Are Motorcycles Going to DISAPPEAR? The End of the Internal Combustion Engine.
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- čas přidán 9. 09. 2024
- Sorry about the single camera angle, I accidentally deleted the rest of my 360 footage from that day!
This video is more a conversation around what I think/hope will happen with the coming bans on the sale of new ICE powered bikes. 2030/2040 is not that far away in real terms and if it's set to go ahead we'll see more brands doing what Suzuki have done, and that'd suck.
MCN article: www.motorcycle...
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#endofice #cop22 #electric #ev
As someone who has gone from commuting daily on bikes to a Sunday rider I can see why manufacturers have gone for the more focused machines as their customers have gotten older and want different things from bikes. They are definitely more of a luxury item in the west now. I dont think i could ever not have an internal combustion engine bike in the garage, the experience is much more involved than an electric twist and go machine. Synthetic fuel hopefully will progress sooner rather than later as i would rather have five older bikes than one new one.
Yeah exactly, a lot of people are the same and there really isn't that many younger people adopting bikes for whatever reason. I wish they did as it's honestly the only way to see the world. And cheap do it all bikes are there and available, I think maybe people want to aim too high from the off. Get a CB500X, travel the island, upgrade when you have built on your skills etc.
Same, I love everything about them including working on them, like I said I appreciate electric but I don't want one.
Yeah I hope so, and I hope if it works well enough it might even stop the 2035 death of the ice bike.
Alternate fuel is the go, not opposed to electric but life’s about options 😎👍🏼
Yeah exactly, leave the people who want the cheaper, greener option go from A to B with it, we'll do the alphabet with synthetic fuel then :)
ICE engines may go away during our lifetimes, which is why it’s so important to get out there and enjoy them while they’re still around.
They may, I think if I survive even close to the average age etc they definitely will. I'm currently 30. I do enjoy them, every single day :)
Sorry again about the single camera only. Like a big goose I accidentally deleted my 360 files!
Anyway, get involved in the discussion down below in the comments :)
The MCN article I mentioned: www.motorcyclenews.com/news/new-tech/electric-motorbike-co2-emissions-green/
This is a complex question, I have been riding since 1972 ,less people are getting into bikes, the general public hates them, bike manufacturers are turning out some fantastic products, H2r to name only one, but who can insure it, never mind buy it. Electric bikes, I don't know, anyone who has seen a lithium mine would have a hard time calling it green.
The general public hates them in certain places for sure. In Ireland that's definitely and sadly the case. They are, showcase models which will never be sold in huge quantities which I do think is part of the problem. Honda attempted a good thing with the NC750X imo, if someone was to make a similar bike less boring we'd be flying it. Something simple, utilitarian, affordable. Strap everything to it and just enjoy it.
Yeah I'm not a fan tbh, I've seen them and it's pretty bad. Electric bikes and vehicles in general still have a long way to go imo.
This is a great video I agree with you bikes are no longer seen as a tool but rather seen as a toy
Thanks! Yes, in "western" society anyway. It's a pity as they're honestly the best overall form of transport imo.
An alternate fuel would be great, but it would most likely come at the expense of another resource we rely on (just like ethanol).
The argument for not having the infrastructure in place would have probably sounded the same when gasoline powered vehicles first appeared. You can hear all the horse owners telling each other. Where do you fill up these machines? I can take my horse to any place where there is water and they are good to go.
I live in one of the most backward countries (Australia) when it comes to EV infrasturcture. The last goverment made sure of that. But I am seeing EV charging stations showing up everywhere. From service stations to accomodation (even caravan parks).
EV Motorcycles will struggle for some time due to limited space to carry a battery. But I am confident when demand increases, so will the advancement in technology. You can see that with our cars. Some family sedans have the same fuel consumption as my Moto Guzzi Griso.
It would for sure, but it's all about balance. I wouldn't see one tech as the total answer, it'll be a combination.
I get that argument and I agree with it, my point was more towards the fact people the world over still use horses for everything from farming to hobbies. The way some governments are approaching things is 100% change by x date. That's wrong and I don't think it's achievable with how we're rolling out the infrastructure for electric. Ireland is tiny, we're perfect for it yet we're lagging waaaaay behind and still charging massive VRT tax on all new electric vehicles....so it's all mixed up here and electric is only viable for rich people imo. So my point was more attempting to be.....it's not going to be electric any time soon. Charges times need to come down, capacities need to go up, etc.
I hope the tech does get good enough tbh. I'd like a family car to commute in and stuff that costs very little to run. Plus the more people adopt electric and such the more fuel left over for out bikes :P
Another thought provoking chat, which I'm sure will get people thinking.
As I live in London the amount of PTWs (powered two wheelers) as they're known, has been steadily increasing as it's preferable to wasting time sitting in a tin box stuck behind lots of other tin boxes going nowhere. Parking is also much easier and often free apart from in good old Westminster borough. We also get to use quite a few bus lanes too, which makes it even quicker and generally safer to ride.
Of course cycling gets all these benefits too, plus it's cheaper, healthier and a lot more popular, as the cycle network has expanded so much recently.
Alternative fuels would definitely be of interest to me, as long as it's economically viable. By that I mean, cheaper than buying a new electric bike and being able to recoup the conversion costs within a reasonable time frame. I think it's better to convert existing machinery than build new anyway, as from what I understand, the bulk of pollution is in the manufacturing process.
Could bikes eventually disappear? I guess they could. From what I see, the average age of riders is increasing and there seems little interest in the younger generations in either motorcycling or in driving either. They have a much different view about road transport, and this is influenced by the pollution they cause, and the knock on effects of that pollution which we are currently experiencing.
With reducing customers, logically this will lead to fewer sales and eventually manufacturers would no longer be able to recoup their costs, so they would diversify or close. Not going to happen for many years though, but your generation may well be among the last to love motorcycling in Western society.
However we should bear in mind that we aren't in the only places bikes get ridden. India, and South America for instance both use PTWs a lot and I'm sure there are plenty of other examples around the world where two wheeled freedom will carry on long after it has passed into history in the West. It would be interesting to hear from people in those regions to see what they think 😁👍
Haha hopefully, my brain will eventually implode as I think literally all of the time about this shite :D
I honestly don't know why all cities don't follow that route tbh, free/safe parking and get people out of cars that just cause congestion and misery. Cars are for motorways and bringing home shopping.
I'd cycle if I ever lived close to work again, but also I'd have to have cycle lanes, been knocked off too many times.
Exactly that, if I could run my old bikes for 10+ years without losing 2/3 times the money as it would cost to switch then it's a no brainer. And yes, the bulk of the emissions is manufacturing, the greenest thing we can do really is just keep old things going. It's not even just the CO2, it's the damage the mining itself does etc. Old stuff is the greenest stuff as it already exists.
Yeah it's a weird one. I wonder why it's fallen off so much, even my own brother who is not much younger than me just doesn't have the same bug to get out and about as me. He likes being inside on his PC. Pollution is one thing, but bikes are pure class, we just need to get the younger ones to understand :P
Agreed, I have often thought the exact same and it does sadden me. I'll enjoy the hell out of them while I can.
Oh 100% it's why I mentioned the west when I said bikes here were becoming a showpiece. In India etc they are very much still utility vehicles and I absolutely love to see it. The issue is why is there no in between. Why is there no utility vehicle style bike with all the required safeties and a decent sized engine that isn't made of largely cheese. There actually sort of is one actually, the new KLR 650. Not fast, not fancy, but cheap and durable. Maybe there is hope :)
@@TheGorillaBiker As long as you put your thoughts out there, I can assure you, your brain will not implode/explode 😂
From what I can see, younger people are not interested in bikes because they're not stylish and neither is the clothing. Helmets especially mess up your hairstyle. So not a good look.
I commented to TMF about this. He rode past a group of older school kids (on a Ducati I think) and didn't get noticed. I said if he'd waved the latest iPhone about, then he'd get their attention!
In the West, bikes have got very niche. Also, although their Dad may have ridden bikes, he and Mum often don't want the son/daughter to do the same, as they're "too dangerous". Social media and technology may have issues, but in general aren't perceived as dangerous would you say?
I see what you mean about the KLR 650. Is it new? I couldn't find it on a main dealer site, but did find some used from 2018/9. Anyway, seat height might put off some newer riders, but basically a good bet. What about the new BSA Goldstar 650 single? Obviously no-one knows how reliable they'll be, but it can certainly fit in with the utilitarian concept and new prices look pretty reasonable. The RE Meteor also ticks a lot of similar boxes, just wouldn't be so great on a motorway. So, yes maybe there is (a faint) hope 😁
Well, I hope that's the case anyway :D
I suppose it depends on the type of young person, I mean the ones fully worried about style and hair etc were probably never going to be petrol heads :P I know and knew a lot of younger people who are mad in to motorsports in general, I do think it's a lot to do with parents now and the general bubble of safety people want to live in now. People in general are very risk averse. We do need all types of people in the world, and you'd also never know if those folks were watching secretly :P We just need more people to get the chance to try bikes and find out if they do love them.
Social media is definitely perceived as less dangerous. Which I'd imagine if you were to actually look in to it, it's far more dangerous. Harmful anyway.
Haha I wonder is it because TMF was on the bike that the cool young kids didn't want to be looking :D Was he posing? :P I would be on a Duc in fairness, might have put them off :D
Yes the newest one is the US 2022 model with fuel injection, bypassed Europe due to CAT 5 stuff I believe, we'll be seeing more and more of that I think. It's a solid out thumper that doesn't get anywhere mad fast but will do it forever.
I don't know is BSA sold over yonder, but for sure looks to be a nice bike for the price!! Ah reliability is always a question mark really. That's what warranties are for. A faint hope but one we can cling to :)
I think we are seeing the end of motorcycles, as a means of transport, whether there remains a niche for some kind of sports, either off road or track, I don't know. I think the biggest problem is that the majority of youngsters no longer have a passion for either bikes or cars. When I grew up pretty much every teenage lad had posters of things like the ferrari 512bb or Lamborghini Countach or Porsche 911 turbo or if they were into bikes it was the Barry Sheen Suzuki or Kenny Roberts Yamaha. Most of us were desperate to turn 16 to get an FS1-E or AP50 and sadly I don't see that in the younger generation because they have been conditioned to want to save the world not to get round the world as fast as possible. They are much more interested in the latest playstation or iphone than they are in getting their first transport. As for the future I really don't know what the answer is but I don't believe electricity is the ultimate solution because we simply can't create enough of it to satisfy the need if we all switched certainly not without nuclear which seems to be off the table. I don't know enough about synthetic fuels but I can imagine that it is not going to be a cheap option.
I think they have a good 30 years left at minimum, but I do think they'll gradually continue to get less popular as a form of transport. I think anything that exists as a motorsport will last a lot longer.
That's a very fair point actually, no one really looks up to that stuff anymore, I had ferraris, bikes, exploded engines etc on my walls :D I;ve mentioned that in videos before, even when I was in school, I was told repeatedly how the world was basically dead we'd already ruined it and there was no recovering it etc. Like....what did they expect to happen out of that, well adjusted kids etc? Madness. And then a lot of gaming and whatnot is escapism....I get that as I did it for a few years myself.
I agree, I think Nuclear will come back on the table in some form at some stage, at least I hope so and it's managed right. I'd happily work in an Irish Nuclear plant.
Synthetic fuels are already estimated to cost 3/4 euro per litre, if you upped the production that'd come down. So not that far off tbh!
@@TheGorillaBiker I think you are right in saying it won't happen quickly but I genuinely think that your generation will probably be the last and it really saddens me to think that kids being born today may never appreciate the great achievements of the automotive world and will grow up viewing the people and machines we admired almost as the anti-christ because I fear that all they will be taught is about the damage that cars, bikes and even planes did to the environment.
Yeah, it's something I have thought about a lot, that by the time I'm old enough and have enough money to be able to go and enjoy more racing events etc they'll be gone or severely gutted. It still makes me sad I'll never see F1 cars with V12 or V10s in them. Hopefully we'll find a way to keep the fun stuff going.
Totally agree can't understand why so much was pushed into battery powered vehicles and no infrastructure at all never mind the pressure on the grid with the data banks then little to nothing about synthetic fuel development an even spread of all possible options would benefit I think all manufacturers kinda jumped on the band wagon a bit too quick....
But that's just my opinion 🤷
I agree, I think governments are to blame really tho, I think they kind of forced manufacturers to jump on said bandwagon. Any way I look at it, and I'm a fairly analytical person, it doesn't make sense for the vast majority of people. Sure, if you're well off and can ignore the purchase price and have a fuel powered yoke on standby for longer trips....fine. But anyone who doesn't have a heap of cash the payback isn't worth it. Haha all my channel is is opinions sure :P
I think that what ever fuel is used, will be decided by government instead of citizens.
Yes, unfortunately. That said if enough people like me just hang on to our old fuel burning fun machines then maybe we'll have a hope.
I think a motorcycles should be gas powered, loud and manual.
Cars on the other hand should be fully electric and self driving
I've ridden small bikes, fast bikes, slow bikes, quiet bikes, loud bikes, electric, ugly etc etc. They're all bikes and are all fun. But actual ice bikes are still by far my favourite and it'd be a shame for them to not be an option in the future.
Most cars I'd agree with, people still like their fast cars or old cars....but the vast majority don't give a shit so leave them go around in their automated boxes of boredom.
Internal combustion engines will never go as there are too Many out there
In second and third world countries motorcycles are the main transport for the working class. In Ireland and western Europe electric is becoming popular but in the USA they love there gas guslling monsters so I can’t see them changing very soon
Great video stay safe
They're currently to stop being made and supported at some point in the future, that'd have them still around but on the chopping block. I wasn't talking in the next ten years more like the next 50.
Yeah agreed, that's why I more mentioned the fancy bikes we have in the "west" these days. Will we see the end of them.
The US actually has a lot of people looking at electric now since their fuel got "expensive" even tho it's still mad cheap :D A lot of forums I'd be on and stuff have been looking for opinions on electric cars etc. People panic and spend too much money.
Thanks, you too!
I could rant on this al day long... I'm done trying to live a life of austerity and green-ness and sacrifice while those who make the green laws fly around on jet planes to green conferences in St. Tropez and Ibiza to eat wagu steaks flown in from Japan, champagne flew in from France, caviar flew in from Russia, then they buy Bentleys and oceanfront mansions on all the money they been grifting, etc., etc., etc, ad nauseum... "You'll own nothing, and you'll like it." according to those in charge of The Great Reset.
Prettty much why I never bothered even trying very hard. I like a simple life. Work, food, family, bikes. Don't need much else. A;; those knobheads who go around in jets and such and then preach about being green are literal dopes. Like how do they think anyone would take them seriously.
I must google the great reset :D Never heard of it, but I really don't read much that isn't bike related. I've heard that "You'll own nothing and be happy" phrase and it's a load of shite.
ABSOLUTELY CORRECT! THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT I WAS GETTING AT IN MY COMMENT ABOVE! YOU HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD! THESE SCUM COULD CARE LESS ABOUT THE ENVIRONMENT - IT'S ALL ABOUT MONEY AND CONTROL!!!
@@TheGorillaBiker "The Great Reset" is VERY REAL and there's very powerful people around the world currently working very hard at making it a reality for ALL. Very scary - what most people need to understand is that there's many more of US than there are of THEM but WE the People need to UNIFY to overtake them. This is why they're trying so hard to DIVIDE and CONQUER the masses by using race and equality (B.S.) as a means to divide us all. People need to smarten up and rise above it instead of falling into their traps.
As far as motorcycling in the west is concerned, the manufacturers will no doubt be heavily influenced by what happens in the US regarding legislation etc. The US has of course long been a huge market for motorcycles and indeed cars/trucks.
I agree in a way, I think manufacturers will just start avoiding Europe with a lot of models so they can dodge Euro CAT 6,7,8,9 etc. Europe doesn't really get influenced by the US and vice versa in that type of rule making. I can see more and more manufacturers sticking to selling bikes that are absolutely fine in the US only, such as the DR650 etc which you can't get here anymore.
I think Europe is doing a far better job than North America. The Focus diesel I had as a rental car averaged 4.2l per100kms in the spring. Had lots of low down torque and definitely felt powerful enough. I'm averaging 3.8l per 100kms on my new Tracer. Which is Euro 5. The way I see it Electric vehicles are far too expensive and as you pointed out the infrastructure is not there. My wife drives a Chevrolet Volt. I think it was sold as the Vauxhall Ampera in Europe. To me this is a great blend of electric and ice. She seldom has to put petrol in it as we live in a small town so even with an all electric range of just 60kms she is able to do all the daily running around she needs and if she has to go on a longer trip she has the 1.4litre generator 😊. Transport other than flying only accounts for 2% of global emissions. I think the solution has to be collective rather than individual. I would go as far as to say bikes are much less polluting than cars. Here in Canada the best selling car is the Ford F150pick up. I don't understand that. These are not being used as work trucks. At 80 to 100thousand a pop there not even being used as off roaders.
I believe the science. We are facing a crisis but until the major global powers get on the same page we won't change a thing.
This synthetic fuel you mentioned has me intrigued. However I still think climate change has to be tackled in a new way. The average Joe driving or riding his bike to work isn't the problem.
It is and it isn't. Yes that car did very good mileage but if that's the 1.6 you had my god it's a boring machine :D Plus those engines don't last at all really. It's a toss up between the fuel economy and the longevity really. Between the cost of a dpf etc etc those cars just can't do big mileage anymore which in my opinion is massively wasteful. Euro 5 I honestly don't agree with. For instance transport is 2%....we targeting the minutiae of that 2%....makes no sense. They should put more effort in to other industries and for transport legislate for targeted fuel economy and longevity. If they use feck all fuel and last forever people wouldn't change them as often and we'd be way greener by accident nearly.
Bikes are imo overall yes, single occupancy cars cause traffic and such and sitting in traffic causes smog etc. That's only one little piece of it too. The F150 thing as a daily run around is mad.....what do they get 16 US mpg? I couldn't.....it's just throwing money away.
Yes we are, it's a huge part of why I don't want kids tbh. What the hell would I be leaving them to.
Agreed, it'll all come together to help solve the issue. But more needs to be done on the big pollution emitters and help countries like India before they become worse and figure it out themselves. It's not like our countries have a little bubble around them, any emissions are global emissions.
"The future is eclectic" seems to sum this up and IMO is a more realistic view of the future of transport in general. Cynically I just don't believe any government is capable of a cohesive transport plan and things will find there way through private innovation and "make do/work around" technology becoming the norm (for a time). Dunno enough about synthetic fuel so now I gotta go read up on it ( you're doing it again - making me think!). A good discussion for sure with myriad factors to be considered and I find it easy to get " tunnel vision" on the topic. Very interested to see the chat this generates. Cheers, Andy.
Haha yeah that'd be a good title in fairness :P Yeah I can't see any government just deleting the 100+ years of ICE that's built up, or any other form of transport for that matter that people have emotional attachments to. Private sector stuff will as always be the driver of any adoptable innovation until it's legislated and adopted. Haha sorry but also not sorry :P Yeah you have to keep an open mind to think what could be. Hydrogen for ships, electric for A to B cars, Electric for trains etc....leave the fuel for bikes and racing :P
Wish I'd thought of the "eclectic" thing, there are some good articles under that title similar to the MCN article you attached. I often tell people I learned to ride a horse late in life just in case our governments totally balls this up 😁
Hahaha ah fair enough :P You should have taken credit :) Good shout, herself knows how to ride so she could always teach me :)
I recon in the next few years, we will have synthetic fuel and will burn much cleaner. Can't see the major oil companies lying down and giving in to electric or other power
It already exists just in small quantities, they estimate it could be produced for about 3-4 euro a litre at the moment, that'll only get better. It also works using captured carbon so is supposedly carbon neutral. So there is hope :P
One other quick comment regarding SCIENCE .... I am ALL about following the SCIENCE ... HOWEVER there's a BIG DIFFERENCE between the POLITICAL SCIENCE and REAL SCIENCE that's based on truths and not fear and lies! Just my two cents but I think this was a fantastic video and I sure hope as well that the internal combustion engine NEVER goes away! Boy do I really miss growing up in the 80s and 90s! The world was such a better place back then in many ways!
I don't think ice will ever go away fully tbh, I do think it'll b regulated to painful degrees in the coming 50 years. But I'm 30 and hopefully by the time it's too expensive to use I won't care anymore.
I won't debate science etc, I can read papers myself and interpret data. I also don't watch political channels for science. I think 99.9999% of politics is a load of shite. Both sides lie out their holes.
LPG has virtually same efficiency and performance as petrol and has very little emission output it’s main output is water. You could still use your petrol engine just convert it mmmm CBF1000 duel fuel lol
I’m waiting for stator for mine had same problem as the Gorilla biker broke down and after 57000 miles I think the original stator has done really well.
It's a bit less energy dense so it uses more litres per 100km but yeah overall it's basically the same and has a higher octane so it's a good option. Like I said I had it in a car years ago :P I was always an experimenter :) The issue is I dunno how you'd fit the system on a bike that wasn't purpose built for it. Definitely would be worth a test at some stage tho! :)
57k miles! That's bloody good going :)
Perhaps Honda will want to see your stator. Find out what they did right on yours compared to a lot of others 😁 Mine's done 30k miles and is on its second one. First lasted 15k miles and was replaced under warranty.
@@TheGorillaBiker we need a cheap bike to play with mmm always wanted to play with it but never had the spare cash. At the moment I’m saving for a cruiser for a summer bike keeping the CBF for a winter/all weather bike plus she was cheap after two years still less than £1k lol bargain basement babe just how I like em hahaha
@Mark they definitely need to have a look at it, bloody thing is a Zombie among mere mortal stators :D
@John yeah it'd be great to have a bike to just do experiments on, maybe one day :) For now tho I couldn't risk wrecking my bike :D Great plan :) 1k!!! Bikes are so cheap in the UK.
Small capacity IC engines will be still in use. Bio/Alternate/synthetic fuels plus hydrogen combustion will be in the mix for Combustion. Current gen battery energy density is nowhere near practical for motorcycle use. Moreover mechanical drive will be preferred over electric emotionless drive for personal/adventure crafts.
Or even slightly higher capacity but very efficient bikes. The CB500X for instance sips fuel.
That's the biggest thing for me tbh, electric is fun but it honestly does feel like the "soulless machine" thing.
Only thing is the efficiency of the electric motor is superior, but the weight of the batteries is a problem. Charge time too. I myself will definitely not buy an electric motorcycle that weighs more than 200 kg. And would have less power than what I now am used to... Yes, I certainly don't need the power but for me it is a toy to play with!
It is definitely more efficient. That's inarguable. But with storage capacities and charge times most of them just aren't practical for a lot of people.
And like you say a lot of the beauty of having a bike is the performance aspect, the fun, the character. I do feel a lot of that is lost.
I think in the short term, prices of secondhand petrol/diesel will go up and vehicles will hold their value better.
I've always thought that bikes are the greener option, the majority of car journeys are done with just the driver but unfortunately there is the safety issue with bikes.
I was watching a programme the other day that stated to build a petrol/diesel car from scratch to getting it in the showroom creates 6 tonnes of Co2 but for an electric vehicle it's 12 tonnes ! So they're not quite as green as people think.
Yeah that looks to be happening at the moment. Buying new actually seems more and more reasonable by the day :D Agreed, single occupancy cars is mad really, especially in traffic and stuff. If you have more on bikes and allow filtering you'd be laughing. I do think if we had more year round bikers though people would be safer, a lot of the properly mental riding I see are lads who get out for 2/3 months of the year.
Yeah the new cost is waaaay higher, that's the payback period thing I was talking about, I've now linked the MCN article that discusses it. I'd forgotten to so thanks for the reminder. :)
Safety issue lol? Have you seen the amount of two-wheeled vehicles that are on the roads in other countries? Just look up videos on CZcams there are literally hundreds of them on the streets at one time and they're all going in-and-out of traffic not hitting each other driving crazy and no one has an accident.
Yes I agree totally, my personal opinion is that before gaining a full car licence you should have to have had 12 months of riding a bike because riding a bike makes you more aware of your surroundings and teaches you to think ahead.
Unfortunately the general opinion of the public is that bikes are inherently dangerous so the idea would never happen.
@timsgta that's why I was saying it'd be great to see more people using bikes daily, that kind of thing really keeps people on the button. That said look up the amount of injuries and deaths over yonder, those are just the recorded ones. I definitely wouldn't like to see that type of traffic here :D
@Anthony, yep 100% agree, get everyone on a scooter before they can get a license they'd have a lot more cop on then.
What about converting bikes to LPG as it burns clean and the infrastructure is already in place just needs bolstering
That's actually a great shout, I had an LPG car before. It'd be interesting to build a LPG bike for a test, but I'd be wondering would you have enough space to store a decent amount etc. And in crashes howd it fare.
From memory you only get about 2/3 the mileage from LPG compared to petrol. Fuel tank would probably be a lot thicker and heavier. Not impossible, but a difficult sell to riders.
@@bondradman7353 my car was never quite so bad as that. But definitely 80% of the distance. It's much thicker and heavier yeah, it's why I honestly couldn't see it working, you also need petrol to start the engine on still and get it to a certain temp. It would be an interesting thing to try but not feasible for a bike I'd say
i had a go of a Zero SR/S recently and honestly as a "do everything" bike it would work great, I could readily commute on one, it has storage space and can take luggage and it will pass ULEZ regulations forever. The experience of having instant torque available from the motor is much more "direct" than having to work with a throttle that asks a computer for more power, decides how much fuel you can have to stay emissions compliant and then chucks that fuel into an engine to wait for it to combust (not to mention the need to actuate a clutch and change gears!)
The one downside to me...cost! If I could get an SR/S for the same as a Z1000SX I'd be all over it tbh. If someone can crack a 650 adventure class type electric bike for a reasonable price I think it would be the go-to for daily riders. At the 50-125 end of things I think ebikes will probably take over for commuters unfortunately, although I'd love an electric Honda Cub or Puch Maxi type thing.
I think if you really want a petrol engine bike it'll just be like running a classic car now, by the time new ICEs are available all of your bikes will be MOT exempt! I'm sure we'll have sorted out some type of synthetic fuel for ICE enthusiasts by then too.
Overall I think once the teething troubles of electric motorbikes are sorted they'll be awesome daily drivers and it's not like the classic stuff will all be crushed into cubes and we'll all be zooming around on our pride and joy, however it happens to be powered. In the UK especially electric bikes will be charging off zero carbon electricity anyway so most will pay themselves off in CO2 terms over their lifetime, it's the case in Scotland most of the time already!
I've ridden an SR/F and a DS. Both were great bikes and fun, but I honestly wouldn't consider either do everything. I'd commute on either, but literally neither would be able to do any of the weekend riding I do, and even I'd be questioning some of my spins home from work.
I'll be honest, I much prefer the drama of combustion, part of that might be to do with me being a engine head but also my slowest bike is often the most fun, and the noisiest and most dramatic. Personality counts for a lot to me and in my experience the Zeros don't really have one. They're just really good machines.
Agreed, they're waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too expensive. Brand new KLR 650 in the US is less than 8k dollars......Not in a million years would I buy the DS for 15k for the model with decent range instead of it. I just don't see myself buying one any time soon due to the cost mainly, as a commuter, I'd love one.
I don't have an MOT in Ireland anyway tbh so that has never bothered me! I'll honestly just give up on life if I can't run ice bikes at some point in my life. A good 50% of why I bother getting out of bed :D
That's the biggest thing for me tbh, once there is a reasonable payback time for both carbon and money I'd go for one for commuting. I like commuting on bikes I think cars are fairly wasteful when used for single occupants.....but I just like it mainly. Not only payback is important, mining practices are huge and this stuff should really be monitored more closely.
I think ADV bikes are def the "practical" bike of the era, like you say they can do almost everything, but they don't do each of those things the best, is why I still have other bikes! :D I do occasionally commute on it ;-)
I'll be over 60 if the 2035 thing happens for bikes with internal combustion engines and we can no longer buy them new. There will still be many many years after that date where they will still be a viable form of transport, but as charging stations pop up, petrol stations will gradually fade away and that will be the start of the end of the ICE bikes and cars. I'll try to always have an ICE bike throughout my life, but I am not anti EV.... just not ready to buy one yet. Personally, I can see there being a real issue once the batteries on the EV bikes start to die, as it will probably mean that the cheaper bikes will just get thrown away which is far worse for the environment than us keeping our petrol bikes on the road! I do hope that synthetic fuel becomes a thing... my concern is that farmers will stop growing food as the crops they use for the fuel will become more profitable, and countries will starve in the pursuit of fuels.
Exactly!! Haha well we all need multiple bikes anyway, it's written in the rulebook somewhere I believe :P I knew it! :)
Ah you're collection will be well healthy by then so, you're laughing :) Yeah I think we easily have another 30 years of fuel that's easily attainable even if it does get crazy pricey by then. Yeah that's a fair point, once it's not economically viable for fuel stations to stock liquid explosive fuel in giant tanks under the ground why would they bother to. I'm not anti EV either at all, I think they're great. Just far too expensive right now and there isn't one that'd fit any of the open slots in my needs.
Those are very good points, battery recycling and waste will be a big issue, but I never even thought about the rest.....hopefully that doesn't happen.
@@TheGorillaBiker We all know the formula n = number of bikes owed + 1 😀
Am hoping some upcoming mods will see me still riding my Gixer for many years to come.... and possibly an ASBO or two! 😀
Fuel will never get affordable in the way it has been, but it will still fuel the bikes of those that live motorcycle.
EV bikes are so much fun, but I want one with a clutch and tickover like the trials bikes I had a go on up at the Festival of Motorcycling!
Yeah, we think Chinese 125cc bikes were bad for falling apart, well the newer ones don't, but if you can't replace the battery at an affordable price, they will still be getting dumped once a few years old.
Haha indeed. :) Need to get that tattoo'd so I don't forget :P
Haha I need to get out and fix my GSXR :P Don't be getting asbos now, they sound like some weird disease when you say it out loud :P
I hope it does come back down a bit as where it's at at the moment is a bit upsetting :P I'd have to live closer to work and I don't want to, I like a good degree of separation :) But yeah, I'd sacrifice a lot to be able to ride my bikes.
They are, a clutch would be nice, as would gears, just for the feel!! :)
Yeah people just don't care enough, not everyone, but enough that the place is a state as is from rubbish.
@@TheGorillaBiker That would be a good tat to explain to grandchildren in your 80's! :D
I already have one ASBO recorded for a road rage incident... weirdly, it was the person who road raged me and tried running me off the road that reported my driving lol.... That was a few years back now so probably no longer on record :D
Hey, at least when you get to the USA the fuel will be a lot cheaper. I work 5 miles from home, so it is often quicker to go in my van than on bike, but I'm trying to do the bike thing more while we are in summer months.
Haha it would :P I'd have to have kids first tho so I'll just explain it to my cat or old person nurse :P
Oh really :D Can't imagine you getting angry enough to warrant anyone reporting you. Ah good, a clean Hippo :P
This is very true, they think it's expensive but it's cheap as chips :P Yeah that's fair then, if I was only 5 miles away I'd even try cycle some nice days if the roads were safe enough to do so :)
motorcycles wont disapear, lack of fuel supplies will be the killer for internal combustion engines.
to be fair we have electric motors that are good for the job now even after market independants have some cracking motors.
The killer is batteries we currently have access to are a pile of steaming turds, they just dont cut it for our needs.... but better alternatives are available or becoming available, carbon 14 batteries have the potential to revolutionise power supplies, eliminates nuclear waste by using carbon 14 which is currently stored after use in nuclear power stations, the battery uses nuclear decay to make power, the best bit is that its a sealed unit encased in man made diamond so doesnt emit radiation, even if somehow one was split open the radiation would be negligable.
even conventinal batteries are coming on leaps and bounds mostly by accident... litium sulpher batteries were a surprise as they have the capacity that we need, ie if it was a fuel cell in a car then you would only have to charge once a week like you do now with fossil fuels, mad bit about this accidental discovery is that they think they can illiminate the lithium and use a salt instead.... they ran the test 900 times on the lithium sulpher battery becouse they didnt think it should work... 900 batterys later ... it works but why is it working,...
by the time it comes around to ditching internal combustion engines, hopefully everything will be more advanced than it is now.
i dont deny science but i think they dont always have quite the right ideas, climate change is a big barrel of fish to go diving in, i think their is natural cycles of warming and cooling, but i also think that the pollution and crap were throwing into the atmosphere let alone seas etc aint helping the situation.until everyone on the planet plays ball tho nothing will change, the earth can heal itself pretty quick, we saw some of that in lock down, "dolphins returned to the venice canals, goblins returned to new zealand" :D
electric will be king, especially once power sources get better.
ICE will be the same as steam, long gone but collectors and musuems having vehicles, at some point it will be a sight to be seen when one pootles past,
i think that there will still be 100+ years of ICE vehicles on the roads, how much depends on a lot of factors tho.
But that's why I hope synthetic fuel does become a bigger thing. They can all coexist happily. Most average people don't care what their car is once it goes from point A to point B. It's the only explanation I can come up with for Micras and Jukes being on the road. So let them use the electric ones :P
Yeah there are good motors out there, I just don't want any of them :P
Yeah batteries need a leap forward whatever it is, no matter how negligible anything may be the general fear of Nuclear is a problem, otherwise Ireland would have a few and have very cheap and fairly clean energy.
Yeah Isaw a bit about that, mad how discoveries come about, mad in a good way :P
I honestly do hope the ditching won't happen, a nice co existence can happen!!
Haha the goblins returning was so beautiful! :D Ah stop, sure we'd be very careful at home around composting and recycling. Then I visited Tampa and realised it was all completely pointless. Plastic bags handed out for a plastic bottle of water and no recycling bins anywhere. Street food vendors serving in plastic instead of compostable trays. Like....why. And that's just America, don't mind looking at other areas!
100+ years I'm ok with, once I'm well dead when they're gone I'm happy. Electric is fine, but honestly it's like super new fancy bikes. Somewhere along the lines we accidentally removed the soul from the machines.
They are already trying to price us off the road bike tax £101 wife’s car tax £0 that’s fair !!!
In Ireland it's 88 euro a year for a bike, Cars vary wildly depending on emissions. What does the average car cost there? What's her car?
@@TheGorillaBiker her car Peugeot 108 but my car was free tax too and that was a vauxhall insignia not a small car but like you say depending on emissions it goes up to I think £600 maybe more but it's still not rite £101 for a bike that takes up no space ah that feels better rant over.good vids by the way👍
How do they get free tax? That's mad. 101 is a bit much for a bike, I agree, shouldn't really just be on emissions it should be on impact to the road and congestion etc.
Thanks!
We are being had with the whole electrification movement. The infrastructure is light years away, there is barely enough generation to cope with current demand, never mind moving every car over. Where is all the lithium coming from? What do they do with batteries once they reach end of life? How do they intend to offer charging to those who live in high rise blocks etc? No one even attempts to answer these questions because they know they cannot. If the Green movement is honest, they would be looking for a hybrid solution and that would include motorcycles. I get 80 plus mpg on my Honda NC750X and my new Royal Enfield 350 is returning over 100mpg 😀 i would love some eco warrior to tell me i am not helping the environment 👹I am in my sixties now and probably got about ten years left of biking if lucky, I feel really sorry for you young folk who will no doubt suffer in years to come.
Let alone here we're being warned of blackouts in winter for the next 5 years due to issues with energy production, and they want to add to that by horsing electric cars on to the road. In fairness batteries can be recycled very well, but you're point is a good one as a lot of people will just upgrade rather than fixing. People seem to hate fixing things these days. Yep, literally can't answer a lot of this stuff, my favourites are committing to have a number of EVs on the road by 2030 here that would mean 100% of the vehicles sold from now to then would have to be EV.......plus another 100,000 or so :D Literally impossible.
The NC750X prints fuel, it's magic. I'd love to try one of those 350s :) Between cost to manufacture and such I think you're as green as can be!!
Yeah.....it'll be interesting to see what the world looks like when I'm 60 if I make it that far :)
Great topics. All electric will not solve the carbon issues as the carbon to create the vehicles is twice that of the petrol version, the way the resources are mined is not "clean", the electric needed to power the vehicles still require fossil fuels unless like you said an alternative fuel could be developed clean and affordable. With all the talk of creating clean energy they forgot to think of the rising population. The more people the greater the demand that will be put on the resources. Electric makes sense for the bigger cities but as the cities get more conjested where are you gonna put the vehicles. With charging times you'll have alot of people hanging around waiting and that's not gonna work in a world that expects you to be more productive.
Agreed, it's one thing that baffles me about the drive for electric. Where they make sense is cities.....but cities are actively driving to remove parking for cars and personal vehicles so where are the people who live in them going to store and charge them? It's honestly like a lot of departments had plans and ideas but never spoke to each other. Want to drive up electric ownership in cities? Great, I agree with this, but then make sure there is plenty of parking for apartments and jobs etc etc. Public transport is largely shite and people don't like using it.
And agreed on the energy generation, we already know in Ireland we're strained on the grid....add a million EVs to that and what's going to happen. It'll be interesting to see how it all unfolds anyway.
Synthetic fuel is my hope…. I love explosion power!
Same, Once I can ride the nice splodey bikes until I die it's all I need :D
From what i see now there is a huge uptake in bike licensing these days due to traffic congestion, commuting etc.... However its worth checking out Sky News Australia on CZcams talking about the 15min city that Oxford is proposing. Its scary times in the western Liberal world
Good, glad to hear it's happening somewhere, I haven't seen it personally but as long as they survive somewhere I'll be happy. :) I haven't I'll have a look at the video. I honestly don't buy in to any side politically, they're all shite :P
@@TheGorillaBiker ya, big uptake in licencing esp by 40+yr olds and returning bikers. I hear ya on the political side of things, my ears will always open when I hear this stuff on main stream media. Loving the content, keep her lit
Ah fair, I see more my age group where way too many are honestly scared of even trying it which is a massive pity. My concern is that we don't have enough younger, like 20 odd year olds, coming through to keep everything going.
Yeah that's fair, mad to see it on sky news. I kinda stopped watching most news a few years ago. Just got sick of it. Thanks bud!
@@TheGorillaBiker costs are probably the big issue, however i think what's coming is very exciting esp with the new BSA, Royal Enfield etc etc. Cost effective, simple motoring.
Cost is huge, initial insurance cost as well is nuts which I think is very unfair. Absolutely. It's such a pity the new KLR 650 isn't available in the EU.
You ask whether UK circuits would let you use electric because of the risk. Surely the question is how prepared are the Emergency Services across the world to deal with a crashed electric vehicle of any sort on public roads? The whole issue of pollution, emissions, and the planets future seems to dominate legislation and talk in the Western World. I sit here and watch the farmers burning off the stubble from the rice and cane fields three times a year. I watch them felling trees faster than they grow. I am drowning under plastic packaging and being choked by fumes from old and badly maintained engines. We won't talk about the fact everyone smokes 20 day everywhere. Asia is expanding its industry exponentially but we are all doing it as if we were in the 1950's. Coal fired power stations, unregulated factory chimneys. There would be more sense in sorting that out as Europe did with clean air acts. Electric vehicles have always had a role, think of the old milk floats and various city delivery vehicles. Horses for courses. I am sure evolution will find the world using different fuels or forms of energy for different purposes. At the moment we are living in a period of headline grabbing by politicians and industry figures like Musk. I am sure that when the dust settles a lot of the current bike manufacturers will be gone. Honda will still make cars, some will make scooters, and the luxury brands will be making Gucci and Dior aspirational machines for the rich few. Bike culture as we know it today will be gone. Here in Asia it will take longer. There is no alternative for 90% of the population but a small capacity, underbone, or bebek. Thoughts suitably stirred 👍
Very fair point!! I hadn't even really though of the roads themselves and the challenges that await there. Imagine the May rush back to the roads where we always have a few dropped bike this part of the world and the chaos it could theoretically cause.
Ah I have long wondered at the weird divide of countries and areas doing different things. Really if we lived in an actual functioning global society the "West" would step in and help developing countries not repeat mistakes and just grow wildly with unsustainable industry etc. But that's where I kind of try to switch my brain off or I'd probably try go actually do something about it, and I think then I'd lose my mind. Emptying a bottle of water in to the ocean so to speak.
Yep, it's why I said I think the future we'll have a blend of tech. Boats are a huge one we should clean up so they stop burning bunker at the very least. Instead of smacking the common person over and over again with silly little developments in reducing C02 by 2% etc when the stuff mined to do it is astronomically worse, let alone transporting it all around.
I really hope the likes of the KLR etc do survive, sure the smaller run models with the cool bits for a very niche buyer will likely be in the main gone, with the few bespoke mega sellers left like you said. Either way it'll be interesting to see unfold eh :)
Gosh I hope that never happens. For me an ADV bike or a CBF like bike would have lots of appeal if I was only allowed to have 1 bike but in a perfect world what you and Hippo have done is more where I prefer to be at, track bike, motocross bike, touring bike, etc...Money makes the world go around so that will dictate what get's built and becomes popular. As one genre out prices itself to a point where people start buying other genres or cheaper models in the same genre the manufactures will respond cause again it's all about money. I think the biggest problem with it all is two fold, 1) Humans have an infant's level of understanding when it comes to the energy and the universe 2) we have to make fucking money on everything OC: I don't really know anything about Synthetic fuels really to have an opinion, I will say here in America Ethanol died off, it cost too much to make and the government ended up subsidizing farmers to make it with our taxes.
I don't think it will when we're alive anyway thankfully. Yeah definitely, if I had to have one I think ADV sort of do it all mostly ok bike. But any sensible human needs all the bike types :P Very true, it's why ADV are booming and sports bikes are sadly struggling.
Yes indeed, I see more and more people looking for simpler bikes with a lot of the mega expensive stuff stripped off, the V2 Ducati is a great example. MT07, R7 etc. Simple solid bikes. 1) - Infant is being kind. We assume a lot and are often way off base.
2) - It's such a pity humans are so god damn greedy. Literally everything is worse since the advent of shareholders in absolutely everything who need year on year profits etc.
Oh really? I thought E85 was still a big thing over there in the likes of Ohio and Virginia etc? That surely isn't still subsidized that'd be madness.
@@TheGorillaBiker I think money is the bigger driving factor over simplicity. I can't afford the R1 so what is the next best thing, R7, which then leads me to rationalizations for why I'm settling. I've done the same thing when I was young. I almost bought a Katana over the GSXR600 because I didn't want to wait to save more money. Obviously I waited, the wifey talked some sense into me but it's just the way humans work. Maybe E85 is bigger in Ohio and Virginia IDK but I don't see it as often as I use to around here anyway. We still give big oil many millions in tax breaks that is used for "development". Once that free money starts rolling in its next to impossible to stop it.
True, but the money side drives the desire for the simpler, cheaper bikes. Yeah I completely get you man.....that's something I often look at doing but then just buy an older bike instead....cus then I can afford the bike I want instead of the newer bike I don't if that makes sense. Ah your wife is a smart lady :P Yeah....we're always rushing....which I know I do so I can't complain :P
Yeah...all that stuff should stop, those companies don't need a bloody scratch of free money. It drives me mad when I see money given to multi billion dollar companies instead of tax breaks to normal people.
The goverment can`t even fix the public services so how do you expect them to carry through such a collosal task as banning ICE`s, also the cost is so significantly higher and electric vehicles are much less practical
Cus there'll be money in it for them, when they can squeeze people that's when they seem to work towards a goal properly. Cost is very high and I just don't want one.
@@TheGorillaBiker I think we should just eat the rich and enjoy our gas guzlers, im too in love with my magna even if its a pita :D