THE DARKNESS THAT COMES BEFORE by R. Scott Bakker - No Spoiler Review (Prince of Nothing Book 1)
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- čas přidán 17. 10. 2021
- THE DARKNESS THAT COMES BEFORE by R. Scott Bakker - No Spoiler Review (Prince of Nothing Book 1)
#booktube #fantasy #grimdark
The Darkness That Comes Before by R. Scott Bakker is the first entry in the Prince of Nothing trilogy and the first entry in Bakker's series called the Second Apocalypse. The Darkness That Comes Before is R. Scott's Bakker's beginning in taking a strong hold within the grim dark sub genre of fantasy and for good reason. Prince of Nothing has been highly recommended to me and I am very happy I've read it. The Darkness That Comes Before is beautifully written and full of both life and death. I hope you enjoy this spoiler free review.
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/ thefantasynuttwork - Zábava
Do you enjoy grimdark?
Yessss!!!! Dont tell the PTA though😅
@@mrsduncanthetall hahah
Sure😎
Yes indeed!
@@mrsduncanthetall Yeah those parents might freak out lol.
Imo, this is one of the only fantasy series where the prose was just as gripping as the story, rather than being flowery for the sake of flowery. Every sentence was packed with meaning and contemplation, creating a haunting atmosphere of dread and anticipation with complex characters to guide the twisty narrative. It felt like a masterfully crafted psychological horror thriller set in a gritty fascinating world. Absolutely love it and wish it would get more attention. I feel the same way about the Manifest Delusions series by Michael Fletcher.
Bakker's work deconstructs great works like LOTR and Dune but at the same time creates something that stands unique within the genre.
Agree
I'm on The Judging Eye right now, I CANNOT GET ENOUGH OF BAKKER! His prose is so beautiful
Agreed!
I am rereading the Judging Eye these days and I think he raises even more his level in these Aspect Emperor books. The writing and the atmosphere is so beautifully bleak and melancholic and ominous.
Damn the dialogue in this book is so well written
It truly is
‘One cannot raise walls against that which has been forgotten’ :)
Yesssss
standard bakker stan checking in. We do our daily browse through the reviews section to see if anyone else has stumbled upon something they dont realise how much they will like!
Glad you're here 😁
The battle of Kiyuth is where this book grabbed me to the point where I could do nothing else but read until I finished it :)
The Second Apocalypse is my favorite fantasy series of all time! For me Bakker's prose continues to improve as he matures as a writer that by The Unholy Consult he seems light years ahead of everyone else in the fantasy genre.
I look forward to hearing your thoughts on it as the series progresses. Hopefully you continue to enjoy it. The last three books of Aspect-Emperor are some of the darkest headiest stuff I ever read.
I'm excited to delve deep into the darkness 👀
I just finished the first book and I love it soooooo much.... already 150 pages into the next book
That recap is something that more classic fantasy did in the 80s and 90s but it fell out of fashion in recent years. I wish it would come back.
I agree!!
The Absolute best work of fiction I have ever read is The Second Apocalypse. Looking forward to your review all the way through!
Thanks for checking it out!
Alright 👍
Let's go!!!!!
Hell yeah! I mentioned you at the end as the king of grim dark booktube haha 🤘
TSA is really awesome I got into it because of red 🤟
@@thefantasynuttwork very generous of you 🙏.
I'm so excited for you to continue this journey. It changed the game for me. I feel like I'm chasing that experience now
@@slowlyred2082 I get that feeling from book one, it's such a solid foundation!
@@slowlyred2082 you're the reason I'm reading this series. 🤘
I can hardly wait for your take on the whole series. Kellus is one of my favorite fantasy characters.
every time he is on page i am enthralled
I discovered The Darkness That Comes Before during a visit to the library in 2004/2005. I saw it on the Recently Arrived shelf and read blurbs on the cover and it seemed intriguing, so I thought I'd give it a shot. He captured my attention right out of the gate with that wonderful opening sentence: "One cannot raise walls against what has been forgotten." (I'm a sucker for a great first sentence.) I was hooked after Kellhus's encounter with the Nonman in the prologue. The depth of world building, Bakker's excellent prose and the themes raised throughout the series are some of the reasons why his books have become some of my favorites. It fills me with joy to see videos like yours and Slowly Reds.
I truly think it's one of the best lore/backstory for any series ever
i think this is the most underrated (or underhyped) series on booktube so i'm glad to hear you talk about it, and i do think it's the most comparable to malazan in a lot of ways. hope you enjoy the rest of it. but those names tho :o :/ mindfck
I think I'd agree!
I wouldn't say its underrated, it's just for this specific series you need to have a certain amount of literary "baggage" in order to enjoy it.
Having a bit of religious knowledge in combination with knowing some philosophy and psychology will make this series a lot more enjoyable.
The books are also very slow at times, you could even call it the "Slog of slogs" and while it does work for the series, seeing all of the minutia of the Holy War and the Great Ordeal in the future really make you feel like you are on the same journey as the characters.
It's also fair to say that a lot of the cast in this series will be unlikable for a lot of people, and the Esmenet going to the Holy War chapters might turn off a lot of readers with more sensitive dispositions, Bakker does not shy away from the sexual and abusive imagery, and while those scenes are extremely important to setting up the world, Consult and how the characters view women, which will be subverted and expanded upon in the other books, I love the trajectory of Esmenet and she evolves along the series, but it is not an experience that will be palatable to everyone.
I always like the treatment of magic in this series. Mostly because of the cost: Eternal damnation.
Like, when you put it against that, is magic really WORTH it? Not to mention that Chorae let you kill sorcerers instantly, and only non-magic users can wield them.
Yeah it’s so dope
My favourite series of books. I will keep an eye out for your reviews on the next 6 books
Awesome!
I found this because Bakker is my favourite author and you have a new subscriber. You did an excellent work on grasping everything that makes this book and Bakker distinct.
I hope you will continue enjoying this, one of a kind, author. In my opinion he treads paths no one dared to in the history of the genre. Really thought provoking and unconventional staff. The second series, Aspect Emperor, was even better for me.
Wow thanks! I know he has a very loyal and dedicated fan base, I'm happy to finally dive in!
0
Dune was definitely an influence on Bakker :)
For sure!
Darkness That Comes Before / Aspect-Emperor, are my favorites, coming in JUST in front of Malazan Book of the Fallen. Absolute must-reads for those who aren't faint-of-heart. Bakker is MUCH darker than Erikson in my humble opinion, though both are masters of their trade.
Oh for sure, the intent/messaging in Bakker's work is much darker and in some regards opposing
Thank you for this review! I've been thinking about picking this book up for quite some time, and now you convinced me to finally start reading it! I'll get to it asap after finishing my current read
Let me know how you like it!
Amazing video Jimmy! I looked up reviews for this book as I will be reading it soon, and came across yours, so of course that's the one I watched! Great insights! Now I'm really jazzed for this read!
I appreciate it!
This sounds like my kind of book. I love the complexity that you described in this book. Im going to check this one out for sure.
If you're into dense, complex fantasy then this one is for you. As long as you don't mind some super grim moments haha
The next book, The Warrior-Prophet, is awesome.
I'm definitely going to start it soon
Great passionate review.
🙏
I'm so glad I decided to pick up this series this year. I'm now 2 books into the followup series and it looks like it might end up being a top 4 favorite series for me. And I honestly consider PoN and Aspect Emperor to be like 1 series even though there's a 20 year time skip in between.
The fact there's more than just three books in this vast, rich world is what has me really fired up. All the amazing lore and history would be wasted on just 3 books. Really solid groundwork here in book one, I'm about ready to jump into book 2, hell I may even start tonight.
It’s my fave of all time
This sounds pretty sweet! I’ll have to check it out
I'd enjoy hearing your take brother
Definitely picking this up soon
Let me know what you think!
I read this many years ago and loved it.
Omg omg omg I really really wanted you to do this one .i will feel more comfortable once I hear your review
I think you could like it!
Ok so i heard you reference Bernard Cornwell.....did you started Wlc😍???
And did you cry?
@@mrsduncanthetall not yet!
@@thefantasynuttwork two months later....starting it today
This book sounds really good! It’s been on my shelf for a long time. I’ll probably tackle it next year.
Let's go!
Great video!
I just found a first edition hardcover copy at my favorite used book store so I will be adding this to my book queue.
I am so jealous lol
@@thefantasynuttwork it has some highlighting in the front half of the book which hurts to see but I can't say no to a first edition.
This has been on my radar for some time now, i might have to move it up.
I hope you like it!
The political maneuvering you were talking about will probably be the ultimate selling point for me to pick this up!
I'd love to see you review this tbh
A burned out sorcerer and crows with bald human heads? Oh hell yes!
It's so awesome 😂
This was a fantastic review, Jimmy! You sold me on the book. While I do sometimes struggle with grimdark, the writing, the scheming, and just your level of enjoyment has convinced me that I should give this a try. I feel like this one is a book I always hear about - in the vaguest sense of the word - but don't actually see a lot of people discuss openly! So thanks for filling that fantasy gap :)
You would like this, I am almost 100% sure of it
Also thanks!
This sounds good, I can enjoy some good grimdark. Definitely added this to my TBR for a 2022 read.
Hope you enjoy 😁
Great analysis TFN. I agree. I loved the book and number 2 and will read the third. I must add the glossary helped a lot. An excellent writer.
One of the best the fantasy genre has seen imo
Well - it's a great read, but it is a challenge to understand, I had to reread a lot of it and I still got a lot of stuff wrong. I thought a lot of it was some killer evil shit, but know that EVERYTHING in it has meaning, everything is significant, so the entertainment of it is secondary really. Don't give up on it, the glossary is so helpful and even more helpful is the FB Group and the TSA online forum. A great deal of the fun is talking about the story with others and man, I've encountered some very smart people to discuss it with and half the fun has been connecting with them and they helping me out understanding it ( and stuff they don't understand makes me feel better, hee hee! ). Anyways, it's an investment, but so worth it and there's a rich group of people you can connect with about it.
I can't wait to connect with more people on this one
I put all the other Fantasy series I've been reading, excluding Farseer, on pause to read Prince of Nothing and I don't regret it so far. I think I'm with you on Esmenet, though Achamian is also a strong contender for my favourite so far. Have about 150 or so pages left.
It ends with a bang!
@@thefantasynuttwork you weren't wrong
I read the first two books several years ago when we were assigned The Darkness that Comes Before in a Fantasy lit university course and Bakker came in to speak. It's been so long I need to re-read and finish the series.
That's is so cool. I'd love to take that class!
I go to your channel to get recommendations on a new fantasy book to read. I am about done with the first book of the Under the Northern Sky and I don't think I will continue on, it isn't for me. I have finished the Dandelion Dynasty series, also recommended in this channel, which I thoroughly enjoyed. And based on your glowing review here, I think I have my next fantasy book in the queue. Thanks!
Yeah The Wolf isn’t bad but not very remarkable in pretty much anyway
Be warned!! After reading Bakker all other novels will feel like you're reading the back of a cereal box. Yes it's that good.
😂
Facts.
Damn dude 🤣 I just ordered the trilogy.
Yes sir!
so read gene wolfe then, i think he is the best follow up
Bakker is the greatest living fantasy author. Truth Shines! I read Bakker before grimdark was a category. So I read Abercrombie after completing the whole bakkerverse. Abercrombie reads like YA compared to bakker
I don't think Abercrombie is YA really at all, but yeah I love Bakker
@@thefantasynuttwork YA only in comparison to Bakker, not YA in content. It's light fare.
@@NaosSabot cool cool
Cool review.
Thanks!!
This is one I've been curious about. You see a couple varying opinions out there.
It's one that demands discussion
This is a really good series
I'm digging it 🤘
You had me at "political maneuvering". I love palace intrigue!
Although, I'm still not sure what the plot is.
The plot is slow moving, but we are moving towards a massive holy war, and a possible apocalypse.
Just finishing the book, and I agree with you, the prose is amazing! And the storytelling has me hooked. I am extremely excited that there are more books than just one trilogy by Bakker set in this world!
Just wanted to chime in on the sexual abuse bits. I'm a survivor myself, and am typically not really a fan of reading things like that. However, even though Bakker's descriptions can be a bit graphic, he never writes the abuse gratuitously. I appreciate that the author decided to include such a difficult topic without wallowing in it for pure shock value.
Anyways, subbed :)
This was a great comment. I really value hearing your thoughts on this book and appreciate you sharing your personal experiences. I'm sorry you went through that.
I think Bakker gets better as he goes and hope you find the sequels as amazing as I have
Fine, I will read it
It's about time
Good book review!! I don’t like too much grim dark books.... grim dark book has to be a great storyline then I will pick it up... happy reading to you! 📖😊👋🍁
Thank you!
I have the PoN trilogy ready for me as soon as I wrap up Realm of the Elderlings before the end of the month (sickening thought). I read the first few pages of Darkness just to get a flavour of it; man you weren't kidding about those names! I'm not dyslexic but for whatever reason I have a super hard time remembering names. It'll be a real learning curve for the first book at least for me! Especially after Hobb and her wonderfully easy to remember characters, half of whom are named after virtues haha.
Yeah it's a big switch lol
Bakker has said he is flexible on how people pronounce character names, it's up to the reader. Also probably ties into some of his themes though, because when you run into another reader and they say character X's name this way and you say it that way...there's an interpersonal hurdle to work out.
I like that
Loved this review, and this just shot up my tbr for sure after seeing how well it landed for you! Is that cover not one of the ugliest fantasy covers you've ever seen though? Pretty hard to believe everyone involved was pleased with that goofy photorealistic face.
It's such a bad cover and it's impossible to get all three books matching 😭😭
A bit of topic, but with your mentioning of GGK and Lions of Al-Rassan, I just wondered if you had read/planning reviews of other works by him? I have finished «Tigana» & «The Lions of Al-Rassan» and is halfway through A Song for Arbonne.
Loved the world building/mythology and villains in «Tigana» and loved the characters in «Al-Rassan» from the very start!
Just halfway into «Arbonne», but have already fallen in love with the major characters. Blaise’s scenes first with the Duke in the mountains and then with Rudel at his villa: Such wicked good writing!
Hey good to see your comment showing GGK some love! I definitely will be reading his other stuff but not sure when. Will be doing publication order I think!
Joe Abercrombie, the faithful and the fallen is amazing by John gwynn, Beyond Redemption. Never heard Malazahn pronounced that way, but I like it!! I could care less bout races though, it’s more culture that interest me. Thanks for your review
My pleasure, thanks for checking it out!
Hits different on a re-read.
I got this book as a gift in 2009 but never read it cuz back then i was craving something more similar to Tolkien. Magic, different races and stuff like that. Didn't even know what grimdark was. Now I'm so Happy that i own it.
That’s awesome!
I just finished the first book today, absolutely loved it. I was especially interested because I see it compared to Berserk. And yeah, going in with a comparison expectation is usually a recipe for disaster, but it worked well here.
By far my favorite genre is dark fantasy that lets the horror aspect fully creep in.
Between the No-God, the Giger-esque feel of the skin spy, and the Consult, I imagine I'm in for exactly what I want.
I'm also super interested in Khellus. Strong Griffith vibes, particular after his reincarnation. Both characters just effortlessly amass people around them and its frightening but so fun to read
Oh dude Griffith and Kellhus are tightly coupled
Cnaiur along with Kellhus has similar dynamics, characteristics and antagonism to Griffith with Guts
@@Red21Viper I can definitely see that. Almost done with the 3rd book now
@@trill_nathan that was fast. Hope you enjoyed. The sequel series is even better and more horrific in my opinion
@@Red21Viper I am loving it! And great to hear. Can't wait
The title of this book sounds unique. It sounds evil to a point that you can realize that there is an understandable reason why it is evil.
Brace yourself when you get to Aspect Emperor
I've heard it's a trip
@@thefantasynuttwork Indeed and beyond i should say
Great, more books to pick up along with some Wurts....
My bad 😂
I'm glad you liked it. I for my part couldn't get into it tho I read the whole book I surrendered at book 2 of the trilogy cuz I couldn't root for a single person especially Cnaiur and Kellhus were disgusting people from start to finish and they were too prominent roles so I dnf'd
That's totally fair
How do people pronounce Malazan?
Love this series btw, absolutely gorgeous
Fun fact - the major events in this story are lifted straight from the real First Crusade that took Jerusalem in 1102. The battles are the same, the sieges, the speech from the Pope (Shriah), the Vulgar Holy War (People's Crusade)
Oh very cool!
@@thefantasynuttwork yeah he basically superimposed his crazy apocalyptic fantasy over the real history of what happens. The Nansur are the Byzantines etc it's all there. I only just realised it cause I read a book about the crusade, but Bakker has apparently been quite explicit about this the whole time
Personally, enjoyed this lot more than Malazan. I do have some problems with the series, especially later on, but the finale is probably one of the best I've encountered so far. Definitely Erikson level of "HOLY FUCKING SHIT".
Names are ridiculous. I dislike them sincerely. But they're also awesome.
Kellhus is the original gigachad.
Dune and Tolkien are Bakker's greatest influences outside some philosophers like, say, Hegel. Speaking of, philosophy is a big theme and probably together with Acts of Caine (he he) the best representation of it in the genre.
Fuck Esmenet though : baseddepartment:
Next book is my second favorite in the series. It also gets progressively darker.
The sorcerous battles - best I've ever read
Top 5 beatiful prose material, too.
Definitely more similar to GGK for me. Erikson is much more... dramatic about... well, absolutely everything.
I loved reading your thoughts. He is a gigachad 😂
You don't like the names? The first time I read the name "Kumrezzer" I was like yessssssssss
Would you recommend this to someone who hasn't read much grim dark but loves sword and sorcery and heroic fantasy? My favorite writers are Robert E. Howard, Moorcock, David Gemmell, Clark Ashton Smith, Fritz Leiber, and Jack Vance
Worth a shot but I don’t think it matches that vibe exactly
@11:30 i thought you said "misuse of the sexual nature" and i was thinking: I want some of that!
Hahaha
Dear Jimmy, I have only read The Darkness That Comes Before By Bakker. A big complaint of the story is there is sorcerers but not any magic in the books is this true as the series continues?
Nope, tons of magic and destruction coming in the following books
@@thefantasynuttwork thanks Jimmy I appreciate it
Very well thought out review, honestly don't see many reviews on this series, but it's grabbing lot of attention lately, I'm currently reading The Last Argument of Kings and loving it very much, Why do you think it's dense and in what way, I've been thinking about this book since longtime but I've heard it's dense but not sure it's because of plot or prose?
Prose is not too dense, it's the world building and the sheer amount of characters and locations who all have their own cultures, etc. Plus the names are ridiculous lol
@@thefantasynuttwork Wow sounds very interesting, I always have hard time with names in fantasy world's 😁
@@muttineni03 same, where's all the Bob's at in these worlds 😂
@@thefantasynuttwork lol a Bob could lighten up a bleak world like this 😀
@@muttineni03 one small hint from an Old world person. I am Greek and I find the names easy to cope with. Very interesting too. They fit to the world building. Bakker uses a lot ancient germanic names and mostly eastern Mediterranean and eastern, Iranian or Indian. Guessing from your name I think you ll find them relatable too.
I am having a hard time getting through this one! But I feel I should keep pushing.....should I keep going?!
If you want! Book two is much better imo
@@thefantasynuttwork the way you described The aspect emperor in one of your other videos is what makes me want to continue.
I think the series is called "The Prince of Nothing".
Ah, I missed the The lol
:D
Littlefinger: Knowlege is power
Bakker: Magic is power
In all seriousness I think I will like this series! Is this the series that people consider really rapey?
There's a lot of assault in these books
@@thefantasynuttwork I read the first chapter. It reads a lot like poetry and the names are stupid hard to pronounce 🤣
@@currangill430 it's extremely dense and complicated. I found the names very hard to remember lol I gave characters nicknames 😂
@@thefantasynuttwork 🧐
haha i'm losing my mind at your syllable emphasis. They might be correct but I've always pronounced Erikson's books MAL-uh-ZAN and Bakker's line of kings an-ASU-rim-BOR.
I'm the dumbest guy I know so don't mind my inability to speak 😂
@@thefantasynuttwork never heard the authors say the names so you might be right for all I know
Chiggra, chiggra ket ahn narnu cetara chiggra
Are you secretly a strongman?^^ Those are some serious thick arms.
Hahah I do workout a lot and such
@@thefantasynuttwork My respects :)
non-man are elves? how? they can't be killed with swords and command the srank and wear capes of humanfaces and heavy armor, does not sound elvish to me.
Certainly not a one for one, just through discussions I've read it's the connection I've seen made
Bakker thinks he's a good author too.
he definitely is!
I love the premise of this book but I’m nervous to jump in. I bought it recently so hopefully I’ll get to it soon. Great review, Jimmy!
Thank you 😊