning my bolt face when I run hot loads.
Hi John, how much uniform have you made the primer pockets? or what would also be worth, how much to preload the primers?
cheers
Thanks
Do you think reloading is a good hobby for people stricken down with OCD?
What is that tool you are using for measuring the depth? I looked on their website and I couldn’t find it.
Thoughts on the Forster priming tool? As for me I love it. If nothing else with the little tray you can load it up in a few seconds vs picking up primers 1x1 forever. That said I am not all that familiar with the primer tube loader. It seems to me that loading primer tubes is the weakness of most priming tools that use them.
I had the Forster unit years ago and it’s not bad. It just doesn’t have any way to set depth on it so you’re at the mercy of whatever it does.
The rubber band is...a tad hilarious. I use a 21st Century, and it is very, very consistent (and adjustable) IF, but only if, you stroke each primer twice and rotate the brass about 180 degrees between strokes. Otherwise, even with primer pockets prep'd the way John is prep'g them, the variation on seating is greater than 0.001". But when you do the rotation method, that variation tends to wash out. HOWEVER, the 21st Century doesn't have the primer feed system, which is huge (if you have ever used a Dillon progressive or an RCBS hand primer, you know what I mean!).
great videos. Is it just me or are these videos on reloading a form of super flex? A primer video, as if there are primers in the wild? I wish I could reload, I can not find primers at any supplier. Love the videos, envious of the primers. Keep up the flexing.
What I dont understand, is if pretty much everyone uses a rubber band, why dont they upgrade the design to account for this flaw?
If, and it’s a big if, this thing actually helps accuracy, I wonder if most shooters, including myself, are good enough to even take advantage of this expensive increase in consistency.
So now you need another gadget ,plus a rubber band..Ive.heber had a daily to give from anything loaded or primed on my Dillon 550c even when I only prime on my Dillon and loadcwith my Amp Mate or K&M Arnor press. SO is it better than the Holland Priming Tool?
Up with the algorithm
What does primer seating depth do for group size? Can you show me a rounds on target video of your 0.0065" seating depth vs seating with a hand primer or some other priming system?
Rubber band mod….! 🤯
I have an RCBS and love it I wanna see if there's a difference on paper!
Hollands shooter supply carries an add on for the rcbs to accurate it.
John, did you get rid of the CPA again in favor of the Lee?
Thank you for the well made video.
Please explain why would you slow down the reloading process and not increase accuracy. Frankford Arsenal hand primer has the adjustment for primer depth and is excellent. Fast accurate robust inexpensive.
In my case I absolutely can't and won't use a hand priming system. It's way too hard on my hands with the problems I have. I know there's good hand primers but they're not for me, that's all.
John,
Understood. Primal Rights is a top tier primer seater and I can see the advantage of hard stop seating adjustment especially with physical limitations. Thank you for your tremendous contributions to precision.
Blessed Memorial Day for those who offered their best and brightest for peace and security of others.
Can you feel the seating pressure required to seat the primer, like seating a bullet with an arbor press ?
Absolutely!
What kinda of a powder scale do u use
Use the shell holders from Sinclair, they don't bind up like the lee version when priming Lapua brass. I love my CPS...
I'll check them out. Thank you.
Please let us know what the result was.
I ordered 4 Sinclair shellholders for mine, but 3 out of 4 didn’t work for me so I sent them back. My cases just didn’t fit in it.
@@bennyvandecraen3509
That's odd, mine have worked flawlessly...
I’m really happy for you. They are made really nice, but the 45-70 was a tight fit, but a bit too tight for my liking. My 280rem and 260rem cases didn’t fit the 308family shellholder or you had to push them in really hard, and my lapua 338LM cases and 300NM cases didn’t fit the 338 shellholder at all. The one for the cheytac cases worked perfectly tough. Really strange but this was my experience with them. I ordered the Lee shellholders and everything that is supposed to fit fits.
$600 Primer and worth every penny! Yes there are plenty of cheaper ways to seat primers but there isn’t a better or even as good way…….
What difference does it make on target?
so for $600 the couldn't put a spring in the feeder? and since primer can only seat to the bottom of pocket and will level out, how is this better?
What is the product from IGaging that you use to measure for the primer depth?
It's this bullettipping.com/products/precision-primer-gauge/
John what brand is the depth gauge? It looks like a tire tread gauge but Im sure its not.Thanks.
It's this one bullettipping.com/products/precision-primer-gauge/
@@FClassJohn Thank you.
7:10 You know what primer system isn't rim-dependent? Lee Loader. The primer sits in a cup and the case is pushed down onto it. Perhaps someone needs to invent a priming machine in which a rod goes into the case and holds it flush against the base of the shell holder as the priming arm is rising to meet it.
Yes! You will never get square seating by indexing off of the rim.
I looked it up. It's janky as hell in the most legitimate possible way.
@@ChielScape The Lee Loader? Hell yeah, but it will do ammo on the go when you don't have space for anything else. I agree that a benchrest application would need a more sophisticated approach to the same basic concept, but an arbor press should be able to handle it.
I started watching this video thinking I'm very happy with my 21st Century hand primer and I'm not interested in anything else.
I ended this video with the primal rights website opened in another tab and my card at the ready.
😂
You won’t regret it. I love my CPS.
Could you use the 21st century shellholder’s in the CPS?
This tools worth, is relative to your expectations.
Accuracy costs money. How tight do you expect to shoot ?
If one is pleased with 1/2 groups at 100 yards. This tool isn’t for you & will not be needed.
If one wishes to shoot 1 hole bingos at 200, this tool offers an exceptional means of identifying primer seating issues & meticulously controlling them.
I expect one level of accuracy from my, off the shelf, hunting rig.
I expect something else entirely, of my custom target rig.
would you mind saying exactly what tool you used to measure this?
Accuracy One Primer Gauge.
How do you think the CPS compares to the 21st-century hand priming tool as far as seating depth consistency?
The 21st is really good too and super consistent. The biggest thing is my hands can't handle using it.
@@FClassJohn i’m still a pretty young guy, who has more grip strength than money.
I could see down the road getting the CPS.
But I was wanting something with the same consistency at a better price point.
So I think I did right with ordering the 21st for now.
@@linemen71 I don't think you'll be disappointed.
Great stuff! I usually don't comment on your videos because I probably sound like an idiot. I don't do anything beyond loading blasting ammo, so excuse my ignorance. How much does the seating of a primer relate to consistent ignition/es/sd/etc and thus group size? Is there an article or something testing amounts of "crush" vs "yeah, there's a primer in the case" you would recommend. Thanks for sharing 🇺🇸👊👍
I don't know about articles but I can tell you it does have an effect on numbers and groups. Maybe later this year I'll do a video on it for everyone.
It should be like ignition timing on an engine. I believe there is a relation between primer seating depth and head space that definitely shrinks es/sd.
Powder nodes, neck tension, headspace, Brass Case head perpendicular concentricity, primer seating depth, powder humidity.
There is nothing out there. Orkan claims it will take a .5 moa shooter to point .3. It is just a claim to get the average shooter to purchase the tool. It can't be proven thus he isn't going like people returning it. He even has a video of a return tool and all he shows is the tool isn't broken even though the customer stated that wasn't the reason.
@@davidsalsedo let's see the proof then. do a blind test with these "pro" seated primers vs primers seated with the cheapest seater in the universe, and see if there is any detectable difference in group sizes.
what comparator body are you using on the Igauging tool?
It's this one bullettipping.com/products/precision-primer-gauge/
@@FClassJohn are you running the igauging tool and there comparator body?
Guys, save your money and get the Frankford Arsenal Platinum Series Perfect Seater.
...Or the K&M or 21st century, or Sinclair's
Hello, What is the name of the i Gaging Type? Where i can buy this?
Hello, it's this one bullettipping.com/products/precision-primer-gauge/
I am a progressive guy and recently upgraded to a Dillon super 1050. When something that costs 25 percent of what that entire unit does and ALL it does is prime you know you are getting scammed. Just get a hand primer for like $25. There is no way your return on investment on that piece of equipment is even going to improve your ES by 5% nor your SD by 3%. Brass and the prep, bullets and powder make the biggest difference. Ive seen videos of guys who clean primer pockets and uniform them and they don’t gain anything in any meaningful way. If it makes you feel good thats great but your time I am sure would be better spent just slapping your stuff in a progressive after annealing and cleaning, making 200 rounds in less than 30 minutes than taking 2 hours to make 100. Time is better spent practicing.
$600.00 And 5 cent Rubber band, really
600 dollars to prime! Well if you have problems priming maybe you need to look at a little primer pocket prep over spending this much money to do something that has been done for years on presses and with mechanisms on the press and hand operational tools. The main thing is there any gain in accuracy. I am skeptical! Reloading needs attention to detail to a reasonable degree, but there are some I feel get a little carried away. Using a considerable amount of time to load a few rounds I thought the idea was to speed up reloading operations while still maintaining reasonable consistency ie the progressive press!
For 675, throw in shell holders ...At least a choice of 3
What brand is the gage
Where do I buy one
bullettipping.com/products/precision-primer-gauge/
If you still have you Dillon 750, would you still use this to prime?
I got rid of the Dillon set up almost a year ago. I only load on the Zero now.
Sorry I may have misunderstood your question. If I had the Dillon I would probably prime on the Dillon to be honest.
@@FClassJohn thanks for the honest opinion. My grammar was poor and I meant to say “had” which is probably where the confusion came from. With a Dillon xl650 running about the same as the CPS, I just can’t see the upgrade being worthwhile. That being said, I like many others here, have more money than skill so may just buy one anyway for the fun of it 🤣
@@edd1e22 And keep in mind that because of how the 650 primed, you can actually order the little primer seating stems from Dillon and sand them to different lengths for different seating depths. You can't easily do that on a 750.
@@FClassJohn appreciate the insights and tips. I just joined your Patreon as well. Love the content there!
For the amount of money you pay for this thing you shouldn't have to ghetto rig it with an elastic band, the company should have built it with some spring system so an elastic band wouldn't be needed
Primer pockets would have to be uniformed for this tool to be accurate.
I have about 5 different priming systems, and combined they don't add up to even half the cost.
600.00 ? somebody is screwing somebody.....
Why is the primer tube flopping around... seems likely to fall off and there goes money all over the floor
It's not like it looks, he simply allows for just about any size tube to fit but I've never (back when I had my old one) knocked the tube out. You would think it might be an issue but it's really not from my experience.
I've never had a priming tube fall out. This thing is awesome.
No blast shield?
I don’t think so!
I can't get over the overdone technology of priming cases. I just primed last night and found I had to pocket uniform to prevent protrusion on new brass and this primer is the same as any other primer, really. My Lee ram prime on my RCBS partner press is just the right leverage and feel is consistent. Priming isn't and shouldn't be this critical.
£800 in the UK and you need a rubber band to make sure it work right ????
600 $ for 30 $ of metal is unacceptable.
Prices are going up badly....
I will never spend that much for a tool that costs few bucks
I love ❤️ spending a boat load of money on equipment and still need a rubber band on it to operate it... That's a hard NO for me.
people with more money than brains, more power to them if they think this is money well spent, i'll spend mine on brass,powder etc.
21st Century....Done.
Not sure it's 500 dollars better than a 21st century hand primer...
I can tell you that in my case it definitely is because I have bad hands and I probably couldn’t even get through 50 primers on my 21st century hand primer when I had it without my hands starting to hurt. Not everyone can handle repetitive motion the same. Trust me I understand the unit you have is probably the best hand primer on the market but there are times where people can’t use those.
@@FClassJohn perfectly fair point!
I have both. The 21st Century is awesome but you have to hand feed the primers so its slow. This gives you the same no compromise consistency at a ridiculously fast pace. So for me, worth the extra $$$. I would trade my auto-Trickler for a chargemaster if I had to, I would trade my Giraud for a WFT trimmer and RCBS case center. I would trade my AMP for a torch annealer. I would not trade this for anything. For me its the one piece I cant replicate and get nearly as quick a workflow.
@@sf2189 I can load 100 rounds pretty quick with the 21st tool. And I don't need to load primer tubes, have something screwed to my bench, etc. I think for 600 dollars it should at least auto feed primers. If it auto fed... I'd already own one.
@@FullSendPrecision For me, like John, it killed my hands and slowed me down - more than anything feeding the primers. However, there is no argument that the 21st Century is an amazing tool. Before this, I used it exclusively and very successfully. I was hesitant given the cost but after using it, Im sold. I do think this was made for people who load thousands of rounds and want to do it with precision. I’m not in that category but boy is 100 rounds quick.
Can anyone actually show me the increase in performance I`m getting with these things?
21st century hand primer click adjustable no rubber band needed 😂
I don't want to win that much. Actually, I don't want to win at all.
You would think for 600 bucks you wouldn’t have to wrap a rubber band around it.
Get a refund and buy the Lee bench primer, that thing is ridiculous.
$600 just for seating primers is ridiculous
Nope rcbs bench vs this 600 vs 80
all that 6 h un dereed and no rubber
Good for the the world class paper puncher but not for 99.9% of hand loaders. I'd rather spend $600 on other reloading tools and components. No insult to the designer and maker of the tool. I would spend that amount if I dedicated my life to competitive shooting.
To make it work well, you have to use a rubber band? No thank you. I have a Hornady and a Frankford Arsenal handhelds work just fine for a heck of a lot less and NO rubber bands needed.
Ok, you just promoted a $600 priming tool, and modified its design because of known issue. You incorporated a rubber band to ensure the process...I like your videos, but for $600 it should've been designed to function flawlessly in every aspect.
Thanks to this video, I won't invest in this, the design although nice, still is not functioning as designed
A good way for a rich man to throw away his money...
Can u get me one less than 600. bucks ?
So a stupidly expensive priming tool will make a person more accurate. Fetish or fact?