Prime Shaquille O'Neal CLEARS Prime Tim Duncan
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- čas přidán 26. 07. 2023
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2003 Duncan playoff run he had no All-Star teammates (and not even a teammate finish top 30 in All-NBA voting), led SA in every major statistic, averaged 10 more PPG than his next best scorer, was a top 3 defender in basketball, beat 6 current All-NBA players on route to the title, and to this day has the highest VORP and Win Shares of any playoff run ever
Peak/Prime Duncan beats Shaq.
In 2003 he had multiple different players contribute and chip in for different games in the games they won.
On average the other top scorer on the team in 2003 averaged
PTS: 22.2
TS%: 63.2
@@kingjaydex7464 You’ve just made this up. Through 96 playoff games, his 4 best scorers only managed to score 25+ in 4 games (aka once a series one teammate scored 25+).
You’re making up numbers. A teammate on average did not average close to that many points or close to that efficiency.
Top 3 carry in league history
@@hardwoodthought1213 That’s cute 🥰.. Prime Shaq won the scoring title, was 2nd in DPOY voting , averaged 3.8 assists that season just as much as Duncan or Hakeem ever averaged in their careers , shot 57% FG and ended his run with a Finals AVERAGE of 38 ppg, 17 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steals and 3 blocks. Did I forget to mention that Kobe got injure in game 1 of that Finals ?
Duncan had the longevity but peak Shaq CLEARS him. Better scorer , higher, volume more efficient, and better playmaker.
@@kingjaydex7464 Yeah, you're lying bruh. In that playoff run, Duncan averaged 10 more ppg, 9 more rebounds, 2 more assists, and 2 more blocks than any player that was second on his team.
In the 03 finals, he averaged 10 more ppg, 10 more rebounds, 1 more assist and 3.5 more blocks than any player that was second on his team.
One of the greatest runs in history.
@@Thanosdidtherighthing 2000 Shaq averaged 3.8 APG in RS and 3.1 come playoffs
03 Duncan averaged 3.9 assists in RS and 5.3! In the playoffs
Try again, making stuff up. Rigged series v Portland, Kobe the closer, Kobe made All-NBA and All-Defence
03 Duncan >>> 00 Shaq
2:05 how Duncan win 5 of the 9 categories but isn’t the better player 😂
Because Shaw scored way more on way better efficiency and was a way better playmaker.
@@ImbetterthanDWadebut Duncan is a better shooter and is a way better defender than Shaq + a leader / teammate as well…
not a way better defender. he had Robinson, Bowen and Kawhi to cover for him. Duncan may have been a better defender than shaq but it certainly isnt enought to overcome the Scoring, efficiency and rebounding difference @@MOCdude
@@tridra5714shaq has 3 all defensive teams
Ducan has 15😂
Shaq FEELS more dominant but maybe Duncan has more substance. He's very skilled defensively, shooting, passing, and strategically playing as a team. Duncan had better IQ and was much steadier, winning over the course of 20 years. He can play any role on any day. If his team is cold he can score, if his team is hot he can play defense and defer.
In terms of winning, Duncan was one Ray Allen shot away from being 6-0 in the finals!
Shaq a 3 times finals mvp Duncan is not
@@stevencowart-ud7dsuhm yes he is
@@stevencowart-ud7dsdon’t talk ball no more casual
@@stevencowart-ud7dsthis is why knowing what ur talking about before speaking is important
@@stevencowart-ud7dsgoogle is your friend.
Prime Duncan. All day. Better defender. Stepped up bigger in the playoffs. More complete game and he was a better teammate.
Duncan clears Shaq.
Not even close.
I’m taking Duncan. As dominant as Shaq was Duncan was fantastic on both ends. how you gon put a whole chart with most Duncan checking off on and still say Shaq overrall?!
Cause shaq lol
We going to pretend like Shaq didn’t average 27 in Orlando ?
Unreal people think he was sitting on his thumb until 2000.
Peak Shaq > Peak Duncan
Prime Duncan > Prime Shaq
Shaq peaked higher, but Duncan got way more Prime Years.
No no no!!!!
@@christopherhawkins7388 it’s the truth homie.
@@christopherd.3291no it’s not bro Duncan’s longevity is overrated he was no longer all nba level after 09
@@Abel-yo9mfhe was all nba literally in 2013
Tim Duncan is the 6th greatest player in NBA history. Give me 1999-02 Shaq over damn near anybody in NBA history
@BoskoShabazz Duncan is more like the 6th greatest PF in history not player
@@christiansoldier77 you’re drunk.
@@BoskoShabazz You are delusional
@@christiansoldier77 very stupid take
@@rockstarhulk your take is stupid my take is informed
Dude want to go crazy about Shaq’s 3-peat but fails to recognize the greatness of Kobe being on those teams. If Tim Duncan would have had Kobe, he could have easily won back to back chips as well.
From 2002 on, Tim cleared Shaq in every stat in head to head match up practically every outing
That old Chill hate on Kobe is All time Muppet level 😆
How was he hating Kobe was the best player from 2007-2010 he mentioned that already he wasn’t the best player for the whole decade 😂
when did he hate on kobe
@@NapoleonBeats
U muppet.
Old Chill hating and talking about his COUSIN Shaq vs Duncan as if Kobe didn't exist and led the Lakers in both points and assists and steals in the 01 and 02 regular and playoffs like 🤡
Shaq was great in the paint bec of his size and power and not bec of his basketball talents like Duncan and Kobe.
You should go and watch them Playoffs in the West of who the best player was since you are a Muppet that haven't even seen them games!
@@24Jabba
Are you new to this channel?!
🤡
yall replying gotta watch this entire episode to understand why this man said that. chill was lowkey tryna push bron propaganda
I’m not disputing the dominance of shaq But Tim Duncan’s entire career he won for 20 years straight he led his team to the playoffs
You said that like Shaq wasn’t doing the same thing and was doing it more dominantly the game of basketball had to change just to stop Shaq because he was so dominant at it Tim wasn’t as dominant but he was able to stay on that good ass spurs team while Shaq got bounced around
Ok give him the Hank Aaron award for being consistent. The last 8/10 of Duncan career was rather role playerish. Tim avg 17 ppl and 9 rebounds
this was actually a good conversation
Duncan > LeBron > shaq
….
Big facts.
I dont hate that
Yup.
This isn't really that much of a debate. Shaq played with FAR more talent than Duncan over the course of his career and won less titles. Ain't no way in hell Shaq is leading that '03 Spurs team to a title. Put Duncan in Shaq's place and he and Kobe probably never break up and win at least 2X as many titles together
Shaq didn’t play with Kobe or D-Wade in their primes.
Penny got hurt so early in his career, that retroactively it was his prime with Shaq, but it likely wouldn’t have been if healthy.
Fake news! Duncan joined a Spurs team that won 59 games the last time Robinson was healthy. Shaq joined a Magic team that was 21-61 before he got there.
@@Thanosdidtherighthing No kidding. And he shortly inherited Penny, who was generational before injuries. Then prime Kobe, then prime Wade, then Nash & Amare, then Lebron, then Boston. Robinson got old quick then Duncan was playing mediocre rosters for about 3 straight years of his prime. There’s no way you can argue Duncan played with more talent than Shaq. It just doesn’t add up
@@TheJesseGladSaget Duncan was the best player on his team in 3 out of 5 Finals wins . Shaq was the best player in 3 out of 4 finals wins. No your math isn’t adding up.
@@Thanosdidtherighthing Wrong. Duncan was the best player on both ends of the court on the first 4. Parker just took advantage of a good matchup in the ‘07’Finals and won MVP. He wasn’t even the Spurs 2nd best player in the regular season or the playoffs that year
No panel today??
That 03 title alone is enough for me to put Tim over Shaq
Ticket keeps bringing up the "one shot away" like Shaq wasn't a miss shot away from being down 3-1 in 2002
Shaq vs Duncan in the playoffs:
99: Duncan 29-11-2BLKS, Shaq 24-13-2
01: Duncan 23-12-4BLKs, Shaq 27-13-1BLKs
02: Duncan 29-17-3BLKs, Shaq 21-12-3
03: Duncan 28-12-1, Shaq 25-14-3
04: Duncan 21-12-2 Shaq, 22-14-4
Duncan outperformed Shaq in more of they matchups in both of they primes. But the difference is Shaq had a better costar than Duncan did during those years.
In all of those series the 2nd highest production was Antonio Daniels avg 19PPG on 41%
Meanwhile Kobe took advantage of the Spurs weak backcourt and 25+ PPG in 4 out of 5 series. Imagine if Duncan had that kind of help
Nothing but lies lol. Duncan never averaged over 27 in he's carrer and he did that once and lost in the second round.
@@thialhoinj1971who cares the next year he averaged essentially similar numbers and won a title. Tim was a more balanced player and during his peak he won more with his team.
@@thialhoinj1971 i clearly put Shaq vs Duncan head to head matchups during they prime in this post. If you could read you would see that.
When Shaq and Duncan faced off in they primes, Duncan outplayed Shaq during his peak/prime
@@Jolteon1989 yes Duncan did out play shaq in 3 of 5 series but Duncan couldn't do that for a whole playoff series. In his first 3 runs to the finals he averaged 23, 13. Shaqs best 3 playoffs run and definitely finals Performance clears Duncan's or anyone beside maybe mj.
@@thialhoinj1971 The reason why he averaged crazy stats like that was because he was a 7'1 325 tank, but he wasnt a better bball player than Duncan.
Not to mention when Phil came to the Lakers they switched the coaching scheme to be a faster tempo with Kobe.
Pop offense was a slow it down give the ball in the post, play defense type of scheme during Duncans prime.
That proof is in the pudding during Shaqs prime was getting at least 20 FGA in a playoff run 4x in his prime, while Duncan had only 1 playoff run where he shot 20 FGAs. And he averaged 28-14-5ASTs-4BLks.
Duncan in his prime definitely wouldve had similar scoring production like Shaq if Duncan didnt play in a slower system
00-01 Shaq
02-03 Duncan
04 KG
05- Duncan
06 Kobe
07 Duncan
08 Kobe
09 Lebron
Shaq played with Kobe. It was kobe who was killing the spurs not Shaq. Give Duncan Kobe and the results would be even better cause he didn’t cause any issues with any of his teammates. Duncan would have gladly given the reigns to Kobe after his prime unlike Diesel.
I love shaq, like…..that’s my DAWG! But if we going prime for prime, gotta go with Timmy. Timmy was so good man, like so good.
Shaq was just stronger. Tim was a better basketball player
NO
Shaq and Wilt have the best primes in NBA history. The only thing that could stop them was the free throw line
Yeah you’re high
Winning 3 out 5 championships while Shaq and Kobe is in the league makes him not better because he didn’t back to back? Winning a chip every other year doesn’t count for anything? Dumb argument. Shaq is what we know he is. Duncan is just disrespected on the reg.
Tim Duncan over Shaq yes. Tim was a damn good defensive player. Shaq should have more dominant season on the defensive side, go look at both players on the defensive side.
Even with injuries shaq sill averaged more rebounds and blocks. I would stilll say Duncan is a better defender but don't act like shaq was a pushover.
@@hintssabbat I'm taking Tim Duncan. Shaq had 3 dominant seasons in The Finals and who did he beat to win those Championships? The Finals had a weak amount of bigs and Shaq did what he needed/had to/ was asked to do/was expected to do.
@@arianparker2482this is highlighted by the fact Duncan also averaged video game numbers against a similar finals opponent as Shaq
Tim Duncan is also more skilled. So if you are taking one of the two it's Duncan. You just said video game like numbers. If there are two players with that level of greatness. Shaq is more physically dominant and yet Duncan was also physically dominant and more skilled then Shaq.
@@pandabear1576 than why does Duncan's best playoffs and final run don't compare to shaqs.
This should not be a debate. Duncan affected is by far the better player. Shaq may have had better stats but stats aren’t basketball.
So if we are talking about teams who is better in their primes.
Pts Reb Ast. Blks St. BPM VORP Rings All NBA All DEF. MVP All Star
Shaq 28.1 11.8 3.1 2.4 .6 7.5 35.9 3 6 3 1 5
Duncan 23 12.3 3.2 2.5 .8 5.9 35.1 2 6 6 2 5
This is from 1998 to 2003. In the six years that Duncan came into the league to Shaqs prime years with the Lakers.... The period of which they both played together in their prime. Duncan was more accomplished and averaged more of everything than shaq except.
When they played against each other, Duncan averaged more of everything except for points and blocks. When playing against each and focusing on the stats that attribute to one v one play. Points and blocks. Shaq wins. Shaq had twice as many blocks as Duncan during their matchups and even had a game of nine blocks .
I should note that Duncan also had a game of grabbing 20 rebounds vs shaq while shaq remained under 10.
Also important to note that during this stretch shaq won the matchup with a 10-7 win loss vs duncan.
To start my team in their prime, I going with tim
Duncan Is a better player. He’s a better all-around player, he’s a better defensive player, he’s a better team leader, had a tremendous burning passion to win. Tim Duncan all day..
Just going to point out that Duncan was the real end of the lakers run. And arguably was cheated out of a quadruple double on his way to winning a title after beating shaq. People need to remember when he was fighting the lakers at that time the days of Parker and Ginobli hadn’t really began. Duncan’s numbers only dropped and increased his longevity because they turned into something more later in the 2000s. Context bro. Context.
Duncan was great but the Spurs only won between dynasties like after the Bulls in 1999, after the Lakers started having problems in 2003, in 2005 and 2007 similar sort of thing
That’s what happens when you start having subjective conversations as facts. People do it with their favoritenplayers to justify their opinions
love the Big Fundamental but Shaq was a different animal
Hakeem > both of them 🥱
Facts!!!
maybe shaq but timmy we never know cause they never faced up against each other in their prime
@@bainesontoastz1Hakeem never faced prime shaq either
@@t1h_tvj212 he did, 95 is in his prime
@@bainesontoastz1 2000-2003 shaq vs tim?
That’s cute 🥰.. Prime Shaq won the scoring title, was 2nd in DPOY voting , averaged just ad many assists that season than Duncan or Hakeem ever averaged in their careers , shot 57% FG and ended his run with a Finals AVERAGE of 38 ppg, 17 rebounds, 2 assists, 1 steals and 3 blocks on 61% FG. . Did I forget to mention that Kobe got injured in game 1 of that Finals ?
Duncan has the longevity but peak Shaq CLEARS both him and ducks. Better scorer , higher, volume more efficient, and better playmaker. We gotta stop penalizing Shaq just buy everyone else on the court was too small and weak for him.
actually shaq averaged 3.8 assists in his scoring title season while 03 duncan had 3.9 so you're splitting hairs either way. Tim averaged 5 assists a game in the playoffs that year and shaq in 00 was at 3 assists. 00 shaq averaged 2.4 blocks timmy was at 3 a game. Shaq was more efficient by about 5 percentage points but duncan was still very efficient while having more to his game like the elbow jumper and turnaround. Shaq was a much better scorer but in the 03 finals tim averaged 24/17/5 with 5 blocks and got robbed of a quadruple double. shaq scored better but everything else is up for debate
@@md.221exactly bro Timmy is ultra efficient while shooting jumpers and Shaq is not close to the playmaker Timmy was. He could easily avg Draymond green assists if the spurs ran everything thru him.
@@itsmeflacko1618 facts, thats just who timmy was tho unselfish as hell didn't get in the way of what worked also he played very slow and methodically if you look at timmy's numbers per 100 possesions they are better then shaq across the board
What year was Shaq 2nd in DPOY voting? He only received 3 all defense selections, all of them being for the 2nd team
@@chrilpy 1999-2000.
4:45 Who was arguably better in 99?
Hakeem went from underrated to overrated
@htx.: Can You guys rank these 7 contenders… 97/98 Jazz, '05 Pistons, '10 Celtics, '12 Spurs, '16 Warriors, '19 Warriors and '22 Celtics?
I prefer Tim Duncan ..more versatile..better shooter ..wasn’t a lob threat but had better footwork than Shaq ..shaq was only dominant in the post and couldn’t defend near as well
03 and 05 is it for dunacan as the best kg and Kobe
Now ticket I think got it wrong peak vs prime both of guys from 99-00 to 04-05 were the top 2 players in the game but I think Shaq peak is better than Duncan because of the 3 straight finals mvp's he was just monster but better prime Tim Duncan the first year he was drafted he was first team all nba while being rookie of the year. and then the next year he swept Shaq and to win his first championship Tim Duncan was already the best power forward in the game and Duncan can impact the game on both ends of the floor than Shaq can so Shaq better peak Tim Duncan better prime
Ain’t Shaq and chill cousin. ?
Finally Chill Town is coming around (pause). He's finally telling the truth about Kobes career. Maybe Chill Town ain't so bad after all..
2006 is Dwayne Wade. Y’all tripping.
0:19 real life
I like how Ticket mentions the Robert Horry shot, like Robert didnt make GW Buzzer beaters for Shaq and Kobe in the playoffs during that dynasty run.😂
Not to mention there was ALOT of factors to Tim not repeating.
00: Tore his meniscus
04: Derrick Fisher shot after DUNCAN made a Clutch shot over Shaq.
06: Manu stupid foul in the final seconds of Game 7 on Dirk
08: Kobe beat them
13: Ray Allen Shot
15: Chris Paul Shot.
Im not even gonna mention that Duncan won the chip in 99 before Shaq won as a 2nd year player.
You mean Duncan getting drafted to a team with David Robinson while Shaq was drafted to a 20 win team ?
@@Thanosdidtherighthing You mean drafted to a team with an INJURED Admiral and a team that won 26 Games? 🤔
@@Jolteon1989 Admiral let them to 59 wins the season before when he was healthy…. Shaq doubled the wins of the Magic by himself
@@Thanosdidtherighthing And you proving my point also. David was injuried which sapped his athleticism afterwards. He only had 1 good season but Tim was better.
Hell Tim made all NBA first team, all defense, all star and was Top 5 MVP voting as a rookie.
If David was the super help you say, Explain to me what happened the year after they won the chip in 99 with the same squad in the 2000 playoffs?
@@Jolteon1989 Tim was not better than Robison in 1997-98. Check the stats
2000 - Shaq
2001 - Shaq
2002 - Shaq
2003 - Duncan
2004 - Garnett
2005 - Duncan
2006 - Kobe
2007 - Kobe
2008 - Kobe
2009 - Lebron
2010 - Lebron
2011 - Lebron
2012 - Lebron
2013 - Lebron
2014 - Lebron
2015 - Lebron/Curry
2016 - Curry/Lebron
2017 - Lebron
2018 - Lebron
2019 - Curry
2020 - Lebron
2021 - Giannis/Curry
2022 - Giannis/Curry/Jokic
2023 - Jokic/Giannis/Curry
Nobody could deal with Shaq unless you recruit a offensive left tackle from the NFL, he just outweighed everyone and bullied them with his weight advantage
yeah, and none of that mattered as he we was consistently getting beat and swept until Kobe got an opportunity to start.
Tim did a fantastic job of slowing him down better than anyone else tho. And he was the only one who could dish those buckets right back at shaq. Timmy outplayed shaq in several series head to head.
Kobe casually being dissed on in 2004-2007
What's up with all you Tim Duncan fans, yall were nowhere for the past 20 years but now everybody is acting like he was the consensus best player of the 2000s
Why is buddy always snuggled up in his coat or hoodie??
I Career wise Tim Duncan? But prime Shaquille O'neal
Tim Duncan clears Shaq easy
I’m taking prime Shaq over damn near everyone who touched a basketball
Admittedly no one could deal with Shaq but at Sametime no one was stopping Timmy either let's keep it 100 even Shaq couldn't stop the big fundamental and better defensive player overall than Shaq imo Shaq was lazy period but still a all time great
shaq peaks higher and is a better scorer and rebounder Duncan is a better defender its so close Duncan has a lil bit better career/longevity
‘03 for Duncan that’s it
How did manu deserve 2005 finals mvp when Tim avg 20 14 and 2 blocks manu avg 18 points 5 Rebs
Tim Clears Shaq, and I don't know how this even a question. How do you give Duncan five checkmarks and Shaq 4, yet Shaq is better overall?
Duncan entered the league and was a top 5 player by his rookie year. Never won less than 50 games in a full season, turned a small market good, but not great franchise into one of the greatest in NBA history, was a better overall player, as he got older, was able to adjust his game to still be the best player while letting his teammates have more offensive responsibilities and did much more with less. If Tim had a Penny, Kobe or D-Wade for any period of time, he's looking at 7 or 8 chips.
Because he joined a team with David Robinson who won 59 games before he got there. Shaq joined a 21-61 Magic team. Duncan was not a top 5 player in 1998 let alone the best player on his team . He only outrebounded Robinson. Every other category was tied or advantage Robinson. Shaq single handedly double the wins of the Magic.
I agree it shouldn’t be a question. Shaq clearly had the higher peak.
@@ImbetterthanDWade false, they won 20 games before he got drafted, then won a chip his 2nd year. Shaq got swept with an All NBA Penny, deeper team against and aging Rockets team. Then continued to get swept for the most part until 2000.
Duncan was All NBA 1st team and All NBA defense 2nd team as a rookie, and was clearly the best player on his team. Just looking at stats and not considering impact to winning is superficial. Robinson was winning games and could never get his team to even a finals berth, and by Duncan's 2nd year, Robinson was averaging 15ppg.
Were you watching the games or nah?
Duncan has more MVP's, chips with less talented players. Duncan clears.
@@remnant8898 READ my comment again.
They won 20 games in a year where Robinson played only 6 games. The season before when Robinson was healthy, they were a 59 win team. That means Duncan as the #1 pick essentially joined the #1 seed in the western conference since Robinson got back healthy that year. You automatically lose the “less talent” argument with that.
Shaq didn’t lose to the 1993-94 Rockets. He lost to the 1994-95 Rockets where Clyde Drexler averaged 20, 7 and 5 on 56% 2pt during the 1996 playoffs. You’re the one that’s not considering impact on winning. You’re just doing the casual “ all nba this year” talking points. By the way, Drexler was all NBA in 1995 making your mention of Penny as all nba meaningless lol.
I don’t know why you’re mentioning rookie seasons when Shaq had a better statistical rookie season. Shaq didn’t make all nba as a rookie since there were actually centers to compete with. Ewing, Robinson , Hakeem, Mourning. When Ducnan was a rookie, most of the power forwards were declining. Kemp, Barkley, Rodman. Malone was the guy still pushing but he was 35. Don’t believe me ? All the other all nba forwards besides Malone were small forwards. Pippen, Rice, Hill, Baker
I think Shaq was number 1 from 2000 to 2002 and Duncan 2003-05.
2002 has to go to Duncan. Duncan was unreal all season putting up his best statistical season and even outscored BOTH Kobe and Shaq in that series. The problem was that between 2000-2003 the Spurs had by far the WORST supporting cast around Tim in his entire career. Duncan backpacked those years.
@@alex84167 Of course he’s gonna out score them. He’s sharing the ball with nobody “ like you said while shaq and Kobe are splitting shots between each other. That didn’t stop Shaq from winning two scoring titles though
*offensively
Legacy wise of cf course I’m taking Duncan hands down, but if we’re going PRIME for PRIME, it’s EASILY Shaq….come on bruh
1999 - Duncan
2000-2002 - Shaq
2003 - Duncan
2004 - KG
2005 - Duncan
Shaq was not better than Duncan in 1999 and 2003 .
@@Oppenheimer1967No he wasnt. He swept Shaq and outplayed him in the playoffs IN 99. Not to mention Duncan was 3rd in MVP voting and won the chip and FMVP
@@Jolteon1989 Led the league in PER. You’re talking about team accomplishments.
@@Oppenheimer1967 And Duncan won FMVP and is the 2nd youngest FMVP in History. "Team accomplishments" Try again.
@@Oppenheimer1967 So i guess Outplaying Shaq in the playoffs is a "Team accomplishments"
Shaq can’t deal with Tim 🤔 and vice Versa. Don’t think that’s an argument
So, since a common argument in the chat is "Chill always diminishes Kobe's accomplishments to big up Shaq". Is this Chill just manipulating everybody else into speaking highly of Shaq?
I have the utmost respect for Tim but come on now it’s shaq
Dennis Keith Rodman
Wilt over both of them Foreal
Tim Duncan > Shaq all time
Shaq and Duncan played in their Prime.........Duncan alternated every ship Shaq had and kept winning
Prime shaq can get you 30 pt 20reb easily but Mr. Fundamental was too fundamentally sound for him.
As could Duncan
@@hardwoodthought1213 why are people lying about Tim Duncan he could not easily get you 30, he was a 20/10 guy for his career
@@real-timerami5041For his career
This argument is peak/prime
Shaq has 52 playoff games of 30+
Duncan had 40
Both were capable. Shaq a little more, but then again he also always sought to, Duncan never gave a shit about stats
@@real-timerami5041and he had no issues deferring to his teammates. He could and did put up
Buckets
@@hardwoodthought1213 How many more playoff games did Tim Duncan play than shaq though? Also in his last ring he was far less impactful than shaq for his last ring. Tim Duncan had a 7 year stretch of playoff mediocrity and his first championship came against one of the weakest finals teams in nba history.
Gimme shaq he was just too dominant on offense and I truly think Duncan was a better basketball player but shaq was that dominant
Peak it’s Shaq but Timmy D has an overall better career.
YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW GOOD TIM DUNCAN WAS OH MY GOD
They are close Duncan clears defensively and playmaking wise and longevity wise, shaq clears in dominance and scoring
Duncan dos not clear shaq in playmaking
defensively not by much but he does in have longevity.
prime shaq was a better shot blocker, could of one defensive play of the year.
90s he had to go against a prime david robinson and hakeem both better defensively than anyone in the 2000s
@@Coldskin1Shot blocks do not reflect defence 😂😂 Duncan affected 10x as many shots as Shaq did, whilst anchoring league best defences
And yes Duncan clears on playmaking
@@Coldskin1 not by much defensively? The 15x all NBA defensive player who traditionally anchored a top 1-5 defense every year compared to a 3x All defense 2nd team in shaq? lol
@@Coldskin1Duncan was the league’s best rim protector almost every season of his career
First of all what was Duncan's position ? Power forward or Center now if we put Duncan at center where does he stand as best center ever? now let's go to power forward yes he is the best power forward but in the NBA history who are the best power forward that position is not that deep ..... A lot of Timmy's D was help D at power forward
So Orlando Shaq doesn’t count?
Right!
KG was the best player by far in 04.. That Wolves team shouldn't have been that good
He played the best but Shaq was the best. Shaq’s numbers went down when the lakers added GP and Malone
The thing I don’t understand is after chill basically proved Duncan was the better player ticket just fell back on “if he’s so dominant why didn’t he 3 peat “ u know how many legends greater than shaq AND Duncan didn’t 3 peat like what I don’t get why chilltown just sat their shaking his head that’s like me saying bron ain’t top 2 all times because he never 3 peated to show his dominance like what magic didn’t 3 peat bird didn’t 3 peat I can go on and on are we just gonna say shaq greater than magic now cause magic ain’t 3 peat???
Shaq won 3 in a row.
shaq had a top 10 player to run with duncan didnt
Damn chill hates Kobe 😂
what makes you think so
Duncan over Shaq n it's not even close
You clearly weren't watching nba during the 2000s if you say stupid shit like this
Casual
"not even close" screams crack addiction
@@sweetconnect23 it's not close for a few simple reasons I'll explain tim a better mid range shooter n better fg percentage from the floor better post game n back to basket he a better ft shooter n especially for a big man he a better playmaker n better at pick up defense he got a better playoff resume he got a higher baseball i.q all Shaq was just a Bigg fat 340lb dude down low n him being so fat not buff not in peak physical shape just from him being that far n heavy made Shaq able to get them eazy dunks n layups b he still got a lower fg percentage just how since Zion is the heaviest player in today league he easily drop 26pts just because of size
@@jimmytaylor4102 u a casual Shaq has a higher fg% better scorer and rebounder, dunacan is the better defender and passer slighty but it is close u saying its not close just shows u prolly a spurs fan shaq 3 peated duncan could
never go b2b
Shaq prime ended in 2003
BILL RUSSEL HAVE 5MVP AND 11 CHIPS. He better tham all of them.
Prime Shaq would be goat if it lasted longer then it did
So he wasn’t a beast when he finished top 5 in MVP voting several times in the early 90s?
Duncan easily
Shaq was lucky he had kobe in his team.
Duncan Swept Shaq in his 2nd season! He was the overall better player. Shaq was just a better scorer that’s it. Duncan knew how to win. Shaq did not. Duncan played to win Shaq played more for stats that why he got swept soo many times
Y’all are crazy Tim Duncan clears him easily
Duncan by far
Shaq 3peated Duncan couldnt even win two in a row
Is Ticket really talking about the help Duncan had when Shaq had an All NBA Penny, and 2 of the top 3 SG's in history with Kobe and Wade? Is Manu or Parker in the top 10 in the position they played? Does anyone believe that Tony or Manu can lead a team to a chip as the main guy? We know Kobe went to the Finals 3 straight years without Shaq and Wade was clearly the best player on Miami in the 2011 Finals.
Kobe was a bench player when Shaq got there. Robinson was 20 and 10 with elite defense when Duncan got there. You don’t have to be top 5 at your
position if you got MANU AND PARKER AND ALL DEFENSIVE Bruce Bowen.
Parker literally led the Spurs in the 2007. He outplayed Lebron and Duncan that series.
@@ImbetterthanDWadeBy the time The Spurs had won a chip Robinson was a 16 and 12 guy and was still defensively solid if you take Duncan off that team however the Spurs get destroyed that was proven in 2000 after Duncan tore his meniscus and The Spurs got swept by a Phoenix Suns team who also didn’t have their best player
And Parker only beat Tim in scoring, throughout that series Duncan led the Spurs in rebounds, assists, and blocks as well was tied for second in steals(had more than Parker in that as well) and if you watch those final 2 games against the Cavs Duncan was still extremely important to winning those games most of the offense went through him they’d dump the ball to Timmy and force a double team then he’d dump it out to an open man for an open shot as well as being very useful defensively if you look at the +/- as well Duncan had +24 and Parker was +16
I’m not saying that I think Parker didn’t deserve the award but I believe there’s much more to the discussion than just their scoring
@@ImbetterthanDWade Manu and Parker were essentially role players until about 2005, Kobe was an allstar and All NBA player coming off the bench and Robinson had one 20 pt 10 rebound season with Duncan on the team and that was for his rookie year. Secondly, Duncan was clearly the best offensive and defensive player on those squads. Take him off that team, and they're not winning 50 games every year and they're certainly not title contenders. Shaq has had significantly more help than Duncan, and was notoriously getting swept almost every year until the 2000 season.
@@ImbetterthanDWade and you know very well, that Manu and Parker arent even in the same league as Kobe, Wade and even a prime healthy Penny. They worked very well as a trio, but like Curry is to Klay and Dray, remove Tim, and it's a wrap.
@@remnant8898 Kobe averaged 15.4 ppg when Duncan was a rookie. Shaq brought his team all the way to the western conference that season. Yea he got swept but that’s a TEAM accomplishment since he played just as good as Malone in the WCF. Duncan had David Robinson that year and they lost to the Jazz in the 2nd round.
People love to talk about the elite defenses that Duncan anchored yet the Spurs were already a a top 3 defense before he got there.
Hareem is underrated, that man was incredible he could guard all Five positions and still dominant offensively. He won without having Hall of Famers around him. Hareem did have Clyde later. Hareem dominanted a lot of great players and in there primes. Hareem would be a all time great player in all era's!
Hakeem was drafted 1st overall in the same draft as Jordan. Yet was overshadowed by MJ and Barkley and didn’t win until Jordan retired in 93. Houston did make it the finals in 86. Hakeem was great but Duncan’s resume waaay more impressive.
@@jcballer12c Is it way more impressive? When you take everything into context?
@@elijahjacob4505 what context are you referring too. I’ll give you some for Duncan, 1st team All NBA and All Defense as a rookie.
Duncan the best big ever
It’s Kareem but he’s the best pf ever
technically prime shaq and duncan got 3 chips in their prime
shaq got one more after his prime
and duncan got 2 more
2007 Duncan was still clearly his teams best player
Shaq was not in 06
@@hardwoodthought1213 07 duncan was not in his prime
Park won fmvp
@@Coldskin1 2007 NBA Playoffs
Duncan - 22/123/3
Parker - 20/6/3/1
So not only did Duncan beat Parker in raw stats, he also had better efficiency, better advanced metrics and an infinite gap defensively
FMVP doesn’t make you the best player on a title team unless you think Iggy > Steph or Maxwell > Bird?
@@hardwoodthought1213 tim duncan still was not in his prime in 07 he was much better in the early 2000s
and the difference was not that far off, tony parker is a point guard and duncan is a center. The gap no way as far is iggy and steph.
parker avg more during finals thats why he won mvp
@@Coldskin1 Tim Duncan in 2007 finished 4th in NBA Voting, 3rd in DPOY voting and made All-NBA and All-Defensive 1st team
On what fucking planet was he not in his prime 😂 Parker didn’t make an All-NBA team that season
Let’s say for the sake of the argument he wasn’t, what difference would it make? He was still quite clearly his teams best player. Parker averaged more in 1 series in which the Cavs doubled Duncan every touch and Mike Brown stated publicly he did so because he wanted anyone besides Duncan to beat them. For the whole playoff run Duncan averaged more.
Fuck no kg was better than Duncan in 04
Hakeem over Duncan
Shaq does clear Timmy. Also Kobe was the best player in the game from 03-10
He was definitely the best from 06-09 2010 and 2005 debatable but Duncan literally won more fmvps and MVPs than him if Kobe was the best he would’ve closed out the 3-1 lead over phx
Kobe was not the best player in 03 and 04
Kobe was not better than Duncan in 03. How can you even say that after seeing the man average 24-17-5-5 like a fucking created player in the finals?
@@harp1288 Duncan averaged a Carlos Boozer statline the 2nd half of his career lol
@@ImbetterthanDWade yet he still has more fmvps and MVPs and less finals lost than kobe😭 I don’t know what the point of that statement was?