Bonus Drive Thru: Jim Cornette on Hulk Hogan Leaving The WWF & Turning Heel
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- čas přidán 11. 07. 2017
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Most people who were fans of Wrestling in 93 were sick of Hogan by that point. His NWO heel turn tho was fantastic.
It was a game changer but when you look back on it you realize a lot of the reasons why he was hated so much was because his character always got stale whether it be yellow and red hogan or nwo Hogan people got tired of him doing the same thing and doing the same type of match for years with no change.
Best heel turn ever... I wish Vince had the balls to do it with Cena... It would really ignite his career again. Once he realizes movies aren't for him I hope he does a 2 year heel run
@@revans100591 speak for yourself... He went a lot longer than most wresylers did. And without him there is no WWE. No wrestlemania
@@corneliusbransonflogger5446 No one is denying Hogan's impact on the WWF or wrestling I'm just saying if he put guys over like Flair did he would be looked at more favorably.
@Damien Jones if you lived in the South you knew who Flair was back then wrestling was still a North and South thing and just like some people didn't know who Flair was there were some that didn't know who Hogan was and if they did (especially in the South) they didn't respect the style of wrestling he was promoting.
i was 16 when this happened, and i can tell you that everyone in high school was talking about this. no one ever talked wrestling in school at all, but after this, nwo shirts showed up everywhere. im not hogans biggest fan, but this event was huge back then
All we talked a out on Tuesdays in high school was the MO day night war..i was just about to go I to 10th grade when be went heel at bash at the beach
I was 8 years old... Now kids that age got to deal with roman reigns... Or brock lesnar who wrestles 2 times a year
I live Canada and it was a big deal it was on News Outlets.
@@edwinlujanhernandez6048 kids don't even deal with Reigns or Brock. The audience is mostly men 30-50 yrs old.
Yep. I was 16, me and my buddies are watching wrestling, our parents are bbqing, all of a sudden, 3 generations of wrestling fans are slack jawed staring at the TV saying "what the fuck just went down?"... got all of our parents watching again!
Hogan turning Heel made the news back in the day *"Local and National News"* The greatest heel turn of all time!!
Hogan had been a heel since the AWA days. So, Barry Windham's heel turn had a greater impact on me personally. But I do think that Hall and Nash/The Outsiders were a great gimmick.
Took an old tired act...and completely made it new and interesting.
Hulk has always been a heel in real life, the politicians politician.
Never was a Hogan fan but that heel turn had me watching. I remember that sh!t made national news. It was on every news channel.
Really??wow!!that's something
This is what people don't understand....He was newspaper, late news, CNN news, Fox news....It's was bigger than a real murder
I was born in 98. Wrestling was that large back then??
@@theyliveinthematrixofthefa4437 you missed out on the best Monday nights in the world.. there was nothing better bro, than to go to school on Tuesday to talk about what happened on Monday there is nothing better than that feeling I promise you!!!! WCW and WWF on Monday night the greatest thing on TV
@@teamgreats4084 I experienced that to an extent. I grew up on Ruthless agression era with the likes of Eddie, Benoit, Edge, Cena etc and the school and friends around the neighborhood used to always speak on it . I can only imagine how It was the era before me . Damn dawg
This was the top 3 most shocking moments in wrestling history. We’re talking about a guy that in the 80’s was a hero to 10’s of millions of kids. A guy who was a pop culture MEGA icon in the movies and media. When he turned I was 12 years old watching BATB with a group of friends and when he turned we were speechless. My friends little brother was 8 years old and he cried like a baby. That’s how big this was.
I was 7 and remembered telling kids at school the next day and how genuinely upset they were.
And he pulled it off
Jim's bias shows when he discusses stuff like this. That heel turn was groundbreaking. Still the most memorable moment of wrestling in the 90s
From a fans perspective , hell yeah. But from within the business it didn't seem as surprising. At least that what I got from Jim.
. there was no turn in 02. But good job showing how massive a geek you are
Yeah, when he says Hogan didnt change the game hes kidding himself
He’s the same pos who bashed the WWF then sucked their dick & worked with & for them in Smoky Mountain where Jim some of your wrestlers are still waiting for their $$$$.I guess you forget these things when Donald Trump & God are living rent free in your tiny mind.Shall I discuss things you & your wife did with OVW wrestlers?
Heel Hogan is the best Hogan.
Greatest face of all time and greatest heel of all time.
NO HOGAN is the best Hogan
@@LeoWhalen1933 second greatest heel after Mr McMahon
I really liked heel Hogan during his first stint in the WWF where he was managed by Freddie Blassie.
Punk Slapper Eh, he was a poor man’s Billy Graham or Jesse Ventura. He hadn’t really figured it out yet.
I'm from Los Angeles. Hogan turning heel was such a big deal that it made the news. Sorry Corny, but it was a big deal.
Cornette said it was a big deal at the start of the video, but means it wasn't a big deal backstage in WWF
Spring-heeled Jack Then that shows you how clueless WWF/E were at the time and why they ended up getting their asses kicked and almost going out of business to WCW
Vince was clueless as hell though. He had Michael's and Diesel as champion and they were two of the worst draws in Wrestling history as Champion. It wasn't until Stone Cold went tweener that Vince learned "hey, people want wrestling and people want edgy".
@@staticcharm3808 think about from the WWF's point of view nobody thought turning Hogan heel would be profitable because he was so over as a face. Even with people begging for the turn most thought it was safer to keep him as a heel. Plus nobody had faith in WCW executing a proper heel turn with Hogan or managing that heel turn considering a lot of the blunders/ideas they had such as having Ric Flair cut his hair and changing his name to Spartacus or creating a tag team called the Hunchbacks.
@@VillaFanFTW it was actually Brett heart leaving WWE and the Mr McMahon Chara ter being born that saved the wwe
Hogan turning Heel was MEGA!! COLOSSAL.
I started watching wrestling again, specifically, because of Hogan's turn and NWO. It had been years.
James Smith I think that if Magnum TA (if he was never in a car accident) and Kerry Von Erich (if he was never on drugs) both signed to WCW and both turned heel on Sting, that would have caused more heat.
exactly. I was flipping channels n saw hogan spitting on the wcw logo on nitro n said "what the hell, is that hogan?". Kept flipping through, n then flipped back to check it out again. By that time it was at the end of the segment, n I was hooked from there.
@@Mr.Majestic77 you're out of your mind. Hogan turning heel caused the next boom in wrestling- just like his face turn in wwf.
More so then Andre
The build up to the Yokozuna match was always funny to me.
“Hogan has decided to trim down to 275 in his match with Yokozuna. He figures if he’s lighter, he’ll be able to use his speed against Yokozuna.”
Great story. Believed it as a kid, but now we know what the real deal was.
I always thought as a face, hogan didn't look right being 265, it took away from his larger than life, superhero persona, and just didn't work. As a heel though, being smaller, n cowardly, n trying to look more "hollywood", it just worked in spades. I don't think he or anyone else knew it at the time, but they fell into it. That's why it worked so well in 02 to be a face again- he was gigantic n looked better than ever, even if he couldn't move anymore. Came back in '03 n looked like shit- lost a lot of steam. Look has a lot to do with wrestlers gimmicks. Like if Jake would have come out n looked like the texas tornado in '90, body wise, it just wouldn't fit his persona, n he woulda failed.
He did look slim in 93,94,95.
Yep, he dropped the roids!
@@aotearoa4eva924 Yea, my Dad, upon seeing how he looked like in 1993 was shocked and said: "It looks like he had lipo!".
If you look at footage of Hogan even back in 1990, he looks rather gaunt as well. He had to quit steroids for a while during that time.
I remember the garbage in the ring 😄
G-Dub 85 ...and all the trash that was thrown in too lol
That was wcw in general, people were always throwing crap in the ring
Mean Gene: "Look at all of this crap in this ring, Hogan". Gene's delivery was hilarious. I also remember reading that Scott Hall couldn't believe all that shit got thrown into the ring.
"People got blown up with dynamite and kick out on a 2 count." Ha Ha Ha.
the indies today
@@egagnard or WWE after 2001
Great line
Yeah, that's why I always roll my eyes when people laud ECW as "changing the business." Yeah, they changed the business, all right, but it sure as hell wasn't for the better.
lol I went to the comments to post this exact thing, hilarious. I don't agree with Jim's hatred for ECW, but I understand his feelings behind it. Jim hates anything that challenges the traditions of wrestling...no advancing, which is one of his flaws as a booker.
Whole thing was genius Hall(Razor) and Nash(Diesel) come into WCW exited WWF. Invades the shows. Say they are taking over. Fans think WWF is invading WCW. They hype the shit out of it. Everyones talking whos the third person is and the least expecting person joins them.
BUT WHICH SIDE IS HE ON
People really believed it was an invasion, I remember. That's when Nitro became Nitro, beating WWF every week also.
David Johns shit was awesome, a truly underrated angle
It helped that some of the original core members other than Giant were all from the WWF. Hall, Nash, Hogan, Dibiasi, Six, Vincent. And it made sense with Giant because he basically admitted that they bought him off and he was hired muscle
Was a huge risk that provided a monumental payoff. Totally refreshed him.
Yep it turned things around for him as wrestler and put wrestling back on the map which in turn forced Vince to actually be creative without that heel turn we might have never seen Vince the character as a tyrannical boss or Austin, The Rock, or DX.
Hogan, Nash, and Hall is more important to Pro Wrestling than anything... If it wasn't for Hogan turning Heel which forces Vince's hands to do whatever it takes to make a great product, WWF would of went out of business a long time ago.. If it wasn't for Razor and Diesel leaving to become Hall and Nash in WCW Triple H would of won King of the Ring and in My Opinion Triple H wasn't ready for that yet which gave us Stone Cold Steve Austin who was molded ready! If it wasn't for The NWO DX wouldn't even formed the way it did and even Shawn Michaels admitted that! So You can say What you want about Hogan and ECW but they gave the Pro Wrestling business a new breathe of Air! So far as I'm concerned Pro Wrestling wouldn't even be mentioned without Hulk Hogan's name cause of the Winkle of time he impacted.. (now my opinion) *"It was Hollywood Hogan who said those racists remarks who his heel friends turned on him to use privately recorded tapes against him which I think anything he said privately should of not been a big deal"*
Hogan had to go heel because everybody was tired of his ass by 96
Speak for yourself ass wipe hogan still drew pops unlike your never will be ass or even brett fart
Richard Taylor yeah but he wasn't drawing money if he did Vince would've kept him
QuentinDude
By 96? What about 93 when he pissed all over Bret and Yokozuna by winning the title in a match he wasn't booked for?
I loved the hitmam but he was never In his career a bigger draw then hogan
Tyler Dalton
With a name like "Hitmam" I can see why.
When Hogan says, the fans can stick it. And Scott Hall's hand gestures was hilarious on that night when Hogan turn 😂😂
at the time Hogan turned heel and joined NWO to fans at the time was a big shock and most didn't know he was a heel in the late 70's in WWE. with Freddy Blassie as his manager. I knew he had been a heel before.
Hulk Hogan and The Rock are the only 2 wrestlers bigger or just as big as WWF/E but hogan was a active wrestler and Hogan was instrumental in 2 eras no wrestler can make that claim as a world wide attraction
I was at Bash at the Beach when Hogan turned heel.
Mom dropped the kids off with tickets so she could go rat out backsatge.
WeCoolWeCool BOUNCE your a piece of shit
The guillotine leg drop heard ‘round the world
Don't lie.
G33k Culture No you wasn’t
Babies born the same year as The NWO are now legal to drink in every state . 21 years ago (1996 ) was the begining of the last interesting period in wrestling .
Thats Nice this made me watch every Monday night. Both Nitro and Raw.
its weird this was all almost 20 years ago isn't it?
vince is afraid of change and its killing his company
OLE SammyOLE I think Vince is too arrogant to realize his system isn't working anymore. WWE is no longer the "Promise Land" it used to be. Guys like Cody Rhodes proved that you don't need to be in the WWE to make it in wrestling. Once Vince is gone, Hunter will get with the program and hopefully Stephanie will drop down as head of creative.
@@ryanbenson4610 What is so remarkable when you mention it today is, Monday night was Wrestling Night back in the mid- to late-90's. It's what EVERYONE did on Monday nights, watch wrestling. For a short while after Thunder debuted, three of the top five most watched hours on television every week were Nitro and Thunder. Raw was a strong competitor, and Smackdown later was, too. My teenage son really doesn't have a concept of just how huge wrestling was during the Monday Night War.
Yes it was a big deal when he turned. Did you see the ring it was filled with trash
So true I got DVD's of it.
I've never seen the wwe ring full of trash
It was filled with trash before the fans threw debris.
lookin back l dont see how somebody didnt get hurt by the mess thrown in the ring
Hulk Hogan was a heel early in his career. He was a heel when he did Rocky III . . . which helped him become a well-recognized figure and where he looked like a face at the end of his scene.
rockvill
Not the same people at the time saw it as Hogan just playing a part in a movie like any other actor it didn't have the same impact as his heel turn in the mid 90's.
@@revans100591 heel turns then caused people to be violent
Hogan helped WCW to beat out WWF in many pay per views even before he went heel but Cornette thinks he wasn't drawing? Gimme a break.
He probably meant drawing more house shows than ppv at the time
Beating out WWF in 1995-96 was no accomplishment and even still WCW wasn't doing it consistently. No one was drawing at that time, Hogan included.
Mid 90's was the lowest point in pro wrestling with the exception of right now lol
Bischoff in Controversy...stated that he put more focus on TV and PPV than house shows.
All respect to Cornette, in the "wrestling world", it was a huge fucking deal.
Damn...What's up with Jim? This was a huge deal. It was all over the place and everyone was talking about it. It was, and still is, the biggest heal turn in wrestling history.
He's saying it wasn't a big deal to most people in the WWF personally he saw it as a big deal he mention in another video that despite him hating Bischoff he was smart enough to take advantage of a idea nobody thought was a possibility at the time.
Hulk's heel turn HANDS DOWN was epic! The greatest heel turn of all time! I understand why Corny was downplaying it though. Because he was with WWF at the time. And the Monday Night Wars were intense. But it's THE THING that put WCW on the path to beat WWF in the ratings for a long ass time. And WCW's roster in terms of depth SMOKED WWF's at the time. Plus let's face it, Hogan, Hall, and Nash was a LEGIT dream team faction! Hall and Nash were so cool and had major swag. So letting that rub off on Hulk was HUGE! And Hogan giving them the notoriety in terms of being MAJOR ENOUGH for Hulk to join them was huge too! Hulk had sway in his own way. But the Hollywood shit no doubt gave him new life!
What Jim also isn't wanting to admit is that had it not been for Vince allowing Mick Foley to become the WWF champ that one Raw (after almost two years of the "Attitude Era" that everyone pretends "won the MNW", and also the infamous "Fingerpoke of Doom" fiasco..) the fortunes would have been reversed.. and WCW would have spent the last 20 years bragging and posturing....
Hogan turning heel was news in the mainstream.
Can you please give me a link or some proof because I can't believe it till I see it
Say what you will about Hogan or WCW, that was MONUMENTAL.
I wasnt shocked, I was excited. I was not a Hogan fan as a kid. Razor was one of my favorites in WWF. When I attended a WCW event in my hometown of Macon Ga. as a kid and saw Razor, I was going crazy! Then as everything unfolded to the leg drop I was becoming a fan on NWO
Whole bunch of commenters missing the key point of the question. From the standpoint of the business and backstage, not your high school hallways and water cooler conversations. He asked "What Was the BACKSTAGE like?"
Getting over means attracting more casual fans or new fans to the product. The Smarks stay regardless. Hogan’s heel turn pulled MASSIVE amounts of 80’s casual fans back to the product in addition to new fans. Also, the economy was good in the late 90’s just like it was in the mid-80’s. The economy being up or down has a lot of impact on businesses being “up or down”.
I can listen to Cornette all day!!
The Iron Sheik match
The Andre the Giant match
The Ultimate Warrior match
The heel turn
Some of the biggest moments ever
From what I heard, He hated putting the Ultimate Warrior over by dropping the belt to him. Apparently, He helped bring Warrior to WCW just to beat him as payback.
@@charlesdavis7285 he didn't himself any favors. He even admitted he was so embarrassed by how sloppy that match was he just wanted it to be over.
Jim is right the Hulkster had grown stale by this time and his move to WCW and heel turn was just the thing he needed,this is the problem with world wide TV coverage compared to working territories with them you can go to a new city or town do the same match and nobody had seen it.
While i liked the Hulkster his matches were basically the same for years he would get the heel to beat the shit out him then he would hulk up point the finger no sell a few punches big boot then leg drop finish 1 2 3 which works fine until its been on TV to many times you knew what was going to happen.
Its a bit like a comedian on TV once they have done the routine its fucked for using with a live audience as everybody has heard it already
I was 11. Begged my parents to watch the beginning of Nitro in early 1997 lol. NWO is so Iconic.
I was not a " Hulkamaniac " growing up. I always liked the bad guys. When Hulk Hogan turned heel, that's when I started to like him. His heel turn sparked the national interest in wrestling again. I remember seeing that on Sportscenter. Kids in the crowd crying, and even friends of mine who had a casual interest in wrestling talked about it. From there came the Monday night wars, and my cable bill going through the roof because of the attitude era.
N.W.O. still has an impact, look at wrestling shows like WWE, AEW, Impact, fans wear N.W.O. shirts still over 20 years later!
Wrestling followers love stating that fans were tired of Hogan by 93 which is interesting. First is that the entire business was down and there was no other wrestler in WWF or WCW they helped rebound the business, I am sure many were tired of Hogan in general but it seems people are also just sick of everything in the wrestling world at that time as well yet Hogan has to shoulder it all. Secondly is that despite his significant dip in popularity he was still helping WCW have a fighting chance against WWF even before his heel change. Lastly it was Hogan's heel change that reignited wrestling..without debate!!! Hall and Nash legitimized his switch but trust that it was all Hogan that rebounded the business and had WWF adopt and build its attitude era. Hogan single handedly rebounded wrestling again and ushered in the new era that WWF copied and eventually took to new heights and to assure his eternal status all one has to do is watch his eventual return and match with The Rock
“Every minute move.” Yeah this was one of the biggest angles ever lol
Nitro was in Savannah ga on St Patrick’s day in 97. Nwo got covered in beer thrown from the audience, it was a great show! Sting came down from the rafters obviously
Hogan had to go heal because he was stale by 1991.
*heel
It was either that or retire which he kinda did for a minute before he was talked right back into wrestling with the promise of more money and more control over his character.
If say 1993....when he won the rumble in 1992 the arena went bananas... So he was still going strong then.... I think had he lost more he would have not gone stale as quickly.... And pple can talk shit on John Cena all they want.... But now later in his career he is doing a good job of putting pple over... Pe used to say he never out pple over... Why would he put pple over in the prime or his career.... U do it after your prime to pass the torch.... And he is doing it well. I used to hate Cena. Now I like and respect all he has done........ 1. Hogan.... 2. SCSA..... 3. Cena.
@@corneliusbransonflogger5446 you put them over in your prime to keep your gimmick/character from becoming stale and to create new formidable opponents if you don't you end up Hogan at the end of his WWF run and all of his WCW run or Triple H during his reign of terror from 02-05. Also John did put someone over in his prime (Edge) and it worked well for him considering it was one of his best feuds.
Reclusive Person went heel to heal his career lmao
these questions to Jim are as long as war and peace. Good Lord get to the point listeners!
This was the biggest heel turn. At least the top 3 in many years. I recall this.
if only Russo ended up in ECW... pole matches galore and David Arquette, the King of Hardcore!!
I love the logo. Great show
Hogan didn't leave WWF because he wasn't drawing. He left because he had a baby and a toddler at home and wanted to slow down and look at outside ventures due to nagging injuries and being the Man for 8-9 years who carried the WWF on his shoulders
Hogan's heel turn was Huge! I usually agree with Corny, but it's obvious that he's extremely biased, and he's not being objective.
Absolutely. He didn't like them or Bischoff so he has to downplay it. Same way he tries to downplay Heyman and ECW and pretend his company and ECW were like on the same level even though SMW didn't have a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of the success Heyman/ECW did with what little he/it had.
Corny with the no selling of the heel turn or the NWO. I would embrace it. Wrestling was fully back and both companies did well in the next few years.
As a huge hulkamaniac, by 96 I was 14 and I had become a rebel. I was sick and tired of the red and yellow good guy. And the night this happened I marked out so hard. I cheered so loudly I was so excited. And it only got better. Once they unleash those nWo shirts boy me and about ten other guys in high school wore those every Friday. We actually felt like we were apart of the nWo. looking back this was stupid but we actually went to school looking to fight and kick ass. Anybody who messed with us got a beat down. A lot of suspension but no regrets.
Hogan in his very worst years outdrew Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels.. I mean this is the only man to draw over 30,000,000 PPV buys, so everytime Jim says "Hogan wasn't drawing", I cringe because it is very obvious that he doesn't know a lot about drawing power outside of the companies he ran... I see about 10 HBK's and Bret Hart's in today's WWE, but there hasn't been a Hulk Hogan since Stone Cold Steve Austin.
Justin Jockisch I agree with everything you said except the last thing. John Cena is in the Hulk Hogan category like it or not
Dustin Miller haha Vince tried to make him the next baby face Hulk Hogan, but no he is not in the same category as Hogan. Idk how old you are but in the mid to late 80's (and beyond) Hogan WAS wrestling to the casual (I did say casual) fan or how big he actually was. This was BEFORE social media and internet and 2 kids in the deepest part of Africa, or Korea or wherever knew who Hulk Hogan was. Whenever a non wrestling fan is ask to name a wrestler, and somewhat still, Hogan is the name they know. He took it, with Vince, from high school gyms and VFW halls to a Arena exclusively and built the company. Not Even Austin or the Rock can claim the same career recognition outside the wrestling world. Yes, Duane has been I blockbuster movies but most people besides fans even know he was a wrestler. You just had to be there to know just how over Hulkamania was
Comrade Trump I'm 32, I was there. I was a Hulkamaniac. However, the statement wasn't about matching the level of drawing power, but just being in the same category as Hogan. Rock, Austin, And Cena are world wide known and were before the boom of social media. They were hosts of award shows, multiple times guests on Late night TV, and blockbuster movie stars. That's a fraternity that very few are a part of but Hogan isn't alone w/o peers by any means
Comrade Trump I'd say it's more a function of wrestling's vanishing relevance that how over Cena is.
Cena would be as big as Hogan if wrestling is as big now as it was during Hulkamania.
Justin Jockisch You might "cringe" but Jim is not wrong Hogan wasn't over anymore.His gimmick was dead nobody gave a shit about prayers and vitamins.
Greatest turn in my wrestling lifetime (late 80s to early 2000s). NWO is only reason WCW could compete with WWF.
if it didn't happened hogans career would of died in 1996.
Ryan Benson And Sting until Hogan nixed that
WCW also had better wrestling, better international appeal, more realistic gimmicks, and wasn't confined to it's own companies past experiences... Not to mention the WWF had nothing on the NWO in terms of popularity, aside from Steve Austin.
Justin Jockisch DX was just as hot a faction as nwo
I hope he's not serious. DX didn't draw like NWO did.
"he raised all his eyebrows" as in he had more than two?
To this day I think it was the all time greatest heel turn. Hogan knocked the heel role out of the park with that fucking epic promo he cut at the bash at the beach .
Somebody goin to get blew up with a stick of dynamite just for a 2 count😂
Thunder in paradise and viper. Vehicles that changed were big in the 90s.
It seemed to me that Hogan enjoyed being a heel in WCW more than a face.I understand why he was reluctant at first but once he turned he was on fire.
Hogan's heel turn was cool, and the NWO was fun, but they let it run way too long, and in the end they were instrumental in killing WCW, much to my dismay.
Hogan turning heel in 96 was the best thing to happen since Andre the Giant turned in 87. And it was about time too because everyone was sick of Hogan by 95/96 and he needed a change
Tim Munsey Andre was always a heel to the hotel cleaning staff fanbase
Got into pro wrestling at the age of 4 and now I'm 41, never was a hulkamanic but his heel turn was great. Still love it to this day. The nWo booking, Hogan heel turn. Will never be topped ever.
A lot of people are missing the point. Fans saw it as a big deal because we were watching as fans following a story. Backstage would have been looking at it from a business standpoint. Two entirely different perspectives.
Hulk Hogan vs Ric Flair was pretty big time when Hogan first came to WCW. That was the match fans had wanted to see for 10 years and through most of that 10 years we thought would never happen. When Flair went to WWF we got teased with it but never really got to see it the way we wanted too. When Flair went back to WCW we thought once again we'd never see it.
The WCW had a pretty shitty track record when it came to properly promoting debuts of new talent or big matches etc. but when Hogan came to WCW and almost immediately had a match with Ric Flair they actually did a pretty good job of promoting that one and finally we were going to get to really see the 80s dream match. If you were a Hogan baby face mark you wanted to see Hogan annihilate Flair or if you were a Ric Flair who probably thought Hogan sucked you wanted to see Flair wrestle circles around Hogan and prove that Hogan sucked once and for all.
To me I think that match doesn't get the recognition in hind sight that it deserves. My guess is WWF and Vince like to bury that match to some extent because that is the one match Vince dropped the ball on and the competition capitalizes on. I think in terms of wrestling history that match was a very important match. It was like we could finally lay the 80s pro wrestling to rest and move on to the 90s pro wrestling when the smoke had finally settled on that one. And it was a great match! Two guys that knew how to deliver when the spot light shined the brightest delivered. They both had tremendous egos and neither was going to let it be said that the other guy carried the match. They had something to prove to eachother and to themselves in that one. But yeah after that one it did kind of get like "Okay what do we do now with Hogan for everyone including Terry Bolea.
I was a little kid when this happened. Huge Hulk fan. I fucking BAWLED when this happened. Cried my eyes out.
The real question is was the slick hard?
Cornette always seems to downplay Hogan's impact.
Going back to Lance Storms line about ECW and breaking the rules, anyone know the context of that? Thanks in advance!
He's referring to how ECW broke what was at the time considered wrestling law that you didn't hot shot continuously like they did and make wrestling look over the top and at times comical with the hardcore matches they were having where guys were intentionally hurting themselves on purpose in matches for attention.
@@revans100591
History repeats it's self WWE PG era got people wanting violent wrestling again AEW might or might not give that edgier product and once again it'll run it's course
@@aaronscott4984 and that's something I'm concerned about we could see a brief period of interesting wrestling only to have to deal with 20 years or more of bad or mediocre wrestling after.
At one point in time maybe 2 now, Sir, Hogan was over Hulkamania was a phenomenon. The man was over big time.
The important moral here is sometimes people need a change of scenery to improve. And that can go for both parties.
Hagan and Michaels are the two biggest stats all time in wrestling
Ha! I lived in Morristown and Knoxville.
This is a great question.
Hogan, Rock, Taker and Savage are awesome as heels and faces, Austin and Sting can only do babyface and Flair and HHH can only do heel
Cornette never gives Hogan his due
Beulah vs. Fonzie was a fucking amazing match.
The video thumbnail looks like Hogan is grabbing Scott Hall's junk.
Weren't The Moondogs basically wrestling the ECW style before that though? With Cornette as their manager. They would rush to the ring with chairs, vacuum cleaners and so on. Is that not hypocritical then to say he didn't want to associate with the style of ECW when he previously already did, at least individually if not a whole promotion wrestling just that style. There was definitely a lot of hardcore stuff though back when Cornette was doing his thing. Why is that acceptable but not ECW? Genuinely asking. Was it the out-of-ring antics? The promos and so on that he feels differentiated it?
Blown up with a stick of dynamite but it’s only for a 2 count 😂😂
I remember watching this live as a 7 year old. I was soooooo bummed out. I couldn’t believe it was happening. I remember a buddy of mine back then crying. It was monumental.
And it’s what turned me into the biggest Sting mark haha I already loved the dude but the Crow was fucking awesome.
mike west you don’t remember it
Ronnie B haha I mean, it’s a stupid argument to get into. I definitely watched his heel turn. I couldn’t believe what I was seeing. I was watching it at my grandmas house with 2 friends and my cousin. I still remember it clearly. I was so confused. A buddy of mine started crying haha
I think that was also the first time my cousin told me that wrestling was a work. He was much older than me and my friends, and we all had a serious emotional reaction to it. I think he told us because he could see the horror in our faces and he thought that would console us. But it just made everything 10x worse
So your buddy is a woman now, right?
Richard Tucker lol no, he’s not a woman now.
Well shit, I guess it’s been a good 15 years since I’ve talked to him. He totally could be a woman.
Hogan turning heel was HUGE, i still remember that Bash at the Beach 96... corny sometimes is so blind with his views.
Sorry JEC, you can’t underplay the hogan heel turn
"Guy gets blown up with a stick of dynamite but it's only for a 2 count" ROTFL!!!!!!!!!
I was pretty excited about it lol 😆
Hogan was always a heel. His "friends" were below and beneath him, he took everything he could from the business that made him and gave very little back to it. Look at the business now!
Hogan turning heel seems a natural idea to me, in the 80's it was all about the Rocky idea of the American hero, but in the 90's with films like Pulp Fiction the bad guy became cool and the Rocky ideal was seen as cheesy, so it made sense to turn him heel
Blown up with a stick of dynamite and still be a 2 count 😭😭😭
Of course, it didn’t happen in 1983, or in front of 43 people, nor did it involve the Midnight Express, so of course it’s not of any import to Cornette.
Funny how Jim says he didn’t draw worth a shit in WCW but he still drew better than anyone ever with the company in history
What email do I send my questions to again?
Salvador the Metaphor mandingo4urwife@gmail.com
There is no argument about how big this turn was. International news outlets were discussing the ramifications of Hogan "showing his true colors". There were college kids shown crying and burning their Hogan memorabilia in places even.
I agree with Jim on many things, but the simple truth was Hogan turning heel and the entire nWo story line from mid 1996 to late 1998 was what many people wanted. Everyone crows about the "Attitude Era".. but it was Mick Foley beating the Rock on Raw that one night that really turned the tide in WWF/E's favor.
Now.. Vince is in a *_WORSE_* position right now than he was then.. and still pretending it couldn't happen for real....
Hogans heel turn got me back into wrestling after a 8 year break.
It's odd to me Vince not watching his own Product! To pick it apart to try to make it better!
“You needed a fresh coat of paint, and different matches, against different people, in a different area, And that’s pretty much the only way you can get anybody over again once they’ve gone downhill.”
That is one of the big reasons why professional wrestling worked under the territory system. A wrestler that got stale in Memphis could go to Dallas a wrestler that needed a new gimmick could go to Louisiana, etc.
But, once cable TV allowed wrestling promotions to go to a national audience, then there was nowhere besides maybe Japan for a wrestler to go once his gimmick got stale.
I think there were options the problem was considering wrestlers to turn face if they were prominent heels or a prominent face to turn heel potentially risking any merchandise money he could potentially make. That was a big deal for guys during the territory and later cable years within wrestling. Its the primary reason Hogan stayed a face for years and Flair remained a heel for years
Uh, that Francine/ Bill Alfonso match was awesome.
If Vince Russo was such a huge ECW mark, I'm surprised he never tried to go there and write for them. Maybe Paul E. wouldn't let him?
The Game Dyke: I think Heyman but he wouldn't have put up with his shit to the level Vince did. Heyman didn't have an army of middle-men to balance Russo out. Once Russo's aims became clear, I'm sure Paul would've fired his ass.
Heyman actually understood the wrestling business. Russo wouldn't have made it through the door.
Only person bigger than hogan in my childhood was the great bob backlund
In all the accounts I've heard, It was Hogan that wanted to do the initial heel turn.
It WAS HUGE then but it wasnt JUST HOGAN that made it so. Back then i watched both shows after working 12 hours and strongly favoured WCW. As i chronologically rewatch NOW (im in 97’) i enjoy wwF much much more than the goofy Turner offering
I always laugh when people ask guys who worked in the WWF with Vince if they watched various wrestling shows from other companies. Obviously the merits of the question make sense that you’d expect a company in a head to head battle like they were at the time to keep up with what the other company were doing to at a minimum being able to possibly adjust your programming to counter against whatever they happened to be putting out in the market. Market research in a sense like that would make sense for most normal people. The reason it always makes me laugh when it gets asked from the WWF people is thinking about it in context of the life those people would’ve been living while working in a role close to Vince at the time. When you think of the absurd amount of hours you always hear that people had to put in when they worked in those roles it becomes funny to think about any of them watching the competitors product. The idea that somebody would be putting in 12+ hour days consistently in their job at all random hours of the day that Vince works finally being able to go home and then watching a wrestling show is genuinely hilarious to consider. If you were putting that much time in working on your own show all the time I bet the very last thing you’d consider watching in your minimal time away from work being a wrestling show. I don’t think I’d even want to watch a wrestling show when I finally left the office working a normal 40 hour workweek much less the absurd schedule these guys had to work.
Hogan needed to turn. The fallout was toxic af tho. Helped to expedite WCWs end.
Which bill alfonso match was he talking about?
Remember the Yoko feud brings me back
wcw in summer 96 was the only show to watch. made me a wcw fan til the end despite how bad it actually got.
Hogan and Bret were the last two big stars to resurrect their careers being able to jump a big ship to another big ship; except for the big merge after Vince bought everything. Now the only other options wrestler have is to make movies or join UFC if they're young enough.
No the option now is to go indie or go to Japan if that doesn't work then movies or the UFC.
Bret didn't resurrect his career in WCW.