Is the Thrustmaster T300RS STILL Worth It in 2024?! (Honest Review)
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- čas přidán 26. 06. 2024
- The Thrustmaster T300RS was released in 2016! Is it STILL worth it today?!
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Lowest Priced T300RS Bundle: geni.us/QujH
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Product sent by Thrustmaster for review.
Chapters:
0:00 Intro
1:32 What's Included?
1:52 Pedals
4:25 Steering Wheel
5:52 Wheel Base
9:30 Still Worth It?
10:44 Conclusion
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Written Review: www.ocsimracing.com/reviews/thrustmaster-t300-rs-gt
I'm a beginner Simracer and this is my first Wheel... I highly recommend it... Having sooo much fun!
Its still so surprising how good belt driven wheels can feel in these sims.
Have one for about 4 years...top notch, assetto corsa with content manager is a must. Still running as the 1st day.
You can put a little piece with rubber (included in the box) to give a much better feeling to the brake pedal 👍
@@KTMLaranjinha brother does it still competitive wheel? i bought several days ago and i am waiting for delivery. I want to play iracing types of game.
Very good. Top quality.👍
@@klovez49in a nutshell, any wheel with FFB can be competitive if you spend more time getting the feel for it. I think I remember someone mentioning that in a video somewhere.
Also I bought the T300RS a month or so ago as an upgrade to my controller (and I became love racing/driving games, it just made sense) and I've been enjoying it so far on Assetto Corsa, BeamNG and Dirt Rally 2015.
Dirt with a steering wheel is heavenly.. especially coming from a controller 👌@@perezadotarts
Thanks a lot for this review! I am considering this wheel even tho its older. Looking for the proper wheel for me has been a bit confusing but your videos have helped so much. I have watched your older videos and your older t300 review multiple times to make my decision easier. Your videos are greatly appreciated!!!!!
Thanks for mentioning countries outside US, Europe and Japan. The Fanatec DD PRO here in Brazil is still in the 2000 US Dollares mark.
Good video!
Got mine for 230$ used & just 4 months old and feels awesome! Great review
i am thinking about buying this for my birthday for some time now. couldn't find good reviews expect yours a while ago. so glad you made another one. Respect
Glad I could help!
@@OCRacing got a question. There's a TX leather edition for 300$ no shipping its a local. Is it worth?
@@sandro_abesait’s not a bad deal, although if you can and are willing to save a bit extra the Moza R5 bundle is $460 at microcenter so if you’re willing to spend the extra $160 I’d go for that instead.
Hbd bro 🎉🥳
@@yahyagamal8326 it's not till June but thanks bro ♥️♥️
As long as Moza can't deliver the R3 and Fanatec is filing bankruptcy, Thrustmaster, Logitech, PXN, and Hori is more relevant for the beginning Sim racing market.
Honestly this is probably true. At the moment, neither Fanatec or Moza are targeting the VERY entry-level market. However, I wouldn't say the T300 is in that segment either, at it's current $450, I would say this is very much in contention against the R5 from Moza and CSL Wheelbase by Fanatec.
@@OCRacingFanatec was bought by Corsair so they ain't going bankrupt
@@IMX383Did you see the meme of the future Corsair/Fanatec wheel that was one giant RGB ring? That was a good one.
@@dauntae24 I saw that one
@@IMX383the deals still in the works, while it’s more than likely to go thru. Until Corsair has officially acquired Fanatec anything’s possible
Had a great run with my T300! Can’t recommend enough as a first second hand wheel
I just wanted to say that I'm a big man. 6ft 3inchs. And I don't mind the size of the wheel. I've owned it since 2018 with no problems. Love the channel. One con is the lack of wheels in the aftermarket.
You don't need 3rd party mods for the T3PA pedals, use the provided conical brake mod and calibrate them properly in your games and you CAN get more reliable braking and lower the chances of a lock up, yeah you lose pedal travel as a result but you DO get physical resistance underfoot making trailbraking achievable and braking far more consistent in general than without it.
My biggest issue with the T300RS GT ed is that it costs waay too much new e.g. £354 on Amazon in the UK (or £379 from TM directly) vs say the CSL DD ready to race bundle with the added Loadcell pedal and desk clamp costing just £488.20.
The 2nd biggest problem with the pedals is the same issue you get with the G series pedal sets, dust and dirt ingress into the base which invariable ends up trapped in the gearing mech connecting the pedal pivot to the potentiometer, potentially causing pedal flutter of 1-5% on the brakes or an inability to get max throttle if even a single hair gets caught in the mech, in the 6 years I had mine I went through 3 sets of T3PA pedals adding £240 to the overall cost, through either pots wearing out or dirt becoming trapped and being ridiculously hard to clean.
True it's a great starter wheel and I used one for around 6 years but imo you're far better off getting it 2nd hand off Ebay for £150-200 and then getting the T-LCM pedals which can be found 2nd hand for £60. hell I'm seeing the non GTE versions for £100, meaning you can get them both for £160.
The wheelbase itself is practically bombproof and afaik my old wheel is still working just fine 8 years after I bought it. Just don't buy it brand new.
If you have the money to buy brand new? Then save an extra £130 and get the CSL DD with LC pedal set and get a much MUCH better product from day 1.
Bruh!!!! You're almost at 100k!!! I remember when i subscribed to you when you had less than 10k
Been waiting for this!
Made it just for you 😉
The people have been!
I’ve used this wheel since 2017, the base t300rs not gt. I never had any problems till I plugged it in the wrong plug and fried it. It’s the only wheel I’ve ever used so this review was really helpful
Mine's still going strong after one year (got it on sale for $320). However, I did get a set of T-LCM's, got a TH8S shifter, and swapped the base wheel rim out with a 13 inch one (one that still allows you to use the buttons). Overall though, love it! I may sell it down the road, but for now it works for me.
The cockpit mount for the pedals is not overkill because they do slide across the floor. I have them and before I mounted them they always moved. And if you use the conical mod or a DIY loadcell, you will definitely need to mount them.
I got a t300rs gt at the beginning of the year and it’s amazing.
Rocking the t300 for almost a decade now !
And me 😁
Does yours 'wobble' a bit when it does the initial start up? When mine spins it almost looks like the wheel is installed incorrectly that is how much it wobbles.
@@kylerobinson6102 no all good 🙏
I am between this and a DD bundle solution (not for cage). The problem is that I want it for both PC and PS4 , be able to put it at table and not to make noise like 923. Unfortunately, the cheapest I have found is Fanatec gran turismo gg pro but it costs 600+ euro :(
9:05 you don't need to undo the small screw all the way, you can leave it in the collar, that way you won't lose it
About 2-1/2 years ago, I bought a used T300RS GT with used T3PA-Pro pedals (these pedals are practically full metal and can be inverted, which mine are). I ditched the stock wheel rim and have a new Sparco P310, and added a new TH8A shifter and a new TSS handbrake. I am a massive Thrustmaster fan, as my first one was in the mid 99s with a Formula T1 (which I still have displayed on a shelf), and when I got back into sim racing after a 20ish year hiatus, got a Thrustmaster Ferrari Wireless GT Cockpit 430 Scuderia Edition for the portable convenience.
For the amount of time I get to race, for the price I paid for the entire ecosystem, at the time I bought it all I would have paid the same amount for a entry DD base, basic wheel and a 2 pedal set. So I feel like this was the best choice for me overall, and I have no complaints using it with my triple screens, used VR (that I bought for $50 CND) and Logitech surround sound.
I would like to do a future update, when one of our kids moves out, and be able to use one of the rooms for a full motion rig, large triples, and then a nice DD with load cell.pedals. I even know every brand I would buy for each item also. I just have to be patient!
Race dad race
I used to have two setups, G29 and T300, one for college and one for home. Back then, I felt like G29 was like a toy to me compared to T300, it felt so loose and I was about a second per lap slower on G29. Several months ago I bought DDpro to replace G29, and to my surprise I'm not significantly slower on T300. But after using load cell pedals, it's hard to find the same consistency on T3PA. So I think I'll be purchasing TLCM for the my next upgrade.
But for those who are looking for a new setup, I would definitely not recommend T300. A T300 with TLCM is almost the same price as the cheapest Fanatec DD wheel with load cell or a pretty good Moza wheel bundle. Not to mention that T300 has cooling issue, the force feedback lost about 50% after playing for like 20 mins. I did some modifications to fix it and it's fine now, but you can just plug and play if you go for other better wheels.
I used this exact wheelbase for many, many years. I switched over to Fanatec DD but gave this to my roomie who is still using it two years later. It's all but indestructible and works more than good enough, If you want well proven durability and simple and low cost upgradability, which includes the quick release (a cheap sleeve lock upgrade works wonders for it) this is still a great option. I'd honestly buy it again, no joke.
Hmm this is probably the first time T300/TX and proven durability has been said in the same sentence. This base is notorious for overheating which leads to bad ffb fade and burnt out motors. You are obviously very lucky with the one you got
@@robertcarr4172 And YOU need to stop reading about/looking at reviews on stuff and actually try using it. No one I know, and I know more than a few, who use this wheelbase ever overheated. They all work fine and last for many, many years. You'll also get great warranty service (at least in the US), try the same with Fanatec---and I own both so I know that as well. Instead of listening to reviewers who use it for a few weeks at best, get one yourself and make up your own mind in the end.
Got this as my introduction into sim racing a month or two ago , and so far I'm having a blast using on it. It's definitely quiet, the rim it comes with looks nicer in person, FFB is very good (it feels strong to me still since it's my first time, but other than that it's smooth), and I feel it is very worth it for what it's being offered at.
I definitely recommend it for those on a slightly decent budget and just starting out 🙂
Does it overheat?
@@dvnny1680 nope, used it for 4-5 hours on most days at 85% FFB Strength (the default), and there isn't any loss in feedback.
I did make sure to take some precautions with turning Fan Mode to always on by pressing 2 buttons on the unit just to be on the safe side of things.
I buy a used one in 2022 and i still have it ! Best wheel if you want to start any sim (racing,drifting,rallye…)
I just got the T818 as an upgrade to my T300 (found the SF1000 + T818 bundle for $800) and it's shocking how much better direct drive is, zero noise, zero latency, lightning fast movements (downright dangerous at times), and overall much more rigid feeling
More points to mention:
-Tons more detail felt
-No fan, so no fan noise when it's pushed to the limit continuously
-Unlike belt and gear driven wheels, it can give all the feedback you need while being light to steer (like how it should)
But doesn't have PlayStation compatibility :/
@@mateuszs6666 Yeah, that's what threw me off paying $1200 for the bundle, but as soon as I saw the $800 Amazon listing I had to do it as it's not an easy wheel to get where I am to begin with
Here's hoping that they secretly put a PS compatibility chip inside and all it needs is a firmware update somehow lol
@@MrTARIQSs they legally wouldnt be able to sell it even with disabled chip as that what Fanatec was going to do with its newer PS5 wheel and Sony blocked them and told them they cant sell it without being approved by sopny even with disabled PS5 security chip so in the end Fanatec had to delay untill Sony gave them the green light to do so
I've been using the T300RS ~4 years, for about a year or two I have been dealing with the FFB shutting off due to overheating after about a hour of play in games like DiRT Rally 2.0 and doing rally/off-roading in Forza Horizon 5, and the cooling fan inside is pretty loud and doesn't do too great of a job at keeping the FFB motor cool, although the solution is to mod the wheelbase to use a Noctua NF-A6x25 FLX fan which is ~$20 USD, but requires soldering to install due to the fan using a 3-pin PWM connector if you don't have a 2-3 pin adaptor.
I'm a SimRacing "beginner" (did race motocross / Enduro for over 10y irl thou) and i bought this a year ago for 279€ on a sale. At the time the R5 was 499€+ shipping where i live. Since i only do VR-Rallye / MODs. this was a no brainer. I put in around 700h and the wheelbase is as good as new (exchanged the wheel for an actual Rallye car wheel, cuz i'm tall and the wheel felt way too small. Hope this'll help someone?!
Great wheel! Have minimum on 300 hrs in the last year for drifting 🤘🏻 no issues
Proudly still using it
After many years with various Logitech products )8 years with a G29) I found a T300 with the extra Sparco wheel used for $300AUD. The pedal set with the conical brake mod is excellent but remember to calibrate in game.
It makes the G29 feel like a toy.
I play AC with CM.
Using a T150 with just gas/brake pedals. Would I notice that much of a difference and would the T300 wheel actually help lower lap times?
Bought mine about 2 months ago for £290 or 360 dollars and its been great 👍
He remains the undisputed best Thrustmaster T300RS for all professionals and beginners from all sides thank you for the wonderful video 💯👌
You should check out MVH Studio's F1 series wheels, could be a game changer for the Logitech(or Fanatec/Moza) users
Is it really that big of a difference in something like the moza r5 compared to the t300?
Got mine for little over a year now (€270 brand new, got lucky with a discount) and have to say it's been wonderful except for the fact that the wheel rim as fewer buttons than the G29 I previously owned (got the SF1000 add-on and solved that part of the problem), and no leather also which was a shame. But overall i felt like that the T300 was sn improvement over the G29, better FF overall and no noisy gears (belt > gears). But the biggest issue with the T300 is that you'll probably have to upgrade the fan, I've had some issues with some kind of overheating and losing FF, and will defo upgrade the fan soon. But even though it's a great wheel, for the normal price that you can get this bundle is way to expensive comparing to some offerings with DD. Makes no sense that brands still practice these high prices on non-DD wheel bases...
This but TX leather edition and moza r3 bundle is similar price in Australia so I ordered r3 bundle
Great wheel just had some over heating issue but over all it’s a great way to start sim racing still a good wheel
Bought mine last year no regrets
Glad to hear 👍 is it holding up well?
my quick release screw went missing
@@OCRacing yes but the cover snapped😅
I need help guys. I have this steering wheel and the 2 pedal option. I try to use it on f1 23 which working good for like 20 seconds but after the gas pedal stop working. Break pedal is good but the accelerator not working. Any help ?
I literally bought one yesterday
I’ve had mine for what? 2 days? And I’m loving it! And even better, I got mine for AU$250!
Should i get this used or brand new?
Im daily user of the t300 in acc 😅 100% ffb and booat checked and 80% force in acc, never clips and gives solid ffb. Im using a acelith gt wheel mod on it. Pedals sucks and broke after 4 weeks so im using csl pedals.
im looking to get into sim racing and am looking at getting my first force feedback wheel. I’ve been looking at the t300, the t248, and possibly the fanatec gran turismo dd pro if fanatec gets there problems figured out. which wheel should I get?
If it helps, i recently bought my first set up. I got a Playseat Challenge X and a T300 RS GT. I couldn't be happier with them both. I'm sure people will frown upon it, but as a wheel to start out with, I personally think it's really good. I mainly play GT7 and ACC. I'm sure DD wheels are way better, but for the money, I don't think you'll be disappointed. Happy shopping 🏁
I agree with the other comment but I already fell into the ecosystem trap:
I was also thinking about Fanatec CSL because bundles start at 400€. But during a refurbished sale at the TM online shop I bought a T300 with Ferrari Alcantara wheel. That wheel is a step up compared to the regular T300, T150 etc. Some weeks later there was another refurbished sale at TM online shop and I added the 28cm leather wheel and LC pedals. That feels more like a real brake.
I bought the additional steering wheel to not wear out that nice Alcantara wheel and in case I want to fiddle around with different rims.
I just built a sim rig with wood. It needs some tweaking but is stiffer than I expected. And it was fun to think about how it could be done, see some things working and others needing improvements. I'm not good at working with wood but it was fun.
Hi, I have a Thrustmaster t300rs GT but when I turn the steering wheel it looks like the buttons are pressed along with the steering wheel. What's the solution?
still worth it
i beginner simracing
so this T300 much more better than G29/G923
also can add on handbrake or shifter or change for better steering wheel or pedal
If i turn off ffb then does it will get heat or not ?.
I used one for about a year and while it was nice I feel like it's a pointless buy nowadays. Best upgrade path is start on a used Logitech wheel from fb marketplace then if you stick with it go straight to dd.
I bought the TX when my trusty noisy Logitech G920 started falling to bits. Force feedback on the TX/T300rs is just better than the Logitech G920 an similar. The supplied pedals (T3PA?) are rubbish mines lasted less than a year and where not nearly as good as the Logitech G25 pedals that I was using with the G920. I got lucky and got a set of the Thrustmaster load cell pedals used but perfect for £80 30 mins drive away. Load cell pedals are the best upgrade for anyone in my opinion. I've moved onto a DD wheel now but the TX was great
thank you SOO MUCH fir this vid . My parents said that if i get a scolarship they'll buy me one !!!!!
Sounds like a great deal for the parents 🤣
Is this more durable than the G923?
Still going strong after 4 years.
Use an Acelith 🇮🇹 open wheel steering mod on it.
2 of the pedal springs broke in 4 years of use. Easy fix.
Bro of I turn off ffb then wheel won't got heat up ? I want to make sure it stays for long time
@@liamsmith455 never had overheating issues.
Where I live a t300rs gt cost $650 and the r5 bundle cost $900 :(
I found a t300rs gt for 150 usd 2nd hand is it worth it?
Its a great wheel, but only because of console compatibility. Otherwise, cammus has the best offers currently
I need a new mid to high end wheel for ps5 what do you reccomend?
I would recommend the Fanatec GT DD Pro. You can find my review on it here: czcams.com/video/Rb0WX9XZ6LI/video.html&ab_channel=OCRacing
How can you talk about the T3PA and not mention the conical brake mod?
In India Fanatec has no sales or service support. Moza and Thrustmaster exists through third party dealers and are mostly overpriced 😢
I bought a t300 with the f1 wheel add on and the ferrari 599xx evo wheel and fanatec csl elite v2 pedals for 340 dollars was it worth it?
And its used of course
The wheel rim is bigger than the logitech rim for those wondering. The force feedback is much better than logitech.
are the pedals better or the same as the g29s?
Ngl they better
Is just the steering wheel on sale anywhere? i have a t300 but with a swapped wheel and no padel shifters so im searching for one
I don’t believe so but let me know if you find anything
@@OCRacing alright, thanks
Recently TM online shop had refurbished 28cm leather wheels. There's also a bundle of 599XX Alcantara wheel and headphones that's worth a look imo.
Edit: I heard that the 488 GT wheel is quite good but not cheap.
This review will be worth watching if I won it on a draw with it and a PS5. The catch is I need save BND 200 for a copy of GT7 and either a TH8S or TH8A shifter. The problem is I'm currently waiting for my friend's Logitech G29 because he upgraded to a Moza R5. If it arrives, what should I do with it
Also I'm planning to start sim racing, still a beginner to this scene. Please do consider that in mind
Love the t300rs gt but I’d get the moza r5. Good vid oc!
I agree, thanks for the comment 🤝
i bought one in august last year, and i do very much enjoy it, but it doesn't come close to the quality of the moza r5 for almost the same price. i wish i just went full moza, but i can't really do anything about it now.
@@seallz same but I got mine during Christmas 2021 so that was before the cheap dd bundles
Only for a beginner, have a good weekend Oscar😊😮🥓🙋👍
I am watching this even having fanatec clubsport v2.5
Is the V2.5 holding up well?
is the only wheel i have tried besides g29 so i will say yes
Can you do this with the T-GT II?
Yes but not the price lol
I've actually created a video on the T-GT II, you can find it here: czcams.com/video/7r6HL8WVgY0/video.html&ab_channel=OCRacing
I'll try to get my hands on one again to create a more updated review though.
Never buy belt driven wheels over 4nm
@@jarmoac Why ??
@@THESHADOW97139 used for a good price is ok but if you're buying a new one buy a direct drive
@OCRacing I am a huge fan of your channel I would love to make a video with you I understand your busy but if you would I would very much appreciate it I would also like a shoutout but I understand if not and by the way another banging video
No, I had it, you get locked into an ecosystem where the parts are always in the low to mid quality range. Which is fine for the affordable range, but once you want a step up it’s very limited.
I went to a moza r12 and haven’t gone back. I wanted the option of higher end rims and the sf1000(which I had) didn’t quite do it for me. The creaky plastic just was not it imo
Imo If you’re just starting out get the g920 or g29. Yes it’s loud and the gears can be annoying but you won’t experience the slip that the t300 base is suspect to with its belts.
G29’s are a lot easier to resell on the open market due to their inherent compatibility and there are less parts to lose.
Then when touching on upgrading to another ecosystem you only have to spend ~$200 more than you bought the bundle Logitech for to get a dd kit from fanatec
@@Tyler_Evans0411 In all honesty, have you tried both??
gt is just a gt wheel right? same as normal t300 rs no big dif? i can just buy the normal one
I think the pedals are different. ne has a clutch pedals and afaik these pedals are better in general.
Or you get the cheaper one and upgrade to the LC pedals.
second hand they go for €150 here so that's a good deal
face reveal this year at 100k just reminding u
any t300rs and t500rs are worth it but i wouldnt buy new ones i found both t300 and t500 on facebook both were 300€ with the t300 the guy was giving the gt wheel and with the t500 the guy was giving f1 ferrari wheel
Is is compatible on xbox??
Thrustmaster TX is an xbox compatible version of T300. I have it (using it with Series X) and I love it.
Claim your early my wheel ticket here
Rare new version of the ticket claim 😳
amazing
You sir are the first comment. This is for you: 🥇
It’s so good I still go back to it from my Clubsport dd+ because of the ease of use across the board. Like goosiest says it’s literally the best plug and play wheel for PlayStation
Hmm, never thought I’d hear someone say they’ll go back from a DD+ to it. What exactly makes its ease of use “easier” compared to the DD+? Just wondering because I’ve used both on PlayStation and they both equally connect and function the same on that interface
@@OCRacing goosiest said it perfectly, no complicated tuning needed to jump from game to game. playstation ACC is especially tricky to get realistic ffb on My DD without excessively messing with the settings. Also certain games like drive-club and other older games just plain suck on Dd drives because they aren’t as compatible software wise as a t300. It just works very well in terms of plug and play on almost all games new and old ps or pc.
It feels like Thrustmaster and Logitech is kinda obsolete for racing sim today.
W Video
i mean, i paid 250 euros for this bundle new in 2021. at that price it would still be a steal, a 360, clearly not
$250 for this bundle would be a steal! Now I can only find them for minimum $450
@@OCRacing 😰
Definitely not worth it, that base overheats badly. Unless you run wrong the FFB low and in that case use a G29 instead. If you are new to sim racing and want to start with a legit belt system base and playing on console. The best bet will be a T-GT II which is way better than the T300.
People do not buy this wheel new it's just not worth it. Get it used!!!! Save your money. They go for the same as a G29 in the UK and are milleess better.
Disagree (in general) and here's why:
1. While yes this is a sim channel, every channel like this forgets or neglects to mention games like Forza Horizon, The Crew, and NFS type racers (simcade), and for those, this wheel is perfect. As those don't need or use a lot of NMs to replicate real world civilian vehicles.
2. For some reason every channel like this loves to say that Fanatec and Moza offerings are comparable in price. That's flat out incorrect. To buy even the cheapest comparable setups from those boutique vendors it is 2x the price. Not to mention Fanatec having awful customer service and seems to be going out of business (rumors), what seems quite often.
3. Also, these channels never mention game compatibility, only platform compatibility. For the aforementioned games (Forza Horizon for example), The Thrustmaster and Logitec are an out of the box, plug and play experience. Meanwhile the Fanatac forums are littered with people trying to make their wheels function with these games.
Bottom line, if you are a hardcore sim racer, yeah, go for the cheapest Fanatec (etc) DD, and build up your rig piecemeal. If you want to play full on as soon as you drive home from Microcenter or BestBuy, then the T300 is your best bet. I built a full rig with a T300, T8h shifter, cheap amazon handbrake, and an A Frame cockpit, all for under $800 AND was playing with no fuss no compatibility issues instantly. No one can even come close to doing that with a Moza etc.
Some remarks:
1. and 3. Thrustmaster and Logitech wheels have quite a long list of games they are compatible with. They also (most of their wheels) support one console or the other. Afaik the cheapest Fanatec base isn't PS compatible yet.
2. Not sure if it's really 2x. Cheapest Fanatec bundle is 400€, T300 is usually 3xx€. Ckeapest load cell pedals are around 200€ for both.
But there's quite a rabbit hole at Fanatec because you can configure your own bundles. Add LC brake pedal and a wheel where rim and hub are seperate, 400€ turn into ca. 600€
But to be fair, T300 with interchangeable wheels is not that much better.
Can I have one?
7
8
what wheel do you normaly use HA HA HA HA
Last
For a few seconds you were
Comment 28 woot woot yeaaaaaaaaa son
Comment 28 is ELITE
@@OCRacing doing the Patrick Bateman point, oh yeah
E
actually first to comment (pls pin)
Unfortunately you were not 🥲
@@OCRacing still gonna watch the video, this "hobby" has dominated me
No, this phile of plastic is too expansive for what it is.
its quite a shame thrustmaster is pretty much dead in 2024 i mean their new rim is overpriced as heck
gateway drug
Entrance to the ecosystem rabbit hole because it has interchangeable wheels, shifters and optional LC pedals :-o