Boeing 733 & Lockheed L-2000 SST - 1965
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- čas přidán 15. 03. 2014
- Nice news report filmed at Ames Research Center, Moffett field, Sunnyvale, CA. 1/5 scale models of both the Boeing 733, and Lockheed's L-2000. Also, great footage of the Boeing 707 prototype, "Dash 80" at NASA Langley! That special time when we were all waiting for the SSTs to arrive. From the Rick Prelinger Archives. Be sure to check my channel for the best in VINTAGE & RARE airliner videos!
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I love this optimistic attitude everyone has. We need more of that.
agreed
a well informed, educated , or just a really informed interview.that's refreshing. A different world.
It was all so... *literate*. Even when Fitch asked basic questions for the benefit of the audience, it wasn't dumbed down.
+RonJohn63 I know, I couldn't understand what they were talking about. They need to slow it down some.
Excellent profile pic, sir.
I just picked up an old book "Pioneers of Flight" my grandparents gave me. It was published in 1968 and the 733 was mentioned in it as was the Concorde which was undergoing testing at that time. Searched google and found this great video. Thank you for posting!
Just look at that flight simulator in the end! Photorealism to the max, in 1965 :)
James Doolittle flew the Boeing SST simulator in Seattle and reported that the plane flew wonderfully. Pretty amazing!
I forgot to add, Boeing's simulator had a night landing condition into KSEA and in order to create those conditions they built a model of the topography and covered it in black cloth. Then they used ball bearings and a single light source to simulate lights in buildings in the area. I always thought that was a great solution.
That simulator device with the model of the landscape was absolutely impressive.
HACIA AÑOS QUE NO VEIA UN REPORTAJE TAN ANTIGUO. SALUDOS DESDE GUAYAQUIL ECUADOR EN LA ERA DEL COVID 19 MARZO 15 DEL 2021
The Boeing Company just dismantled their hypersonic wind tunnel on East Marginal Way. It was built in 1955 and hadn't been used in twenty years. I used to enjoy looking at it, inside and out.
How well I remember. "The last person to leave Seattle, please turn out the lights."
Awarding the program to Boeing wasn't too good for Lockheed, either. They soon skirted on the edge of bankruptcy, and were saved by loan guarantees approved by the U.S. Congress.
And Seattle didn't disappear, either.
MrShobar The SST wasn't what hurt Lockheed, the poorly designed C-5 and problems with the L-1011 development drove the company in the red forcing them to ask for the loan.
Yes. The problem with the L-1011 program was that Rolls Royce went into bankruptcy due to the huge developmental costs of the RB211 engine. Lockheed thus had an airframe, but no engine.
Scott Haskin The problem with the L-1011 wasn't the plane, it was the jet engines or the lack of. Rolls Royce went into bankruptcy and couldn't supply any.
Hence, it was the L-10 issues and not SST that hurt Lockheed....incidently, the RB211 is probably the most reliable jet engine today thanks to the L10
Great news!! By 1974, those old subsonic airliners will be a thing of the past! No more weather delays! You'll fly right over the top of it! No more delayed or missed connections! You'll fly nonstop to damn near everywhere! Baby, by the mid-70s, we'll be planning for a 2 hour flight from LA to London on a Delta Scramjet! Right? Hello? Can anybody hear me?
Dave Thompson no, who really cares?
"We have been using two of our En-Aye-Essay pilots" THAT IS INSANE. Until now I've never heard Nasa pronounced that way before.
yan-Deriction It's funny how many different ways there are to pronounce "NASA".
One of my best buddies still pronounces it as one would, "Nassau", even though I've told him that is no longer the preferred way.
+yan-Deriction He may have referred to it by the letters, "N-A-S-A", because it had not been called that for very long at that point. Until 1958 it was NACA, the National Advisory Committee for Aeronautics.
In other words , "NASA" isn't really a word in case you didn't know.
"Dash Eighty" (B707 prototype) may have been the most heavily modified aircraft of all time.
I might have to put my vote in for the 767-200 prototype with the Airborne Optical Adjunct. (AOA)
22:22 that simulator is genius! I wonder how long it would take to build one like that today...
The Boeing design won the competition with a swing-wing design. After winning the competition, they retreated to a fixed-wing design, much like Lockheed originally proposed. The prototype was once on public display at the Boeing Developmental Center on East Marginal Way in Seattle. This was the first (and last) commercial airplane design the U.S. Government (through the FAA) ever footed the developmental costs for.
Not "prototype". A mock-up. Sorry.
Bizarre that something so advanced as an SST is shown in a black and white documentary!
It breaks my heart that we don't have the Concorde or any SST aircraft in the air. What a huge faceplant for humankind.
Folks should remember..."what the mind can conceive, man can achieve".
"...And possibly not afford to pay for…".
MrShobar
Build a better mouse trap, and the world will beat a path to your door.
It'll get paid for.
I get what you mean. Seems we have taken a step backward! Howeverf you flew the Concorde.. you would understand why passengers would rather give up 3 hours or so to have all the creature comforts of a wide body jet with fold down delux biz and first class. Plus if you time your departure right.. you wake up rested upon arrival at your destination ready for a full day of business. The supersonic flights will make a difference when they have the range to go to Asia Pacific form N. America / Eurozone. And can do it without the sardine can Concorde interior. just my 2 cents. :)
supersonic travel, black and white film. my oh my how things were different way back then...
What gem!!!! I thought i watched all the science reporters!!!
RIP THE LEGEND JOHN FITCH
Fly by wire back in 1965 ? 18:00
38911bytefree Earlier than that.
This will be a big one as well as a fast one. Brilliant!!
Love it!
Have you ever seen the clip with JFK cussing a fit about Juan Tripp of Pan Am,for a newspaper article claiming Pan Am had ordered a lot of Concord aircraft when they were finished on the production line? it's very entertaining to think with the space program going on,and Lockheed trying to get a supersonic aircraft into production,and all of the problems the american project encountered,only to be lost all together.Sad story but true...
The mock up looks so much like the B1-B bomber now in service.
2:52 Lucky dogs, look at that power pole. That bottom wire looks a lot like fiber optic broadband internet.
Is the soundtrack music for real?
I think it failed because they tried mach 3 instead of staying at mach 2
>>----------------------------> What? No political speak mixed with science back then? No negative tone about hurting the environment and building off the oppressed labor force? ...oh I forgot, that came later on, in a few years, when everything started to go to h3ll in a hand basket in the US. Thanks for uploading this film. We need to always be reminded what REAL R&D looks like! ...uh.... except for that music!
+surearrow That was so old school. Today we do science right, like climate science, you are either a believer or a denier. Doing science like the World Wrestling Federation (or a religious cult) is so much more modern and enlightened, you are either a hero or a villain depending on your opinion. So much more "progressive."
*****
No, you're surmising is correct. The SST was cancelled by politicians and sissys ( one in the same, really) whining about noise, pollution and sonic booms causing earthquakes. The was just noise to hide the facts. Some of us were alive during those times and we remember.
Wesley Peck
*****
LOL. You almost had me there.
The Ames Laboratory wind tunnel is still the largest in the world.
omg this flight simulator
damn, it's genius to steer a camera over a map
I wish we had flight simulators like that today
why?!
Aside from computer control we haven't made any giant leaps in air travel since the 70s. Before that tech leaps were made every 10 years. Now were stuck with slow buses to get from point to point.
+MontrealMan1970 think before you speak mate
many new materials are being developed and applied in aviation. aircrafts now are lighter, quieter, flight longer distance, use less fuel, flight higher and most of all safer. compare that to the 70s
+MontrealMan1970 Not true. A current modern jet is much quieter, flies longer using less fuel, pollutes less and most of all, is about 100 times safer than the jets of 50 years ago.
That's normal design evolution, not a giant leap forward. Safer? Do you mean more reliably? I agree. Better human survivability, the facts don't support that.
Not sure what "facts" you read, but it is a fact that fewer jets crash today than they did 50 years ago with many, many more planes in the air. I suppose if a jet hits a mountain at 600 mph, no one will survive, but the chances are so slim, it is almost negligible.
Has very little to do with the technology, more like politics, and inefficiencies.
8:24 Not to improve visibility, but to provide visibility !
Wow. Computers!
Great video. Thanks for posting it. But after seeing some of the comments... People are so downright stupid these days they think this is technical. This IS dumbed down for a common audience.
One of the XB70 aircraft crashed and killed NASA's chief test pilot, Joe Walker, among others. Walker had a midair collision with the XB70.
If you want a great trip, visit the US Air Force museum in Dayton OH, they have the first XB-70 (AV-1) there, very cool to see! You can walk right under it! AND the museum is FREE!!
Kennedy announced that the US would develop a larger, faster (of course) SST aircraft.When this was shelved they were so jealous that they at first refused to let Concorde to land there.
+Hunter Ziegelmann It only killed people because it was hit by another airplane.
+Hunter Ziegelmann The XB-70 was canceled by JFK because we were simultaneously developing ballistic missiles. The missiles were considered more effective and more survivable and we couldn't afford both systems. It was probably the right decision.
***** In fact only one XB-70 crew member died, the other survived.
+kevin heming Gee, let me guess, your a Brit? LOL. Why would America be jealous when it had already designed and produced far more advanced and far faster planes like the SR-71 and the XB-70?
Who told Mr. MIT that it was OK to walk on the wing of that test aircraft?
MrShobar If it could not stand up to the light weight of a person, it would not be approved to fly. The forces at supersonic are much bigger.
Like the wide mouth frog,don't see many of those around
Have you ever seen the clip with JFK cussing a fit about Juan Tripp of Pan Am,for a newspaper article claiming Pan Am had ordered a lot of Concord aircraft when they were finished on the production line? it's very entertaining to think with the space program going on,and Lockheed trying to get a supersonic aircraft into production,and all of the problems the american project encountered,only to be lost all together.Sad story...
at c.10.30 he says bigger engines reduce SST noise. Hmmm
To increase thrust you can move more air through a larger engine or less air though a smaller engine, but faster. Pushing it through faster make more noise. That's why airliners have gone to such large engines, they're putting through a lot more air mass to get more thrust. But because it doesn't have to go through really fast, it's quieter.
2022
sooo.. by the time this was even started Concorde was already developed and ready to fly .. the Russians knew that and rushed the concordski to beat them in the air and we know how that all turned out for them at the air show.. and then the Americans typically piped up and said we will build it to carry more.. do it faster and in the end that fizzled out like a wet fart. And then have the gaule to say oh its so noisy we dont want it landing in the US in an embarrasing show of we cant do it so we dont want others seeing it or rubbing in our faces. The Brits and the French nailed it with Concorde.
Grumpy OldMan yeah, i see Concordes flying all the time. Saw one in Paris one day.........at a museum.
The Concorde flew regular routes to JFK and Dulles...which is in the USA.
One interesting problem: Russia had most of the world's titanium. Building the Blackbird required some strange maneuvering to buy the raw materials from Russia in the middle of the Cold War. Sure, they could get it, and they could get enough to build a few special aircraft. But how on earth did they intend to put this into series production, if titanium was so expensive and hard to get? I doubt anyone ever intended to mass produce these.
It was simply a research program, at taxpayer expense, delivering massive benefit in terms of our aerospace technology but delivering no viable product. One could argue that programs like this are a major reason we made it to the top of the aerospace game, because they paid for research that couldn't have turned a direct, immediate profit. The private sector gets around to it, but if you subsidize some research, the involved companies get the new technology a few years sooner, which gives them a jump on the market, which improves the economy, which comes back at tax time. Not a bad investment.
According to Wiki, "Major deposits of titanium minerals are found in Australia, Canada, India, Norway, South Africa, Ukraine, and the United States."
@Tommy Tuttle. Sounds like you went to the Soviet school of Social Engineering and business. Try to remember, the USSR went broke, morally, ethically, and financially.
Concord
This video was so informative. Anything produced today would be completely dumbed down and filled with flashy transitions and overly optimistic background music. Can't we go back?
Who else thinks there soo cool boy and likes aitplanes
1:55 I'm surprised that people knew of the YF-12A. Maybe because it was AF instead of CIA?
+RonJohn63 The YF-12A was the experimental model that eventually became the SR-71. It was initially meant to be a fast attack fighter for the AF.
Jeff Baviera _It was initially meant to be a fast attack fighter for the AF._
Right, since I did write "Maybe because it was AF instead of CIA?"
My point was that I'm surprised it wasn't Classified.
+RonJohn63 I still have a copy of National Geographic magazine from September 1965 that had a long feature article on the U.S. Air Force, with a sub-article on the YF-12A and SR-71. It seems like they kept information classified that should have been classified, and were open about information that could be responsibly shared with the public. A bit of a contrast with the modern habit of using national security and secrecy as an excuse for covering up political corruption.
French concord was the winner...
Winner of what?
AND MAN FLEW FASTER THAN THE SPEED OF SOUND, for decades on the Aerospatiale "CONCORDE" (Air France & British Airways) while american planes manufacturers never match it!
...and for a very good reason. The same reason it eventually died. It was never practical, and cost far too much money to run and maintain. It wasn't because American plane manufacturers couldn't do it (obviously). Only the rich could afford to fly on a Supersonic plane.
SkylineToTheSeaAndMe LMAO......Always remember!
When unsure of the facts better to keep your mouth shot!
@SkylineToTheSeaAndMe. Not true. The SST was cancelled by politicians and sissys ( one in the same, really) whining about noise, pollution and sonic booms causing earthquakes. Some of us were alive during those times and we remember.
Concorde made of aluminium? No wonder...
Dr. Anderson is no pilot. He is all over the approach path with that simulator.
How to build a supersonic transport in USA
You don’t
With the death of JFK also came the death of the SST, as well as America.
y
bcuz
I'm the 100th liker :D
these folks are all dead
like we will all be pretty soon. progress is a scam. just another form of religion
Some may still alive
Ah, the days of hope, innovation and inspiration! I remember them well.
Oh, look at that... 22:19 that's how they faked the Lunar fly-by footage. Oops.
new york to london in minutes right i bet they thought we would eat pill foods too
+obi wan , He didn't say it properly. the notion of Trans-Atlantic flight in minutes applies to flying from London to New York not the other way around. Basically if you take of from London at 7 am in a Concord you'll arrive in New York at around 7:15 am local time, so theoretically your flight duration will be 15 minutes.
+Aryajet That's absolutely true. I flew Air France Concorde way back in the halcyon days - had lunch in Paris, and then breakfast in New York. Literally, the day began all over again. In a strange sort of way, it assisted in my understanding of the theory of relativity.
the speed of light
or, "folding space"...
america tried to make their own concorde but failed
Didn't fail, rather killed by gov. regulations.
If it wasn't for the tree huggers we would have a US SST flying now; in fact the titanium billets were already ordered for the first prototypes when congress cancelled funding.
Bub, it wasn't the "tree huggers" as much as it was the conservitards who didn't want to fork out the money for it. Anything that can't be monetized, profitized, or privatized gets vigorous opposition from conservitards. Because they can't force the government to make everyone else pay for it while getting Brabazonian tax cuts. You need to read some real sources, and stay away from RT, Breitbart, and Faux News...
Lies lies, then nothing!!!
Have you ever seen the clip with JFK cussing a fit about Juan Tripp of Pan Am,for a newspaper article claiming Pan Am had ordered a lot of Concord aircraft when they were finished on the production line? it's very entertaining to think with the space program going on,and Lockheed trying to get a supersonic aircraft into production,and all of the problems the american project encountered,only to be lost all together.Sad story but true...
Have you ever seen the clip with JFK cussing a fit about Juan Tripp of Pan Am,for a newspaper article claiming Pan Am had ordered a lot of Concord aircraft when they were finished on the production line? it's very entertaining to think with the space program going on,and Lockheed trying to get a supersonic aircraft into production,and all of the problems the american project encountered,only to be lost all together.Sad story...
Have you ever seen the clip with JFK cussing a fit about Juan Tripp of Pan Am,for a newspaper article claiming Pan Am had ordered a lot of Concord aircraft when they were finished on the production line? it's very entertaining to think with the space program going on,and Lockheed trying to get a supersonic aircraft into production,and all of the problems the american project encountered,only to be lost all together.Sad story but true...