I went into duels with a shovel, and just started building walls. I think my opponent was confused, but he ran around it to try and attack, and I planted a bear trap right before he hit me. He ragequit so fast. Lmao
Just recently started playing, but I think it's crazy the Engineer doesn't get any kind of points for extending the game out using their kit. Like if they gained points everytime a barricade was hit for an example, it would more accurately show their impact on the game!
I like skirmisher purely on Mason for aesthetic reasons. The gambeson + hood, the kettle helmet, along with a buckler and small spear give some strong bandit vibes, and I'm *all* for it. Super cool look imo.
I would argue the oil pot is better in defense because blocking off reinforcements in a choke point like a gate or bridge is great, and it prevents people from destroying objectives like gates. I would know, I have had the game for 2 whole days.
I did that during the siege of askindar when I was the defender cause the main entrance was the into the library and I threw an oil pot righjt between the sides of the entrance and it took a few or them and it’s like they didn’t know where to go without getting hurt and we won the siege
As someone with 15 minutes total playtime, and _only_ as Archer, I think the Oil Pot is better in 1v1s because if you throw it at your feet, you _and_ your enemy will die.
Yall must be playing bot lobby’s honestly because polemen are trash he gots this list all messed up I never see them and spearmen are dooo dooo once u in they face with war hammer
What i love about skirmisher is that he's (true to his name) pretty good at hit and runs, you can just run in, quickly throw a jav, preferably at a wounded/healing enemy, and get out, and since his ranged weapon is also a melee weapon he's always ready to defend himself against any surprises and retaliations. He does need some buffs though, damage buff, more ammo and more damage to archers.
I’d give him the Vangaurds dodge and +3-5 more ammo. That way he plays like a glass cannon that has good range. Also give him a minor version of the ambushers backstab and the oil pot as his Ult. He will become a weird hybrid build that plays like a vanguard at range.
@@bionizard5480 I think more ammo and Footman's stamina would work best since it wouldn't make him stronger but a lot easier to play with the type of class you say he is which is a glass cannon. He can do a lot of damage from a distance and support himself in a melee but his stats very bad that makes him too vulnerable. His range is what should compensate for it but so long as you can hold the guard button when you're advancing, he's easy pickings. Boosting his stamina will make him last as long as a footman but still squishy compared to one with a weaker shield. More ammo will make him less frequent trips to the ammo crate since It takes at least two hits with a javelin to down anyone, if you can manage to get past right click.
More damage to archers? Kinda agree. No other weapon is getting pulled out the same way from a body as a javelin. I’m not saying there should be a bleed effect but I am saying maybe a minor bonus could be doing damage by retrieving a javelin from a hit enemy. I’m sure you can make pulling it out hurt half as much as going in, especially without armor. I like the speed but could be more like vanguard tho. I actually like the low damage output. As a spear wilder you can always go for pokes if you want higher damage. The utility of having throwing weapons AND it being a spear is enough. 85 minimum is fair enough when you can kill most classes from across the map with enough skill. It fails in being quite a fair 1v1 but it excels on a defense and as suggested by the names in TO’s. I think 7 is a good number of javelins for the skirmisher since that’s two-three kills, and one for protection on the way to reload. I’d like an oil pot ult option but more pressingly I think they might merit a unique form of item ability. Notably. A net. A throwable net that you could toss out doing the same effect as a tackle. It wouldn’t be impossible and would just be a way of giving skirmisher that one free extra hit it’s always needing in a fight. Or time to land it on the next guy 😂. The archer hate in this game is real. They need kits to deal with that sadly. Being squishy is fine but being so range challenged is unique to javelins, They deserve a pseudo way to sprint attack or something.
The most important niche role of the Raider and of weapons you can throw with projectile flinch in general is interrupting interactions. I still hold that crossbowman is probably at least B tier on offense and A tier on defense, but that the tier goes down inversely proportional to the number of archers you have. Crossbowman is most effective if you only ever have one of them. I also think you undervalue oil pots a little bit on defense. Any time you see your VIP attacked by oil pots you can essentially cut off one path of entry for the enemy team and choke them out of getting oil pot value, for example, and then there's objectives like the Darkforest second convoy where oil pots on defense are almost as essential as banners are. As far as Offense goes, we're lucky that not a single team has ever coordinated oil pots decently because most objectives for offense can be done by carpeting a point with oil pots and doing them by suiciding on point into the enemy team through your oil pots to stop them from retaking. Oil pots are just one of those things which could easily break the game, but we just don't do it.
Like I said, it isn't always one thing that gets worse, but rather another thing that gets better. So Oil Pots aren't significantly worse on defense, but Banners are significantly better. And so the tier rankings change accordingly.
@@SoterDave I think part of the problem is that it's too inherently situational. Where oil pots are good they're essentially required, and where oil pots are bad it's a good laugh unless you have spawn locations memorized whereas banners are universally god tier on defense of course. I'm also saying it's closer to that crusader would still be A tier(bottom) whereas devastator due to the inferior health pool(matters more in defense, any lack of bullshit mitigation is amplified immensely by the long respawns) would maybe even moreso worse than you implied.
Great video! As a new player I really enjoy Poleman, specifically Spear. I didn’t know it was S tier but it makes sense as it has allowed a very average new player like me to do pretty well a few times. 😂
I'm pretty new to the game but I've taken quite a liking to the skirmisher class. Do you reccomend picking up heavier shields in the battlefield & always ditching the light one whenever possible? Also, nice video. I know it doesn't pertain to me too much since I'm still a noob, but it's interesting to see how higher skill levels see the game and I always try to learn something from you guys. I recently got this game a few days and I'm loving it, I have hundreds of hours on For Honor but this game scratches a different kind of itch. I just love sword fighting games. Maybe I'll even try Mordhau one day, though I hear it's even less beginner friendly than Chiv
Regarding the shield, I actually think the Light Shield pairs well with the Skirmisher's playstyle. You just need to counter as much as possible to conserve its durability.
I think Dave would agree, too, best advice for a new skirmisher is to not play skirmisher. It’s just weak as a class sadly.. if you like the throwing playstyle, raider with double dane axe is incredible. You can throw both, and in many situations, pick them back up or pick up random weapons around you, and get a lot of free throws in. Ambusher is an option as well, lots of knives. Not great but still light years better than the skirmisher.
in competitive matches where field engineers are borderline necessary on defense, where exactly are the walls and whatnot placed? are there specific areas to place them that might not be apparent outside of comp, or do people just largely look for areas like doorways and fighting lanes?
Basically the same, except neglect the abilities. All that matters in LTS is loadout and passives. For TDM, the difference between classes would be a lot closer since both teams are attacking and defending. Field Engineer would be way worse, since there's no objective to play around.
New to the game. If I'm getting wrecked in melee I'll swap to crossbowman so I can make myself useful with the banner and landing more damage than I would getting thrashed in melee. I haven't really played Vanguard but I enjoy the Knight classes and Footman classes a bunch. Right now my favorite melee classes are poleman and guardian.
@@SoterDave Thanks. Yeah I'll probably be playing it for a while. The game is fun even as I'm not really sure how to play it so it'll probably be even more fun after I understand how to be consistent and don't have try and remember what the controls are.
I'm one of the new PS console noobs. I've been playing Officer with a Heavy Mace and I've loved it. Im horrible at combat based multiplayer games so I usually play Medic-type roles to help my team. Awesome game.
I only ever play Officer. War Axe and Greatsword are just too damn fun, and that healthbar is absolutely amazing. I also manage to use the tackle to some decent effect, throwing an enemy back which gives me a chance to deal some damage to his friends
Skirmisher I usually rank top 10 in everything at worst in competitive in 64 man match. It's not a bad class even on attack. No class is bad you just have to be good with each class. Which takes time for each class. Also the short sword for The archers. Fantastic! Not a lot of people know how to block drag do stabs so it's more viable. I'm confused with your ranking early on. To be honest, I just turned it off after those first three cuz I was baffled by choices
Any chance of a FFA weapon tier list? I feel like it deserves it's own one due to many situations you don't really find yourself in when doing duels or TO (hurried duels where you need the killing blow, 1v1v1v1, stealing kills etc). I'd love to hear your thoughts. Ambushers and Men At Arms seem to go up in value & I always do better with the maul in FFA than in TO.
I mainly play the game competitively, and it's hard for me to give my opinion on that because FFA is probably the least common competitive mode possible. Regardless, I think the best options would probably be the Greatsword or Executioner's Axe. Take that opinion with a grain of salt though.
Honestly, I would say that when it comes to the A and S tier classes on attack and defense, there's not a hell of a lot of difference in viability between any of the classes, and that player skill matters much more at that point. I play officer, and personally believe that Officer is slightly above poleman for TO purposes because of warhorn and the versatility, specifically the combination of heavy primaries (I run poleaxe and the special is totally busted) and secondary weapons of the one-handed mace and the throwing knives, which allow it to switch to a faster attacking style and do ambusher's job way better than ambusher, but theres also one other element that doesn't get talked about as much: traps. Traps are an extremely important part of TO that get ignored, and most people don't bother with them, even in the comp matches that I've played. Officer's versatility lets them activate traps extremely easily, and this is something that is extremely important for defensive scenarios that would have me put the officer in S tier for defense as well. There are many maps where a single trap or set of traps can grind an assault to a screeching halt. Take Askandir, for example. When the masons topple the columns and have to get into the library, the majority of them charge to the main door and try to hack it down. There are three braziers attached to chains, and with the throwing knives on officer, I regularly get mega-kills in that spot, and have killed up to 10-11 people at one time. It hard stops the assault, and buys my teammates precious time to focus on the guys invading from the side doors, as well as regroup and pick up jugs of water to douse the book cases. I do agree that guardian is best on defense by a little bit, but that's mostly because of its shield. The heavy shield, from full health, can absorb two full ballista hits, but this also makes it better for advancing on attack. It's extremely important when wither attacking or defending to have good guardians that can use that shield to prevent a well placed ballista shot in a choke point from skewering three or four guys at once.
@@Mugwortcircle yeah, but you probably want to use your medkits for healing teammates rather than activating traps. Medkits also take a while to recharge, rather than having them on spawn and being able to refill from ammo crates. Ambusher probably is the best trap-kill class, but it lacks a lot that the officer doesn’t. Footman isn’t universally the best class, and that’s doubly true when there’s any kind of skill gap.
@nickstanton9480 You can just pick up the kits after you activate the trap. Even if you don't they can be used anytime laying on the floor in a high traffic area. After 3500 hours I generally play footman. I'll play knight here and there but only for the poleaxe.
@@Mugwortcircle you can pick up knives too. Even if a knife is unreachable or despawns, it’s easy enough to hit up an ammo crate. Footman (Poleman specifically) is a great TO class with very balanced stats and great 2 hander weapons, but it doesn’t quite have the sheer offensive power of officer. The footman is also relegated to the small one handers for secondaries, like the knife, hatchet, and cudgel, where the officer gets much better secondaries, including 1h Axe, Sword, and 1h mace. These are generally regarded as the best one handers in the game, along with Morning Star. Also, the potential for healing and team effectiveness cannot be overstated with the officer’s horn. If you charge up all 3 footman medkits, at most you’ll get by is 150 points, assuming all three of your targeted teammates need at least 100 points of health restored. With the horn, anyone can pull 300+ points and heal far more effectively with a blanket spread. I often get 500-600 points in an average game.
Call me insane but I really like throwing axe skirmisher, being able to spam so much more is just more appealing to me. Plus, I kinda prefer it over jav in combat. And the falchion is always a good weapon.
If you get a polearm with field engineer you become a way better Poleman, not only you have reach, but also can provide with barriers (as cover or blocking defenders from recovering an objective) but also you heal yourself every time you throw a medkit to your team.
You did ambusher dirty. I feel like it’s pretty underrated. Vanguard in general is a glass cannon, but someone who has great accuracy with throwing knives takes this class to another level. Fast attacks, high stamina, and then playing in an engage-release style makes it a real problem if you know what you’re doing
Trust me, I play Ambusher a ton. But on a tier list, it doesn't matter if something is viable. We are rating it relative to other subclasses, and in this case, it is worse than the other subclasses most of the time. Especially the other Vanguards.
i've a question... did they change the classes meanwhile?? i just started chivalry and found skirmisher with javelins extremely powerful :O body shots hit for 85dmg... headshots over 100... thats quite something. with 5 spears, you'll be at least killing 1-2 foes and then you can just recollect your javes. the only thing i dont like about javelin is the special ability "refill", because it will not give you any points. therefore it is pretty hard to top the charts.
I reckon Devastator is better than Raider in defence and vice versa. Oil pot on a path to the objective as the enemy come in plus swinging a greatsword to hold somewhere down is quite effective. On the other hand, the banner for Raider can be used to establish a forward point for attackers which can be useful offensively. I feel like the Dane Axe and dual 2h weapon slots is useful for attack as well cos you can pick up weapons as you move forward or chuck a Dane Axe at a defender as you go.
As a side note I think the Oil pot is severely underrated. If you know how to use it you can just throw it onto maybe 3-4 unsuspecting victims attacking at a narrow point, they burn and either retreat or go on to get cleared up as the rest of the attacking force hesitates to go, having to move to attack another point, and you gather up a few lads and guard another point. It doesn't need an elite team of players to pull this off, just a bit of strats.
The polehammer is actually shorter than the halberd. Also, The increased damage is negligible because both of them still two shot every class in the game.
Archers 🏹 were never strong to begin with. This is why they gotta be WISE and SMART to RUN, HIDE, and SHOOT 'EM IN THE SKULLHEAD ☠️ (insta-kill) You can't bring an Archer in a confrontational sword battle against a full armor walking knight. That's just not going to happen.
I don’t think you give ambusher enough credit. It’s very easy to get free throwing knife hits because from a distance you don’t look like you have a ranged option. As well as the fact that the short sword is absolutely insane, and has an extremely fast windup. If you can start a combo with the short sword you can get two or three free hits before your opponent even realizes what’s happening. Ambusher is at least one of the best when it comes to getting takedowns, because of the amount of free hits you can get on unsuspecting victims. Pretty much any weapon with a large windup time will get destroyed by a solid short sword play. Ambusher is at the very least a super fun class to play, and very solid in general.
Its a shame, skirmisher is one of my fave subclasses. Imo it should be better than archer because its riskier to play and you are just as squishy. I have always thought that thrown weapons should need to be countered so you cant just hold block and win, I think that would make all of them more useful. Aside from that, skirmishers should get 7 javelins and should one shot archers. Kill two birds with one stone, make skirmisher the ultimate anti archer class. You give javelins more utility while also creating another counter to archers which currently have no counter besides other archers.
@@SoterDave Yeah that would be good. Idk, it needs something. Now that I think about it making jav the anti archer weapon would make picking the war bow even less of a sound decision since they get worse melee weapons and the brazier is thoroughly meh. Lol hit stun would be great for singling out enemies, quick jav run up and stab then run away. Thats less extreme, might make just enough of a difference though
Competitive means matches between competitive teams. If you're confused about the competitive community (or you're just unaware there was one) be sure to check out my video on the competitive Chivalry 2 community!
I personally run dagger and hatchet. Dagger to deal with light classes, hatchet for armored ones and just general fighting. Short sword is also a good option for general fighting, just so long as you remember to switch to dagger whenever you're in a position to backstab.
My man, new to the game. Bout 15 hours. Big "film guy" this and your weapons list. Perfection. These plus dueling guides have made it so I atheist know why I am getting stomped. Knowing how much better other people are has helped me go from bottom of the pack to mid. Avoiding the lobby Kings, while I have joined in as a knight no matter what lol
Well shit I’ve been playing skirmisher since I got the game a few days ago cause I hoped it would be good but maybe I should try something else I’ve been losing a lot
In my opinion they're all good but you could always pick up a weapon off the floor or around the map you'd find yourself in a much better stance if you find a shield and sword than any of the Engie weapons (but shovel is my personal fav)
I mean competitive matches between the miscellaneous competitive groups in the game. Consider watching my 'How to get into Competitive Chivalry 2' video for more info.
@@alexanderrobinson9971 I agree. Although, they are put into a weird situation. You can't have too many archers on a team, or else it's pretty much a guarantee that you're going to lose. So your team will hate you because you're contributing to the loss, the enemy will hate you because they don't find it fun to fight archers and all around it leads to less enjoyability for everyone. This is why it is banned or extremely limited in most matches. Me personally, I would have an Archer limit of around 2 Team Objective matches. Usually the amount of archer mains per lobby never exceeds that much, but the limit also prevents teams from purposefully throwing the match by having a surplus of archers.
The field engineer has the ability to defend objectives with their barricades while simultaneously dealing extra damage to objectives. Both of these are extremely valuable
Depending on the map you can just grab a sword+ shield or a halberd pretty fast and just use that instead. You get your four barricades+ spiked down and then you become a pseudo man at arms/pikeman. It’s not perfect but if you know the weapon your picking up you can survive a lot longer then usual. Not to mention the “shitty weapons” can destroy other people stuff and that includes objectives that have a destroyable wall or prisoner area, you will make short work of them and when time is everything it does add up.
I mean, someone with huge shield and a banner to hold the ground until more come to help do make a big difference compared to the warhorn which is good but not banner good at holding areas better for long term
Guardian is B tier you are actually trash the war hammer is amazing it does devastating damage on special attack plus the axe is perfect for holding the line I have won mostly every game with guardian with heavy shield and short spears are better the long spears you must be really bad and ppl that agree are very bad I’ll be so good sometimes they all go for me because I’m holding them back with short spear and mace you goober
I went into duels with a shovel, and just started building walls. I think my opponent was confused, but he ran around it to try and attack, and I planted a bear trap right before he hit me. He ragequit so fast. Lmao
Typical engineer gameplay
@@SoterDave Guilty as charged. Lol
Based?
@@imanomeglebaiter9109based on what? 👀
🤔I'd say based on that bear trap but he already got got🤣
Just recently started playing, but I think it's crazy the Engineer doesn't get any kind of points for extending the game out using their kit. Like if they gained points everytime a barricade was hit for an example, it would more accurately show their impact on the game!
Now that you mention it. It is a little silly that they don't get points for doing what they're supposed to.
Very true. I figured you did get points for having a shield or a spikes on the objective
I'm always so grateful when we have a wall of spikes or barriers protecting the objective, and if I see that as an attacker it sucks ass lol
@@LunkLanguageIIRC that's how it works in Mordhau, correct me if I'm wrong.
Btw you are so right, it should definitely work like that.
If they give points to engineers for barricades absorbing damage then they should also give knights points for absorbing or mitigating damage
rest in paradise dave we love you❤️
What happened?
@@krinkton23 Dave took his own life 3 weeks ago ☹️
@@Sosa0125bullshit
@@Sosa0125 how do you know ?
He just posted 2 weeks ago
I like skirmisher purely on Mason for aesthetic reasons. The gambeson + hood, the kettle helmet, along with a buckler and small spear give some strong bandit vibes, and I'm *all* for it. Super cool look imo.
Generally a very cool get up! Nice to hear someone so invested in their fashion like myself
I would argue the oil pot is better in defense because blocking off reinforcements in a choke point like a gate or bridge is great, and it prevents people from destroying objectives like gates. I would know, I have had the game for 2 whole days.
Can't argue with that play time!
I did that during the siege of askindar when I was the defender cause the main entrance was the into the library and I threw an oil pot righjt between the sides of the entrance and it took a few or them and it’s like they didn’t know where to go without getting hurt and we won the siege
..I remember the oil pot well.
Dam, both Chivalry 1 and 2 are good games. Had Chivalry 2 made the game course to protect the King?
Chivalry 1 has it.
As someone with 15 minutes total playtime, and _only_ as Archer, I think the Oil Pot is better in 1v1s because if you throw it at your feet, you _and_ your enemy will die.
Yall must be playing bot lobby’s honestly because polemen are trash he gots this list all messed up I never see them and spearmen are dooo dooo once u in they face with war hammer
Cool video. I never thought about certain classes being better at offense and defense. Good stuff
It can be interesting.
What i love about skirmisher is that he's (true to his name) pretty good at hit and runs, you can just run in, quickly throw a jav, preferably at a wounded/healing enemy, and get out, and since his ranged weapon is also a melee weapon he's always ready to defend himself against any surprises and retaliations. He does need some buffs though, damage buff, more ammo and more damage to archers.
All sound opinions
I’d give him the Vangaurds dodge and +3-5 more ammo.
That way he plays like a glass cannon that has good range.
Also give him a minor version of the ambushers backstab and the oil pot as his Ult.
He will become a weird hybrid build that plays like a vanguard at range.
@@bionizard5480 I think more ammo and Footman's stamina would work best since it wouldn't make him stronger but a lot easier to play with the type of class you say he is which is a glass cannon. He can do a lot of damage from a distance and support himself in a melee but his stats very bad that makes him too vulnerable. His range is what should compensate for it but so long as you can hold the guard button when you're advancing, he's easy pickings. Boosting his stamina will make him last as long as a footman but still squishy compared to one with a weaker shield. More ammo will make him less frequent trips to the ammo crate since It takes at least two hits with a javelin to down anyone, if you can manage to get past right click.
More damage to archers? Kinda agree. No other weapon is getting pulled out the same way from a body as a javelin. I’m not saying there should be a bleed effect but I am saying maybe a minor bonus could be doing damage by retrieving a javelin from a hit enemy. I’m sure you can make pulling it out hurt half as much as going in, especially without armor.
I like the speed but could be more like vanguard tho. I actually like the low damage output. As a spear wilder you can always go for pokes if you want higher damage. The utility of having throwing weapons AND it being a spear is enough. 85 minimum is fair enough when you can kill most classes from across the map with enough skill. It fails in being quite a fair 1v1 but it excels on a defense and as suggested by the names in TO’s. I think 7 is a good number of javelins for the skirmisher since that’s two-three kills, and one for protection on the way to reload. I’d like an oil pot ult option but more pressingly I think they might merit a unique form of item ability. Notably. A net. A throwable net that you could toss out doing the same effect as a tackle. It wouldn’t be impossible and would just be a way of giving skirmisher that one free extra hit it’s always needing in a fight. Or time to land it on the next guy 😂. The archer hate in this game is real. They need kits to deal with that sadly. Being squishy is fine but being so range challenged is unique to javelins, They deserve a pseudo way to sprint attack or something.
Deadset, throw a spear directly through some guys face and he still got half HP
Soter Dave, my guy!! Always good seeing you
*flourishes incessantly*
Legend!
appreciate this, just saw your dueling one also :)
The most important niche role of the Raider and of weapons you can throw with projectile flinch in general is interrupting interactions.
I still hold that crossbowman is probably at least B tier on offense and A tier on defense, but that the tier goes down inversely proportional to the number of archers you have. Crossbowman is most effective if you only ever have one of them.
I also think you undervalue oil pots a little bit on defense. Any time you see your VIP attacked by oil pots you can essentially cut off one path of entry for the enemy team and choke them out of getting oil pot value, for example, and then there's objectives like the Darkforest second convoy where oil pots on defense are almost as essential as banners are. As far as Offense goes, we're lucky that not a single team has ever coordinated oil pots decently because most objectives for offense can be done by carpeting a point with oil pots and doing them by suiciding on point into the enemy team through your oil pots to stop them from retaking. Oil pots are just one of those things which could easily break the game, but we just don't do it.
Like I said, it isn't always one thing that gets worse, but rather another thing that gets better. So Oil Pots aren't significantly worse on defense, but Banners are significantly better. And so the tier rankings change accordingly.
@@SoterDave I think part of the problem is that it's too inherently situational. Where oil pots are good they're essentially required, and where oil pots are bad it's a good laugh unless you have spawn locations memorized whereas banners are universally god tier on defense of course. I'm also saying it's closer to that crusader would still be A tier(bottom) whereas devastator due to the inferior health pool(matters more in defense, any lack of bullshit mitigation is amplified immensely by the long respawns) would maybe even moreso worse than you implied.
I love the list Dave, its really close to mine... U even changed my opinion on some sub classes!
glad to hear it!
This homie out here replying to everyone asking chivalry questions, its beautiful! Thank you for the list and the help!
Any time!
@SoterDave your 2.8 tier lists still relevant in 2.9? Or new vids soon? Thanks!
@@SGO_Joshua new vids soon, after 2.10 drops
Great video! As a new player I really enjoy Poleman, specifically Spear. I didn’t know it was S tier but it makes sense as it has allowed a very average new player like me to do pretty well a few times. 😂
Even good subclasses require you to understand and learn the game mechanics. You may be better than you realize.
You're probably a beast by now aren't ya ?
Nice tier list! I play guardian alot but with an axe. Might change it up and try the hammer or cav sword instead. Also love the halberd!
Glad you enjoyed it
Great guide Dave
This is exactly what my noob ass needed good looks bro 💯
Happy to help!
I'm pretty new to the game but I've taken quite a liking to the skirmisher class. Do you reccomend picking up heavier shields in the battlefield & always ditching the light one whenever possible? Also, nice video. I know it doesn't pertain to me too much since I'm still a noob, but it's interesting to see how higher skill levels see the game and I always try to learn something from you guys.
I recently got this game a few days and I'm loving it, I have hundreds of hours on For Honor but this game scratches a different kind of itch. I just love sword fighting games. Maybe I'll even try Mordhau one day, though I hear it's even less beginner friendly than Chiv
Regarding the shield, I actually think the Light Shield pairs well with the Skirmisher's playstyle. You just need to counter as much as possible to conserve its durability.
I think Dave would agree, too, best advice for a new skirmisher is to not play skirmisher. It’s just weak as a class sadly.. if you like the throwing playstyle, raider with double dane axe is incredible. You can throw both, and in many situations, pick them back up or pick up random weapons around you, and get a lot of free throws in. Ambusher is an option as well, lots of knives. Not great but still light years better than the skirmisher.
@@JohnnyFalco This really only applies to competitive, but yes I agree. Skirmisher is perfectly viable in random pubs as noobs don't block javelins.
Bro you are capping hard everyone knows peasant is S tier both in attack and defense
Unfortunately I'd say B tier at best
thanks!
No problem!
in competitive matches where field engineers are borderline necessary on defense, where exactly are the walls and whatnot placed? are there specific areas to place them that might not be apparent outside of comp, or do people just largely look for areas like doorways and fighting lanes?
Primarily defending the objectives. The spots aren't too crazy, but they can be at times.
Good list! I agree with the rankings. How would a list for TDM or LTS look like? I would guess the list would look most similar to ATK's rankings.
Basically the same, except neglect the abilities. All that matters in LTS is loadout and passives.
For TDM, the difference between classes would be a lot closer since both teams are attacking and defending. Field Engineer would be way worse, since there's no objective to play around.
amazing video mr kosher
thanks
I enjoy that the halberd and spear are the best since they were the best throughout history as well
Best Chivalry coach out there !!! If you need help Dave is the man !!!!
I appreciate the kind words!
Dave's DBZ shirt and Flawless Stache put him in S tier Chivalry 2 Creators!!!
Thanks!
New to the game.
If I'm getting wrecked in melee I'll swap to crossbowman so I can make myself useful with the banner and landing more damage than I would getting thrashed in melee.
I haven't really played Vanguard but I enjoy the Knight classes and Footman classes a bunch. Right now my favorite melee classes are poleman and guardian.
Glad you're enjoying the game and I hope you stick around!
@@SoterDave Thanks. Yeah I'll probably be playing it for a while. The game is fun even as I'm not really sure how to play it so it'll probably be even more fun after I understand how to be consistent and don't have try and remember what the controls are.
I'm one of the new PS console noobs. I've been playing Officer with a Heavy Mace and I've loved it. Im horrible at combat based multiplayer games so I usually play Medic-type roles to help my team. Awesome game.
Glad you enjoy it
I only ever play Officer. War Axe and Greatsword are just too damn fun, and that healthbar is absolutely amazing. I also manage to use the tackle to some decent effect, throwing an enemy back which gives me a chance to deal some damage to his friends
Officer is a really great subclass
Pole ax is the goat
Skirmisher I usually rank top 10 in everything at worst in competitive in 64 man match. It's not a bad class even on attack. No class is bad you just have to be good with each class. Which takes time for each class.
Also the short sword for The archers. Fantastic! Not a lot of people know how to block drag do stabs so it's more viable. I'm confused with your ranking early on. To be honest, I just turned it off after those first three cuz I was baffled by choices
where do u find competitive matches and how do u compete dave? asking because id like to get into the scene
I would check out my video 'Introduction to Competitive Chivalry' which should get you started!
Nice breakdown ! I'd like to have a screenshot of both tier lists side to side at the end to compare.
DM me at 20mm#9000. I'll send it them to you
Question... what do you think of the polehammer for the poleman.
Is it nearly as good as or better than the spear/halberd in your opinion?
It's a great weapon, but noticeably worse than the Halberd or Spear
Man at arms with a rapier is my go to and best win rate in 1v1s the extra 50% dodge speed makes a difference for sure.
Man At Arms doesn't have increased dodge speed. He has a decreased dodge cooldown.
@@SoterDave ok I don't want to seem like a smart ass but can't you tell that's obviously what I'm saying.
@@malikcox9309 I get a lot of confused comments all the time! Can never be too sure
@@SoterDave oh ok well thanks then
Any chance of a FFA weapon tier list? I feel like it deserves it's own one due to many situations you don't really find yourself in when doing duels or TO (hurried duels where you need the killing blow, 1v1v1v1, stealing kills etc). I'd love to hear your thoughts. Ambushers and Men At Arms seem to go up in value & I always do better with the maul in FFA than in TO.
I mainly play the game competitively, and it's hard for me to give my opinion on that because FFA is probably the least common competitive mode possible. Regardless, I think the best options would probably be the Greatsword or Executioner's Axe. Take that opinion with a grain of salt though.
Honestly, I would say that when it comes to the A and S tier classes on attack and defense, there's not a hell of a lot of difference in viability between any of the classes, and that player skill matters much more at that point. I play officer, and personally believe that Officer is slightly above poleman for TO purposes because of warhorn and the versatility, specifically the combination of heavy primaries (I run poleaxe and the special is totally busted) and secondary weapons of the one-handed mace and the throwing knives, which allow it to switch to a faster attacking style and do ambusher's job way better than ambusher, but theres also one other element that doesn't get talked about as much: traps.
Traps are an extremely important part of TO that get ignored, and most people don't bother with them, even in the comp matches that I've played. Officer's versatility lets them activate traps extremely easily, and this is something that is extremely important for defensive scenarios that would have me put the officer in S tier for defense as well. There are many maps where a single trap or set of traps can grind an assault to a screeching halt. Take Askandir, for example. When the masons topple the columns and have to get into the library, the majority of them charge to the main door and try to hack it down. There are three braziers attached to chains, and with the throwing knives on officer, I regularly get mega-kills in that spot, and have killed up to 10-11 people at one time. It hard stops the assault, and buys my teammates precious time to focus on the guys invading from the side doors, as well as regroup and pick up jugs of water to douse the book cases.
I do agree that guardian is best on defense by a little bit, but that's mostly because of its shield. The heavy shield, from full health, can absorb two full ballista hits, but this also makes it better for advancing on attack. It's extremely important when wither attacking or defending to have good guardians that can use that shield to prevent a well placed ballista shot in a choke point from skewering three or four guys at once.
Great analysis all around. You're correct. As always, player skill is more impactful than any class can!
Footman can trigger traps much more quickly than Officer by tossing a medkit at it.
@@Mugwortcircle yeah, but you probably want to use your medkits for healing teammates rather than activating traps. Medkits also take a while to recharge, rather than having them on spawn and being able to refill from ammo crates. Ambusher probably is the best trap-kill class, but it lacks a lot that the officer doesn’t. Footman isn’t universally the best class, and that’s doubly true when there’s any kind of skill gap.
@nickstanton9480 You can just pick up the kits after you activate the trap. Even if you don't they can be used anytime laying on the floor in a high traffic area. After 3500 hours I generally play footman. I'll play knight here and there but only for the poleaxe.
@@Mugwortcircle you can pick up knives too. Even if a knife is unreachable or despawns, it’s easy enough to hit up an ammo crate.
Footman (Poleman specifically) is a great TO class with very balanced stats and great 2 hander weapons, but it doesn’t quite have the sheer offensive power of officer. The footman is also relegated to the small one handers for secondaries, like the knife, hatchet, and cudgel, where the officer gets much better secondaries, including 1h Axe, Sword, and 1h mace. These are generally regarded as the best one handers in the game, along with Morning Star.
Also, the potential for healing and team effectiveness cannot be overstated with the officer’s horn. If you charge up all 3 footman medkits, at most you’ll get by is 150 points, assuming all three of your targeted teammates need at least 100 points of health restored. With the horn, anyone can pull 300+ points and heal far more effectively with a blanket spread. I often get 500-600 points in an average game.
Attack by Tier (Left to Right/Best to Worst)
S Tier
15:12 - Poleman
14:02 - Officer
A Tier
12:39 - Raider
11:37 - Devastator
10:49 - Crusader
B Tier
09:15 - Field Engineer
07:56 - Man at Arms
06:10 - Guardian
C Tier
04:56 - Ambusher
03:05 - Crossbowman
02:17 - Bowman
D Tier
00:56 - Skirmisher
Defense by Tier (Left to Right/Best to Worst)
S Tier
25:23 - Guardian
24:40 - Field Engineer
A Tier
23:53 - Poleman
23:18 - Officer
22:28 - Raider
B Tier
21:45 - Crossbowman
20:00 - Crusader
21:00 - Devastator
C Tier
19:34 - Man at Arms
18:53 - Bowman
18:00 - Ambusher
D Tier
17:18 - Skirmisher
What a legend!
Call me insane but I really like throwing axe skirmisher, being able to spam so much more is just more appealing to me. Plus, I kinda prefer it over jav in combat. And the falchion is always a good weapon.
My favorite part about medkits is landing a 3-pointer to heal a teammate mid fight.
Agreed that's why I love em too
My go to is…
Attack: Devastator
Defense: Officer
With a little bit of poleman if I trust my team lol
I always plays civil Engineer with the hammer. Making walls and traps so i can decide were we battle our fights, as team.
Field Engineer is great
LOVE ME A DAVE TIER LIST!
Glad!
yooo i know you
@@9rave969 wassssssssuuuup
If you get a polearm with field engineer you become a way better Poleman, not only you have reach, but also can provide with barriers (as cover or blocking defenders from recovering an objective) but also you heal yourself every time you throw a medkit to your team.
True
You did ambusher dirty. I feel like it’s pretty underrated. Vanguard in general is a glass cannon, but someone who has great accuracy with throwing knives takes this class to another level. Fast attacks, high stamina, and then playing in an engage-release style makes it a real problem if you know what you’re doing
Trust me, I play Ambusher a ton. But on a tier list, it doesn't matter if something is viable. We are rating it relative to other subclasses, and in this case, it is worse than the other subclasses most of the time. Especially the other Vanguards.
Rip Dave, i know you're on the battlefield in spirit.
i've a question... did they change the classes meanwhile?? i just started chivalry and found skirmisher with javelins extremely powerful :O body shots hit for 85dmg... headshots over 100... thats quite something. with 5 spears, you'll be at least killing 1-2 foes and then you can just recollect your javes.
the only thing i dont like about javelin is the special ability "refill", because it will not give you any points. therefore it is pretty hard to top the charts.
they did not change anything major, no
Is this tier list and your weapons tier list still close to accurate in Duel of Fetes? Thx!
Yeah for the most part. They haven't made many changes to weapons and so as a result the meta hasn't changed much
When there is an objective to burn a certain target, can oil pots work instead of the torches
No
Officer, raider and poleman easily S tier
lol guess what
Devastator> raider
@@reid3335 That's mostly up to preference in my experience, they can do very similar things though
wish they'd buff the poleman still haha.
Sorta
Very excited SOTERGE david.
Indeed I am!
I reckon Devastator is better than Raider in defence and vice versa. Oil pot on a path to the objective as the enemy come in plus swinging a greatsword to hold somewhere down is quite effective.
On the other hand, the banner for Raider can be used to establish a forward point for attackers which can be useful offensively. I feel like the Dane Axe and dual 2h weapon slots is useful for attack as well cos you can pick up weapons as you move forward or chuck a Dane Axe at a defender as you go.
As a side note I think the Oil pot is severely underrated. If you know how to use it you can just throw it onto maybe 3-4 unsuspecting victims attacking at a narrow point, they burn and either retreat or go on to get cleared up as the rest of the attacking force hesitates to go, having to move to attack another point, and you gather up a few lads and guard another point. It doesn't need an elite team of players to pull this off, just a bit of strats.
Raider doesn't have a banner.
@@SoterDave Trumpet is even better for attack.
Guardian is always a solid pick
What about the Pole Hammer Vs. the Halberd?
Personally I love the pole hammer more simply because of it's extended reach as well as Blunt damage
The polehammer is actually shorter than the halberd. Also, The increased damage is negligible because both of them still two shot every class in the game.
@@SoterDave thanks! Saw your pole hammer video also, completely agree Halberd just seems better right now for most pub situations
Sometimes I wonder if people learn Oil Pot line-ups like in Counter-Strike lol
To a degree
I main devastator and will sometimes drift to raider or crusader.
Great choices
Archers 🏹 were never strong to begin with. This is why they gotta be WISE and SMART to RUN, HIDE, and SHOOT 'EM IN THE SKULLHEAD ☠️ (insta-kill)
You can't bring an Archer in a confrontational sword battle against a full armor walking knight. That's just not going to happen.
How do I play competitive??
how many damage the fire from arrows inflict?
Same as normal arrows, plus fire. I don't know how much fire damage does over time.
Just got to level 100 in the game and i i love the guardian with the heavy calvalry sword. Does the green team ever get in any battles in the game?
Not sure what you mean, but I'm glad you like Guardian!
@SoterDave in the armory you can switch between red blue yellow and a green team to gear up but I've never used the green team in a game.
@@jeffreykoch122 oh yeah Tenosia is not in many maps.
@@jeffreykoch122 green one is not actually green xD it is free for all costume. you can change the color to yellow blue red so on..
Idk why, but I find men at arms incredibly fun
I do as well! It is my favorite subclass!
We miss you Dave
I don’t think you give ambusher enough credit. It’s very easy to get free throwing knife hits because from a distance you don’t look like you have a ranged option. As well as the fact that the short sword is absolutely insane, and has an extremely fast windup. If you can start a combo with the short sword you can get two or three free hits before your opponent even realizes what’s happening. Ambusher is at least one of the best when it comes to getting takedowns, because of the amount of free hits you can get on unsuspecting victims. Pretty much any weapon with a large windup time will get destroyed by a solid short sword play. Ambusher is at the very least a super fun class to play, and very solid in general.
unfortunately, some subclasses are better than others. it doesn't matter how fun or enjoyable ambusher is if the others are better.
Its a shame, skirmisher is one of my fave subclasses. Imo it should be better than archer because its riskier to play and you are just as squishy. I have always thought that thrown weapons should need to be countered so you cant just hold block and win, I think that would make all of them more useful. Aside from that, skirmishers should get 7 javelins and should one shot archers.
Kill two birds with one stone, make skirmisher the ultimate anti archer class. You give javelins more utility while also creating another counter to archers which currently have no counter besides other archers.
I think Skirmisher is low key fine. The only change I would make is javelins flinch on hit.
@@SoterDave Yeah that would be good. Idk, it needs something. Now that I think about it making jav the anti archer weapon would make picking the war bow even less of a sound decision since they get worse melee weapons and the brazier is thoroughly meh. Lol hit stun would be great for singling out enemies, quick jav run up and stab then run away. Thats less extreme, might make just enough of a difference though
Crusader and quarterstaff is a W, chad loadout
I don't agree, but if you enjoy it I'm not gonna step on your grindset
"Size matters not."
- Guardian 2023
Fr
Also is he meaning that the 40 player game mode is competitive? Just asking for clarity here.
Competitive means matches between competitive teams. If you're confused about the competitive community (or you're just unaware there was one) be sure to check out my video on the competitive Chivalry 2 community!
Officer mains rise up, we are the wardens of this game
I am new to ambusher what do you say is the best out for that subclass
I personally run dagger and hatchet. Dagger to deal with light classes, hatchet for armored ones and just general fighting.
Short sword is also a good option for general fighting, just so long as you remember to switch to dagger whenever you're in a position to backstab.
Hatchet and Shortsword is probably the best beginner loadout. Then Hatchet and Dagger when you get better for more fun.
@@SoterDave Thanks I’m just about to unlock hatchet so I’ll try it out
My man, new to the game. Bout 15 hours.
Big "film guy" this and your weapons list. Perfection. These plus dueling guides have made it so I atheist know why I am getting stomped.
Knowing how much better other people are has helped me go from bottom of the pack to mid. Avoiding the lobby Kings, while I have joined in as a knight no matter what lol
I'm glad to have helped you!
Field engineer still needs a buff
I concur!
This man got a can of beans for a pfp
The absolute mad lad!
@@CopeAndSeeth Lmao 🤣
Rip
might switch from bannerlord cuz apparently ranged is weak here while strong in m&b
Relatively weak. Still completely viable
As a fellow premier pro hater, try da vinci resolve
I use premiere pro because it's free with my work
RIP
😅 luckily they just changed archers quantity per game, i love archery 🎯
Archer is pretty fun.
Well shit I’ve been playing skirmisher since I got the game a few days ago cause I hoped it would be good but maybe I should try something else I’ve been losing a lot
If you're having fun, no need to change
Warbow can two tap every class in the game
Technically, yes.
I still find it weird how footman and vanguard have swapped places in 2
yeah it's definitely weird, but I don't dislike the change
As someone who was really into the roman type of combat i was really disappointed on how shitty the skirmisher was
Fortunately in public lobby skirmisher is totally viable.
Poleman + Spear is nice
And Guardian
Definitely
What weapons are best for the engie?
I believe the Pickaxe is the best option
Sledgehammer
In my opinion they're all good but you could always pick up a weapon off the floor or around the map you'd find yourself in a much better stance if you find a shield and sword than any of the Engie weapons (but shovel is my personal fav)
I always hear you say "competitive mode".
Do you mean 40p games by that?
Sorry, I am playing for two days or so
I mean competitive matches between the miscellaneous competitive groups in the game. Consider watching my 'How to get into Competitive Chivalry 2' video for more info.
Bro played archer. I don’t know if I can respect you now.
It seems like the leading Comp players agree that archers are kind of trash... so why the cap in comp play?
People do not find it enjoyable to fight against them. In fact, they are entirely banned in LTS
@@SoterDave That's a huge bummer since they are a major part of medieval combat!
@@alexanderrobinson9971 I agree. Although, they are put into a weird situation. You can't have too many archers on a team, or else it's pretty much a guarantee that you're going to lose. So your team will hate you because you're contributing to the loss, the enemy will hate you because they don't find it fun to fight archers and all around it leads to less enjoyability for everyone. This is why it is banned or extremely limited in most matches.
Me personally, I would have an Archer limit of around 2 Team Objective matches. Usually the amount of archer mains per lobby never exceeds that much, but the limit also prevents teams from purposefully throwing the match by having a surplus of archers.
The engineer shouldn’t be that high since you only have 1 mediocre weapon with a mediocre stamina bar.
The field engineer has the ability to defend objectives with their barricades while simultaneously dealing extra damage to objectives. Both of these are extremely valuable
@@SoterDave I wish they could defend themselves more.
Depending on the map you can just grab a sword+ shield or a halberd pretty fast and just use that instead.
You get your four barricades+ spiked down and then you become a pseudo man at arms/pikeman.
It’s not perfect but if you know the weapon your picking up you can survive a lot longer then usual.
Not to mention the “shitty weapons” can destroy other people stuff and that includes objectives that have a destroyable wall or prisoner area, you will make short work of them and when time is everything it does add up.
Pick up a weapon on the ground, ez
F
this guy really hates jav players
I don't hate them. It's just the unfortunate reality of how bad the weapon is.
This guy knows nothing. Skirmisher ftw
Indeed+
Bro suks my brother gets 40 kills with ambusher
Bro. Drink some water.
I always do! A gallon a day!
@@SoterDave He meant before you record, so we do not have to hear your mouth and lips in your mic when you talk. Basic content creator things.
@@Meryle25 my bad!
such a bad tierlist lol guardian above any other in defese makes me wanna puke
Skill issue
Why does that make the tier list bad?
@@SoterDave ur taste sucks duhdoy
I mean, someone with huge shield and a banner to hold the ground until more come to help do make a big difference compared to the warhorn which is good but not banner good at holding areas better for long term
you dont know chivalry2
😔
Bruh...
Have you even seen their account?
vs him VS HIM
Its real easy to tell you really do not know what you are talking about XD
Why do you think so?
Guardian is B tier you are actually trash the war hammer is amazing it does devastating damage on special attack plus the axe is perfect for holding the line I have won mostly every game with guardian with heavy shield and short spears are better the long spears you must be really bad and ppl that agree are very bad I’ll be so good sometimes they all go for me because I’m holding them back with short spear and mace you goober
Why tf is the crossbow archer the only subclass who’s helmet does not match the rest of their class. Unplayable
So unplayable!