Setting the AV Receiver Crossover, 80Hz?
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- čas přidán 2. 05. 2019
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Let's talk speaker size, and setting the proper crossovers for best integration. Should you set your main speakers are large or small? Is using a spec sheet accurate to determine this? What is LFE? All will be discussed and more in this live stream event.
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Hey Gene, don't lose Matt. Love these discussions!
This is awesome seeing you & Matt, looking forward to seeing you both on all videos! Love it!
Okay, I love that you guys are putting great info out there for the more advanced audio video enthusiasts out there. I hope to be able to understand you in three or five years. In the meantime, as a favor to those of us who are still crawling up from the Quadrophonic days, to basic 5.1 with a mix of cheap new, and mix matched old stuff, such as my Sony DH790 I got at BB, because it was so cheap my wife let me buy it, hooked up with leftover Pioneer HTIAB, front, center, and rears, running as center, rears, side and the mains are some big RCA ported three ways with 12" woofers, 4" mids, and some kinda tweeters. The sub is a Pioneer 8" passive sub that is wired up to pass through the output from the Receiver through the sub, and then to the speakers. I'm sure you would have bad dreams from looking at it, and the room it's in is about as bad as it gets. But hey, it's pretty far down the budget priority, like last on the list, but I am trying to improve it. I have experimented with tilting my spare set of surrounds up as Atmos bouncies and set up as Atmos speakers with mixed results. So, I guess what I'm saying is, could you please do one of these for the largest group of people who are trying to kludge together an AV system with basic stuff mixed with older stuff.
So, the main thing I got from this is if you want Atmos speakers, then knock holes in the ceiling, and if you aren't willing to do that, then, you are better off with an extra pair of surrounds, than fake Atmos. 😔, I knew it, I shoulda been born rich instead of good looking. Better luck next time.
Hey bud, I'm kind of where you are in terms of a budget system being a necessity. I just can't justify spending $1000's on brand new state of the art speakers. But I'll give ya 2 pieces of advice that might be particularly helpful for ya. 1st off, a good receiver can help out mediocre speakers tremendously. 2nd, don't worry about the atmos setup. You can get a decent/newer receiver and run a 7.1 or 7.2 setup (using rears) that will blow your mind and you really don't have to spend much to do it. Lastly, check pawn shops for incredible deals on used speakers! As long as you can verify the drivers are good before you buy, you can get absolutely unbelievable prices on good gear because pawn shops get inundated with excessive used speaker inventory. No joke, I've looked up the msrp on my speaker setup and it's well over $6500+ and I've probably paid no more than $600 bucks just upgrading here and there over the years. It's not nearly as important as you might think to have matching brands or specs. It might not be ideal aesthetically, but placement and a good receiver with room eq can make budget speakers sound incredible these days.
Me too! 👍
How could I have missed this episode! It's pure gold for me, as I've been toying with setting up a 7.1 of "35hz" towers. I think I was moving that week, and sadly the towers are still in storage, but my knowledge grows greater everyday! Thanks to you et al.
everyone recommends bass management and crossovers and setting speakers to SMALL. REL who has been in the subwoofer business for a long time or perhaps could be called the leaders, beg to differ. They always want all speakers set to LARGE while extending every channel with a separate subwoofer. How would you look at that?
@@yogabyaakaash I think it comes down to positioning in the acoustic environment, bass is just better produced in some locations. If the amplifier can feed multiple speakers full range, it doesn’t hurt to play around and experiment. But remember a crossover isn’t a dead stop, it’s a roll off, so even with them bass managed they’re still producing bass, and by producing less they gain fidelity in their active region. And you wouldn’t want to stress a speaker by having it reproduce signals outside it’s frequency response. That’s a good way to destroy a speaker. An octave above the frequency response is a good safe zone for a custom crossover. But 80hz has a bunch of advantages too, to many to get into, but mostly sound engineers mix for it so that’s fairly significant.
As I upgrade my sound system, I want to upgrade my knowledge. As I upgrade my knowledge, I come to this channel. Thank you!
Thanks Gene, absolutely awesome info..and eye opening as well...
Always nice to watch your very helpful videos here, Adam. Hope you’re feeling well.
I just added my 2nd Subwoofer, I have followed your recommendation of setting my speakers to SMALL then dialing the crossover on the Subs and the receiver.. WOW! Great Sound! Music and Movies sound amazing! Thank you Audioholics!
Franken Studio what settings are they?
@@DEEJAYKLONE - In my Yamaha configuration screen (I believe many receivers have an option like this) I can select Speakers and set them to large or small. If I set them to large... then the receiver/amp sends the full freq range to any speakers set to large. (Which of course is probably to much low end for speakers that are not subwoofers.) When I set them to small... I also have the option to set the CutOff/crossover freq on my receiver/amp... which is basically allowing my receiver/amp to send that selected frequency to the subwoofers and only frequencies above the selected freq to speakers that I have set to small.
I set my crossover freq to 100hz (I think the default for most people is 80hz) I feel my system sounds best at 100hz - This way there is much less "strain" on my amp and my amp only needs to send 100hz and below to my subs and it frees up my remaining speakers (7.1.2 configuration) to play only freqs above 100hz. you will be surprised on how much better your system will sound when you are not pumping low freqs through speakers that just are not meant to take it. (even if the manufacturers specs say it can go that low.) ~ Best of luck
Franken Studio so you leave all your speaker setting set to small or do you set them to small then set your subwoofer settings then set your large speakers back to large and leave your satalite speakers set to small.
Pho Tato thank you
Outstanding! I just re-tweeked my system, and it does sound even better! Thank you!
I run stacked Paradigm studio 40’s as my mains, each getting about 200 watts because I subscribe to Genes view on a strong midrange and double tweeters. I add 2 300 watt 8” Paradigm sealed subs for music. I add another larger ported Paradigm sub for movies and loving it. Got my eye on Aura 3D and think the more speakers the better as long as they are all the same line.
Gene, Thanks a mill for this discussion, MY FRIEND!
Hi you two. Thank you for the indepth discussion of crossover for high quality HI-Fi AVR & speaker systems.
But, I'm just a elderly guy who has a passion for HI-FI Stereo & 5.1 surround for Blu-ray DVD Collection. My speakers are book shelf size SONY 6ohms for left & right channel, a SONY Centre speaker, 8ohms & SONY rear speakers 4ohms, playing through a Pioneer AV RECEIVER.
I have set the crossover for 80herts as you suggested, using the wee microphone to set the parameters for my listening room. The microphone set the crossover at 120herts, but, I manually changed it to 80herts at your suggestion. Can I say wow, what a difference the sound stage is expansive & clear. You can pinpoint the instruments in the orchestra or band. The vocals of the singers clear & crisp. Thank you for the help your channel provides for old timers as such as myself to enjoy
Matt Poes! A tremendously HUGE help / resource wrt diaing/ REW-ing my THTLP subs in about 100 ft^2.
looking forward to see more . .
and TY, again
Great discussion. So much knowledge here!!! Learned so much here.
@lawrence09151 sorry I missed your superchat. You can run a Ysplitter to connect 2 subs to each of the 2 sub outs of your receiver. I don't recall if your receiver has parallel outputs or independent. Follow our sub placement guidelines. Time align them in groups if your receiver has independent outputs. Use REW to make some measurements to make sure they are all playing in phase. After it's all setup reasonably well, then run Audyssey and compare on/off. Audyssey tends to set bass levels a few dB low so you may have to adjust. Good luck.
I went to see End Games at the Marcus SuperScreenDLX this week and by force of habit I found myself reaching for the remote for the AVR to adjust the settings LoL.. the ground shaking LFE and end credits music sounded great but they didnt seem to take full advantage of the Atmos,, and the vocals sounded like they were coming from a giant old TV speaker.. In all it didnt quite impress me. Goes to show you all systems even in a commercial theater things always need tweaking depending on the source content and the mix intended for the final production by the audio engineers. Its a never ending process. At home I always go to a dynamic part of a movie where theres alot of vocal action, music and boom going on and make my sound level adjustments and then go back to start the movie, drives the wife nuts ..she is like what are you doing.?. I say something didnt sound right hehe ..each movie has its strong and weak points its not a set it and forget it one size fits all type of deal. But the basic overall settings as discussed in this video are the main rule of thumb platform to build on.. :)
Very enlightening info here... congrats!
My finding as one reason for using a sub up to 80-100hz range is it improves midrange control/purity, since the smaller drivers are no longer being asked to play to their design limits. Less xmax = quicker start/stop capability of the midrange driver and more detail in the midrange.
I’ve also found that I prefer the sound of a sealed enclosure for tighter, faster, better defined mid-bass. Anytime I’m using a ported speaker engineered to allow the ports plugged with a foam port bung, I do it without hesitation, the bass roll-off starts at a higher frequency, yet extends deeper than the ported design.
I set my crossovers to the satalights of 100hz. My fronts and sides are different. They are lower . I disabled crossover of sub. Covers all the base on all my speakers. Also takes pressure of the amp allow my 15inch sub to take the lows providing clean mids and treble to all speakers. Rule of thumb is set all speakers to small. Crossover on receiver to the highest speaker crossover in your speakers( look at specs on all your speakers crossover data. Use the highest stat even though your fronts go lower. Reason is you sub will draw the low out off all speakers. You now have 500w sub amp to provide current andto drive base and take huge load off amp. )dial on your sub crossover to highest setting to disable sub crossover if wired lfe. Done. I used sound meter to match levels with 7.1 white noise test tones at 70db on meter and measured with tape measure to listening position.
Liked and subscribed in the first minute :)
This is better than school :)
Sealed speakers for me! My JBL. speakers set sounds awesome! Currently at 7.1 Thanks
I have a 2.0 system with amp & preamp but also a powered sub, so I use line-level splitters with in-line 100hz high pass filters running into my stereo amp, and set the sub's variable low pass at 100hz. Harrison Labs makes the in line filters.
Superb video thanks guys
Helped me a lot
Spock is always watching and listening.
Awesome stuff Gene. I love the new direction you're taking now. Not only is this a good refresher course but you are updating information based on what you're seeing on the internet and keeping us informed as the technology advances and changes. I see so much misinformation on just about all of the forums. Its kind of sad. Allot of know it alls getting it all wrong. Look forward to the next video...
Thx I like to keep a pulse on what is happening in the industry. There are a lot of sources now for home theater info but it's hard to know what's good or not sometimes. Hopefully we get it right most of the time. We try.
@@Audioholics absolutely!
This video blew my mind but makes so much sense.
I watch your videos as much as I can and enjoy them intensely. Unfortunately, I can not categorize myself as an audiophile due to my limited hearing. Years of industrial environment has played its toll on me. I listen to your wisdom in these matters and where I can, I apply your suggestions and even I can notice some improvements. Thanks again and I hope you feel better from your bout with covid19.
Always something to learn from you guys
I took the advice to set cross over alto my mains at 80hrtz and my receiver at 8 ohms. 👌👍
Thanks Gene for this discussion. I have been trying for the longest time to get a handle on the bass in my small room. I would love to see more in depth tutorials on REW, it is such a powerful tool and I have yet to see anyone but Audioholics do a detailed video that is understandable enough that even a nubbie like me could understand.
Big Pappi93 I’ve done a few for a variety of sites. You should see plenty more in the future. Bass integration is a topic I’m passionate about and it’s one that most folks really don’t understand that well. A lot of tutorials are either wrong, based on faulty rules of thumb, or incomplete. Gene has done a great job with his tutorials in the past and I hope to add to that going forward.
I gave a talk at AXPONA on how to use REW wavelets to properly integrate the bass. It’s a visual approach that makes the process easier. Todd Welti has a look at my ideas before the talk and seemed to walk away intrigued without disputing any of my core points. After the talk a number of professionals, experts, and experienced forum folks emailed me to mention how impressed they were with this trick.
Love this video!! Thank y'all!!
After watching a couple of your videos and, a couple others, I went a bit deeper into my Rotel RSX1056 setup menu and found the advanced setup, where I could adjust each speaker (lr Epos M12i, c Epos M8) and sub's (PSB Subsonic One) crossover. I didn't realize that even though I had the speakers set to small and crossover at 80hz, my lrc speakers were still at 40hz by default. Playing with the settings and using your overlap of 20hz, I settled on 60hz for the lcr and 80hz for my sub (80/100 seemed a bit muddy). Gone is the boom that was driving me nuts. Now it just sounds like my speakers are larger with good solid bass.
I beleive your misunderstood things slightly. your bass LFE (Low Frequency Effects) should always be 120hz (full signal) setting it to anything less and your losing some of the tracks low end detail/content. set it to 120 and forget it.
The LFE is seperate and completely independent from your speaker to sub crossover settting... The LFE is how much of the source materials signal will be sent to your sub... which you want all that info to be sent. again set it to 120hz and forget about it.
Now your speakers cross-over on the other hand is where you experiment with blending your speakers and sub together. This is done by setting the speakers crossovers (which again is independent of the LFE setting)
Your speaker crossover setting should be 80Hz-120Hz.. regardless if the speaker manufacture or AVR room correction software states that the speakers go down to 60hz or even 40hz... in 98% of case's our speakers just ain't ever going to produce low end frequencies anywhere near as good as a dedicated sub, so why make them even attempt too if you've got a nice sub.
Generally your settings should be as follows... bass "crossover" LFE at 120Hz and your speakers crossover at 80-120hz... from my understanding you have your system set up with a bass LFE of 80hz and your speakers (L-C-R) crossover at 60hz... which means your not getting the full bass source signal sent from your AVR to your sub and your attemping to make your speakers play as low as 60hz even though your sub can reproduce those 60hz frequencies much muchh better.
Again set the LFE to 120hz regardless of everything else. and try your speakers set to crossover at 80hz or 100hz (120hz begins to become localized).... this should make your main speakers cleaner and crisper sounding as your no longer forcing them to produce low end frequencies that they just can't cleanly reproduce. with a higher crossover setting your speakers should be less muddy sounding and your AVR will have less heavy load put on its amps aka your AVR will perform better as well!
If your bass is too overpowering and muddy sounding with your speakers crossover at 80--100hz then your sub likely is setup improperly and you likely have it running hot which means you need to turn the subs volume knob down to better blend the subs output levels with the speakers output levels aka SPL and depending on your AVRs room correction software level this may or may not mean buying yourself a dedicated SPL meter.
The brand of my speakers (JTR) were mentioned... Yay!!! Too bad I can't afford the Noesis 215RTs.
Great video guys! Some very helpful in depth stuff there for a newer guy like myself!
Very useful video. Thank you!
So to summarise: You should set the x-over where the transition between mains/sub is the smoothest (as measured by REW, assuming sub phase/distance with is correct), and not rely on the -3dB point as a "rule of thumb"? Sometimes speakers with an F3 of 50Hz transition to the sub smoother if crossed at 90-100Hz, than at F3+10Hz.
I think it’s still great that the Denon I use has separate settings for 2ch music listening vs movie listening, not that my main speakers are really musical, they are great for home theatre, but I can set different distances, levels and crossovers for 2ch, I think I can even set a specific pair of speakers in my room to play the 2ch audio...and it doesn’t effect the audyssey multi channel calibration. 👍🏻👍🏻
Yep Denon does some of the best bass management in AVR's out there. It's always been this way with them.
For me when you are talking about consistency among different source materials it seems to be most of the time. With music sometimes I'll drop my fronts to 60.
Wow I'm a little late to the party, but awesome video I learned a lot! Thank you, two years late but thank you.
Thanks guys.
Thanks for the great enfo. 👍
Regarding the comment you made about why you don't do hard recommendations of products being because you measure and want to make sure they sound good, frankly, that is the VERY reason why we come to you for your recommendations, is be because we know and trust that you measured the product. The people trust Audioholics evaluations which is why your opinions matter so much to viewers and readers like myself. The affiliate store is a great idea, but please don't just limit it to products sold on Amazon. I'm willing to go consumer direct if Amazon doesn't carry said products, so please provide links to those as well. Thanks again for all the great information. Also, I'm still waiting for the Goldenear Triton Reference, Klipsch RF7III's; and Tekton Double Impact review/head to head to head. Thanks!!!
Great video!! I have a couple of questions. Here is my setup:
Denon 4700
Klipsch R-625FA Dolby Atmos Floor stand speakers
Klipsch RP- 504C II center channel
Klipsch R-41M Bookshelf speakers
Klipsch R-12SW subwoofer
1-What are your suggestions for the crossover settings?
2- What are your suggestions for the db level for all the speakers? This is where I am confused.
24 hrs late , glad it was saved
Amazing video, I love the detail!! Well done... 😉👍
I’ve been into home sound systems since the very beginning when only Dolby Pro Logic processing was available.Many years before this I used high quality stereo amps with quality speakers.I am a musician have a reasonable ear have had a recording studio in my home and have done some editing.Without exception most of my friends that have home cinema rooms in their homes pay way over the odds for their equipment and installation and most do not understand anything about how to get the best out of any of their equipment, it’s just bragging rights for them well that’s fine.The other side of the coin is that you can drive yourself mad with these few settings such as channel levels individual, crossover settings,distance,EQ,Speaker size,And in the end you are not watching a movie you are listening to you sound setup and your picture settings and probably find it difficult to watch a movie without fiddling with your settings.I have found if you buy a high quality AVR and expensive speakers you will need to do less fiddling as the sound is so much better anyway.You can’t make a silk purse out of a pigs ear comes to mind.You guys go into this like you think your astrophysicists,Just to listen to a star wars dvd or an old move remastered in a new sound format that would sound better on a high quality processor and individual amps anyway.These cheep all in one boxes are better than sound bars but and have improved but are limited in what they produce because of the way the amplifiers are made and the quality of the DACs and the heat they generate.You ramble on far to long about nothing much and use technical terms that most who buy these Denon and popular brands of AVR’s.most probably don’t understand and if they do the sound difference is indistinguishable to the untrained ear or average user today.From what I can gather the most important aspect of modern day AVR is younger people playing games on them, with the latest video standards.You’re overcomplicating the whole thing.Love to know what you guys watch as the mixing on today’s movies especially such as Netflix or even 4 K BluRay are really bad almost as bad as the cinematography.
Finally!
I've been actively bi amp with 2 woofers since the early 90s.
My crossover point is 120Hz.
Gene et al: if you’re still reading/answering questions... this for a 5.X* system; corner** channels set to Large, each** has its own dedicated sub. .1 channel handles the CC bass and of course the LFE
*5 subs
1. Which channels output the lowest frequencies - LR or LFE? I recall one of you saying the LFE specific sound LPd @ 120hz(?)
2. I’ve studied the THX specs for Home Theatre. I understand all 5 channels are supposed to be full range my reason for 5 subs. That said, after I expand to 7.X, I plan to upgrade my LR & LFE. My question relates to #1: should the LFE or the LR be the “super” sub(s)?
Thanks for all you do for us
Due to room constraints I run my dual SVS 16's 1/3 along the wall on top of bass cubes about 20inch tall one 24inch tall. Any special tips for doing it this way. Have phase around 90 on each.
Fantastic effort Gents - The Golden Trapagon is that a legitimate principle - can the two of you do a live session about perfect room shape? I‘ll be building a home cinema room, you spoke about the importance of an acoustically balanced room, your thoughts on The Golden Trapagon with rounded / crowned internal corners to limited the meeting and interference of sound waves due to 90 degree room corners?
Folks... I have a Yamaha cx5200, klipsch 7.2.4, EMOTIVA x 2 and Panasonic UB82... I have been struggling for weeks... just simply changed everything to 80hz small... my SPL150 Klipsch subs to 120 hz and 1/o’clock gain and let me say... my jaw hit the ground... WOW... thank you...
Place the bouncy house modules on the ceiling instead? Better?
Hey there Gene, I was wondering if you’ve ever considered doing a actual receiver/speaker system setup??? I know that it would be time consuming, but you can release it as a series... Episode one could be proper wiring... Episode to could be proper speaker placement and so on... Most of us schmoes only understand 60% of the language. Lol!!! Great stuff you’re doing though 👍!!!
If the subwoofer mode was set to LFE as screenshot showed, doesn't that miss putting bass from small mode channels into sub?
I literally have a pair of tower speakers with response down to 40Hz and was going to set my crossover to 60Hz...so thanks. Saved me 5 minutes in to a 60 minute video.
NallenTV we are clairvoyant
You should still try it and see how it sounds to you. Not all systems, all speakers, all rooms, all situations obey all the rules in "the book".
Unless i got powered subs built in (Def Techs) , considering passive speaker systems. I'm mostly always sticking to THX reconnected 80hz cross! - ENSURING that ea speaker n subs are in locations that dictate good response at critical crossover spots - unless using smaller satellites (up to 120hz cross to small 8" or smaller subwoofers).
Even larger passive full range speakers aren't efficient enough, especially coupled with AV receivers, but even separates, to handle dynamics well enough.
Just way it is
Nice video. I just bought rx 385 yamaha and bose acoustimass 5 series v. I have been looking on CZcams to see better video on the combination of this two devices but all to no avail. Did you have any idea on the combination of rx 385 yamaha and acoustimass 5 series v? If you do what will u advice to get better sound.
Question - I have Klipsch In wall side surround R3650 - Freq response from 60hz -20KHS. What does it mean when I set that crossover at 80 vs 100 vs 120hz? Does setting at 100hz mean that it will roll off for anything below 100HZ? What is best setting for this speaker - would you say set it at 90hz which is 10 above recommended? It seems like I get more surround sound playing through them set at 120hz vs 100 hz.
Hey Gene I know you say a quality five point to set up is better than a cheaper 16 channel set up. I have my two towers, center channel and it two sites around bookshelves all in SVS ultra. I’m not really pleased with the output of the center channel. It’s nice but just doesn’t quite get it as loud as I would like. Do you think for the amount of money the Arendal 1723THX5 channel set up would be a big improvement especially when it comes to the center channel? Those duel eights being THX ultra certified are supposed to play quite a bit louder than the Ultra center channel right? I also have two rhythmic F-18s on the way to pair with whichever speakers I end up going with.
This is fine for movies, TV shows, but what about surround systems for home audio? Are the crossovers different?
I'm running a HK AVR1710. Subwoofer crossover frequency is managed auto by the amp. will it set the LFE automatically to 120HZ or do I need to adjust the crossover on my sub to 120hz? Running DT SuperCube8000. Thank you, learning lots!
I so agree using speakers from the same range and if possible cross at the same or very close frequency . Found out the hard way.
What if I just want the treble to be clearer what setting is that under?
I heard dual subs are the way to go even if I have small room. 10 X 12. Can I use two different subs? I have one svs SB 3000 (main) and a Paradigm CT 90 10" driver sub? Would it work if I set the crossover to 35 Hz on the SB 3000 because the Paradigm only goes down to 30 hz?
My Onkyo 5.1 speaker line up is set on 100 Hz Crossover. I can't set each speaker seperately on a Crossover level, so what would be your advice? Select 80 Hz, let it stay on 100 Hz or 120 Hz? My speakers are: 2 Monitor Audio floorstanding speakers (Front), 2 (small) surr speakers, a small center and (large) subwoofer speaker. Thanks so much in advance.
Hi, i have Bose accostimass 10 series 5 speakers, auto calibrated at 40hz and lfe 120hz it sets my Yamaha is nc600 ceiling speakers to 60 hz, i really want to know should i leave it as it is or should i change the atmos ceiling settings to higher crossover. i would really appreciate your help with this.
I’m using a 10 year old Yamaha Aventage receiver for music only and the YPAO adjusted my front energy C9 towers to 40hz bass crossover. And it sounds better 😮
I would love some advice. Setting up a 5.1 Onkyo NR6050. Was using and very happy till it died Onkyo TX-Sr608
Room is my living room 12x20
Front speakers are Wharfedale Valdus 400se
Center Sub and surround rear (side really) are Infinity.
Front speakers are set to "full"
Center is set to 100hz
Surround is set to 120Hz
LPF of LFE is set to 80%
Double bass is "off"
So how do you get a set up for multiple people in the viewing,and listening area
I have a question, on my 5.1 AV receiver I set front, center and surround to small, front crossover set on 80 Hz and center and surround set on 120 Hz (here I am not sure if I made the right choice). How to set my surround and center speaker crossover if in speaker specification say that: center and surround frequency range 150 Hz-20.000 Hz? 80 - 120 Hz isn't too low if the frequency range of the speakers is between 150-20,000 Hz?
This was good stuff..
Great detailed discussion. Just have a doubt though - if one is using multiple subs is it necessary to have them with the same sizes?
Of course it isn't..not at all.
Hello I wanna know is it any reciever that’s 7.2 but can you make it to a 5.1.4 with a external amplifier?? If so can you tell which reciever
Hi, Iam using MacBook Pro 2011, umik-1, Yamaha sub, 5 Polk audio bookshelf speakers and Denon avr-x540BT. I use REW to measure and a software called Menubus (no longer for sale) to add my eq nbandeq,s to each channel (width, q, and gains) per REW measurement. What system wide app program can I use on Mac to add my REW nbandeq measurements to each 5.1 channel like Menubus? I reached out to Menubus and designer is now with amoeba he made audio app named source 4 but only 2 channel audio system wide.
Hey Gene, thanks for all the great content. When frequency response range for center channel is 82Hz -21KHz, does that mean setting the crossover for it at 80Htz is pointless, because it can’t go lower than 82Htz (ma be wrong in how I’m understanding this)? Does that, then mean you have to set the crossover above 82Htz (what about rule of thumb THX recommendation of 80Htz) for a speaker like that?
Would there be anything wrong with setting center speaker at 90Htz crossover and main (floor) speakers at 80Htz crossover? Would they play well together?
82Hz, very specific. Must have gotten it from the manufacturer. Ignore their stats. They're usually exaggerated ("-6db" ratings).
Hi! I have Hooked up Elac Cinema 5 & Polk S10 with Denon AVR-S750H, Polk-S10 for front L&R channel, and Elac as a for L&R Surround and Top Middle.(5.1.2 atoms setup). what crossover I should use for all individual speaker including sub, do I need to set LFE+Main or not my speaker Frequency response is Polk S10 F.R = 67Hz to 40KHz (67 - 40,000 Hz) Elac (Front/Center/Surround) F.R=160Hz to 20KHz(160 to 20,000Hz) & Subwoofer F.R= 40Hz to 200Hz.
I have some vintage Altec Lansing bookshelf speakers made in USA. They’re very neutral sounding. They go from 40 to 22,000hz. Their lowest useable frequency is 60hz @ +3db. I have them set to small. But what should I do in the bass management section? Should I set to LFE or LFE+Main?
I neep help,I have 1 amp and a 10"sub in the trunk with a pioneer AVH501EX head unit.Im trying to get the clean,crisp sound with out distortion but i dont know what to set my crossover in the head unit on.I tried doing it by ear but it didnt work....Suggestions PLEASE Audioholics or Community.Thank you
Wow, this was an education for me. My home theater is our living room. The space is 14×20. There is no back wall as it goes directly into our dinning room. There is an arch on each side wall between the living room and the dinning room where I was able to mount my back channel speakers. Keeping my back/surrounds at about 3 feet above seated ear level. I've always felt this was less than ideal but it's the space I have. I enjoyed the discussion about crossovers but was really more enlightened by the REW software and acoustic microphone recommendation. My system, at times, seems lacking and I'm sure it's not the equipment.
Hi guys great stuff! My Denon is making a clicking noise when I use my computer with my receiver. I hear a click and the audio goes out. I guess the clicking noise is actually coming from my speakers. Do I need to lower my hrz?
Receivers will shut themselves off to protect themselves. The electrical switch inside receivers can make a loud single click when it switches off or on. A receiver can shutdown for several reasons, like if it gets hot, so make sure you aren't blocking any of the vents and that it has room to breathe. Sometimes it can be the "current draw" of the speakers, this is why people consider the "impedance" of their speakers. Impedance is measured in ohms, most all consumer grade speakers are -rated- either 8ohm, 6ohm, or 4ohm. It's the low impedance that sucks the most juice, and can trip the protection circuits, so 8ohm is actually easier for receivers to handle. Your speakers should have the ohms written on the back, or the details can be found in online specs, but even a speaker rated at one ohm number can dip down below the number depending on the frequency it's playing. You may want to see if certain frequencies trip it. My guess is your speakers are demanding more current than your amplifier can deliver, and the amplifier is being stretched too thin. If it's only from the computer, then I don't I know about that. Sometimes when you plug a source into a system that is already on, it can make a super loud pop, these pops can destroy stuff, I lost a speaker to that once, when I plugged an aux into a computer headphone jack. Grounding the amplifier chassis eliminates those pops in my experience.
I have a question because i see you recommend setting the crossover to 80hz.
I current have the 8805avp with b&w cm10 s2 in the front which i have set to 60hz. It’s powered by emotiva xpa-2 gen 2
I’ve done rew and for the way i have them set which in my avp i have aud turned off because from the measurements i took with my speakers that’s where i got the flattest response but since you say smaller speakers which even though these are towers it is three small 6.5in woofers and the xpa-2 is a powerful amp should i set the speakers to 80hz.
I’ve ran rew with it at 60 and 80hz at 60 it was a flatter response but would those extra 20 hz put a huge strain on the woofers?
Also I’m running 2 SVS Ultra and 1 plus as my subs so i do have a good amount of bass i wouldn’t mind setting it to 80hz but from my rew measurements i left it at 60hz because it was a flatter response.
Thank you.
What about utilizing Wilson Audio speakers?
Not sure why you dont want to use dipol in atmos or 5.1, works great for me, where I sit close to one of them, and it I really like it.
They are nice for a 5.1 system but if you have a 7-9.2 system then you don't need them because you already have different speakers for every surround channel.
Def Tech BP9080x towers
Dual SVS PB2000 subs
Monoprice Monolith 5x200w amp
Monolith amp powering towers
With my setup, am i able to set my towers to large and subwoofer mode as LFE+Main?
REL set their 'crossover' at about 20kHz ;)
OK - I'm being flippant - but I am interested in the approach they recommend for those of us who have speaker terminals and a subwoofer output on a 2-channel amp. Taking the fullrange signal seems like a simpler method of trying to integrate our main speakers with a subwoofer (or pair of subs - again, their stated preference) : happy to hear from any REL owners how that works out in practice.
The High lvl inputs work better than i expected. In the past I have hated adding subs to small speakers as they never blend well and volume discrepancies were always present when changing from quiet volume to loud volume , but the tiny T5i that I have blends perfectly with my bookshelf speakers on the high lvl inputs, in fact most of the time i cant tell the sub is on , it just sounds like my tiny speakers have bass. In reality i do NOT recommend this T5i , It only works for me because my room is very small. If my room was even 1 square foot bigger I would step up to the T9i or maybe the T7i , just my two cents.
@@matthewhilty4209 Thanks for the feedback - very handy. As I wouldnt be able to afford anything more than a pair of T5i anyway (and they all recommend a stereo pair over a single sub for music) its just as well I also have a small room ;)
Arthur Watts there idea works to get sound to the sub, but their rationale is dumb. Devoid of any scientific logic. There is no benefit to a high level input over passive. If anything the opposite is true, as high level inputs can be noisy.
Their idea that such an approach leads to better bass is silly. While they finally have a few decent subs, many of their classic designs are not very capable. The newer high subs look to be good but cost a lot. It’s a brand that has rubbed me the wrong way for a while given their ridiculous claims.
Great video! Because of your videos I'm now a dual subwoofer preacher and being a fan of stereo, and not a fan of what Atmos is doing to the industry, am focused on 2.2 systems. The issue is finding a receiver or preamp that is focused on stereo and not home theater with bass management. At the $700 price point I think the Outlaw Audio RR2160 is a possible candidate, but can you make any recommendations on equipment at a lower price point or perhaps a stereo preamp with bass management? Keep up the great work.
Sorry... The Outlaw Audio RR2160 is currently at the $850 price point.
Gene do you use Audessy when playing your movies or is it shut off because I am hearing feedback where other say audessy for dialogue does not produce well.
I can vouch for that. I turned Audyssey off years ago because it made dialogue sound like it was on top of the track instead of part of it. It was louder with a weird boost in midrange.
Can you use the anthem calibrated mic for Rew? Or does it have to be the Um1?
Lester D it can be any mic. But calibrated means something specific. It is likely there is a calibration curve for that mic and if you don’t have the calibration curve it’s not a calibrated mic for you.
While they often claim otherwise, many mics shipped with receivers are called calibrated but don’t measure as well against a reference mic without correction. At LF’s it tends to be a non-issue. All mice tend to be flat at low frequencies and just differ in extension. Most measurement mics are flat down to 20hz so im sure you are ok. Just don’t over internet Anthony above 5khz as it might have some errors.
Ok, 5 yr old vid...but I have my REL 7TX sub set at 40 HZ, my Wharfedale Linton's (front L&R) set to Large and my 2 Elac bookshelfs surrounds at 40 HZ, set to Large. All distances changed(overwritten) from Audyssey settings. All by following the Head designer at REL on line article. Sounds great with some minor adjustments on crossover on the sub and level knob (down). Only don't know if they should be at the traditional 80 HZ for all.
I set my speakers and sub to 75db for calibration and am I crazy to say I can’t hear the subs? Certainly I have to boost the sub level 6db to get close to reasonable.
Wait, AV receivers have GUIs nowadays? That's insane!
Thanks for the great videos you put up this one and many of the other ones as well keep up the good work I think you're helping a lot of people make a better decisions with their hard-earned money on what to get because not everybody's an expert on knowing what to get of a sound system stereo so thank you God bless
16 minutes in fellas. That’s it. This is for a self reminder to show my cousin who insists setting his r-260 klipsch towers at 40 hz crossover
Good informative otherwise discussion of discourse to digest and consider
Hey Matt - would you be able to talk a bit more about the time delay/distance for subs and using your REW measurement trick? I don’t know if a private message would be easier or if you had anything up on the site already but would love to see that and try for myself.
a little sad they specifically mentioned Matt's video but then neglected to link to it. I don't even know where to find this guy's channel. lol.
@@rgemail www.youtube.com/@PoesAcoustics
Great video! Would placing Atmos modules on either the front or back wall, about above ear level, be better than placing them on front towers? In-ceiling is not an option, for me.
From what I've read: yes. But aren't normal speakers usually more affordable than the smaller, Atmos 'modules'?
Just hang real speakers high on your wall, pointing at the listening position...
Fantastic video my mains specs are 44hz - 22khz +3db and senitivty is 90db so basically your saying still have them set at 80hz ?
What if I want my treble to be clearer what setting would that be under?
I need help! With my fronts (Klipsch RP280s) at small and subs at 80hz, the some of the bass is severely lacking. I get tons of LFE for films, but for music, the bass drum almost disappears. If I run my fronts in direct mode, the bass is restored. Why is this? I tried setting fronts to large so that subs would only get LFE and while this makes music sound right, it makes films unbearably boomy.
I have the exact same experience with my yamaha reciever and monitor audio speakers. Pure direct sound deeper and punchier. I plan to try a 60hz crossover to see if that fixes it.
Set your sub crossover @ 120hz. You're robbing them of bass by setting them @ 80hz
Can i put 80hz subwoofer crossover in denon AVR X1400H? Is that right and is it handle ?
Great guys
Current Set up - Denon X6400 receiver FRONTS: Klipsch RP280-FA (80hz), Center: Klipsch RP 450C (80Hz) Surrounds: Klipsch R-15M (90hz), I feel like these crossovers are good from what i've seen here, but the biggest question is the FRONT speakers, RP280-FA have the "bouncy house" speakers in the top (temporary fix for now) , what cross over would you recommend them to be at? ive seen so many suggestions online for the up firing atmos speakers and im just confused where to land at? ceilings flat, up firing speaker to ceiling is 4ft 4". Any recommendations or suggestions are welcome!
Set the bouncy house speakers to 150Hz and that should help reduce localization of their sound. If you have them above ear level, that should also help as well. Good luck.
Jason Daudelin if I recall these atoms speakers are built in. Another fix is to get a block of acoustic foam and place it on top of the speaker at the front. It will absorb the sound coming toward you as the listener and reduce their detectability while preserving the reflection.