Mike, Thank you ain't enough by half to say how appreciated your instructional videos are. My god... we'd all be poking in the dark without your videos.
Thank you for making your videos informative. Brings me back to my apprenticeship days when I tried to soak up all the experience of the ole Skool journeymen. Everyone who wants to has the opportunity to learn from a Master Mechanic by watching your videos.
Great video Mike, Picked up an 81 FXS made it 50 miles and it blew a head gasket, hauled it home, found your channel. Put it together and it went 3 miles and the primary exploded. Got it going again with your help. Needless to say this bike keeps me on your channel. Thanks for all your help. Just about got all the bugs worked out.
That was a great memory. I remember the first time I did that as an 18 yr. Old in the late sixty's. On my 52 pan. I didn't know about the washer. Man I had springs going everywhere. Funny. Now on my 75 shovel I have a wet primary with wet clutch plates. Installed them in 1992. They have been perfect. Thank you for the memory.
I would like to thank you sir because of your videos I have been able to successfully work on my newly acquired 71 shovel head. Thank you very much for your very informational videos And making them very simple to understand. Keep up the great work,thank you again sir
Recently went through this step by step on my '70 shovel. Clutch was "catching" and just becoming increasingly hard to ride. It's a foot clutch kick only so that was causing me headaches. After about an hour and a half of cleaning up my clutch and adjustments it was like someone had handed me a brand new bike. WOW what a difference. Just wanted to say thanks for the video it really helped me.
Gaining confidence and getting really excited to fix some things on the shovelhead this winter after watching your videos. Would love to see one on how to install a new clutch cable on a shovel sometime! Keep up the great videos
these old harley davidsons were engineered to run forever but they have to be maintained they will probably outlive us all so mikes advice on these old scooters is priceless
I ride and wrench on a modern machine but these videos are really interesting...and fun to watch. Think I will sub up, and check out whatever you have coming next. Good job on the clear and concise instructions.
Very detailed useful information that was explained like a collage professor. 2nd video I've watched and not only do I love them I appreciate the education. Thanks a bunch!
Thank you. You know it just has to do with the neighborhood you came from. And, we put steel roller skate wheels on the bottom of old 2X4's. Living at the foot of the mountains, was not necessarily a good thing. You know, I had to take the sidewalk down the mountain (just because it had a sharper turn than the street). All was good until Donna's (a little girl I went to school with) mother had left their garbage can out, right in the middle of that sidewalk. Yah the neighborhood was a gas. We all had childhoods. That "Big Wheel" must have been cool.
Hi Mr Greetings from Oaxaca Mexico, i was living in US fixing HDs, your patience is admirable, thanks for point the right matters with a correct information. Erik Cat's Garage Oaxaca.
Thankyou so much! I’m in Brazil. I have a service manual for my Shovel but it doesn’t sow how would be replaced the clutch discs! You’re a hand in the wheel! (That’s our expression for a good help)
I'm a big fan of the Panheads and especially the Knuckleheads but I like the old school stuff personally! The old school stuff to me just have more class and character than new school! Cars, Trucks and Bikes! But good video man! I have a 82 Ironhead Sportster myself! Have had it since 92!
Now I know much more about my shovel dry clutch. Going to follow your procedure because the clutch is engaging VERY abruptly. Difficult to start off in 1st gear without the bike lunging forward, making stop signs and red lights interesting. Can't ride it like this. Hope the cleaning/sanding works. Great instruction, thanks for posting!
@@pacificmike9501 Mike, sorry one more question if you have time. I disassembled the clutch plates and the steels have no cushions? Why might this be? Gary
You know in the summer I imported a 67 Electra Glide into the uk from an ol ’ timer in Indiana. I since discovered that over here in England there’s so little info on old Shovelheads, that your vids have been invaluable!! Thank you so much! You are a star!
An old Harley mechanic I knew showed me how to clean oily fiber plates. He soaked them in aviation gas, which drew the oil out. Fiber looked light gray again and like new. Crazy stuff. Aviation gas is more refined than pump car gas.
I've been having an issue with my clutch not wanting to go into first gear if I put it in neutral at a stoplight. It was working very well when I went to three-and-a-half disc clutch with my rocker pedal assembly. Lately I've been having problems with it going into first gear from neutral. It wants to grind the gears. I've got the clutch all apart and I'm cleaning everything up. I'm going to put it back together and try again that's why I'm watching your video. I wanted to make sure that I have enough play on the clutch pushrod arm. I have the same identical set up with inch and a half belt from BDL. Same pressure plate same releasing disc... I need to lock this video into memory.
Hey Mike, Nice video! I have a 76 FXE that I'm trying to go one step (possibly 2 or 3 steps) further with. Ultimately I need to get the inner primary case off. It is an HD belt primary (don't know if it's conversion or original to the bike). Right now the top end is off and the bike is stripped down. Just the lower end, tranny, starter and primary are left on the frame. The rear wheel and swing arm are all off. Everything but the basic frame and what I mentioned. I realize that this should have been done earlier. But the fact is that this is a project that started out as a rocker box gasket replacement and snow balled. But it was a gradual progression. Which turned into a full blown hardtail chopper build. I'm explaining in detail and carefully as I can so you hopefully have all the information you need to answer me correctly. But what I want to do is get what you teach in this video done (which I now understand perfectly how to do). AND the basket and everything so I can get the inner primary case off. But with what I have already taken off...the motor will NOT lock as you know. How can I get this done? I don't need to take the compensating nut or front pulley off. As the the case will bypass that. Your help is appreciated very much!
I usually remove the front pulley and clutch hub nut with an air impact. The belt drive is definitely a modification. Remember, the motor pulley nut has a right hand thread and the clutch hub nut is a left hand thread. Thank you for watching.
@@pacificmike9501 so after I get the motor pulley and basket off. What has to come off under the basket in order to get the inner primary case off. Which I thought I asked already but maybe not
Please chheck out our inner primary installation video. Once the basket is off, the starter and it's "drive housing" has to be removed, then the bolts holding the inner primary housing on have to be removed, and, please buy a service manual.
@@pacificmike9501 I already have a service manual. But sometimes it's quicker to ask someone. But not in your particular case. I did read the service manual a couple days ago and got everything taken care of
1 1/32". that's the distance from edge of spring collar to face of PP. On adjusting the clutch: H-D Factory Rep showed us to: Set the bike *level* on a stand or lift. Set the PP collar at 1 1/32" on all three studs. Check to make sure T/O brg is in place via oil fill hole in trans/kicker cover. (the later small round needle brg and/or it's snap ring tends to fail quickly when clutch has been misadjusted on the later 70s and 80s Shovels) Check to make sure clutch cable adjuster is run completely in (towards transmission/bottomed out). Yes make sure it's jam nut is run 100% opposite direction too. Now turn the center clutch adjuster until it just touches the clutch (push) rod. Back out adjuster screw 1/4 turn exactly, and hold it still while tightening the lock/jam nut. Now adjust the clutch cable adjuster until you have @ 1/4" or a tad less bewteen lever and handlebar hsg. . Now pull the clutch lever in while watching the pressure plate move. You'll usually notice it'll lift cocked/at a slant to one stud. Find the side slanted toward plate is lowest, and thread in the collar adjusting nut OPPOSITE the lowest side. Check lever again and pressure plate should lift completely straight and even now. Double check to see T/O brg is still in place. Button up everything. Now go do your burn outs. It'll hold it. Now I'll watch the video.
Awesome videos!! I’ve learned so much. I’m restoring a 1961 Servi-Car. Presently putting it back together. Coincidentally putting the clutch on. Do the fiber plates also have a specific orientation? Again awesome tips and tricks of the trade…. You are passing along knowledge you can only get from experience…
THANK YOU MIKE I understand ….NO OIL I gust old ways die hard in the old days those belts broke a lot so I am always thinking boy that belt will brake . but I will try the oil seal and thank you for getting back to me , I bought my frist Harley in 1965 a 1940 61 in a VL frame not running but mostly all there for 45.00 dollars and have been running them ever sins I do most of my riding now on my 1993 Harley FXR with a Harley side car not to meany of them around I started riding side cars in the 70s I had my 54 fle bolted to a 1954 side car . had aheart trans plant in 2000 so not the man I use to be but still love to ride any way THANK YOU Mile and ...hope to see you on the road :) GOD BLESS ..Bill
Cool. I think we've been down roads, most people have never seen. But, enough of that. Currently, just got my old roadbike, my Shovel, which I bought new in 1978, up and running again! And, as soon as it's broke in, I can start making my sidecar mounts. Yah, we could talk for days.
Sure. Why not? Anything that helps keep oil off of your clutch plates is a good thing. And, the nut is deep enough to install two seals. Just something that may or may not help, but, you're there anyway.
Just take off the releasing disc (the way we do it with a washer on the adjusting nut). Now set it down and slowly back off on the nut. It's okay if the stud backs out. Just do it slowly so it doesn't go "Boing!." Now easily replace the springs and reassemble the pressure plate on to the releasing disc. Assemble the stud and tighten down the nut to hold it all together.
I have this style of dry clutch on my FXB Sturgis. I adjusted it as shown here but noticed that in heavy stop and go traffic it really stonks into first from neutral. Am I correct in thinking that with a very hot clutch the adjustment loosens and the gap set with the adjuster screw becomes larger ? This would be the case when the heat in the clutch plates expands them, effectively moving the pressure plate (and with it the adjustmemt screw) outwards... ? Or does heat lengthen the clutch pushrod and tightens the adjuster screw gap ? P.S. I put new plates in the clutch this winter, they are not greased up or sticking.
You'll have to experiment with your adjustments. Make sure the releasing disc is sliding away staight. Adjust the springs accordingly. Adjust the center adjusting screw (with the cable backed off completely) to move the clutch arm so that it is 13/16" away from the top of the transmission cover. You will find this in your service manual.
When do you know it's time to replace the steel clutch plates. I laid them on glass to check that they are flat. My plates have dark marks on the flat surface however they are not warped. Is it time to replace them or can I simply give them a heavy sanding. Thanks very much for all your videos they're great.
Yo Mike - just serviced the dry clutch on my panhead. Makes a huge difference - thanks for the great videos. Quick question - I have the clutch dialed in - she shifts easy and everything seems on point. When I have the clutch engaged at a light and am listening to the chatter of the clutch plates it seems like the bike wants to creep forward the tiniest bit. Normal? This engine has very few miles since a major rebuild and is still tight, so I thought that might be the cause as everything seems to be running well.
You are sitting there with the clutch "disengaged." The steel plates are rattling around. That's okay. If the clutch is grabbing, maybe it's not releasing far enough or maybe it's not breaking evenly enough. This is all adjustable and just needs a little more practice. Sounds like you're getting very close.
Hi Mike, I'm really enjoying your videos, and learning a lot. I recently picked up a 1983 FXRS shovelhead 5 speed, and just followed this to remove the clutch, clean the plates and re-install. I found that the plate spacing was set at 1-1/8", but according to the service manual this was set at 1-1/32" at the factory so that's what I set it to, being careful to make sure the spacing was the same all the way around. I then adjusted the clutch cable per the service manual for 1/4" clearance. I just took it out for a test run and wow! It's grabbing really nicely now. Here's my issue though... when I got home I was unable to "find" neutral. Any advice for next steps? thanks
There are rivet tools around. Or you could make your own. I guess we better do a little riveting to show how. There's really not much to it. It's a whole lot easier to show than tell.
Mike, finishing up my clutch on a 77 shovel head open belt set up. What is a good distance to start when measuring from the pressure plate to the releasing disk?
Great video Mike. I feel like if I was that far into maintaining the clutch and giving it a general once over i'd want to clean and lubricate the clutch basket bearings and make sure that was all nice inside. What do you think?
Sure. Clean and lubed is the best. That stuff, well maintained, lasts a long time. And, the more you do it, the more you understand how the machine responds to good maintenance. Have fun.
Mike, I know this is an old video, but I have a question. I have an 80 fxwg with a chain primary, but I have a dry clutch. I put the aftermarket needle bearings on it with no cage (with a healthy amount of grease) and a 5 stud clutch hub. I noticed that when the bike is cold, the clutch chatters quite a bit when I take off. Once it warms up, it stops. I haven't taken it apart yet to see what's going on, but I was hoping you could point me in the right direction as to what to look for when I disassemble it. EDIT: Probably worth noting it's a 93" S&S stroker kit.
Hi Mike, Happy new year. Thank you for making these videos. My clutch is new but has been sitting for almost 20 years. The steel plates have patches of surface rust. The clutch seems to operate okay but since it’s apart should I worry about dressing up the steel plates? Also my steel plates don’t have the anti rattle fingers. Is it worth the cost to buy them? Thank you
Happy New Year. Use some fine wet or dry sandpaper (like, 400 grit). Clean them up with the sandpaper and a real light oil to get rid of the rust and make them smooth. Then, wash them with isopropyl alcohol and use them. The antirattlers just keep the plates from rattling when the clutch is disengaged. If the sound doesn't bother you, the bike doesn't care. Personally, I like them quiet, but, it doesn't really matter. Don't buy the antirattler fingers (as you call them). If you want quiet plates, buy new plates with the anti-rattlers or "buffers" already installed.
Any thoughts/advice about changing to primary belt drive and dry clutch? Angles: reliability, simplicity, road side repairability, smoothness, cost? Fxrs Con ‘90. Regards Marcus.
Harley did better (I believe it was 91 up) when they went to a splined transmission mainshaft and clutch hub, but the wet clutch and stock primaries on 5 speeds were all pretty good. There are newer, better clutches available for both early and later Harleys and I generally run belt drives on any of the old kickstart only bikes. Electric starts, I run primary chains. Just me.
Hey Mike, I cleaned the clutch out just like you did in this video and adjusted the clutch boost as in another video of yours and it was fine for a couple of rides and now wont release. The plates were just super gummy especially towards the basket and one was really difficult to remove but I got it out and cleaned them all and it was great. Do you think I should invest in new plates? The set in my 56 are at least 30 years old and thats a rough guess. Thanks.
Hard to say. Sounds like maybe you're leaking oil on to the plates. Is the clutch nut seal doing its job? If the plates are just super gummy, they could be so saturated they won't clean up. Did you try sanding them? Sometimes, maybe it's time to buy new ones. If you do, make sure they slide well on the fingers of the clutch hub. If not, try sanding those studs (fingers). Sometimes you need to open the holes up a hair on the plates (1/64th over 3/8). Good luck. I can't make a judgement over the internet. I try. Sometimes it's time to replace more than one thing.
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks Mike. I could not get the oil out of those plates no matter what I tried but then read in the service manual to soak them in white gas and it takes the oil right out of them. I also finally think I have the timing done correctly and will be starting it up tomorrow with the primary cover off to see if it leaks from the clutch nut seal or not. I tried to break that nut free but man that thing is on there. Hopefully with the points set and the timing done it will start easier for me and then we shall see if it leaking. Hopefully not. I may pull it off one more time and clean up the studs since its so much easier with putting a big washer on there to hold all those springs together. Thanks again.
Question for you Mike. I have an issue with a sticking throw-out bearing. Pulling the clutch in when coming to a stop in 1st gear, the clutch doesn’t disengage. Took it all apart, cleaned everything, reinstalled. Same thing happens intermittently. Locks up the rear wheel when it happens if applying brake at same time the clutch sticks. Bike is a 1970 FLH.
I think you need to remove the kicker cover and remove the throwout bear. See if it has a problem. Inspect the finger that moves that bearing. See if the clutch throwout rod is in good shape. They wear out. The angle of the clutch arm is critical. The book says 5/8" from the starter motor. You need to check it all out from one end to the other. Check the adjusting screw. The one with a ball on then end of it is not one of my favorites.
Mike I have a stock ‘90 FXRS CON with the newer clutch shaft. I would like to know which pros & cons are to be expected when installing an open belt and dry clutch. I’m lookin’ for simplicity, reliability, smoothnes and easy road side repairability. Any thoughts/advice would be appreciated. The bike has 104K km on it. Cheers Marcus
Well, I answered you accidentally before finding this comment. I'd run a wet primary, an aftermarket clutch of your choice, and even maybe an aftermarket starter of your choice. You've got a well designed unit to start with.
Respectfully, what is the bike? I assume you're talking about a primary drive. Which motor? Splined or tapered sprocket shaft. Tin or aluminum primary covers? Electric start? Stock clutch basket and clutch hub? What brand of belt drive? Kevlar or rubber belt. All of these things make differences. Does the transmission slide fore and aft on your tranny plate, in your frame. Tell me more and I'll do my best to help.
The basket would be wobbling on the hub. The hub could be wobbling on the mainshaft. I don't know which you have. Hard to say what you're getting in to.
What is the motorcycle? Does it have a year of manufacture? Is it a Panhead? Shovelhead? Evo? Sportster? Do you have a year and model specific service manual? If so, it's in your service manual.
I assume you're speaking of the timing plug hole which they both certainly have on the left side of the crankcase. That particular shovelhead also has an after-market timing indicator mounted inside the primary housing. We may show that later on. I hope this answers the question, and, thank you for watching.
We show some pretty good closeups on our videos and there are a fw on the dry clutches. Go to our CZcams Home page. Just type in Pacific Mike on CZcams, then click on the word "Videos."
Mike, my Pan-Shovel has the same belt primary as the bike in this video, and I have two questions about pulley installation: First, what is the torque on the front pulley nut, and do you use loctite? Second, ordinarily on the clutch hub nut, there's a tab washer that locks to the keyway. However, with this rear belt pulley, there is a dished aluminum piece (with a nylon washer on the back side with holes for the fingers) that covers up the keyway. So, there's nothing for the tab washer to hook into. Do you just omit the tab washer?
Not sure. But, a drop of red Loctite will keep that clutch hub nut on there. About 60 lbs. on the clutch hub nut is adequate. Front pulley nut. What year motor? Splined shaft or tapered shaft? That's why I ask for years and models. I hit that pulley nut with an air impact. Don't get carried away. A drop of red loctite on that nut too.
@@pacificmike9501 - Sorry, this is a '51 Pan bottom, so it's a tapered shaft. Sounds good! I will proceed as you suggest--and thank you for the quick reply. She's almost on the road, in time for the 1-year anniversary of purchase and tear-down. I'll soon be reviewing your 'mousetrap' adjustment video again to make sure I get it right!
Yes. Wet clutches are nice. But, your system must be designed for it. A lot of the plates are "either or." But the rest of the system has to be made for it.
Hey thanks for the video.. I have a 83 FXSB with a dry clutch belt setup. I'm getting a fair amount of oil in my clutch plates and the clutch is slipping. I do have a leak coming from my transmission drive gear seal. I am not seeing any oil leaking from the front crank seal. Is the trans causing the oil on my clutch plates? Do you have a video on removing the primary and changing the seal? This thing has been leaking for years now, and making a mess of my garage but I've been hesitant to tackle the job until I'm comfortable with it. It's long over due. Hoping for a point in the right direction with this. Thanks in advance.
I think we've shown all those things, maybe not in the order you're asking. The transmission has two seals on the left side. The mainshaft oil seal, as it is referred to in the parts book, is the large seal behind the sprocket. This and the spacer that runs inside it are generally the culprits that flood your garage floor. Next, the second offender, especially if you overfill your transmission, or your bike leans to the left too far, is the main drive gear oil seal (as it is referred to in the parts book). I believe you need to replace all of this stuff. Don't forget the clutch hub nut seal. You can stack two in the nut. We do have a video showing the installation of the inner primary, although it's not a belt drive. I hope this helps you.
@@pacificmike9501 looks like I need the parts book. You've been very helpful I greatly appreciate it. I gotta get that part number for the main seal bushing. I think that may be my issue as the previous owner did all the seals shortly before I bought the bike. Or so he says you know how that goes. ✌️
Hi Mike! I finally found some time to dismantle the clutch on my '77 Shovelhead project bike. The plates were a real mess so I cleaned and serviced them the way you suggested in your fine video. However I ran into an unexpected problem with the pressure plate assembly. It has only 3 clutch springs rather than the 10 required. The springs are situated on the adjustment nut studs. Not sure why someone did this, but I intend to install the proper compliment of 10 springs. How do I install the new springs efficiently, and without injuring myself? Thanks.
You'll see. Remove the assembly from the hub using the "washer trick.' Slowly back off the nut and center screw. Take it apart. Put the ten springs in place, Then put the collar, called the pressure plate, in place and replace the center screw and nut. Now, you can install it back on the clutch hub. Be sure you get the right springs for your model. Adjust spacing for YOUR model. Should be just fine.
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks very much for the advice Mike! Would you go with stock H-D springs, if they're still available, or is there an advantage to after-market clutch springs like the ones offered by Barnett?
another superb, simple, matter of fact instruction vid Mike! the only thing i could say would "improve" it is to mention NOT to use methanol (methyl alky), but isopropyl (rubbing alky) or denatured ethyl as your "safe cleaner". methyl is a neuro-toxin you absorb through your skin, by breathing the fumes, etc. just one exposure won't do any much harm, but it's cumulative, so all the short exposures add up to damage over time. "minor toxicity" results in permanent numbness in fingers, teeth rotting, and other fun stuff. real bad exposure (like drinking it) can cause permanent blindness, coma, heart problems, etc. good stuff to avoid exposure to as much as possible, lol. besides, it causes cancer in california, rofl. ALL solvents are kinda bad over long term, but methyl is pretty awful all the time.
Always looking to "improve." I am not a chemist, but I will try to be more explicit in my recommendations. Your input is much appreciated. I appreciate the compliment and the clarification. Again, thank you.
Pacific Mike no chemist here either. I learned the hard way about methanol, so figured I'd spare others the side effects. Thanks for the reply, and keep up the fantastic work, both spinning wrenches and making vids!
Hi mike, I converted the primary to a belt drive on my shovelhead (1982) and replaced the friction discs at the same time. I see the bike you are working on in this video has 4 friction discs. Mine originally came with 5 so after the conversion I installed the 5 new friction discs that came in the pack but now I almost can't let the clutch slip, it's almost like it's either engaged or disengaged with no in between. My mechanic also noticed that the pack of plates was a bit too thick for its taste and we cannot remove tension on the spring anymore, the nuts are at the very end of the fingers. Would you say the clutch could have a better feel if I remove one friction disc even if it originally had 5? I would much appreciate to have your opinion. Thanks!
Not a problem. Original clutches used 5 fiber plates from '66-'84. Earlier ones used 4. Your belt drive clutch basket may be intended for 4. Still not a problem. Try 4 with 4 steels. The first plate in should be a steel because your clutch basket is most likely aluminum and needs a steel to keep from scoring from the spinning fiber disc that you will install next. Now alternate steel and fiber with the last plate installed to be a fiber. You should be good to go. Don't forget, if the steels have the buffers on them to "stagger" them for clearance. Don't forget to get the measurement from the edge of the "pressure plate" to the releasing disc to be as close to 1 and 1/32" as close as possible and even all the way around.
The old Shovel I bought has a belt primary drive. The belt was oily and damaged. I've read that belts need to be ventilated. The one on your Knuckle is fully enclosed. So did my belt get hot or was oil the cause ? My clutch derby cover and front of the primary cover is ventilated.
Good questions, not much information, but I'll try. First, find out where the oil is coming from. It could be the motor seal. It could be from a no longer needed primary chain oiler. It could be leaking in from somewhere else. Next comes your question on heating. I don't know what primary covers you're using. The old belts were made of rubber. Today's belts are made of Kevlar and are far more durable. I only run belts inside tin covers, which are not sealed up, and therefore just don't seem to heat up much. I've run them for many years and it gets real hot here in the summer. But, venting is not a bad thing. Oil is very hard on belts, but age and nasty things in the air deteriorates them, even the Sun's rays. Last is alignment and tension. Best to consult the manufacturer on your particular unit. I hope this helps. Good luck.
Possible leak from the clutch push rod in the center of the clutch hub nut (left hand thread nut with locking washer. There is a small seal that will leak tranny oil on the discs and plates.
From 1965 up until the mid eighties, all Harley Big Twins lubed the primary chain with a drip system that ran a small tube from the oil pump to the inner primary housing and dripped oil onto the chain. There was a breather hose that teed off of the breather hose from the engine to the oil tank that went over and pressurized the the housing. Then, there was an oil line that returned the oil to the engine. This was not a large volume of oil and it didn't get onto the "dry clutch." After that, this system was eliminated and the housing held a separate volume of oil and the clutch and the chain ran in oil and became a "wet clutch." There were different models in the eighties, some wet and some dry. The clutches were made of different materials accordingly.
Great video! I have a 81 flh, my clutch is sticky so I went right to your page. I will be doing mine tomorrow. What are your thoughts on wet clutches and do they make kits for older bikes? Sure wish you were on another platform so I could pick your brain🤣
Hello Mike, Thanks for the VIDEO - and the TIP on using ALCOHOL for Clutch cleaning purposes G@@D information to have COOP ..........................................
Mike, what was that measurement that you took for the pressure plate? I just got a 80 fxe with an open belt primary set up. It shifts fine and doesn't catch or jump but when looking down at it when spinning it doesn't look straight, it looks like it has a wobble. I read in my HD manual that it says 1-1/32 in. I watched another video and the guy was measuring it at 31/32in thanks for any adivce, or if I should even adjust it if it's shifting good.
If it works well, it works well. The measurement is a starting point. Adjusting it to break evenly is where you go from there. Enough pressure for the clutch to not slip and release well is the goal. Early clutches start at 1" and the later ones at 1 and 1/32. Again, that's a "starting point."
Nowdays, everyone uses the internet. Primo Rivera has been around for a long time. Look it up. Find the right model for your bike. You didn't say what bike you have (tapered or splined motor shaft, tin or aluminum primaries). I like a catalog I can hold in my hands, but the information is as close as a computer or telephone. At Rivera Engineering, they have all the information. Just have all of your facts in order. Make. model, year, year of motor, kick or electric start, and style of primary. Good luck. You'll get it. This stuff takes research that foes on forever.
It's personal preference. Neither is wrong. But those little anti-rattlers or "buffers" really quiet things down. I like them. But, a lot of old chopper riders, with open primaries, liked the sound of their clutch when it disengaged and made all that racket. Different strokes.
Hey Mike, rebuilding my dads 79 Shovelhead. Your videos have been invaluable in the process. Putting the clutch hub Assam on today and I do not have a woodruff key as the manual says it should have and there is notch on the hub and trans shaft. It has been a couple of months but do not remember one when disassembling. Possible it popped off when Imremovedmhub but didn't see it and was very careful about keeping all parts. Cannot find a video anywhere on reinstalling the hub, only on the clutch with his already installed.
I believe we showed that on a video for the project bike. Go to our CZcams Homepage and click on "videos." It's just a seal that slides in between the two bushings in the cover. We built a kickstart assembly there.
Hey Mike! Love your videos! I have a 1980 FXWG. I've been fighting the clutch for a little while and have a question about it. The service manual speaks to setting the clutch arm on the transmission 13/16" from the tower on the transmission as the first adjustment your do. I however have yet to see anyone actually do this when adjusting their clutch. All the folks I have talked to and videos I've watched essentially show the same procedure you're doing. Was this a pointless step from HD?
Not at all. In fact, I have suggested it before. The manual is the place to start. And, that adjustment, using the late tranny lid, is the way to go. It's hard to get in there with your little ruler and it seems dumb, but it's the best starting place for your adjustment.
@@pacificmike9501 So just a follow-up, the manual says to loosen the pushrod lock-nut and turn the screw out then use the adjusting sleeve to bring the release lever forward. I have heard of people instead using the adjusting screw to set the 13/16" gap at the release lever, then adjusting the cable. It seems like it accomplishes the same thing. What do you think? (note: I use a little ruler from a set of feeler gauges that I've marked the 13/16" line with a sharpie to get in there. Throw a magnet on top to keep it in place and you're all set.)
I think you're doing great. What you're doing is getting an understanding of how it really works. If you use the adjusting screw to set the arm position, while you hold onto the cable sleeve (which has been backed off completely), back off the screw just a little to make sure the throwout bearing is not under a load. Gotta have a little freeplay. Get your cable adjusted without loosing that freeplay. Don't be surprised if it isn't perfect right off the bat. Do it some more. Remember to lube the cable and the hand lever. Lube where the end of the cable seats into the clutch arm. All of these things are important so the parts wear longer and are a pleasure to use.
I got a trick I use for the same procedure. Just take a piece of fuel line about 6 or 8 inches long and put it on the end of a spark plug that is 13/16 and use that as a feeler gauge sort of between the top of the tranny and the clutch arm. It beats hell out of trying to hold a ruler or anything in there.
For anyone using iso with heigh water content or in an environment that has moisture make sure to sweat the metal clutch plates with a torch. Get rid of the moisture context or you’ll end up with a rusty, glued clutch.
My generation owes you a massive debt of gratitude. Thank you for making these videos so we can be self-sufficient and keep our old bikes on the road!
You're very welcome!
Mike, Thank you ain't enough by half to say how appreciated your instructional videos are. My god... we'd all be poking in the dark without your videos.
Glad to help
The Bob Ross of choppers. Love your vids. ✌️
Thank you.
Bob Ross!! Wow. Knew him well.
A thank you on behalf of everyone who enjoys watching and learning in a clear straight forward way , about and how to work on Harleys . brilliant vids
Quite a compliment. Thank you. We keep trying. We're constantly learning.
Thank you for making your videos informative. Brings me back to my apprenticeship days when I tried to soak up all the experience of the ole Skool journeymen. Everyone who wants to has the opportunity to learn from a Master Mechanic by watching your videos.
Wow. Thank You.
Buying another shirt, still amazes me how you always have exactly what I need on tap.
Thank You.
@@pacificmike9501 Swear, haven't opened my Chilton's in 2 years.
Great video Mike, Picked up an 81 FXS made it 50 miles and it blew a head gasket, hauled it home, found your channel. Put it together and it went 3 miles and the primary exploded. Got it going again with your help. Needless to say this bike keeps me on your channel. Thanks for all your help. Just about got all the bugs worked out.
That's very cool. Thank you. I am impressed.
Mike I love your videos,you are the best one out there.keep them coming .
Thank you. We'll do our best.
Thank you, Mike. I'm enjoying to listen you.
Glad you enjoy it!
That was a great memory. I remember the first time I did that as an 18 yr. Old in the late sixty's. On my 52 pan. I didn't know about the washer. Man I had springs going everywhere. Funny. Now on my 75 shovel I have a wet primary with wet clutch plates. Installed them in 1992. They have been perfect. Thank you for the memory.
Thank you.
I would like to thank you sir because of your videos I have been able to successfully work on my newly acquired 71 shovel head. Thank you very much for your very informational videos And making them very simple to understand. Keep up the great work,thank you again sir
Thank you. Glad to be of service.
Awesome videos I just bought a 48 pan and a 58 pan your videos are extremely helpful.
Wow! That's a call to celebrate. Thank You!
Recently went through this step by step on my '70 shovel. Clutch was "catching" and just becoming increasingly hard to ride. It's a foot clutch kick only so that was causing me headaches. After about an hour and a half of cleaning up my clutch and adjustments it was like someone had handed me a brand new bike. WOW what a difference. Just wanted to say thanks for the video it really helped me.
Thank you. Glad we could help.
Gaining confidence and getting really excited to fix some things on the shovelhead this winter after watching your videos. Would love to see one on how to install a new clutch cable on a shovel sometime! Keep up the great videos
Never thought about it. Next time I put a clutch cable on a shovel, we'll show it. Thank you.
Invaluable brother. Real teacher for all of us to enjoy. Thank you Mike for your time.
Thank you.
Thanks for your videos. I’m in the process of restoring my first 72 Shovelhead, so your videos are very informative.
Cool. Have a good time with it. Thank you.
these old harley davidsons were engineered to run forever but they have to be maintained they will probably outlive us all so mikes advice on these old scooters is priceless
Thank You. I'd like them to live forever. If we could enjoy them forever...
I ride and wrench on a modern machine but these videos are really interesting...and fun to watch. Think I will sub up, and check out whatever you have coming next. Good job on the clear and concise instructions.
What a nice thing to hear. Thank you. From time to time, we'll get into some newer stuff, just whatever comes up. Obviously
Back in the day all this stuff was simple I miss my 58 Panhead
They are still out there.
Very detailed useful information that was explained like a collage professor. 2nd video I've watched and not only do I love them I appreciate the education. Thanks a bunch!
Thank you.
Great video man.. Gonna go adjust the springs in my shovel. Love the tip with the washer on the adjusting screw.
Just the old way I was taught. Thank you.
As a kid I was riding my Big Wheel and he was sanding clutch plates on the sidewalk. Good vids.
Thank you. You know it just has to do with the neighborhood you came from. And, we put steel roller skate wheels on the bottom of old 2X4's. Living at the foot of the mountains, was not necessarily a good thing. You know, I had to take the sidewalk down the mountain (just because it had a sharper turn than the street). All was good until Donna's (a little girl I went to school with) mother had left their garbage can out, right in the middle of that sidewalk. Yah the neighborhood was a gas. We all had childhoods. That "Big Wheel" must have been cool.
I don't even own a HD but love watching your videos!
Thank You.
Great videos MIke. You have a new subscriber since I just bought a 75 FX a couple of weeks ago. Thanks for taking the time to make these videos!
Awesome, thank you!
Hi Mr
Greetings from Oaxaca Mexico, i was living in US fixing HDs, your patience is admirable, thanks for point the right matters with a correct information.
Erik
Cat's Garage Oaxaca.
Greetings, and thank you.
Hello from France. Thanks for sharing . Long life for the " Old Irons ' ....
Hello from America! Thanks for watching. It's our job to keep these old bikes alive for ourselves and future generations. What an honor!
Thankyou so much! I’m in Brazil. I have a service manual for my Shovel but it doesn’t sow how would be replaced the clutch discs! You’re a hand in the wheel! (That’s our expression for a good help)
Nice expression! Thank you. Glad to be of service.
Great. Work Mike take care of yourself and family hope to see you on the road soon!
Thank You. Me too and you too.
I'm a big fan of the Panheads and especially the Knuckleheads but I like the old school stuff personally! The old school stuff to me just have more class and character than new school! Cars, Trucks and Bikes! But good video man! I have a 82 Ironhead Sportster myself! Have had it since 92!
Very cool.
Great video! Exactly what I needed to see for my Shovelhead.
Cool. Thank you.
Thanks again Mike! Always straight forward! Question, do you ever flip every other plate or put them on a flat surface to see if they are warped?
Thank you CZcams Dad! Youre the best please keep making videos🙏🙏
Thank you, I will
Now I know much more about my shovel dry clutch. Going to follow your procedure because the clutch is engaging VERY abruptly. Difficult to start off in 1st gear without the bike lunging forward, making stop signs and red lights interesting. Can't ride it like this. Hope the cleaning/sanding works. Great instruction, thanks for posting!
Glad to help. Make sure the plates can slide easily on the clutch hub fingers.
@@pacificmike9501 Will do, thank you!
@@pacificmike9501 Mike, sorry one more question if you have time. I disassembled the clutch plates and the steels have no cushions? Why might this be? Gary
I run wet primary after going from belt back to chain. I clean my discs when needed! Thanks for the video. I have a 83 Shovel.
Thank you.
Thx again Mike for really useful info! Stay safe!
Thanks, you too!
You know in the summer I imported a 67 Electra Glide into the uk from an ol ’ timer in Indiana. I since discovered that over here in England there’s so little info on old Shovelheads, that your vids have been invaluable!! Thank you so much! You are a star!
Thanks for the vid, Mike.
Thank You for watching.
Thanks for the tips. I like the alcohol for cleaning .
Thank you for responding. Alcohol is quick, easy, cheap, and not very harmful.
Thank you for this mike!
Thank You. I hope it helps you.
you make it look very easy
Repetition does that for you. In fact, a couple times and it becomes routine. Thank You.
Great Vid and greetings from Germany
Thank you.
Very good video, my man.
Thank you. We do things as they come up, and we'll be doing more soon. Hope you like them too.
Great video thank you enjoyed it.
Glad you enjoyed it. Thank You
Very informative.. Thanks Bud..
Thank you.
God bless ! . You are a blessing.
Thank You and the best to you.
An old Harley mechanic I knew showed me how to clean oily fiber plates. He soaked them in aviation gas, which drew the oil out. Fiber looked light gray again and like new. Crazy stuff. Aviation gas is more refined than pump car gas.
Cool. I like that.
I wish that I could have your patience and vocabulary when wrenching.
Thank You.
Good stuff, thanks Mike
Thank you.
I've been having an issue with my clutch not wanting to go into first gear if I put it in neutral at a stoplight. It was working very well when I went to three-and-a-half disc clutch with my rocker pedal assembly. Lately I've been having problems with it going into first gear from neutral. It wants to grind the gears. I've got the clutch all apart and I'm cleaning everything up. I'm going to put it back together and try again that's why I'm watching your video. I wanted to make sure that I have enough play on the clutch pushrod arm. I have the same identical set up with inch and a half belt from BDL. Same pressure plate same releasing disc... I need to lock this video into memory.
Make sure all the plates slide easily and smoothly.
Great video .
Thank you. Glad you like it.
Hey Mike, Nice video! I have a 76 FXE that I'm trying to go one step (possibly 2 or 3 steps) further with. Ultimately I need to get the inner primary case off. It is an HD belt primary (don't know if it's conversion or original to the bike). Right now the top end is off and the bike is stripped down. Just the lower end, tranny, starter and primary are left on the frame. The rear wheel and swing arm are all off. Everything but the basic frame and what I mentioned. I realize that this should have been done earlier. But the fact is that this is a project that started out as a rocker box gasket replacement and snow balled. But it was a gradual progression. Which turned into a full blown hardtail chopper build. I'm explaining in detail and carefully as I can so you hopefully have all the information you need to answer me correctly. But what I want to do is get what you teach in this video done (which I now understand perfectly how to do). AND the basket and everything so I can get the inner primary case off. But with what I have already taken off...the motor will NOT lock as you know. How can I get this done? I don't need to take the compensating nut or front pulley off. As the the case will bypass that. Your help is appreciated very much!
I usually remove the front pulley and clutch hub nut with an air impact. The belt drive is definitely a modification. Remember, the motor pulley nut has a right hand thread and the clutch hub nut is a left hand thread. Thank you for watching.
@@pacificmike9501 so after I get the motor pulley and basket off. What has to come off under the basket in order to get the inner primary case off. Which I thought I asked already but maybe not
Please chheck out our inner primary installation video. Once the basket is off, the starter and it's "drive housing" has to be removed, then the bolts holding the inner primary housing on have to be removed, and, please buy a service manual.
@@pacificmike9501 I already have a service manual. But sometimes it's quicker to ask someone. But not in your particular case. I did read the service manual a couple days ago and got everything taken care of
I forgot to tell. In our next video, soon to be released, we show how to remove the clutch hub.
Great vid thanks
Thank You
1 1/32". that's the distance from edge of spring collar to face of PP.
On adjusting the clutch: H-D Factory Rep showed us to:
Set the bike *level* on a stand or lift.
Set the PP collar at 1 1/32" on all three studs.
Check to make sure T/O brg is in place via oil fill hole in trans/kicker cover. (the later small round needle brg and/or it's snap ring tends to fail quickly when clutch has been misadjusted on the later 70s and 80s Shovels)
Check to make sure clutch cable adjuster is run completely in (towards transmission/bottomed out). Yes make sure it's jam nut is run 100% opposite direction too.
Now turn the center clutch adjuster until it just touches the clutch (push) rod. Back out adjuster screw 1/4 turn exactly, and hold it still while tightening the lock/jam nut.
Now adjust the clutch cable adjuster until you have @ 1/4" or a tad less bewteen lever and handlebar hsg.
. Now pull the clutch lever in while watching the pressure plate move. You'll usually notice it'll lift cocked/at a slant to one stud. Find the side slanted toward plate is lowest, and thread in the collar adjusting nut OPPOSITE the lowest side. Check lever again and pressure plate should lift completely straight and even now.
Double check to see T/O brg is still in place.
Button up everything.
Now go do your burn outs. It'll hold it. Now I'll watch the video.
Very good. 1 1/32" on late model, 1" on earlier.
I LIKE THE BOX END
Okay.
Thanx again Mike !
It's nice to know we're putting in what people want to see. We'll continue as things come up, however or whenever they do. Thank you.
Awesome videos!! I’ve learned so much. I’m restoring a 1961 Servi-Car. Presently putting it back together. Coincidentally putting the clutch on. Do the fiber plates also have a specific orientation? Again awesome tips and tricks of the trade…. You are passing along knowledge you can only get from experience…
I'd have to see those plates. Go by your service manual. If you don't have one, V-Twin carries them.
THANK YOU MIKE I understand ….NO OIL I gust old ways die hard in the old days those belts broke a lot so I am always thinking boy that belt will brake . but I will try the oil seal and thank you for getting back to me , I bought my frist Harley in 1965 a 1940 61 in a VL frame not running but mostly all there for 45.00 dollars and have been running them ever sins I do most of my riding now on my 1993 Harley FXR with a Harley side car not to meany of them around I started riding side cars in the 70s I had my 54 fle bolted to a 1954 side car . had aheart trans plant in 2000 so not the man I use to be but still love to ride any way THANK YOU Mile and ...hope to see you on the road :) GOD BLESS ..Bill
Cool. I think we've been down roads, most people have never seen. But, enough of that. Currently, just got my old roadbike, my Shovel, which I bought new in 1978, up and running again! And, as soon as it's broke in, I can start making my sidecar mounts. Yah, we could talk for days.
Mike I got 1972 FLH do you recommend to put doble seal on mainshaft nut clutch? Thanks very helpful video
Sure. Why not? Anything that helps keep oil off of your clutch plates is a good thing. And, the nut is deep enough to install two seals. Just something that may or may not help, but, you're there anyway.
Hi! how to change cluch hub springs? thank you
Just take off the releasing disc (the way we do it with a washer on the adjusting nut). Now set it down and slowly back off on the nut. It's okay if the stud backs out. Just do it slowly so it doesn't go "Boing!." Now easily replace the springs and reassemble the pressure plate on to the releasing disc. Assemble the stud and tighten down the nut to hold it all together.
I have this style of dry clutch on my FXB Sturgis. I adjusted it as shown here but noticed that in heavy stop and go traffic it really stonks into first from neutral. Am I correct in thinking that with a very hot clutch the adjustment loosens and the gap set with the adjuster screw becomes larger ? This would be the case when the heat in the clutch plates expands them, effectively moving the pressure plate (and with it the adjustmemt screw) outwards... ? Or does heat lengthen the clutch pushrod and tightens the adjuster screw gap ?
P.S. I put new plates in the clutch this winter, they are not greased up or sticking.
You'll have to experiment with your adjustments. Make sure the releasing disc is sliding away staight. Adjust the springs accordingly. Adjust the center adjusting screw (with the cable backed off completely) to move the clutch arm so that it is 13/16" away from the top of the transmission cover. You will find this in your service manual.
When do you know it's time to replace the steel clutch plates. I laid them on glass to check that they are flat. My plates have dark marks on the flat surface however they are not warped. Is it time to replace them or can I simply give them a heavy sanding.
Thanks very much for all your videos they're great.
If they work smoothly, they're good. They can be very smooth. Clean and smooth is it.
Yo Mike - just serviced the dry clutch on my panhead. Makes a huge difference - thanks for the great videos. Quick question - I have the clutch dialed in - she shifts easy and everything seems on point. When I have the clutch engaged at a light and am listening to the chatter of the clutch plates it seems like the bike wants to creep forward the tiniest bit. Normal? This engine has very few miles since a major rebuild and is still tight, so I thought that might be the cause as everything seems to be running well.
You are sitting there with the clutch "disengaged." The steel plates are rattling around. That's okay. If the clutch is grabbing, maybe it's not releasing far enough or maybe it's not breaking evenly enough. This is all adjustable and just needs a little more practice. Sounds like you're getting very close.
Hi Mike, I'm really enjoying your videos, and learning a lot. I recently picked up a 1983 FXRS shovelhead 5 speed, and just followed this to remove the clutch, clean the plates and re-install. I found that the plate spacing was set at 1-1/8", but according to the service manual this was set at 1-1/32" at the factory so that's what I set it to, being careful to make sure the spacing was the same all the way around. I then adjusted the clutch cable per the service manual for 1/4" clearance. I just took it out for a test run and wow! It's grabbing really nicely now. Here's my issue though... when I got home I was unable to "find" neutral. Any advice for next steps? thanks
Yes, it's the way they were designed. Put it into neutral while you are rolling, not when you are stopped.
Hi Mike. Love your channel. What would you recommend for sanding the clutch plates and what is the desired outcome? Thanks!
You're just wanting to "deglaze" them. When I was a kit, we rubbed them on the sidewalk. Any old sandpaper on a nice flat surface.
Hey mike wondering if you could do one on replacing the clutch hub liner? Dry clutch....
Is there a tool for the rivets or????
There are rivet tools around. Or you could make your own. I guess we better do a little riveting to show how. There's really not much to it. It's a whole lot easier to show than tell.
Hey Mike I was wondering what grit paper you recommend to sand with. And thanks for a great lesson. See ya out on the road!
Not critical. 320, 400. Just clean 'em up.
Mike, finishing up my clutch on a 77 shovel head open belt set up. What is a good distance to start when measuring from the pressure plate to the releasing disk?
The book shows it at 1 1/32". But it's really up to you.
thanx Mike
Thank you.
Thank you!
Thank you.
Great video Mike. I feel like if I was that far into maintaining the clutch and giving it a general once over i'd want to clean and lubricate the clutch basket bearings and make sure that was all nice inside. What do you think?
Sure. Clean and lubed is the best. That stuff, well maintained, lasts a long time. And, the more you do it, the more you understand how the machine responds to good maintenance. Have fun.
Mike, I know this is an old video, but I have a question. I have an 80 fxwg with a chain primary, but I have a dry clutch. I put the aftermarket needle bearings on it with no cage (with a healthy amount of grease) and a 5 stud clutch hub. I noticed that when the bike is cold, the clutch chatters quite a bit when I take off. Once it warms up, it stops. I haven't taken it apart yet to see what's going on, but I was hoping you could point me in the right direction as to what to look for when I disassemble it.
EDIT: Probably worth noting it's a 93" S&S stroker kit.
The plates are probably sticking together. Most likely oil on the plates. Make sure it's breaking straight.
Hi Mike,
Happy new year. Thank you for making these videos. My clutch is new but has been sitting for almost 20 years. The steel plates have patches of surface rust. The clutch seems to operate okay but since it’s apart should I worry about dressing up the steel plates? Also my steel plates don’t have the anti rattle fingers. Is it worth the cost to buy them?
Thank you
Happy New Year. Use some fine wet or dry sandpaper (like, 400 grit). Clean them up with the sandpaper and a real light oil to get rid of the rust and make them smooth. Then, wash them with isopropyl alcohol and use them. The antirattlers just keep the plates from rattling when the clutch is disengaged. If the sound doesn't bother you, the bike doesn't care. Personally, I like them quiet, but, it doesn't really matter. Don't buy the antirattler fingers (as you call them). If you want quiet plates, buy new plates with the anti-rattlers or "buffers" already installed.
Thanks so much. I’ll do just that.
Any thoughts/advice about changing to primary belt drive and dry clutch? Angles: reliability, simplicity, road side repairability, smoothness, cost? Fxrs Con ‘90. Regards Marcus.
Harley did better (I believe it was 91 up) when they went to a splined transmission mainshaft and clutch hub, but the wet clutch and stock primaries on 5 speeds were all pretty good. There are newer, better clutches available for both early and later Harleys and I generally run belt drives on any of the old kickstart only bikes. Electric starts, I run primary chains. Just me.
Is there any difference to conducting maintenance on the 45"? I have a 1942 WLA and would like to do check the clutch on it.
Pretty much the same. Check your manual for any measurements.
Hey Mike, I cleaned the clutch out just like you did in this video and adjusted the clutch boost as in another video of yours and it was fine for a couple of rides and now wont release. The plates were just super gummy especially towards the basket and one was really difficult to remove but I got it out and cleaned them all and it was great. Do you think I should invest in new plates? The set in my 56 are at least 30 years old and thats a rough guess. Thanks.
Hard to say. Sounds like maybe you're leaking oil on to the plates. Is the clutch nut seal doing its job? If the plates are just super gummy, they could be so saturated they won't clean up. Did you try sanding them? Sometimes, maybe it's time to buy new ones. If you do, make sure they slide well on the fingers of the clutch hub. If not, try sanding those studs (fingers). Sometimes you need to open the holes up a hair on the plates (1/64th over 3/8). Good luck. I can't make a judgement over the internet. I try. Sometimes it's time to replace more than one thing.
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks Mike. I could not get the oil out of those plates no matter what I tried but then read in the service manual to soak them in white gas and it takes the oil right out of them. I also finally think I have the timing done correctly and will be starting it up tomorrow with the primary cover off to see if it leaks from the clutch nut seal or not. I tried to break that nut free but man that thing is on there. Hopefully with the points set and the timing done it will start easier for me and then we shall see if it leaking. Hopefully not. I may pull it off one more time and clean up the studs since its so much easier with putting a big washer on there to hold all those springs together. Thanks again.
Question for you Mike. I have an issue with a sticking throw-out bearing. Pulling the clutch in when coming to a stop in 1st gear, the clutch doesn’t disengage. Took it all apart, cleaned everything, reinstalled. Same thing happens intermittently. Locks up the rear wheel when it happens if applying brake at same time the clutch sticks. Bike is a 1970 FLH.
I think you need to remove the kicker cover and remove the throwout bear. See if it has a problem. Inspect the finger that moves that bearing. See if the clutch throwout rod is in good shape. They wear out. The angle of the clutch arm is critical. The book says 5/8" from the starter motor. You need to check it all out from one end to the other. Check the adjusting screw. The one with a ball on then end of it is not one of my favorites.
@@pacificmike9501 thank you very much Mike. Will do. Time to go to work then!! Have a great day.
Mike I have a stock ‘90 FXRS CON with the newer clutch shaft. I would like to know which pros & cons are to be expected when installing an open belt and dry clutch. I’m lookin’ for simplicity, reliability, smoothnes and easy road side repairability. Any thoughts/advice would be appreciated. The bike has 104K km on it. Cheers Marcus
Well, I answered you accidentally before finding this comment. I'd run a wet primary, an aftermarket clutch of your choice, and even maybe an aftermarket starter of your choice. You've got a well designed unit to start with.
How do you take it out? I need to replace my belt and the only way I can put a new belt in is to take off the whole thing then put back together
Respectfully, what is the bike? I assume you're talking about a primary drive. Which motor? Splined or tapered sprocket shaft. Tin or aluminum primary covers? Electric start? Stock clutch basket and clutch hub? What brand of belt drive? Kevlar or rubber belt. All of these things make differences. Does the transmission slide fore and aft on your tranny plate, in your frame. Tell me more and I'll do my best to help.
Mike, I will be servicing my servi-clutch and my basket has a wobble on the shaft, What am I getting myself into?
The basket would be wobbling on the hub. The hub could be wobbling on the mainshaft. I don't know which you have. Hard to say what you're getting in to.
How much up and down play should my primary chain have? My manual doesn't say.
What is the motorcycle? Does it have a year of manufacture? Is it a Panhead? Shovelhead? Evo? Sportster? Do you have a year and model specific service manual? If so, it's in your service manual.
Mike,,i noticed the knuckle doesn't have the timing indicator as the shovel you did a video on,, is it over on the distributor side?
I assume you're speaking of the timing plug hole which they both certainly have on the left side of the crankcase. That particular shovelhead also has an after-market timing indicator mounted inside the primary housing. We may show that later on. I hope this answers the question, and, thank you for watching.
@@pacificmike9501 yes and thanks for clarifying
Can you make a video on how to install the springs because mine was all in pieces...
We show some pretty good closeups on our videos and there are a fw on the dry clutches. Go to our CZcams Home page. Just type in Pacific Mike on CZcams, then click on the word "Videos."
Mike, my Pan-Shovel has the same belt primary as the bike in this video, and I have two questions about pulley installation: First, what is the torque on the front pulley nut, and do you use loctite? Second, ordinarily on the clutch hub nut, there's a tab washer that locks to the keyway. However, with this rear belt pulley, there is a dished aluminum piece (with a nylon washer on the back side with holes for the fingers) that covers up the keyway. So, there's nothing for the tab washer to hook into. Do you just omit the tab washer?
Not sure. But, a drop of red Loctite will keep that clutch hub nut on there. About 60 lbs. on the clutch hub nut is adequate. Front pulley nut. What year motor? Splined shaft or tapered shaft? That's why I ask for years and models. I hit that pulley nut with an air impact. Don't get carried away. A drop of red loctite on that nut too.
@@pacificmike9501 - Sorry, this is a '51 Pan bottom, so it's a tapered shaft. Sounds good! I will proceed as you suggest--and thank you for the quick reply. She's almost on the road, in time for the 1-year anniversary of purchase and tear-down. I'll soon be reviewing your 'mousetrap' adjustment video again to make sure I get it right!
Way Cool.
Mike is there any difference between a wet clutch or dry clutch in everyday operation ?
Yes. Wet clutches are nice. But, your system must be designed for it. A lot of the plates are "either or." But the rest of the system has to be made for it.
Hey thanks for the video.. I have a 83 FXSB with a dry clutch belt setup. I'm getting a fair amount of oil in my clutch plates and the clutch is slipping. I do have a leak coming from my transmission drive gear seal. I am not seeing any oil leaking from the front crank seal. Is the trans causing the oil on my clutch plates? Do you have a video on removing the primary and changing the seal? This thing has been leaking for years now, and making a mess of my garage but I've been hesitant to tackle the job until I'm comfortable with it. It's long over due. Hoping for a point in the right direction with this. Thanks in advance.
I think we've shown all those things, maybe not in the order you're asking. The transmission has two seals on the left side. The mainshaft oil seal, as it is referred to in the parts book, is the large seal behind the sprocket. This and the spacer that runs inside it are generally the culprits that flood your garage floor. Next, the second offender, especially if you overfill your transmission, or your bike leans to the left too far, is the main drive gear oil seal (as it is referred to in the parts book). I believe you need to replace all of this stuff. Don't forget the clutch hub nut seal. You can stack two in the nut. We do have a video showing the installation of the inner primary, although it's not a belt drive. I hope this helps you.
@@pacificmike9501 looks like I need the parts book. You've been very helpful I greatly appreciate it. I gotta get that part number for the main seal bushing. I think that may be my issue as the previous owner did all the seals shortly before I bought the bike. Or so he says you know how that goes. ✌️
Great video Mike, I have a early 1984 FXRS Low Glide with a dry clutch will this work the same on my bike?
Thank You. And, pretty much.
Hi Mike! I finally found some time to dismantle the clutch on my '77 Shovelhead project bike. The plates were a real mess so I cleaned and serviced them the way you suggested in your fine video. However I ran into an unexpected problem with the pressure plate assembly. It has only 3 clutch springs rather than the 10 required. The springs are situated on the adjustment nut studs. Not sure why someone did this, but I intend to install the proper compliment of 10 springs. How do I install the new springs efficiently, and without injuring myself? Thanks.
You'll see. Remove the assembly from the hub using the "washer trick.' Slowly back off the nut and center screw. Take it apart. Put the ten springs in place, Then put the collar, called the pressure plate, in place and replace the center screw and nut. Now, you can install it back on the clutch hub. Be sure you get the right springs for your model. Adjust spacing for YOUR model. Should be just fine.
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks very much for the advice Mike! Would you go with stock H-D springs, if they're still available, or is there an advantage to after-market clutch springs like the ones offered by Barnett?
On my 79 lowrider,it had two fiber plates against each other at the end is that right
No, there should be a steel between them.
another superb, simple, matter of fact instruction vid Mike! the only thing i could say would "improve" it is to mention NOT to use methanol (methyl alky), but isopropyl (rubbing alky) or denatured ethyl as your "safe cleaner". methyl is a neuro-toxin you absorb through your skin, by breathing the fumes, etc. just one exposure won't do any much harm, but it's cumulative, so all the short exposures add up to damage over time. "minor toxicity" results in permanent numbness in fingers, teeth rotting, and other fun stuff. real bad exposure (like drinking it) can cause permanent blindness, coma, heart problems, etc. good stuff to avoid exposure to as much as possible, lol. besides, it causes cancer in california, rofl. ALL solvents are kinda bad over long term, but methyl is pretty awful all the time.
Always looking to "improve." I am not a chemist, but I will try to be more explicit in my recommendations. Your input is much appreciated. I appreciate the compliment and the clarification. Again, thank you.
Pacific Mike no chemist here either. I learned the hard way about methanol, so figured I'd spare others the side effects. Thanks for the reply, and keep up the fantastic work, both spinning wrenches and making vids!
Hi mike, I converted the primary to a belt drive on my shovelhead (1982) and replaced the friction discs at the same time. I see the bike you are working on in this video has 4 friction discs. Mine originally came with 5 so after the conversion I installed the 5 new friction discs that came in the pack but now I almost can't let the clutch slip, it's almost like it's either engaged or disengaged with no in between. My mechanic also noticed that the pack of plates was a bit too thick for its taste and we cannot remove tension on the spring anymore, the nuts are at the very end of the fingers. Would you say the clutch could have a better feel if I remove one friction disc even if it originally had 5? I would much appreciate to have your opinion. Thanks!
Not a problem. Original clutches used 5 fiber plates from '66-'84. Earlier ones used 4. Your belt drive clutch basket may be intended for 4. Still not a problem. Try 4 with 4 steels. The first plate in should be a steel because your clutch basket is most likely aluminum and needs a steel to keep from scoring from the spinning fiber disc that you will install next. Now alternate steel and fiber with the last plate installed to be a fiber. You should be good to go. Don't forget, if the steels have the buffers on them to "stagger" them for clearance. Don't forget to get the measurement from the edge of the "pressure plate" to the releasing disc to be as close to 1 and 1/32" as close as possible and even all the way around.
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks a lot, I can't wait to give it a shot! I really like your videos btw.
The old Shovel I bought has a belt primary drive. The belt was oily and damaged. I've read that belts need to be ventilated. The one on your Knuckle is fully enclosed. So did my belt get hot or was oil the cause ? My clutch derby cover and front of the primary cover is ventilated.
Good questions, not much information, but I'll try. First, find out where the oil is coming from. It could be the motor seal. It could be from a no longer needed primary chain oiler. It could be leaking in from somewhere else. Next comes your question on heating. I don't know what primary covers you're using. The old belts were made of rubber. Today's belts are made of Kevlar and are far more durable. I only run belts inside tin covers, which are not sealed up, and therefore just don't seem to heat up much. I've run them for many years and it gets real hot here in the summer. But, venting is not a bad thing. Oil is very hard on belts, but age and nasty things in the air deteriorates them, even the Sun's rays. Last is alignment and tension. Best to consult the manufacturer on your particular unit. I hope this helps. Good luck.
Possible leak from the clutch push rod in the center of the clutch hub nut (left hand thread nut with locking washer. There is a small seal that will leak tranny oil on the discs and plates.
Mike, what determines whether a clutch is wet or dry? I got a 76 FXE and I assume it is wet?
From 1965 up until the mid eighties, all Harley Big Twins lubed the primary chain with a drip system that ran a small tube from the oil pump to the inner primary housing and dripped oil onto the chain. There was a breather hose that teed off of the breather hose from the engine to the oil tank that went over and pressurized the the housing. Then, there was an oil line that returned the oil to the engine. This was not a large volume of oil and it didn't get onto the "dry clutch." After that, this system was eliminated and the housing held a separate volume of oil and the clutch and the chain ran in oil and became a "wet clutch." There were different models in the eighties, some wet and some dry. The clutches were made of different materials accordingly.
Great video! I have a 81 flh, my clutch is sticky so I went right to your page. I will be doing mine tomorrow. What are your thoughts on wet clutches and do they make kits for older bikes? Sure wish you were on another platform so I could pick your brain🤣
There is really no way to successfully seal your primary. You need to run a lot of oil for a wet clutch. Personally, I run dry clutches.
Hello Mike,
Thanks for the VIDEO -
and the TIP on using ALCOHOL for Clutch cleaning purposes
G@@D information to have
COOP
..........................................
Cool. Glad you like it.
what are you using for the belt primary setup? thx
It is Primo Rivera, 8mm, with a Kevlar belt and I love it.
Mike, what was that measurement that you took for the pressure plate? I just got a 80 fxe with an open belt primary set up. It shifts fine and doesn't catch or jump but when looking down at it when spinning it doesn't look straight, it looks like it has a wobble. I read in my HD manual that it says 1-1/32 in. I watched another video and the guy was measuring it at 31/32in thanks for any adivce, or if I should even adjust it if it's shifting good.
If it works well, it works well. The measurement is a starting point. Adjusting it to break evenly is where you go from there. Enough pressure for the clutch to not slip and release well is the goal. Early clutches start at 1" and the later ones at 1 and 1/32. Again, that's a "starting point."
@@pacificmike9501 Thanks Mike!
Sure. And thank you.
Hi there! Do you have a part number for the rivera primo 8mm belt drive kit. I can only find an 8mm drive kit for an open primary. Thanks!
Nowdays, everyone uses the internet. Primo Rivera has been around for a long time. Look it up. Find the right model for your bike. You didn't say what bike you have (tapered or splined motor shaft, tin or aluminum primaries). I like a catalog I can hold in my hands, but the information is as close as a computer or telephone. At Rivera Engineering, they have all the information. Just have all of your facts in order. Make. model, year, year of motor, kick or electric start, and style of primary. Good luck. You'll get it. This stuff takes research that foes on forever.
That was "goes on forever."
do you need to put the rattlers steel plates back in or use steel disc without them
It's personal preference. Neither is wrong. But those little anti-rattlers or "buffers" really quiet things down. I like them. But, a lot of old chopper riders, with open primaries, liked the sound of their clutch when it disengaged and made all that racket. Different strokes.
@@pacificmike9501 thank you for your help
great video
Hey Mike, rebuilding my dads 79 Shovelhead. Your videos have been invaluable in the process. Putting the clutch hub Assam on today and I do not have a woodruff key as the manual says it should have and there is notch on the hub and trans shaft. It has been a couple of months but do not remember one when disassembling. Possible it popped off when Imremovedmhub but didn't see it and was very careful about keeping all parts. Cannot find a video anywhere on reinstalling the hub, only on the clutch with his already installed.
I think it's there. Install the key. Carefully slide the hub in place. Be sure the key does not fall out.
I must have lost it during putting the trans seal in and/or cleaning the fiingers up on hub. Will have to get a new one
Thanks again for your quick response and for the videos. I have been able to do the work myself with your assistance!
Also looking to see about the seal on the lick start shaft side . Any videos on that? Or incorporated in another?
I believe we showed that on a video for the project bike. Go to our CZcams Homepage and click on "videos." It's just a seal that slides in between the two bushings in the cover. We built a kickstart assembly there.
Hey Mike! Love your videos! I have a 1980 FXWG. I've been fighting the clutch for a little while and have a question about it. The service manual speaks to setting the clutch arm on the transmission 13/16" from the tower on the transmission as the first adjustment your do. I however have yet to see anyone actually do this when adjusting their clutch. All the folks I have talked to and videos I've watched essentially show the same procedure you're doing. Was this a pointless step from HD?
Not at all. In fact, I have suggested it before. The manual is the place to start. And, that adjustment, using the late tranny lid, is the way to go. It's hard to get in there with your little ruler and it seems dumb, but it's the best starting place for your adjustment.
@@pacificmike9501 So just a follow-up, the manual says to loosen the pushrod lock-nut and turn the screw out then use the adjusting sleeve to bring the release lever forward. I have heard of people instead using the adjusting screw to set the 13/16" gap at the release lever, then adjusting the cable. It seems like it accomplishes the same thing. What do you think? (note: I use a little ruler from a set of feeler gauges that I've marked the 13/16" line with a sharpie to get in there. Throw a magnet on top to keep it in place and you're all set.)
I think you're doing great. What you're doing is getting an understanding of how it really works. If you use the adjusting screw to set the arm position, while you hold onto the cable sleeve (which has been backed off completely), back off the screw just a little to make sure the throwout bearing is not under a load. Gotta have a little freeplay. Get your cable adjusted without loosing that freeplay. Don't be surprised if it isn't perfect right off the bat. Do it some more. Remember to lube the cable and the hand lever. Lube where the end of the cable seats into the clutch arm. All of these things are important so the parts wear longer and are a pleasure to use.
I got a trick I use for the same procedure. Just take a piece of fuel line about 6 or 8 inches long and put it on the end of a spark plug that is 13/16 and use that as a feeler gauge sort of between the top of the tranny and the clutch arm. It beats hell out of trying to hold a ruler or anything in there.
@@JimShai-yf4et That's a great tip!
For anyone using iso with heigh water content or in an environment that has moisture make sure to sweat the metal clutch plates with a torch. Get rid of the moisture context or you’ll end up with a rusty, glued clutch.
I've never had the problem, but it does make sense.
Hey mike question my clutch arm is flopping around with no resistance even though I'm tightening the adjuster screw what did i do wrong?
Pull the throwout cover. Chances are, your throwout bearing fell off.
@@pacificmike9501 ok thank you Also want to say i really appreciate all the videos you guys put up great work!
Thank You.