This Little Mark May Save Your Sanity, Or At Least Your Material.
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- čas přidán 3. 03. 2020
- If you've ever struggled with inaccurate cuts or misaligned layout marks, it might be wise to take a look at your marking technique. While there is no right or wrong way to do things, in this video I show you the way I mark my material most often to take the guesswork out of measuring tasks. (Please note that this technique is not just for cutting. Apparently that was the message that a lot of you thought I was sending and I apologize for any confusion. The following link is to a followup video if you're interested or need more information. • Marking Material For C... )
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One thing to add: When doing crow's feet, always have unequal length lines in your "v". The side with the longer line is the waste side, so you know which side of the cut to put the saw blade's kerf on. I can mark a 2x4 roughly in the middle, toss it to my apprentice, and he automatically knows which of the 2 is the piece I need before he cuts it. Small tick on the good side, long leg on the waste side.
That's the way I was taught basically. The squared mark is your inside cutting edge, the angle mark points to the scrap side/ cutting side.
I put an “x” on the cut side but the longer leg is a good trick. Might try that
@@lac1260 It saves confusion. The "x" is usually reserved to denote "stud" or "structural member" in non-framing applications. Can get confusing if there are "x"s left on your material from a previous cut.
I WAS wondering why the word "kerf" wasn't brought up even once in the video.
That's the way I do it. Not sure if I was taught that picked it up from someone or just did it on my own.
I love the craftsman space on CZcams and this video is such a great example, it's just a bunch of people sharing the lessons they learned along the way trying to help anyone they can really. Props to you.
I use old tried and true method of:
Measure, Cut, Curse, Measure, Mark, Cut, and probably Curse some more.
Passed down to me thru generations of highly skilled profanitors
It’s clear you care about helping people. Inspiring, indeed. Keep up the good work(s).
Was taught to do a modified crows foot using a small tick as the cut line, and long tick indicating the cut off. The cut guy always know how to interpret the mark and orientation.
In fine woodworking, the EDGE of the mark is the cut line, not the mark itself. That gets you accurate placement even if you're using a pencil, crayon, chalk, or whatever.
I use the line-plus-X method: the X is the waste side, and the farthest line edge away from the X is where the edge of board must be after the cut, even if the line itself isn't straight (because I marked it by feel instead of sight).
His point about being able to tell the orientation of the mark after you clean up your shop on Friday is why I stopped using tics. Good video.
I cannot tell you how useful these precision issue videos are. I work in miniature, so a 32nd of an inch can matter to me. I have looked and looked for someone to talk about exact and precise measurement techniques. Now I have found it. Thank you
Wow, this is a video on communications. Not only with other workers but your furure self. If you pick up that board in the future you know where to cut. Brilliant.
Measure Twice,
Saw Once.
|< is how my old mentor taught me in the cabinet shop. The crowsfoot pointed to the side to cut on.
Or if Centered |
C
|
With the vertical line through the --C-- .
Good tip is to know the work of how others do theirs and then you can both make same mistakes as each other.
The |< method is great if using a speed square, but when freehand marking, leaving the potential of veering off slightly, it could be easy to mess that up. Obviously, if it’s your work and your shop, you know your system. For example if I accidentally make a mark like \< I know that the bottom point to my “less than” sign is my reference. But someone else may not know that and cut the other point.
My first vid watching you, but I'm sold. Not only good info, but well examined and explained, with a useful narrative to tie it to real-world use. Welp, I'm sold.
I am not sure if you have ever considered being a teacher of this craft. There is a shortage of educators, just imagine if you were able to get this into the minds of the youth.....life changing~The videos and information are awesome.
Now this is a tutorial! Well done young man.
Wow, that was very informative! Thanks a ton man! I framed years ago, and now I find myself in the middle of a monster remodel in our house. Nobody ever took the time to explain any of that when I was framing, i started with the tick mark, also got laughed at, and was showed the crows foot. After watching this, I never did it correctly! Lol thanks for taking the time to make and edit a video on this. Any negative comments can go pound sand. Keep on teaching, you've got lots of skill sets!
Jodee, keep this going, i hope it is more than paying your bills. I have subscribed to a lot of woodworking channels and yours is my fave, you knocked off Cam as my fave lol. Stay on the same train of thought, we all know how to hack together a cutting board or table, but its the little things that you bring up that makes a difference. My 2 cents.
I do a P shape with the point being the mark and the O part of the P being the waste side. Its quite quick to do on any square too to mark waste side of the line. That way I get a perfect tick and also what side my kurfs on
Wow thanks for sharing! I haven't seen that one before!
Also good idea! Especially to highlight the wast side
I was going to ask how to know what side to cut in. That is usually my issue. Thanks for the solution.
I like that idea. The tick mark or V mark has never worked well for me as I often get confused by which was my waste side, I am going to try the P mark.
I like the P and am going to try it. For me I can see the circle as representing the curf. Thanks!! Good video though!
Your video makes me appreciate videos that get to the point.
I was taught the crow's foot mark by my dad when I was young. My understanding is that a tick mark might get visually lost if you look away from the piece, but the crow's foot grabs your attention and is hard to mistake. In that sense it has been quite useful to me.
I’m a sewer and this technique will certainly help me when marking fabric.
I just watched a bunch of your videos telling us to never measure anything for a perfect fit. Then I watched this one thats 8 minutes telling us how to measure perfectly... and yet they both make perfect sense together. Ain't woodworking fun:)
I like a crows foot with the angled line on the waste side. Thanks for the video.
Yes I’ve seen that before too! Thanks for sharing. I use this style for more than just cut lines. I use it for connecting two points a lot too. So for me it’s more of a one-size-fits-all marking system.
I was taught a dot with a half circle on the side I pulled from.
Same. Angled line on the waste side.
I do this both in woodworking, and my day job as a sheet metal fabricator.
You definitely need more than just a tick mark to find your scribed mark on galvanized steel.
That's how I was taught to do it so you know where to put the saw blade.
That's a brilliant idea! I've always made the crow's foot, but I've never thought to angle it towards the waste. I'm going to do this from now on
I go with a small single tick mark and a small X on one side of it to indicate which side of the mark I want the kerf on. I know it wouldn't matter for construction work, but for nicer stuff, approaching "fine" woodworking, it does. :)
Adam Tuttle that’s what I do
Me 2 for atleast for the dowls jig
thank you so much for your comment, keeping it straight which side the kerf should be on has always been a problem for me and the best i could do is just say half the distance of the saw blade is about the closet tolerance i can get, REAL PROBLEM sometimes
I do the same thing but with a "C" for "Cut." Might start using an X now though since C's are tough to write on rough surfaces
I do the same thing but with an 2 lines in at an angle to indicate which side I want as the finished piece. Looks like this >|
I'm a professional boatbuilder building high quality offshore sailing yachts for 40+ years...... That was one of the simplest, and BEST explanations about a seemingly simple, but crucial aspect of building..... anything. Well done! My one criticism is you reminded me of all the OH! S**T! moments I had over the years. Some still hurt :)
This is great for those who have never measured and cut anything in their lives or on the first day on the job as a carpenter intern. For those who have done this for half a dozen times, you will develop your own way to mark and cut accurately in no time. It is so common sense.
I agree with the exception that "common sense" is really not so common anymore...
From a former "cut guy" you get 👍👍
I'm not seeing this stuff taught anymore to the new guys.
After a couple weeks a new guy would be shown this stuff by one of the ole heads.
Your a great teacher, ALWAYS enjoy your vids.
Being a structural welder fitter, I always use the crows foot. being super tight tolerance I modify it some. Instead of using the tip of the foot as my intended point, I use where the two lines intersect. This allows room to adjust a mark. So if I need to mark at six inches and my initial mark is off by a 32nd or a 16th I can adjust my second mark to intersect precisely at six inches.
This is how I have been doing it for years now. The point where the length mark and the waste line intersect is the exact measurement point.
I love your video.
I have been doing woodworking for over 40 years and I still learn something each time I watch one of your video.
THANK YOU SO MUCH.
Great video on something so easy and important. Knowing which side is the waste side, as mentioned by other comments, is vital. One more thing. A Corollary to Murphy's Law is "Nothing is foolproof because Fools are so ingenious". But again, a great video on such a simple topic...
Great video. As a Plumber, we use a Crows Foot to Mark Pipes for cutting, but use the angles line to show the waste/off-cut price of pipe.
Also, the guy up the ladder/scaffolding etc measures & marks the pipe/tube. The cutter only cuts, of course this isn’t always practical with 6meter lengths of pipe, But on noisy Building Sites, it reduces the chance of communication errors.
I love your videos! You helped me so much by starting my woodshop! Thank you! 😊 😊😊👍
Woodworking for me is therapy. I love it. Keep up the humility. Subscription added
Excellent...BIG PICTURE...message...Consistency in method and understanding...
As for "Best Method" or what to add...Traditional understanding and standardization. Most American woodworkers (even most professionals) have never been taught an ancient method (or several of them) from unbroken or still intact woodworking linages. These by far have the most consistency and brilliance to their modality and meads of layout...case in point...what we use in China, Korea, and Japan as three (of many) excellent examples...
Thanks for another great video...!!!
I'm new to woodworking and have watched a few hundred videos in the last few months just to get some exposure to "how it is done". This type of video is FANTASTIC! It is the type of thing that the "old guy" would show you if he was working next to you.
Much appreciated!
Awesome information! I'm sure we all can appreciate your knowledge in carpentry.
Thanks for the tips, most people do ignore this, but it’s damn crucial.
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Video I actually clicked on: Plays for half a second, audio cuts out, video stutters, freezes when rewound, then crashes the whole browser.
Thanks CZcams.
I'm not a carpenter, but I appreciate your precision and logic. I didn't think I would watch this, but it was really well thought out.
Hi Jodi!
Thanks for the video. It is super useful to hear from experts when I am an amateur.
Will follow you as I like the way you communicate. Thank you
Always looking for tips to be more accurate and your content is helping me dramatically. Thank you for explaining this so well.
Excellent video as always, Jody. I'm not aware of any other woodcraft sites where the host is as down to earth AND shares small details like this that have huge benefits. Thank you.
Thanks for this thorough and truly beneficial breakdown of something that many of us take for granted, and wind up paying the price for in our own shops. I appreciate your presentation style. You just earned another subscriber.
Been subscribed for quite a while and look forward to having the time to watch the series that you are putting together.
I've used the "crow's-foot" since the teacher in 8th-grade wood-shop taught us how to mark for a cut.
Back when "shop" classes were a thing, in the Dark Ages, that is.
back before the war...
You are an extremely clear and efficient communicator. Thanks for the video.
Really good tip. I'm a beginner and I'm going to try and implement this in my measures. Thanks
It's good to be thinking about this. The most accuracy that can be had from a pencil mark is when your target is not the pencil mark itself, but the unmarked part on the inside point of the v. That point is infinitely adjustable if you don't get it right at first by just adding thickness to one leg of the v or the other . This way the pencil doesn't even need to be sharp, you can get accuracy from a big fat permanent marker in a pinch. Any question about which end is waste is eliminated by an extra pencil stroke on the waste side. Makes for more accurate tick sticking too
Great great video, thanks from a 70 year old newbie woodworker. I am a natural mechanic type, nuts and bolts. I have taken up woodworking because I can no longer do motorcycles etc. However, my largest challenge is MEASURING!!!! What I think I have measured doesn't always get transferred to the cut I am trying to make. This method standardizes HOW I make a mark, no matter what, and I at least can't screw that up.
It's the simple things that matter. Explained and demonstrated very well. 👍
Well explained and demonstrated as usual. I’ve only been woodworking for about 2 years. I’ve used a lot of Jody’s recommendations and they’ve served me well. I think this will be another one.
Very well explained! I hadn't thought of all the points you bring up, but it seems you've covered all the possible error angles. Thanks for making me think.
I also circle my mark so it is easy to find. So it is a vee shape inside of a circle. No mistaking it for a random scratch.
Watching your video sends me a message that I’m moving from being a total wood hacker to seeking some finesse and skill. This is some quality information. Thanks for sharing!
I know a good teacher when I see one and you, sir, are a good teacher. Thanks for the effort that went into this video.
Well said
This was presented very well. As someone with very little experience with anything related to carpentry, this was very enjoyable to watch and made a lot of sense. Thank you for this information. 👍👍
I don't do much wood-working, but I've been both thought and learned and amalgamated in a small tick as the mark, and a feathered out line towards the wasteside.
As usual, very informative. Thank you for taking time to provide these videos.
I do like that modified crows foot! Well presented as well.
I've seen this done on This Old House. Didn't know what it was called to learn more about it. Thanks for the video! Awesome way of explaining.
Can’t tell you how many times I must remeasure. Most excellent tip!
Brilliantly simple. Thank you mate. 👍
This is really good info for newbies to woodwork, like myself...Thanks..this is helpful.
Very effective presentation. Thank you.
Can't thank you enough for that idea! Makes perfect sense!
Screw what others think or say, I follow your directions with no problem. Keep up yhe good work...
I just discovered your channel. Overall, superb overviews and I'm learning a ton. Thanks for taking the time to create so much excellent content!
I'm one of those people who regularly gets this mixed up so this was a really helpful video for me. I like the single point crowsfoot marking and I am going to change to using it. Thanks.
That's very clever and definitely will use it in future.
Thank you, I had not really thought that out. That helps me out.
You are an excellent teacher! Keep up the good work.
Really useful tip. Thank you for sharing
I learned something today. Thanks for your video!
Very informative! Thank you for your dedication! If I may, I would add a quick overview of a tape measure; how to use the hook for inside and outside measurements and why and how to set the kerf for the cut. Then again, it might be too granular of basic for many but would be a good addition on how to mark your cut.
Could have shown what to do in 30 seconds, but great idea giving some background on the system. First I had that "oooohhhh..... that's why everything I cut is off" moment and then right on que, there's the simple solution. Great video.
An excellent suggestion and practical. Good Video and unexpectedly articulate
First time here and I already learned something useful. Thanks!
I'm a DIY kind of guy and that was a great tip.Thanks
Really like this video. Working as an electrician I do need to make cuts here and there but not nearly as often as wood workers. That being the case I've never really narrowed down a consistent method when I need to mark cuts, this will help a ton!
Thank you for this video. I have made the mistake before where I used the single mark and then returned to the workpiece a week later and got it turned around. Your modified crows mark is an excellent way to avoid this issue. Definitely using this idea in the future.
Love that tip! (This is the first video I've watched on this channel, which I heard about from "Gareth's Tips, Tools, and Shop Tales" newsletter.)
GREAT ADVICE MAN!!! Thanks very much! 😃👍
Jody, I have to admit I was flabbergasted by this video. One can so this is so insignificant but boy was I wrong....after I saw your video last night I worked in my shop and what a really great tip....Thanks man
Excellent point. You hit the mark. Spot on.
Very thorough and thoughtful well done !
You DO indeed inspire me! Thanks:)
WOOOOW NICE SHOP!!! THANK U FOR SHARING UR EXPERIENCE IS PRICELESS!!!🙏🏾🙏🏾🙏🏾
I don't even work with wood and I love this. Well thought out and logical.
Thanks, some solid advice. I’m going to have to try that
I like you method, it’s simple and fast.
instinctively smart. I like the idea and definitely will use it. Thanks.
Regardless of whether I'm in the field, back in the shop or my garage, I follow 'The Patriot' strategy. "Aim small, miss small."
I always seen that done and wanted to learn more about that technique , you gave a number of great tips .. Thanks Pete m
Good infor on you’re way of measuring with crows feet. I also use this method to Mark, however the way you are doing this is more effective and more likely to improve the out come of the project. Thank you for the advice and continue making these informative videos on wood working. Rik
Great tutorial. Very well explained and reasoned, I'm always off on my "tick marks" so I will make a conscious effort to try the crows foot technique! Thanks!
It takes a genius to think of stuff like this. Thanks!
Thank you. I’ve seen crows feet but did not understand the mark. Makes sense.
Excellent i felt like i was back in shop class, you do things with a high quality of perfection and i truly enjoy watching and learning. It makes me want to improve my way of wood crafting keep up the great videos I still have room for learning at age 71, And as far as marking i use the beer can method 1 drink 1 mark 2 drinks 2 marks and so on. Hiccup oops.
Great job,... it's all about habits acquired. If yr doing rough construction or cabinet making, what's worked for me was the fade tick at an angle, is always to the waste side. Although I have seen many use the x on waste side.... enjoy your videos, thanks!
Very good presentation - thanks for sharing your knowledge
I do the good old tick mark. But when I go to make a cut if I had put the workpiece down for a time, I always check the marks before cutting. So far it works for me. I think I'll try your modified crow's foot on my next project. Thanks. I also have the same pencil you're using. I love it, bought two of 'em.
Wow, amazing you could get that concept across in only 8 minutes.
great tip. been doing it this way since seeing my dad doing in back in the 70s.
Thanks for the video...very insightful and well done.