10 Woods Species Not To Use In Woodworking Projects
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- čas přidán 2. 06. 2024
- Rob Cosman discusses his 10 least favorite woods
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Hi Rob, Enjoy your channel; keep up the good work. Loblolly pine is one of the species that is sold as southern yellow pine. It is indeed hard to work, precisely because of the hard/soft character of the grain that you described. It will crumble under the chisel if you're not very careful. Here in Virginia it's also the least expensive local wood, and local sawyers with air-dried pine are abundant. Air dried pine is completely different from pine dried in a kiln, being much prettier and immensely stronger. For "farm" furniture loblolly pine is well suited.
@@thomasmosca6683 Thank you for the extra info.
As soon as I saw the title I thought Spanish Cedar. I once decided to make a desk for my grand daughter that I hoped would last her for a life time. (loads of hidden draws etc...) It came as a couple of 6 inch thick boards. After a bit of resawing, I had to vacate my workshop because the fumes would make my eyes water and that god damned awful taste.
I then moved the project into the garage and decided to do the rest of the work with hand tools to keep the dust down to a minimum. That too was soon unbearable. So for the remainder of the project I did all of my work in the open air in the yard.
My daughter loved the finished project and the natural oils (that cause that taste) is a natural insecticide so it's absolutely 100% insect proof. It's also a first choice for humidors as it's good at maintaining a stable humidity (and obviously, it's insect proof), but I'll never touch it again, unless it's for a very tiny project.
Watch out for those rosewoods... they've got thorns!
Specifically, Cocobolo is the most dangerous one. Other names it goes by are Yucatan Rosewood or Mexican Rosewood. It has some gorgeous browns, tans, deep reds and bright oranges in color and the figure is just beautiful! It has a good deal in common with Kingwood and Tulipwood, which are also from the rosewood family of trees. The problem is... allergies! If you are allergic to rosewood, you will have a reaction to ANY species of rosewood, including Burmese Rosewood and other varieties.
But the real killer is the Cocobolo! If you are not cautious in how you handle it, the oils from the wood can get into your body, causing certain reactions. Yucatan Rosewood is what is called a "sensitizer". If you are already allergic, it will make your reaction worse over time with exposure. If you are not yet allergic, YOU WILL BECOME ALLERGIC WITH EXPOSURE OVER TIME. This will make you have allergic reactions to EVERY species of rosewood, even if you were never allergic before! Reactions can become extremely severe, to include anaphylaxis and respiratory failure.
Always respect all forms of life. Even trees have evolved over millions of years with ways to protect themselves against infestation, predation and other causes of death! Don't die just because you admire some very pretty wood and forgot to protect yourself!
Thanks @RobCosmanWoodworking, love this content; informative and helps a newb like me use resources effectively. Didn't know you went to BYU, go Cougs!
I highly recommend a book, "A Guide to Useful Woods of the World" edited by James Flynn and Charles Holder. It describes 279 commercially important wood species, devoting two pages to each one. The info provided for each species include a description of the tree, physical properties of the lumber, seasoning and drying, durability, workability, common uses, and availability. In addition, there are color photos of the lumber, which are pretty faithful in most cases. The book is expensive for a paperback, but it's available at a steep discount on the used book market.
You're both a scholar and a gentleman. Thank you for the insight
But I doubt it would go into how they change in color over time, or have a bad taste/smell to them. That comes from experience
@@kevinh5349 Sadly, this book doesn't discuss how the woods change color over time. I guess because in most cases, it depends on the finish as well a exposure to UV light and heat. However, the book DOES mention smell, taste, and if the dust is an irritant.
Ty sir. The kind of comments I expect to find from the learned crowd that populates Rob's channel
Agreed. Great book.
I built a bedframe out of red oak with purple heart accents about 13 years ago. I put 3 or 4 coats of polyurethane on it at the time. Today, 13 years later, the purple heart still looks as purple as it did back then. The bedframe has not gotten very much direct sunlight, so that may explain why it has not turned brown.
This has been my experience as well, if you seal/finish Padouk and Purple heart well and keep them out of direct UV light, they will not oxidize and so retain their color.
The one species that absolutely cannot be kept from changing color is Milo, when freshly milled it is a lovely purple/red with cream stripes color, but quickly changes to chocolate brown.
I have,read,a bit about Purple Heart and it’s color change. What I understand is that UV light brings back the purple (I tested this and it worked) but still, over time it gets stuck at being a dark brown purple. Also, do not use oil based finishes, the darken it, and even accelerate the color lose. It seems a poly finish, maybe without UV blocking is the way to go.
Used Purpleheart for a guitar build about 10 years ago, used a UV protecting finish and it's still Purple today. Even the leftover pieces that are untreated are still purple. It's a crazy hard wood to work with though.
I read that tung oil is the best. Just add a little poly in final coat for hardness.
So funny you put Padauk first. I once processed a piece about 1/2 inch in a planer and the runout was so bad that it came out with a hole in the middle of the board, 1 inch wide by two inches long. My young self learned something that day.
I still use it because it’s one of the most resonant & affordable wood there is. Now I use the drum sander instead. 😅
I am primarily a luthier and probably use more exotics than many other luthiers. I also do a lot of segmented bowl turnings as well as furniture, cabinetry , humidors and jewelry boxes. Currently I've worked with 118 different woods but I am always looking to experience more. I like almost all of the woods that I've worked with, with only a few that I don't care much for or have to limit my use of. The unique and sometimes challenging properties of each are what I enjoy about wood.
As you have pointed out, many woods exhibit beautiful color when first worked but over time they may develop a displeasing patina, turning to rather dull colors if steps are not undertaken to try and slow or stop the transformation. Some are more challenging than others. A good finish should seal the woods against oxidation as much as possible and have a UV inhibitor when necessary. I've used Purpleheart quite a bit and had no troubles with maintaining the color.
Padauk is a little more challenging, but I have chosen to be more limited in working with it as I do experience an unpleasant skin reaction to its dust.
If you are looking for a vibrant orange which does is more resistant to color change, you may want to try Chakte Viga.
The two woods that I've found most challenging to prevent color change in are Redheart (Chakte Kok) and Peroba Rosa.
I've used Purpleheart too, mainly as either binding or inlay on my builds. Did try to use it as a fingerboard once, but I ended up pulling it and went back to rosewood. Even though I'd bought it supposedly kiln dried, and it sat in my shop for 6 months at 18% stable humidity, it acted like it was green and frets were pushing loose from their slots every time I turned around.
I use nitrocellulose lawyer 99% of the time, and I've not had much of a color change issue, but instruments spend more time in their case than in the light, and that's most likely a contributing factor as to why.
Funny- I made all my window and door jams/casings with poplar and finished them with a rub on concoction. We love it- it looks beautiful.
Rob nixed southern yellow pine, red oak, and tulip poplar. Welp, there goes a healthy chunk of historic southern furniture woods. I suppose this hillbilly just has to rough it. 😂 Cheers, Rob and thanks for all that you do for the craft!
No he just doesn't like them that is all, use what you have and what you enjoy.
@@flowleopard893but the title doesn't say 10 wood species I won't use. It says 10 wood species not to use. So kinda is trying to say we shouldn't use it and this person's comment is correct
Being from NC these are my go to woods. I have the same issues Rob talks about but there are other reasons to use these. SYP is a cheap hard wood that I have made several bench tops with. It machines well and for me is one of the cheaper woods to use while providing great strength. Red oak is another readily available hard wood. The grain is VERY pronounced with deep texture and hard. It has it’s place. Tulip poplar is a great secondary wood. Cheap, zero grain but the color is horrible. Great if your going to paint it.
I made 2 TV stands. One from red oak and the other from tulip poplar. The grain showed so bad on the red oak I had to take auto filler Bondo to fill the surface so it was glass smooth. The tulip poplar was smooth after 2 coats of paint, sanding in between coats.
There is a lot of beautiful Southern furniture made from yellow pine. I made a beautiful Shaker style bench with yellow pine and pecan. I remember looking at a lot of antique books at the library when I was still a kid. Most of them thought only the furniture from the NE was of any value. It always had to be mahogany or walnut or cherry, or some expensive veneer. Southern furniture, and SW style furniture have been largely ignored.
@@woodworkingandepoxy643 did you pay any attention when Rob made it clear thst it is his opinion? Its kinda right in the video mate
I love Purple Heart wood. I learned right away about getting down into the brown color. Purple Heart trees in nature when alive are brown in color . It’s after they are cut and the suns UV light reacts with the wood to change it to purple. If you get down into the brown just put it out in the sun it will darken right up. A matter of fact if your Purple Heart wood isn’t dark enough just leave it out in the sun. Another thing I do with Purple Heart wood is I’ve developed my own tinted varnish color that just adds to it and red oak and other hardwoods. Also my main go to is red oak and in my area is depending on the market is less expensive then popular which I agree with you as a secondary wood. I see issues with all woods and work around them if need be , but I’m a hobbyist and not in the business per se, big difference. And you talk about offensive wood smells , doesn’t bother me. Now I’m a retired heavy duty diesel mechanic and I’ve been around a lot of foul smelling crap. Woods are no big deal to me😂😂😂😂😂👍
I use a lot of Paduak, purple heart and yellow heart. A ready supplay was available for my use. So i used them. They caused me severely issues. It took me almost 3 years before i could get back in my shop. I always wear a mask now, no matter what i am doing. Thank you for sharing. Everyone stay safe, happy and healthy. From Henrico County Virginia
Glad you are doing better and back in the shop. Stay healthy and safe.
Ron
Yes all those woods are notorious for causing respiratory or allergic issues.
@@RobCosmanWoodworking I used Paduak for the drawer fronts for my hanging tool cabinet. Very disappointed on how they aged.
My workbench is maple with Padauk accents ( drawer handles, vise jaws, saw holder) I have not been disappointed. yes, the red faded to deep purple brown but I expected that.
@@larryfisher7056 i like the doo doo brown paduak aging process
Tulip wood is great if you're going to paint it. It takes paint REALLY well.
When I saw the title I hoped you focused on what really matters in woodworking: species must be harvest sustainably. As a tropical forest ecologist, forester, woodworker and business owner myself, all my efforts have this goal, everything/everybody else I regard as foolish/fools.
Btw, alder isn't always alder. Pit wood of Black alder _(Alnus glutinosa)_ is in my neck of the woods considered our local Mahogany and is harvested 100% sustainably.
I recently retired after 43 years in the hardwood lumber business, I also piddle around in my wood shop a bit. I heartily agree with you about Padauk, I usually tried to talk people out of buying it. Poplar is the least expensive wood that we sell. It's not only a good secondary wood but it makes an excellent paint grade wood. I had a customer that needed something more stable, so I came up with the idea of getting rift and quarter sawn Poplar. It mills well, it's stays really straight. It's great for moulding. An overlooked property of Purple Heart is that it's holds up very good outdoors. The purple color will fade to a nice silver color in a few months. Huge pieces of Purple Heart were used for the keel of sailing ships. It's rot resistant, hard and durable and has the weight needed at the bottom of the boat to add stability. We used to sell a lot of Philippine Mahogany, mostly because it was cheap. The last time it was offered, in full container quality, the price was as high as African Mahogany and Sapele. It's just not worth that much. We used to sell a lot of Jatoba, mostly to stair builders who were matching Jatoba flooring, which the flooring suppliers sold as "Brazilian Cherry". I agree that it is too hard for a furniture wood, it's a good flooring wood and also holds up well outdoors. Alder used to be called "The poor man's cherry" because with the right stain it could be hard for most people to tell the difference. These days though Cherry is pretty inexpensive, so there would be no reason to use Alder instead of Cherry. Knotty Alder is popular for kitchen cabinets, it has a nice rustic look and even though it's a bit soft. it's still harder than Ponderosa Pine that used to be used a lot for that purpose. Alder also has a very pleasant smell when worked.
A few years ago the military was using purple heart to up-armor vehicles because of its density and toughness.
We had the BEST hardwood lumber company in Toledo. Hubbard Lumber, now long gone. I miss the stacks and stacks of amazing wood... I'm sure the forests missed them too, but this was before we destroyed the planet. 🤷🏻
What wood would you recommend for making rubrails on a boat?
What wood would you recommend for making rubrails on a boat?
What wood would you recommend for making rubrails on a boat?
We remodeled our kitchen and my wife wanted white, with a few red accents (fire engine red range). As I couldn’t cook for months, I made a cutting board out of “reddish” woods (separated by white holly veneer). One was padauk. It stayed more or less red for about 3 years. Most all the other reddish woods except tulipwood also turned brown after about 3 years. I ran it through a belt sander and refinished it, so far after 2 years it is still more red than brown. The secret is no exposure to direct sunlight.
Billiard Pool cues are a great example for this, colors stay vibrant because they are always in use indoors and keep inside cue case when not in use
Great video well described and explained as always. The characteristics of wood is always good to learn from someone who has worked with it. Thank you and take care. 👍🏻
I like all ten...😊 They each have their place, poplar paints wonderfully.
Yep, I love poplar. Easy on the tools, can leave a fuzzy finish even after sanding, though. I especially like to use it if the project is going to be painted with enamel paint.
I'm with you, I like all woods. One like you say has to pick the right application for them.
priced fairly @@MixingGBP
Yep, Wifey wanted painted cabinets, so should got plywood and poplar.
I did my wife's music room and our living room in Jatoba and let me tell you it is an amazing choice for hardwood flooring. It is more beautiful and durable than any oak. When you look on the Janka hardness scale it is one of the hardest woods around. There is nothing in North America that grows that is close to the hardness of Jatoba.
It did annihilate a pretty good saw blade on my miter saw, by the end of the job the blade was just smoking when I would cut a board. I saved all the scrap and use it for various projects, I'm a big fan of this wood, it's very beautiful. By the way this wood also does not rot.
But I'm a power tool guy and the stuff is very hard. It does sand just fine and does not have rough grain like red oak. By the way if you see anything called Brazilian cherry, there are no cherry trees in Brazil and it is Jatoba with a different name. Jatoba is a legume tree..
My house flooring is jatoba and it's fantastic after 30 years
The thing Rob is taking about are woods for hand tool woodworkers. Jatoba makes a great flooring material, but it isn't normally worked with hand planes.
I put down a Jatoba floor in the addition I built. Boy does it get the compliments!! Absolutely no regrets. Both beautiful and durable!!! Maybe there aren't any bad woods, only some woods being put to bad uses!!
@@trimaranchuck He's a hand tool guy and that wood is incredibly hard so probably not fun with hand tools. It certainly does not have some funky grain like red oak. It is straight stable, and cuts and machines well. It's also a very beautiful wood. I think the only reason he doesn't like it is because hand tools have trouble cutting it. I covered the chute on my lawn mower with a piece of the flooring. The lawn mower was left outside for years and the board never rotted. Like at all. I prefer power tools so I'm totally good with it. Look at Janka hardness scale on Wikipedia and look at where it ranks compared to other woods.
@@josedomingosteixeira1379 it is such a good dense stable wood I expect it will still be good after 100 years. Mine is 14 years old now and it still looks great. I would like to eventually sand it down and refinish it with a good oil based polyurethane.
LOL! All I can get at my big box lumber supply store are yellow pine, poplar, and red oak. Occasionally fir, but unlike the old days the fir is second growth with wide growth rings and very splintery. Easy to work of course. I made a large bookcase out of red oak and finished it with Watco Danish oil golden oak color, and it turned out very nice from my amateur hands, but it was really hard on the tools. I also had to wax all the screws because even in counterbored pilot holes they tended to snap off. I have one other small project going now, (in Padauk of course!) 😉. Hopefully a poly finish will keep the color from fading…
«I love wood». That's something I identify with. Thank you for the precious information. A hug from Portugal.
Jatoba is used as hardwood flooring here down in the states, so the hardness is expected. the reason i don't use padauk is that when sanding, if you're not careful, it's really easy to dye the other wood (think, maple) that you might be using in your project
It was used in hardwood in my apartment up in Alberta too. And I was making a desk for myself with Jatoba in that apartment. I don't want to know how many times I stepped on a piece of Jatoba on the floor that I didn't see because it just blended right in...
I love the color change that comes with padauk. I hate the bright orange state but the final darkened
stage is loaded with grain subtleties that you don't find in other woods. The sapwood areas and their
surrounds are some of the most desirable areas for me. I made 4'x3' sheets out of it and it worked very
well and has held up for 30 years very very well. The wood I got was about as hard as cherry and does
mar but not more than even maple. Beautiful wood.
I recently made a video restoring my dads 50's Stanley hand plane and wow this video makes me want to get some work in with it. Thank you for sharing your experience with the wood species.
I knew three of them. Thanks for taking time to share your list!
Years ago I made several projects with a stack of Lauan harvested from discarded kitchen cabinet drawer sides. The wood was softer than mahogany but easy to work and finished nicely, giving off a little sheen and character. I also used vermillion with the Lauan in a few projects, which still look good after 25 years. I can't remember how they were finished. I like to think that any wood, especially that which would otherwise be headed for the landfill or fireplace, can be useful for something!
can u pls explain the difference between lauan and narra? i thought narra was considered philippine mahogany. its a very hard wood used for furniture. its very rare and expensive. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pterocarpus_indicus
can u pls explain the difference between lauan and narra? i thought narra was considered philippine mahogany. its a very hard wood used for furniture. its very rare and expensive. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pterocarpus_indicus
can u pls explain the difference between lauan and narra? i thought narra was considered philippine mahogany. its a very hard wood used for furniture. its very rare and expensive. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pterocarpus_indicus
can u pls explain the difference between lauan and narra? i thought narra was considered philippine mahogany. its a very hard wood used for furniture. its very rare and expensive. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pterocarpus_indicus
can u pls explain the difference between lauan and narra? i thought narra was considered philippine mahogany. its a very hard wood used for furniture. its very rare and expensive. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pterocarpus_indicus
Yep it’s a pretty good list of what I normally use 😆 stinky alder, southern pine, Purple Heart, tulip poplar and retired folk love when I make their projects out of red oak!
Thanks Rob. I'm glad to have come across your channel. Been doing woodworking for eons but am still a hack. Always happy to learn from experts.
Great content as always. Thanks for your experienced opinion
Hey rob and the team watching from Birmingham uk and I’ve built your bench love you guys I’ve learned so much from watching rob!! ❤️👍🏻❤️👍🏻
Send us a pic of the workbench at RobCosman.com other stuff and we will post it to our customer gallery
Red oak… grew up in Oklahoma, red oak is still everywhere. I am so sick of it and when we were looking for a house here, after 23 years in MN, the options were depressing. But in our budget. I don’t have the $$ to remodel, and painted red oak looks like paint with a lot of trashy wood grain. Ever paint pine plywood? And pore filling would take forever. Glad you included it.
That's what I don't like.. pores not grain.
Interesting commentary on each one. Some I agree with you on, others I don't. To each his own. Thank you for sharing. Have a great day and stay safe.🙂🙂
Very informative. Thanks!
As a bespoke humidor builder I use a lot of Spanish cedar, and you are absolutely correct the taste is terrible.
also popular in classical guitar building - however, the reason it is popular in classical guitar making is classical guitars hail from Spain and they used what they had. Guitarists are nothing if not superstitious folk and do not allow changes to tradition even when it doesn't make sense (gibson headstocks, spanish cedar which doesn't even sound the best, using 9 volt batteries with diminished capacity, and old capacitors to name a few)
Great info, thanks
Came here to similarly say we used Spanish cedar for a project and yeah, that taste is awful. Have to wear masks and/or respirators at all times. And even then, I somehow got the taste in my mouth again anyway.
I think Spanish Cedar is in the mahogany group. I have a friend who is severely allergic to all mahogany, so I am not surprised Spanish Cedar gives unpleasant reactions.
I love the smell of Spanish cedar lol ❤ paduk is a incredible tone wood for guitars. Thanks for your input rob😊🙏
I've never seen an acoustic guitar made of paduk - now I'm intrigued.
You are lucky Spanish cedar doesn't have a negative effect on you like it does on me!
Rob, thanks for the tips.
Interesting and helpful. I will try to keep those in mind.
Glad it was helpful!
Bloodwood was the first wood that gave me a slight rash from the sawdust. The grain also made it difficult to plane without getting tear out.
Understatement of the year "Purpleheart doesn't plane well"!!! Love how it looks and have tried many projects with it but it is just a world class pain in the butt to get to the thickness you want without signif tear-out someplace on the surface! (I suppose I'd have a diff opinion if I had a drum sander).
Thanks for the interesting info. I have made furniture over the years and use what is readily available and affordable. I also like to find furniture that has quality to it and is cheap. For instance I found a Walnut desk with a 5' X 3' top. It stood in water so that the bottom portion of the sides was ruined. The rest was in great shape. I had some Sassafras (not the best wood, but it worked) to replace the damaged portion. I turned this $10 desk into an enjoyable computer desk.
Great video. Thanks, Rob!
Interesting how different each person's choice of wood is. I love working with cedar of all types. I love it mainly for the smell. And my second favorite is red oak. I love the grain and ability to make big changes with stain.
I did learn something here. I have always wanted to build something with purple heart because of the beautiful color. But I did not know it turned brown with age.
Yeah it’s a really boring brown color too. Too bad because it’s a beautiful purple
Use a UV protective finish
Only one that I disagree with is Jatoba. It's definitely hard to plane because it has interlocking grain and it's so dense, but it can be gorgeous. It has amazing color preservation - if you find a piece that's red or orangish it'll stay that way (unlike Padauk). Incredibly tough, crazy rot resistance makes it great even for outdoors stuff. It's really striking as an accent wood. I made a table out of walnut with bright red jatoba stripes and everyone asks what kind of wood it is, especially if they're a woodworker. I know this is heresy on this channel but . . . Just sand it. ;)
I used a piece of Jatoba for an electric guitar fretboard. Very hard with a nice reddish brown color. I’ll use it again mostly because I have enough to do two more fretboards. But first I have a piece of Wenge to use on what will be my first acoustic guitar build from scratch.
Informative. Thank you.
Thank you for your expertise
Poplar isn't necessarily a pretty wood, but it typically is clear and relatively easy to work. A rough-sawn 4/4 piece makes a great project board for learning to plane 4-square, chamfer, and quarter-round using hand planes, hand saws, and chisels only. Boards are generally readily available in the big-box DIY stores, and because they're free from knots for the most part, Poplar makes for great wood to use when building cabinets and similar projects when the final item will be painted rather than left in some natural state. I also use poplar for jaw-faces on my tail vise for my bench. It's strong enough to hold well when the metal jaw face is a little below grade, and still softer than most of the hardwoods I'd typically put in the vise. The jaw faces are reasonably cheap to replace when they get dinged up.
I can appreciate why high-end woodworkers don't like poplar, but for a working class hobbyist like myself poplar is such a great wood. Like you said, it's easy to work, it's inexpensive yet durable, and it takes pant better than any of the other local woods I've used. I don't have to feel guilty when I screw up a nice large piece because it's readily available and fast growing :) Also, I built a bunch shelves and finished with tung oil and it all aged to a nice soft yellowish hew.
I agree that poplar is a good choice for paint-grade projects, with one exception. Poplar is fine in places where it is held in place and can't warp or twist, but if you use it to make cabinet doors or other such things that are not fastened in place, an unacceptable percentage of them will twist. Soft maple is better for that, though harder.
I have worked with approximately three hardwoods, Poplar, Ash, and Jatoba. With that in mind, planing poplar feels like shaving butter compared to other woods I've worked with...
Living here in the pacific northwest (Western Washington) Cedar and Alder are real common. I have made many things out of both and do not have any problem with either. I agree with you about red oak, definitely overrated. I use it as sacrificial parts on many of my lathe projects. Thanks for the list, I enjoyed hearing your rational for your choices.
Great video Rob! Thanks 😊
Thanks Rob. Guess I'm not crazy as I have run into the same issues with some of these. Great analysis of each! Thanks
For handtool wood working I'd add Bocote. Has to be the most inconsistent grain of any wood - super hard to super soft and off in every direction.
If you ever had the opportunity to work with old growth longleaf pine, I’m sure you would love it. It’s hard, strong, straight grained, and beautiful with an oil finish. The heartwood is very resistant to decay, and makes beautiful furniture in my opinion.
Very dense as far as conifers go
Great Video. Thank you.
Thanks for the perspective. Ive got a couple boards of padauk that I was given and still need to find a use for. Perhaps it'll be something I don't much need to keep looking spectacular over time. Ive never worked Jatoba, but I can't say I'm all that interested. I don't mind alder or poplar when stained dark, but I wouldn't pick them for natural finish.
Indoors must really help the wood keeping color. Parents put purple heart flooring in 30 yrs ago and still looks gorgeous. I'd only use it for indoor pieces anyways.
Interesting view on southern yellow pine, as I have a complete kitchen made from it (commercially manufactured as I'm not at that level yet, or wasn't in 2015 when purchased) here in the UK & love it. Yes, it's hard but the little I've used has planed OK & is certainly stable.
I think the alder you have in the west of the Americas is different to the species here in the UK, which is quite highly regarded for furniture use.
Your content is great - thoroughly engaging & educational.
You guys get Southern yellow pine in the UK? It is not normally used for cabinets here. Most cheap cabinets here are red oak. We use Southern yellow pine here for structural lumber a lot because it's very strong, but it is not very straight. It's common to see floor joists made of Southern yellow pine in America.
Yellow pine is good for lumber I don't like it for furniture. I just think alder is not a pretty wood
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Have you ever run across Longleaf Pine? It was used extensively for lumber and naval stores. until it was nearly logged out by the early 1900s
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Isn't Alder also called poor man's cherry? It is liked for exterior doors for its weather resistance.
In the PNW, Red Alder (Alnus Rubra) has always been "prized" as firewood.😬 With low levels of resin, it doesn't foul flues and chimneys much. But its main virtue is the oils it contains has made it the number one fuel for smoking fish for thousands of years.
Abundant (cheap) and easy to work were the reasons it once upon a time became popular for furniture making.
New woodworker from Ontario here if only I could apprentice for someone like you and learn so much. Nice Apron friend.
Thank that was very informative, just got back into woodworking again been a long ten years
Thanks for the info and interesting reasons. I agree with Padauk but for different reasons (actually like the dark-chocolate brown color it changes to). What I don't like is, when using with other woods, its dust seems to settle into the grain and pores of the other wood and it's very hard to get rid of it.
And it will stain light woods if it gets on it
So agree with you about the paduk, I found my self falling into that trap more than once.
Trouble is that you learn about the colour change long after you have finished the project when there is nothing left to do about it.
Along with its horrible dust.
(I used only a breathing protection not taking in consideration its poisonous affect on the eyes), its definitely the worst choice of wood in my opinion.
Thank you Rob, great advice.
thanks for watching
Interesting video! Only worked with a few of the woods. I personally like Alder and use it a lot. I thought about buying a couple of the others you mentioned and will hold off. Now to see the woods you like!
Thanks for your thoughts on these wood types. One trick I learned to get the color back on Purple Heart and Padauk is to use Acetone after sanding and place in the sun for 20-30 min. Do this multiple times.
Thanks for sharing! Never tried that. How long does it last though?
Is acetone dissolving the tannins or something? I've never heard of such a process
I've never tried it on paduak.
I have used Purpleheart and African Paduk for knife handles. I'm not a wood worker, I'm a knife maker. So far, the knife handles I have made from these woods haven't changed color. I use abrasives to shape my handles, so the hardness of the wood doesn't matter as much to me. Over time, I have decided that knife sheaths that cover most of the knife handle are my favorite, so the knives I sell do not see much sunlight.
The finish you use may also have something to do with it. A good UV blocking epoxy finish will help protect the color for a very long time!
Also, it would appear that nobody ever told Rob the secret of properly treating purpleheart...
Burn it! Take a blowtorch and lightly char the surface, then sand it back to remove most of the char while leaving the surface nearly solid black... then finish and give it a great clear polish! (I sand to 1000 grit, then coat with boiled linseed oil followed by superglue while the oil is still wet...) a few extra coats of superglue add some additional protection to my pen blanks... then I sand again, wet sanding from 1000 grit to 8000 grit. Finally, I polish using Meguiar's Plast-X (also, you could use One-Step... it's the same stuff but costs more!) In bright light, the deep purple highlights in the wood will pop out and really amaze you... You could do this with your knife handles too!
@@KithinaSoulstriker Wow! Thank you for sharing your technique. I understand all of it except for the part about coating with superglue. Is there a video about the coating technique with superglue? I'm going to look for that. Thanks again.
@jeffsherk7056 just a standard pen turning finishing technique...
Apply the BLO with a lint free paper towel, and with the applicator still wet, apply the cyanoacrylate (superglue) to it and immediately apply to the work surface. The oil helps polymerization and cures the glue within 10 to 15 seconds, so working quickly is a must.
I have used this exact property to finish knife handles myself... (replaced multiple kitchen knife handles and finished them all this way.) It dries to the touch within seconds and can take a mirror shine... it's also reasonably easy to replace or repair while still being durable enough for everyday use. It's also waterproof, if applied properly and cared for, so the wood underneath won't be easily stained by sweat and other things. THIS WILL NOT BE DISHWASHER SAFE. The heat in a dishwasher can cause the wood to warp and can crack this finish, exposing the wood fibers to the moisture and ruining it.
There are many videos out there on CZcams about how to apply this finish, so feel free to browse around! "Pen turning" "superglue finish" I personally use superglue I buy from Harbor Freight (not the gel). It cures crystal clear, hard and polishes up very nicely!
Paduk/Purple heart change color due to UV, NOT oxidation, the host is just wrong about them and why your handles have not changed color.
I also make knife handles, paduk has changed color to a redish brown, the purple heart has not really changed color. To treat the purple heart I coat several times with BLO, then put the knife on top of my electric shop heater, (you can use an oven at about 160) and rub beeswax into the handle while it is hot, it gives a good tactile finish and makes it water resistant. The heat also turns the wood a much darker purple, with the gloss added by the beeswax it makes the handle really pop.
Great information.
Thanks Rob. That was an interesting video.
I actually agree with the entire list. I work a lot with soft curly maple because it’s easy on the blades, readily available and fairly cheap and has a decent amount of drama when finished.
I really like bigleaf maple too! I've made some pretty cool stuff with it, and like you said, it's relatively cheap and really pretty.
His list is essentially mine with 1 exception: Red Alder from the PNW is Pure WHITE. If his alder was red/brown this means it was never cut/dried correctly. As for working with alder... yes, it is garbage as it splinters and there are MUCH better woods out there.
Padauk is also an oily wood that can interfere with your glue up. I always wipe down padauk with acetone before glue up.
I love padauk. I’ve used it on many segmented turning projects. Lots of glue joints involved. Never once had any problems with bad glue joints. Maybe I’ve been lucky.
That is not my experience with padauk. Zero considerations given to gluing. PVA worked perfectly and has held up over 20 years later.
Thx Rob, i like your analysis and opinion, usefull tutorial👍
Rob, Recently, I retired with 38 years as a forest technician with a federal agency. I'm starting to get back into woodworking again. The south yellow pines are usually grouped into one category. There are several species in that group. Loblolly, Longleaf, Slash, and Shortleaf pines are grouped together. Longleaf pine is a fine wood to work with depending on what you're try to build such as dressers, tables, and desks. However, I wouldn't recommend it for building a comb back chair.
Hi Rob, I've heard that one of the unique qualities of Padauk is the fact that when it grays in the sun, it retains its grain pattern (unlike other species).
Every wood turns some shade of gray in the sun!
Sure, Padauk and Purple Heart don’t retain their bright colors as they age. However, friend of mine used PH as trim, along with maple and darker woods. It absolutely is still noticeably purple in contrast with the others, ten years on. When you use a variety of woods, the relative color tones remain distinguishable and these exotics still stand out. OTOH, if you want an orange or purple chair, then make it out of pine and paint it.
Purple heart has become common in wooden boat building, especially for the more massive pieces like keel and deadwood and stem. Rot resistance, dimensional stability, and workability are its favored features.
Friend of mine has an instrument of purple heart thats 20 years old and its color has only gotten better. i have one a year old and i can say the same for mine. not sure what hes on about aside from it being a bitch to work with.
Awesome videos as always. I’ve been to exotic woods in Burlington twice. Picked up some snakewood and Verawood there. The Verawood had an amazing aroma to it
I’ve purchased there as well and it’s sometimes referred to as “Erotic Woods”.
I love that your opinions have reasons
Also love that you're not telling *us* to have *your* opinion :)
How could you NOT mention the sap/resin in Southern Yellow Pine. That's what I hate about it! However, just harvested 150 acres of 30yr old SYP and i do like the check. 😅
Good point I should have mention the sap
Quick side note on sap in SYP - read once about an architect using it it walls where he wanted it to soak up heat during the day and release it at night. Apparently the sap made that more effective.
So interesting seeing the contrast between desirable species for furniture and musical instruments (which is what I make). Right off the bat, padauk. Yes it loses it's colour, but in general it is straight, even grained, and it is light weight compared to some of the more exotic rosewoods. It works great for the bridges on some of the finest classical guitars in the world and as a back and sides it has similar tone to rosewoods which are much more expensive and harder to obtain. Spanish cedar, the absolute preferred wood for the necks of flamenco guitars. It can be hard to carve because of it's sort of furry grain structure. but it is light and resonant and fairly stable in service. Alder! one of the great electric guitar woods. It's got good weight and machines extremely well. So many of your favourite songs were probably recording using a fender strat or similar guitar made from alder. So I guess "Not to use in woodworking projects" might depend a lot on what the project is. Also...not being critical. i like your video. it's horses for courses.
Good point re: purpose; Jatoba is good for flooring, precisely because it's so hard, and poplar is excellent value for painted furniture; it stays straight and it finishes very smooth, and the colour variation doesn't matter under the paint!
Would you know what one could use Paulownia and/or Catalpa for in musical instruments? I know Paulownia is used in Far Eastern string instrument making, but I struggle to figure out for what, as it's not very strong (it breaks along the grain) or hard (it dents with a fingernail), even though it's very light and apparently rot-resistant.
Wow you’re an encyclopedia of knowledge thank you I def subscribed
Great video and I agree with the comments (I will confess to being bummed to hear your experience with Padauk over time; I just made a box as a gift from Curly Maple and Padauk; beautiful for now but sounds like like time may be my enemy). I’d like to see a follow-on video on your 10 FAVORITE woods as opposed to least favorite. Thanks!
I have probably used red oak more than any other wood, though mostly for budgetary reasons. I rather like the look of it myself, but I can't deny that it is very splinter prone. Hard to plane a table top smooth without some spots with major tear out.
I found that red oak stains very well. I found it pretty hard to mess up with gel stain.
Agreed. Where I am, it's cheaper than poplar, aspen, or any other woods in the lumber yard. Even quartersawn is relatively cheap, and that's one of the prettiest woods i know. But I like Arts & Crafts furniture, and I'm not against staining. I think most professionals shun stains.
@@MixingGBPI've used gel, water, and oil based stains. With its own grain, it takes everything pretty well. Even paint.
A wood that I’ve grown to love is sassafras. At least in central Ohio it’s one of the absolute cheapest hardwoods you can get. It can be a pain to machine because of the splintering, but well worth it for the grain pattern. It’s similar to ash or chestnut, but is darker than both, it’s lightweight, and smells great while machining. Although I think the dust can be a skin irritant to some people
Funny, had lots of tear out with fir, but not red oak. It’s just hard as hell on my tools. But then I’ve never planed it, just sawed and sanded, so maybe that’s why. (?)
I’ve also never finished it with anything but Watco Danish oil in various colors, always does a good job and brings out whatever grain there is pretty well.
I think it’s cool to put a lot of shellac on red oak. It has a lot of depth and a shimmering effect in my opinion.
My guy, Shellac looks good on everything. It's existence is proof God loves wood workers.
Oil based over water based? No problem, Shellac it first. Water based over oil based? No problem! Shellac it first!
@@B_Van_Glorious funny I love it. can it also be used over HP topcoat and under hide glue for a good hold?
@@shofarsogood7504 I would scrap the Shellac off before hide glue, mainly because I assume the hide glue has a stronger hold mechanically than Shellac does = the difference between a sealer and an adhesive.
My favorite use of Shellac is when I want to build up lacquer. Couple coats of lacquer, 0000 sand, couple coats of shellac, 0000 sand, couple coats of lacquer, 0000 sand, couple coats of shellac, 0000 polish
Thank you Rob! This is such great information. In my own shop, I’ll keep using poplar for internal pieces (I have lots of it and it’s relatively cheap). I use it for structure where I need some. I completely agree with your opinion on red oak. Just don’t like it. The rest you went through I’ve not used or used very little, so I’ll trust your opinion there. Thank you so much for taking the time to make this video.
I use poplar for secondary wood too, but not for primary.
Interesting video, Brother. Beautiful tool cabinets behind you and, as a 4th generation carpenter who's made many handmade reproductions over nearly 50 years, I admire your prowess with a jack plane! A well tuned plane is a beautiful thing. Your comments on the different qualities, or lack of, in different species of wood are insightful, not that I agree with all. I am quite fond of Poplar, as a secondary wood and especially in interior trim and casework. Living in the S.E. corner of the Vollunteer State, we grow some really nice Poplars around here and is one of my favorite woods. I make a fair amount of custom trim, a lot of outdated stuff that is no longer in production, and Poplar is usually my first choice. Recently I made several hundred feet of trim for the facia and soffit of an Antebellum home on Signal Mt. above Chattanooga, TN. It works very nicely as bent wood in curved jambs for doors and arched windows. As a custom gun stock maker, my first choice is Black Walnut and we grow a lot of that here, as well. Now, that is one stinky wood! But, the workability, longevity, and absolute beauty of it is worth donning a mask or, weather permitting, turning on a fan.
Great video as always Rob.
My absolute favorite wood is waterfall Bubinga. And from there it’s walnut, especially the figured variety, curly or fiddleback maple, birdseye maple, then cherry. I’m also fond of Osage orange. There are a few others as well.
Unfortunately waterfall Bubinga is out of my price range these days. Maybe as an accent piece or for a very small project…
I have 8/4 board of Waterfall Bubinga and some 4/4 as well - gorgeous stuff. I mostly enjoy looking at it, lol. Someday I'll make something with it.
I have to agree on Red Oak - water runs right through it and it moves like crazy with seasonal moisture change. It’s course - IMHO - best as firewood. Popular is fine as paint grade interior building trim if you want painted trim!
Agreed
Is it still really bad if sealed with polyurethane all around?
My problem with red oak is it's everywhere. You can spot it a mile away and it looks cheap because of its popularity. I want my furniture to stand out, not look like a Denny's interior.
@@RobCosmanWoodworking I don't know, I just did a whole kitchen with rift red oak. Of course it was not much woodworking more like panel processing, but still it looks good and customer was happy. I saved a lot of money not using white oak, I've noticed with the high demand for white that it's hard to find good quality now. The grain is hard to finish with red oak however.
So glad you share my distaste for red oak, it’s all that’s left in big box stores (along with poplar).
Interesting to hear a different perspective on these woods. As someone who at least tries to build guitars, I love Paduk, Alder, tulip poplar, mahogany and purple heart... that said, I also am not a fan of how the color of these woods gets lost over time - but still makes for beautiful guitars. Thanks Rob
I have over 100 different woods in my intarsia work, and I agree with Rob nearly 100%.
Spanish cedar is awful to sand; it would find its way through my professionally fitter n95.
My favorite is Brazilian tulipwood; the best wood fragrance I’ve experienced.
I like a lot of the really pretty/colorful woods (Purple Heart, red heart, pink ivory, padauk) but they would change color the all the colors of the “ugly tree”.
Great video, Rob!
Looks like we both learned the hard way
I am always trying to avoid rare woods who harvesting is depleting and doing damage that is hard to recover from. If you could address that problem I'm sure many would be very interested. Thanks! (and interesting that you dislike the woods that are in my locale...)
Yep. I have quit tropical woods almost entirely, except for some from plantations. The U.S and Canada produce almost everything I use.
@@wdtaut5650 likewise
You can buy a good deal of the exotics that are certified as sustainable. The U.S. is very serious about that…
Very Interesting-a few woods that I never even heard of. I am however very familiar with red oak-which make a beautiful floor.
Thanks for the heads up on Jacoba. I bought a few board feet of it with the intention of using it on small projects. Thanks for letting me know that it is such a bear to work with.
Purpleheart was already on my do not use list. Lauan has been on the surface of cheap plywood that I have used for convenience in the shop with no intention of it ever being in something that will leave my shop.
One of my least favorite woods is Sapele. I have made some large furniture with it, and it looks gorgeous. My problem is with any splinters I may get while handling the wood. I would get a splinter, and use a tweezer to remove it from the flesh. A couple of weeks later, the area in which the splinter occurred would become annoying, and I would have to dig down to get the little bit that didn’t come out with the tweezer. After another two weeks, when I was getting ready to go to a surgeon to see if any of my flesh needed to be removed, I was able to tease the last little bit of this horrible splinter. (This sequence of events has happened more than once!) I am very careful when handling Sapele, having learned my lesson. (I still have 10 board feet of Sapele in my lumber rack patiently waiting for me to develop Alzheimers.)
I've got to say red oak most definitely has it's place. Yes very coarae grained. I like the look of that. Quite strong, not terrible to work with, and most importantly, affordable and available. Stain it or fume it bit darker than the ubiquitois 90s 'golden oak' or keep it light with a non yellowong water based finish so it doesnt look dated, or at least lols 70s vintage and not 90s old and tireee and its very nice.
You're right, but I still avoid it as much as I can. The smell, the look, and (for me anyway) its tendency to tear out when planed makes it one of my least favorite woods. I can't afford English Brown Oak, and even White Oak is expensive, but it;s worth it.
I’m surprised you didn’t mention ipe. It’s common in the “exotic wood stores”, and it’s very popular among people building decks, because of the rot resistance and the fact that it’s very pretty for a while. But then it changes color, and people keep trying to chase that high, so it’s probably like crack or heroin. What a sad story. There are also people who try to use it for traditional woodworking, only to find that it’s destroying their tool sharpness in short order, and giving them awful allergic reactions. But the exotic wood stores keep selling it.
I’m happy that it has flown under your radar. But the warning should still exist. People who are about to breathe, dispute this? :^)
@declanfaber, Yes the withdrawal from the high after a nice wood turns brown is really hard to take. Ipe is also really heavy and that can be a problem sometimes. lol
I'm enjoying ipe for tool stock, handles and the like, especially fine tools used outdoors.
It's extremely uniform and dense, machines very well provided you're willing to resharpen frequently, takes simple oil finishes very well, and is decay resistant. I'm surprised to report that it sands very well also. It makes no sense to me that anyone would use it for decking, any more than using ebony.
@@starfishsystems Ipe is an option with many deck builders in the US. It originates from South America, and down there it’s allegedly common for entire seaside structures (docks, wharfs etc) to be built out of it. It has its place, I suppose.
I'm blown away by how nice your shop looks.
As for your list of woods... it's funny to hear your reasoning and how it contrasts to woods I use as a guitar builder. Case in point is a Jatoba fret board I recently made. All I can say about it is "WOW". Another example is Alder, which has been a standard tone wood for many decades. And I have a half complete Tulip Tree (not a poplar) guitar built - Tulip Tree has an amazing tap tone.
thanks for sharing! i’d put ipe on that list for those outdoor furniture guys
Rob, you'll always get a thumbs up from me - thank you for all that you do for the woodworking community.
HOWEVER, I'm sure I'm not the only one that recognized some of their favorite wood species in this video.
Poplar?! Alder?! Are you nuts? What do you think we are building with!
Jokes aside, maybe someone can get some ideas from my choices - or at least relate.
Jatoba - great for knife scales or gun grips.
Poplar and Alder - great for Japanese blade scabbards and handle (tsuka). Forgiving woods that cut and glue up easily. They also can be stained to look like mahogany. Most furniture makers have a TON of these woods for carcass builds/upholstered furniture frames/etc. SIDE NOTE: poplar is "tonal" - it's great for traditional woodwinds such as fifes and piccolos. Poplar is also a great choice for "Taiko drumsticks" (Bachi). Maple is another "tonal" wood.
Red oak - if you're good with stains - you can create magic with red oak. Seriously, you can go from "whitewash" to "natural" to "antique" to just...anything really. The open pores in Red oak give you options that you just can't get with other woods. You can literally take an offcut of red oak, put it in a glass of water and blow bubbles. The opposite of this would be hard maple - impossible to stain in my opinion.
Laun - can't build a skiff or sail pram these days without it.
Southern yellow pine - how many of our workbenches are built with this?!!! I can understand not using it for HEIRLOOM FURNITURE but run of the mill woodworking projects? - It'll make a fine stool, bench, shop furniture, jigs, etc.
I honestly thought this video was him saying he doesn't like certain woods but with very little reason why. He starts talking about other woods during each wood and was all over the place.
@@cchavezjr7 Obviously, a lot of us can respect someone having a different point of view - especially if that someone makes fine furniture. However, a lot of us out here sure have a different point of view on this one!
@@kodoan411 I definitely understand some loving woods other hates. My problem is he really doesn't explain much of WHY he doesn't like the woods. The pine one was really odd. He ended up talking about SYP and same with some other species. This video just felt weird. He was just running a plane over the wood while talking and it was like there was no planning other than him having a piece of wood ready for each one.
Completely disrespect anyone that calls you out for speaking your mind. All good points and things to keep in mind. Thank you for sharing!
Yes, sorry I just found that post and am about to watch it. Thanks
Thank you for the video and thank everyone else for the comments!!!!! Didn’t read them all, but I read a lot and I’ll probably come back for more later……. Just interesting!!!!!
Thanks again everyone
My favorite wood by far is Olive Wood, but it gets bought up by turners so fast they normally don't even cut boards out of it, just cookies.
I love the smell of olivewood. Sorry, I'm one of those turners 🙂
I know its super hard to find any decent size Olive to build with
I stopped and picked up a broken table left on the side of the road. It had 2 1/2 inch square legs. Imagine my surprise when I scraped off the brown finish to find olive wood ! 😃🎉
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Yeah same is true for Clairo walnut. I figure all the money slab dining table people have contributed to its near extinction. They deserve what they get now, some crappie epoxy live edge whatever.
My experience with Padauk is different.
I just checked some pieces i made more than 7 years ago.Coated in Danish oil twice...they are lovely red orange.A bit darker but certainly not "ugly brown".
Toxic it is though, protection required.
I turned a Purple Heart pedestal bowl for a friend, turned out spectacular. I finished it on a Thursday and was going to give it to them at a party on Saturday. When I went to get it from my shop, I was crushed when I saw my beautiful purple bowl had turned plain Jane brown. I didn’t want to take it to the party. But I was proud of my work so I threw it in a brow paper bag and went to the party. I was shocked when my friend pulled it out of the bag and the bowl had turned back to purple. Now all of my projects are delivered in or wrapped in brown paper bags. Oh and I haven’t used Purple Heart since.
i made an instrument from it because a friend i have had been gifted one and i loved it. his was 20 years old and was a little brown but only in an enriched purple kind of way. my instrument is a year old now and still has an incredible pigment. time is usually what enriches the color in my experience as the brown is only a result of fresh scarring. Im not sure whats making yall have brown purpleheart after its had its necessary light exposure. hes right about hard to plane tho because its a bitch to work with.
that was lovely, thanks - could have done with more moving in close to the wood itself I thought, but I think the personal aspect outweighs the technical in this vid
I know this is pretty blasphemous in these parts, but in the kitchen industry solid colours are in right now. Almost no one is making kitchen doors out of actual wood, hasn't been in style for years and the cost has gone way up as of late. But Poplar is a really good wood for priming and painting, if your doing base board or crown work its good for that and sure beets the MDF junk you get at the big box stores.
If its being painted, Id prefer mdf for trim.
I concur. I'm in the kitchen industry and I have seen the gradual shift from stained wood to mostly painted mdf. Even our cabinet doors are cnc routered mdf and painted, though I have to say for crown moulding we use maple for painted jobs.
I dont paint or stain wood in my woodwork. I want the natural beauty of the wood to come out, Poplar doesn't have much beauty in my opinion.
Do you have a video on wood you like?
Great videos
I have used red oak in a butcher block style for table tops with much more plain aprons and legs to good effect. I have even glued up some and turned some large bowls from that glue-up. Now, would I really want to use it for a bowl to hold something liquid - not really. Soaks right through, but the color and hardness appears to work for "bench-style" table tops. With the rest, I agree with most. Thanks for the information and video. Always a learning point with you.