Cheap Mountain Bike vs. Super Bike | XC Edition
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- čas přidán 4. 06. 2024
- While we all like checking out the latest top-of-the-range mountain bikes and parts, the reality is that most of us will be riding around on much more wallet-friendly MTBs. While there's a big difference in price, is there a big difference in performance to match? Rich decided to find out by pitting a budget second-hand bike against his no-expense-spared cross country race bike in some XC-themed challenges.
⏱ Timestamps ⏱
0:00 - Intro
1:07 - The bikes
3:52 - Some considerations
6:07 - Ride comparisons
8:44 - Rich Rich's thoughts
9:54 - Budget Rich's thoughts
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The best bike is the one you have. If it makes you smile then its perfect.
this. We often tend to talk about the best tech, the lightest frames and so on but lets be honest. Most of us cannot effort a superbike and even if so we are not even in the class to fully make use of them. On the other hand the cheap bikes fit our riding style and the trails we have nearby. So its enough. And like you said: If we smile while riding a 500€ Bike is more than enough 🙂
They all make me smile and giggle, following your advice I should keep em all 🎉
ABSOFEKKINLUTELY !!!
You literally took the words out of my mouth.
Took the ol words out my mouth sir 🫡
Leaving the obvious tech differences of a full sus to hardtail aside for a moment : From what ive learned trying out different bikes over the years, there is a significant difference between the, lets say, 3000€ and 500 to 800 € budget price range. A very distinct and sharp difference in what the bike feels and sounds like when you're riding aswell as in build quality and maintenance. BUT, going upwards from 3000 € to 6000€ and 8000€ this differences become smaller and smaller. And im not talking about whats written in tech specifications , im talking about how the bike feels when riding it. In the upper price ranges, it becomes harder to make out that supposed difference which the written tech specifications claim to be present. I have no doubt that 10.000€ upwards superbikes are designed to make just that vital tiny difference in seconds when in comes to professional racing, but thats really all there is. For my part, 3000 to 6000€ is as high as i will ever spent on a bike.
Exactly what i am thinking too. Recently bought a 3300€ Propain Tyee and i am really happy with it. I don't know if someone, that isn't a real pro would even feel a big difference in riding, between a 3000€ bike and one for 10000€
Presumably weight for the pros if there is any gain from the extra money spent with bars, strength of the bike with different carbon construction. For full suspension bikes it has to be the internals of those components, how refined they are with fast and slow damping, instead of just one setting like our bikes. Anything which gives them more control over the bike. Probably would do data logging too with sensors so they can get everything set perfectly.
With some products the price is dictated by how detailed their tolerances are. If they are going for absolute precision or custom geometry, maybe hand built vs machine, then the time and precision instruments all cost so visually might seem no better but it is how got built which also counts. Even the paintwork, getting that perfect, putting finishing touches on and protective coatings. They can cost more than the frame sometimes but it is emotive so a special design can inspire to go faster.
A better comparison would have been a budget 29" aluminum hardtail, which can be had on sale from the likes of Canyon for about the price of the 26" Scott ridden in this comparison.
You forget fitness and skill will out perform most no matter what bike you have
There are carbon XC hardtails sub 3k weighing in at a total of 9kg with a premium front fork. I wonder how much better a 13k bike is to the lighter 2.5k bike.
Such as??? Or that be China Ali Xpress??
I thought the same thing.. or even a 2007 full sus in comparison.
There is me looking at £4k for a 8kg or under mountain bike, yes if spend more I might be able to get a tiny bit lighter but I looked at £4k to get idea from my £4k road bike that is 6.7kg, I'm wondering trail vs XC Vs CX
My XC bike is a hardtail Giant ATX 875 from 1995. Over the years I've upgraded it with a Rockshox XC30 fork (2012), wider bars/shorter stem, and a dropper post (2018). The trails in my area are mostly singletrack and not too technical, so I think I have more fun being "under-biked" than the folks riding their full-sus trail and XC rigs. The V-brakes, 26" wheels, and old-school geometry cost me some speed, but I still have a ton of fun... and it does a decent job on gravel as well when my buddies want to do a gravel ride.
Their will always be a better bike just as their will always be a someone faster than you. I think the key is not giving a 💩 and just riding more.
I just restored an old Scott Vail 26" with a Manitou Magnum fork, it's so sketchy compared to my modern XC hardtail😅
But it's damn fun and actually climbs steeper routes better than my modern one!
Theres definitely a happy medium, i could never justify £10k + bikes, because i dont race (other than on strava! 😅) I bought a 2nd hand £3k XC bike. 10kg, absolute weapon
I did exactly the same! There are some great second-hand bikes out there
That's the thing. If you don't race why do you need a faster lighter more expensive bike? As long as the bike can do what you are capable of, it's good enough.
I saw Rich and Blake at the Forest of Dean on Tuesday. I was giving 27 explorer scouts an introduction to mountain biking. The channel helped me get into mountain biking and improve my knowledge. Without it I wouldn't be sharing my love for mounting biking with all of those young people
Just a reminder this Scott Scale used to be a near-top of the range super expensive bike 15 year ago when new.
Been racing a 100$ Trek 930 for a couple years now. Pretty sure I have at least as much fun as anyone else out there. Swapped from the stock 540mm bars to 720mm with a shorter stem; super fun bike.
£500 for a 26er is indeed premium and the Scott Scale was an OTT redbuild (apart from the free bike shop, Rock Shock Rebas, forks!!!) but heh, looking forward to the Scott vs budget 29er comparison!! 😀
I learned the true value and appreciation of a higher end bike by riding a cheaper budget bike (base 2020 Rockhopper) and slowly upgrading the parts for years. Honestly the only thing I think is necessary for mtb is a good set of brakes (preferably hydraulic). Everything else after that is really just icing on the cake.
As long as it's in a good shape, has 27.5" or 29" wheels, hydraulic breaks, dropper seatpost, and front suspension, you are all set for fun and fitness.
I had the exact scott scale. its a real diamond in the rough you know, its a way better bike than it has any business being for 200euro used, people give them away cause they look very old (and are very old tbh) but they ride like 10 years newer, underrated bike
I mostly road cycle, however the big takeaway is cost. I was cycling on expensive bikes and stopped, yes they were slightly faster, but I always feared them being targeted. I now keep everything sub £1k
I paid a little over £6000 for my Honda Shadow, the fact that a mountain bike is selling for double the price of my motorbike is absurd to me. It's out of control, the mountain bike industry is quickly becoming like the phone industry with a new model every year and a price hike to match.
If people TRULY have that kind of disposable income, it's all good. The problem is, few things sour people on a sport or hobby more than looking back and knowing they wasted a lot of money.
thats just an stupid comparison, really you can apply that logic to anything.
there are bikes twice as expensive as my motorcycle, bikes are a scam, the bike industry is quickly becoming like the phone industry with a new model every year and a price hike to match.
there are motorcycles twice as expensive as my car, motorcyles are a scam, the motorcycle industry is quickly becoming like the phone industry with a new model every year and a price hike to match.
there are cars twice as expensive as my house, cars are a scam, the car industry is quickly becoming like the phone industry with a new model every year and a price hike to match.
this is just bulshit logic
i can find you a bike 5x cheaper than your motocylce, i can find you a motorcycle 5x cheaper than you car, i can find you a car 5x cheaper than your house.
your buying top of the line merchendise, comparing bottom line fo one thing with top line of something other is just stupid. if you want to compare compare the most expensive with the most expensive or the cheapest with the cheapest, because im hella sure that the person buying that 12k bike is not the same person buying a 6k motorcycle...
And there are $500k motorcycles. What's your point?
@@omegaPhix no there aren't.
@@tobysemler A 1000cc MotoGP motorcycle costs at least a million dollars...
Hey dude i got the same with your 2004 SCOTT mtb still running till now...🤘🤘🤘
I'm going to argue that cheaper bikes are better. Take a Vitus Nucleus (£550). You've got £16450 to invest into that bike. You can invest into exactly what you want to suit you. Hope brakes? £400. Intend forks? £2200. Tyres? Nah, a WTB Trail Boss out back and a Vigilante on the nose (both TCS) come as standard. Peatys valves and a drop of sealant? Under £50. That's £3200 so far. SRAM XX1 AXS? With the cranks and a chain it's just £1500. So, £4700 in and you've already got a monster capable of XC and trail. Maybe you want new wheels. A Hope wheelset is only £500. Might as well chuck another £100 on Hope discs. Still only £5300. That's still £11700 left to use for whatever you want.
If you've got a decent budget you can build a killer bike by starting with a cheaper one. Best of all you've got a bike. Like a working riding bike. You're never stuck waiting for parts to finish the build, you're only upgrading, you can ride while parts are on order.
My current MTB is a 2016 GT avalanche would love to upgrad but this thing is solid and does what i need it to.
I've said it before, but I fully upgraded my haro extreme ex 1997 mtb, boight brand new for a special birthday. Its 26" wheels( OK I know) but rides superb, stops superb and feels great. The frame is bullet proof. Ok, I could have bought a new bike, but I upgraded mine for alot less than a new bike
I through when rich Rich we to get the teas. He was outside the café. He was having kittens about leaving his expensive bike outside.
Nicely edited video.
I've had two bikes pinched whilst locked outside cafes this year, one was a £250 used Voodoo Bizango and the other a Canyon Exceed.
I love my Giant Talon, its care-free fun and cheap maintenance even though I upgraded everything but the frame. Still, I'd love to add one of those cool loking Scott Spark with the integrated fork to the stable haha.
Wellllllll, I have just an ordinary everyday $700 "Specialized ROCKHOPPER" that does fanfekkintastique on all terrains be it street, ally way, or trail.
It replaced my 21 year old "G.T. AGGRESSOR 2.O" a year ago.
I have not seen one difference between the two except my Specilized is noticeably a bit lighter.
I guess it over all doesn't matter what you ride but rather thee importance is to "JUST GET OUT AND RIDE" !!
When going for pre owned bikes, you get quite a lot of quality even in the 700 quid range. So imho there is no need for the average rider to spend north of, say, 3k on a bike in order to have a seriously great riding experience. All without the negative thoughts along the lines of „zomg I hope I dont scratch my beautiful frame“
Any chnce you give us more specific details of the specs on the hardtail: chainring size, cassette, etc. Thanks
Look I love the contrast between extremes, but I would really love to see you guys build value bikes. And I don't mean the cheapest bikes you can build, I mean the most capable bike you can build with out breaking the bank
love the videos guys
My sons scott scale cost me £90! Over paid rich. If you catch me spending 17k on a bike it better have a 1000cc engine in it!
I ride a hardtail that I love everywhere, I ride the trails in Orange County with people that all have full sus or ebikes. Best thing is no worries to much about the bike I concentrate on my riding. Plus people don’t hold value to their bike they just get a new one and thinks it makes a difference when they haven’t progressed on what they have already.
Best is the bike you have. Second is having an expensive "ish" bike for fun times, and a cheap one to beat the hell out of. Plus not worrying about it being stolen is so much nicer for popping to the cafe and shops.
I love those Clark's m2 brakes man. On a budget i cannot recommend anything more
Agreed for the cash there bang in 👊
Well after I stopped laughing at Rich Rich I think I'm more like a budget Rich because I made my electric 750w mid-drive mountain bike sndbi love it, plus I own two more expensive electric bikes for different kinds of biking but I'm very happy with my budget bike the power of that 750w mid-drive is a lot of fun to ride and hills are no problem 😅😊
I have two bikes, one entry level hardtail (1.500€) to train, and a hig-end full-suspension to compete (6.000€) Usually I do more klms with the hardtail because the mainteance cost is significantly lower.
As said earlier in the comments, there's always a sweet spot price with anything you buy, where you get most of the benefits but without the huge premium of the top of the range. If you can afford the top of the range then why not, but most people will be more than happy with a bike half the price of the super fancy Orbea in this video. I bet Rich didn't pay full price for that bad boy! 😉
Yep, $500-1000 is a good bike for most people. Much better than a $150-300 department store bike, will shred almost anything. Slower than a race bike, but if you're not racing...
Budget all the way, I’m not trying to win races, just enjoy riding. All the gear and no idea springs to mind when I meet weekend warrior bike snobs.
Could you review some of decathlon mountain bikes?
Where I live in Canada xc bikes depreciate extremely fast we got a barely used '18 scalpel si for my wife last year and we saved about $6000 finding it on marketplace...
When I think XC I think of Miguel Martinez on his Sunn steel ht bike with either rigid or the super short travel fork. That is proper XC Ladies and Gents :P
I think More the white full dynamix with white/red sid, and crosamax with blue michelin tires.
Would love to see one of these done on a halfords bike such as a Carrera Karkinos or something. Its great seeing things done on older bikes, but where do the newer low end mountain bikes stack up these days?
How well do they hold up?
Will they just fall apart?
I returned to the sport recently, bought a Silverback for around AUD850 (so maybe 400-500 pounds equivalent?). Having had some pretty decent bikes in the past, I am really impressed with the new budget bike. I thought I wouldn't be able to do much on it, it would be more of a commuter. Turns out it's more capable than I am so far. If I outgrow it, I'll upgrde to a dualie - otherwise I'll keep thrashing it. I am very surprised how far cheap bikes have come.
Greetings from Costa Rica 🇨🇷
what helmet and goggles do you have?
No matter the price difference between the cheap and super bike, I notice that you spent the same amount on the stands for each bike.
You should compare more similar bike lets say scott spark expert 2012. First scott carbon 29er full suspension bike. Excelent bike for maybe 1500 euro. I have 2012 scott scale expert. I bought it for 700 euro. 10,5kg xc machine, full XT build.
i would like see this same video whit but with a high end xc hardtail that is smilar in price to the oiz
Rich.. there are plenty of 26" tires.. especially ones that are XC ready.
The clarks brakes on the scott would of made the bike feel rubbish worst hydraulic brake on the market if the scott had a better brake the comparison would be closer if it was timed.
Why does it even have them that's the question the scott has shimano as standard.
that budget bike kills my old 2010 xc bike just by having that Reba in the front and a 1x
does anybody know what rich rich's 1000£ brakes are?
Trickstuff diretsema or piccola...lightest brakes on the market
There Trickstuff Piccola f+r with a 180 rotor up front and a 160 out back dude
Start budget and ride the bike you've got whilst saving up,until it won't do something you want then upgrade parts or replace it for the bike that will do that thing. Rinse, repeat.
No amateur NEEDS a 10k bike build especially from the outset of the hobby, but if you want one crack on.
Of you are miserable on a cheap bike you would still be miserable on an expensive one. Enjoy riding if it puts smile on your face!
The only reason to spend such a stupid amount on any bike is because you're SO rich Price doesn't matter....Simple..!!!
Apples to oranges for sure. The biggest reason why the orbea is better is the wheel size.
Top end bikes are nice to have, but they offer no additional performance over mid-range. These comparison are always careful to compare something old or crappy to a super bike, rather than a good bike to the super bike... the difference is minimal. That doesn't mean you shouldn't buy a super bike, but don't think you need it. Pros use the bikes they do because they are free.
Not like you even put it against a cheap full suspension bike shows you a hardtail can do most trails.
a shovel doesn't dig a hole a spade does 😂😂😂
How many bikes do you all own!?
You always do the cheapest bike against the most expensive. Why don't you show differences between several more real price points? Like $1200, $2500, $5000, $6000 bikes. Talk about why you would buy in the various price points and which would be the best value. We all know that a the most expensive bike is better than the cheapest bike. As you move up the price point you get better quality shocks, forks, and wheels. Most people don't consider this. It seams all they think about is the group set. Shocks, forks, and wheel sets can be very expensive upgrades.
Love the bike design czcams.com/users/postUgkxHL1v1R3NE5x4KiYfyt8dnQmyNYz7qi5L and functionality. It is hard to align the front tired to center the disk brakes. The brake wheel touches the stationery side of the brake caliper and pad. I aired the tire up to 40 psi as the markings say 40-60psi. Left the house for a few hours and came back to an exploded innertube.All in all it seems to be a good bike. Have not ridden it yet though so that's the max of my knowledge. Update, put a new innertube made sure the tire was set properly and it did the same thing in under 20 minutes as second pic shows.
This comparison should not have occurred, totally different applications. The difference is a hardtail vs full Suspension, despite the price differences. Please do like for like, but with the dollar difference applied. That will make a lot more sense. Seems this type of video is cropping up a bit often too.. Good to watch nonetheless
for £550 used there is no reason to not be building a 29er xc bike.
Specialized stumpjumper alloy or Norco Fluid FS A4, Ive always been a kona, specialized guy and always wanted a stumpjumper but ive been reading while pedaling the rear suspension sags and is soft. I could just buy a stiffer one if that is a problem. But the Norco fluid is on a good price right now.
Anyone got any thoughts aswell?
My bike is a downhill bike but I love it but cost u a arm and leg and its shit up hill but I wouldn't get rid 😂
Theres a guy in my class who smokes everebody on an old 26 with 9x3 drivetrain. We all have modern 29ers, he still pulverizes. Bike is important but strength is more importante. The engine.
Sam Pilgrim shows what's possible on a really cheap bike (and, eventually, what's not possible!!!)
Unless you're racing, you don't need to go as fast as possible. Get the cheapest bike you're not going to break, get out there and enjoy. Spend the money you saved on something better than a bicycle.
Super bikes are not worth it for anyone except professionals. An amateur will likely perform the same on a good 3-5K bike, and anything above that price is frankly useless. It’s more about show up with a +10K bike to impress others than anything else. Plus, maintenance of super bikes is super expensive. I can afford several super bikes, but they won’t make a difference on my PBs. Better keep my bikes using Ultegra, XT and use the money elsewhere. Plus if I trash a 3K-5K bike I can easily buy it again and have the same fun as a +10K super bike.
Budget and priority, right? But can manufacturers really justify pricing? And how high can it climb? And it does so when somebody is willing to pay it. But then it's a comparatively smaller market segment... Sport bikes have done similarly over 30 years. A ZX-10 is 17K in the states, I'm willing to pay that price for many miles/smiles. And it's a better commuter in that respect, to me. I've commuted much on a hardtail. But yes, the right Santa Cruz or Intense Cycles 29er is my COT, at 2/3rds less $$$.
I might have missed the point a bit, got confused by the commuting statements, so apolgies if I have. I can see a lot more value (resources and cost to manufacture) in a ZX-10 than any bicycle (short of PERHAPS a custom). I think it is completely stupid that a bicycle can cost the same as a brand new cuting edge supersports motorbike.
@@tobysemler They're typically not that much, what I see advertised anyway. The "wireless" bits could be some 10%, and a different wheel set-up can be similar as well. That's why I was talking about manufacturers mark-up... And a whole bike spec is less spent than separate bits. It's like fine wine, when you know the difference. And there is a whole mental and physical side of it, for health and fitness. You're spending money on stuff anyway, what are you getting back?
@@brucehamilton6019 Agreed, aexcept I wouldn't say bikes are anything like fine wine. Fine wine is a luxury product with limited tangible value and low cost of production relative to the price. Bike are sporting equipment - oh, wait... you may have a point!
I ride an expensive Buget mountain bike can i leave it outside a shop? no
is it going cost a lot to maintain? yes
Do i enjoy it
Yes 👍
Why do the budget bikes not get a dropper.. ever.
13k is crazy
A spade and a Mini digger are worlds apart , bad analogy .
Difference is a spade or digger MAKES you $$$. Invest more in capital, make more $$$. Unless you're a paid pro, don't waste your $$$ on an expensive bicycle.
Even the cheapest off-road bike needs proper off-road wheels that start from £300 a pair. Anything else goes out of true as soon as you hit the first tree root
It doesn't matter that much. Back in the day we just loosened our calipers and kept riding. Now we don't even have to loosen our calipers. Anyway, with good technique parts last longer and stay in better shape - no reason to be buckling rims on every root.
@@tobysemler you can hop over one root, but if you're going downhill and there is plenty no technique can prevent the buckle if the material is not fit for purpose
@@infinitydreamzz If the track is so steep that you can't slow down and so many roots you can't jump them then yeah your wheels might buckle but most people aren't riding that. My point was more that unless your wheel is taco'd, it doesn't really matter if it's buckled and even cheaper wheels will get most people down most tracks, so I disagree that you need to spend $300 on wheels just to go MTBing.
My whole bike cost less than AUD900, came with cheap but double-walled rims. Are the wheels perfectly true? I don't know, probably not. If they get buckled, it's not the end of the world - it's not even the end of the ride!
@@tobysemler if you need to slow down to protect your rims then you are doing off-road cycling, but with compromises imposed by inferior/unsuitable hardware, not to mention the need to true after every single ride which is not an issue for proper off-road wheels. And if the bike still rides, seeing a buckled wheel is demoralising because it doesn't look good. But maybe standards are higher in Australia because I've had multiple mid to low range off road bikes with factory rims prone to buckling.
I understand and appreciate any bike that can take you out to nature which is exciting, all I'm saying is for proper unrestricted off-road experience one needs to invest in appropriate wheels. They make a difference
@@infinitydreamzz All rims will buckle if you hit them hard enough. I've buckled several 26inch D321s (showing my age). But I didn't true them after every ride - they work fine buckled a bit, unless you're racing. I don't think slowing down and showing some mechanical sympathy means you're not riding hard - who wants to break bikes and themselves constantly? And any bike will break if you hit it hard enough and crash enough. I do fine on cheap wheels these days. Cheers!
instead of expending a lot on a pair of grips, should had bought a cheap dropper post on the old bike, it would change a LOT.
You can get a fairly decent full suspension at Decathlon for less than 1000$.
😅😅😅 it Houghton-le-Spring the orbea was the cheap and nasty bike
Which is better a 7k bike or 700 bike, hmmmmmmmmmmmm. I wonder..
700. The 6300 you save gets you a lot of stuff way better than a bicycle.
Ride the bike that you can afford to replace
Common gmbn with that budget tou have invested a little bit more. Make more diverse movies. Buy some older full sus like scott spark 700 and compare it to modern it will be fair, and more interesting and you can have more content like finding a good deal, rebuilding it, and testing against modern stuff. You are beating a dead horse with those movies.
Each to their own but I really think XC is boring
Cool story, bro!
If I had millions, I would never pay $15k for a bicycle... that is just an insane price that makes no sense whatsoever.
Any bike below $8k is pointless.
This is the 327th iteration of this video you’ve done now.
Sorry. But both bikes look like they handled like crap going down the trail.
What makes you say that? They didn't crash.
So you are matching a Full Sus bike against an Hard Tail .....Come on surely you can do better than this.
Cross country is dead
Hahahaha never worth over 10k 😂😂😂
This scot is not worth 200 quit is better the get brand new moder bike for over 500 like vitus or treck marlin, s grashoper even specialize do 500+ bikes these days
Never paid more than £1000 for a bike. Never will. You're not a pro, chill.
Build your bike.
Stop saying "absolute" where it makes no sense.